Another $3000 price dropped to all time low for model 3 long range
Mod Note: Price in the title has been updated to include Delivery & Order Fees. RWD & Performance Model duplicate removed from the title.
Tesla Model 3: LR $66,700 (Was $69,700) Delivered + On-Road Cost @ Tesla
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I suspect Tesla has bigger underlying problems.
I suspect Tesla has bigger
underlying problems
Elon.
Should have focused on the Roadster and a hatch or cheaper model instead of the Truck.
Nailed it. I recall he admitted as much. The market was yearning for a small cheap affordable EV, not an overpriced unpractical monstrosity.
@dealsucker: I mean neg me all you want, don't let facts get in the way of a weird billionaire worshipping fetish.
Here's a quote from one recent Time article of many on the subject:
"… carmaker released its quarterly earnings report yesterday and revealed that its profits fell 55% and revenue fell 9%—figures even worse than many analysts had anticipated"
"…shown that public interest in owning an electric car has declined, and that consumers want lower-priced EVs that do not currently exist…"
https://time.com/6970399/tesla-stock-earnings-call-elon-musk… (24/4/24)
Add to that I did read a quote from the man himself sometime in the last year regretting not concentrating on a smaller EV first but I can't find the source - will post when I do.
@[Deactivated]: The Cybertruck is what happens when Elon's actual ideas come to the fore. An immature meme product riddled wuth faults.
@[Deactivated]: Without going into the earning report, you cannot assume things. Look at their expense - they spend a lot of money on compute that quarter. Rest I am not going to play elon good/bad with you.
The truck fits His ego better!
I think that Elon knows that he can never make a car as cheap as Chinese makers do
@Terencey: Why not , he’s got a factory in china that affords him every advantage that other carmakers in china have .
Unless there’s some subsidies we don’t know about , or his shipping cost is substantially more ?@beach bum: Well, it's pretty common knowledge that the Chinese government bankrolls (or has bankrolled) a lot of the Chinese EV car manufacturers.
https://europe.autonews.com/automakers/byd-gets-big-boost-ch…Sooo…. there's that….?
And that article only references BYD.
There's another 3 or 4 manufacturers that are heavily subsidised as well.Not saying this is a negative toward China in any way, btw.
They shifted their focuses to EVs in the early 2000s and have expedited things by funding a lot of the changes needed.@Deviner: 3 or 4 more manufacturers that are subsidised as well .
That doesn’t seem fair .
How many EV manufacturers are there in china ?@beach bum: The popular ones that you'll see on the road here are BYD, GWM, Geely and Chery.
One that made the news (that makes really, really nice looking cars that I'd be super keen to see up close) a while back was NIO, who were making enormouses losses year on year, but were able to continue due to the heavy backing by the government.I don't have a major problem with it.
The country has lots of money and they wanted to shift their focus (similar to how they would've made Shenzen their tech hub) from ICE to become the market leader in EVs.
So they could wait for it to happen organically, where it could take a very long time and may put themselves behind the curve, or they could expedite it by offering heavy subsidies to companies that were willing to take up the EV idea and run with it.@Deviner: Yes , so apparently there are something like 54 startup electric vehicle manufacturers in china at the moment.
I think one went bust yesterday , I forget which one but there is probably more to come if the ccp has decided to let them fail now . (Fiskars?)
The worldwide economy has slowed down just as the Chinese economy had recovered after the Wuhan Flu lockup .
As well as the world economy has been depressed as the Saudi’s , Russia ect have been keeping fuel prices artificially high by restricting supply of oil.
I see it as the last gasp of the oil industry , as once there are enough ev’s out there and they then built out the charging infrastructure , the oil producers will no longer be able to manipulate the market ,or blackmail the world .
True! Telsa enjoyed monopoly prices and made huge profits for too long and finally now is facing the heat of the competition and the prices are coming down to where they should have been in the first place.
I am all for Tesla but I can not get over the simplistic interior for the price of luxury car.It's not luxury. It's far from luxury. It's a an economical option.
That's exactly what he said, read it again, lol.
Translation of what he said: It's NOT a luxury car, yet it costs as much as one.
@Koppeldread: I notice you’ve conveniently referenced the most expensive Civic the Type R which is definitely not your average civic and competes with the Golf R
@Bsc088: Back to his point. Comparing entry level tesla to entry level luxury car of a similar size, what luxury car are you paying 60k for?
Similar sized luxury is C class / 3 series / a4. All are at the 80K mark or above?
@Bsc088: True, being a bit facetious.
The type r is my dream car and I am currently trying to choose between it and the Tesla. The Honda is fun, unique and will probably hold it's value as a collectable. The Tesla is incredibly practical and more suited to my young family. And now it's cheaper, meaning I am even further from my dream car.
@Koppeldread: You should get an older JDM Type R dream car for the weekends and buy a cheap old Accord Euro for the family. You won’t have to worry about depreciation or the kids wrecking a new car. Your wife might leave you though.
Isn't the clean and simplistic interior design one of the appeals though?
I remember much preferring it to a BMW ev that was full of cheap plastic buttons and knobs all over the place, really tacky looking compared to the Tesla.
Exactly. I havent come across one Mercedes even brand new who plastic dont squek or scream when you press on them
We went and looked at one on the weekend and were surprised slash devastated at how basic the 2024 interior was. Felt like a massive downgrade from the ordinary cars we own, both around 70k back in 2017 and 2019 respectively
@BusMan247: Basic? What features did you feel like it was missing for the price range?
It's got all of the interior stuff you could hope for - very comfortable pleater electric ventilated and heated seats with user memory, a heated steering wheel, 3 zone climate control, keyless entry with a fully featured phone app, wireless charging for 2 phones, a best-in-class navigation system with integrated charging support, plus a heap of creature comforts and entertainment options and a very decent audio system.
If you're saying it's "basic" because it doesn't have a bewildering array of artistically arranged buttons and knobs where most of them never get touched more than twice a year, then you're missing the point entirely.
@klaw81: I'm not missing any point. I didn't like it. It screams cost cutting sold as "clean lines".
I didn't like it. It screams cost cutting
It's true that Tesla interiors look different to the interiors of other expensive cars. But to say it's "basic" is simply false. All the features are there, they're just rearranged and/or hidden.
I consider it a plus - most modern luxury cars have an abundance of garish clutter to me. Just the steering wheel of a modern BMW or Mercedes has rows of buttons and knobs and lights and little displays, and it's just plain ugly and confusing.
Tesla has very clearly reconsidered every single aspect of the interior design from the traditional layout, and provide a simple, clean and logical layout where every feature has a purpose, the driver's and passenger's immediate needs are within easy and convenient reach, physical controls are provided for the essential parts and the rest is tucked away but available if needed.
I love the simple interior. I see it as a positive not a negative.
Or artificially inflated if you have substantial market shares.
What's the best EV next to Tesla?
Byd Seal surely
BYD sure nailed the aesthetics of the Seal. Dunno about the rest of it, but visually it's stunning.
@theredkrawler: Battery tech is good, build quality also seems solid. It has lovely buttons and stalks too. At this point in time I may even have greater faith they'll stick around longer…
Shame it’s a BYD but.
I’d go with Hyundai. Consistently all right reviews for their modern EVs and from a company with a track record I’d actually trust.
@PainToad: Did you do any research at all before making that statement? Korean EVs are trash. Multiple major recalls. That crappy track record is something you're going to trust? LOL
https://www.vehiclerecalls.gov.au/recalls/rec-005940
https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-news/hyundai-ioniq-5-and-io…
https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-news/2018-20-hyundai-kona-e…
@Creamsoda: Every car manufacturer has recalls.
But overall, yes I’d trust Kia and Hyundai much much higher because they’ve been in the Australian market for decades now and have basically reached the point where Japanese manufacturers were at in the 2000s.
The Korean manufacturers were also the ones who first introduced long warranties. The only reason we have warranties over three years in this country is because of them pushing the others.
@PainToad: The same is happening to Korean cars from Chinese cars with not only long warranties but also plenty add on extras included.
@PainToad: Those are EVs not ICE. Tesla and Chinese EVs dominate on EV tech compared to the Koreans or Japs . It's funny that you mentioned BYD and put "Shame" next to it. In terms of battery tech they are one of the safest compared to the LG chem batteries that has massive recalls and destroyed the Chevy Bolt/Kona electric.
How many RECALLS has TESLA or Chinese EVs in the past 3-4 Years that has a CRITICAL component failure such as the drive train???? or battery failure that could potentially lead to thermal runaway??
Don't be ignorant and crap on other brands you have no clue about and mention "Track Record" like a badge of honour then proceed to deflect by saying "Every car manufacturer has recalls".
@Creamsoda: @Creamsoda all manuafacturers have recalls. Heres a list in the past 2 months ONLY.
So what is your point? LolAston Martin Lagonda Limited
Audi Australia Pty Ltd
B M W AUSTRALIA LTD.
FCA AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
FORD MOTOR COMPANY OF AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
HONDA AUSTRALIA PTY. LTD.
Hyundai Motor Company
INEOS AUTOMOTIVE AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
JAGUAR LAND ROVER AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
KIA AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
Lamborghini S.P.A.
MAZDA AUSTRALIA PTY. LIMITED
MERCEDES
MITSUBISHI MOTORS AUSTRALIA LIMITED
PORSCHE CARS AUSTRALIA PTY. LTD.
SUZUKI AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
Suzuki Autoall manuafacturers have recalls. Heres a list in the past 2 months ONLY.
So what is your point? Lolmy point is you should read my reply again and learn to comprehend what "EV" and "Critical Recalls" mean.
@Creamsoda: "Critical Recalls" - is that an official classification or are you making that up?
Here's that latest recall from Porsche: 'Due to a manufacturing issue, the cell modules installed in the high voltage battery may be defective. A short circuit could cause a thermal overload and result in a vehicle fire over time'.
That would also count as critical right?By your measure one should not purchase any car then.
Here's that latest recall from Porsche: 'Due to a manufacturing issue, the cell modules installed in the high voltage battery may be defective. A short circuit could cause a thermal overload and result in a vehicle fire over time'.
That would also count as critical right?yep for sure. why is that? Maybe because its using LG chem batteries MADE IN KOREA???
https://www.batterydesign.net/battery-cell/cell-benchmarking…Here is your track record of LG chem battery fires. This is why you don't trust Made in Korea brand on EVs.
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/12/lg-chem-to-pay-up-to-1point9…
https://www.carexpert.com.au/car-news/hyundai-kona-electric-…
https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/proposed-compulsory-re…
@Creamsoda: Recall is a good thing, it means the manufacturer admits that there's a defect and willing to fix it.
@Creamsoda: The reason why Chinese car makers have no recall is because they don't recall even if they know about it.
@SOSreef: Right. If any of those Chinese made EVs had a critical failure like the Koreans it will be all over the news on MSM. Every Tesla OTA recall has been plastered on major news outlets.
HYUNDAI IONIQ 5 (NE) & IONIQ 6 Due to a manufacturing issue, the driveshaft may brake under load. A sudden loss of motive power whilst driving could increase the risk of an accident, causing injury or death to the vehicle occupants and/or other road users.
how many Chinese made EV or ICE recalls do you see that have their driveshaft snap off while driving!? And Hyundai fanbois will call this "good track record" what a bloody laugh.
@Creamsoda: Search the BYD dealership goes up in flame in China.
https://www.carscoops.com/2024/05/byd-reportedly-sees-10th-s…
@PainToad: I think your trust is a little misplaced. Only a generation ago they had engine that were famous for exploding and now they have brakes that burst into flames.
https://www.drive.com.au/news/investigation-into-hyundai-and…
https://www.hyundaiengineclassaction.com.au/
https://www.mauriceblackburn.com.au/class-actions/join-a-cla…
How do you define best? Range, battery type, fun to drive, interior, in car technology, room in the back seat, boot space, frunk space, number of seats, price, charging speed
It all depends on the individual buying the car and what they need/want
xiaomi su7
Not for sale in Australia and they’ve no intention of selling overseas. These are also heavily subsidised by xiaomi and have had numerous faults. The Chinese are buying them as they’re vastly under priced.
Anyone considering an EV should watch this from CarExpert about Tyres, Insurance, etc… I was thinking about Tesla but didn't factor some of these costs… now I am on the fence and will likely wait till the ownership costs become reasonable
What's the TLDR?
Polestar. BYD are good for getting from A to B, but a massive gap in the Electronics and 3rd rate charging experience.
It would be nice if you could put statistics / comparision to back your comments.
@OzeePlay: A lot is personal choice they are all great cars.
Faily common knowledge the Seal charges at 150kW vs 250kW and secondly the Tesla Supercharge experience, which for Tesla owners have access to the entire network and it's plug and play. No smart phone apps, credit cards, just works.
Decent comparison,
https://www.carsguide.com.au/car-news/2024-tesla-model-3-vs-…Tesla screen is larger and night\day in-terms of responsiveness. BYD has CarPlay\Android auto, for many not having it is a deal breaker, but that basically dumbs down the car. We can't all like the same thing, or life would be boring.
tell that to our supermarkets
The lack of stalks is such a killer. Why remove the thing? Why why why? Indicating with a capacitive button on the steering wheel is such a stupid idea.
Cost cutting and less plastic materials
Would it really make a difference to costs given how many people are put off by them?
I think they couldn't make enough anyway, so the stalks won't matter. I agree they suck, but it definitely works, and people adapt.
The lack of anything in the dash and stalk area really make the cars easily adaptable for Left or Right hand drive operation. None of that goofy European "indicator on the left" stuff going on.
@Droz: in this case the indicator can be on the left or the right of this same bloody car depending on which way you're turning
@Gdsamp: Confused - On the tesla isn't the indicator capacitive switch on the same side of the steering wheel (left)? The left/right arrows are stacked.
@Gdsamp: Haha yeah, the turning thing - It's so stupid.
I did mean in the manufacturing sense though! They've saved every single penny by building a very Spartan box that's totally empty, no matter the usability cost :(
Allows them to pump out different versions for right or left hand driving countries.
@Droz: European cars have the indicators on the left so that in a manual car, you can shift with your right.
IMO there are plenty of bad design decisions in every Tesla, yet they still sell very well. I think there must be a belief that consumers will eventually come around to it.
People probably felt the same way about the clutch pedal when automatic trannies became the norm, and yet here we are.
BMWs have indicator stalks and their drivers still choose not to use them..
There are bigger problems with the new highland model, there are no USS (ultrasonic sensors) and now rely on Tesla Vision (cameras). The sweet spot are the models from 2022-2023 that still have these and stalks etc.
The ventilated seats on the highland have thousands of micro holes and are a pain to clean also. Recent post about a kid vomiting on the seat and pretty much totalled the seat!
Link to post about seats please. Also it seems a problem with ventilated seats in general as correct me if I'm wrong but you need holes for the air to pass through for it to work.
Highland doesn't look like a toad tho
My family literally refers to the pre highland 3 and the model y as skinny toad and fat toad. Models both look so similar.
Tesla should have waited until they have 48v architecture and steer by wire (like in the Cybertruck) to remove the stalks. With steer by wire, the lack of stalks is a non issue as you don't need to rotate the steering wheel more than 90 degrees each side.
Why have them on top of the other? Should have at least been on the left and right.
Gear selector is another backwards step
Yeah, I was almost considering a Tesla before the Highland update, I was hoping they would add some normal car stuff to it like rear parking sensors, drivers display and 360 cam. Instead they removed even more stuff so its really off my list now
Same here, was going to get a Tesla until I test drove one. Too many compromises for profit!
It’s missing features that even my cheaper car has.
It has a rear parking camera and sensors. 360 Park Assist is slightly different from its competitors.
I wouldn’t buy a car without rear cross trafffic alerts. Such a great feature. Tesla doesn’t have that either.
@Brick Tamland: Here is a pic of what you see.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtub…
Totally agree. If it had stalks (and some buttons for aircon say, and no crap subscriptions and had android auto…)..maybe I'd consider it
Because their vision is automony, even if its not there yet everything is built towards it now. A motorbike's indicator operates very smillar to it, somehow that's ok. People will adapt, and if you can't adapt then its not for you
True, you do see motorbike riders crossing their arms over when trying to navigate roundabouts and somehow they still manage to reach the capactive buttons on their handlebars…. Oh wait that's right - their bars turn less than 90 degrees, and have mechanical switches, and they tend to move in the direction you want to turn instead of being on top of each other. That's probably why it's ok.
there are heaps of refreshed model 3 on the road, if its really that bad there won't be any on the road
I have not tried stalkless, but many reviewer praise the move. Guess there is a learning curve.
People cite the lack of drive selection, but non-Tesla drivers don't realise the car is quite good not at automatically determining if you need to go forwards or backwards and auto selects. Sounds scary, but driving an EV is a very different experience, you need less buttons, things just work.Every time I read this I think of the outcry when Apple released a phone with only one button.
Strewth
Bring on more Chinese car competition so we can normalise prices back to pre covid gouging commencing 🙏
Won't somebody think of the poor CEO and owners if they don't price gouging! How are they going to afford those million dollars yachts.
Bogus losers use to scare monger about Chinese competition or they’re still too busy sniffing up rich white ass like trump supporters 😂
Also, Elon is a (profanity).
Funny how competition in the market drives down prices