Is It Time to Give up on Australia?

Would be interested to hear people's thoughts on this.

Was at an impromptu gathering of friends - a woman announced that she was moving to Texas. I was quite surprised because both of them had good incomes, kids, and were obviously having to leave a lot behind. It turns out that the husband was born in the US and was a citizen even though both of them had spent their lives there. They weren't struggling, necessarily, but they did have a large mortgage. They were worried what might happen if either of them lost their job. They would rather sell than spend their lives paying off debt. Fair enough.

Someone mentioned the health system in the US. They shrugged and said you could buy top notch health cover and still be ahead compared to Australia, when you factored in how everything else here was so much more expensive. They were already looking at buying a specific house in Austin. It looked very nice. It was 400K AUD. Everyone oohed and aahed at the picture on the phone screen and the price tag like it was a fairytale storybook.

We've seen plenty of migrant friends pack up and move back home (basically like this: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-06-08/why-these-immigrants-… ) - but this was the first "Aussie" couple in our peer group to decide to leave.

What was interesting was that it became apparent that just about everyone else in our peer group was thinking the same thing. Someone else said: "I have a UK passport, but its no better over there, its quite a bit worse". "My wife still has her Japanese passport, we've looked at it, houses are dirt cheap but I don't know what I would do for work." Another person even admitted that he was seriously thinking about the "spiritual values visa" being advertised by the Russian government.

There is a palpable sense of decline in Australia. I went to the Philippines recently for a couple of months with the children. I stayed in a cheap condo close to the downtown area and caught the ferry every day that left from the wet market. These were desperately poor people by Australian standards, but the children wore clean clothes and were playing with marbles and pogs between the baskets of fish, and the people were unfailingly polite and solicitous. I did not feel unsafe the entire time I was there, and my only complaint was that people were excessively polite and kept referring to me as "sir" even if I was just out walking casually in flip flops. Within two minutes of getting back to Australia, I had to usher my kids to another carriage because someone was having a mental health episode on the train. Im not blaming him, I don't think its a matter of assigning moral blame to any one person. We made a choice to have the kind of society we have.

Would be interested in whether others feel the same way.

Comments

  • +175

    I have not always lived in Australia. Based on my (and my family's needs) there is no where better to live.

    The US is on the brink. Your friend is best to delay any move until after the election. Who knows what could happen. And after that there is one pressing detail. Right now, I never, ever have to give it a thought that my children could get shot whilst at school. in the US, even if it is remote, it would always be a possibility.
    Also, I never have to give it a thought, that my children could be shot/murdered by the police for the "crime" of being a minority. In the US, even if it is remote, it would always be a possibility.

    Sure, cost of living is high here but, so are wages. Australia is one of the safest countries on the planet. Whilst not perfect, it is still the top of my list.

    • +8

      Ive never liked the US and have only gone there when compelled to do so by weddings and funerals. Can't really put my finger on it. I think its because I find Americans to be quite sentimental and schmaltzy, whereas I tend to prefer those cultures that prize emotional restraint and economy of expression. But that is a matter of taste.

      I've lived in countries with a slight terrorism problem, and after a while, you realise that the chance of being kidnapped or dying are statistically very small and that traffic accidents or some weird medical issue that the local hospital can't treat are the real risks. I imagine the school shootings issue is similar.

      • +46

        there's literally no worse time to be in the US. it's such a divided country, everything is political to them, very us vs them mentality. that's not considering the gun violence and poor social safetynet/ poverty and high healthcare costs.
        if you are rich, US is the place to be. as an average income earner, Australia is much better

        • +56

          Depending on who you are, there have probably been worse times to be in the United States….

        • +1

          There's currently one confirmed exception to that reality in the US, and that's one county in Washington state:
          https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/only-one-county-has-voted-…

          Probably other pockets of calm too, but it seems WA is the state to be right now. The bellwether reputation better hold!

        • It's easy to say that. In reality, an average income earner in Aus cannot even think of buying a place to live in, let alone the other aspects of cost of living. I doubt if it's any better to be an average income earner in Aus than in the US. In the US, at least there are many more cities to choose from and far more opportunities to come out of 'average income class'.

          • +1

            @virhlpool:

            an average income earner in Aus cannot even think of buying a place to live in

            Not true,there are 400-500k places to live in all over Australia and even in Sydney.

            • +2

              @cadwalader:

              Not true,there are 400-500k places to live in all over Australia and even in Sydney.

              I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

              • -1

                @magic8ballgag:

                the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                So no average persons are buying 400k apartments and townhouses and apartments? Zero, no matter the cost?

                • +4

                  @cadwalader: Of course some are, but it is an unobtainable dream for a lot of people and is only going to get worse.

                  • -1

                    @magic8ballgag:

                    Of course some are

                    Good to know

                    an average income earner in Aus cannot even think of buying a place to live in

                    So this isn't true then?

                    it is an unobtainable dream for a lot of people

                    For what % of Australians is owning a 400k apartment unobtainable and what calculations made you come to that conclusion?

                    • @cadwalader: Are you done being picky with words?

                      For what % of Australians is owning a 400k apartment unobtainable and what calculations made you come to that conclusion?

                      I have no idea, but I know that you know it's a lot less than it used to be.

                      • -5

                        @magic8ballgag:

                        Are you done being picky with words?

                        Do words have meaning? I would be done if you used them properly.

                        I have no idea

                        So why would you conclude its an unobtainable for a lot of people if you have no idea?

                        it's a lot less than it used to be.

                        Actually more people can afford a 400k property in Australia than ever before. The number of people earning 100k+ (the average full-time income now) is higher than ever before.

                        • +3

                          @cadwalader: I have no idea on the exact percentage, as your question asked.

                          Income is only a piece of the puzzle, if you're unable to save it due to debt/cost of living, purchasing a property is still out of reach.

                          You already know all of this though, and are just being picky much like every other forum dweller looking for an arguement.

                          • +1

                            @magic8ballgag:

                            I have no idea on the exact percentage

                            So what is your approximate estimation then?

                            Prove this statement or find a better way to waste your time dwelling in the forums.

                            The number of people earning 100k+ is higher than ever before.

                            https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/labour/earnings-and-workin…

                            To achieve the same % of principal and interest as part of annual income today on borrowing 360k. You would need an income of around 80k when interest rates were at 4%. So the only time it was easier to spend 400k on property in Australia was between 2016 and 2022 during the tiny low interest blip. Any time before that, interest rates and income made spending 400k on property much harder than now.

                            Now for you to prove that owning a 400k property is unobtainable for a lot of Australians.

                            • +1

                              @cadwalader: You're taking words from two different comments and mixing them up to suit whatever point it is you're trying to get across, I never stated that Australians earning an average income can't afford a $400k property.

                              Take a look around you, it's not a secret that people are struggling, which is actually related to the topic of this forum thread and the reason people are looking to move abroad.

                              • +1

                                @magic8ballgag:

                                I never stated that Australians earning an average income can't afford a $400k property.

                                Good to know

                                I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                So how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost?

                                • +1

                                  @cadwalader:

                                  So how much does the average person earning an income earn?

                                  About as many friends as you make at a party.

                                  Member Since 03/09/2020
                                  Submitted 0 deals
                                  Dwells in forums 99% of their time

                                  Checks out.

                                  • @magic8ballgag:

                                    About as many friends as you make at a party.

                                    Source that the average person earning an income earns $2 a year?

                                    Dwells in forums 99% of their time

                                    Says the person with 7907 comments over 9 years compared to my 366 comments over 4 years.

                                    How is that ad hominem supposed to support your statement anyway?

                                    • @cadwalader:

                                      Says the person with 7907 comments over 9 years compared to my 366 comments over 4 years.

                                      For someone so obsessed with facts and being right, you forgot to report that the majority of those 7907 comments were made on deals (you know the main reason this website exists), compared to leeching/dwelling in a forum where the average user leeches/dwells.

                                      • +1

                                        @magic8ballgag: Imagine using a function created by the developers for its purpose and arbitrarily assuming that the function was not for its purpose. Just like you're assuming everything else.

                                        I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                        So how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost?

                                        • @cadwalader:

                                          Imagine using a function created by the developers for its purpose and arbitrarily assuming that the function was not for its purpose. Just like you're assuming everything else.

                                          Imaging doing that, plus more, like contributing to the website where you take so much.

                                          So how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost?

                                          Yikes. What an unpleasant person you are. I hope that works out for you.

                                          • +1

                                            @magic8ballgag:

                                            I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                            So how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost?

                                            Yikes, you still cannot provide any supporting information for the claim?

                                            • @cadwalader:

                                              So how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost?

                                              Keep dwelling in the only place where anyone would consider giving you the time of day.

                                              • @magic8ballgag:

                                                I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                                So how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost?

                                                Yikes, funny how you can't even stay on topic or provide supporting information for the claim while scrambling for lame ad hominem attacks that add nothing to the topic whatsoever.

                                                • @cadwalader:

                                                  Yikes, funny how you can't even stay on topic or provide supporting information for the claim while scrambling for lame ad hominem attacks that add nothing to the topic whatsoever.

                                                  Keep reaching/dwelling, it's all you've got.

                                                  On a side note, witnessing you in a social setting would be quite the show:

                                                  ACTUALLY, you're incorrect. Here's my evidence of why you're so wrong and I am so right.

                                                  🙄

                                                  • @magic8ballgag:

                                                    I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                                    Still waiting for your source on how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost.

                                                    Yikes, funny how you can't even stay on topic or provide supporting information for the claim while scrambling for lame personal attacks that adds nothing to the topic whatsoever.

                                                    ACTUALLY, you're incorrect. Here's my evidence of why you're so wrong and I am so right.

                                                    wow fact check bad. don't ever ever do it. Imagine mocking a person for presenting evidence.

                                                    • +1

                                                      @cadwalader:

                                                      Still waiting for your source on how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost.

                                                      Reading your comment history is cringe-worthy, you try so hard yet only get so far.

                                                      • @magic8ballgag:

                                                        I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                                        Still waiting for your source on how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost.

                                                        Yikes, funny how you can't even stay on topic or provide supporting information for the claim while scrambling for lame personal attacks that adds nothing to the topic whatsoever.

                                                        • @cadwalader:

                                                          Yikes, funny how you can't even stay on topic or provide supporting information for the claim while scrambling for lame personal attacks that adds nothing to the topic whatsoever.

                                                          Don't take it personally, unless of course I've hit the nail on the head. 😉

                                                          • @magic8ballgag:

                                                            I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                                            Still waiting for your source on how much does the average person earning an income earn that they wouldn't be able to purchase/own any property, no matter the cost.

                                                            @magic8ballgag directs attack at a person: "Don't take it personally".

                                                            Yikes, funny how you can't even stay on topic or provide supporting information for the claim while scrambling for lame personal attacks that adds nothing to the topic whatsoever.

                                                            • @cadwalader:

                                                              @magic8ballgag directs attack at a person: "Don't take it personally".

                                                              You picked up on that, huh?

                                                              Here's another:

                                                              cadwalader's dating profile - my hobbies include trying really hard to prove people wrong on an online communities, mainly OzBargain and reddit, I don't contribute much else to society

                                                              • @magic8ballgag:

                                                                I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

                                                                So do you even know what the average person earning an income earns when you made the statement above?

                                                                • @cadwalader: Don't worry about that, let's see your evidence for this statement.

                                                                  Can we also get another run down of exactly which amenities you're referring to?

                                                                  Also, please enlighten us with your predictions for the Sydney housing market for decades to come.

                                                                  • @magic8ballgag:

                                                                    Don't worry about that

                                                                    So you dont you even know what the average person earning an income earns when you made the statement above? And your immediate response is to go trawling comment history troll mode?

                                                                    Can we also get another run down of exactly which amenities you're referring to?

                                                                    Entertainment, music festivals, plays, concerts, dance etc. Fine dining, other food options, micro breweries, gastro pubs etc. Healthcare technology, specialists etc. Sports, rock climbing gyms, sailing, spinning, yoga, pilates etc. Perceived education quality houses near higher ranked schools are more expensive etc. Ease of international travel like number of connections and flight frequency etc.

                                                                    Also, please enlighten us with your predictions for the Sydney housing market for decades to come.

                                                                    Easy. Houses would be 6-7X the top 20-5% of household incomes depending on area, supply and turnover for the next 30-40 years.

                • +1

                  @cadwalader: I don’t think you can compare a $400k dog box Sydney apartment to a $400k house in Texas.

                  • @entropysbane:

                    I don’t think you can compare a $400k dog box Sydney apartment to a $400k house in Texas.

                    Please quote where a 400k AUD Sydney apartment was compared to a 400k USD house in Texas?

                    • +2

                      @cadwalader: Your own words:
                      “ For what % of Australians is owning a 400k apartment unobtainable and what calculations made you come to that conclusion?”

                      The Texas property referenced by the OP is $400k

                      Close enough for the principle to apply.

                      • @entropysbane: Where did I mention Texas or reply to OP?

                        I was replying to these comments

                        an average income earner in Aus cannot even think of buying a place to live in

                        I think that @virhlpool meant the average person earning an income can't afford to purchase/own a property, no matter the cost.

        • I wouldn't call it American more academia/lawyer speak. Or it could just be really subtle rephrasing using AI.

            • +3

              @JakeyJooJoo: do you mean condo? in SEA condo vs apartments are different things

            • -5

              @JakeyJooJoo: Probably Filipino OP, they love to imitate American English.

              • +3

                @spast1ka:

                'Probably Filipino OP, they love to imitate American English'

                Generalising, much?!? Sheesh … that's total bullshit.

                I frequent the Philippines, and the English accent there tends to have a more Spanish/European slant. You have clearly never been there, and are posting based on your experiences with call-centre staff and the like.

        • +2

          probably because he grew up in some country that uses predominantly American English. Trust be told I have few family members living at the north end of the globe, including some migrant friendly area like Texas and California and it sounds to me the only place comparable to Australia is West Coast of America but not up to the bit near Canadian border where only draculas like to live. But in those place house price is no cheaper than Australia, you must be a tech millionaire to be able to afford the lifestyle. Texas housing is cheap but last time I heard people burned furniture to survive the winter during black out so no.

        • +1

          'You are speaking American English, saying words I've never heard a fellow Aussie say'

          What post is this referring to? scrolling up, I see nothing relevant.

          • @GnarlyKnuckles: Well these caught my eye:
            prize emotional restraint and economy of expression

            • +3

              @DazMon: I think they are just speaking 'fancy'

        • Nucking futs.

        • Lol what gave off that vibe?

      • +6

        One of your main points about why Aus is on decline because you " ran into someone having a mental health break ", then you completely dismiss school shootings and terrorist attacks.

        lol

      • I love the US… as a tourist. But I doubt anyone would try to say they have a better standard of living than Australia. In fact few places do.
        We might not be the lucky country we used to be and could be, but we're still right up there.

    • +34

      Right now, I never, ever have to give it a thought that my children could get shot whilst at school

      ^^ This

      Kids have to practice active shooter drills at school. There's something very wrong with that. Apparently some workplaces also practice them too!

      • +10

        yes because the obvious solution is to give kids guns so they can shoot the shooters. because 'murica

        • +5

          'yes because the obvious solution is to give kids guns so they can shoot the shooters.'

          You have misunderstood the definition of 'shooter drills at school'. These drills involve locking doors and taking refuge/etc.; not pulling out guns.

          • +13

            @GnarlyKnuckles: yes I understand what the drills are, it was a dig at the usual comeback from gun lobbyists towards gun violence 'just give everyone else guns'
            i didn't neg you!

            • +1

              @May4th: They still say that after Uvalde

      • +1

        Note that the OP uses the US as an example only; he/she is not suggesting that moving to the US is the only option.

    • +6

      Texas is one of those places where the wind never changes direction no matter who's in power.

      You're right about the school thing though.

      • +3

        It's certainly windy around those grassy knolls…

      • +4

        Can't let MAGA types off without a fact check. Australia's most recent school shooting occurred at Modbury High School in Adelaide on May 7, 2012. No one was injured. Since 2012 the US has seen 14 school shootings (four or more deaths) with 134 dead and 99 injured. That they have 12.8 times more population doesn't quite explain it.

        • -8

          Cant understand the word stabbing??? Never said shooting.

          • +10

            @91rs: But the old bring up school shootings thing is getting tired and something that smug aussies like to point out, however the stats are low so given the rate in reality Vs what is in people's mind are miles apart,

            Each day 12 children die from gun violence in America. Another 32 are shot and injured.

              • +30

                @91rs: Let's then consider intentional homicides per 100,000 inhabitants: USA 6.383, Australia 0.833

        • -1

          Pretty sure the gunman killed himself at MHS

        • Actually there was a school shooting at the start of this year in Perth, no injuries.

          • @Gdsamp: If we use the School Massacre definition, Australla hasn't yet got on the chart

      • +8

        WTF did I just waste my time reading. Get outta here.

        • +2

          You bothered reading that? :p

    • +2

      Note that the OP is not suggesting that the US is the only option. There is a world of options out there.

      • +7

        If you hate freedom

        And where is this utopian country of freedom where there are no rules for its citizens?
        Anarchy anyone?

      • +18

        That’s a lot of words to say “I’m a moron”

        • +1

          Yeah, but the same amount of thought went into it.

    • +1

      I wouldn't say you are wrong but the points you have raised don't affect day to day life of the most and therefore benefits that the US has to offer still remain effective. e.g. Political divide - in long histories of nations, many have gone through worse ideological divides and systems still survived ok. It's the corporate America and the power of economy that will make it sail through it. One election isn't gonna fail a country. As for school shootings, it's like saying I won't drive on mountains as there's a real risk of sliding into a valley. There's a risk but it's super tiny, especially when you consider the pros of living in the states.

      For a hardworking Joe, no other place can offer the width and breadth of career or business opportunities that US offers. Low cost of living and high Forex rate mean that access to lifestyle and luxury is much much better. Cheaper housing means that people have much more disposable income to spend on things other than the loan repayments. 50+ good universities mean that students can get into the desired programs more easily. I can go on, but you get the point. Australia is an amazing country to live in but that doesn't take away the benefits of living in the states.

    • I agree with waiting until after the election, if Kamala wins the decline there will surely continue past the point of no return.

    • Healthcare. That is the problem.

    • +1

      You're a brainwashed Progressive. Everything you believe is a delusion inculcated by the Progressive propaganda industry, i.e., the media.

  • +32

    There is a palpable sense of decline in Australia.

    Based on one mental health episode?¿

    • +14

      Wait until OP finds out what they do to the mentally ill in developing countries. Talking about what the families do, not the government.

    • 'Based on one mental health episode?¿'

      No, based on:

      • A now unresolvable housing crisis (it's too far gone to fix; forget home ownership unless you have rich parents, ever. we are now exactly like the UK in this respect)
      • Wokism gone mad/destroying any chance of achieving anything resembling true equality of opportunity in any employment sector
      • A completely dysfunctional healthcare system for poor people, and no dental care at all for poor people
      • A primary school/high-school education system that has been in sharp decline for years, and is stacked against public schools
      • A university system that in less than 2 decades has gone from being world class to relying on full-fee-paying international students as 'cash-cows'; and thus 'passes' said students then sends them home, even if they have never actually shown up to class
      • etc., etc.
      • +14

        Wow, you got all that from the OP 🙀

        • +8

          The wokeism! The crazy radical left!!

          • +3

            @BuzzBuzzBuzz: It's worse than that, it's not just wokeism, it's "wokeism gone mad".

            Why won't someone protect GnarlyKnuckles from the horrible things he's imagining?

      • +16

        Could add that bulk billing has disappeared in the country over the past couple of years (i.e. more GPs are charging gap fees) and that teachers are burning out in Australia.

        I'll also add:

        • Deteriorating roads and driver quality. It seems every night when I'm out some knob will be driving without their headlights on. Watch DCOA on YouTube these days and you'll see multiple clips of idiots driving on the wrong side of the road in every frickin video whereas that never (or hardly) happened 10 years ago.
        • Increased homelessness resulting in tent cities popping up all over the country. But screw the homeless, they must not work hard enough. /s
        • Insane amount of toll roads in Sydney (one of the hardest cities to drive in), I think due to privatisation? Could probably just include privatisation as a whole in this country leading to issues we are seeing now.
        • On top of privatisation Australian companies over time have been sold to overseas entities. Can't throw a stone without hitting an Australian brand that is now owned by an overseas corporation.
        • 1/3 of Australians now born overseas. Don't know about anyone else but I think it's weird to have such a high number of foreign-born people in a country. If this isn't an issue how about when half of us are born overseas? Oh wait we're an immigrant country? Ok how about 99% of us are born overseas? How about 100%? How about we import 50m migrants next year from all countries because limiting migration is somehow racist?
        • Our living standards collectively have gone backwards. Surprise surprise, more people = more competition for the same amount of resources = less resources for everyone. This seems to be too hard for some to grasp.
        • Really simple economy due to decades of laziness and mismanagement by those in government with no long term vision for this country (i.e. we rested on our laurels because of our massive wealth of natural resources).
        • Increasing mental health issues in younger generations. Oh wait mental health isn't a serious thing (look at the OP of this comment thread making jokes about it) and OP must have mental health problems by realising that maybe, just maybe this country is going downhill. Literal quote from the article by a professor of youth mental health at UoM, director of the board of the national youth mental health foundation Headspace and the executive director of Orygen:

        “Something’s gone very, very seriously wrong with our society and the way we’re heading and the way we look after our next generations,” he said.

        • But no, everything is fine and dandy, that guy has no idea what he's talking about.

        But somehow OzBargainers must be right, Australia is awesome because it's not [insert any other country here]. We are de best! 🥇 ⭐️ It doesn't matter that the people (who have been paying attention) can see that Australia was better 5, 10, 15, 20 years ago because at least it's still better than the US and that's what's important. Rests on laurels

      • correct, except for the 'sends them home' bit.

    • +13

      Used to work in healthcare.

      Posts on ozbargain confirm what I found.

      Lots of whackos that have grown up without adequate education or guidance from their parents or mentors.

      People often go to extremes based on very little information/don't read/misinformation

      OPs friend is a moron.

      Also remember, OPs partner is a citizen. You won't get the same benefits as an Australian over there.

      Australia is literally heaven on earth compared to most other countries on earth. A lot of people come here to get away from the 'bs' they have experienced in their countries where sht is pretty fked up.

  • +54

    Successive governments of both persuasions have alternatively or collectively passed legislation that encourages people to see property as an investment rather than a human right, pissed away successive mining booms on middle class welfare or failing to capture the mega profits for a national wealth fund, importing people at a higher rate than is sustainable, and spending hundreds of billions of dollars on ridiculous defence spending which might not produce a thing.

    Australia was great, could have still be great, but has become a play thing for the Murdoch family, mining companies and other vested interests who cripple anything remotely positive for the people and stupidly convince people to vote against the own self-interests to profit the few, just so the parlimentarians can nibble at the gravy of their corporate masters when they retire. Billions squandered by the majority so an extermely small minority can profit. Seeing corporate tax dodgers Santos as the new sponsors of the Wallabies almost made me sick, if i wasn't already by their performances.

    I'm too old to get out now, but if you're not, do so. It's not getting better. Australia is done.

    • +17

      I saw this today:-

      "As a result, median Australian rents will grow by 25% between 2024 and 2029, well above projected CPI inflation. In short, there is no end in sight to Australia's rental crisis unless the federal government eases demand by slashing net overseas migration."

      https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2024/10/theres-no-end-to-au…

      25%? Jesus, how are people expected to bloody live?

      • +7

        That's 4.56% per year, which seems an underestimate IMO. We've seen rents rise by 10-30% in the last 2 years, so I think a lot of people would take that.

        • a part of the meagre forecasts is that we are hitting affordability levels where people are moving back home or moving from living alone to back with room mates - at some point you hit an affordability ceiling! people simply cannot afford to pay more given their current wages

      • +5

        That site is a long term anti immigration site and blames immigration for every issue. Apart from falling house prices which apparently is caused by lack of demand https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2024/10/australian-housing-…

        So rent = immigration causing demand; falling house prices = lack of demand (despite immigration)

        All that said, agree that housing (buy or rent) is the biggest issue for individuals today and something needs to be done. Immigration is a part of that but by no means the answer to that.

      • +10

        Absolutely frightening. We moved to Australia a decade ago and the decline is obvious in just about e wry corner. Prior to this I lived in three other countries. I have dual citizenship but it’s not easy either way. Before anyone replies with “you can just leave” how about no! There’s children and pets that need to be considered also.

        • +3

          At least you can actually see what's happening, most other immigrants seem to live in a bubble and can't actually see what's going on because it's not as bad as where they came from (which isn't even the argument in the first place, it's not Australia vs the US, it's Australia now vs Australia in the past).

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