Part of David Jones extra 30% off
Two years ago was available for $999 - https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/624487
Sunbeam PU8000 Torino Coffee Machine & Grinder - $836.50 (Was $2,199.00) + $10 Delivery @ David Jones
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Lrichplatt on 20/06/2023 - 12:31 davidjones.com (2222 clicks)
Last edited 20/06/2023 - 12:38 by 1 other user
Last edited 20/06/2023 - 12:38 by 1 other user
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I'm the same, not yet convinced. It's a good deal, but might be worth spending more on something better.
good find
ty
still go breville >>>>
Don't do it. Get a Breville DB instead.
But it's more expensive even without a grinder.
It's also significantly better, for not a whole lot more $$$ (though doesn't look as nice unfortunately)
The grinder included here is nonsense anyway. In for a penny in for a pound. Breville DB and Eureka Mignon Specialita and don't look back.
Do you have any hard data on why the Specialita is better, or is this a "Monster Audio Cables make your music sound better" type of thing?
@jong: It's a flat burr grinder. You generally get a more even grind size over conical burr grinders.
Then on top of that, the grind consistency with these 'cheaper' grinders (this Sunbeam, and the Breville Smart Grinder) isn't fantastic to start with. Inconsistent grinds will make it hard to ensure uniform water flow through the puck (more risk of channeling, fines clogging up the puck etc).
If you care about extracting the perfect shot of coffee everytime, then it matters. If you don't then cheap grinder is fine.
@jong: There are plenty of reasons why the Specialita is better
Flat burr. Better quality burrs too. Less retention. Less clumping.
@jong: Not sure if you're trolling… but essentially the 55mm flat burr in the Specialita gives far more consistent grinds than the 38mm conical burr in the Sunbeam.
Trying to dial in a shot with an inconsistent grind size is, putting it politely, difficult.
@jong: If you want that data, pay people to do it - you're on a blog where people are sharing their experience free of charge. This isn't their job so don't be snarky to them if you don't get people giving you the confirmation bias you wanted.
@jong: dude the idea that better grinders make better coffee has far, far more universal acceptance than basically any single concept in the audio world. but i mean if you wanna ignore what literally everyone here is telling you then yeah feel free to buy a $10 herb grinder from marketplace and go for your life.
@jong: If you are genuine about finding out more on the topic, there are quite a few comparisons online, e.g. James Hoffman's intro guide (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgjvLQu5NlE&t=35s). There are also videos of people comparing coffee ground sizes from different types of grinders with different sized sieves - I'd encourage you to do your own research.
Also, I'm not saying flat burrs > conical burrs. The Niche Zero using conical burrs and it's a brilliant grinder. It is however a 63mm conical burr compared to the 38mm in the Sunbeam, and in general bigger burrs give more consistent grinds, especially when you do successive shots.
Espresso making, at the end of the day, is about controlling factors. The more variability you have in your workflow (e.g. particle size, temperature, pressure), the more variability you're going to have in your shot.
@jong: yes because so many people have something like a nest of endecotts sieves at home to do particle size analysis on a regular basis. Come on mate, you have got to be pulling the piss..
Having said that, Id love to do it at work, but i dunno how itd go down if i clogged up our screens with coffee grinds :D
@jong: Your question was "why is it better". Not "how much" is it better. And asked as a specific comparison between the Sunbeam grinder and a Specialita.
The Specialita is better because it's a bigger burr (the effect of which gives you more uniform grinds) and it's flat, not conical (which all things being equal also gives you more uniform grinds - due to the design of flat v conical grinders).
Your question is like asking "do you have any hard data on why a Toyota Klueger is better at driving off-road than a Hyundai Accent, or is this just like Monster Audio Cables…"
It's simple to get a Klueger and an Accent and drive both through a swamp to see which one gets bogged first. But obviously the bigger car with the 4wd is going to be better.
@namtae: No, I asked for "hard data on why it's better" and nobody had any.
I got a bunch of "everyone says the sun goes around the earth", and "I don't know of any research proving the sun goes around the earth, but I'm sure it's out there" and finally "Pope Hoffman says it's true, so it's definitely true".
14 downvotes, six or seven comments (from people who've spent quite a lot of extra money for a benefit they don't know the product provides) and no numbers.
This looks and feels exactly like when I'd call out Monster Audio cables back in the nineties.
@jong: Think everyone has been relatively civil and helpful, so here's some candid feedback:
- No one is obligated to give you hard data, especially not with that attitude of yours. You'd do well to understand that basic fact. If you want to learn about something, do your own research. I've given you a starting point to do your own research on (it's literally the 3rd link in Youtube if you search for "Coffee grinder consistency test"). If you're too lazy to do it then just say so, but don't be an entitled dipshit about it complaining that noone is giving you numbers.
- I don't have sieves at home to measure coffee ground consistency, but I can see pressure and flow rate fluctuations from the machine with the Breville grinder. Do I see a tangible benefit that the product provides? Yes. Do I need a sieve to draw the link between grind consistency and flow rate? No. Do I have to share videos of that with you? No.
- Do you have any experience in coffee that is worth mentioning here? No one is saying James Hoffmann is the pope here (your words only), but he at least won a barista championship. No one is saying they know everything or is the authority on coffee, but at least have the humility to want to learn more.
- Nothing wrong with subjective opinions without hard data, especially with F&B. It's like someone telling you "I had that burger and it was really bad, don't get it" and you coming back and saying "do you have hard data to support that?". Would the hard data support the opinion? Absolutely, but doesn't mean the opinion doesn't stand on its own without hard data.
- As you are giving assertions about cheap/expensive grinders are the same as monster cables, do you have any reasoning to support that there is no difference between the Specialita and the Torino grinder? Not even asking for hard data at this stage, even just your hypothesis or train of thought will do.Nothing wrong with wanting data. Just don't be a prick about it.
@jong: Hard to quantify without extensive testing - far too many variables.
But unlike monster cables, where most in the industry knew were a sham (only managed to fool non tecchy ppl on the whole), you will not find many in the coffee world that doesn't recognise the difference between good grinders and poor grinders.
It is probably the most important aspect, more so than the espresso machine itself (assuming we're not talking absolute junk).
@jong: You don't sound like anyone we could convince anyway. How would I provide hard data around what is a subjective item being coffee flavour anyway. I can tell you I had a better grinder than this one and then swapped to the Specialita, utilising the same coffee beans and the resultant coffee tastes much better.. you could still argue this is simply my own bias though.
Appreciate the thoughts from others here though and I appreciated others who provides me with the advice to upgrade my grinder when I did. It's night and day.@drprox: Yup, I went from the Breville Barista Express to a Dual Boiler and Specialita. There is a marked improvement - not that the BBE was bad.
@drprox: I think there is still an objectivity to coffee, in that you want the output to be consistent. Flavour is subjective, but at least if you have a preference in flavour I'd hope you want to have the same every time.
I could literally see the crema reduce and the shot getting more and more sour as I pulled successive shots with the Breville Smart Grinder.
Just looked that grinder up, $700 and not very aesthetically pleasing. What about a rocky or something?
No issues with my EM0480 grinder, the main issue with them was that they didn't grind fine enough, and was an easy/common mod with a small washer/shim from ebay $2.
I got the Gaggia Classic & Sunbeam EM0480 for $700 incl 5yr warranty back in 2008.
I haven't felt like replacing these although have never tried a better one to compare.
I bought this grinder from appliances a couple of years back, and it literally blew up while I was grinding. AO swapped it for the breville and it's great
Yep, it's trash. Blown up is preferable to the working version, far less mess.
this sunbeam thingy with a fake e61 group head + "Triple Thermoblock heating technology"… don't know how good it can be but i would steer clear of it..
This looks way more expensive than it is, I'll give it that credit. It's basically a fake coffee machine.
Buy a real italian made machine with a boiler, not an 'inspired by' thermoblock rubbish.haha too true. I could have added in an earlier comment a colleague who loves aesthetics bought this over an "ugly" Breville DB which is what I bought. He regretted this within weeks. I had a coffee at his place and just felt sad (my machine even lives on Aldi beans and his on some fancy leopard bag print stuff that costs 5x the price).
This machine might look a bit like a traditional e61 machine, but it doesn't have the same reliable internal components as most other e61 machines have.
I had sunbeam dual thermoblock for 6 years , was working when I gave away and got dual boiler ….both make great coffee …… The dual thermo was great, fast heat up time and extracts and froths at same time if you have milk drinks ….this machine has the e61 which is easier to clean and change seals on and looks better ……
based on previous discussion I was a bit hesitant but thanks for posting