An interesting opinion piece in The Age:
https://www.theage.com.au/business/markets/crypto-is-just-an…
The article references this speech:
https://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/speech/brainard202…
I'm interested if there are any in the OzB community who "invested" in crypto, still have a holding, and remain positive?
You do not "invest" in crypto you are simply taking a punt like at the casino roulette table
It depends on what you are doing. I was buying into defi token launches early on avax, polygon and ftm and then dumping after everyone else bought in, it worked for last year, made a fair bit of money but when you break it down, its a zero/negative sum game when you factor in the liquidity dynamics. You only make money by taking it from those who buy in after you. So in a way, pyramid scheme, but potential to fail if you dont sell out in time
you were not 'investing' you were trading relying on the next sucker to buy it from you.
That is not investing.
Investing is running DCF models (example) and try to buy cashflow thats undervalued via its stock price.
The real money was in selling GPU for mining.
Cryptocurrency, the technology that each coin cannot be forged or double spent, is not a pyramid scheme itself.
Selling them like an investment product IS the pyramid scheme.
Trading them with your saving on an exchange, is like putting all money on a cheque that may or may not bounce but it might increase in worth.
opinion piece
Into the trash it goes.
I have a small amount of crypto, I'm still very much in the black. I think it has no intrinsic value, but I also think that way about a lot of other things, that make a lot of people a lot of money. It's easy, it's quick.
If you swing trade, you could make a good bit of money, especially at the moment, as there are decent daily swings, making a few percent on each trade can quickly add up.
Another easy one is playing at the bsc casino. Buy into random shitcoins that have a little bit of online shilling as soon as it's possible, sell when you double your money, before the rug pull.
You need a bot for the bsc rug pulls now. Prices offered at private sale is fixed. If it is successfully(big IF) and goes to public sale, the prices spikes for like a minute before it sinks to lower than private sale prices as all the private sellers get rid of their coins. You need a bot to ensure you sell at the price you want(2x is risky btw, many of those private sellers will sell at 25~50% profit nowadays). You also need a good node to ensure your sell order is first in line to the server instead of the hundreds of other orders occurring at almost the same time.
Sad, can't even make money on rugpulls now.
'Another' ponzi scheme?
What are the other ones?
'Central Reserve banking' perhaps?
How about 'Fractional reserve banking'?
No?
Must be just crypto then.
yeah, crypto has grifters and code, the others you mention have governments and guns. Who you reckon is going to win?
Not sure, most governments are frantically working on their own cryptos behind the scenes (CBDC's) and it would be scary if they succeeded, at this point it's not looking good for us. Spotted this assessment of the current crash this morning and he could be close to the mark.
Jim ROgers reckons the Gov.
When there are threads on ozbargain like: https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/613895, you sell.
When there are threads like this one, you buy.
Simple as.
Funny how MSM has so much time to write about crypto but yet there's not a single article or discussion about how the entire US financial system (in which the whole world pegs against) is based off Bernie Madoffs pyramid scheme of payment for order flow and naked shorts.
Of course I exaggerate but the infection of the system runs so deep that all systems can collapse. But of course let's worry about some cottage industry of….
Where's the news about the US SEC approving single share ETFs? Does anyone even realise how ridiculous that is, can't get a crypto ETF going but single share ETF, no worries.
Crypto is a gamble, not an investment.
It has no intrinsic value. You might say that neither does fiat currency, but it is legislated, and therefore has value in that it is accepted for all payments and debts. Gold and Silver have value. Property has value. Crypto can be used in some markets, but at present that is at the mercy of the government, and at any time they can declare it illegal, as has been done in some countries.
If you can afford to lose every cent that you put into it without losing sleep, then give it a go. If not, then stick to things that have real value, like property, gold and silver. or in money in banks that are government guaranteed.
And yes I do know the idea of crypto being outside of governments and nations, and being untraceable, but if it's made illegal, or the price is manipulated, then it's not a viable investment. It's not a scam or a pyramid, but it is extremely risky and at the end of the day it's useless unless you can actually convert it to goods and services.
Gold and silver have value because people think they have value. The value from the physical utility of the metals is insignificant.
You think that plastic $50 note in your wallet has value?
It costs like 5c to make, and be printed over and over, yet you value it at $50.
You can't eat it, you cant cook with it, you cant make anything with it, and in a world war or major societal breakdown has virtually zero value.
Anything can have value… it just needs a market that values it accordingly.
The difference with crypto is that it isn't a single government or entity that controls that value, it's decentralised.
It's "value" is here to stay, and like all commodities (gold, bonds, concentrated orange juice) its value is determined by the market.
And the market for crypto hasn't vanished. People still see it has a place and a purpose, and it will eventually stabilise. At what price who knows, but it IS here to stay.
At what price who knows, but it IS here to stay.
Yup, just like scientology is like bitcoin to christianity. It is here to stay, regardless we think it shouldnt be classed as religion or not.
thats what the silverstarman is saying. the piece of paper with $50 printed on it has value simply because it is legislated. it costs 2 cents to print but the remaining $49.98 is given to it because its backed and legislated and supported by govt who controls your taxes, builds your roads, spys your home, gives you food, water, electricity, gas, petrol and dog parks.
The difference with crypto is that it isn't a single government or entity that controls that value, it's decentralised.
Crypto is far from decentralised.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/06/science/bitcoin-nakamoto-…
Although the analysis showed that the big players numbered 64 over two years, at any given moment, according to the researchers’ modeling, the effective size of that population was only five or six. And on many occasions, just one or two people held most of the mining power.
She found that within a few months of the cryptocurrency’s introduction — and contrary to Bitcoin’s egalitarian promise — a classic distribution of income inequality emerged: A small fraction of the miners held most of the wealth and power. (Mining income demonstrated what is called a Pareto distribution, after Vilfredo Pareto, a 19th-century economist.)
On several occasions, individual miners wielded more than 50 percent of the computational power and, as a result, could have taken over like a tyrant using what’s called a “51 percent attack.” For instance, they could have cheated the system and repeatedly spent the same Bitcoins on different transactions.
But to add a twist, Ms. Blackburn found that while some miners had the power to execute 51 percent attacks, they repeatedly chose not to. Rather, they acted altruistically — preserving the cryptocurrency’s integrity, even though the decentralization-based fraud-prevention mechanism had been compromised.
You're trusting a few faceless individuals.
in days gone by most newbies and youngster come into market boasting making a killing with CFDs (another risky product, more akin to gambling than investing)
then one by one they get wiped out. There used to be a lot of shop setup to suck in CFDs traders and like Crypto, then one by one get shutdown by ASIC or gone bust along with their gamblers
Nothing has changed all these years, same human behavior, everyone wants to get rich quick and easy just different time line and generations
now they even have CFDs on crypto I bet, two poison products mixed together what could possibly go wrong ?
I'm interested if there are any in the OzB community who "invested" in crypto, still have a holding, and remain positive?
I love the first line "Recent volatility has exposed serious vulnerabilities in the crypto financial system." Recent volatility across all markets/goods/services, is exposing the false illusion of stability that everyone used to have a strong belief in.
The past year my habits have moved to exclusively transacting with a crypto debit card. I have no business case as a paying customer of a traditional bank. I still have accounts, they just see very rare use lately. I'm prepared to move a decent portion of my cash into crypto 'assets' now that so much debt has been flushed out and companies liquidated (see netjock's comments earlier). I feel far more confident in those investments, than owning any one of a host of business that rely on extreme leverage, and artificial consumption. Especially since Australian Index funds have such a high concentration in banks, which provide no (or little) utility/value-add to people in my own position.
Broad stock market indexes are down 10-20% from peak after a massive run. Bitcoin has tanked 70% and that would surely be inline with total crypto market. Normal banks (non crypto) aren't collapsing regularly and made by some random teenagers that could forget the password and lose everyone's money.
Centralised #defi run by shady people, with no protections from your government or other financial regulators. High fees, slow transactions, poor security. Not fun.
Bitcoin has tanked 70% and that would surely be inline with total crypto market.
It's certainly volatile. Down 70% from a random high, yet still up 500% from the 2020 covid lows. I guess it also depends what you compare it to, a US dollar or AU dollar is in itself a form of volatile commodity.
with no protections from your government or other financial regulators
No, no protections. Protections are overheads the consumer will have to pay, for not doing their due diligence into the topic. Either approach has it's respective benefits.
High fees, slow transactions
It's a pay to transact auction system, so you'll have to wait if you don't want to pay. If you know how to read the auction system, it's pretty easy to navigate. If you want lower fee's, there's other scalable approaches depending on your application.
this whole reliance on layer 2 for BTC and ETH just makes me really concerned about long term adoption. I think it's too early to tell but layer 1 is just not enough to replace retail finance and layer 2 get really complex really quickly.
also the lack of true decentralisation (i.e. solend) is also deeply concerning.
the cracks are really starting to show on crypto
this whole reliance on layer 2 for BTC and ETH just makes me really concerned about long term adoption. I think it's too early to tell but layer 1 is just not enough to replace retail finance and layer 2 get really complex really quickly.
It does have a long way to go for true utility. Layer 2, in the completely compromised form it is in today, is starting to give a glimpse into potential scalable use cases of the future.
also the lack of true decentralisation (i.e. solend) is also deeply concerning.
This makes me think of the quote "If you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's the bank's problem." All parties played by the rules of the system in place. There wasn't enough liquidity available to buy out that much collateral in a rapid liquidation. The parties who gave out that much credit, clearly weren't paying attention to the system they use.
Buy Now Pay Later turned out to be quite the failure, Who figured, giving credit to people who consistently 'consume' more than they 'produce' would end up being a bad business model. LendingClub and similar models failed. Now Celcius and other crypto companies that ran on a system of debt are joining that list. Maybe defi's collateralized lending will end up being of little utility in the future.
It's far easier to see the economic model fall apart in a tiny economy like crypto, and the true exchanges of value that happens. Put a market price on a screen and everyone is happy, they don't care about the fundamental exchanges going on beneath.
Ask the chick that borrowed (dumb move is an understatement!) 350,000 to invest who lost that + also lost her house over it.
The Greater Fool Theory is the idea that, during a market bubble, one can make money by buying overvalued assets and selling them for a profit later, because it will always be possible to find someone who is willing to pay a higher price
Celsius filed for bankruptcy as per news. It was very popular among crypto fans
Ahhhhhh another crypto post for the unenlightened to hope against hope. Wait until BTC hits US$10k then get back to us. Remember you lose nothing until you sell and profit takers never go broke. Being all in all of the time is a mugs game. Playing with fire will also get you burnt. And the best one of all - it’s a crime not to separate a fool from their money.
Let me assure you that this is not one of those shady pyramid schemes you've been hearing about. No sir. Our model is the trapezoid!
and in the defi space - we are 10000x over collateralised and yeah, you have deposited you crypto with us in your account (where in fact you're an unsecured creditor with no recourse if we go bankrupt….byeeeeee).
why is this gettting downvoted?! an exaggeration of the 1000x to highlight how outraegous some defi claims are but this is exactly what Celsius was saying!
Question: Do people who think Bitcoin is still a great investment think they're still early in the scheme? Bitcoin has been around for 13 years now. Sure, if you bought in at $1, $10, or even $1k, you made out like a bandit. But do you see Bitcoin going to $200k, or $2M, to give you awesome returns from here?
Pretty much everyone on the planet with access to the Internet, TV or radio has heard of Bitcoin by now. Where is the new pool of buyers ready to send it rocketing upwards?
There used to be a saying in Wall Street that when the taxi driver or shoe shine boy talks about or recommends you an investment, that is a signal to get out.
1.7m people invested in Celsius and now have nothing, and those who listened to Michael Saylor when BTC was 60K telling them to remortage their house and buy bitcoin are probably in trouble, and even banks with the most bullish bullsh!t I've ever seen : https://www.forbes.com/sites/billybambrough/2020/11/19/leake…
All of Mark Cuban's mates got rinsed on his recommendation to get into Voyager too.
Yeah, hopefully enough people have been burned to realise its made people rich on speculation alone, not utility.
those who listened to Michael Saylor when BTC was 60K telling them to remortage their house and buy bitcoin
Saylor and Elon both buying big via Microstrategy and Tesla. Tell you a lot. Putting other people's money (shareholders) on the line, they make money like a bandit if they get it right. If send their companies bankruptcy they get to walk away with whatever they have intact.
Bitcoin is a hedge against currency debasement.
If you think people will lose trust in fiat currencies, bitcoin should probably be part of your portfolio.
Is it?
In first world countries I really, really can't see this happenening. There are just too many vested and powerful interests for this to actually happen.
And where currencies have lost faith, like El Salvador, it is a complete sh!tshow with the government now able to print a digital token that is supposed to represent bitcoin (but it doesn't) instead of their failed currency, it's wild and it's not working - how could it when the price flucuates against fiat so much?!
The countries in that sort of state will not have the capability to implement a decentralised cryptocurrency with any real success.
Bitcoin is a hedge against currency debasement.
You mean to tell me bitcoin fell 70% and my dollars are worth like what? Nothing?
Did you know the creators of Bored Apes are trolling the world with nazi propaganda?
It has a legitimate use for illegal transaction payments, though only if you are careful to buy and sell anonymously with cash and leave no trail back to device/IP.
And in countries without a functional banking system or international exchange restrictions it is a good substitute.
But everything related to using it as an investment commodity is basically classic scam of getting new buyers to come in and keep pumping the price up.
It's a fine game to play and can make a lot of money, just don't pretend it's something else.
If it's taken people this long to realise, then I feel sorry for them.
The people who create the coins and manipulate it's worth through marketing and fake, news articles are the ones who profit the most through pump and dump schemes.
A tiny percentage of people make big money naturally by investing
A small percentage make profit
Everyone else loses so that the people above them can make their profits.
The stock market is basically the same but at least the companies are generally real and you're investing in something that exists and usually makes something tangible and not the hopes and dreams of someone's claim that crypto will overtake cash and banks
Perfect, buy invigaron with that pyramid scheme mummy money!
There are things that have inherent value, because owning them provides something of value to the owner. A new piece of manufacturing or office equipment allows a company to make something that it can sell. These things are "investments". An investment has a value that is based on the real wealth it can create.
And there are things that are only worth it because you hope or expect someone else might buy it off you tomorrow at the same or higher price. Like art. These things are "speculative purchases". People who buy them are speculators. They purchase them only to drive their prices up. Speculative purchases have no real value, they are worth whatever someone else will pay for them.
The problem in economies is when there are too many speculators with too much money, and they start speculating on things that are necessities for other people. Like homes. In the Soviet Union people who did this were called parasites. But in our part of the world they are allowed to make huge amounts of money out of making life harder for other people.
Crypto currencies provide somewhere for the speculators to not be parasites. But ultimately the end result for them is the same as for a pyramid scheme because the sole reason they are purchased is because of the hope they'll be worth more tomorrow, and with more and more of them being created all the time, eventually the supply will exceed the demand, the price will stop rising, no-one will want to buy them, and their price will collapse.
HODL on a USB, that is the main strategy for Bitcoin, awesome! Then lend it out and get margin called when the price moves, also awesome!
I have some crypto because I believe there are greater fools but that's IT!
Michael Saylor is a deluded shill and most youtube channels a full of grifters trying to entice greater fools or attract advertisers for payola.
People I trust:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfPQrqsmYFFRK0NKLEr27Bg
When I have some popcorn and some time to relax I go here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Buttcoin/
The sh!tshow continues, Celsius, the crazy lawsuit (https://www.cnbc.com/2022/07/08/crypto-lender-celsius-is-a-f…), Stakehound, Voyager, 3AC, BlockFi…crypto.com probably next, tether some day when the tide is going out, man, so much more bloodshed to come!
of course Crypto is a pyramid scheme….but I got in early so i'm happy to HODL
People who buy stuff from pyramid scheme dont buybit out of necessity, their intention is to make profit.
Same is case with crypto, people buy it to sell it when it gains value.
Its definitely a scam when the founder is unknown and wants to remain unknown
Bitcoin/cypto enable crime? Never! That's why it's the currency for ransomware payments. Pyramid scheme and crime enabler IMO
Which is, strangely enough, why crypto is actually not a PURE pyramid scheme.
Monetary theory holds that money has TWO seperate uses - as a medium of exchange and as a store of value. And crypto has intrinsic value as the first, but not so much the second. This exchange value sets a floor to its value under all it's wild oscillations - oscillations that badly impair it as a store of value. There oscillations are inherent in the impossiblty of regulating banking in it - whether the regulators are a private or public monopoly.
That exchange value is only because of its use for illegal transactions. Most of these transactions are illegal for very good reasons, no matter what ignorant "libertarians" claim. They overwhlemingly represent "force or fraud" and are in no way victimless crimes. This immorality does not affect the medium of exchange's value to the parties, but it certainly affects its SOCIAL value.
It's not but I can see if you don't know that much about the space you may conclude it. It's not much different to investing in companies via the stock market, except with more risk.
The coins i invest in have real world utility not just meme coins or sh*t coins.
If you were one of the first investors in Microsoft would you call it a pyramid scam? I know it's a bit different but you get my point.
As it stands yes, its mostly hype with no real value.
All the ingredients are there however for crypto to become an amazing alternative to fiat currency (which is the basis for the hype). The value is derived from facilitating translations. None of the current implementations are there yet however & trying to pick which one will get it right/get lucky is impossible.
Who knows what crypto will turn out to be in the next 5 to 10 years.
Blockchain technology is fascinating!
😂
It's like I'm back in 2012
I spent a number of months investing in crypto and nfts, and am still in that system.
Yes, it's pretty easy to make money particularly in the nft space, although quite hard atm. Previously you could easily make at least $3k a month with genuine zero risk (selling whitelists, essentially your spot in a queue to buy an nft - and yes, you could make $1000+ from just selling your queue spot… ridiculous).
I'm yet to see a single reason why nfts or crypto are beneficial, and most people in the space are delusional or morons. Everything crypto offers can just be done via normal means, and the lack of governnent oversight means theres a huge amount of scams, as well as greedy people just losing their money gambling on uneducated 'HODL' strategies.
I'll stay in the ecosystem because I'm happy to take people's money, but you aren't missing out on anything IMO if you're looking for the next big tech thing.
I started reading about last year and still am up. Took out my profits to invest in GPU mining. So technically I pad $25 for 4 x 3090 that were about $4k each at the time.
Probably losing money to electricity usage now as my solar power is only 6.6kwh and I have no battery
everything is a ponzi scheme - crypto, stocks, bonds, real estate, fiat
crypto is just the least regulated of the bunch so naturally there's more room for blatant scams, huge blowups, etc.
but it's also the least efficient market which means you don't need to be a hedge fund manager with 40 years of experience to have an edge in crypto and make money although that edge is rapidly diminishing
Looks like a lot of ozbargainers invest in crypto. May be ozbargain mod could create a new discussion categroy specifically devoted to crypto.
We all know it's a pyramid scheme, we just hope to get out before it collapses.
Blockchain as a technology has tremendous value.
All cryptocurrency is worthless and always has been. Whatever transaction you think bitcoin could be used for in the future will occur with a cryptocurrency that has fundamental value - such as a Chinese yuan cryptocurrency, or an ANZ bank cryptocurrency.
I have no sympathy for the magic bean bag holders who keep pretending bitcoin is valuable because the technology that created it has utility.
You know… I've read a few posts and replies here… what you realise is most people are stupid… or just think/ feel they need to comment. Sure i have just done that myself now however some people make bold categoric statements. You realise after a while; not everyone can be smart … and not everyone is smart about their investment … and that most people are gamblers and greedy. It's not your place to educate them because ultimately… we need stupid people to make society and the world go around.
In short - NO.
Longer answer needs to explain a lot about psychology, liquidity and capital cycles.
But I don't think you are asking the RIGHT question. I think your question is "why the price has fallen so much and so quickly with a lot of operators going bust"?
Again, the proper answer is a long one.
In all its short history crypto as an asset class NEVER had to face a cycle of seriously tightening monetary conditions (put simply, rising interest rates and removed QE). Therefore, this new regime has been an extreme test for the whole crypto universe and it did not pass the test with flying colors. I warned all crypto-cats on this forum months before the wash-out started.
BTW, same applies to the the most recent (10 years) parabolic rise of RE prices and I also think that RE will not pass this new regime test.
There is much more the above to detail but local folks don't appreciate long texts.
You have my vote but the truth is nobody knows…
I put $50k into crypto late last year and it worked for a couple of weeks and now i got nothing to show for…
After seeing one called Saitama, manipulate a false pump and then covert their so called coin over to a version 2, then cutting off anyone who did not have enough when originally purchasing it, it definately is a pyramid scheme. Start on the bottom, buy in get dumped each level depending on how much you invested.
They now have moved there LLC office from America to Dubai. Might have well moved to Mumbai.
To many criminal elements getting involved screwing people over on false claims, it just seems like.
I had reached Lambo status then went back to a slightly used Camry status. Now even pretty Russian girls on Crypto social channels don't want to hack me.
I'm in it for the tech
More of a ponsie scheme but suppose pyramid could apply.
Brother in law is losing half a million in super. Got scammed big time, plus I warned him countless times. This is through a 3rd party company…
He got tickled withing being told to invest $1000, return $1250 overnight, then the amounts grew to the point 90% of his super was invested.
They asked him to deposit nearly $30k to re-verify his account and they ask for more and he’s now stuffed.
I said from the beginning. It’s not long term.. in and out quickly.
This is an awful story, absolutely heartbreaking. Words and condolences can provide no comfort for the suffering of him and his family.
Damn, I'm sorry to hear that.
I had a extended family member of sorts invest all his super into Cash FX Group, as did the rest of his immediate family.
https://asic.gov.au/about-asic/news-centre/articles/alert-su…
It takes so much effort to try and help people help themselves, to help them comprehend their poor decision making.
Pretty bad and so many people involve their family members. Destroying families and livelihoods
I'm in financial dispute resolution and this is not an uncommon story. Currently dealing with a case where a lady got scammed for a similar amount. She probably won't get it back either as she authorised all the transactions with her bank in the correct way.
I’m hearing similar stories from more and more people. It’s pretty sad.
When it initially became something of interest, before all the influencers/scammers and fintech/stock bros pumped up the price, it was Monopoly money. Now there’s thousands of shitcoins for no reason other than trying to cash in on FOMO. I don’t feel sorry for the people who lost money, because they were warned over and over again. The only people who won were the GPU miners as they are still holding their equipment haha if they purchased them outright or paid them off already. If you were purchasing this shit with your hard earned cash, what can I say.
Check out r/buttcoin
yeah, it's alot close to reality than r/bitcoin!
Bitcoin in $USD:
2011 @ $2: it's a scam/useless
2013 @ $1000: greatest invention, computer geeks fomo in
2015 @ $200: it's a scam/useless, nerds got rekt
2018 @ $19k: greatest invention, retail fomo in
2019 @ $3k: it's a scam/useless, retail got rekt
2021 @ $69k: greatest invention, institutions fomo in
2022 @ $18k: it's a scam/useless, institutions got rekt
fast forward…
2024 @ $150k-$200k: greatest invention, everyone fomos in
2026 @ $50k: it's a scam/useless, everyone gets rekt
Most cryptos aka shitcoins are indeed scams. Just your classic pump n dump scheme.
Most, but not all. Just like the tech bubble innit.
There are idiots who watch a few youtube videos about a coin and proceed to pour their life savings into it, and after getting dumped on, they call the whole industry a scam. They didn't do enough research, didn't risk manage, and got rekt by their own greed.
2024 @ $150k-$200k:
Hoping it happens doesn't make it fact :)
If you fully believed this you would have zero other investments or life expenses apart from 100% into btc
These kind of price history and prediction posts work in hindsight yet never seem to be accurate for the future. Could find a similar one at the end of 2107/2018 boom and I bet it didn't have $69k 2021 on it.
Nothing is 100% but my conviction is strong because humans will continue to be greedy and desperate. Crypto is the best place for that to manifest.
I also fundamentally believe in the tech but that's a different story.
You can do this with almost anything. You could pick up technologies and companies that had similar swings and are now bankrupt. Or collectibles that went up and up until they collapsed.
I don't get why people have this incessant need to try and justify it and can't see common financial sense. If the technology was more promising and useful sure, but it really achieves absolutely zero we can't already do better. Just a useful way to make money on the side for some and for scammers to make a healthy living.
2027 @ $2: it's a scam/useless
A simple thing is to withdraw profits at the right time to protect our capital and not being greedy about it. But this is very tough to do in my personal experience. It is also clear that a few powerful folks are manipulating it all the time.
I dabbled a bit. Lost some and made some. But I can safely say one thing. NOBODY knows what will happen with crypto. But the funny thing is to see shills defending this all over the place even on ozB without understanding it fully which I think happens with 90% of the passionate debates on here anyways. It is 100% a pyramid scheme because we make money when others buy in after us.
Can you give some past examples of how the crypto market is being manipulated by "powerful folks"?
Can you name who these "powerful folks" are?
Elon Musk is a good example. Drove up Doge and Shiba inu (and who knows how many shitty clone "Inu" coins) prices. Many who got it at the top lost a good deal. Another is the guy who ran Luna and Terra. Some of the revelations from their whistleblowers are eye opening.
I'm more of an old school finance person and am still researching crypto.
I think it behaves like an extremely high beta stock/share, so my guess is, when an economic recovery is on the horizon, crypto will skyrocket.
My guess: the lows will occur from now to the next few months, and crypto will start booming again before the end of this year.
I think it behaves like an extremely high beta stock/share
Zero coupon bond with no face value or redemption date more like it.
For it to be a stock/share you need revenue / cost / profit / cash flow underpinning it. Crypto. No revenue, cost is unknown, no profits and no cash flow. Just pray someone some how makes a use out of it.
I'm pretty sure he meant the price action correlates heavily (with higher beta) with the stock market and risk assets in general, which is true.
Recency bias. Everyone’s opinion follows the trend (of course except for the majority of people who were always saying it’s turd… until the next bull run).
It’s a very convenient method of trading drugs and porn. There’s its intrinsic value. It will outlast religion. The price will be variable over time.
Key risk to the above is exceptional processing capability, such as with quantum computing. Impact of this is unknown. That is all.
It’s a very convenient method of trading drugs and porn. There’s its intrinsic value. It will outlast religion.
So even if Elon can get miners to use green energy it won't be ESG then?
Key risk to the above is exceptional processing capability, such as with quantum computing.
They are going to invent quantum computing for drugs and porn. LOL.
So even if Elon can get miners to use green energy it won't be ESG then?
That’s an insanely broad term. If you mean purely ethical, then no (the same as any other system of trade).
They are going to invent quantum computing for drugs and porn. LOL.
It’s already invented, and yes it has utility in drugs etc. That’s not the point though. It could be used by a bad agent with enough processing power to break a variety of encryption technologies, including crypto.
Currently the tech does not have this power, but it may do in the future.
It could be used by a bad agent with enough processing power
You can buy enough hash power right now to attack a crypto project. Been done a few times. Don't need to buy a super expensive quantum computer.
It is cheaper to run all the ransome ware, malware and phlishing attacks than using quantum computing. You just don't have enough interpersonal skills if you need to bring a howitzer to a knife fight.
The GubbaMINT - Look into it