Everyone Who Bought a Japanese Car. R U OK?

I'll preface this by admitting that I have been out of the loop with regards to cars and news etc. But I do clearly remember that during the early days of the Japanese cars coming into the country, all the experts, mechanics and journos were saying that they were cheap "jap crap", they won't last and the Japanese people don't know how to build cars etc.

And the technology they brought in like fuel injection, etc when all the experts were saying that carburettor systems were the best because they can be tuned and not having abs is better because proper drivers know how to brake etc. I assume this tech wasn't widely adapted to newer cars because of the original tech's superiority?

Given the strong evidence by all these experts, I can only assume over the years all these Japanese manufacturers have gone under. And I can only assume early model cars like the hiluxes, land cruisers, skylines, etc were all taken to scrap or are completely worthless now.

My question to Japanese car owners is how did it feel having egg on your face for so long and why are people still buying them? I do see some on the road but given how many people and experts were so confident that they were crap, why they're still being purchased? Must be some sort of weird Japanese propaganda or cult I assume.

Its interesting seeing all the same things being said about the new Chinese cars today and EV's which all the experts are telling us they're crap and wont last. I guess we will live through another country trying to push their crappy cars and new fad technology onto us and soon fail just like the Japanese market did!

Anyway, some weirdo once said "Those that fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it". Unsure if this applies here but hopefully people learn!

Comments

  • +101

    That makes sense. Cheers

    • +53

      No, it is possibly the craziest shit I have ever read in 10 years on this website. This OP seems to be oblivious to the fact that Toyota is a Japanese company/car maker. Peeps keep buying Toyotas because they are the best value for money going around, on all fronts; incredibly reliable, cheap to run, easy/cheap to find parts for, etc.

      This OP is must be a troll I reckon, and is in fact fully aware of these facts.

      • +3

        Yeah, he's either a troll or he needs the "R U OK" attention…

      • +93

        OP is of course well aware of the current state of Japanese Car sales in Australia. They are using satire to make an analogical rebuttal to criticism of Chinese EVs.

        • +26

          thought this was obvious, but after reading a lot of the comments I guess not…..

          • +7

            @connorlo: It’s super obvious. You’d have to be a buffoon to not get it….

          • +6

            @connorlo: The irony of commenters here calling op an idiot because they have poor reading comprehension. A valid criticism is that China and Japan are different beasts so it writhe be foolish to trust Chinese cars 100% just because Japan turned out good.

      • Particularly work vehicles. Land Cruisers and Hiluxes have been the gold standard in work vehicles for decades, for both reliability and performance (for passenger vehicles it's also Subaru, Mazda and Honda but that's a separate discussion).

      • +12

        This is a total <whoosh> moment. How could anyone possibly mistake the OP saying that Japanese cars had a bad re? He's saying they turned out good, and that the same might happen with Chinese cars.

        I don't agree with him- Japanese culture famously values quality and Chinese culture (very generally) values cheap semi functional shite, but he's not saying that Japanese cars are bad.

      • The general comparison was true back in the day , yank tanks lasted forever and Japanese cars were small engines in lightweight bodies .
        Which would rust out and/or blow up .

        Of course compared to today’s shitboxes they look great looking back with a nostalgic eye.

        Tesla are Chinese made electric with an aluminium body so they seem to have sidestepped those issues.

        But mg have a pretty terrible rep with their ice cars so I’d want to have a lot of faith in the dealer before buying one of these and make sure you get your moneys worth before the warranty runs out as they’re worth nothing after.

      • Cheap to find parts lol
        My mum's Corolla Cross side mirror was more than $2k each. Yes, you read correctly. I thought we were being taken for a ride and got quotes from 3 other panel beaters and while the labour charge varied, side mirror price was the same across the board

        • Let me guess. She insisted on genuine Toyota mirrors? You can buy a new 'knock off' one for < $250 on AliExpress:

          https://www.aliexpress.com/i/1005006225082643.html

          If she would have been happy with a new knock off, then you did in fact get taken for a ride.

          • -4

            @GnarlyKnuckles: lol omg… who replaces parts with a knock-off on a 1 year old car?
            Keep doing that for your shitter….

            • @dji1111111: I think you'll find you're in the minority there. The exception is, of course, unless someone else is footing the bill (insurance company, warranty, etc.).

              • -2

                @GnarlyKnuckles: maybe you are just in that circle of people? lol
                Nobody uses knock-off parts on a practically brand new car.
                Maybe you also don't understand the difference between 'knock-off' parts and 'used/refurbished' parts? geez

                • @dji1111111:

                  1. I (and you) are 'moving in that circle of people' here on this bargains website.

                  2. 'Nobody' is a rather all-encompassing word, wouldn't you say?

                  3. In this case, the difference seems to about $2000; for a side mirror. That's extortion.

                  'geez'

                    • @dji1111111: Let's throw it out to the audience:

                      Dear OzBers, if you had somehow acquired a Toyota that was less than 2 years old, and you had to pay for new side mirrors for it, would you pay > $3000 for a pair of genuine Toyota ones or would you pay $$500 for a pair of knock off ones?

                      • -1

                        @GnarlyKnuckles: crap… you are not only stubborn, but your numeracy sucks too.
                        Where did > $3000 even come from? from your behind like everything that you write lol

                        • @dji1111111: Sigh, that is what they cost without the labour charge to fit them; because you can't compare the price of an unfitted product with the price of a fitted product. I would have thought you might have been smart enough to riddle that one, cashy.

                          • -1

                            @GnarlyKnuckles: LOL omg this guy is off his rails…
                            Talking about the part price and suddenly wants to talk about installation cost.
                            For someone who buys knock off parts, you would be crazy to pay $1000 for installing a side mirror lol

                            • @dji1111111: It's two side mirrors, not one. Your numeracy sucks bro.

                              Personally, I would install them myself, but have it your way, and we'll revert to what the original poster stated was the price she was quoted 'for the mirrors' (not the labour). 'More than' $4000 for the two.

                              So … $500 for two new knock offs, or more than $4000 for two Toyota genuines?

            • +2

              @dji1111111: It's a…MIRROR. A piece of glass that reflects light. A simple 'technology' that's been around over a century.

              As long as the motors to adjust it work okay, what do you think is possibly going to go wrong with a mirror- what's the catastrophic worst case failure scenario here?

              It's not like trying to buy a tyre or some other critical safety part from from AliExpress.

      • +1

        Is this meta-sarcasm?

      • +1

        He's clearly being sarcastic. How do you survive on the internet without being able to see that?

      • Is this a serious reply?? Or CCP propoganda

      • oh my lord. the post couldn't be any more dripping in sarcasm..

      • +4

        It's a feature, not a bug… cars come with free fireworks for Chinese new year…

      • -1

        yeh its an issue for non blade batteries, look up blade batteries

        • Search in Google 'byd factory fire' you will see how these blade batteries are actually son of arson going around lighting up their factories and showrooms on fire.

          • @skillet: i think you need to look at reliable sources, im not saying they are bulletproof, but to date they seem to be the most reliable in terms of catching fire

  • +14

    Yapanese

  • +94

    Old man yells at cloud

    • +27

      I think OP is missing a massive point. The Japanese have always aspired to be better at what they do. Yes, their cars were ordinary in the beginning, but they have improved, to the point that they are amongst the most highly-regarded car manufacturers in the world. Their continuous striving to improve is visible in a number of ways:
      1. their time to market for new products is longer than most manufacturers - they develop new products more slowly, and have longer production runs for their products (this benefits existing owners because depreciation decreases the longer the duration of a model run)
      2. their car prices have risen over time, and consumers are willing to pay their higher prices
      3. their cabin tech is less blingy than other manufacturers, but it is super reliable.

      Chinese manufacturers on the other hand, have less regard for quality, and are more focussed on reducing price and pumping out new products. Perfection is frowned upon as a waste of time. This is evidenced by the constant price decreases from Chinese manufacturers, and new models being released regularly (which harms resale value for existing owners)

      Those of you who are familiar with Japanese quality philosophy will know the term Kaizen, which literally means "change for better", but in the context of quality, now translates to "continuous improvement". Personally though, I think of it as "continuously striving toward perfection".

      Now let me introduce the corresponding term in Chinese (Mandarin): Chabuduo, which roughly translates to "good enough".

      TLDR: Japanese manufacturers want to increase quality and reliablilty (causing their prices to increase), Chinese manufacturers want to decrease price (causing their quality and reliabilty to decrease).

      Your choice as a consumer is to decide what is more important to you - there is a place for both in the market.

      • Yeah true MG cars though worse ever I driven.

        I wouldn't touch any EVs except BYD

        • I probably agree.
          Though what makes BYD the exception? They are Chinese also. Are they taking a different approach to everyone else in China and trying to be more quality driven?

          • -1

            @Pedsy: Just cause they help Tesla making batteries and better standards

      • +1

        Isn't all this just the same as Hyundai and Kia? Low cost and lower quality offerings initially (backed by good warranties) to get into the market and then steady improvement along with increased prices until they become mainstream, reliable and respected brands. The Chinese manufacturers are taking a similar path towards maturity and it is good that they are around to offer lower entry prices than would otherwise be available.

  • +53

    Its interesting seeing all the same things being said about the new Chinese cars today and EV's which all the experts are telling us they're crap and wont last.

    your argument is stupid because you're pointing at the current quality of jap/korean cars and comparing them to what Chinese is putting out now.

    Will chinese quality improve? Probably

    Is it comparable to the incumbents? In a lot of cases, no.

    Not sure what point you're trying to prove. You might as well predict that the sun will rise tomorrow.

    • +6

      You might as well predict that the sun will rise tomorrow

      The sun stays in its position at the center of our solar system. It doesn't rise and set.

      • +6

        Wait until you hear that water, in and of itself… is not "wet"…

      • Wait until you find out it moves with space-time

      • Okay then, Neil Degrasse-Tyson

    • +1

      You might as well predict that the sun will rise tomorrow.

      but the earth is flat :D /s

    • predict that the sun will rise tomorrow.

      Yes, but how many moons?

    • -7

      The big difference between them is that even the crappiest Japanese cars didn't ever just suddenly ignite and explode for no reason.

      • +1

        Survivorship bias.

        Just like how you probably think all music from the 80s was great.

        • aga doo doo doo ;)
          .

    • Could of just left it at this

      your argument is stupid

  • +3

    Classic Strawman fallacy

    Copium is strong with this guy.

  • +62

    TLDR: OP is a fan of Chinese EVs and wants OzBargainers to know that.

      • +4

        Alright I'm board with this now.

      • And the clear consensus by a landslide here is saying the opposite of what you and these "experts and journalists" are saying?

        • -1

          And the clear minority consensus here is saying that those in the landslide consensus clearly have a comprehension problem.

  • +20

    Weak rage bait.

    Some bad examples. Why has the daily hybrid appreciated in price lol?

    Worthless skylines? Have you had a look at the COVID/enthusiast tax?

    I have egg on my (profanity) face selling a Evo TME for 18.5k. highly modded JZX100 for 16k, rare specced 110 for 26k Refusing to buy a Vspec II BNR34 for 70k in 2016. Why invest in housing when you should have acquired peak 90's Japanese nostalgic boy racer cars.

    • +13

      Sold my supra in 2018. I still cry about it at least twice a day

    • +1

      TME for 18.5k 😳

    • Sold my JZX90, 120K kms, sunroof for 2.5K in 2014, came with rego and all

      • If that is true, it is a very sad story …

      • Did you put THAT song on after or b4 sale ?

    • id like to see what the actual sold price of these cars are. EG supra. dreamers asking 80-120k for them. whose buying these? and at what true sold price ?
      same goes with R34 skylines. get real they are selling at 120k

      and to be fair, 26k for your 110 was a great price. rare specced or not, they are the ugliest chaser in the series.

  • +31

    WTF did I just read?

    • +29

      I stopped reading after the first line and went straight to the comment section LOL

      • +4

        Haha same!

        • It appears a lot of people did.

    • -2

      OP seems to be jealous because unlike communist cars, Japanese vehicles don't ignite and explode for no reason.

      • +1

        what are "communist cars" and how many "communist cars" has exploded in Aus? All i see is jihadist using Toyota to do the exploding.

    • -1

      I think OP has some brain cells that malfunction … poor OP

  • +7

    The fact is early Japanese cars were crap. Building products well is not something that is in the Japanese DNA.

    The Japanese car manufacturers actually learned how to do it from an American, W. Edwards Deming. They were the ones who were smart enough to listen to him, and then when everyone else saw it worked, most of the world adopted the same techniques. Every country that builds itself a new car manufacturing industry now picks up those techniques, and gets it right first time, without making the mistakes the Japanese did before Demming. Including China. And without ever going through the phase of building crap, and expecting the customer to bring it back and get it fixed, like the American car manufacturers and their subsidiaries round the world did.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._Edwards_Deming

    • +1

      How do I know about Deming? I discovered his methods quite by accident, and applied them to write bug free software that worked first time every time. The software shop I worked for at the time couldn't understand how I could deliver a product faster than anyone else. They had all the elaborate processes for testing and catching bugs at the end of the production process, and sending them back to be fixed, which is far more expensive and time consuming than getting them right to start with, like the car industry used to do with manufacturing defects. The answer, of course, was the same as the Japanese car industry did, to design it so that there was only one way to put all the parts together, so they worked.

      • +2

        Impressive you discovered Total Quality Management by accident. There was a big drive in my organization in the early 90s. This became Lean, Six Sigma, etc.

        How did you discover it?

        You had a better product (process); why didn't you start your own shop?

        • +1

          "Lean", that brings back 2011 memories…

    • +13

      It comes down to most industries have teething problems and quality improves as time goes on. With the Japanese and Chinese industries there is also the racism aspect.

      There will be resistance to Chinese made vehicles, just as there was with Japanese, until they become more mainstream. We aren’t protecting an Australian auto industry anymore so it really is a choice between which foreign built car you choose. I suspect it will eventually get down to price and build quality.

      • -4

        Apparently we had to have a war (and then get over it) to fall in love with Jap cars, so as it will be with Chinese cars?

        I mean the LNP ( who run this country even when in opposition) declared war the moment the Chinese banned Hastie from poking his obsequious nose into their business. So maybe once the SE China sea nuclear war dust settles, we can all happily drive them glorious glow in the dark BYD Seals.

    • +11

      There is this myth that the workers in some countries are slack and lazy, and in others they are conscientious and thorough. The fact is that when you look at car manufacturing around the world, the quality of manufacturing doesn't depend on the race or nationality of the workers, but of the management of the company. German cars are in large part built by immigrants from places like Turkey. The Japanese manufacturers can build well-built cars everywhere in the world they choose to build a plant, because they use the same effective manufacturing techniques everywhere.

      • +5

        Industry in Australia is often ruined by crap short sighted management that are only concerned with meeting this months KPIs.

        • +5

          Yea, it's not surprising that the only things left are mining and housing. Literally the only things that can't be imported.

          It takes a real special effort to turn housing into the focal point of our economy while ignoring every single person who might know how to build a non-leaky apartment building.

          • +3

            @crentist: "the only things left are mining and housing"
            you forgot barista's
            .

    • +1

      Re:

      'The fact is early Japanese cars were crap.'

      It may surprise some to know that this extends to hand tools also. The very first hand tools exported to Australia from Japan (more than 60 years ago) were absolute crap! Japan changed this situation rapidly though, and ever since, regard for Jap tools here in Australia has been up there with the best—and for good reason; they started producing high-quality stuff, and only high-quality stuff. There is no 'cheap Japanese equivalent' of a 'cheap Chinese' hand tool you buy at Bunnings. You can buy a crap, cheap, Chinese one, or you can pay a lot more for a high-quality unit made in Japan (or Australia, or USA, or Germany, etc.).

      This contrast will likely plague China for decades to come, no matter what industry they try to branch into. In their 'race to the bottom' re cost (and by extension, quality), they have sacrificed their global reputation as manufacturers. 'Cheap Chinese crap' is part of the Aussie vernacular, and I am sure that the same applies in all other affluent countries, where peeps can actually choose to pay more for something of high quality, or less for … well … 'cheap Chinese crap'.

      This may or may not apply to Chinese-made cars in the future. What I am saying is that once you have forged a reputation, over many decades, it is very hard to 'shake' that reputation.

    • I am not sure I agree with the sentiment that building products well is not in their DNA. They built a lot of good war machines, making a plane like the Zero dominate for most of the war, despite not having a strong as engine. They have 13-16th century castles still standing in good condition despite being made out of wooden and stone, surviving a lot of strong earthquakes. They just have a tendency to rely on tradition and not changing what works, I think that is where the continuous improvement principles really made a difference, it encourages continual application of ingenuity, not just a one off process and then sitting back.

  • +8

    "…the hiluxes, land cruisers, skylines, etc were all taken to scrap or are completely worthless now." To pick those 3 models and say they are worthless has to be pure trolling.

    • +27

      I suspect this was sarcasm.

    • +13

      Never attempt sarcasm on the internet. There are always plenty of people who will take it at face value, no matter how obvious you make it. As we can see right here.

      • +7

        yep, logged in this morning and almost had to go and get the popcorn.

        Cannot believe how many people are failing to see this post for what it really is.

  • +14

    Let me guess… someone said something you didn’t agree with and they ripped apart your argument, made you look like an idiot by pointing out the flaws in your stance and your comments either got deleted or you copped a boat load of neg votes and a pile on of other commenters adding to it, now, full of butthurt, you made a passive-aggressive semi-sarcastic shitpost instead.

    What was the context of the comment you were butthurt about? Did someone point out that China is pulling a Japan with regards to cars, offering shit quality cars and then getting better and better and swallowing up the market, or how the Koreans did it after the Japanese but you think the Japense always made brilliant cars because you have the Elon Musk Kool Aid equivalent, but for Kiichiro Toyoda instead?

    • +6

      See this comment was far more interesting, informative and entertaining than the original post despite being 1/10 of the size. Nice one.

  • +22

    I think you need to point out this article is sarcasm. People seem to be taking this at face value.

    • -3

      It's not….that's the worrying part.

      • +8

        I think I will wait for the OP to confirm his view. It certainly reads like sarcasm.

      • It's sarcasm from OP's point of view

      • @plmko
        Please don't

    • -7

      I'm not surprised.

    • Yeah, crazy how people on here think OP is serious

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