The only coffee machine I would recommend. Not quite back to pre-covid prices, but getting there! $1 more than this Retravision Deal but with free delivery!
I like to think I know a lot about coffee. Hit me up with any questions in the comments.
Well, I promised to know about coffee, not about Breville's pricing models. That seems to be the rumour. But doesn't change the fact that it used to be insanely cheap, even with the grinder coupled.
E.g. $1,038.40 with bonus $100 TGG Store Credit in September 2016 for Dual Boiler AND Smart Grinder Pro
Insane how Breville is still running this machine with almost no upgrades from several years ago and it still beats the competition out of the park. They upgraded a lot of their other models, but not this one.
My machine from 2015 hasn't skipped a beat. Had it serviced twice under warranty, once outside of warranty, and had to replace a solenoid myself which wasn't too hard.
Edit: Also note this is priced a lot higher overseas. Not sure why it has always been such a bargain in Australia.
Oh, not a criticism of you or the deal - just an observation. It will be interesting to see if they refresh the model or introduce a "Pro" variant as they've done with some of their other models.
I managed to score an open box Barista Express for a great deal last year, but already see the appeal in the dual boiler. I might still use the Barista Express until it starts to give me trouble before looking into upgrading. A year in, no issues so far and already making coffee better and cheaper than most cafes.
Why did you get yours serviced? Only thing wrong with mine is the dripping steam wand.
Maintenance. If they will service it within warranty for free, get it done. Paying for labour and getting it serviced outside of warranty is like half the cost of a new machine.
Dripping steam wand - get it fixed. The seals are usually the first things to go. But if water gets in because of a faulty seal, you may be in trouble.
@ts13: that's good to know. Did you just get in touch with them and ask for a service? Mine is about 18 months old now, so still in warranty.
@beatsntoons: While your machine under Breville warranty - contact Breville - they will ask few questions and provide you with service centre address and some reference number (like job authorisation number).
Service centre needed that job authorisation number only.
Dripping steam wand is a common issue. But I have never serviced that issue alone - always had something else to repair.
Regardless of the issue (or even if you don't have any) it makes sense to do a close internal inspection at the end of 2 year warranty period in case you have some issue.
Mine has dripping hot water spigot. I wonder if swapping out the seals is possible without sending it in for a service.
@ddr0001: I have never had hot water dripping.
It sounds like a needle valve issue.
Check this topic here.
https://www.home-barista.com/repairs/breville-dual-boiler-wa…
@SickDmith: Changing seal under the group head is easy. Just buy the part (super cheap - a rubber ring) and unscrew the shower screen. I like to clean under here pretty regularly anyway.
I haven’t even gone to Breville in the past - I’ve just gone direct to a Breville approved service centre and had it serviced and invoiced to Breville. Been a while since I’ve done it under warranty though.
@ts13: I think ddr0001 is talking about hot water dispenser. I believe needle valve is not serviceable officially.
Yeah, group head seal is the easiest.
Damn man. I got this one in 2019 and has been brewing once a day since then…. plenty when guests come. They seem to love it!
I can't throw enough aldi beans at this thing.
My question is what routine maintenance do you recommend? How about filter changes?? Do you have to use demineralised water?
THANKS!!
Water quality is something I could talk about for a long time - particularly in terms of specific mineral composition and how it affects extraction and flavour perception.
But to focus on your question, which is about maintenance, the only thing important to note about water is limescale. Do not used demineralised water. Firstly, it will make you coffee taste like sh*t. Secondly, the water is so clean, it will strip the internal pipes of the machine of their minerals. You want to be using filtered water that is on the softer side. If you live in an area that has particularly hard water, you'll need to find a way to soften it. Something like a big boy Brita filter might do the trick, or otherwise bottled water. You can also buy demineralised water and couple it with Third Wave Water sachets to put the minerals back in. If your water is too hard and heavy in calcium carbonate in particular, scale will build up, and you'll need to descale (think like a kettle or steam iron). The Breville does not have a sensor to determine when there is scale build up. It gives a notification to descale based on the "water hardness setting" you picked when you first set it up, and the volume of water that passes through. The machine has descale access, but easier to get it serviced if within warranty.
Routine maintenance - buy a cleaning product like Cafetto and follow instructions to backflush. Once every 2-4 weeks should be enough, depending on your usage.
Filter changes - depends on what water you're putting in. If you're filtering the water before it goes in the machine, there isn't really a need to change the filter inside the machine. I would just get rid of it.
Thanks man. My water is TDS 35 out of tap so very soft!
I will try to back flush because I have never done it. I run the cleaning cycle every month with some vinegar.
I will get rid of filter.
Well, no harm in the filter being there but if it hasn't been changed in months, maybe just ditch it. TDS 35 is very soft. Note that TDS doesn't tell you what's actually in it though. You may be fine running water in from the tap, but I would just err on the side of caution and run it through a Brita style filter nonetheless.
Try to backflush with water once every week or two, if you're only going to chemical clean every month. Don't use vinegar. Get a proper cleaner. Vinegar is an acid, for removing scale. But a normal flush cycle won't get into the boilers so it's a bit futile.
Really depends on how much coffee you make each day. For my 1 coffee a day, I backflush my machine once a week and chemical flush once a fortnight. I always feed my machine with filtered water as a minimum. You can service your machine yourself or get your machine serviced outside.
Thanks!! Will do as above.
Has anyone received one of these machines from Bing Lee, from the previous deal(s)?
I ordered one, but cancelled for the Retravision deal, and it turns out the Bing Lee deal was on 'backorder', which I didn't even realise upon initially ordering.
Been using the Retravision machine for a week or so now. Still trying to get it dialled in, experimenting with different beans.
You will find that every bean needs to be dialed in differently. So switching between beans isn't going to help you dial your machine in.
Also fresh beans vs old beans are night and day. Store bought beans are trash. I would recommend getting some fresh beans from one of the many ozbargain coffee deals, starting your grind around a 12 for 18 seconds, tamp then use the gold leveller to get the beans to the right level. If you get more than 60ml (for a double shot) in the 30 seconds, make the grind finer, if you get less than 60ml make the grind coarser. I have had beans that need to be as high at 16 for coarseness and as fine as 7. Once you have the right coarseness, start reducing the amount of time each shot until the correct amount of beans come out each time. I do the last step as I'm making coffees throughout the week.
2:1 ratio - so if you're pulling a double shot that has 20g in the basket you should be pulling 40g (ml) of water out.
Also another note. When I refer to reducing the amount of time I am referring to how I originally told you to set it to coarseness 12 and time 18 seconds. Reduce that time as you go until the right amount comes out and you no longer need to level it with the gold leveller.
Don't get me wrong - this is a very strange way of dialling the grinder in.
Normally you identify the weight of the coffee you going to put into the basket - either by basket manufacturer specs or by testing (5c or 10c coin on the top of the puck, that orange blade Breville is provided serves similar purpose).
Once you know the amount you start adjusting grind size to achieve 2x weight of liquid out in 25-30 sec.
If you are getting more liquid (it runs faster) - you reduce the ground size (finer ground) and readjust your grinding timer to get exactly the same weight of coffee as before.
If it's running too slow or not running at all you adjust to grind coarse and again readjust the time to output the same weight.
After 2 or 3 attempts you get to the point where it is just right. :)
The number on the grinder itself means nothing. It is there for your relative reference.
There are plenty of tutorials about "grinder dealing in".
Yes I ordered one earlier this year. Delivered promptly and still sitting in its box unopened because my previous Breville Dual Boiler machine, which I purchased over 4 years ago from Harvey Norman and was starting to play up and so I thought was on its way out, had its solenoid fixed under warranty by Breville and is working like a dream.
No issues with Bing Lee or Breville in terms of customer service. None.
Did you buy extended warranty or is the solenoid lifetime warranty? Asking because our machine has now packed up but I'm sure the issues prior were due to the solenoid.
Absolutely noob question but would this be good in a staff meal room for about 5 employees? Would probably be used for 10 cups of coffee a day…
My honest thoughts - this is undoubtedly the best coffee machine you can buy at its price point - but it's a manual machine, and does require somewhat of a learning curve. The coffee will only be good as the quality the grinder, beans, water, and the knowledge of whoever is using it. If your staff don't know how to make coffee and are not interested in learning, and/or if you don't have space in the staff room for a machine and grinder, you may be better off going for an automatic machine and/or a Nespresso style machine for ease of use and consistency, but coupled with some specialty pods from a specialty coffee shop.
We have a Barista Touch at work for ease of use. Not fully auto but best of both worlds. I would not recommend the Touch for the home enthusiast. The OP is the better one.
https://www.binglee.com.au/products/breville-bes880bss-the-b…
Too manual and involved IMO. Staff just need to press a button and watch as the machine does its thing.
Biggest issue against for having a manual coffee machine (of any brand) in a shared staff area is that you can be absolutely certain that it will not be maintained properly.
Things like maintaining the quality of the water; regularly cleaning and back-flushing; and replacing filters and de-scaling will simply not happen as required to maintain the machine in peak operating condition.
As a result not only will the quality of the coffee be well below par but the life of the machine will be substantially reduced.
So the short answer is NO, this is not the machine for a staff room.
Heck, I even keep my almost adult kids away from mine in our kitchen.
The only coffee machine I would recommend.
This!
BES920 pros:
1. Makes better espresso
2. Makes better steamed milk
3. Easier to clean
4. No touchscreen
5. Requires external grinder (yep, it's a big plus)
BES920 cons:
1. More expensive
2. Takes more space
3. Takes a bit longer (more steps) to produce a drink if you are in a hurry
If you know how to make coffee, and have the space for a grinder, dual boiler is a no brainer. I wouldn't touch the other one with a ten foot pole tbh, but people have their own needs and requirements. Summary by SickDmith is great as well. I love how they said no touchscreen is a pro. lol
I am talking from personal experience.
I had fully automatic machine before and I didn't realise how much I am missing in flavour until I switched to Breville Dual Boiler.
Also I remember that pain of cleaning my fully automatic machine - internal brewing module (brew group) was difficult to clean and grease.
Because of the cleaning I gave up on automatic milk steaming as well and used steam wand of the automatic machine to do milk manually (although the pressure wasn't that good compared even to BES920).
Thanks so much for this. Looks really a no brainer.
Should I upgrade from my Bambino to this? Tempting…
If you want better quality coffee, and are willing to spend the outlay on a good grinder that can grind fine enough for espresso, and have the knowledge / want to learn how to make better coffee, definitely. No shortage of resources on coffee making on Youtube. Look up Lance Hedrick of James Hoffmann as a starting point.
Big plus for the Bambino is its small footprint. Dual Boiler + grinder will take up some space…
I want to ask a similar question to coastbargain above. I’m looking at upgrading machines. I just got the breville smart grinder so now want to get a stand-alone machine.
For me, it’s between this and the Bambino Plus. I know this is better but I can get the Bambino for $361 at TGG Commercial. Considering I make 1 coffee a day (sometimes 2) and am the only coffee drinker, would it worth spending 3x the amount for the Dual Boiler? I’ve been impressed with the Bambino Plus reviews. I just struggle to spend $1k on a coffee machine when only one coffee is made a day.
tl;dr: this will pay itself back over 5 years if you're willing to make the investment. It's much nicer to use, and will create a much better coffee. You just need the kitchen space. Smart Grinder Pro is a good enough grinder.
Price of a decent coffee probably going up to $5-6 in the next two years, given poor yield in Brazil, Colombia and Ethiopia in the past 18 months. The hospo industry is going to have to react to this at some point. Coffee prices haven't really moved in 10 - 20 years in Australia, whilst costs have been going up. Especially on the back of crazy inflation during covid.
As a coffee amatuer do you think I would be able to clearly tell the difference between the Bambino Plus and the BDB - especially if I got one of the un-pressurised baskets for the Bambino? And now that I have the grinder, I can grind fresh beans which I've heard is a major flavour booster.
I don't have much kitchen space actually, but only renting so that could change in the next year.
Hard to say. If you’re drinking milk coffee only - maybe Lulu are less likely to notice the improvements in espresso extraction afforded by the BDB. Milk hides a lot of imperfections. So does sugar. But the BDB is also just a pleasure to use. No waiting around between brewing and steaming.
Also depends on the quality of your grinder…
Coffee prices haven't really moved in 10 - 20 years in Australia
In Melbourne prices went from $3-3.50 to $4-4.50 in around 2016. In my book a 30% increase is pretty significant. Once you get above $5-6 you are getting close to alcoholic drink price range which I'm not sure would be sustainable? Then again those prices will probably also increase and our cash is devalued across the board.
Beans is not the main part of the final price of a cup.
How many grams of coffee are you using? I used 18-19g for a 1:2 ratio brew on my Sunbeam and it makes a great coffee.
The question to ask isn't how much coffee I am using. It's about the ratio like you've identified. I think the OEM Breville basket is about 18g, so 18-19g is a great place to start if that's what you're using. Just make sure that the tamped coffee isn't touching the shower screen. One way to check is to put a 10c coin on top of the tamped coffee, place it in the group, and then remove it to see if it makes an indent. If it does, it's too close, so drop your dose back a bit. May need to tighten up the grind a titch to compensate too.
How much coffee you use should be based on two things: (1) the size of your basket, and (2) how much espresso you want in your cup.
I swap between a 15g and 18g basket, and dose +/- 1g (usually 16g or 19g) when I'm brewing. I'll usually aim for a brew ratio of just over 1:2 (i.e. 16g:35g, 19g:42g)
I was more just curious on what people in here do. I thought it was an 18g, but some people might change to a VST or similar
My 15g and 18g are both VSTs but I wouldn’t really recommend unless you upgrade your grinder and/or tamper.
@Oldmate88: That’s plenty good enough! Grab a VST or Pullman basket. You’ll need a tamp with a wider circumference too. Barista Hustle tamp is a budget option. Go for Pullman or Reg Barber or something practical like a spring tamp for something fancier if you have the cash.
The BDB is hard to beat, other dual boiler machines with PID are $2,500+.
Some people doesn't like the appliance look, but this appliance gives you a lot of bangs for your bucks.
People choose more expensive Italian made machine not for the merit of looks, but build quality. Brevilles are not built to last
Bloody pain getting someone to service an Italian machine and find parts etc. everyone knows how to service Breville and parts are easily accessible.
Pros and cons mate. Also depends on how well you maintain it. These things just run and run if you look after them.
I've had 2 of these, great machine while they are working.
The first failed just after the end of the 2 year warranty, but Breville paid for repairs. The repairs took so long I bought another at around $720 from Good Guys Xmas special (BREVILLE Model BES920BSS The Dual Boiler - Stainless Steel Qty 1 Amount $719.10), and sold the repaired one to a friend, it failed again about 2 years later.
My second unit failed (leak, temperature control and pump problems) a few months shy of 4 years. I now have a Rancilio Silvia Pro, took a little while to adjust to and I changed the standard basket (7-9g) to a larger one (13-15g).
Hmm that's a bit scary… I was hoping mine would keep going for 8 years or so. ie roughly $120 per year.
If mine ever fails, I'm remortgaging and getting a Rocket R58 v2
OP, do you recommend upping the setup from the default at all? e.g. distributor/tamper/bottomless portafilter/vst basket/milk temp labels etc
Distributor - I find this helps a lot for consistency, you can pick a cheap on aliexpress or amazon
Tamper - Feels and looks nicer, that's about it
Bottomless portafilter - Helps diagnosing problems with shots but mostly for aesthetics (I love seeing the naked extraction)
VST basket - This would probs be your biggest bang for your buck for an upgrade, there's a few to pick out of for brand and size (VST, Pullman, etc) so do some research before buying one.
Milk temp labels - I never used one of these and never had problems feeling the temp of milk on my pitcher
Your grinder will probs be the biggest game changer since the dual boiler pretty much comes with everything you need.
BREVILLE BES920 The Dual Boiler $979 incl delivery @ David Jones
I don’t quite agree with POSITIVEVIBESONLY - his advice isn’t wrong. It’s just more a matter of opinion I guess. I agree that grinder is the best thing you can invest in - but also a lot more expensive. To upgrade from Breville smart grinder pro to something like a Baratza sette 270 is a jump from ~$200 to ~$650.
To be frank, if you’re only ever going to drink milk coffees from this machine, you probably do not need to upgrade from the OEM setup at all, provided your grinder is at least as good as the Breville smart grinder pro. maybe a nicer milk jug if anything.
Distributor: I don’t think they’re necessary as there are other ways to distribute - either without it tools (eg palm tapping) or WDT is probably better.
Tamp: will obviously help - the breville’s circumference sucks. But it fits in the machine nicely.
Portafilter: aesthetic only. If anything, a split portafilter is more useful to be able to split shots into two cups of you’d like.
Basket: VST baskets allow higher extractions, but they also highlight any flaws in your preparation, technique, or grinder. I wouldn’t advise upgrading, unless you have a good grinder, improved tamp, and good puck preparation.
Milk temp labels: helpful for consistency if you’re not used to steaming. But not necessary. It is quite slow to steam, so you have a lot of time to figure out what’s good for you. Rule of thumb: steam until too hot to touch, and then keep going for about 7-10 seconds.
Naked portafilter: there are many benefits aside from being able to see the extraction.
Temperature label: get a thermometer instead, an analogue one works better than digital. You can see the needle moves as temperature rises, and does not require a batteries.
Great machine! Bit of a learning curve though. Got mine a week ago and still getting the hang of it. James Hoffman is your friend!
great deal these days, as mentioned Breville have stopped selling these standalone so it's hard to find them by itself and less than $1500 sometimes…
For those asking if this machine is worth upgrading/buying instead of other Breville machines - YES. This far outperforms any Breville, sunbeam, delonghi, kitchenaid machine… all the 'appliance' brands, and even better than a lot of 'specialty' coffee machines 3 or 4 (or more) times the price.
Yes it looks ugly and is a bit plasticky, but if you are keen to develop your home espresso game this is a terrific machine.
And to those that say it's not made to last.. there is a HUGE online community in Australia and overseas where people have had them for 5-10years and still works perfectly - you just need to keep it clean/well maintained, use good water etc… like any other coffee machine.
The only thing would be to get a proper tamper - the one that comes with it is too lightweight IMO (also a pain to hold/use). The rest of the accessories aren't essential… MAYBE a bottomless portafilter if you REALLY want to get into perfecting your espresso.
If you compared this to a computer game I am assuming it would be GTA V.
People keep buying it so gta VI will never come out
I got the Breville Bambino Pro recently. It's OK, but I prefer a stronger coffee and often have a need to make one for my wife too.
Will this BES920 make bigger coffees than the Bambino, so I could make two decent coffees with one go? I'm tempted to trade up.
Usually the amount of espresso out is 2x of the weight of the coffee you put into the basket.
It looks like Bambino basket is 54mm vs Dual Boiler 58mm. I don't know how much coffee you put into Bambino basket but standard Dual Boiler basket it comes with is 18-19g I believe.
Also a grinder (and a basket itself) makes a big difference in extraction.
Just got an email saying the machine is out of stock and I'll be getting a refund. I ordered night before last. Thankfully, the David Jones deal has popped up so I was able to get the machine for twenty dollars cheaper and can pickup locally if I like.
Thanks mate. I’ve updated as out of stock.
DJs is a great (better) deal!
Good find. Feel free to post!
![[eBay Plus] Breville Dual Boiler Coffee Machine BES920BSS $999 Delivered @ Bing Lee eBay](https://files.ozbargain.com.au/n/84/663884.jpg?h=084fb768)
Good find OP. From what I'm reading it will never quite get back to pre-covid prices given that they're intending on only selling this as a bundle with the grinder soon?