Got a letter, a very heavy fine and demerit points for not wearing a seatbelt.
I had no idea this camera existed, and now I am terrified there are more letters coming. It was at night too, when it is dark.
So be wary, there are hidden cameras.
Seatbelt Ticket Received in Mail
screensaver on 07/08/2024 - 04:02
Last edited 07/08/2024 - 10:17 by 1 other user
Last edited 07/08/2024 - 10:17 by 1 other user
Comments
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Different state and I have heavily heard of this and the tracking of mobile phone use….. They show its usually taken from above so they can see your chest and lap in full view I believe….
https://media.drive.com.au/obj/tx_q:70,rs:auto:1200:675:1/dr…
For example: https://www.drive.com.au/news/phone-and-seatbelt-detection-c…
Just wait till the op hears about point to point and mobile phone cameras 🫣
Edit: Yes, i know the seatbelt and mobile phone camera is one and the same.
Its time to add pic of a seatbelt to OP's @screensaver :)
Why not try something new ? Wear your seatbelt while driving ! What state are you in ?
nsw
Those cameras that got you are also in place for mobile phones , I believe we’re getting / got them in Victoria.
OP said what state they were in. Terrified.
I would have said "ignorance"… All the other road users are in "fear".
What state are you in ?
Despair…
Wear your seat belt Pam!
Oh come on
Seat belts make sense. Cheers.
I tell you, this better make it to next Monday's "weekly round up" questions…
No they don't, that's Big Seatbelt talking. They are in cohoots with Big Crumple Zone. Bring back cars that don't bend, and where you're safety thrown away from the accident onto the road or into a bush.
Interested in understanding why you wouldn't wear a seatbelt.
He’s too cool for seatbelts
He’sShe's too cool for seatbelts
gets flung from car, avoids being impaled by tree/pole through drivers seat, you know, the usual reasons
.
Well kind of a fair nick I guess, everyone knows it's verboten not to wear a seatbelt and the eye of Sauron is everywhere these days so it's way too dangerous to flout any 'laws' while driving around where they might get a pic. I thought this was going to be one of those totally grubby extortion attempts where they send you the same taxation bill even though you do have your seatbelt on but it's a couple of centimetres outside of the 'allowed' parameters.
nah, bet they have the overhead pic and its a fair cop…
Yeah that's what I meant. :)
If taxation is theft does that mean seatbelts are non-consensual bondage?
Relax pedants, it’s a joke.
Haha, nice. :)
The funny part here is that it isnt a "tax", it is a "toll". Taxes are not usually optional, you have to pay them. A toll is applied for people who want to shortcut or bypass something, usually a law, so they pay a small toll for the pleasure… Ergo, traffic fines are "optional" and not a tax.
The difference is a seat belt "toll" is totally avoidable and is a voluntary contribution. This leads it to be neither consensual or non-consensual bondage. It's your right to choose. You wear the belt, but dont have to pay the "toll", or you dont wear your seat belt, but the downside is, you have to pay a "toll" to use the road without your belt on.
Or maybe it's just a tax on "stupidity", I dont know.
Traffic fines are not optional, you pay them under the threat of 'or else', hence a tax. Yes the implementation may be different but it is still an authority demanding money with menaces on the basis of ''even though you didn't hurt anyone or damage anyone's property you didn't do what we told to your to do so nyah nyah pay up bloody peasant".
Some people have a really confused idea of what constitutes government coercion. Yes, most of us obey because we prefer this side of the jail bars and contributing further to the great government ponzi scheme with whatever amount of our money they allow us to keep and not because their is any virtue a LOT of government rules.
Any action that comes with an 'or else' is not consensual nor voluntary.
@EightImmortals: For those not in the know, the last time this happened it triggered a wall of "taxation is theft" madness
@CrowReally: Taxation IS theft, it always has been. It;s only madness if you are a faithful statist. None of you have ever refuted the claim that taxation is theft because you can't, the best you can do is try to justify it. I'm still waiting for an answer as to whether I can claim Zelensky or the PNG rugby league as dependants on my tax return. Thanks.
@EightImmortals: This entire argument is conveniently hashed out in the link I posted above, so I don't need to revisit it.
TLDR version for everyone else is:
"No one has been able to convince me of the fault of my arguments that use words like "theft" in figurative ways while still insisting they are literal"
I'd say you're getting good exercise moving the goalposts but I'm not sure you're even in the stadium
@EightImmortals: You'd gain better traction arguing against taxes on money already taxed or anything else self-evident rather than something that appears as an emotional argument.
Traffic fines are not optional
They are 100% optional. The state government prints out a book of rules… you read those rules. You go do a test to make sure you understand these rules. You get a form to fill out to state you understand these rules and sign off that you will adhere to them as a condition of being granted a small rectangular piece of plastic based on the proviso that if you do not adhere to these rules, that you read, understood, were tested on and signed that you would agree too, that you would receive an infringement notice and a fine.
Ergo, traffic infringements are 100% optional. They are more akin to a toll. You dont have to break the rules, but if you do, you have to pay a toll. Much like a "toll" road. You can use the toll road to get somewhere, but you have to pay. If you dont want to pay…. you dont use the toll road. It really is that simple.
At no point are you forced to even get a license. Even getting a license is optional. Driving is not a right or a necessity, it's a privileged activity. You want to drive on the roads supplied by the tax payer, then you are expected to drive to the rules outlined in the "terms and conditions". If you cant do that, then you are pre-warned that there would be consequences for not following the rules. You are at no point "coerced" into having a license and/or driving on "public roads".
Traffic fines are there for the stupid and the impatient, the reckless and the dangerous, the inattentive and the distracted. Traffic fines are "optional" if you just concentrate on what you are doing, have some patience and drive safe.
@pegaxs: So obey their rules 'or else'? That's exactly what my complaint is. (yes I understand the need for a driving test before letting people loose on the roads)
So obey their rules 'or else'?
No… "adhere to the terms and conditions you agreed to…" would be a better description.
If you don't agree to the road rules or don't agree with the fines that may come from breaking the road rules, you are free to refuse to sign the license contract.
You are also free to contact your local member of parliament and ask them to change the laws you don't think are fair and/or remove the fines (make sure to use your "It's a tax" stance as your reasoning, they love that shit. Add a little "I pay your wages". I've heard that helps).
The government is not forcing you to get a license and they are not sending out fines for "good driving", ergo, ALL traffic fines are "optional".
I don't get how people get a license via having to read the road rules, then sit a test, then sign paperwork saying they will adhere to these "rules" and are witness to road safety media campaigns and advertising and then act all surprised Pikachu when they get a fine for breaking a law they read about, studied, were tested on, saw countless amount of media about possible infringements and said that they will adhere to.
TL;DR: Traffic infringements are "optional" and work more akin to a "toll" than a "tax".
I don't understand the distinction. You don't have to earn 200k, but if you do, you have to pay 47c (or whatever) on the dollar. Both are 100% optional. Why is it a 'carbon tax' and not a 'carbon toll'?
Depends if OP was traveling or driving
Seatbelt Ticket Received in Mail
That’s usually how they come, yeah.
Juts found some of my medical records
Question I have is should you be driving at all? If you can't wear a seatbelt then is there an alternative way to safely transit?
Maybe a motorcycle, don't need a seat belt in a Ducati Street Fighter
from the neck up
Sure that includes the shoulders though 🤔
I have a shoulder injury but didnt think to apply for an exemption
Shoulder too injured for a seatbelt should mean it's also too injured to be in control of a motor vehicle.
It's unlikely you will get off any form of camera fine as the judicial view is that camera technology is foolproof.
You might get off due to having a good record but it will depend on the personal biases of the magistrate.
You might find one has a bee in their bonnet about mobile phone use but is OK with 10 other traffic related fines in a 4 year period; another might consider that 6 low grade traffic fines in 45 years to be "a poor driving record".You'll also need legal representation as they like to keep their mates employed.
judicial view is that camera technology is foolproof
I mean, if the image very clearly shows the person not wearing a seatbelt with the seatbelt at the side of the vehicle, it's quite cut and dry that the person was not wearing a seatbelt.
Entirely different but i recently got off a camera fine for using a mobile device whilst driving. The thing was, i wasn't using a mobile device in the photos and was holding a wallet. It had to get through AI + human review before the fine was issued. As soon as i saw it though it was obvious and put in a review request.
My point is the judicial view shouldn't be that it is foolproof. There's no dispute here though that they were not wearing a seat belt.
didnt think to apply for an exemption
You need to get an exemption before you can legally not wear a seatbelt in NSW. They even have a process of registering the exemption which waives any camera detected fines you may receive and completely avoids the situation you are in.
What shoulder injury is bad enough that you can't put on a seatbelt, but good enough that you can operate a vehicle with both hands?
None
Dude, this is Pam… 100% she is also driving one handed…
Thankyou for contributng to the State Revenue Service.
What do you mean you are expecting several more of these fines? Wearing a seatbelt is one of the most basic things tou need to do in a car. Its onenof the most advertised and policed and has been for decades. If you regulalry dont wear a seatbelt you deserve every ticket you get.
The cameras are NOT HIDDEN they just aren't marked.
Lol. seatbelt laws have been in effect for decades and this fine comes as a shock to you? There are no exceptions for private vehicles.
Hilarious.exemptions may exist for medical or other reasons
Which is why you need to get one before you drive without a seatbelt
What kind of exemption can you get for not wearing a seatbelt? I doubt one would exist.
Examples:
- doing work that requires you to continually get in and out of the car, and it is not travelling faster than 25 km/h.
- a taxi driver working after dark carrying multiple passengers.
- providing or receiving urgent medical treatment, eg in ambulance.
- being lawfully detained by a police or prison officer.
- in a seat not fitted with a seat belt, and not required to be.
- emergency services personnel.
- bus drivers.
- occupants of agricultural machinery.Plus of course a medical practicioner can give you an exemption for whatever reason they choose. The usual one it it requested for is advanced pregnancy, on the basis that the lap belt could injure the foetus in even a minor crash. Advice is usually to wear the belt anyway.
exemptions may exist
yeah and I guarantee the one in ten million exceptions does not apply to you.
Sorry but I don't need this advice. Not wearing a belt is stupid.
So be wary, there are hidden cameras.
Oh
Magoopam, you've done it again…
With so many crashes and deaths out there in news, not wearing a seatbelt is not a good idea.
BuT iM a sAFe DrIvAH!! Maybe, but ive seen enough dashcam australia videos to know that its all the other unskilled/drunk/high idiots that are the problem. I wear my seatbelt because of them.
I HaVe an aNecDoTal $toRy ABout 1 PeRSon hoo diD N0T WeAr a SeAT BeLT aNd thEY wEre Thr0wn CLeaR anb tHey suRViVed!
more people die in car accidents wearing seatbelts than people dying in car accidents whilst not wearing seatbelts <—- proof that seatbelts are dangerous (things an idiot would say)
now I am terrified there are more letters coming.
Have you tried this one simple trick that law enforcement hate? "Wear your seatbelt"… Then it doesn't matter how many cameras they have or where they put them…
I like to think of people not wearing seat belts are assisting Darwin with his job…
So be wary, there are hidden cameras.
Or, better still, just wear a (fropanity) seat belt… JFC, Pam, you look at things arse about sometimes.
Why don't you wear a seatbelt, Pam?
I'm curious as to the mental gymnastics that must be done to try and justify why something that is 100% proven to be safe and effective shouldn't be used when it takes an extra 2 seconds.
And don't try to give some BS medical excuse as to why you can't use it like you eluded to in another reply.
Also, no-one cares about your own personal safety, but in an accident your body will become a projectile so you are deciding to put OTHERS at risk because of your SELFISH decisions.
Grow up.
I have a shoulder injury
Apparently bad enough to warrant not wearing a seat belt, but not bad enough that she can still drive a car…
Ha!
Pam at it again
OP, at least you can make the post a bit more useful by including the exact location of the camera..
TLDR: OP is scared at night.
Just keep not wearing your seatbealt. Soon enough you'll end up with a far worse injury than a shoulder, and you won't have to worry about driving at all.
I eluded to this in my comment but it's not just about them. In an accident they become a projectile and can injure/kill other people in the car and outside even.
"Alluded", FYI
doh. thanks!
Looks like you were one of the 11,400.
Is one of those photos you?
Simple way to avoid this in the futureI had no idea this camera existed
So if you had known what would be your strategy then?
Obviously swerve to miss the camera!
Then op will whinge when he gets the infringement in the mail and will ask how did they know it was fake with the image showing a belt over their left shoulder instead of the right.
"I did something illegal and got caught!"
How can you not know about mobile and seatbelt cameras?
How can you not know about night vision cameras?
The cameras have been all over the news with lame stream media reporting on them taking "upskirt" photos.
They are the easiest fines to avoid for most people.
Your PSA shoulder be "wear your seatbelt" or apply for an exemption if needed.
Your talk of night time suggests a trip to an optometrist may also be warranted.
I had no idea this camera existed, and now I am terrified there are more letters coming.
Damn straight!
How did you even get your driver's licence?You could invest in a 1960s or earlier vehicle. Prior to 1969 if a vehicle did not have a factory fitted seat belt you can still drive the car without one.
There is an interesting discussion on seatbelt laws in the book Risk by John Adams.
'Investing' in a coffin would make more sense.
The night is a dark time for me
Unless (in Australia) you are the one in the driving seat.
If only Pam had received a refund for that course she could have afforded this fine.
The one where she left her folder behind? Maybe it was finally found and she was zooming to get it
What is the address of the Rock you've been living under for … years?
wait till it finds out about nasty hidden speed cameras… or that police have them in cars too….
Jesus… I honestly can't believe people don't wear seatbelts. It's so simple, completely free and literally can save your life.
You deserve every fine you get for not wearing one, and tbh it should be something you lose your license for.
fcuk around and find out i guess?
Wear yo seatbelt bish.Lucky you didnt get into an accident and die lol - wear your seatbelt dont make excuses. If you cant wear it dont drive
Hello Pam, it's been a while, but the hilarity you bring to the forums is unmatched.
Bait
I am terrified there are more letters coming
Get the service NSW app…then the letters won't be such a shock 🤔
OP is bored and wants to troll us.
Why are we telling the OP to wear a seat belt?
If OP gets fined daily, the revenue office wins.
If OP gets into a bad accident, the human race wins.
I had no idea this camera existed
LOL Ok… But why haven't you been wearing your seatbelt!?
OPs next post -
Got a letter, a very heavy fine and demerit points for speeding.
I had no idea this camera existed, and now I am terrified there are more letters coming. It was during a solar eclipse too, when it is dark.
So be wary, there are hidden cameras.
Sorry OP, but how did you pass your drivers license test?. Only been mandatory in nsw for 50+ years.
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don't know how you wouldn't know the camera existed, it's only been heavily advertised its in operation, plus, wear your belt, then no fines