Pretty sure this is a price mistake
Sells for 3 times the price everywhere else.
CamelCamelCamel.
🤮
How get this in OP ?
Price History at C CamelCamelCamel K Keepa.
Can I get an Amen?
I'll have to consult the book of armaments
The blood of the martyrs commands you.
You mother sucks lollipops and candy land.
Pretty tempted just to add this to the library.
My mates will be like, "you're religious now?"
"Nah. OzBargain 😂"
There is a difference?
one's a religion the other is a cult :P
Which one is which?
@jesseboy89: ozbargain is a religion, Christianity is the other one
thinking about it, we should make ozbargain a religion
@Zaddo: A tax free status like the Church of WeetBix…
Can’t we structure a co-op and headquarter it somewhere offshore… not Hong Kong, maybe King Island off Tasmania.
Church of WeetBix
That is gold. Did you make that up yourself or read about it somewhere regarding Sanitarium?
@holdenmg: and protection if you're a sexual predator. And you can discriminate against others in society without fear of being charged - well, as soon as the bill is passed.
@poohduck: A church or religious school should be able to discriminate against someone who is trying to propagate oppositional values.
Just as an LGBT organisation should be allowed to discriminate against a person who is undermining their mission.
This is on the basis of action and beliefs - not merely on identity.
A cult is when the founder is still alive.
@poboy: Many Christians would consider Jesus the founder of Christianity, and still alive. So cult.
But Jesus was and remained Jewish. It was actually St Paul who created Christianity as a new religion, and he is very much dead.
@bargaino: Omg. You don't take facts into a shit fight.
A few facts here and a few more there, before you know it we will have a civil discussion!
@[Deactivated]: Jesus was Jewish - fact, yup.
But "St Paul…created Christianity"? Seems like you're too quick to say that's a fact.
Regardless of whether you believe Jesus or not, seems like Jesus kicked off his new religion when he called himself God.
And it was well underway before Paul got in on the action - Saul/Paul used to entertain himself by watching Christians being stoned and banging Christian heads together.
So, pithy comment and response, all kudos for that, but not factually correct.
@limafoxtrot: See what manic has done.
You've presented a differing point of view based on more facts and we have devolved into civil discussion.
@[Deactivated]: yeah.. I was here for the laughs not common sense or facts - as soon as you mention religion or eneloops…
@limafoxtrot: No it was a pithy and accurate statement. Kudos indeed @manic.
Actually, factually Jesus never inevocably said he was God. He had many times to say it in the biblos but did not. Find a statement in the Bible which Jesus himself said he was and you'll see he did not.
Fact, Jesus' followers said he was the son of God (but again Israel and Abraham were also sons of God, as were all those who followed Jesus directly afterwards).
Another fact is that Paul never met Jesus but had a vision and his version of events is what has shaped modern Christianity.
Fact again, early Christians including the Ebionites and Nazarenes followed the Jewish halakah* (*this meant they didn't fall outside Judaism beliefs) which believed that Jesus was not divine but a prophet and teacher.
Fact, even the now apocryphal gospels of James and Mary (ie. Jesus' brother and mother/follower) themselves did not mention divinity not resurrection. Central tenants in this creed.
Fact, it's actually quite interesting what historians scholars conclude of the matter that Paul's accounts differ from that of Jesus closest disciples and family. Especially early Christians and texts attributed to them.
Conjecture, based on historical fact, so Saul of Tartar who was a pagan (ie. Paul) may have used elements of his previous religion to shape the new one to ensure that Roman subjects would be attracted to it. Indeed his belief was correct.
@khomeini: You made several claims since you look like a Muslim.
The Quran, the Bible, and the Islamic Dilemma https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNAS0aaViM4&t=3s
Where Did Jesus Say, "I Am God, Worship Me"? (David Wood)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS-lLTfCI7c
Clearly claim to be God. If you're a Muslim. Let's compare the attribute of Allah and Jesus.
The First and the Last/The Beginning and the End
Allah
Quran: S. 53:25, S. 57:3, S. 92:13
Jesus: Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 2:8, Revelation 22:12-13, 20
Sovereignty and Inheritor
Allah S. 3:189, S. 15:23, S. 19:40, S. 57:2
Jesus: Matthew 28:18, Mark 12:6-7, John 17:1-2
NT WRITERS: Colossians 1:17, Hebrews 1:2-3a
The Resurrection and the Life
ALLAH: S. 22:6-7, S. 40:65, 68
JESUS: John 5:25-29, John 11:25-27, Revelation 1:18
The Gatherer
Allah S. 3:9,
Jesus Matthew 25:31-34
Omnipresent
Allah S. 2:115, S. 57:4, S. 58:7, Hadith Qudsi 18
Omnipresent
JESUS Matthew 18:20, Matthew 25:31-46, Mt. 28:20b
Omniscient
Allah: S. 3:154
Jesus: Mark 2:8 Revelation 2:18, 23b
The Object of Prayers
Allah: S. 2:186
Jesus: John 14:13-14
Light of the World
Allah: S. 24:35
Jesus: John 8:12, John 9:4-5
Forgiver of Sins
Allah: S. 3:135
Jesus: Mark 2:5-7,10a, Luke 7:47-49
The Truth
Allah S. 20:114
Jesus John 14:6
NT WRITERS: Ephesians 4:20-21
Day of Judgement
Allah S. 89:21-23
Jesus Matthew 24:29-31, Matthew 25:31-34, 41, Revelation 14:14-16
King of kings and Lord of lords
Sahih Muslim, Book 025, Number 5338, see also Number 5339
Jesus Revelation 1:5, Revelation 17:14, Revelation 19:11-16
You quote the Ebionites they don't believe in the virgin birth? Do you think they are correct or the Muslims are correct?
Interestingly we have narration that Muhammad copied from Paul.
However, as it is written:
"No eye has seen,
no ear has heard,
no mind has conceived
what God has prepared for those who love him." (1 Corinthians 2:9)
Narrated Abu Huraira:
The Prophet said, "ALLAH SAID, ‘I have prepared for My righteous slaves (such excellent things)
as no eye has ever seen, nor an ear has ever heard nor a human heart can ever think of.’"
(Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 9, Book 93, Number 589)
@gto21: Around the ninth hour, Jesus shouted in a loud voice, saying "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" which is, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" Mark 15:34. And at the ninth hour, Jesus shouted in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?" which is translated, "My God, my God, for what have you forsaken me?"
@limafoxtrot: Since when Jesus call himself God in the Bible?
“I can do nothing on my own initiative……I do not seek my own will, but the will of Him who sent me.”
@brongz: He can only do what the father does. You prove our point read the chapter. Since you want to help the Muslim. Can you show us, Muhammad, saying he can do only what Allah does?
Your comment is not helping the Muslim since Jesus use the word father. Does Muhammad teach that Allah is a father to no one? Why are you bring evidence that Muhammad contradicts Jesus?
And yes at the incarnation. Jesus is fully human and fully god. If he's fully human he will have a God over him. Jeremiah 32:27. And if he comes as an example for others, he won't come as an atheist. Because of the incarnation, Jesus is also called the heir. Where Muhammad copied. Allah is the best of inheritors/heir. Can you explain from who Allah inherit?
And if Allah is the best of inheritors. That means Allah is in a group of inheritors and the best among them. Who are the other inheritors? That shirk.
@gto21: Copied? I believe from what I studied, Jewish, Christian and Islam is Abrahamic religions that came from the same sources. So, no wonder there are many similarities between them.
Why the difference? There’s for you guys to read the history.
My advice, read the whole book if you have time. It will make sense about what’s wrong or right.
About ‘can only do what the father does’, or is it by father’s permission? Which mean every creation is the same, even the son of Father.
@brongz: You can't have that kind of similarity since being the heir makes no sense in Islam. From who Allah inherits? Based on your logic if I show you similarities between paganism and Islam. From Islamic books, I'll be generous I won't use external sources to make my case. Are you going to accept it's from the same source? If he can do what the Father does it mean he have the same ability as the father. Their things that only God can do and can claim. Does he say he can do every that the father do except for example: giving life, create the world? Is that what the text says? If he lacks any of those abilities he can't do like the Father. The same Gospel of John your quoting shows that Jesus existed before creation. If permission of God, show me where Muhammad said he can do only what Allah does. Can he make such a claim? And did he ever made such claim?
@bargaino: Here the answer by an agnostic whose a new testament scholar. This guys make a living criticizing Christianity. However, even he says no, Paul did not invent Christianity. Did Paul invent Christianity & corrupt the bible? Bart Ehrman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKpRYLAH4h0&t=1s
@gto21: No, the idea that Paul made Jesus up remains a fringe theory. I was not saying that. Merely that Paul put Jesus teaching, with a bit of his own added, and made it into a new religion. Before that, Jesus was just another jewish preacher. (Miracles including resurrections were common in those days apparently.)
But the fact that some people have been able to make serious arguments that Jesus was a creation of Paul, shows how little we really know about Jesus, due to the absence of contemporaneous records.
It is a bit like Socrates, who we mostly only know about via Plato. But at least Plato knew Socrates well, whereas Paul and the other bible authors (except for a few of the letters) never even met Jesus. It is all third hand and more.
@bargaino: You clearly wrote Paul invented Christianity. And you obviously did not watch since the same scholar refute the idea that Paul corrupted the bible. I'm being generous by quoting an agnostic scholar. This guy is more likely to be on your side than my side. You're not even open to listening from scholars on your side.
You clearly wrote Paul invented Christianity.
I said "created". Should have said "founded".
the idea that Paul corrupted the bible
How could he have corrupted something that did not exist? The Pauline letters are the oldest books in the new testament, and most of it was written after Paul's death.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dating_the_Bible#Table_IV:_New…
@bargaino: You have creeds that pre-date Paul. And he writes to already existing believers. Watch the video bro, he tells you it's different sources. Paul did not have access to the other sources. And the other sources did not have access to Paul. Your last two objections are actually addressed in the video. If you watched the video we won't even be having this conversation right now.
If you watched the video we won't even be having this conversation right now.
OK, the guy seems to be respected, so … Arg! He makes assertions with no evidence provided. He lost me 10 seconds in with the circular logic that Paul could not have started Christianity because he persecuted them before joining. But we only have Paul's word for that. There is zero evidence.
(BTW, I'm not arguing that Paul was lying, just that we cannot know.)
It really comes down to what you mean by christian and christianity. I could say that while christianity predated Paul, it was in a form that bore no resemblance to what it became under paul - a separate religion rather than a Jewish sect.
@bargaino: It's recorded by Luke as well not just Paul. Even if you take Paul out of the equation you still have the early creeds and other sources that none of them have access to Paul. I'm being bored, to be honest. Take care.
@gto21: We are just arguing semantics. (I won't start correcting your chronology :-)
Bart Ehrman makes the same point I did: Paul changed Christianity from being a jewish sect, to being a distinct new religion.
@bargaino: Ok if that what you understood from the video. Pretty sure 99.9% of people will hear the opposite.
@bargaino: In addition to switching mid-argument from "created" to "founded", your original pitch was that Christianity was a "cult", not a "sect". Completely different things, dude.
Best to pick one or the other, otherwise it's impossible to discuss rationally. Does Ehrman really say Paul "created" a new "cult"?
@bargaino: Re: "zero evidence"/"we only have Paul's word for it" - are you saying Paul wrote Acts chapter 8 & 9, which, for example, references Ananias specially as essentially saying - I don't wanna meet this guy Saul, he's a bad dude that's infamous for going all Gestapo on us?
How is it "circular" to say he didn't create it if he was fighting it? Isn't that just linear, chronological logic? E.g. "somebody else made the cake, then I ate it" makes sense; "I ate the cake, then I made it" makes no sense at all.
@limafoxtrot: Circular logic is "paul was telling the truth because paul said he was". No independent evidence was offered.
Acts was written long after Paul's death (same anonymous author as Luke) but shows no awareness of the letters of Paul. But that does not mean Acts was not just repeating Pauls claims. There is very little evidence of anything, just old stories. Stories are important, but should not be construed as factual.
Next thing you will be telling us that Genesis is real. Because it says it is.
Signed by Israel Folau?
Lol gold.
That'd be the KJV, not the NRSV.
Almost be a sin to let that bargain slide
Spending 400 bucks on a bible is a no brainer. This bible is worth easily $1200 to any random person on the street.
Sorbent is cheaper and I find it’s more comfortable
Need to raise more money for Pell's defense.
Need to google lectern
Need to OzB a lectern
Christ there's a lot of money to be made from a public domain work…
You only pay for the cover, like how we buy Voss water just for the bottle
I don't like the bottles but love the water
username checks out
The publishers that sell Bible translations are very greedy. I am content with to own a 2nd hand hard cover copy of the King James translation, which of course was around before the 20th Century intellectual property rort.
Sells for 3 times the price everywhere else.
lol. Only to suckers, maybe…
Massive houses for the rulers don't buy themselves you know
Wait, doesn't it also cost x1 Soul ?
The goat's
Random deal of the week.
How many walk amongst us who own a church or have a room in their house with a lectern
Definitely random! Not sure if it's for a laff or genuine bargain for someone in this diverse community. Either way, all good I reckon.
Actually, friends of ours bought an old church. They've left the lecturn in :) There's a copy of "Hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy" on it. They said that was a more realistic story. Mice are everywhere (omnipotent).
*Omnipresent.
Give a Bible out for free, it's a doozy.
Wrap it in leather, make it $1k and then divide the price by three… Ding ding ding. We got a winner!
Amazon Grace, how sweet the sound
You lowered the cost, but OzBargain still frowned
Normal price?
Black Goatskin Leather
The temple may be long gone but apparently the senseless animal sacrifices remain.
I was foolish enough to believe that sacrificing goats was limited to Satanic rituals.
Animal sacrifices are ongoing, and tasty.
So many Maccas deals, most people sacrifice animals for their survival. But I guess that satanic.
@gto21: No. In fact non-theistic satanism generally opposes senseless animal exploitation; LaVeyan satanism definitely and explicitly does.
Remember too that Abel was a shepherd well before Noah's flood, and Yahweh was happier with his animal sacrifices than Cain's plants.
Yahweh has been a sick (profanity) with bloodlust since the beginning.
@fantombloo: In what world do you live? I see more people wearing dead animals. I see more people eat meat. All those people practising satanism?
Their's several reasons why he could have rejected Cain's sacrifice. Even animal sacrifice if not don't properly is rejected.
Instead of criticizing them. I believe they are right to sacrifice animals to survive. And sacrifice an animal to keep warm if necessary.
But that my view. I value human life more than animal. Maybe you value the life of a pig more than human?
Was the goat sacrificed according to abarhamic doctrines before they removed its skin?
It really wasn't a goat..
1 Samuel 18:27
what a bargain…
I only read one book, but it's a good book, don't you know
I act the way I act because the Good Book tells me so
If I wanna known how to be good, it's to the Good Book that I go
'Cos the Good Book is a book and it is good and it's a book
Glad to see some Minchin in these comments.
I wonder how many fires this baby can put out?
How many times can you use it as very expensive toilet roll substitute?
Book length 1325
1325 I'm guessing.
You can probably wash & re-use the goat skin.
goat skin can be the anti contraceptive
… oh wait
Depends how many thoughts and prayers you do.
As the great yet little know xmas song goes, somebody's house always burns at Christmas
Am wondering how many uses I can get smacking cockroaches
It’s year 9012, does young people really believe in religion?
You Philistine Non-believer!!
Well it's pretty clear what I've got to do…time to get smiting!
Samuel 17:46
https://biblehub.com/1_samuel/17-46.htm
This day will the LORD deliver thee into mine hand; and I will smite thee, and take thine head from thee; and I will give the carcases of the host of the Philistines this day unto the fowls of the air, and to the wild beasts of the earth; that all the earth may know that there is a God in Israel.
I'm not sure why this isn't more widely read in school. Perfect children's book.
It is pretty funny, given how the PM is telling people off for scaring the kiddies with talk of Climate change.
XD, smite doesn’t apply to summoners unless you are Zac
I hope their babies are spared during the smiting.
Psalm 137:8
https://biblehub.com/psalms/137-8.htm
Blessed is he who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.…
God will answer your prayer as long as he does not takes it out of context.
The Psalmist is not literally requesting the brutal deaths of children, but is asking that justice be served, can be easily seen from the phrase, "dashing them against the rocks (stones)." As anyone familiar with Babylonian geography can tell you, there were no rocks and stones in Babylon. As noted Old Testament scholar Walter C. Kaiser Jr. writes:
"… Surely someone who goes about stealing babies and slamming them down on the pavement or over a rocky embankment is more than a brute; but is that what we have here? Not at all, for the expression is a hyperbole, typical of the emotional Near East, which consciously exaggerates. The writer, however, locates this psalm in Babylon. One thing Babylon is devoid of is rocks or rocky cliffs. This is so different from Palestine where rocks are all over the place; but not in Babylon. If one were to build in Babylon, he would need to bake mud bricks first; rocks or stones simply do not exist there." (Kaiser, The Old Testament Documents: Are They Reliable and Relevant? [InterVarsity Press (IVP) 2001], p. 213)
Thus, the text is clearly a poetical cry for righteous retribution, i.e. do to them as they did to others, and not a literal description of the kind of punishment to be inflicted on Israel's enemies.
@gto21: Thanks for the geological lesson, I was totally unaware if that.
But the old testament is pretty much the antithesis of the gospels of Jesus which Christians proclaim to follow. In modern terms its like Bin Laden vs Ghandi.
@[Deactivated]: You're welcome, my friend.
I posted a video on the so-called violence in the bible. I'll put the link here as well https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bksANxAv2JA
I might add others later. God bless
The Power of Christ compels you