Could you live on $35/day? Jenny Macklin, the Families Minister, says she could

L-.- on 02/01/2013 - 19:55

WELL since the media's gone all berserk on Jenny Macklin's comments, I thought maybe as OzBargainers we could have a little discussion. (This article might be of interest: http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/macklin-make-the-most…)

Sure $35 isn't a lot, but if you took in some of the OzBargainer spirit, I'm sure you could make ends meet.

SO, if you had $35 a day what would you allocate it to?

Food:
Rent:
Fuel:
Clothing:
Utilities:
Services (Internet, TV, Telephone, Mobile):
Entertainment/Leisure:
Kids? (If you have any):
Savings:

Fill in the blanks. The more detail the better; it'll be interesting to see what people come up with!

General Discussion

Comments

        • AG_ACT on 04/01/2013 - 08:28
          -6

          Quite honestly, if they can't find a job within 6 months, are they really likely to in the future? Why should Australia care about people who don't care for themselves?

          Just to clarify what I meant though, I was referring to the size rather than co-location.

          And obviously, little knowledge is a dangerous thing, I didn't know about the work for Dole thing. What sorts of jobs are they required to do? Something actually useful for the community or just something that was invented to keep people busy?

        • _Bruce_ on 04/01/2013 - 08:44
          +7

          Quite honestly, if they can't find a job within 6 months, are they really likely to in the future? Why should Australia care about people who don't care for themselves?

          Because what else are we meant to do. You are correct some people will never escape the system, but just stopping paying them is BAD for everyone. Have you ever been to a city with high poverty? In my experience one of two things happen:

          1: The homeless fill the city streets. Crime rises and violence increases. Intolerance rises.

          2: The homeless/poor are forced into ghetto areas. These areas are horrible for human rights, crime and violence, but are 'out of sight'. Civil rights everywhere suffer and police are given drastic powers to keep undesirables away from the privileged.

          Many people get outraged at the concept of people on welfare who will never contribute to society, but many people have commented that it is the mark of a good society that is able to look after these people. Although you might think it isn't fair, everyone benefits in the end.

        • AG_ACT on 04/01/2013 - 13:00
          +1

          Again, I'm not suggesting that you stop paying them, all I am saying is that you help the people that want to be helped, not the people looking for a free ride.

          Just think about how much easier it would be for people actually looking for a job to find a job if they had a reasonable amount to live on for upto 6 months. No time limit on the Dole (I don't care if it's 5 years!) just encourages people to be lazy….

          I have lived off $95 a week (admitedly that was 5 years ago, and I was in a regional area, where accomodation was $80, and my food was pretty much 2 min noodles, or cheese and tomato/cucumber sandwiches) I didn't get a hand out from the Govt, and I had to make my savings last atleast 4 years… I managed to survive, study, and find a job! I'm not suggesting that everyone should be subjected to the same pressures I was under, afterall, it was my choice to study in Australia, I could have stayed in NZ, and gotten a scholarship; but handing out $245 a week to people who are not WILLING to work, is just silly.

          Again, I'm all for increasing the unemployment benefit for a specific period of time, and I don't think it should be cut off immediately after that period, but it definately should be reduced to the amount that entitles a person to survive, not to live…. if they want to live, it should be up to them.

        • tsunamisurfer on 04/01/2013 - 13:10
          +1

          The dole should have a time limit with a sliding pay scale.

          For example :

          Year 1 of unemployment : 100% of eligible payment.

          Year 2 of unemployment : 75% of eligible payment.

          Year 3 of unemployment : 50% of eligible payment.

          Year 4 of unemployment : 25% of eligible payment.

          This acts as a disincentive to stay on welfare.

          There are MANY jobs out there, look at Seek.

          The issue is that they believe they are above pushing a broom or flipping burgers.

          They are not.

          The reduction in payment will reinforce that message loud and clear.

        • AG_ACT on 04/01/2013 - 13:33
          +1

          Precisely what I am saying.

          I hope this never happens, but if I ever become unemployed, and if someone can help me find a job, it shouldn't matter what sort of job I get….. If I need to pick up rubbish to keep our streets clean, fantastic, atleast I am contributing to society somehow…

          I wouldn't wish unemployment on anyone, but some of these people (and I am not suggesting that it is all of them) really need a good kick up the backside. I've been trying to find some "unemployed" people to help me landscape my yard, I'm offering them $20 an hour (more than what i get after tax!!!) do you think I can find a single person?

        • Duff5000 on 04/01/2013 - 16:00

          This already exists. Job seeker agencies will organise interviews for job seekers. They have to accept any job offered or they will not get payments any more.

          They just need to crack down on it more.

          Follow up with people that had interviews with and make sure they actually turned up ect.

          RE work for the dole: A guy i know hadnt found a job in a few months so was put down for work for the dole. Was going to be cleaning up the suburb for x number of hours. From memory that was enough to motivate them to get a job faster.

        • dealman on 06/01/2013 - 10:37
          +1

          The reduction in payment will reinforce that message loud and clear.

          Couldn't agree more, there's nothing like a burning in the stomach to light up the fire in the belly.

        • nikey2k27 on 08/01/2013 - 08:15

          ghetto it will be.

        • Skinnerr on 08/01/2013 - 19:56
          +1

          How many are unskilled that someone on the dole could realistically get? Yeh sure i see alot of IT sys op jobs, somehow i doubt someone on the dole has a IT engineering qualification.

          What happens after year 4? Homelessness and crime?

        • Givemethemoney on 08/01/2013 - 21:43

          Retail, Labourers, hairdressers, etc. Not everyone is cut out for a professional life

        • Architectonic on 09/01/2013 - 01:05

          Work for the dole is often a failure in that it costs more than the production output and it has very little effect on employability.

          It is a stick rather than a carrot.

        • leiiv on 11/01/2013 - 17:14

          How about we just put them in prison? All unemployed people, parents on welfare, pensioners, teens that drop out of school all in one mega prison in the middle of nowhere! Out of sight out of mind hey?

          Perhaps here? Right in the middle of desert, but still close to lakes. They can be tasked to terraform the desert and build infrastructures!

    • leiiv on 03/01/2013 - 15:13

      Do they also get free dental health care?

    • Geewhizz on 04/01/2013 - 07:39
      +3

      Food:$50 (this is VERY generous, if you eat veges only it is MUCH cheaper).

      If you eat veges only, you're going to become unwell.

      those on Welfare get free health, and $6 scripts.

      Please note that Welfare recipients get MORE THAN just the $245 / week, there is also :
      Subsidised Utilities.
      Subsidised Shire Rates.
      Subsidised Public Transport (FREE in Perth).
      Subsidised Pharmaceutical.

      What you seem to fail to realise is that not everyone has access to doctors that bulk bill. Many that do bulk bill, only do it for pensioners, ie, a hcc is not considered adequate. Apart from subsidised pharmaceutical, all of the aditional benefits you have listed apply to pensioners, not those who are unemployed.

      Kids? (If you have any): Please do not have children if you are living off Welfare.

      Are you aware that contraceptives are not covered by PBS? When my daughter was briefly unemployed (after moving to a different area to escape an abusive partner) I was mortified to find this out. That's just total lunacy, in my opinion.

      It's totally impossible for anyone who has everything (including good medical and dental health) to start with, to genuinely be able to undertake a challenge such as this. At the end of the day, she won't have the stress of knowing that the power or phone bill is due next week, or the car rego, or the baby that has become ill and needs medication that hasn't been budgeted for. Or the loan repayment, taken on when you thought your job was secure, or the mortgage payment, come to that. Some things are just not optional, and everyone's circumstances are different.

      • tsunamisurfer on 04/01/2013 - 12:43
        +4

        If you eat veges only, you're going to become unwell.

        I see…must tell all the vegetarians that they are unknowingly wilting away.

        If you want Rib Eye, may I suggest you go work for it?

        What you seem to fail to realise is that not everyone has access to doctors that bulk bill.

        Get the bill, go to Medicare office, probably next to the Centrelink office. Claim it back.

        Apart from subsidised pharmaceutical, all of the aditional benefits you have listed apply to pensioners, not those who are unemployed.

        Yes….sorry I was wrong. the PBS doesn't apply to unemployed, please pay the correct full price for your medication.

        Are you aware that contraceptives are not covered by PBS?

        Fail. They are. Even if they aren't please google 'Abstinence'.

        When my daughter was briefly unemployed (after moving to a different area to escape an abusive partner) I was mortified to find this out.

        I would be mortified too if I found out my daughter was unemployed.

        At the end of the day, she won't have the stress of knowing that the power or phone bill is due next week, or the car rego, or the baby that has become ill and needs medication that hasn't been budgeted for. Or the loan repayment, taken on when you thought your job was secure, or the mortgage payment, come to that. Some things are just not optional, and everyone's circumstances are different.

        • Power bills do not just 'pop up', they are scheduled according to your choice, use less power.

        • Phone bill, don't have a landline, they are expensive, use a prepaid mobile. Hint : Phone bills don't pop up either.

        • You cannot afford a car if you are worried about Rego. Please use public transport.

        • You should have been budgeting for medicals from Day one of having a baby, or do you expect your child to never get sick ever?

        • No job is 'secure', your failure to put in place a buffer when taking out a loan is not Julia's fault.

        • Whilst everyone's situation is different there is one constant, they need to be personally responsible but aren't.

        • John Dough on 06/01/2013 - 15:08

          Finally some sense in this discussion.

      • dealman on 06/01/2013 - 10:45

        What you seem to fail to realise is that not everyone has access to doctors that bulk bill.
        Anyone with half a brain should be able to find doctors that Bulk Bill everyone. Here's a start

        http://lmgtfy.com/?q=bulk+billing+doctors+melbourne&l=1
        This list is grossly incomplete, but it just goes to show there are plenty.

        All these clinics bulk bill everyone: http://www.alliedmgp.com.au/

        Are you aware that contraceptives are not covered by PBS?

        They needn't be, If you can't afford contraceptives, you can't afford to have S##. If you thought contraception was expensive, wait till you have kids.

        • Geewhizz on 07/01/2013 - 17:32

          Anyone with half a brain should be able to find doctors that Bulk Bill everyone. Here's a start

          It doesn't require "half a brain" to find something that doesn't exist in many areas of the country. It seems it may come as a surprise to some to learn that not all of of live in capital cities, though.

        • dealman on 09/01/2013 - 19:00

          And the system your supporting is really detrimental to the legitimate job seeker at the difficult time

          True, if you live out in the middle of nowhere all sorts of things from Fuel to groceries to medical care are more expensive. If you are complaining about these costs perhaps you should consider moving.

          My friend you always have a choice !

        • janeymac on 18/01/2013 - 09:15

          Medicare refunds a significant portion of the bill if you pay upfront. Just got to be bothered to fill in paperwork. They even do it online theses days.

        • Geewhizz on 18/01/2013 - 10:04
          +2

          If you are complaining about these costs perhaps you should consider moving.
          My friend you always have a choice !

          Do you honestly think everyone has a choice about that? Some people obviously lead very insular lives.

          The people who are most affected by the greater costs of living in particular areas are often the ones who can least afford to move. And in the case of people who are unemployed (whose income is the subject of this discussion,) Centrelink dictates to many of them that they cannot move, or will be penalised for doing so.

    • shaiguy on 07/01/2013 - 17:11

      Completely agree. As a uni student before I lived on less than that and you learn to know when the deals are and I think it teaches you to also be disclipined and to plan ahead. The dole is NOT intended to support a non-working bludging lifestyle but moreso as an interim measure. I think that perhaps there should be 2 tiers - 1 for those who evidence that they are search for work and those that are just happy bludging off the dole. It has to also be noted that the $245/wk is $245 higher than people in many countries. Couldn't agree more with the statement on welfare and kids… why should my taxes support people to have kids so they can bludge on welfare? What ever happened to work for the dole?

  • Ronnnie on 03/01/2013 - 15:49
    +3

    As somebody already noted, the dole isn't made to live on. Its a temporary payment to get you through until you find work. I've been in period of having no work for upto a few months and haven't even claimed the payment, and just lived off my savings till I found more work. What kind of sucks, someone studying gets less handouts than an unemployed person, where a student has higher expensive and is trying to improve their chances of obtaining employment. I try to keep my costs down and live frugally, so this is what I typically budget a week.

    $100/week rent
    $50/week food
    $25/week electricity (have 500+ credit, so obvsiouly don't use that much)
    $20/week home/mobile/adsl

    I don't have a car, and rarely use any public transport since its virtually non existent anyways. I live close to town and either walk or use bike to get around. Better for your hip pocket and keep healthy. If I had a bigger income though I'd probably do things differently, but I'm pretty sure most people live within their means until they reach 6 figures or beyond per an annum.

  • Gabstardeluxe on 03/01/2013 - 17:30
    +3

    A lot of people on here are completely ignorant. My father passed away in June and I had been caring for him since I was 13. I only found out about Carer allowance when I was 17. I had quit two jobs, failed year 8, and have no education behind me now he is gone. I have renal impairment, a crushed disc in my spine, and suffer migraines up to three times a week, I get hypertension and vertigo. Centrelink says I can't work yet I'm still on newstart.
    I am on $444 a fortnight, we don't get paid weekly. That's $200 a fortnight on rent, $50 for gas, and $50 dollars for electricity. $20 for water. I am repaying an advance loan I had for funeral expenses on the carers $87 a fortnight. That's $407 without petrol for doctors appointments, without my prescriptions paid for, oh and if you expect people to eat unhealthily on high carb, high fat foods that's not possible for some with health problems. Then I bet you will whine that they can't be in poverty because they're fat. Well no, they are budgeting on the cheap foods you expect them to eat.
    There are no share houses where I live, and I am Certainly not ready to see my unit over run by someone with twenty kids to ruin it and knowing I will never get cheap housing again.

    • samfisher5986 on 03/01/2013 - 17:39
      -1

      Sorry for your situation but things could have been done a little different.

      If you are not in a financial situation to pay for a funeral, then funeral insurance should have been arranged.

      If you don't want to live with other people, then you need a job, there is no alternative.

      This part is a total guess, but if you can't work, then shouldn't you be on disability from centrelink? Or is this inability to work only very short and you can start soon?

    • chloden on 03/01/2013 - 17:40
      +1

      I sincerely am sorry to read your story. I know that Centrelink have changed the criteria for the DSP and it sounds as though you have fallen foul to that. I don't know where you are but in Victoria you can seek free legal help from Social Security rights Victoria. I believe that they could help you appeal Centrelinks decision.

    • tsunamisurfer on 03/01/2013 - 17:41
      +1

      1) Believe me your prescription drugs ARE paid for. They would probably be over $100 if it wasn't for the PBS. Your scripts are $6 when others have to pay much more, please recognise when you are being given a major helping hand by the taxpayers of Australia.

      2) Fast food is very expensive, for half the price of a Big Mac Meal, you can buy enough veges and lentils for a hearty vege stew that can be divided into MANY meals. I advocated they eat very healthy and cheaply.

      3) You seem like you are in public housing. That too is paid for by the Taxpayers of Australia. Please recognise you are getting MORE THAN $444 a fortnight.

      • cookie2 on 03/01/2013 - 23:34

        I agree. the exclsuion of meat from your diet as well as shopping smart and by the specials of the week (and in larger quantities if you have a few in the house) can make an enormous difference to food. I guess people on payments that find it tough need to concentrate on saving in areas that they CAN CONTROL.

  • tsunamisurfer on 03/01/2013 - 18:07
    +8

    Guys…

    Look how Welfare is impacting this country's budget.

    http://www.budget.gov.au/2012-13/content/overview/html/overv…

    Income Tax Receipts : $163b.

    Welfare Spend : $132b.

    Welfare alone consumes more than 80% of the income taxes we pay.

    Lets look at other more worrying statistics.

    Defence Spend : $22b
    Education Spend : $30b
    Health Spend : $61b
    Total : $113b.

    We spend MORE on Welfare than we do protecting our country, educating our children and keeping our Health COMBINED.

    Is this the path we want Australia to go down?

    • BinaryPirate on 04/01/2013 - 14:10
      +16

      @tsunamisurfer - You do realise that the bulk of money attributed to welfare goes to people who work, don't you? Family tax benefits, education allowances, childcare rebate, scripts for pharmaceuticals, the now-defunct(??) healthcare rebate, first homeowners/builders grant, etc…

      What's perpetually missing from this debate is the understanding of how much money the govt spends on people who work. The percentage of people collecting newstart, for example, pales into insignificance against those collecting family tax benefits. The argument that people who work are paying dole bludgers to do nothing also applies to those on low incomes having their lifestyle subsidised by people earning higher incomes.

      People who work arguing that those on welfare payments aren't trying hard enough to find a job is no more valid than those earning >$125k pa telling people on $50k pa they're not trying hard enough to earn a decent income.
      Besides which, every single person in this country accepts handouts from the government in one way or another.

      Incidentally, total revenue for 2012/13 is estimated to be $376 billion. Total expenditure for 2012/13 is estimated to be $376 billion with welfare at $131 billion. It's somewhat misleading to represent whole-of-budget costs as a percentage of only one income source - a welfare budget of $131 billion against an MRRT income of $0 looks as equally bad as the example using income tax receipts.

      The rest of the debate about whether it's possible to live off the current newstart allowance - something the government's own report found was not possible - is going to be fatally flawed until people accept that this country is basically a welfare state for every person living in it, without exception. We've even got corporate welfare for companies who don't reside here (GM & Ford being the obvious examples)

      • [Deactivated] on 06/01/2013 - 00:17
        +2

        Probably the most intelligent thing written on Ozbargain. I've debunked similar myths on another website although nowhere near as eloquently. Add in super benefits, very generous tax deductions for the self-employed and to some extent small business and you've got be be very unlucky not to be pocketing a good slice of government money - one way or another.

      • cannedhams on 11/01/2013 - 02:35

        When I last worked in government, I remember the social security budget was $80 billion and of that, Newstart allowance was $5 billion. The big ticket items were parenting payments and aged/veterans pensions.

        Newstart is a pretty modest contribution to the social security budget in the scheme of things.

  • Gabstardeluxe on 03/01/2013 - 18:17

    My pop payed for my fathers funeral but somehow my family put too many memorial things in the paper. Seeing as we opted out for the cremation service it shouldn't have costed more and we opted out for a few things. Somehow we were charged for the bookmarks as well. I think we were ripped off.
    I realize all this, and my last medical assessment didn't have everything written down. So I'm going Tuesday to get my doctor to fill in everything. The thing is that pensioners, who have payed their taxes, and done everything are in the same boat as me.
    My boyfriend recently became redundant (he worked in the mines) he payed up to $2000 in tax per week. It sucks because of the timing. He stayed with me a few days a week after my dad died I guess to look after me. But everything went crap.
    I remember when I was first working, half my pay was taxed for six months and I got $300 back.
    I would just like to see everyone here pay for rates, rent, whatever after living a cushy lifestyle.
    Hopefully my boyfriend will get a job down my way and I'll let him live with me then I won't have to worry about bills so much.
    As a plus my job seeker place is looking for an admin position for me :) and I will be thrilled to be able to afford physio or at least chiropractors relieve pain temporarily.

    Also I'm not talking about fast food. Potatoes, pasta, and high starch foods are bad. I don't know anyone who can afford fast food!

    I see a lot of dole bludgers in the housing commission areas and how they afford drugs and smokes is they borrow off mothers (especially men) and never give their partners any board or shopping money. Thus a vicious cycle. And I know they're not looking for jobs.

    • tsunamisurfer on 03/01/2013 - 18:35
      +8

      Holes in Gabstardeluxe's story.

      1) Funeral Expenses.

      My pop payed for my fathers funeral

      Yet…

      I am repaying an advance loan I had for funeral expenses on the carers $87 a fortnight

      2) You group yourself with Pensioners, who you acknowledge have PAID their taxes.

      Yet..

      My father passed away in June and I had been caring for him since I was 13

      How could you have 'paid taxes' if you have been a carer since 13?

      3) Working life.

      I remember when I was first working, half my pay was taxed for six months and I got $300 back.

      HOW was half your pay taxed? How were you in the top marginal tax bracket without work experience and no education?

      You can't have worked without a TFN because you got $300 back you said.

      4) Boyfriend.

      My boyfriend recently became redundant (he worked in the mines) he payed up to $2000 in tax per week.

      Hopefully my boyfriend will get a job down my way and I'll let him live with me then I won't have to worry about bills so much.

      For your 'boyfriend' to be paying $2000 in tax per week, he would have to be earning more than $5200 / week (or $271k a year).

      I trust you will report to Centrelink and the Department of Housing that you are co-habitating with a person earning in the top percentile of Australian wager earners?

    • johnno07 on 03/01/2013 - 20:08

      As tsunamisurfer pointed out, there is something off about this story. Surely a person you describe as your boyfriend could sling you a few dollars out of his astronomical wage?

    • ubcool on 04/01/2013 - 09:07
      +4

      i wish i had to pay $2000 a week in tax lol.

      • -.- on 04/01/2013 - 13:29
        +1

        What has the world come to! People WANTING to pay more tax :P

        • cwongtech on 04/01/2013 - 13:39

          If you have to pay $2000 a week in tax means you must be pretty damn highly paid :)

        • AlanHB on 07/01/2013 - 09:03
          +4

          If I paid $2000 a week in tax I could afford people to ensure I paid $0.

  • aerona on 03/01/2013 - 21:47

    Pretty easy in Adelaide if you are single and a uni student.

    Living 5km from city 100-120 per week with utilities included
    Other expenses is 15 without a car.

    Once you start getting all these other assets or living alone your bankroll starts to take slow decline. Still manageable though.

    Easily get away with 230 a week but that's only cause SA public transport is really cheap like $1.20 one way.

    Then shopping at target for $5 clothes your good to go.

    • Architectonic on 09/01/2013 - 01:11
      +1

      Look, there is a reason why we spread myths like the idea that Adelaide is boring. ;)

  • Gabstardeluxe on 03/01/2013 - 23:25
    +2

    Holes in my story… Read my previous comment, I left two jobs to care for my father. I was working at 14 and nine months. Thought I could keep up with caring for my father and not having to come home and study. And no, I didn't have a tax file number when I first worked because I had no idea how it all ran. I was too excited about my first jobI did my tax return after 10 months working.
    My pop payed for my fathers funeral and yet again… Read it. He payed for the same plan. We didn't have balloons or flying jets at my fathers funeral or a cremation service… So please read a comment before trying to debunk mine.
    My boyfriend has been made redundant, therefore is on newstart as well.
    A person can stay 3 nights a week without living with you. He doesn't even stay that much. So of course I would tell the proper people, I know when to tell them and how thank you very much. There was no need for a second explanation. Would you like my drivers license number and social security number too? Or is it that you think everyone on newstart allowance or "the dole" as it's called are all bludgers and untrustworthy?
    I guess so. I also guess everyone here putting crap on people doing it tough are mainly right wing?
    Anyway I am off to bed, goodnight lovely people. I only registered here because I think you have it wrong. A lot ruin it by doing drugs, drinking and smoking. But I've seen it, their parents suffer for it.
    If you're wondering why I can spell and have some form grammatical skill. It's because I self educated off my fathers books. I Guess because I'm not "talkin lyk dis" it makes me look like an apologist.
    And I am on my phone, it is old and slow. I do apologize for my spelling and grammar errors as I'm typing faster than its spelling the words out.

  • tsunamisurfer on 04/01/2013 - 01:11

    Holes in GabstarDeluxe's Story part Deux.

    1) You said you cared for your Father from 13. Now you tell us you were working at 14 and 9 months.

    2) What sort of job lets you start without a TFN declaration…but then somehow garnishes you with the mystery documentation to do a tax return?

    3) Your 'boyfriend' earns 270k a year…yet is able to satisfy Newstart's significant Assets Test immediately on redundancy?

    4) We don't call them 'pop' in Australia.

    5) So Pop paid for the Funeral Plan yet you took out a Loan for the funeral. What did you use the money for?

    • samfisher5986 on 04/01/2013 - 01:23

      I called it first.. yet got downvoted :/

    • pinktasha on 04/01/2013 - 14:03
      +7

      we called my grandfather Pop =) just because you don't use the word doesn't mean the whole of Australia doesn't.

      And I remember when I started my first job, I was 15, at woolworths and I didn't have my Tfn yet, and for my first 3 pays they taxed me half my pay as well.

      I don't know if GabstarDeluxe is not telling the truth or whatever, but I find you're nitpicking at it absolutely ridiculous.

      Have a nice day people's.

      • King Steuart on 05/01/2013 - 07:16
        -2

        Oh no, you had to wait until you were 15 and a half to get the tax back? What an amazing story, I can't wait to see the motion picture.

    • [Deactivated] on 06/01/2013 - 00:21
      +1

      Nowhere near the holes in your budget story pal.

    • BinaryPirate on 06/01/2013 - 21:27
      +5

      Dude you've really got to get out in the real world more. If you don't give a new employer your tfn on commencement they're required by the ATO to withhold at the higheast marginal rate until you do. I can't remember having a tfn for my first job or two either.

      As for not calling anyone Pop; my grandfather on one side was called by his Dutch titles. On the other side he was known by nickname one of my cousins gave him. I used to wonder why my grandfathers wasn't called Pop like all my friends were.

      It is possible to take a redundancy and be on Centrelink payments. Did that myself a couple of years ago.
      Just because you don't do something, or don't know how to do something, doesn't mean it isn't or can't be done.

    • penthius on 10/01/2013 - 12:07
      -1

      ENOUGH! Give it a rest! This thread is sickening to say the least but is certainly opening my eyes to the kind of people we have here at Ozbargain!

  • ubcool on 04/01/2013 - 09:50

    i lived on less than 200 a week while working in Caboolture 3 of us paid $80 a week each rent for a studio including bills, 50-60$ a week each food, $20 each week for internet and phone.thats $150 a week. we had old cycles to ride around with and got a taxi once a week to Lidls to get food. cheap cornflakes, tuna sandwich for lunch and pasta,chilli,for dinner, ,it was only for a few months while we saved up and it did get boring occasionally and it was exactly luxury but it is was easy and could of easily done it for even less.

  • derman on 04/01/2013 - 19:32
    +1

    Not near $245 a week but here's some food for thought.
    This is right out of Page 66 of the USYD Undergraduate Guide…

    Most Students spend from $350 to $400 a week.
    Rent: $180+
    Food: $90+
    Utilities: $10 to $20
    Travel: $35
    Laundry: $10
    Entertainment/personal: $50
    Stationery and textbooks: $15

    Take away entertainment and stationary, rent in a cheaper area and don't spend all your time at cafes (shop at aldi) and you should be close to $245.

    • scotty on 04/01/2013 - 23:39
      +2

      I can't believe that's how much "most" students spend.

      When I did my undergrad (18 years ago) I've got around $700/month allowance.

      • Rent: $75/week shared housing with water/electricity included
      • Transport: Bought a 2nd hand bike at the start of the course, lasted me 2 1/2 years until I can afford a car. Used to rode all the way into the lab.
      • Food: Cook everything myself. Cup of chips from uni cafe was considered a treat.
      • No phone. No mobile. No Internet. Almost no entertainment.

      And I still managed to save some money to buy enough PC parts to get me through the course.

      $35/day possible? Sure, for a student that has no life. However after you start working, earn some money to make some adjustment to your lifestyle, I don't think it's possible for me to re-live that again.

      • [Deactivated] on 06/01/2013 - 21:35

        Very good point.

        And to set the record straight, when I did my undergrad degree, it was "almost free". BUT what most commentators forget is that there was NO way you could get any living allowance assistance, unless you indentured yourself to the Teachers training schemes, which could have meant many years in country areas working this off.

        $700X12 months = $8400+ vs what is paid in HECS

        This is something that many recent commentators fail to understand when discussing government aid for students and point back to when it was "free"

        • Givemethemoney on 08/01/2013 - 21:48

          Not every uni student receives government benefits, I never did and I have a HELP debt to boot.

      • cannedhams on 11/01/2013 - 02:43
        +1

        I ate potatoes for my first year. I added pasta to that in my second year and started adding some rice dishes.

        I definitely got by on $50 a week but I honestly think that some of my health issues now boil down to that terrible diet I had when I was a student.

  • bargainjargon on 05/01/2013 - 02:28

    I don't have much of a life now so I don't spend a lot but there are people who depend on me. If I was on my own, I could probably do it. I wouldn't be happy though so I'd wanna try hard to get a job (which, as some have stated, is the purpose of the dole).

  • ethereal88 on 05/01/2013 - 07:28

    Impossible. I just bought my standard ale choice which is a ridiculous $69 a carton. What will you live on? Sausages and potatoes? You'll be in the cemetery within one week. You can't ignore the point that food (and pretty much everything else) in this country is retarded expensive. Fix that first.

  • Givemethemoney on 05/01/2013 - 15:08

    Isn't this whole issue about the reduction or ceasing of access to welfare for single mothers whose kids are all at school?

    If so, then with all kids at school, what stops the mother seeking a job which coincides with school times?

    There are many women who do it whether they are in a relationship or are single mothers.

  • niksrulz on 05/01/2013 - 16:27

    I can easily survive on $1050/month if I don't count my tech purchases and ozbargain deals..
    Infact, I've been an international student for 5 years so I know how to save money.
    Currently if I elaborate my spending it will be
    Rent + Internet + fetch tv + bills + Food = $1000 max.

  • dealman on 05/01/2013 - 17:09
    +7

    Could you live on $35/day?

    Why would you ? It's far too easy to get out and make some money, it's the land of OZ, Come on people.

    Anybody who says he can't live on the dole is missing the point , the Dole is not "to live on". It should be just enough to keep you off the streets, if it is enough to live on then where is the incentive to work and move ahead in life.

    Anyone on the dole should be no better off in time or money than any one working and paying his own way.

    Hope some day shame returns to the dole takers, for the rest of us working types there is Ozbargain to stretch our thin pennies further.

  • Givemethemoney on 05/01/2013 - 18:00
    +2

    There are also several websites were you can pick up free things like furniture which will save thousands

    http://au.ziilch.com/listing/26628/Free_Italian_Leather_2_se…

  • eve on 05/01/2013 - 20:40

    Off topic…

    The Spelling Police say: "Could of" is a common heterographic misrepresentation of the word "could've" (could have).

    (So say the Spelling Police, not me.)
    =D

  • cycleri3 on 05/01/2013 - 23:23

    I could do it easily, mostly due to being on a vegetarian diet. Even the $30 amount is very generous especially if you shop Aldi and look for specials in Coles/WW, my real food expenses have been lower than that at times not counting eating out but that's avoidable.

    Food (vegetarian, mostly eat rice/pasta/bread/veges/fruits/beans) $30
    Share house rent including utilities $120
    Myki Zone 1 (28 day - $120) $30
    Mobile $7
    Other expenses - leisure, clothing, eating out, savings etc $58

    = $245

    I could probably say save $20-30/week on this budget when there aren't some odd expenses like medicine/doctors.

    But if i had no job I would get 0 benefits not being an Australian and would leave the country first.

  • linz88 on 05/01/2013 - 23:54

    Once you cut out entertainment/leisure, eating out and clothes, I don't see how Newstart is inadequate.
    You don't need to buy clothes every week, make your own lunch and coffee instead, do as much cooking as possible, and shop at the local markets where you'll often find cheaper fruits and vegetables.

    The problem is that when you want to have everything, and expect Newstart to cover all expenses then that becomes a problem.

  • peterpeterpumpkin on 06/01/2013 - 13:23
    +1

    I noticed a lot of commenters say they only pay $100/week for renting a room. Do any of you live in Sydney and if so, where? As an Eastie I've always wondered where a cheap, relatively safe area in the west would be with good access to public transport. When I checked Gumtree a while back options in this price range were sparse. I guess it helps to share a rented house with friends rather than rent a room from a stranger since it turns out much cheaper out west.

    Annoyingly, I've been working out west lately and the lack of trains in the south-east means a 2 hour commute one-way. But then again I haven't been mentally re-programmed for living an hour away from a beach. I may as well live in London again (shudders…).

    • bargaino on 06/01/2013 - 17:10

      I may as well live in London again

      I found it hard to take any pity on the London beggars. If you are poor, why on earth would you be in London? Move!!
      Nowadays, Sydney is the same way.

      • peterpeterpumpkin on 06/01/2013 - 21:23

        http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205553/Professional…

        Other than the fakers, the rest often have mental health issues or more rarely, a different perspective on what constitutes "quality-of-life" (much like the beggars in the Sydney CBD and worldwide, for that matter).

        It's rare to see a happy beggar in "active begging-mode". If I was one of the London fakers, even if I could overcome the shame of being deceptive I would hate having to put on an incessant fake frown more than anything else. Maybe the politicians put them there to convince everyone to cheer-up about their own circumstances :)

  • ozzy on 06/01/2013 - 18:32

    so u have $245 a week.

    Food: $70
    Rent: $0 i own my house
    Fuel: $0 no car $10 for bus per week
    Clothing: $15
    Utilities: $100
    Services (Internet, TV, Telephone, Mobile): $30
    Entertainment/Leisure: $10
    Kids? (If you have any): Dont have kids
    Savings: $10 saved. : )

    • tonyjzx on 06/01/2013 - 20:02
      +1

      a question for you…

      you own your own house outright? that makes you pretty unique and pretty immune from one of the biggest problems in australia

      even if you do own your own house you are up for a fair bit as far as council rates and maintenance goes

      • Duff5000 on 07/01/2013 - 09:21
        +1

        Life would be so much easier without a mortgage. We bought our place around 10 years ago, would be much harder again if we had only just got into the market (house prices have tippled)

        • [Deactivated] on 07/01/2013 - 11:02
          +1

          (house prices have tippled)

          Yea just another thing wrong with todays society, houses that over indulge.. :)

        • tonyjzx on 07/01/2013 - 17:18

          people dream of owning their house outright before they're too old and decrepit to enjoy it…

          if you have no mortgage and your income goes into investments and stuffing around, sure that's the life

  • lostn on 07/01/2013 - 13:30
    +1

    If Jenny lives with her parents and doesn't need to pay her share of the bills and board, or lives on smart buy 2 min noodles then it might be doable. For the average independent adult though, it's unlikely. This is poverty level income. In many countries you could easily live on $35 a day, but Australia has some of the highest costs of living in the world.

  • WT on 07/01/2013 - 20:06
    +2

    $35 is heaps

    When I was a teenager, I knew a lot of people, on the dole, housing commisions etc.

    A good portion would budget like this:
    $20 Pot
    $10 loaf of bread, 2L bottle of coke, hot chips
    $5 long neck

    Nothing else mattered.

    When I say a lot, 1, maybe 2 didnt do this and got themself a job, moved away from the ghetto and never returned.

    The rest are probably still pumping out babies to get the baby bonus, school bonus.

    Rant on:
    They should also make it mandatory that you need the injection contraception if your on the doll/ chile care pension.

    The reason why they are up in arms, you can buy a stick and a pack of smokes for $35 per day

    • lostn on 08/01/2013 - 00:47
      +3

      All teenagers can live on $35 a day… If they live with their parents.

      Not everyone is a teenager.

    • Skinnerr on 08/01/2013 - 21:01
      -1

      @ contraceptive needle - Only in china/north korea would this happen lol.

  • achandrasiri on 08/01/2013 - 09:55
    +1

    a few years back, circumstances dictated that me and the missus lived off about $1400 a month for a year or so. (No it was not the dole, we worked our asses off for it)

    Food: 200 (Springvale market & Aldi for groceries FTW!! so much cheaper than Woolies and Coles)
    Rent: 800 (Student accommodation)
    Fuel: 120 (Pizza delivery meant that a tank a week was normal, but fuel was only 1.08 a liter)
    Clothing: Occasional
    Utilities: around about 100
    Services (Internet, TV, Telephone, Mobile): 100 (internet was a must have for one of the jobs i did)
    Entertainment/Leisure: occasional eating/going out with mates.
    Kids? (If you have any): nope
    Savings: Unfortunately, nothing was left for savings after the necessities were paid for :)

    35 a day, isn't entirely non-doable(if thats even a word), but it does mean that you need to give up on pretty much all luxuries and hope and pray that no emergencies arise.

    Edit: should also mention that, naturally, i wouldn't want to do that again.

  • BinaryPirate on 08/01/2013 - 13:05
    +2

    I'm not sure whether to find it suprising or par for the course that those arguing for being able to live on Newstart, in virtually every example given, have neglected to included dental costs, medical expenses such as scripts and billing gaps, clothes, haircuts, dry cleaning for those needing to prepare a suit for job interviews, telco costs (while not excluded for every example have been overly simplified and under-funded),

    This doesn't even include costs that people usually have for those prior to exiting the work force. Things like rego and fuel, vet bills, more expensive telco & other service contracts, health insurance. Also, as was pointed out by one person, this is mainly focused on single parents who are now receiving $130/fn less and have one or more kids to support already, without without taking a massive income cut because the govt stupidly promised a surplus in a rapidly receding world economy.

    The alternative strategy to this big stick of poverty approach could have been to provide people with an incentive to rejoin the workforce. Maybe a tax rebate after 12 months of work. It's not like the people of this country ever begrudge receiving a handout if the recipient is working.

    • Skinnerr on 08/01/2013 - 21:17

      @ binary not trying to s*** on your argument but those are 1st world problems (for want of a better term) and there are smart ways around this, think back to before there were shopping centres and 7/11's everywhere.
      Doctors are bulkbilled - $0; Medication almost always pbs subsidised - <$10; clothes You pay for what you get is somewhat true with clothes as kmart/big w are generally crap unless you get the 'name brand' slazenger etc. premium brands (lol). Target is generally the best of the 3 but you pay a bit more. Also in todays throwaway society op shops arent as scummy as what they used to be so id average this to $50 every few months (50 goes a long way in a decent op shop) - say $10 a week; drycleaning: what suit??? $0 drycleaning is for the 9-5 'suits', an iron is sufficient; telco: im on iinet naked and have been for 4 years which is $60 pm which is 100gb data and free unlimited voip calls to any landline in aus. $20 clipper or 10 haircuts in footscray/st albans every so often is peanuts.

      Pets/cars/phone contracts are a luxury on the dole and not viable unless you are working/spending all the allowance on those. When you see flash lookin cars at the next comission flats you go past, there is 100% chance they didnt buy it on the dole alone (aka they are exploiting the system/just visiting?). Go down richmond flats and see how many mercs there are around the walk ups as the doctors in the area use their mothers HC flat as some sort of tax haven/scam.

      The one thing you're right on is dental care. I neglected dentist costs to my own cost and had one rot on me, had to be removed. Dentist care is rather expensive - the cost to have it and 1 wisdom tooth removed was $650 (medicare subsidised luckily under health care plan).

      • gilbarc on 08/01/2013 - 21:31
        +4

        So when you lose your job, you should just give away your pets? And you don't see any problem with this?

        • Skinnerr on 09/01/2013 - 00:49

          Check out how many free pets there are on gumtree that people are trying to give away.

        • gilbarc on 09/01/2013 - 13:06

          Check out how many free pets there are on gumtree that people are trying to give away.

          And I repeat: you don't see any problem with this?

        • AlanHB on 09/01/2013 - 13:36

          Pets/Kids

          If you can't afford them, you shouldn't have them.

          Is there a problem? Well it sure was a crappy choice to get them.

        • gilbarc on 09/01/2013 - 15:02
          +2

          Presumably, they could afford to have them when they first got them.

      • BinaryPirate on 09/01/2013 - 02:03

        Sorry, I thought we were talking about a first world country. Not everyone receiving govt benefits like Newstart rolled straight onto them from wherever they left off with school and/or living at home. 14,000 former public servants in Qld alone, for example, would need to take time to try and get out of their telco contracts, find someone to take the remaining portion of their salary packaged lease, etc…

        Not all doctors are bulk-billed. Try living in a regional community. Essentially every single medication that's not classed as experimental and is prescribed for treatment in Australia is PBS subsidised for every person with a script. Not all of them are $4 with a healthcare card. My most expensive was just under $90 with a healthcare card.
        Naked internet? Try getting that in all locations. One of my neighbours can't even get basic ADSL and there's bugger all 3G coverage at their place.
        No one included a clothes budget in their For arguments. In most even a thrift shop purchase pushes them over the limit.
        Point me in the direction of a $20 haircut for women please?
        At a guess I'd say you could make do with an ironed suit because you've never applied for the sort of role where an ironed suit doesn't cut it. Besides, who do you think the '9-5 'suits'' are before they become 9-5 'suits'?
        etc…
        etc…
        All this was really to demonstrate additional costs left out of the examples given; examples which were based on people's own experiences in or shortly after their uni days which took into account their circumstances only. The single comment I'll make about your flash looking cars diatribe is that your prejudice is showing.

        Skipping merrily past the missing of the point, you've highlighted another major demographic affected by the outcome of these debates yet so often ignored because the focus is held firmly on those the community has decided are dole bludgers.
        In truth, people from all walks of life, all ages, all professions rely on the govt for support, not just educated males in their early-twenties with no dependents.

        At least that answers the OP's question.

        • tsunamisurfer on 09/01/2013 - 12:27
          +1

          Binary…

          Just because we live in a 'First World' country does not mean you get to spend on discretionary items on Welfare.

          Lets break down some of what you had listed :

          1) Clothes - Clothes are cheap @ places like Kmart. Alternatively go to the Op shops. Or will only Hugo Boss suffice?

          2) Haircuts - Buy a $15 clipper and have someone at home do it for you. You don't need Derek Zoolander hair to get by.

          3) Dry Cleaning for 'suits' - Just how dirty are these 'interviews'?

          4) Vet bills - You are struggling to feed yourself, why have you got pets as well?

          5) 'Other service Contracts' - What other 'services' are you engaging? Please do not say 'Foxtel'.

          6) Health insurance - You have no money, why would you go and BUY health insurance to expose yourself to the premium AND the gaps? Wouldn't you be better off in the public system (that taxpayers pay for)?

        • Skinnerr on 10/01/2013 - 09:57

          Exactly. Nailed everything, which was my point exactly. Something like %90 of the population live in the metro areas of australia, and you give us some example of country life? Where EVERYTHING is more expensive in general? Very poor argument binary, its like raising an argument for the cost of living expenses in Kalgoorlie, of course its gonne be high.

        • BinaryPirate on 16/01/2013 - 06:04

          Lolz, I'm not going around in circles again simply because you two can't see it from anyone's perspective but your own.

      • spiderpig on 13/01/2013 - 04:15

        There are places which provide free hair cuts e.g. colleges for hair dressing, beauty etc for both men and women.

        Re: dental work, concession card holders can access free dental work at government funded dental hospitals

        • BinaryPirate on 16/01/2013 - 06:06

          Dental work is only accesible if the person is in pain and wants their teeth removed with a five year wait to be considered for advanced dental work to fill in the gaps. Obviously a person's prospects of getting off welfare drop considerably when their front teeth are taken out :(

  • kolorijo on 08/01/2013 - 15:28
    +1

    Could I live on $35/day. Yes I could. Do I want to? No, I don't.

    Filling the blanks (living like an international student)

    Food: Instant noodles, fried eggs, spams, mince meats, rice (lots of them - so I wont feel hungry) and get my fruit and veges from paddys market (sydney) on Sunday after 5 PM - 5 dollar could get me enough fruits and veges for the whole week.

    Rent: Cheap boarding house, $100/week - $120/week, bills included (normally they do have wifi too)

    Fuel: No car - no fuel, get a travelten from the suburb to the city (pay only what you used, tag a long with a friend who has a car if you can)

    Clothing: Go to flea market, you will be surprised with what you can get for $5

    Utilities: All bills included in the rent

    Services (Internet, TV, Telephone, Mobile): Get a cheap tablet - ainol tablet and utilise free wifi, look in gumtree for free CRT tv and digital setop box, look for a really cheap prepaid mobile phone - get a simcard from crazyjohns for $1 or so and buy a flatchat $95 credit that will last you the whole year, make sure you are the one that being called, not calling people to save on your credit.

    Entertainment/Leisure: Free TV or even DVD (go to flea market to buy used DVD for $2/each or borrow DVD from your friends) if you could get a free player from gumtree. You could go to the park, darling harbour for free

    Kids? (If you have any): I dont have any kids

    Savings: Not interested in counting, but there should be enough money to save

  • maximum on 09/01/2013 - 23:58
    +1

    The $35 a day is the maximum newstart allowance for a single person with no rent assistance. Could I live on it a day? Yes but would I want to - no way. i guess that is an incentive for me to save and to keep building skills so that i will never be out of work.
    There are number of ways that people can stretch their budgets. In my local area we have community garden which you can trade work hours for food , a food bank where you can do volunteer work in exchange for food , and a fantastic library which can provide most of your entertainment needs for free - DVDs , books , cds and Internet access.
    Even "unexpected" costs like funeral costs can be avoided if you plan ahead. I have organised to donate my body to the university, when they are finished they will cremate me and return my ashes to my family. Now that's budget.

  • dragon7 on 10/01/2013 - 14:39
    +3

    I lived on less than that whilst studying in Sydney. Here is the break down per week:
    Rent: $80 (a partitioned section of the living room in a shared house)
    Bill: $10 (shared)
    Food: $70
    Bus ticket: $20
    Incidentals: $20

    Mind you, i'm an international student from Asia and we learn to live modestly, even on bare minimum. I guess OZ is a lucky country, so people will keep complaining.

    • [Deactivated] on 11/01/2013 - 12:09

      …a partitioned section of the living room in a shared house

      How many were in the house?
      Did it breach local housing regulations - regulations designed to ensure the safety & well-being of the whole community, especially in case of fire?

      Guests to this country should respect our local laws, or get out.

      • Givemethemoney on 11/01/2013 - 22:24

        I have heard about this in apartments and the landlords were Australian citizens

        • cwongtech on 14/01/2013 - 19:25

          I know of a guy/landlord who is doing exactly this, though it's not in an apartment, just his backyard.

          Guests to this country should respect our local laws, or get out.

          Um, it's the landlords who are creating the illegal partitioned housing. The "Guests to this country" are just trying to save money, some of them don't have the luxury to afford not to be in illegal partitioned housing.

        • [Deactivated] on 16/01/2013 - 23:53

          …it's the landlords who are creating the illegal partitioned housing.

          Well they should be taken out & shot, on the assumption we can't deport.

          I like being hardline now & again…

          But yes, hotbedding (same bed, multiple people, different sleep shifts), overcrowding and unlawful partitioning is rife esp in Sydney. Problem is when there's a fire all hell breaks loose.

          Mind you that's not the only problem.

          Guests to this country should respect our local laws, or get out.

          Well i'm sorry but that's simply not a balanced statement, as made clear by cwongtech.

        • cwongtech on 17/01/2013 - 00:25

          Well.. if it helps, the guy I know does it is in his own backyard, not in an apartment…

          Well i'm sorry but that's simply not a balanced statement

          I'm so confused.. that's your comment before O_O

        • [Deactivated] on 17/01/2013 - 00:31

          I'm so confused…

          Well yes, i guess i clarified my position. The word 'freckle' is in my name for a reason.

  • earths_pacifist on 10/01/2013 - 16:14

    I did it in adelaide and quite comforatbly.

    Rent: $85pw incl bills (shared with 2 friends)
    Food: $60pw
    Fuel: $30pw
    Rego: $15pw
    Phone credit: when i had spare cash
    Clothes: only at christmas
    Dental: didnt go til i went back to work
    Medical: sucked it up at home
    Recreation: $8 pool night at local pub - included one drink and paid for 1 out of roughly 5 games shared between our friends.
    Smokes: $15pw
    Savings: $10pw
    Left me roughly $20 for others

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