ING Immediately Restricted My Friend's Account (I Referred Him) - Any Ideas???

Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 13:33
Last edited 06/06/2024 - 13:52

Hey guys, so I've been trying to refer a whole bunch of friends with the latest $100 promotion.

I've referred at least 10 people so far with no issues whatsoever, however one guy who I referred, had his account almost immediately restricted.

To make matters worse, there's $1000 STUCK in that account, and ING support are now demanding he verified 3 pieces of ID at a local police station?!?!

Summary of events:
1) He signed up with my links, uploaded the required documents
2) I offered to send him the $1k to help make the process quicker (have done this for others as well without issue)
3) He put the $1k into savings, and then back to everyday account, but when the then tried to send back to me, his accounts became inactive, and he received an email saying he's been restricted. Leaving the $1k in limbo.
4) Upon contacting them, they asked for live photos from his phone of him and ID documents.
5) Now they're demanding he goes to a local police station, certified 3 pieces of ID, and then send it to them.

Can anyone advise what's happened here? He's a normal honest guy, who's done nothing wrong BUT signing up to ING with their literal referral requirements! How is this acceptable?

TIA

Financial

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Comments

  • spackbace on 06/06/2024 - 13:34
    +6

    Now they're demanding he goes to a local police station, certified 3 pieces of ID, and then send it to them.

    That's normal for remote AML

    • Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 13:34

      Thanks for the quick reply - can you please explain what remote AML means?

      • spackbace on 06/06/2024 - 13:35
        +21

        Was adding this as well:

        They probably think you're gaming the system and creating fake accounts, or using stolen details and committing identity fraud

        Can you explain what remote AML means?

        https://www.austrac.gov.au/business/core-guidance/customer-i…

          • spackbace on 06/06/2024 - 16:32
            +39

            @Uncle Roger: How do they know that? You're transferring money back and forth to these accounts rather than them using them as normal day-to-day accounts

            • Sinnerator on 09/06/2024 - 08:15

              @spackbace: surely large companies know that a percentage of customers legally game the system for rewards and referrals
              and the notion of using stolen id's creating fake id's for $100 referals is laughable, wouldn't a fraudster go for something more profitable knowing their id's will burn out over time

          • spackbace on 06/06/2024 - 17:05
            +19

            @Uncle Roger: Ok let me put this more simply…

            Let's say you had 4x peoples' identity documents. You now proceed to:

            1. Using a vpn, setup each account using the identity documents and easily obtainable email and mobile number
            2. You now transfer $1,000 from your main account to each of these dummy accounts. Back and forth it goes between the 4 accounts
            3. Once they each receive the bonus money, you transfer the money back to your main account and close the dummy accounts down.

            Now, clearly you're not committing identity fraud coz you'd be stupid to admit that to a public forum, but you should hopefully be able to work out how the financier could come to this conclusion.

            So now your friend is the unlucky one who has caused too many red flags to be shown, so now they get the stuff around rather than you.

          • bamzero on 07/06/2024 - 13:17
            +17

            @Uncle Roger: You said you've transferred the $1k for others. From the same account?
            ING will just see multiple new accounts being created, and $1k being transferred in from the same source.
            Of course it will look a bit dodgy from their end.

          • jwl81124 on 07/06/2024 - 15:33

            @Uncle Roger: they are very bad; they try everything won't give me 2 referral bonuses as well. So, I am not using ING anymore, then they keep sending me a lot of referral bonus with the other bonus as well, I just ignore them.

            • KinderBueno on 08/06/2024 - 22:22

              @jwl81124: In my case they won't give me interest for about 5 Months even though I had my pay go in and used it as every day account completing necessary transactions to comply with interest rate bonus so I transfered all my savings to a different bank. They are shit bank to deal with.

      • RTX9090Ti on 08/06/2024 - 09:13
        +1

        When you say your 'friend' it actually meant yourself?

    • spackbace on 06/06/2024 - 17:09
      +20

      And here we go:

      https://campaigns.ing.com.au/refer_75

      If you use this offer in a manner that is not satisfactory to us or in line with the intent of the offer (such as sharing your referral code on the 'OzBargain' website or other similar websites, or advertising or marketing your referral code), we may refuse to pay the cash reward (including in respect of any or all referrals made in relation to the offer). This includes conduct on your part which is designed to undermine the fair and intended operation of the offer.

      • rambao9 on 08/06/2024 - 13:23
        +6

        Lol, it actually says Ozbargain wtf

        • spackbace on 08/06/2024 - 13:25

          Yeah, has done for some time

        • capslock janitor on 08/06/2024 - 14:39
          +2

          OZB PROFESSIONALS AT IT AGAIN

  • Hybroid on 06/06/2024 - 13:35
    +2

    Sounds like he triggered a security flag in the system for some reason none of us would know. Maybe money laundry?

    Comply with ID verification request or forfeit the cash I guess.

  • Dollar General on 06/06/2024 - 13:37
    +12

    He’s taken your $1K

    • Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 16:25

      Na na, like I said he's a mate who I've known since primary school. I'm not using any stolen details and neither is he, I just feel bad that he has to go through this

  • MS Paint on 06/06/2024 - 13:38
    +7

    there's $1000 stick in that account

    What does a $1000 stick look like?

    • Dollar General on 06/06/2024 - 13:48
      +5

      It’s a Chanel stick

      • MS Paint on 06/06/2024 - 14:15
        +10

        That makes scents. Cheers

        • Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 15:26

          At least its not another gift card post haiyaaa

    • DashCam AKA Rolts on 06/06/2024 - 16:47
      +1

      Stick is stuck. Cheers.

      • tooblue on 06/06/2024 - 22:40
        +1

        Where is your stick stuck in?

  • screensaver on 06/06/2024 - 13:42
    +13

    they can see hes trying to send the 1000 back to you, it all looks suspicious to them, trying to game the system

      • atrolgehapis on 07/06/2024 - 07:48
        +34

        "send him the $1k to help make the process quicker (have done this for others as well without issue)"

        Are you serious?

  • PissLUR on 06/06/2024 - 13:51
    +2

    you can go to other places to certify document(s).

  • CyberMurning on 06/06/2024 - 13:55
    +3

    Just do it
    As nike says

  • Sye on 06/06/2024 - 13:58
    +4

    offered to send him the $1k

    Can I please have $1k?

  • SBOB on 06/06/2024 - 13:59
    +19

    2) I offered to send him the $1k to help make the process quicker (have done this for others as well without issue)
    3) He put the $1k into savings, and then back to everyday account, but when the then tried to send back to me, his accounts became inactive, and he received an email saying he's been restricted. Leaving the $1k in limbo.

    Maybe because as far as ING is concerned, this screams 'same person scamming referrals'?

      • SBOB on 06/06/2024 - 17:01
        +10

        The bank's taking your word for proving your identities when signing up (with some level of verification)

        Lets assume you and your friend were the same person trying to scam referral $
        That flow of $ would be the same as what you just described.
        Not really a shock the most basic of fraud detection software flagged it as 'hey, this looks suss'

      • matt_will_fix_it on 08/06/2024 - 06:07

        Are you sure? Sounds like you are asking friends to churn accounts. Those is against their terms and conditions. See the extract from those post
        https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/15350654/redir

  • Jimothy Wongingtons on 06/06/2024 - 14:11
    +4

    aiyah

  • p1 ama on 06/06/2024 - 14:46
    +21

    Can anyone advise what's happened here? He's a normal honest guy, who's done nothing wrong BUT signing up to ING with their literal referral requirements! How is this acceptable?

    Sigh, and this is why we can't have nice things. It's clear that you've been picked up by some KYC / AML algorithm, and I'm not surprised. If I were looking at your patterns, I would also raise a red flag about identity fraud, and the potential of you just using the stolen identity of a whole bunch of people to try and scam and abuse the referral promotion.

    The irony of all of this is that you are literally scamming the referral promotion. Your friend could technically just ignore ING, and you're the one who will be out $1,000.

    • SBOB on 06/06/2024 - 14:59
      +3

      plot twist, there is no "friend" ;)

    • Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 16:34
      -3

      I don't understand all the negativity here and assuming that I'm scamming everyone with false information!?

      I'm literally messaging my friends, encouraging them all to sign up for what I think is a great promotion!

      I mean are you trying to say that anyone who refers a whole bunch of people gets flagged for potential fraud?

      • DingoBilly on 06/06/2024 - 16:47
        +21

        You know, generally if everyone is telling you something you should reflect on that and think about why they're telling you that.

        The issue isn't so much that you're referring many people, but that you're also sending money into and out of those accounts. That looks dodgy as hell.

      • randomusername2017 on 06/06/2024 - 16:48
        +3

        I offered to send him the $1k to help make the process quicker (have done this for others as well without issue)

        Flagged this time…

      • p1 ama on 06/06/2024 - 22:01
        +8

        I don't understand all the negativity here and assuming that I'm scamming everyone with false information!?

        And how many of the friends you've gotten onto this promotion have become ING customers?

        Don't play dumb. You are sending them $1,000, they then send you back the $1,000 and you keep your money, they never touch their ING account again, then you go and find the next person to put their details into ING and rinse and repeat.

        Personally, I'm no fan of banks, so good on you for getting your money's worth out of them, but what you're doing is pretty stupid and you were always going to get caught out sooner or later.

        I mean are you trying to say that anyone who refers a whole bunch of people gets flagged for potential fraud?

        Anyone can be flagged for potential fraud for any reason - banks always take the approach that if anything looks suspicious, it will get flagged. They are required to do this by law. How well they do it is a different matter, but they have the responsibility to ensure the integrity of their accounts.

      • gromit on 07/06/2024 - 17:59
        +4

        referring a whole bunch of people likely did NOT get you flagged, transfering money back and forth between the accounts to get the bonus almost certainly got you flagged.

  • BOGOF on 06/06/2024 - 15:05
    +1

    Two scenarios likely to play out.

    1. Friend goes to police to verify id. Police interested why, so investigate potential money laundering or anti-terrorist crimes…..and interview you. All clears, and you get your money back.

    2. Friend says "stuff that for a game of soldiers, I'm not getting involved, not my money". You lose $1000 which is equal to the amount of money you were attempting to game.

    Good luck with that!

    • Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 16:36

      My friend is happy to help out, he's as confused and annoyed as I am that would should have been a simple sign up promotion, is now becoming an absolute headache

    • ValueInvesting on 06/06/2024 - 19:10
      +4

      Two scenarios likely to play out.

      Friend goes to police to verify id. Police interested why, so investigate potential money laundering or anti-terrorist crimes

      Why on earth would the police investigate anything? They couldn't be less interested why someone wants a copy of their ID certified.

  • randomusername2017 on 06/06/2024 - 15:26

    Roger Dodger ..back from the bottom of the harbour….

  • redfox1200 on 06/06/2024 - 15:36
    +2

    ill use your link if you send me 1k

  • leiiv on 06/06/2024 - 16:42
    +6

    That is because you sent your friends $1000.
    If you "have" to do that, send it to their non-ING bank account first.

      • Uncle Roger on 06/06/2024 - 20:21
        -6

        Thanks lol. At least someone seems to understand what I'm going through lol

        • regenade on 07/06/2024 - 23:49

          Very likely you will get reported to Austrac and if the choppers don't have much to do, you might get lucky and get an early morning 4am knock from them

      • capslock janitor on 08/06/2024 - 14:43

        "friend" spotted

  • miwahni on 06/06/2024 - 21:44
    +2

    If ING can see money going into a number of people's accounts all from the one source (you), not only could they be considering possible ID take but it's quite possible that they are now looking at these people as being money mules ie setting up accounts for someone to wash illegal funds through. Hence the request to provide the certified ID at a police station. Annoying and inconvenient for sure, but part of FI's Austrac obligations to investigate anything that flags as suss.

  • runamuck on 07/06/2024 - 01:04
    +4

    This sounds suss. Why would you send $1k to all your 10+ friends?? You mentioned to make process quicker but how much time you really saving? None of your friends got their own accounts that they can send the money to their ING account?

  • 82norm on 07/06/2024 - 08:08
    -2

    I don’t see anything wrong with what OPs doing. May not be 100% ethical, but unless the bank has clauses stipulating such activities , go for it. Just get your mate to validate the ID’s. Now for all those righteous Ozb, opposed to this potential loophole…. You go to Woolies and there is an offer of a carton of say 24 cans of Pepsi, Sunkist, etc $12.00. Offer ONE carton per person…. Is anyone (except for smartarse responses) you’re telling me you’re not going come back for a second, third at that price?
    OPs tactics are not too dissimilar.

    • DingoBilly on 07/06/2024 - 08:22
      +5

      Noone is saying OP is doing anything wrong, just pointing out why he's likely been (rightfully) flagged as that was his question.

      It's likely just an automated system the bank set up to catch fraud. We're not saying it's fraud, it's just a standard security check that any good bank would have.

    • justworld on 07/06/2024 - 09:12
      -2

      There's nothing wrong with it but unfortunately the bank will freeze the accounts - not on "money laundering" (lol) grounds like all the bank ass-kissers are saying but because it's obvious that their promotion is being gamed. If OP really wanted to do it properly he'd need to transfer the $1k to his friends' related (non ING) account first so that there wasn't a single origin of all the money and he would also need the $1k to be 'given back' to him at some much later date. Doing it too clustered together means the bank realises and freezes money.

      I had the same thing happen to me when I roped a bunch of mates into registering for betting sites back when Betfair had a massive promo. Unfortunately betting agencies aren't allowed to have those promos any more but it was good while it lasted.

    • toniyellow on 07/06/2024 - 10:14
      +3

      He’s copping a lot of flack for being so unstrategic about it. Referral behaviour in the past got ING to hate ozbargain so much they specifically reference it in the fine print. https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/15350654/redir

      Sure go back to Woolies multiple times for the ‘one per person’ offer. But choose a different store, or return later in the day at least. Don’t walk out of the registers, back inside 2 minutes later and be outraged about the fact they recognise you.

      Very nice for his friends as well that he got so greedy to get his referrals as fast as possible he tripped the bank’s suspicions and now they’re all associated with his behaviour.

      • justworld on 07/06/2024 - 18:47
        +1

        While this is all true, at the same time I wouldn't blame the poster for just trying to take advantage of a bullshit bank promotion. Banks are greedy and will try to skew promotions any which way benefits them. They don't play a fair game.

    • gromit on 09/06/2024 - 07:47

      "Whilst this is not an exhaustive explanation, we consider that conduct which is designed to undermine the fair and intended operation of an offer will be inappropriate. For example, this will likely include behaviour which is outside the course of usual consumer conduct that is intended to maximise the customer's return from the applicable offer, promotion or campaign."

      seems he is definitely outside the terms and conditions. regardless I don't see anyone getting all righteous on him, just explaining why he has been caught. If you are going to scam the offer you need to be more subtle about it.

  • mattyman on 07/06/2024 - 09:46
    +3

    Dodgy Rodgy.

  • panos on 07/06/2024 - 09:48
    +3

    This has all the hallmarks of creating false accounts for nefarious reasons, if your so called friends don't have 3 points of proof (which I doubt) whats the big deal take them to the Police station and get them verified it's no big deal OR IS IT OP……

    Don't come here wanting to get advice on how to game the system. Geesus.

  • gengi on 07/06/2024 - 18:07
    +1

    It's likely Know your customer / Anti money laundering. They just need to confirm who he is as for some reason there was a flag on him. sucks but just need to get the ID.

    Did it need to be the police station? or just a certified document ? certification can be done by multiple people like post office workers

  • umoddbro on 07/06/2024 - 22:00
    +6

    Look at this from INGs perspective, 10 new accounts, 10 fund transfers from the same source….. How is that not sus?

  • stedmaster on 08/06/2024 - 03:14
    +2

    "…All I do is transfer you the $1000 to kick-start it, okay? You don't even have to use your own money. Look, I've already done it a few times; it's easy money, nothing to worry about. You can take the money out once you're done; you don't even have to keep using the account…"

  • youknow on 08/06/2024 - 10:17
    +3

    What ING is asking for is not that unreasonable given the circumstances. The effort to comply is relatively minimal. So, unless your "friend" can't comply, because your "friend" isn't able to, because your "friend" is you, then I can't see why you'd bother writing this post. There is a community of like minded individuals you might be interested in.

  • Hydrool on 08/06/2024 - 10:59
    +1

    Lmao this literally ticks every AML red flag box

  • bruhhh on 08/06/2024 - 13:02

    This sounds like KYC laws.

    I've been with ING for several years and tried to open a new savings account to budget out of 6 months ago and instead ING restricted my accounts and gave me 14 days to verify my identity, much like your friend. I had to find a JP and make copies of my license and passport for ING to lift the restrictions.

    • bamzero on 08/06/2024 - 14:32
      +3

      Ah.. remember the good old days when banks had branches, and you could just go in and show them your ID….

  • Pudina Chutney on 08/06/2024 - 18:36
    +1

    Google money mules. He's most likely flagged for that.

    Also, going by your post, you seem to be doing quite a fair bit of U-turn transactions (many-to-one). This may alert internal transaction monitoring systems.

  • hikaru78 on 08/06/2024 - 21:35
    +2

    Anyone else do a double take to see if this was hellopam2024

  • rumblytangara on 09/06/2024 - 01:36
    +2

    The OP is like someone pissing on electric fence then being repeatedly outraged at the resulting shock.

  • jmytch on 09/06/2024 - 04:57
    +1

    Clearly OP is very selfish and not being considerate of others. What he is doing is fraud, and money laundering. He clearly should be locked up for doing this.

  • c64 on 09/06/2024 - 15:45
    +1

    looks like ING has the last laugh …

  • runamuck on 09/06/2024 - 21:20
    +1

    Greed is not a financial issue. It's a heart issue.

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