How Are People Affording Properties?

Ljam-donuts on 18/05/2024 - 21:29
Last edited 19/05/2024 - 10:45 by 1 other user

I am genuinely confused and wondering if someone can explain to me how people in Melbourne and Sydney are affording properties. I rent in the eastern suburbs in Melbourne and see a near 100 percent clearance of houses sold at auction for at least $1.7mil+ around me in the Monash area. That is 11k in repayments over 30 years! You wouldn't be able to afford that even with a salary of $250k.

Where is all this wealth coming from? Is the average income of an Australian $400k or am I missing something? And is the only possibility of homeownership for an average OzBargainer (with a salary of $200k -$250k) to buy a property in crime ridden suburbs on the outskirts of Melbourne or Sydney?

Financial

Comments

          • Brianqpr on 19/05/2024 - 22:30

            @Homr: I'm aware of that, my own household income exceeds 200 comfortably, but two average full time incomes doesn't.

            1.3 doesn't buy much in Sydney, you need closer time 2 million for something decent that isn't too far from the city.

            • infinite on 20/05/2024 - 20:23
              +1

              @Brianqpr: If you can't service a loan for a home in inner suburban, you shouldn't have any reasonable expectation of ever living there until you get a better job, work harder, save more and then can be in a financial position to do so.

              Until then, you need to be reasonable and responsible with your life choices, accept that you'll be looking at housing in outer suburbs with millions of others and then simply seek jobs around those areas like everyone else in the same position. It's what every prior generation has always done - what makes you so special that you won't be doing the same as everyone else?

              • krisspy on 22/05/2024 - 12:08

                @infinite: Well the problem is even in greater West syd, houses around the poorest suburbs (willmot,tragear,shalvey) are selling for close to a million.

                People already living in that area most likely won't be breaking six figures.

          • Powershopz on 19/05/2024 - 22:55
            +3

            @Homr: I remember reading a LinkedIn article a few years back and it stated something like 60% of people lie about their salary and inflate it by 30% on average.

            Of course people are going to bullshit trying to make themselves seem impressive to some random on the street.

            Their live stream came up in my feed the other day and it was cringeworthy. They were just looking for big fish hyping up their salaries while most of the people they talked to were students on minimum wage.

      • Hybroid on 19/05/2024 - 22:00
        +6

        Thinking more East of Liverpool, on commuter lines so Wattle Grove/Moorebank/Hammondville, Chipping Norton South, Milperra, Revesby, East Hills etc. are approx 45 mins train to CBD. I'm sure you can do the same North of Sydney along the Metro line too.

        • May4th on 20/05/2024 - 11:18
          +2

          not sure why you are being downvoted, express train from holsworthy is 40min to CBD, revesby 25min, with a large commuter carpark with easy access to M5 and a quiet working class suburb with reasonably affordable houses with backyards - plenty of options for early 1m. out west there's plenty of options as well

          • infinite on 20/05/2024 - 20:25

            @May4th: Whoa whoa whoa now, folks here don't want to be hearing that sort of honesty. You need to be crying and in a perpetual rage. Can't be doing any of that common sense discussion now, that's just not helpful at all :)

      • Nebargains on 20/05/2024 - 09:37
        +1

        Well you could have a 1hr train ride or you could just rent and complain about property prices I guess?

    • SydBoy on 19/05/2024 - 12:49
      +14

      Normal working class people don't earn 200k even they work 2 jobs. So your comment is purely for rich not the working class working retail or restaurants which pays minimum wages.

      Even to buy $1.2m home with 20% down payment requires you to have $291,000 cash upfront and how would someone have that sort of cash upfront doing day to day working class job?

      • Hybroid on 19/05/2024 - 20:02
        +4

        Sure, I’m not sure anyone’s disputing that.

        There’s thousands of skilled workers earning more than that in Engineering/Finance/Consultancy/IT etc that can though.

        Most auctions seem to be relatively young families, if you discount the foreign investors.

        Those people could never afford a place in Vaucluse either and so on..

      • redfox1200 on 20/05/2024 - 09:16

        by not having coffee and avocado toast everyday

      • infinite on 20/05/2024 - 20:26
        +1

        Why would anyone working a minimum wage job think they'd be anywhere near Sydney in a house…… ever ?

      • R4 on 20/05/2024 - 21:48
        -2

        Get skilled.

        It isn't hard.

        • SydBoy on 21/05/2024 - 07:54
          +1

          So rich to say get a "Skill" like everyone has a same iq and time to do that ? I want to be a doctor and start printing money but can i get that skill? no I can't, age, time and cost all those will come in a way. if you are plumber and get an electrician licence would be bolt on advantage but if you working in lower wage jobs like retail sector where standing 10hr shift will drain you out and don't pay enough to earn weeks' rent will force you to do another job leaves nothing.

          i am way too old for anything and i am more worried out future generation then myself !

          • ZloyKrys on 21/05/2024 - 08:20
            +4

            @SydBoy: Sure thing, for that reason there are Double Bay and Hervey Bay. One is for those more capable and another one for those who have less deisre/capacity/IQ or effort to get there. It's no different to how it was 50 or 100 years ago.

            Those who think a checkout staff can afford the same area as the CEO need to go to Cuba and North Korea, thankfully there's not much left of stupid ideas of equality of outcome, aka communism

            Not developing useful skills throughout life is a personal decision and it has consequences. Lazy, entitled people won't have as high earnings as those who put effort in and this is only fair.

            • SydBoy on 21/05/2024 - 12:23

              @ZloyKrys: This is another ignorant comment. You don't push people out of country for sheer grid and failure of politician.

              in past people can live in blacktown at reasonably affordable price and work in retail job as well at the same time but now property prices even in those suburb out of reach.

              no one talking about north of river in Sydney where rich people lives.

              not everyone has a choice to develop skill as they don't born to the wealth or even working class aussie parents with houses and cash deposit available to feed their kids. Many migrant has no support and has to start earning from day one with no one accepting their resume for jobs thanks to lack of local experience (only applicable to those with Asian country but if same migrant if from Europe then it will be accepted).

              • ZloyKrys on 21/05/2024 - 12:38
                +1

                @SydBoy:

                This is another ignorant comment. You don't push people out of country for sheer grid and failure of politician.

                Nah, this country is built on capitalism. If people want communism, they go elsewhere. Same with migrants to the country who would like to build their life in our awesome Australia

                in past people can live in blacktown at reasonably affordable price and work in retail job as well at the same time but now property prices even in those suburb out of reach.

                Oh so what, 60 years ago the same retail workers might have been able to live in Lower North Shore, who cares, gentrification and population growth raised the bar for the area and those who can't afford it will move where they can afford it. You seriously don't get the concept of finite land and dramatic population growth that squeezes out those unable to compete?

                not everyone has a choice to develop skill as they don't born to the wealth or even working class aussie parents with houses and cash deposit available to feed their kids

                This is total bullshit and everyone has a choice, except for the disabled but they get non-market solution in a form of public housing which has no relation to the cost of the property.
                Everyone has access to HECS funding, stop spreading BS

                Many migrant has no support and has to start earning from day one with no one accepting their resume for jobs thanks to lack of local experience (only applicable to those with Asian country but if same migrant if from Europe then it will be accepted).

                Again, stop spreading BS, this country runs a managed migration system. A prospective migrant would need to have a job offer or demonstrated amount of savings in liquid currency to support themselves and their dependants to get a visa.

          • R4 on 21/05/2024 - 10:45
            +2

            @SydBoy: You don't need a high IQ to be a plumber or a carpenter or an accountant.

            • SydBoy on 21/05/2024 - 12:19
              -1

              @R4: Well, you have not read the comments. To gain a skill one need a time but if they paying sky high rent with kids they can't have time to go study or when they do have time TAFE are closed. You don't study plumbing practical online.

              Also, if everyone became plumber or carpenter or accountant then you will have much bigger problem !

              understand the problem first and current property problem can't be solved with saving penny every morning or doing skill upgrade. We need solid change in the way investor claims 50% capital gain discount on investment property and some have more than 1 investment property at a time and that is what needs to be worked on.

              • ZloyKrys on 21/05/2024 - 12:44
                +1

                @SydBoy:

                To gain a skill one need a time but if they paying sky high rent with kids they can't have time to go study or when they do have time TAFE are closed. You don't study plumbing practical online.

                What a load of BS. Get a qualification and skills before making babies. Is it that hard to comprehend?

                Also, if everyone became plumber or carpenter or accountant then you will have much bigger problem !

                There are other skills and occupancies in high demand we literally importing hundreds of thousands of people due to that. Do something that's in demand, plain and simple.

                understand the problem first and current property problem can't be solved with saving penny every morning or doing skill upgrade.

                There is no property problem, they are readily available. We have a problem with people not getting a real job that pays money and ready to make sacrifices, they turn their nose at apartments where a lot of us started, they want their tattoos, uber eats, bali holidays and they want it now. This is not how that works.

                We need solid change in the way investor claims 50% capital gain discount on investment property and some have more than 1 investment property at a time and that is what needs to be worked on.

                Hahah what about 80% of the market that are not investors who pocket 100% of the capital gain and pay zero tax when they upgrade, surely the scale of that tax concession is much larger as it's double the size and covers 4x more people

                • SydBoy on 21/05/2024 - 13:37
                  -1

                  @ZloyKrys: what a lot of crap. Property are available but not affordable to those working on minimum wags that is the point. everyone can't get the skill to be highly paid job because economy requires people at various levels to serve the industry and those people do need to be able to buy property which isn't the case anymore thanks to capital gain tax benefits provided to wealthy end of the town by Labor & Liberals over the time.

                  your argument is stupid to compare property investor with how owners who upgrade the property. prices are jacked up because property investor uses interest only loans take massive tax cut on their property which home owners don't get so stupidly arguing isn't doing any favour to you.

                  • ZloyKrys on 21/05/2024 - 13:55
                    +2

                    @SydBoy:

                    Property are available but not affordable to those working on minimum wags that is the point. everyone can't get the skill to be highly paid job because economy requires people at various levels to serve the industry and those people do need to be able to buy property which isn't the case anymore thanks to capital gain tax benefits provided to wealthy end of the town by Labor & Liberals over the time

                    Who promised those on minimum wages ( = making least effort possible) to provide them with equity in Australia's most expensive property market? Are you dumb or invent this right out of your fantasies? People on minimum wages usually rent, everywhere in the world. There is no God-given right to property anywhere, more so in Sydney just because you decided to do any work.

                    The cost of the property grows organically with more desirable locations competed for by high-earning individuals whose qualifications are in high demand and who we, as Australia, welcome to our shores, along with local talent who puts effort into their careers and aspirations. Those who just do the bare minimum won't be able to compete in this race and that's the very nature of our economic system.

                    your argument is stupid to compare property investor with how owners who upgrade the property. prices are jacked up because property investor uses interest only loans take massive tax cut on their property which home owners don't get so stupidly arguing isn't doing any favour to you.

                    say stupid one more time so somebody would belive you more. How can you be so dumb that you can't even verify through a very well-structured ATO website that just by taking an interest-only loan no one would get a tax cut, lol - who loaded that shit into your head?

                    • SydBoy on 21/05/2024 - 18:40
                      -2

                      @ZloyKrys: are you really high school leaver?

                      Interest charge on investment property is fully tax deductible.

                      really, if you don't know this then finish high school first and then do google search and then comment on ozbargain.

                      • ZloyKrys on 21/05/2024 - 18:41

                        @SydBoy: Why don't you say school one more time? Skipped yours today?

                  • tonka on 21/05/2024 - 15:48
                    +2

                    @SydBoy: My god Sydboy, why are you arguing so hard to fail at life. People offer a path and you talk about wanting a 1.7 mil house on minimum wage. Are you trolling?

                  • justworld on 21/05/2024 - 16:34
                    +2

                    @SydBoy: I can understand saying that single earners on a min wage ought to be able to find a rental property but to posit that they ought to have a right to buy a property (and not just any property, presumably a freestanding house) is a little over the top

                    As to 'capital gains tax benefits', the biggest beneficiaries are owner occupiers, who are the only ones in society who get a 100% exemption from capital gains.

                    As an investor, I would gladly trade negative gearing away if I got back the 100% capital gains tax exemption and 100% land tax exemption that owner occupiers enjoy.

                    • SydBoy on 21/05/2024 - 17:21
                      -1

                      @justworld: owner occupier don't get their interest on the property mortgage + council & rates & water bill + maintenance tax deductible so if you put entire picture together then the biggest beneficiary are the property investor who get their tax deductible on all these items plus get 50% discount on capital gain.

                      a typical property investor has no reason to change unless their family size change or property prices bubble due to investor putting extra premium on to market which is going on and on for many years now.

          • purelysam on 21/05/2024 - 17:08
            +2

            @SydBoy: Syd the nepo baby

    • ForkSnorter on 20/05/2024 - 10:38
      +9

      I am genuinely confused and wondering if someone can explain to me how people in Melbourne and Sydney are affording properties.

      Many of these people built their wealth through property, by buying when prices were much more affordable. I remember, just 16 or 17 years ago, you could buy a renovated 3-bedroom terrace house in inner city Sydney (Surry Hills or Paddington) for $600k. Back then I thought that was high, but you’re looking at $3 million for the same thing now.

      Where is all this wealth coming from? Is the average income of an Australian $400k or am I missing something? And is the only possibility of homeownership for an average OzBargainer (with a salary of $200k -$250k) to buy a property in crime ridden suburbs on the outskirts of Melbourne or Sydney?

      How did you get a salary of $200-$250k? And why are you complaining about house prices when you have a salary of $200-$250k? Also, you don't have to focus only on inner Sydney and Melbourne. With that salary, there are plenty of affordable properties in beautiful locations with vibrant communities in other places around Australia.

      But you're right about house prices being an absolute blight on the Australian economy and the Australian way of life.

      We have been scammed by a government that has been working overtime to keep house prices high and rising for the past 3 decades.

      The government has again and again given the middle finger to decades of hard work by lower and middle-income Australians.

      The value of the work we do has dwindled and dwindled in comparison to the value of property while the investment class of the population, especially those who own multiple investment properties, have made millions and millions of $ in equity and capital gains without having to lift a finger.

      Everyone talks about the average income, but the median income is shockingly low.

      There is pretty much one path to wealth in Australia unless you’re in the top 30% income bracket, and that is property ownership (preferably ownership of multiple properties).

      I'm still grateful for what I've got, because I've been able to get into the property market and was able to afford a modest property after decades of hard work. But when I look back at what my parents and aunties and uncles and grandparents could afford on really basic jobs in the 1970s-1990s, compared to what I can afford today working for a successful international company with more advanced education and skills than all of them, it just does not make sense. We're talking people with day jobs in small towns owning mansions on lush acreage, or an entire mountain, or households earning a single-income from a basic job while owning a proper 3-bedroom house in a decent suburb in inner Sydney.

      The government is the one to blame for making it increasingly attractive and lucrative for property investors to buy up all the properties.

      I will not respond to any biased response stating that investors are only a minor pressure in the property market.

      The fact is, when Bill Shorten talked about winding back negative gearing prior to the 2019 election, house prices stalled or even fell for a year or two. This pretty much lost him the election. As soon as Scott Morrison won, it was game on again. The knowledge that investors are there ready to buy, and that there are incentives for them, puts confidence into the property market.

      There are 2.3 million property investors in Australia, and about 25% of them (~550,000 Australians) own more than one investment property. That means, counting their principal place of residence, over half a million Australians own 3 or more properties.

      Now, when prices rise rapidly, like they did during COVID, this already mostly wealthy portion of the population makes millions in equity and capital gains without having to lift a finger.

      They are benefitting from the confidence in the market that’s fuelled by their own existence. They are benefitting from incentives and tax concessions, and they are benefitting from the fact that the government and RBA will do whatever it takes to keep house prices high and rising.

      • SydBoy on 20/05/2024 - 20:58
        +1

        Your thoughts are absolutely 100% on money.. !

        Just one thing you missed was that we were unfortunate to have RBA governor in past kept interest rate low even though in US they were increasing rates and he even came out with dumb statements like he doesn't see it going up soon !

        He is part of the problem but he did what any liberal government elected RBA governor would do.

        Peter Dutton himself is property investor so I don't see he will do anything tangible to lower property prices.

        Albo hasn't done anything so far and I doubt he will do anything apart from singing green hydrogen song with Andrew forest.. !

        Bill shorten had very bright idea but real-estate mafia and news corp crushed it before it eventuates.

    • Drakesy on 20/05/2024 - 10:52

      For a 200k salary with 20% deposit saved up, a $1.2-1.3m home is achievable within an hour train to Sydney CBD.

      so applies to 8 out of 100 Australians. and no bank is going to loan someone with a 200k salary $1 mill. Thats 50k a year in just interest. We really are leveraged up to our eyeballs. And if you have a kid you'll be going backwards. no wonder our birthrate is capitulating.

      • Tomcruise on 20/05/2024 - 13:09
        +1

        If you have a kid, the taxpayers helps out even more with childcare etc.

        It's all a scsm and needs to come crashing fown.

        • Frankensnore on 21/05/2024 - 08:11

          that's 50k in just interest

          Have you considered the rental and capital gain in return?

    • JohnHowardsEyebrows on 21/05/2024 - 09:10
      -1

      You fail to comprehend the OP's question. The OP wasn't asking about how to find a crap house out in the sticks. They were asking about how normal people are paying for houses costing nearly $2m in what should be affordable areas in far flung suburbs.

    • supersabroso on 21/05/2024 - 12:33

      Living within your means is important, eg. you can get a 2 bedroom apartment in Auburn for $520k or a 3 bedroom for $630k only 30 minutes from the city. This mortgage is very affordable for a couple. Once you've out grown it, sell it and upgrade to a house by restarting with an affordable $600k home loan again. Rinse and repeat until you're in the $2M dream house that you want, yes you'll be 60 when you're done. You can't expect to start out in that $2M house, that's not how life works.

    • gougou8 on 21/05/2024 - 18:01

      Some people enter into payment plans with their bank only paying back what they can afford. Banks do not foreclose on owner occupiers.

    • Slippery Otter on 22/05/2024 - 08:29
      +2

      I'm the 'Some people have family support networks, & 'Some people dump savings into offset accounts to reduce interest' for family members. They have saved over $100,000 in interest on their 3 properties in under 9 years.

      So if you have family and can open up offsets in your name but rename them in the banking platform as their name and give them full authority over those offsets, they can put their savings and operate it like a normal everyday account. Privacy concerns? That's where a credit card comes in handy for your family members, they can just bpay it on the due date from the offsets that way nobody can see their spending habits. There's always a way.

    • PhilosophicalTurtle on 22/05/2024 - 17:36
      +2

      Some people receive substantial inheritances.
      Some people rent out portions of their property.
      Some people take advantage of low-interest rates.
      Some people leverage equity from other properties.
      Some people downsize to more affordable homes.
      Some people have high-paying jobs in tech or finance or even leverage social media and online platforms to generate additional income..
      Some people partner with friends or relatives to buy property.
      Some people purchase fixer-uppers and renovate.
      Some people buy properties in foreclosure.

    • Salternative on 24/05/2024 - 01:14
      +2

      Brought my first property mid 300 $ks , 35 kms from sydney , when i was 27 yrs old, similar properties go for $550-600k now , 70 sqm 55 year old unit , fun times having bogans set off fireworks at night and do burnouts .
      2nd property 50kms from the city , $700k , 45kms from city, 35 years old , similar properties go for $900-$950k , 120 sqm 45 yr old brick veneer house needing work , this time middle eatern bogans doing burnouts .
      3rd property 15 kms from city , $2 million , 40 years old, sold above 2 properties to finance .
      Came to aus, a country i lovingly call my own now with $ 3000 in my name .
      Stop whinging and get to work, if you think you should be able to buy your first property in marrickville/newtown/dee why just because you grew up there , unless you have rich parents and generational wealth , it aint happening bud . Swallow a bitter pill and buy in liverpool/parramatta wherever you can afford, a free tip is it will give you an outlook in life that will help and give you a boost all your life , something an entitled and victim mentality will never do. the above property path can be done by anyone on an average income even now, but they think they should be able to get to stage 3 first .

    • ItsMeAgro on 24/05/2024 - 13:56
      +1

      Some people have dual working incomes. Most people trying to buy already have this, but still can't afford much
      Some people work 2 jobs. At least one has to be part time, and hours aren't usually sustainable, this isn't a great get-rich strategy
      Some people have dividend-generating investments. less than 0.1% have enough to buy a house from
      Some people borrow more than they should. This is one of the major reasons.
      Some people have foreign funds to bring over. This is another biggie, skilled migrants and former international students are often rich (at least in their own countries, and often by Aussie standards too))
      Some people have family support networks. Looking at the stats, this is the biggest one for under-30 buyers: Bank of Mum and Dad. Generational wealth.
      Some people put up more deposit than base 10%, so the monthly payments are lower. Not a significant percentage
      Some people dump savings into offset accounts to reduce interest. this is common but doesn't help buying in the first place
      Some people sold their properties they bought for much cheaper prior to the recent increases. This is how everyone over 30 does it

    • RefusdClassification on 24/05/2024 - 17:46

      When interest rates were going up, guess what happened? Housing prices went up. Everyone is rich in Australia. I don't know where they are getting all of their money from , mind you. According to the ABS, anyone earning more than $185,000 per annum (pre-tax) is in the top 4% percent. That's 90% of OzBargain. They are the top end of town. AusFinance are even richer. They consider $130,000 per annum a lower class income. People who own a 1 million dollar home. Lower class trash according to them. The other day I saw a homeless woman on a train (I frequently see them around the Brisbane CBD but haven't seen one on a train before). The reason why poverty exists is because wealth exists. But AusFinanciers have probably never spoken to a lower class person in their privileges life.

      Why is everything so expensive? Because the middle class are rolling in wealth. Inflation is too much money chasing too few goods. The rich are driving up the prices of everything for the proletariat.

    • brandt on 28/05/2024 - 13:41
      +2

      In my group of people who grew up first generation immigrant backgrounds have all inherited one or more property from their parents who are aged 50 to 70. Their parents bought 1 primary residence and 2 or 3 investment properties, and the ones who built most wealth leveraged their portfolio during covid, pulled out their super and bought several properties during covid. Then they gifted these properties to their kids or underwrote loans. No those kids in early 30s all have a PPOR and at least one investment property.

      These are people whose only overseas holidays were to go back to home country once every 3 years to see the olds, they drove the same car for 15 years, cooked at home every day, and even when they had a professional job spent their weekend at Coles or driving a taxi to top up their banks.

  • AndyC1 on 18/05/2024 - 21:47
    +3

    Spare bedroom with grow beds and bikies to ensure they mature before the flashing lights turn up on the street.

    • WhyAmICommenting on 18/05/2024 - 22:56
      +3

      don't forget to bypass the electricity meter

      • AndyC1 on 19/05/2024 - 09:03
        +2

        Great, forgot the power for the lights. Looks like I am not very good at growing as a side income to pay the mortgage.

      • Chandler on 20/05/2024 - 09:36
        +1

        No, no, no! You are supposed to run an extension lead from the park next door!

  • Jaduqimon on 18/05/2024 - 21:54
    +11

    1.7mil property. so 20% deposit leaves 1.36mil borrowed.

    @6.1% IR thats 8.2k per month repayments.

    Dual income @ 100k each person thats $6.3k take home pay each month so 12.6k dual income.

    still 4.4k to spare for the month. Easy.

    • Wiadro on 18/05/2024 - 22:35
      +23

      200k income wont be approved for 1.35m anyway.
      200k will get you around 850k

      • SlartiBartFozz on 19/05/2024 - 20:03
        +9

        Commonthief Bank calculator
        https://www.commbank.com.au/digital/home-loans/calculator/ho…
        Based on combined 200k income, 5k monthly expenses, 20k credit card limit, they would lend $842k.

        That's just their 'estimate' though, in practice it's likely to be a tad less than that.

        • richrichie on 20/05/2024 - 10:49

          The same calculator is showing borrowing capacity of 935K for combined 200K income, 4k expenses (based on the remaining $ in the calc above), 0 credit card, and 6.1% interest. Why would you keep the credit card limit if you want to have a big borrowing?

          Still not 1.3m, but if one tries going for other smaller lenders, there might be one that happy to give 1m to 1.1m.

      • May4th on 20/05/2024 - 11:31
        -1

        you need to talk to a broker or LM. who actually uses online calculators

    • SydBoy on 19/05/2024 - 12:51
      +3

      to buy 1.7m home with 20% down payment means you need cash in hand $418,505 ! How will you save that and when if you just came out of uni and happens to be child of working class aussie ? by the time you save that much cash then prices will be $3m probably if negative gearing is not stopped.

      • Jaduqimon on 19/05/2024 - 13:05
        +15

        Didn't buy 1.7 mil property when straight out of uni?

        Plenty of properties under 400k in Sydney

      • justworld on 19/05/2024 - 13:47
        -5

        lol negative gearing is tiny compared to all the incentives owner occupiers get like stamp duty exemptions, first home buyer grants, no capital gains tax, no land tax etc.

        If you really want property prices to go down, go after the owner occupiers, especially the pensioners sitting on a paid off house still getting a full pension.

        • Jaduqimon on 19/05/2024 - 14:08

          why would going after pensioners make house prices fall? if you're thinking is forcing them to vacate their 4 bdrm house then yeh maybe the supply for 4bdrm houses will increase and make the price lower at that end of the spectrum (yay for people who already have enough cash to gob these up) but the pensioners will then have a wad of cash to spend on 2bdroom apartments and then the prices in this end of the spectrum will increase… and that hurts new buyers more…. FHB has no chance to compete against pensioners who just sold their 4bd rm house….

        • Chandler on 20/05/2024 - 09:42
          -2

          Not sure if /s

          stamp duty exemptions

          What exemption? Stamp duty is paid on purchase/sale. So because they're occupying and not buying/selling like some street-corner (…), it's an "exemption"?

          first home buyer grants

          Because the government wanted to keep home-owing "reachable" without taking from their slumlord voter base?

          no capital gains tax

          Still have to pay capital gains tax, same as investors. It's just that it's paid at the point that any gain is realised, and if an owner-occupier doesn't sell then any gain is not realised…

          • justworld on 20/05/2024 - 11:59
            +2

            @Chandler: PPOR doesn't pay capital gains at all on sale

            PPOR doesn't pay land tax at all

            PPOR gets stamp duty discount on first home

        • Drakesy on 20/05/2024 - 10:54
          -1

          50% of all properties are negatively geared.
          For the first time this year negative gearing deductions will outweigh the income the government gains.

      • Chael Sonnen on 19/05/2024 - 14:23
        +12

        Why would someone straight out of uni be looking at a 1.7m home lol

        • SydBoy on 19/05/2024 - 16:31
          -2

          Sydney median house price is $1.6m so whether the person comes out of uni or after 20 years they can't afford house if the are working in Coles and Woolies or retail sector can't afford to buy houses unless they want to live with bogans or area with high crime rates

          This is not a laughing subject.

          • ZloyKrys on 19/05/2024 - 16:34
            +8

            @SydBoy: working in the retail sector in a low-wage job is a personal decision, living in Sydney is another personal decision, and looking at a detached house in a landlocked area like Sydney is another decision. Not all decisions we make are compatible with each other, plain and simple.

            • SydBoy on 19/05/2024 - 21:26
              +1

              @ZloyKrys: Units aren't cheap either.

              Sydboy Melbourne full so where do you go for jobs ?

              WA needs remote workers but first thing they ask do you have local experience!

              • Eeples on 19/05/2024 - 22:26

                @SydBoy: I think Melbourne is cheap for units.

              • ZloyKrys on 20/05/2024 - 07:07

                @SydBoy: There are hundreds of units to choose from priced under 400k in say Melbourne and Canberra, and both these cities pay higher hourly rate in my line of business than Sydney for example, so yes they are very affordable to FHBs. Looking at Domain, Brisbane is even cheaper, but it's not my cup of tea.

                I don't see it as a birthright to be able to afford in Sydney.

            • SydBoy on 20/05/2024 - 07:00
              +1

              @ZloyKrys: not everyone can be doctor or engineer or lawyer or economist.

              Economy needs to cater for everyone in the society. A greeter divide in the income will result into poor society and you can witness that in developing and poor countries

              those who liked your comment has absolutely ignored the fact you think that retail sector job is a personal decision.

              • ZloyKrys on 20/05/2024 - 07:04
                -3

                @SydBoy: It's not a class war comment. If people decide not to take low paid jobs, the pay goes up. A case in point is the recent massive salary bumps in the Aged Care, albeit not enough but it will drive the outcome. Submission to corrupt unions like SDA will not.

                Absolutely all of these are personal choice. If you don't get it you probably need more experience in life and read a wider spectrum of opinions outside of hard left wing press.

            • Chandler on 20/05/2024 - 09:49
              +1

              @ZloyKrys: That's an interesting point to touch on. If Sydney pricing keeps going the way it is, where are all the low-wage employers going to find their staff? There's only so far that people can commute…

              • ZloyKrys on 20/05/2024 - 09:59
                +1

                @Chandler: So the low wage need to go up to the level when it affords the rent. Obviously landlocked areas whose population is increasing will have housing cost climbing more and more. Nobody asks stupid questions why, say, a 1br in Manhattan costs 1.5M USD when the entire island was bought with glass toys worth $23 in today's dollars from indians. Neither it's considered reasonable for low wage workers to be able to buy in a high priced market. People in other parts of the world buy where they can afford and rent where they can not afford to buy. It's just Australian phenomenon of people claiming they're entitled to live close to their parents. They're not. People who make money to afford to buy under competition are. We're not in the middle ages anymore where my clan defines where I live, my abilities and earnings are. Same with people whose parents decided to raise them in Sydney.

                • Drakesy on 20/05/2024 - 10:55

                  @ZloyKrys: I think you're a bit delulu

                  Respectfully

                  • ZloyKrys on 20/05/2024 - 11:01

                    @Drakesy: No, I'm fine, thanks. I'm aware of the prevalence of hard left-wing demographics on this site who think the government owes them something just because they've been born and/or raised in a certain time and area, that is okay considering the concentration of students and people who didn't have much experience in life. This gets better once they understand who is responsible for their life choices and position.

        • infinite on 20/05/2024 - 20:29
          +1

          Because they live on Reddit instead of the real world.

      • supersabroso on 21/05/2024 - 17:06

        Don't wait for a 20% deposit, when I bought my first home a few years ago I only had about 15%. Also, you aren't meant to afford your dream double story, 5 bedroom house with a sub basement to park 4 cars straight out of uni. Try for a 2 or 3 bedroom apartment 30 minutes from the city for $500k or $600k instead. Saving a $75k deposit will be very manageable for a young couple.

        • SydBoy on 28/05/2024 - 15:32
          -1

          I also had only 10% deposit when I purchased but in my time house prices (Unit or House) where roughly 3 - 4times average wages in Sydney but that is no longer the case so what happened in past can't be worked out and unfortunately if interest rates goes down then prices will go up and that will increase difficulty so best to remove capital gain discount from property or limit it to 1 property per person or couple.

      • brandt on 28/05/2024 - 13:46
        +1

        If 1.7m is the goal, then you've had at least 10 years working towards it. Ideally, you stayed in your parent's home and saved double digits every month and invested in index funds, and 5 years ago rent vested in a 500k property which is now closer to 800k.

        Saving is easy when you live 2 hours away from work, and the only thing you do is wake, work, commute and sleep.

        Of course if you're someone starting out today, that 1.7m house in 10 years time will be in Campbelltown or Box Hill.

        • SydBoy on 28/05/2024 - 15:30
          -1

          You making assumption that everyone had parent with a house where they can live in this country and that where you got thing's wrong in understanding whole situation.

    • Brianqpr on 19/05/2024 - 14:01
      +1

      That is definitely not easy and you would not be approved for 1.36 million on that income anyway. I've been through the process recently with a higher household income than that and could get up to 1.09 I think. Banks have to factor in potential rate increases to meet responsible lending obligations.

      Also how long is it taking to save 340k while renting?

      • Jaduqimon on 19/05/2024 - 14:11
        +1

        well i guess those who bought 1.7mil had bigger deposits then or sold up.

        im waiting for the day RBA lowers rates… gona be eve more rough for those thats not on the ladder yet…

    • whyisave on 21/05/2024 - 02:30

      $8.2k repayments are still repayments,
      that won't chip away at the 1.36M principal amount
      for a long time.

      Basically, the way interest rates have gone ,
      your interest payments are buying someone else a house,
      except owning your own home.

  • JIMB0 on 18/05/2024 - 21:57
    +8

    Some people work hard, go without many things and save every dollar they can. They haven't even got time to watch Netflix and complain about the price increases.

    • tonka on 19/05/2024 - 02:53
      +16

      Plus expectation of holiday, new furniture, new car, new kitchen and bathroom, pool etc. After working 2 jobs for 35 years I own my home, I indulged myself in a new lounge and dinner set at that point.

      • Nugs on 19/05/2024 - 07:17
        +6

        This is the way
        .

      • lknight on 19/05/2024 - 12:05
        +10

        so we should all ignore the ponzi scheme and slave all the way till we become old and lose the health to enjoy the roof over the head?

        • tonka on 19/05/2024 - 13:42
          +2

          No, you shouldn't. If I had a do-over I'd live in housing commission in some nice coastal suburb, remain unemployed and visit the beach every day, with plenty of medical benefits and look forward to a government pension. And I certainly wouldn't complain about not owning a home if I chose that path.

        • supersabroso on 21/05/2024 - 17:29

          As opposed to what, live everyday to the fullest without having to work but have everyone else work their butts off for your royal heinie to enjoy life? You need to earn your place in society. If everyone was a leech, nobody would have anything to leech off.

          Yes, our housing system is set up incorrectly but until the majority of people vote to stop using housing as an investment, you should be thankful that you can afford to buy apartments with relative ease. A house is a luxury that you can move into later in life once you've earned your place in society by doing enough work. Many people in other countries can never own a house as 10-20 million people are crammed into a single city.

      • SydBoy on 19/05/2024 - 12:52
        +5

        it was possible if you have bought home 35 year ago not now.

        if you stop eating still you can't save 20% deposit on 1.2m home with normal minimum wage job.

        • tonka on 19/05/2024 - 13:43
          +2

          No, so you save a deposit on a $350K unit, plenty around. Then sell and upgrade when you can. The same as the rest of us home owners. Why do you feel entitled to a $1.2 million home if you haven't worked to get there?

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