Need Opinion if I Should Buy a Car and if Car Dealer Is Shady

plop123 on 05/09/2023 - 21:42
Last edited 06/09/2023 - 10:33 by 1 other user

Found a car 2011 Mazda with 200km on FB Marketplace- first car purchase.

Dealer initially listed it for $10k and I was able to get negotiate it down to $9k Drive Away, the private seller is actually a LMCT so that did give me additional confidence to buy however car currently does not have RWC. After some further research I can see the car was initially posted back in April for $11k - 5 month the car did not sell. Upon messaging he notes the car is mechanically sound and there are no issues.

I ask to meet him on the weekend for a test drive but he mentions someone is coming to inspect it on Thursday but he will would hold if I made a non refundable deposit of $250. I confirm with him on Friday if the car has been sold he says the guy was a no show.

Weekend comes along I inspect the exterior and interior of the car everything looks fine, however since I'm not too familiar with the internal/engine stuff. - i don't know what to look out for specifically besides watching a few YouTube videos. Dipstick check, tyre condition, smooth engine start, no smoke when starting, no rattling. Dealer notes that the car is due for a service. Upon doing the dipstick check I can see the oil is very dirty - he does not mention this to me?

During the test drive I notice the front brake is not as responsive as it should be, I used my girlfriends car as a comparison as I've driven that before an AUDI A1 for reference. I note the issues to the seller and he says he will get it fixed with the RWC but should he have told me this prior to me finding out? He would have known because it was his daily drive?

He then tells me to pay a $500 deposit so he can get the service, brake fixed and do the RWC. In which I transfer the $500 deposit to his business bank account.

I tell him to take a picture of the logbook and it hasn't been serviced since 170kms. He comes back to me saying for the RWC - it only needs polished headlights and the RWC mechanic notes there is no issue on the front brake.

Have i made a mistake in paying the deposit? Is there anything else i can do before to ensure the car is mechanically A1 before paying his the remaining amount?

Cheers.

Automotive Mazda

Comments

  • thatonethere on 05/09/2023 - 21:48
    +75

    Lots of red flags so I continue in the valley of death…

  • bobokingdom on 05/09/2023 - 21:51
    +38

    9K for a 2011 Mazda (I assume it is a Mazda 3 as you are comparing to a A1) with 200K seems a bit high.

    • Jimothy Wongingtons on 05/09/2023 - 22:17
      +2

      Definitely high

    • plop123 on 05/09/2023 - 22:24

      have checked relative to carsales and facebook - seems to relatively quite fare, includes stamp duty and transfer.

      • plmko on 05/09/2023 - 22:31
        +11

        So really it's a $7k car. About right for the age.

    • Sinnerator on 06/09/2023 - 08:36
      +3

      using precovid pricing this would be a $1500 car, so $9000 HAR HAR HAR

      • bobs burgers on 06/09/2023 - 17:25

        I'll give you $300 take it or leave it

    • Brianqpr on 06/09/2023 - 20:52
      +1

      I got a 2011 one for $8.5k 3 years ago with only 79k on it. Private seller and I took a bit of a punt as not much service history but I've had it serviced regularly since I bought it and only minor wear and tear type stuff so all good.

      Prices did go up during COVID but seem to be settling down again now. I'd reckon $7k would be about right but more through a dealer.

    • Ramrunner on 08/09/2023 - 16:25

      It says 200km - that's a steal dude!

  • Mikefr on 05/09/2023 - 21:58
    +14

    Free Advice - Walk away and save the heartache!
    As has been said - Red flags here!!

  • Aureus on 05/09/2023 - 21:59
    +8

    Have i made a mistake in paying the deposit?

    Yes

    Is there anything else i can do before to ensure the car is mechanically A1 before paying his the remaining amount?

    Get a professional to inspect. Fair chance the scammer seller is hoping to keep the deposit. If the brakes are squishy, then fair chance you just need brake fluid flush, which isn't expensive.

  • MS Paint on 05/09/2023 - 22:11
    +8

    break

    Brake

    • Kangal on 06/09/2023 - 18:39
      +2

      Brake

      Breighake

    • Ramrunner on 08/09/2023 - 16:26

      You also had the eye twitching? :)

  • Downvoter on 05/09/2023 - 22:12
    +17

    Why are you comparing a 12 year old car with 200+ on it to an Audi A1 in the first place

  • pjetson on 05/09/2023 - 22:16
    +17

    You need to realise that a car dealer, or in fact any seller, isn't on your side. Why would they point out anything that might cause you not to buy the car?

    You say that you're "not too familiar with the internal/engine stuff", which is the important stuff. Anyone can make the exterior and interior of a car look great with a bit of detailing.

    What you should have done is paid for a proper professional check of the car. The RACV and many mechanics can do this. It may be too late now, depending on what you've signed. If you haven't signed anything, the worst that can happen is that the dealer will probably keep your deposit if you decide not to buy it.

    If you do buy the car, get a full service and mechanical check at a proper mechanic as soon as you possibly can, preferably before you drive it much - 30,000 km since the last service is too long.

    I don't know what you mean by "front brake is not as responsive as it should be". That's something you'd need to discuss with a mechanic.

    Despite working to the same set of rules, different RWC testers will often find different things wrong with a car. I'm not saying that some are dodgy, just that there might be things wrong with the car that the dealer's RWC tester might accepted that a different RWC tester might have failed the car on. I had one tester fail a car because of the window tint that was perfectly legal and that another tester was quite happy with.

    • plop123 on 05/09/2023 - 22:26
      +4

      Have not signed the contract of sale yet, still need to do one last test drive before paying the remaining amount. I might try and find a mechanic this time around to see if it actually is a issue.

      • SoapyWooder on 08/09/2023 - 07:48

        Yes get a mechanic, next time you may not need him again as you gained experience with the first inspection.

    • EightImmortals on 06/09/2023 - 08:19

      That's assuming the seller actually did get the RWC inspection done.

  • Jimothy Wongingtons on 05/09/2023 - 22:19
    +7

    Why didn’t you arrange for a mobile mechanic to suss it as well if you’re not sure? At least they’d be more likely to give you a run down in obvious suss issues. 10k is not an amount I’d be comfortable gambling on.

    • plop123 on 05/09/2023 - 22:27
      -3

      Might do this - how much does it cost for a mobile mechanic to suss?

      • Jimothy Wongingtons on 05/09/2023 - 22:48
        +2

        from $285 for non racq members, slightly cheaper if u r a member - you could prob shop around but I can’t really see it being wayyyy cheaper for an equally well known/recognised 3rd party mobile assessor. Can guarantee you’ll be paying more than $285 right now in parts and labour to service the car after drive away from what you’re saying.

        • Poor Ass on 06/09/2023 - 15:11
          -1

          I think those potato cake eaters uses RACV

        • Pet20220224 on 06/09/2023 - 15:44
          +3

          those red book checks or whatever they are called aren't as safe as they appear, I once sold a car the buyer had the red book check mechanic showing up. The guy turned up is a 24 yo guy who is contracted to do the job. Yes he gets a feel of the car, does the xxx points checks on his tablet which automatically generates a fancy report. But if the engine has worn pistons and is burning oil much much quicker he won't be noticing that from driving the car around in the neighbourhood for 20 minutes.

          • Brick50 on 06/09/2023 - 18:19

            @Pet20220224: Agreed, when they inspected my car I was selling they let it idle for 20/30 mins and checked for dripping oil. If they didn't notice any then take it for a test drive and call it ok after going 500 metres or so

        • rave75 on 07/09/2023 - 14:07

          Damn, OP lost $750 already, might as well pay $285 from the beginning. When the dealer said oh someone else is coming, gotta pay deposit to hold it >>> oldest trick in the book.

          Better buy from private and bring a mechanic to check.

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 05/09/2023 - 22:23
    +8

    So many red flags you could open a stall selling them at the Tam Kong Festival.

  • Simoneee on 05/09/2023 - 22:26
    +7

    Dealer is dodgy.

    the car is mechanically sound and there is no issues

    Literally on everyone's Facebook Marketplace description

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 07/09/2023 - 12:35
      -1

      IKR

      Very rare I see a car ad "car is farked, have a 8k quote from the mechanic, pls buy and relieve me of this POS"

  • Toph Beifong on 05/09/2023 - 22:27
    +7

    You need to do second hand car shopping with the mindset that most dealers are dodgy. Unfortunately in this industry, dishonesty is rampant.
    Now to the car…

    The fact that it hasn't been serviced for 30,000km is an issue. The fact that he is asking for all of these deposits is another issue.
    The fact that its been listed for 5 months (and probably been through many inspections and viewings) is an issue.

    Reliable vehicles in good condition with valid logbooks sell like hot cakes. Especially in this market. Sometimes sold to other dealers who then on-sell it again

  • Tomhaigh1 on 05/09/2023 - 22:35
    +7

    You already lost $500, dont loose the rest 8500, this looks dodgy af.

    • rave75 on 07/09/2023 - 14:04

      He lost $750 no?

      • BartholemewH on 07/09/2023 - 15:00

        He never paid the initial 250

        • rave75 on 07/09/2023 - 18:04

          Oh I misread the 250. My bad.

  • Mokr on 05/09/2023 - 22:58
    +3

    10K for a 2011 mazda - 200km - and not great service history - damn

    • dkwon10 on 06/09/2023 - 14:56
      -2

      I bought a 2016 Elantra sr turbo with 100k km for 25k last year now I feel better seeing people are paying 10k for this trash lol

    • ribze1 on 06/09/2023 - 16:00

      Average 20,000 kms a year needs bare minimum the two services p.a.

  • KaTst3R on 05/09/2023 - 23:06

    If your gut feel tell you the dealer is dodgy, you should trust your six sense.

    • Protractor on 06/09/2023 - 09:57

      If OP had a sixth sense this post would not exist.
      Even "common" sense delivers basic ground rules to non-mech minded ppl, when they risk parting with this much $$$.

      Common sense, everyone has it. These days everyone seems to be saving it for a rainy day.

    • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 07/09/2023 - 12:37
      -1

      six sense

      I see dodgy car dealers. Walking around like regular people. They don't see each other. They only see what they want to see. They don't know they're dodgy car dealers.

  • spackbace on 06/09/2023 - 00:00
    +7

    Hope you've done a $2 ppsr…

    Bet that's why it hasn't sold

  • Some Human on 06/09/2023 - 00:30

    Was this at a dandenong dealership that was featured on ACA?
    Sounds like the same dodgy car they tried to sell my younger brother.

    • plop123 on 06/09/2023 - 09:55

      Nope, dealer is located in Tullamarine

      • JIMB0 on 06/09/2023 - 09:57
        +1

        Maybe they moved again.

    • billy72 on 07/09/2023 - 12:18

      actually, every dealership in Dandenong is dodgy, you can read their reviews :)

  • Euphemistic on 06/09/2023 - 05:01

    As others have said, red flags here.

    If you don’t know cars how can you tell the front brakes are no good? I do know a little about cars and can’t tell if it’s front or rear brakes unless there’s a squeal you can hear.

    Don’t ever put down a deposit on a car unless you are sure you are going to buy. Doesn’t matter what the seller says.

    • Ade99 on 06/09/2023 - 07:37
      +1

      Playing on FMO…and if been on the market for several months it would be a walk away unless a very keen price. Lots of other cars in the World.

  • Bilby s on 06/09/2023 - 08:16
    +2

    Walk away, plenty of cars to choose from without dodgy sellers.

  • Protractor on 06/09/2023 - 09:50

    Advice One: This car is a bargain. If you don't buy it, someone else will and double their money.
    Don't miss out.
    Advice Two: Lose the deposit, and get someone who knows what they are doing, do the car inspection and purchase from now on.
    Stick to washing it on weekends. Your strengths are in writing , not in mechanics or economics

  • Malik Nasser on 06/09/2023 - 09:55
    +1

    Your asking if a used car dealer is shady.
    Might as well be asking if water is wet.

    Their business is to make money by selling cars. They want to put in the minimal amount of work and expense to sell a car to maximise their returns.
    Some car dealers are better than others.
    In general they have an information and knowledge advantage over the general public, so get away with doing shady things.
    It is prevalent in a lot of businesses, especially where there is a knowledge/understanding mismatch.

    • Euphemistic on 06/09/2023 - 10:10

      Might as well be asking if water is wet.

      need to ask if water makes you wet. Water in itself is not wet.

  • TheMindsetTraveller on 06/09/2023 - 10:11
    +1

    Sounds dodgy as hell

  • apple2016 on 06/09/2023 - 10:49
    +1

    During the test drive I notice the front brake is not as responsive

    Curious, how did you test the front brake independently of the back?

    I can see the oil is very dirty

    dirty is not an issue. if its runny and not sticky, it would be time to replace the oil.
    Also RWC does not mean anything these days.

    • plop123 on 06/09/2023 - 13:49
      -2

      When braking normally it felt the front breaks needed a lot of push to break well. When I was reversing and braked - it was way more sensitive and responsive.

      • Aureus on 06/09/2023 - 15:08
        +1

        The back brakes aren't just for reversing, when you brake you use both front and back brakes.

        • trongy on 07/09/2023 - 08:33

          Momentum puts more load on the front brakes when travelling forwards. The rule of thumb is that the front brakes will take about 70% of the braking force and the rear brakes 30%.
          Therefore the reverse braking test is a rough way of highlighting differences between front and rear brake performance.

          The caveat is that some cars will have higher capacity brakes fitted in the front.

          • Aureus on 07/09/2023 - 08:57
            +1

            @trongy: Almost all cars will have higher capacity brakes fitted to the front.

            I don't think reversing at normal reversing speed and applying the brakes really tests the performance of the back brakes, as there isn't much momentum and the front brakes are still doing most of the work anyway

    • abb on 07/09/2023 - 14:20
      +1

      Curious, how did you test the front brake independently of the back?

      Turns out it's actually a motorbike disguised as a Mazda

  • billy72 on 06/09/2023 - 12:13

    Just to remind you, you won't have 3-month statutory warranty with cars that are more than 10 years old.
    Does he sell it to you as a private seller or a dealership?

    • plop123 on 06/09/2023 - 13:49

      A private seller who is a LMCT

      • billy72 on 06/09/2023 - 19:01
        +1

        I know that but what transfer form will they use to sell this car? Normal form or dealer form?

    • Poor Ass on 06/09/2023 - 15:14

      if dealer what about

      ‘class B’ statutory warranty if you buy a vehicle that:

      has an odometer reading of 160,000km or more on the day of its sale
      has a built date of more than 10 years before the day of its sale.
      The ‘class B’ warranty expires after 1 month or the first 1,000km, whichever occurs first.

      • billy72 on 06/09/2023 - 19:01

        there is no class B statutory warranty in VIC

        • Poor Ass on 06/09/2023 - 21:00

          lol damn

  • ak47wong on 06/09/2023 - 12:28
    +1

    Need Opinion if Car Dealer Is Shady

    FB Marketplace

  • trapper on 06/09/2023 - 12:37
    +1

    Why would you pay a $500 deposit? Buy or don't buy, paying a deposit makes no sense at all.

    For second hand cars, especially in this price range, you are far better off buying privately.

    If you don't know much about cars then always get a mechanic inspection before buying.

  • Drakesy on 06/09/2023 - 12:57

    I mean it is a fairly bombproof mazda

    although it is a Mazda with 200,000k's on the clock.
    I wouldn't be putting down any money on it. If it's been with the dealer for 5 months and the car market has fallen off a cliff it's a buyers market.

  • IpGem on 06/09/2023 - 13:10

    Full of red, ambient, you name it flags here.

    Hope you checked and have it in writing that the deposit fully refundable in case of issues found, change of mind, subject to finance etc.

  • dogboy on 06/09/2023 - 13:35

    Bloody hell that is a major rip off. I sold a 2011 Mazda 3 with 90k kms on it 2 years ago for $6k in roadworthy condition in great nick.

    • brad1-8tsi on 06/09/2023 - 14:01
      +2

      A seller has every right to put a ridiculous price on their goods. A buyer has every right to walk away.

  • MustardKetchup on 06/09/2023 - 13:45

    DODGY, shouldnt have paid $500 deposit.
    Learn from mistake.

    Dont take car without getting a mechanic to do thorough test

  • brad1-8tsi on 06/09/2023 - 13:59

    RWC in NSW is a joke. How much do you think a mechanic will do for the $46(?)??

    Something has to be really bad to fail a RWC in NSW

    • BartholemewH on 07/09/2023 - 15:05

      Exactly. There's a big difference between 'the brakes passed' and 'the brakes perform well'.

    • kaleidoscope on 07/09/2023 - 16:32

      those cons always come back with something to charge your for some extra $ such as viper not performing optimally or tyres worn too much etc … 🤷‍♂️

      • brad1-8tsi on 11/09/2023 - 17:36

        always come back with something to charge your for some extra $

        That's happened to me twice in 20 years. Both times due to tyres which were legal but had an odd shoulder profile.
        The first guy I simply explained to him what he was looking at and he then passed it.

        The 2nd time the bloke tried to tell me it was caused by wheel alignment issues. I used to be an alignment specialist so this was the worst thing he could do and I explained where he was incorrect and why I intended to report him. I then demanded my rego papers back, didn't pay and went to the workshop around the corner and have been going there for rego check ever since.

  • blorx on 06/09/2023 - 14:20

    I'd walk at non-refundable deposit talk. RWC really only cover missing doors or wheels. Doesn't cover the stuff you would actually care about like engine quality, intermittent electrical issues other unseen internal issues.

  • Thinkswithelbow on 06/09/2023 - 14:44

    If it's one of those no brand dealers walk away.
    If it's a name brand dealer ie ford/Audi/Mazda used car from their dealers etc…you may have some way of fighting them but it's really not worth it.

    Lots of red flags

    I'd you really really must buy it then spend the 280ish and get a mechanic to come by and do a check. They're really good and have saved me in the past from buying a car riddled with rust and other issues unknown to me.

    • Poor Ass on 06/09/2023 - 15:16
      -1

      you saved the big money by spending the small money but still $280 rather spend else where hahahahahaha

  • dirtybigbjelke on 06/09/2023 - 16:44
    +3

    Audi and European cars like VW do have more initial Bite when braking, that's why you have to replace Pads and Rotors more often and they are so expensive :)

    • greatlamp on 06/09/2023 - 22:03
      +2

      Was about to say the same.

      @plop123 you can't compare the brakes on an Audi to a Mazda. Euros tend to have better brakes, but the tradeoff is that rotors are designed to be consumable so you are up for more in regular maintenance

  • Windows98 on 06/09/2023 - 17:27
    +1

    What exactly makes them shady?

    Putting a deposit to hold a car is normal to weed out the time wasters. And a deposit to pay for the rwc costs in case the buyer decides to back out is again normal.

    Get an RACV pre purchase check if you're concerned about anything and ask for the deposits back if anything actually concerning comes back.

    They will check everything and is an essential service for people who know nothing about cars when they're buying second hand.

  • Morefromgerry on 06/09/2023 - 18:09

    Way too many red flags, and there are plenty of other mazda 3s in that price range with less kms (base spec neos but still a fine car for your first car). Also, when someone doesn't service a car for 30,000kms, you have to question how they treat the car in general.

  • lgacb08 on 06/09/2023 - 21:09
    +1

    Nah, I'm playing devil advocates here, 200k mazda 3 is nothing to worry about. Yes, 30k without a service is a bit of a worry but I wonder why didn't you pick it up in the first place. You even mentioned oil being dirty but it's odd that the service question not even came right afterwards. But the car sounds alright by description, nothing can go wrong with it anyway.
    Also you can't really tell the oil dirty or not mate, the moment you close the hood and turn it on, all oil be the same. You cant tell 3 week old vs 3 year old oil unless the car have serious oil byrn/leak that hardly anything left.

  • kindra on 06/09/2023 - 21:30

    Do not buy this car or any cars from these areas. Dodgy as f****. Ive purchased 2 cars from around that area and it seemed they were involved in floods or some kind of major accident thats been rebirthed. Your better off buying from a private seller.

  • bmerigan on 06/09/2023 - 22:27
    1. Why would you pay him money unless you've decided to buy the car?
    2. How can you determine the front brake is not working properly? I don't think you can.
    • ZachBlasphemy on 07/09/2023 - 07:58

      They think the front brakes are for when you're going forwards and the rear brakes are for going backwards.

  • fredk1000 on 06/09/2023 - 22:48
    +1

    The car is pretty much looking brand new only travelling 200km, should be still on the first tank of petrol.

  • Dabbler68 on 07/09/2023 - 00:29

    You should consider the $500 as in the past. Try not to think that you are invested in it. So now you can either walk away (vague possibility of getting a refund), or buy the car for $8,500. Now, after reading all these comments would you spend $8,500 on this car?

    If you have no ability at assessing the mechanical state and still want it, then pay for that inspection. That may REALLY save you money. The fact that it has not sold in months is one of the red flags.

    Do these cars have timing belts or chains that need to be replaced at around that distance or before? If that fails you probably need a new engine. Check maintenance records.

    I said there was a vague possibility of getting that $500 back. Your first post said it was to get the service done and RWC. Did the service get done? Service report?

    • plop123 on 07/09/2023 - 10:52

      RWC and Service has now been complete. RWC notes only headlights needs a polish but other than that no issues. Called the mechanic that did the service and he notes brake looked fine from inspection also notes there’s 70% left in the front brake pad and 90% for the rear - and there’s at least 30,000kms left before a change is needed.

      Could that be potentially the reason why it’s not as responsive?

      Will be test driving it again this weeknd and having a mechanic look at it for peace of mind. If there are any issues mentioned I will walk away.

  • bhubb18 on 07/09/2023 - 11:43

    Brakes - yeah brake feel can be different between cars
    Dirty oil - yeah, oil looks dirty pretty quickly. No log books isnt a red flag, it may have been serviced by an owner

    Conversely, this doesn't mean the car isn't a lemon though, just that it isn't necessarily one.

    • pjetson on 07/09/2023 - 15:56

      It may have been serviced by an owner

      If so, it's very unlikely that anything other than draining the old oil and putting new oil in has been done.

    • Matt P on 08/09/2023 - 00:07

      Brake feel - Audi/VW/Skoda etc.. notoriously have touchy brake pedal feel. My Mazda (08 MX5) is a lot more progressive than any of my VWs

  • bomberswarm2 on 07/09/2023 - 11:51
    +1

    13 year old car for $10k? Buy a new Kia picanto for $18k and a 7 year warranty. Didn't buy a used car when I needed a new one this year as $27k for a new i30 was far better value than paying a fortune for some ancient piece of junk.

    • billy72 on 07/09/2023 - 12:23
      +5

      The used car market exists because some people can only afford a certain amount of money. It's always more difficult to buy a $6k used car than a $12k used car less a $27k new car.

  • kaleidoscope on 07/09/2023 - 16:29
    +1

    I notice the front brake is not as responsive as it should be, I used my girlfriends car as a comparison as I've driven that before an AUDI A1 for reference

    Brake response differs between vehicles as well as driving profiles such as comfort/ sporty/ normal…

    I don’t see much red-flags tbh rather than you being too suspicious of everything. It’s also standard practice for seller to ask for deposit for rwc as the damn thing only is valid for short time. You can however set expectations around that where rwc does not come back with issues than what’s disclosed to you at the time.

    ——

    Asking price of $11k for 2011 vehicle at 200k is too high but then again used market is inflated due to supply issues. If I were you I’d rather try to negotiate bit low based on rwc fixes and not serviced since 170k point and i’d probably go there again with someone experienced or better with mechanic. If you’re still unconvinced get one of those korean ones with 7 year warranty for a bit more money.

  • AG_ACT on 07/09/2023 - 21:00

    Not saying it’s a good deal or will be trouble free but:

    My Mum’s brakes on a 2009 golf are far more responsive than a 2019 Camry. Comparing euro Audi a1 to Japanese run about doesn’t seem like a fair comparison.

    A service should be done when you buy a car anyways, I would care less about the actual condition of the oil and more about when it was last changed.

    By all means get a mechanic to check out, but just fyi, we got a clean bill of health on a car with a water pump with fins rusted through. Completely cooked the engine after 3 mechanics couldn’t figure out why head gasket kept blowing…. A car with 200k on it is going to be a car with 200k on it. Anything can go wrong at any time.

  • carlJack on 07/09/2023 - 21:50

    You can buy this cheap car for 10k and spend another 3k for repairs or buy a better one for 14k.

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