Advice Needed: My Tenant's Cats Has Been Killed by Neighbour's Dogs

Yaren24 on 12/06/2022 - 14:36

Hi everyone,

long story short, my tenant who has got 3 cats, this morning has been killed by his neighbor's 2 dogs,

Both of the cats are loving cats and never provoked any neighbour dogs in the past, never wondered to other neighborhoods, most of the time they have rested in front of door and sit under sun . The investigation has been conducted, the owner of the dogs seemed to had alcohol last night and forgot to close his gates. The other neighbour also witnessed this.

Through the discussions with the investigator, it seems to be they are looking at ways of regulating the dogs; but I am not sure yet, I am not sure how to aid my tenant as he is in 70s who needs help.

I am not sure how to help him at the moment.

thanks

Pets

Comments

  • screensaver on 12/06/2022 - 14:38
    +47

    complain to the police and the council.

    • Yaren24 on 12/06/2022 - 14:41
      +5

      This is done, they are in the process of investigation

      • Scrooge McDuck on 13/06/2022 - 08:05
        +6

        I got something in my eye. T_T

        • consume on 13/06/2022 - 14:59
          +8

          reddit.com/r/BanPitBulls

      • surg3on on 14/06/2022 - 17:42
        +1

        End of thread then. Likely the dogs will get a Dangerous Dog citation. Two or three strikes and they get put down

    • SlavOz on 17/06/2022 - 22:04

      Why punish the dogs? They don't do anything out of spite or harm, they are simply acting on instinct.

  • tsunamisurfer on 12/06/2022 - 14:46
    +61

    This is nothing to do with you the landlord.

    This is between the tenant and the neighbour.

    The neighbour should face some gegal scrutiny but I doubt much will come of it.

    Did the dogs enter your property?

    • Yaren24 on 12/06/2022 - 14:47

      Yes, they both came to the front yard

      • lubos on 12/06/2022 - 14:54
        +26

        Then the dog owner would be liable for damages. Cats would be considered a property. So it's a damage to property. Best to speak to lawyer but pretty sure your tenant can take this to court and get compensated by neighbor.

        • cameldownunder on 12/06/2022 - 21:04
          +1

          I think the owner can be fined around $1000 ( maybe per dog ) if they are not on leash and cause damage

          "There is a penalty of up to $1,100 fine to a dog owner or person who isn’t the dog owner but above 16-years of age in charge of the dog, if he/she:

          Is in a public place; and Fails to have effective control of the dog by the use of an adequate leash, cord or chain attached to the dog while being held by him/her at the time."

          • Poor Ass on 13/06/2022 - 01:34
            +2

            @cameldownunder: Nah it won't stick you have to prove that they are doing it repeatedly etc never closes the gate or not fenced causing a hazard

            Hit a dog with a car once and owners were not liable for my insurance excess because they took "reasonable care" most times

            Dog survived but limped away. Front bumper wrecked.

            • Scrooge McDuck on 13/06/2022 - 08:00
              +12

              @Poor Ass: Did you get the dog's details?

              • Poor Ass on 13/06/2022 - 10:25
                +3

                @Scrooge McDuck: I know this a joke but yes I did get the dog's details and dog's owner

            • mauricem on 13/06/2022 - 11:55
              +18

              @Poor Ass: "owners were not liable for my insurance excess because they took "reasonable care" most times"

              that's strange, it's like saying I usually stop at red lights so I'm not liable for the Ferrari I just t boned when I ran a red

              • Poor Ass on 13/06/2022 - 14:25
                +8

                @mauricem: possible but insurance also even calls it an act of god so it's BS

                it's no act of god when dogs are just roaming around the street. it happened because the owners were negligent.

                • CocaKoala on 15/06/2022 - 19:03

                  @Poor Ass:

                  possible but insurance also even calls it an act of god so it's BS

                  All insurers are absolute pondscum when it really comes to that. I mean, if they believe in God then everything is an act of God so they might as well get out of paying for it when a b double crushes your parked car. Technically it was an act of God, yes? Stupid bastards.

              • Poor Ass on 13/06/2022 - 14:30

                @mauricem: it's kind of like that stupid rule in Qld where if you hit livestock on the road the owner of the livestock is not liable because livestock has right of way on the roads

                not sure about other states but surely the owner would be liable

            • berry580 on 13/06/2022 - 23:12

              @Poor Ass: Reasonable care most times?
              I think the only time that matters is when the "accident" occurred.

              "Reasonable care most times" is the dumbest argument i ever heard of.
              Did they use the same lawyer as Amber Turd?

              • Poor Ass on 13/06/2022 - 23:38

                @berry580: If you ever need to deal with insurance they do stupid shit like that

                In Qld there's a stupid law that says animals have right of way in any circumstance and you can't seek financial compensation from the owner

              • bigbadboogieman on 14/06/2022 - 08:31

                @berry580: They surely didn't because clearly they won.

      • [Deactivated] on 15/06/2022 - 16:05
        -1

        Cat's should be kept indoors to protect native wildlife.
        They wouldn't think twice about catching a bird or lizard.
        Law of the jungle I suppose.

    • MrBear on 13/06/2022 - 09:42
      +32

      This is between the tenant and the neighbour.

      They know this, they are just trying to be a good landlord and are helping their elderly tenant. As they stated in the post.

  • AndyC1 on 12/06/2022 - 14:59
    -5

    Who is the "investigator"? Police or ranger?
    Were 2 or 3 cats killed?

    Get your tenant to call one or more of the mental help lines to see what help the tenant can get.

    • Yaren24 on 12/06/2022 - 15:01
      +35

      Police, 2 cats of his were killed, (he had 3 cats), the reason i am posting as the tenant is still a good friend of mine.

      • cameldownunder on 12/06/2022 - 21:05
        +44

        Nice of you to help out. Especially elder people sometimes avoid causing commotion.

        • Yaren24 on 13/06/2022 - 19:08
          +6

          Thank you, I think you are right being neighbourhood he tried to avoid conflicts, In the contrary, I was so angry that i nearly wanted to break bones of 2 dogs yesterday he had to stop me going there.

            • Bren20 on 14/06/2022 - 08:37
              +14

              @[Deactivated]: Yes, I agree, it's the cats fault that they were mauled by an unrestrained dog

              • [Deactivated] on 18/06/2022 - 17:15
                +1

                @Bren20: No… it's the cats owner's fault the unrestrained cats were mauled by the unrestrained dogs.

            • cameldownunder on 14/06/2022 - 08:39
              +2

              @[Deactivated]: If the Cats would have killed the dogs, then I might be with you.
              How many cats have attacked / bitten people? How many dogs ?

              Did you ever read "Cat mauled toddler to death" ?

              • miicah on 15/06/2022 - 19:15
                +1

                @cameldownunder:

                How many cats have attacked / bitten people

                How much native wildlife have cats killed?

              • [Deactivated] on 18/06/2022 - 17:17
                +1

                @cameldownunder: BOTH owners were at fault. But if anyone deserves greater blame it's the cat owner… because the dogs are usually kept correctly behind a fence they can't jump over and escaped once, whereas the cats are free to jump the fence at will every day of their lives.

                • cameldownunder on 18/06/2022 - 18:51

                  @[Deactivated]: "and forgot to close his gates" I think the dogs escaped. Could have been a toddler or another small dog.

                  Greater blame to the less strong?

                  "because the dogs are usually kept correctly behind a fence" but it seems not in this case.

                  As if the cat throw themselves in the mouth of a dog.

            • RDY4ME on 14/06/2022 - 10:03
              +10

              @[Deactivated]: Do you blame human victims of assault for being in the street after dark as well?

              • [Deactivated] on 18/06/2022 - 17:18

                @RDY4ME: Humans aren't dogs and cats. There's zero correlation.

            • Bargain Slut on 14/06/2022 - 19:51
              +2

              @[Deactivated]: I pray that you don't have daughters…

              • [Deactivated] on 18/06/2022 - 17:19
                +1

                @Bargain Slut: My daughters don't jump fences to kill and bring back dead wildlife in their teeth.

                • cameldownunder on 18/06/2022 - 18:59

                  @[Deactivated]: The only thing my daughter has in her teeth is caries.

                  Do you think cat bring back Koalas, Kangaroos and possums?

                  The biggest thing my cat got was a Rat and a Mina Bird.

                  I wonder what damage the dogs are doing.

                  • [Deactivated] on 19/06/2022 - 20:33

                    @cameldownunder:

                    The only thing my daughter has in her teeth is caries.

                    Canaries!?

                    Do you think cat bring back Koalas, Kangaroos and possums?

                    Never said the last two, but you do know animals start off as small young, right? e.g. I used to live in a house that backed onto bush. Its trees were full of koalas, probably possums too. Sometimes a koala with young on their back would amble out of the bush, across the road, and climb trees on the footpath. Then I'd see dogs on leads barking up at them, and solitary cats peering up wide-eyed waiting. Not only do cats climb trees, but koalas often travel from tree to tree by descending to the ground first and walking. So it doesn't take much imagination to realise why the cat was sitting licking its lips. Also had a neighbour who rescued a sugar glider after seeing a cat kill it's mother.

                    I wonder what damage the dogs are doing.

                    Not much in comparison. The dogs escaped a yard that otherwise keeps them in check - once. Whereas it sounds like the old guy gave his cats free reign of the backyard, for years, from which point they could easily spring over the fence.

                    • cameldownunder on 19/06/2022 - 21:33

                      @[Deactivated]: Caries: tooth decay, commonly called cavities

                      I used to live in a house that backed onto bush

                      Lucky. I live in suburbia, the wildest we have are possums and Rabbits ( maybe bandicoots )

                      Our cats are in at night ( mostly ) and haven't taken anything back ( like baby possum or ringtail possum )

                      But I do see soo many dogs off the leash going past our house. With one getting into our kitchen through the side of the house.

                      And the two cats scared on the kitchentable.

                      I was going for the big knife but the owner showed up.

                • Bargain Slut on 19/06/2022 - 16:51

                  @[Deactivated]: There might be a few bargains here that could be of use to you: https://www.ozbargain.com.au/cat/education

    • dtc on 12/06/2022 - 15:02
      +114

      Maybe because sometimes people care about other people and want to help them, rather than treating other people as a financial asset (or liability)? I dont know, obviously that might be a weird opinion.

        • dtc on 12/06/2022 - 15:12
          +41

          How do you go from 'I want to help my tenant' to 'I am going to force the tenant to do something he doesnt want to do'?

          Have you never helped a person before? Here is a tip to start off - you offer help when you see that someone needs it, you suggest things maybe you can do, the person then decides whether or not to accept that help. You follow what they tell you they want.

          Try it sometime.

    • Some Human on 12/06/2022 - 23:58
      +4

      The landlord / OP is good friends with the Tennant. This is why they want to help.

      • OZKap on 14/06/2022 - 19:04

        Average internet user incapable of comprehending the concept of "friendship".

        • DiscoJango on 14/06/2022 - 20:24

          Average internet user incapable of comprehending the concept of "friendship".

          Just your average ozmoron :)

  • screensaver on 12/06/2022 - 15:01
    +10

    Perhaps you can install a fence and gate to protectt the properrty more. Same thing happened to me, I was extremely traumatised for a long time

    • Yaren24 on 12/06/2022 - 15:10
      +18

      I probably should, never had These dogs gone berserk, i was so livid as i lived with these cats before

      • Scrooge McDuck on 13/06/2022 - 08:06
        +6

        Sorry for your loss. </3

        • Kangal on 13/06/2022 - 09:18
          +1

          I'm gobsmacked that Pam actually made a decent post/suggestion. Have hell hath frozen over?

    • Gronk on 12/06/2022 - 15:08
      +48

      With a bit of luck they might move in next to you and do us a bigger favour :)

    • Pelicannn on 12/06/2022 - 15:09
      +7

      A bit uncalled for…

    • 2025 on 13/06/2022 - 00:27
      -2

      Wildlife would be happier if it was the dogs.
      http://www.australasianscience.com.au/news/january-2012/dome…

      • mapax on 13/06/2022 - 08:07
        +8

        That sounds like a misleading article, it almost smells like it was written by a cat fancier or they forgot to include information from the study?

        Dogs frequently worry and injure wildlife closer to or larger than their own size which results in wildlife injuries requiring a vet visit. Cats frequently target wildlife smaller than their own size and therefore have a higher kill to injury rate which results in dead wildlife being dumped in the bush or in a bin and not taken to a vet.

        • Charmoffensive on 13/06/2022 - 12:46
          +7

          it's more a function of: People lock their dogs away, but think it's perfectly fine for their cat to roam outside of their property.

          Dogs have much, much, MUCH less opportunity to hunt wildlife compared to everyone's outdoor cat.

          • Yawhae on 13/06/2022 - 13:17

            @Charmoffensive: Couldn't agree more.

            I adopted my sister's cat after she got sick of looking after it. It was an outdoor cat and locking it inside at night sent it insane. Even during the day it would catch birds, lizards, mice ect…

            We eventually locked it inside permanently but its just always crazy.

            It's kind of why I'm against cat ownership. They want to be outdoors but can't because they just kill wildlife. Keeping them permanently inside also seems cruel.

            • Charmoffensive on 13/06/2022 - 13:38
              +1

              @Yawhae: It depends on how the cat grew up. I know a couple people who have kept their cats indoors since they were kittens and their cats seem perfectly happy indoors. I'm ok with cat ownership, but there needs to be strict controls on how and where they are allowed. i.e. indoors or it's straight to the ranger and a chunky fine.

    • smartazz104 on 13/06/2022 - 09:21

      I bet you couldn’t name any of the local wildlife.

      • lew380 on 13/06/2022 - 10:49

        I cry when i go out, i dont see any native species, i just see cats and foxes, prowling around, killing whats little is left of our "untouched" outback. In not anto cat, but if its not housed, its a killer on the loose. Those dogs saved a bullet.

  • dtc on 12/06/2022 - 15:09
    +1

    The council is responsible for regulation and it is the council that will investigate and make the decision. Often they consult with the injured party eg 'we think these dogs could be sufficiently dangerous so as to be put down, do you want us to do that'. Or whatever the decision is. In terms of what happens to the dogs, there isnt really anything that can be done by you or your tenant.

    In terms of compensation, your tenant may not want any - its not like a value can be put on a standard pet (that isnt a show animal). If he wanted to get replacement cats then perhaps the cost of those is a fair payment, but its probably not really what he is after. However it could be raised and it may be something you can help out with, because having it go through a third party is much less confrontational than the tenant doing it himself (not to mention less stressful in the future). Be the liaison with the neighbour, perhaps even with the council

    As to how to prevent it in the future - others have given suggestions. Cats can climb over fences so if they are allowed outside there is no way to absolutely protect them; but you can prevent the dogs getting in.

    • Scrooge McDuck on 13/06/2022 - 08:18
      +18

      They could put down the dog owner.

    • TEER3X on 13/06/2022 - 14:33

      Is it's on private property, council will likely not be involved

      • banana365 on 13/06/2022 - 15:31
        +2

        Not true. We've had less extreme issues (fence damage) with a neighbour's dogs and the council are very interested. It may take a while to talk to the correct person in the council, but they will likely do everything they can to help. In our council (and likely most others) that can escalate to removal of dogs, though we didn't need to go anywhere near that far.

        • TEER3X on 13/06/2022 - 18:25
          +1

          most councils these days are shite, you're lucky you live in an area where the council gives a rats

  • Gronk on 12/06/2022 - 15:22
    +2

    There's not much recourse here because it was only animals involved, if a human had of been bitten it would be a very different scenario.

    If the tenant decides to get more cats to replace those they lost, maybe look at getting a cat-run installed so that the cats can still get outside in a controlled environment?

    • Yaren24 on 12/06/2022 - 15:41

      The tenant was scatched by the dogs, but i don't think the dogs bitten the tenant.

    • TEER3X on 13/06/2022 - 14:34

      The recourse is the dogs will be put down. Basically the law when they bite or attack anyone or any animal, with some discretion

  • MS Paint on 12/06/2022 - 15:32
    +60

    my tenant who has got 3 cats, this morning has been killed by his neighbor's 2 dogs,

    To clarify, your tenant was killed by 2 dogs?

    • pjetson on 12/06/2022 - 17:38
      +17

      That's what the sentence says.

      • Scrooge McDuck on 13/06/2022 - 08:10
        +4

        It'd kill me too if two of my babies met violent ends. </3

  • rektrading on 12/06/2022 - 15:33
    +22

    Pet owners should keep their pets locked up inside their property.

    That includes both 🐕 and 🐈 owners.

    • deme on 12/06/2022 - 17:22
      +21

      Cryptocurrency shills should be locked up

      • nobro25 on 13/06/2022 - 01:10

        When Dogecoin absorbs Catcoin.

  • bobbified on 12/06/2022 - 16:34
    +8

    The investigation has been conducted, the owner of the dogs seemed to had alcohol last night and forgot to close his gates.

    The neighbour didn't close his gates.

    And how did the dogs get into your tenant's place? Did they not close their own gates too?

    • Sirlofty on 12/06/2022 - 17:50
      +25

      Ok.

      And if a child is in their yard playing and a dog comes in and kills them, is that fine because dogs have "instincts"? Should people not let their children play in their yard just in case a dog comes in and sees "prey"? What a stupid argument. Animal owners have a reponsibility to keep other's safe from their pets. If they can't, they don't deserve to have any, and get punished if anything happens.

        • screensaver on 12/06/2022 - 18:47
          +2

          just furbabies this time

        • nobro25 on 13/06/2022 - 01:12
          -1

          Lol I get your jokes but unfortunately this isn't 4chan. People are much more tame on Ozbargain and yea… Hence the dislikes.

          • [Deactivated] on 13/06/2022 - 01:28
            -4

            @nobro25: yeah, people want to deny reality here. fact is, a dog is not too far off a wild animal, with poor training, they can act as a wild animal. people should take precautions to protect themselves and their pets. expecting everybody else to be a perfect citizen is foolish, the society we live in is far from a utopia.

            i stand by what i said, any cat outside is going to kill, the dogs only did what the cats have been doing for their entire adult lives. the only cat that i have that is allowed outside does it too, sometimes he even brings back the carcasses, or vomits them up.

            • AlanHB on 13/06/2022 - 07:43
              +3

              @[Deactivated]: Cats also go outside to sleep, go to the toilet, chill in the sun, you know, not be permanent death machines like you think.

              • [Deactivated] on 13/06/2022 - 17:54

                @AlanHB:

                https://wilderness-society.org/domestic-cats-as-a-serious-th…

                Cats are also known to carry many diseases: plague, rabies, and the parasite Toxoplasma gondii. All are zoonotic diseases, carried by animals and capable of jumping to people. About one third of the worlds population is infected with Toxoplasmosis which can cause death of the fetus in pregnant women. Despite the evidence lined up against cats, pet owners have a hard time accepting that their felines may cause problems. Solving the problem of cat predation on wildlife obviously will require cooperation of pet owners. While one individual cat’s predation may not be an issue, the sheer number of cats equals a big problem. Especially because domestic cats are not part of a healthy natural ecosystem.

                https://invasives.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Fact-she…

                Many people are unaware that their pet cat is leaving the house and roaming. A radio-tracking study in Adelaide found that of the 177 cats whom owners believed were inside at night, 69 (39%) were sneaking out for nocturnal adventures. Many owners believe their cats don’t hunt because they never come across evidence of killed animals. However, studies of pet cats using video-tracking collars or scat analysis have established that the vast majority (85%) of the animals killed by pet cats are not brought home.

                About 38% of the animals killed by pet cats are introduced species like rabbits, house mice, house sparrows and Indian mynahs, whereas about 23% of a feral cat’s prey are introduced species. But even considering the toll on native species alone, pet cats kill 4,440 to 8,100 animals per square kilometre each year, which is 28–52 times more native animals per square kilometre per year than feral cats kill in the bush (157 animals per square kilometre). Like feral cats, pet cats also kill frogs and invertebrates, but the available data on these prey groups were too patchy to estimate overall predation rates and tolls.

                https://catharnessaustralia.com.au/blogs/research-on-cats/ev…

                cat got your tongue?

            • Scrooge McDuck on 13/06/2022 - 08:14

              @[Deactivated]: Does your outside cat have a bell?

              • [Deactivated] on 13/06/2022 - 12:18

                @Scrooge McDuck: he used to, we found out it was (profanity) up the skin around his neck, even though it wasn't tight, so he doesnt wear a collar anymore.

                we took it off a few months ago for another unrelated reason and the skin was all scabby, crusty

    • DemocracyManifest on 13/06/2022 - 01:33
      +3

      Yeah and put the dogs down too because now they’ve been blooded, if they haven’t before

      • [Deactivated] on 13/06/2022 - 02:55
        -2

        oh please, that is a myth.

        • UFO on 14/06/2022 - 09:17
          -2

          No… it's not a myth. Get a clue.

          • [Deactivated] on 14/06/2022 - 12:42

            @UFO: It is a myth. Take your own advice.

    • burningrage on 13/06/2022 - 08:11
      -1

      Booooo! No.

    • merivetio on 13/06/2022 - 22:42
      -1

      All of this is very unfortunate and neighbour was in the wrong, but the downvoters are just butthurt and have no actual (valid) argument, as per usual on the internet…I'll measure my accuracy of this comment with the number of downvotes, so please keep them coming! Please and thank you

      • DingoBilly on 15/06/2022 - 05:06
        -1

        Yes, upvotes and downvotes signify the accuracy of the comment, where down means accurate and up means inaccurate. You've got this system figured out!

        The jumps of logic people do when they're wrong always amazes me.

  • shaybisc on 12/06/2022 - 18:35

    What kind of dogs?

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