Genuine Question, Are We behind The World in Our Speed Limits?

[Deactivated] on 06/09/2021 - 19:06
Last edited 06/09/2021 - 20:06 by 1 other user

Where I live in NSW, most roads speed limits are 50km/h, and the fastest I can go on the highway is 110km/h. I went for a drive with a co-worker in a brand new 2021 car. It got to the 110 speed limit ridiculously fast, and was barely even trying to do it.

Around town the car was damn near falling asleep doing 50. Do you think speed limits might be increased one day, maybe not in towns but 110 seems pretty low on the highway. Although we do need to account for roos. I saw some cop cars in BMW's worth $150k, that can reach 100km/h in 3.9 seconds.

Just couldn't help but think this today. I did some looking and 130 seems more common around the world. Some say we could even go to 150

Automotive

Comments

  • Hybroid on 06/09/2021 - 19:08
    +20

    Wishful thinking but won't happen. UK is 70 MPH = 110 KM/H too.

    • [Deactivated] on 06/09/2021 - 19:15
      +3

      I was looking to buy a new car soon and get rid of the used camry. Cant help but wonder why the more I think about it. Most I can do is 110, which even the camry can get to fine, and most of the time I am limited to 50, which the camry does at 1500 revs.

      • SF3 on 06/09/2021 - 20:54
        +31

        If you want drive fast, your best bet is to go to a track day event. Heaps safer, no risk of fines and drive as fast as you can.

        • unwashed00 on 07/09/2021 - 09:21
          +23

          But then you need to know how to drive fast

          • SF3 on 07/09/2021 - 09:28
            +4

            @unwashed00: better if such drivers (profanity) up on the track than on the public road right? :)

            Or they go to official events to do a quarter mile and get a Time Slip.

          • Leeroy Jenkins on 09/09/2021 - 12:42

            @unwashed00: That's basically where all the fun comes from, the process of improving your driving skill and getting faster lap times.

        • JDMcarfan on 08/09/2021 - 12:55
          +11

          I mean OP is not talking about speeding as fast as they'd like.

          Just that the relative speeds on our roads are horrendously low for the infrastructure we now have. I cannot understand for the life of me why comparably shitty arterial roads in the country are signposted at 100, whilst interstate standard highways (dual-carriageways) with sufficient clearances and wider lanes at statutorily limited to 110. Either the former should be reduced (unlikely given country distances) or the latter increased (much more logical). Nor do I understand the justification for statutory speed limits on our roads, no law should dictate the maximum velocity that we should be allowed to travel, but instead professional engineers/surveyors/road safety experts who examine the road standards and determine a speed that's appropriate.

          In saying all that, I don't see any potential changes on the horizon, and need to admit that our driving habits/licencing scheme in this country are terrible though, with next to no lane discipline on >=90 speed zones or formal high speed training. This is what most people would say is the most important thing to enable high speed driving and is why Europe can handle high speeds and high tolerances without having a drastically higher death rate.
          People need to learn to KEEP LEFT UNLESS OVERTAKING and drive to the conditions (i.e. slow at night and in rain). If police monitoring on highways shifted more from speeding to driver behaviour (i.e. not keeping left, reckless driving, driving high/drunk/fatigued) you'd get a better overall outcome for all parties.

          Our infrastructure has greatly improved (not yet at European standards nationwide) over the last 10-20 years with high quality dual carriageways from Melbourne to Brisbane, and I believe that the whole stretch should really have a speed limit of 130 with a fixed & transparent 5-10% tolerance (like Europe).
          I've driven the whole thing and other than a few sections here and there (mainly pacific highway), 130 would be the most appropriate speed, and is generally what I travel at when I have Waze on.
          Using the French model would also be a good idea, where limits are reduced to 110 in poor visibility settings (rain, fog & night) with strict drive to the conditions rules in place.
          Trucks should also have greater speed restrictions in place which should bring the limiter to 90 (like in Europe) so that they don't compete with cars on velocity and attempt unnecessary overtaking, whilst also improving fuel economy and emissions.
          Further states with speed restrictions on provisional licences (NSW), need to remove that draconian mindset so it causes a safety hazard on motorways given the large speed differentials and doesn't train new drivers to become familiar with higher speed driving. I've noticed many close calls where impatient people try to overtake a learner doing 80/90 and nearly be collected up by someone in the neighbouring lane doing 110-120.

          As mentioned by Hybroid "The straight line route from Sydney to Canberra also frequently goes up to 140 KM/H", I can confirm that this is 100% accurate given my weekly commute previously and is quite safe given the road conditions, most traffic doing that speed is extremely familiar with the route (and know where the cops hide). Its still is great when you have a small group of cars travelling together at those speeds, as paranoia often kicks in given frequent police/mobile speed camera presence, however highway patrol generally leaves 10-15kph buffer before fining on those section.

          • [Deactivated] on 08/09/2021 - 18:33
            +2

            @JDMcarfan: All of this. I've driven in various countries, including some highways with a signed speed of 160km/h. The difference is that people follow lane rules strictly (each lane is signed with a speed limit and the types of vehicles allowed) and there is less road rage. The roads are also of a far higher standard (Aus has third world roads in a lot of places) and it doesn't actually feel scary travelling at high speeds.

            • Scrooge McDuck on 09/09/2021 - 05:33

              @[Deactivated]: Both Liberal and Labor are too gutless to ever increase speed limits.

              The Liberal Democratic Party are the only ones who want to reduce government interference in our lives.

          • Roman Sandstorm on 09/09/2021 - 15:45

            @JDMcarfan: @JDMcarfan

            Nor do I understand the justification for statutory speed limits on our roads,

            You answer your own question.

            I don't see any potential changes on the horizon, and need to admit that our driving habits/licencing scheme in this country are terrible though, with next to no lane discipline on >=90 speed zones or formal high speed training.

            Back in the 60's, 70's 80's Australia's road toll was so high (proportionally to the rest of the developed world), that governments were forced to finally take road safety seriously. But by then, a long-standing pattern of behaviour had been entrenched.

            And as proper driver education and skills testing/improvement have always been regarded as too difficult, statutory regulation has been the answer.

            To be fair, it has mostly worked. Our rates are pretty similar now to comparable countries.

            However, this plainly upsets all the fantastic and perfectly safe drivers (like @JDMcarfan, and 95% of OzBargain members), who really want to drive their fast cars, fast.

            As most people who have driven on European motorways can attest, there still remains a definite cultural, attitudinal and skills difference between average 'Aussie' drivers and average Euro drivers. I do not see this changing.

      • SydStrand on 06/09/2021 - 23:37
        +3

        If your only requirement is higher top speed, then what's stopping you upgrading? Even in the 70s and 80s, passenger cars could hit 110kph. New cars are improving other aspects like efficiency, reliability, safety, etc. Also, there are only a handful of scenarios like crossing the Nullabor where 150kph will actually save you any meaningful time. And at that speed, most of your fuel will be used pushing against air, so I hope you have great aero.

        • This Guy on 07/09/2021 - 19:09
          -6

          Not really. Doing 60 in a 50 zone saves you 17% if you could sit at 50 or 60 for the whole drive. 150 compared to 110km/h is a further 10% faster, but is far more draining.

          What can feel better is going 55 for a minute or two to get you though a set of traffic lights you would have got stuck at if driving at 50. Two minutes saving for two minutes low range speeding is a pretty decent return.

      • tessel on 07/09/2021 - 18:19

        cOz sOciety TellZ u 2 C0SUM3!!!

      • lint on 08/09/2021 - 10:23
        +3

        I get the argument that maybe the speed limit on certain motorways should be increased, but your justification seems more to be "these cars I've driven or rode in are overpowered for these roads, why can't they change it so they can be driven to their potential?"

        To which the answer would be that the speed limits aren't designed around the speed and acceleration capabilities of the vehicles that go on them.

    • dogboy on 07/09/2021 - 12:09
      +10

      Try driving on the highway in the UK doing 70MPH. People will be passing you like you are standing still and you will be abused if you are not in the slow lane.

      • Hybroid on 07/09/2021 - 13:23
        +8

        That is completely correct. General flow does commonly reach 100 MPH, especially on the M6 Toll with relatively fewer cameras and police patrols.

        The straight line route from Sydney to Canberra also frequently goes up to 140 KM/H.

        • 2BsQzrbgkL on 07/09/2021 - 22:32

          100 MPH is exaggerating a bit, 100MPH is approaching loss of license. 80-85MPH is fairly accepted on the motorway around (130-135km/h give or take).

          • Hybroid on 07/09/2021 - 22:47
            -1

            @2BsQzrbgkL: Did M25 daily for a long long time. 100MPH easily and you'll still be overtaken.

            • Arsenal on 08/09/2021 - 14:12

              @Hybroid: When was this though? I used to drive back and forth regularly between London and the Isle of Wight and would occasionally hit 100mph (in a Ford Ka mind you), but this was nearly 20 years ago now. I was under the impression that travelling consistently over about 85mph these days was considerably more likely to end up getting you booked.

              • Hybroid on 08/09/2021 - 16:20

                @Arsenal: Probably 4-5 years ago now. It was generally well known the M25 speed cameras were never switched on and didn't work for some reason so no one cared.

                It's probably changed now with the new "smart" camera upgrades but not sure. I know there's far wider average speed checks being setup such as the A40.

                All these schemes are setup as "temporary" basis then never gets removed (like congestion charging).

                • alUK234 on 08/09/2021 - 21:10
                  +1

                  @Hybroid: 100mph is definitely speeding and if you were seen by police you would be fined. I'm not saying I haven't driven that speed there and it's definitely far less strict then here (been here 4 years and it took me a good year to learn that the speed limits are very literal here and every rule is followed absolutely to the letter) but saying 100mph is normal in the UK 5 or even 10 years ago is not true in my experience.

                  It is also true that there are tonnes of cameras now on roads around that area and variable speed cameras on the M25.

                  Nice to read about the UK..can't actually go there right now but I'll take any little piece of home I can get right now :)

                  • chriise on 09/09/2021 - 09:49

                    @alUK234: Agreed. 100 definitely happens but is not the norm and you will get booked for sure. I’ve heard many times people copping a ticket for going “95” because over that is a ban and (occasionally) the cops show a little mercy.

      • Yorkshire-Man on 07/09/2021 - 13:25
        +8

        Agree. I'm from the UK, the cops generally ignore you till you get over 85mph or if you drive like an idiot.

        • alUK234 on 08/09/2021 - 21:11

          Also agree..people care more about how you are driving rather than speed alone. I also miss the concept of giving way and saying thank you which is non-existent here. On the flip side once you get used to the rules, driving is less stressful here..

        • chriise on 09/09/2021 - 09:53

          I always enjoyed being in a stream of traffic creeping past a cop car on the motorway, everyone doing 75-80 then slowly picking back up again afterwards. Always wondered what cops are thinking in those situations. It’s like an unwritten rule

    • ATangk on 07/09/2021 - 13:40
      +6

      But the difference is that UK is tiny, Australia is massive.

    • [Deactivated] on 07/09/2021 - 13:59
      +29

      The UK motorway speed limit is 70mph, but they don't enforce it unless you are in a marked average speed check zone, or you are over 100mph (160kmh). I lived in the UK for years and used to drive to and from work between 150-160kmh daily. Cops don't even have cars on the motorways, they sit on overpasses and look out for bad driving, not speeding.

      UK has speeding right. They put clearly marked cameras up in high accident zones to slow people down, they let you speed on sections of the freeway which is safe, they have slower speed limits where cars and pedestrians are in close proximity, and they target bad driving, not speeding.

      Most of the rest of Europe does the same. In Australia, it's just a source of revenue (but it has been getting better, even cops on the Westgate freeway don't drive at 80kmh through the roadworks section, they do 100kmh like everyone else).

      Also, a thing to take onboard is that UK, despite having a higher density of people and drivers, despite having ice on the road and very bad weather and potentially snow for months every year, has a road toll 30% less than ours. Says a lot.

      • nfusion on 08/09/2021 - 06:55

        has a road toll 30% less than ours. Says a lot.

        Yep about how badly people here drive, my wife is from UK and I'm from NZ, whenever it rains we see people here drive like a session of bumper cars in an amusement park.
        And it doesn't even rain that bad :D

        • [Deactivated] on 08/09/2021 - 09:11
          +1

          The rain here is way worse than UK. But UK people are for sure better drivers.

          • co doonunda on 08/09/2021 - 11:48

            @[Deactivated]: Amongst my group of expat friends/acquaintances from the UK, we have talked about the shock of the standard of driving in Sydney when we arrived.

            • [Deactivated] on 08/09/2021 - 12:16
              +3

              @co doonunda: It starts with eye contact. In the UK drivers look at each other when in an intersection. Here people purposefully don't look at you, jump queues, push their way in, undertake, drive too slowly in the fast lane, have no lane discipline, and now, worst of all, drive in the freeway at 100kmh texting on their phone. Nuts. But the cops would rather pull a mum dropping the kids off for going 53kmh in a 50kmh zone, instead on nailing p platers on Snapchat doing 20kmh over the limit with their eyes off the road, in the slow lane of the freeway.

            • Gina Rinehart on 08/09/2021 - 13:29
              +1

              @co doonunda: That's what you get with the clusterfeck that is Sydney's road network. I'm from ACT and driving in Sydney is a bloody nightmare. No wonder the drivers suck (hint: drivers suck everywhere and everywhere thinks they have the worst drivers).

    • OzzyOzbourne on 07/09/2021 - 16:12
      +1

      It's 150 kph for Transit vans 😂

  • jjjaar on 06/09/2021 - 19:14
    +57

    A lot of cities around the world are reducing speed limits, especially in built up areas. The equivalent of 30km/hr is becoming a trend where lots of pedestrians are. This is a worldwide thing. Many small European cities have always had 40-50km/hr in built up areas anyway.

    (The main argument for this is being hit by a car going 50km/hr is the equivalent of falling 3 storeys, whereas being hit by a car going 30km/hr is the equivalent of falling 1 storey - I know what kind of environment I’d rather walk in).

    Also, Germany’s no speed limit freeway is not the entire country. There’s only about half of their network that is no speed limit, and the rest is max 120km/hr anyway.

    • [Deactivated] on 06/09/2021 - 19:16
      +4

      So whats the point of these modern cars? I guess this is all heading toward self driving EV's?
      30km/h, I may as well bike to work really

      • jjjaar on 06/09/2021 - 19:18
        +7

        We are nowhere near self driving cars:

        https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/aug/28/toyota-pa…

        I don’t work in the car industry so I can’t explain that part, but I do work in road safety and I can understand why we’re trying to reduce the lives lost on our roads.

        • [Deactivated] on 06/09/2021 - 19:21
          +2

          I can understand in sydney, but 30km/h in my town would be crazy. I live in a town with a population under 10k.

          New cars power just seems pointless a bit now

          • jjjaar on 06/09/2021 - 19:26
            +7

            @[Deactivated]: I’m in Victoria so can only speak to that data, but rural Vic actually has a higher number of lives lost than metro Vic. When you take into account the number of people who live there, it’s a massive difference.

            Now, the simple public data available doesn’t go into the cause, but our rural roads are where most fatalities occur. There’s been some suggestions that the older cars are to blame (hence a large campaign to understand whether people with older cars would replace them with new), but another factor is that rural roads have a higher speed limit than urban roads, or roads within rural towns.

            • tanksinatra on 06/09/2021 - 19:42
              +11

              @jjjaar: Surely the biggest factor would be that people travel further in regional areas and therefore spend more time on the road?

              • jjjaar on 06/09/2021 - 19:59

                @tanksinatra: It’s a factor, but not the main one. A lot of people in metro areas travel 60-90 minutes each way to/from their place of work as well.

                • ESEMCE on 07/09/2021 - 12:45
                  +6

                  @jjjaar: That has little do with speed limits when the car is crawling through congestion.

              • netjock on 06/09/2021 - 21:15
                +5

                @tanksinatra: Lot of it is people driving at 100kph for long periods, getting bored, falling asleep and hitting stationary objects.

                • ProlapsedHeinous on 07/09/2021 - 00:58
                  +3

                  @netjock: Not to mention the distance between the accident and the nearest hospital. time is something car accident victims don't have a lot of if they're bleeding out a couple of hours away from the nearest help.

                • srhardy on 07/09/2021 - 11:03
                  -1

                  @netjock: Disagree. Just cruise control & pull over for a nap if your tired. Often a break for food and loo is all you need. BTW often 100 on the Speedo is 90idh, so use the gps to set 100 and your probably doing 108+ on the car Speedo

                  Nappy often does occur closer to home on sub 60 roads or roadworks as you brain is kept busy at 100 but at 50 your brain will close down

                  • netjock on 07/09/2021 - 11:44
                    +5

                    @srhardy:

                    Just cruise control & pull over for a nap if your tired

                    Easier said than done. Why do they not have signed in Victoria country roads that say "Just cruise control is all you need to stay alive" they have signed that say "micro sleep can kill in an instant"

                    Whether 100kph on speedo is 108 or 90 doesn't make a difference when you wrap yourself around a tree.

                    I'd suggest your brain is busier give a busy road + pedestrians and traffic lights at 60kph suburban road than 100kph in country roads where there sometimes there is stretches where there is no cars at all.

                    I haven't seen any signs that say "sleepy? take a nap, sleep kills" in 60kph metro zones.

                  • nomadspartan on 08/09/2021 - 06:45
                    +3

                    @srhardy: Wrong. When you're driving at 50km/h its usually in town where there are potential hazards that you're trained to look out for therefore your brain is kept busy. Also the width of the roads are narrower which discourages high speeds, which is totally acceptable. Shouldn't speed on residential roads anyway as the risk of hitting another human is unacceptably high.

                    On the motorway however, its a completely different scenario. There are hardly any hazards to look out for, no traffic lights, wider lanes. Just hold the steering wheel and stay in the lane, which is where your brain shuts down. This is where I feel that driving at higher speeds could actually be beneficial just so everyone is forced to stay awake as driving at 140km/h or 150km/h is a totally different experience to chilling at 110km/h.

        • TEER3X on 06/09/2021 - 20:58
          +1

          There are already self driving cars and some countries and states in the US allow them. They're not 100% but I'd guess within 10 years they'd be everywhere

        • 2025 on 07/09/2021 - 08:52
          +1

          That Toyota thing was being driven by a human at the time of the accident, btw

      • mickyb80 on 06/09/2021 - 19:21
        +6

        "So whats the point of these modern cars?"
        D1(k swinging! :)

        Yes, yes, I know…

      • DashCam AKA Rolts on 06/09/2021 - 20:59
        +11

        30km/h, I may as well bike to work really

        That was the point. Many cities OS are trying to make themselves more pedestrian and cyclist friendly.

      • Ryk on 07/09/2021 - 08:39
        +2

        whats the point of these modern cars?

        manufacturer upselling on power and performance that's mostly unusable.

      • unwashed00 on 07/09/2021 - 09:21
        +3

        The point is vanity

      • Antikythera on 07/09/2021 - 11:30
        +1

        penis substitutes

      • NigelTufnel on 07/09/2021 - 11:42
        +5

        I may as well bike to work really

        Good idea! Get some exercise too. Highly recommend.

      • Longtimescroller on 07/09/2021 - 12:06

        Have you ever recorded the average speed while driving through the cbd it will likely be less than 30km/h. The point of cars is to have flexibility to travel faster and further on other roads. You are right though, for short commutes in congested high trafficable areas bikes are certainly preferable.

      • Bren20 on 07/09/2021 - 13:56

        30km/h is generally for local roads. Arterials allow faster speeds.

      • drfuzzy on 07/09/2021 - 17:50

        Why don't you bike to work?

      • peterpaoliello on 07/09/2021 - 20:14

        Technology naturally improves over time, which is now well passed what's required for practical purposes, shit, cars in the 80s were already there. It's human reaction times both for the driver, and other people on the road including pedestrians is the bottleneck.

      • Narull on 09/09/2021 - 13:44

        "So whats the point of these modern cars?"

        There is no point, they make them like that to attract people like you thinking they are powerful so they can make money off you. They don't make them to change laws or for you to go fast, they just want your money for the car sounding 'cool'.

        Your mindset as a whole is wrong mate, just because new cars can go faster doesn't mean they should be.

        You have a desire for speed go to a race day, that's what they are there for, if you're buying a new car because 'wow it can go to 100kmph in x' you're buying a car for the wrong reasons.

    • FLICKIT on 06/09/2021 - 19:25
      +7

      Hobart CBD changed to 40km/h recently, I suspect most cities with lots of pedestrians will go the same way in the coming years, liability and all that, people dont seem to be able to take responsibility for their own safety these days…

      https://www.hobartcity.com.au/Projects/Hobart-CBD-speed-limi…

      • jjjaar on 06/09/2021 - 19:57

        people dont seem to be able to take responsibility for their own safety these days

        Wow that’s just blatant victim blaming right there, you should be ashamed of that.

        I was hit by a car at a signalised pedestrian crossing because the driver of a car did not stop (and then drove off).

        But sure, it was my fault for not taking responsibility for my own safety by going to the pedestrian crossing (out of my way) and waiting for it to turn green before I went.

        • FLICKIT on 06/09/2021 - 20:06
          +12

          Wow that’s just blatant victim blaming right there,

          I didn't say EVERY accident is due to the pedestrian…

          You dont notice the number of people walking around, taking zero care, crossing roads and such, while staring at their phones?

          • dizzle on 06/09/2021 - 20:53
            +12

            @FLICKIT: About the same that I see drivers playing with their phones. The fact is that at slower speeds, an accident is more survivable no matter who is at fault.

            • FLICKIT on 06/09/2021 - 21:09
              +4

              @dizzle: Very true…

              My point was more that city councils and such are likely to decrease the speed limits to decrease liability on them, Australia is very much a nanny-state kinda country…
              https://rarlomagazine.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/wont…

              • xylarr on 07/09/2021 - 08:58
                +4

                @FLICKIT: Why is it a council's liability. I don't think I have ever heard of a council being roped into a case about a car hitting a pedestrian.
                I think it is more likely that the council just wants a safer city, nothing to do with liability. Isn't safety a good thing?

          • Harold Halfprice on 07/09/2021 - 17:24
            +1

            @FLICKIT: Last year I was at an intersection and saw someone cross a main road whilst on their phone and very nearly got hit by a car. He crossed a single lane, and 1 or 2 steps more and he would have been hit. The guy quickly turned back around, but the irony is that when the green man came on and everyone else cross, he didn't cross - I think he was too shaken up and embarrassed.

            First and only time I've ever seen that happen. Couldn't believe it.

        • kyle on 07/09/2021 - 04:21
          +5

          If those drivers did not stop, you'd also expect some to also not respect the speed limit.

          I see so many pedestrians who just cross the road slowly without constantly checking if there are cars around. Sometimes I do wonder why they don't get hit.

        • Caped Baldy on 07/09/2021 - 11:43

          I was hit by a car at a signalised pedestrian crossing because the driver of a car did not stop (and then drove off).

          Did you look when crossing?

          I've forced a habit to always look both ways when crossing even when I have the right of way as a pedestrian and driving.

          • jjjaar on 07/09/2021 - 16:18
            +4

            @Caped Baldy: Of course I looked. I watched them as they came out of a side street speeding around the corner.

            They were clearly too excited to see that there was a gap in the traffic to pay attention to the fact that there was a red light on the road they were turning into.

            But I looked so hey, it’s all fine. I looked so much that I watched them turn the corner and I ran to get to the side of the road, but they still hit me, because they didn’t look.

            But hey, thanks for further victim blaming and putting the onus back on me. At least I looked and got to watch the whole thing happen though? Great for the PTSD to have the memory burnt into my brain.

            FWIW this is why I work in road safety. Even if the victim does everything right, they’re often unable to have done anything else to prevent crashes.

    • Ozpit on 07/09/2021 - 09:03
      +9

      A speed limit of 30kph came into force on most streets in Paris last week (30 August).

      https://www.ecowatch.com/paris-speed-limit-2654840707.html

      • tanksinatra on 07/09/2021 - 11:16
        +1

        Rather than limiting speed to 30kph, they would be better off just banning cars in Paris. I wouldn't want my bus travelling at 30kph… what a waste of time!

        • [Deactivated] on 07/09/2021 - 14:28

          I cant even set my camry's cruise control at 30. It wont let me under 40.
          Ridiculously slow.
          The people who disagree are probably from sydney, where you see tonnes of people on the roads. Where I live the streets are pretty quiet, putting 30 on us would be ridiculous.

          • [Deactivated] on 07/09/2021 - 15:48
            +7

            @[Deactivated]: Of course a Camry driver would think that cruise control is something you use on city streets.

    • Serapis on 07/09/2021 - 18:25
      -1

      Yep, I remember London and surrounds were ~ 20mph. I made the mistake of renting a car there (partner wanted to drive to Windsor Castle) as the streets were narrow af, car was manual (which I can drive but unfamiliar with the rental car), speed was in miles and there were roundabouts with a ridiculous amount of exits + traffic lights in between (e.g clockhouse roundabout, just south of the Heathrow terminal where I was supposed to return the damned car).

      I remember highways been being 70mph as well so not that much different there.

    • Hansi on 08/09/2021 - 07:04
      +1

      Amsterdam will have a speed limit of 30km/h on most of its roads from 2023.

    • alUK234 on 08/09/2021 - 21:17

      The issue is that despite rigorous rules here and excessive enforcement, accident rates are still much higher than the UK. You would think as it was smaller and more sense, that there would be more accidents pre head of population but it is the opposite..

      https://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/ongoing/international_…

    • kabammi on 09/09/2021 - 08:05

      France is 130km/hr in a lot of areas. I've driven some of them up near Paris. Which is fun in a left hand drive vehicle.

      • [Deactivated] on 10/09/2021 - 12:12

        It's not really fun. It's just a steering wheel on the other side. 130kmh on a freeway feels exactly the same as 100kmh.

  • fantombloo on 06/09/2021 - 19:16
    +22

    We are behind but because we have some of the most entitled drivers I have seen anywhere it's probably for the better.

    Another place I have noticed lazy drivers is in the states but there they don't act as entitled, probably because they might get their head shot off sooner or later if they are. Also they quickly lose the entitlement when they hear a siren.

    • netjock on 06/09/2021 - 21:16
      +2

      You know in Australia driving fast is considered a demonstration of skill. Driving fast and wrapping your car around a light pole when you lose control (due to lack of experience) is just bad luck.

    • kyle on 07/09/2021 - 04:21
      -1

      Could say the same for entitled pedestrians.

  • mickyb80 on 06/09/2021 - 19:23
    +24

    We are behind the times, not only on allowing for greater/higher speed limits on highways/freeways etc, but skills too.
    Far too many people in AU don't carry basic skills or knowledge of how to control a car in the event of an emergency, or change in conditions.

    • FLICKIT on 06/09/2021 - 19:31
      +18

      A lot of our roads outside of cities are pretty damn shocking, and with the number of road-trains, backpackers in shitboxes, and nomads towing caravans, higher speed limits just aren't practical around most of the country IMO…

      • mickyb80 on 06/09/2021 - 19:45
        +10

        Sure, I don't dispute that where accurate. However, let's take some of our highways - e.g. Hume from Sydney to Melbourne or Sydney to Canberra Hume/Federal.

        Once outside of the city outskirts like 15km or so… Why can the limits not be raised to 130 or 140km/h (if not 150?)

        Where approaching and exiting the boundary of a town/city again, then 15km back to 100km or the likes.

        Sure, there is the trucks and the likes to contend with and look at how to contend. However, consider modern cars, radar cruise control etc then why not?

        Again, ok, not all cars have this, or 5 or fewer years old. But why not consider adjusting certain speeds based on a set of updated guidelines.

        Similar to motorways, speed limits can be remotely adjusted based on traffic flow and weather conditions etc.

        I see a lot of variables, but I think it's time we look to update the rules and guidelines.

        (I have no issue with the local, high foot traffic speeds dropping to sub 60km/h, providing there is discretion where a few km/h over. So many variables contribute to a small number variation (a large percentage). Tyre pressure, wear, road gradient etc…

        • macfudd on 06/09/2021 - 20:36
          +2

          To be honest, I would like a faster limit but overall I think I'd rather just have one speed limit once I get on the freeway so I can set my cruise control and be done with it. Not be worried that I might have missed a dynamic sign and the limit has gone up or down again.

          • mickyb80 on 07/09/2021 - 00:37
            +1

            @macfudd: We can already essentially go from Sydney (outer) to Melbourne (outer) without the need to adjust one's cruise. That includes the internal relief route through Albury/Wodonga. All towns are not bypassed.

            In such case, to my earlier point, flick the cruise to on - 150km/h or whatever and your set.
            Have the speed creep up out of Sydney, and likewise as you hit just outside of Melb. Once off the freeway and onto the motorway, then back to normal - 100/variable.

            If in the event of weather conditions or any other need to reduce (same as a motorway), then reduce accordingly.

            Simple!

            Does anyone know of any reports or whitepapers that can show evidence of cars 10yrs or younger that have crashed on a 'highway' (not motorway) and injury or death has been found to result from speeds between 110-150km/h?

            I suspect where one could reduce the 880km drive from Sydney to Melb by around 2 hrs would actually save lives. It's likely to encourage people to take a break, rather than just a fuel stop. I know I've done the straight run without stopping a few times. Long drive! (I miss my Diesel)…

            • Euphemistic on 07/09/2021 - 05:43

              @mickyb80:

              Does anyone know of any reports or whitepapers that can show evidence of cars 10yrs or younger that have crashed on a 'highway' (not motorway) and injury or death has been found to result from speeds between 110-150km/h?

              You’d probably have to look for stuff from Germany or other places wheee the speed limit is that high.

              Aussie accident records are probably skewed because the investigation often hinges on physical evidence. Speed and DUI is relatively easy to determine, fatigue or distraction are not easy to determine from physical evidence.

              Besides, it’s not outright speed that links in most circumstances, but a combination of factors exacerbated by speed. Ie too fast round a corner because the driver didn’t slow. Couldn’t stop in time when another car pulled out etc.

        • Antikythera on 07/09/2021 - 11:44
          +4

          Why can the limits not be raised to 130 or 140km/h

          because the roads are not designed for those speeds. the engineering of roads takes the speed limits into consideration. the length of turning lanes, lane separation, the camber of corners, the design of emergency lanes, intersection distance from curves and crests etc. see for yourself the quality of a 110km road vs many 100km roads.

          road design also take into consideration all vehicle types not just the latest supercar. traffic is more dangerous if some vehicles cannot travel at close to the speed limit. I believe you can be fined for travelling too slow on the highways. nanna in her 3 cylinder buzzbox would become a hazard if other traffic is traveling at 150km. in germany i'm guessing there is enough alternate routes because of population density that nanna never needs to use the autobahn to get from A to B. try getting from sale to bairnsdale using alternate routes.

          • mickyb80 on 07/09/2021 - 13:17

            @Antikythera: Agree - however, to my earlier point regarding newer cars. I see no issues with a 150km/h limit on any new (sub 10-5yr) cars that would be unable to maintain such speeds on an open highway.

            In any such circumstances, then those areas could carry a reduced speed limit for that section - similar to my point around the reduction around towns etc.

            There are many ways we could look to increase, even slowly over a 5+yr period or the likes. But the idea and my point is to open this up as a serious conversation and consideration for the relevant governing bodies etc.

            • Antikythera on 07/09/2021 - 15:43

              @mickyb80: you could put nanna in a McLaren and she still isn't going to travel at the speeds you are talking. and if she is travelling at 100kmh and other drivers are 50% faster she is a hazard. come over a crest or around a corner and she is in your lane you're both dead.

              you'd need to rebuild much of the countries highway roads with a focus on resurfacing and improving sight lines as well as redesigning off ramps and intersections before you could raise the limits to 110kmh let alone 150kmh.

              • mickyb80 on 07/09/2021 - 16:03

                @Antikythera: I think you might want to reread up a little further.
                I've also talked about tech such as radar guidance.
                As for nanna sitting on 100 v a car come from behind at 150, there isn't any difference on a "highway" as it currently stands with a truck or any other slow driver travelling in the left hand lane, sub 100kmh.

                I travelled from Sydney to Melbourne at one stage every week via the Hume. This was a problem regardless. It exists and is already a problem.
                If you don't like 150 that's fine, my comment still stands in my mind. The rules and speed could also be gradually changed.

                IMO if there was to be rebuilding, it should be around widening, 3, 4, or the likes lanes…

                The point you also raise goes to my earlier comment around driver skills and training as well.

                Let's not get caught up on the speed value of 150km/h. But, I'll say, you might want to do some googling on the reaction times, distance, and revelant values when it comes to stopping/slowing down. Again, this is subjective of tyres, pressures, type of brakes etc and so on.

    • neme on 07/09/2021 - 15:59
      +1

      Coming from Norway, it surprised me how little is expected of someone to get their driver's license here. Getting my license in Norway in 2003 was way easier than it is today, but it was still much more involved than e.g. NSW. More info here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driving_licence_in_Norway

      Based on this it looks like Australia has more than twice the road toll of Norway.

      Obviously these are two very different countries in terms of geography and other factors, but I would be surprised if the lack of training wasn't a factor.

      • mickyb80 on 07/09/2021 - 16:06
        +1

        👏👏👏
        100% - my point earlier.
        Here is a real life example, from neme to suggest ones such problem.

  • Bafranz on 06/09/2021 - 19:23
    +4

    Lol try 30kph zones

    https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.abc.net.au/article/10015…

    • [Deactivated] on 06/09/2021 - 19:43
      -8

      30 is so slow. When I set my cruise control to 50, the car is doing it so easy, 30 I might fall asleep.
      I wouldnt mind as much if the car would drive itself.

      • morse on 06/09/2021 - 19:48
        +16

        I think the point is to have a safe speed to break in time in built up areas to avoid hitting children, cyclists, dogs etc. If you’re at risk of falling asleep at the wheel you shouldn’t be driving.

        • OzJD on 08/09/2021 - 01:39
          +1

          At 30km/h you're too busy watching your speedo rather than the road ahead.

          • morse on 08/09/2021 - 02:20
            +2

            @OzJD: 30km/hr is slow, 40km/hr is probably fine for most heavily built but areas, but falling asleep or watching the speedo says more about the driver than the speed limit.

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