Found Breville Dual Boiler machine for 899$, cheapest price online. Worth the price over Breville Barista Express.
I also can confirm managed to get it for 855$ in store.
I have attached the invoice it might help to price match with stores:
Breville The Dual Boiler Espresso Machine $899 C&C /+ Delivery ($855 in-Store Negotiated) @ Good Guys
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peaks2006 on 06/06/2021 - 12:27 thegoodguys.com.au (2490 clicks)
Last edited 07/06/2021 - 22:51 by 2 other users
Last edited 07/06/2021 - 22:51 by 2 other users
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I too am curious
It would be better,
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/627783
The guys in this tread know more.
@sovereign01 on 03/06/2021 - 14:04new
+16 votes
The Dual Boiler uses proper commercial grade temperature control, pre-infusion, has an over pressure valve and has individual boilers for extraction and milk frothing - It's a much better unit than the "Pro" imho.Choice rates express to be better than dual boiler on taste test that is probably due to 53mm portafilter to be forgiving, for frothing both should be good unless you are making more than 1 cups in a go. If you making milk based drinks using the shots, then I dont think it matters much.
Best much better. Also uses full size basket/group head.
Barista Express Pro is just the same machine as the express with the digital interface. That alone is not worth $200-250 extra.
The dual boiler is a completely diff machine. Dual boiler for extraction and steaming at the same time. Timer for scheduled on/off, 58mm portafilter, easy water top up, etc.
Have a look here:
https://youtu.be/zvKWvkDUmVUDual Boiler is a class above, you won't go backwards after a dual boiler. The next step up is a big jump!
Had 3 express and there was/is a part in there which failed in all 3, i had the extended warranty so I didn't care as much,but upgraded to the dual boiler probbaly close to 5 years ago.
You do need to service them though, I recently had a leak in the steam circuit as one of the o rings was leaking.Yes, I had the exact same problem and had it fixed for about $150, back to new now after 5 years.
@JTTheMan: Yea beeing extended warranty in my case they replaced quite a bit. I guess that's how they make money 🤷🏻♂️
Any suggestions on servicing places?
Cheaper via the eBay site too
better warranty from store i think. cheaper is cheaper though
Exactly the same warranty.
@kulprit: Yep. Exactly the same manufacturers guarantee (2 years) and exactly the same statutory warranty under Australian Consumer Law for 'major failures'.
Hiw does this compare to the Breville Oracle? I know the Oracle is more expensive, is it worth the extra money? Any one with experience to share? Is a dual boiler machine worth it, or is something like Breville Touch sufficient?
I want to be able to make a good coffee from home, Cafe quality, I am working remote and this will replace my daily drive to grab a coffee from the local Cafe or McCafe.
Can't say about the Oracle. I have the Bambino Plus.
On the topic of dual boiler - Since I am not a pro, I can't stretch the milk and pull a shot together. So, dual boiler isn't much of use at my skill level. Maybe the dual boiler serves another purpose, but the single one is working just fine for me. And is even less than half this price.Since I am not a pro, I can't stretch the milk and pull a shot together.
It isn't difficult at all, but without a dual boiler, how could you know?
I start the milk, steam wand in, and set the jug down. Grind the shot into the filter, <12s, fit the portafilter, put the cup under and press 1 shot, while that is happening, pick up the jug and finish the milk. The shot stops on it's own and you pick up the cup and pour the milk. Done.
100% get a dual boiler if you want to get the coffee made quickly.
Thanks, I'm gonna give this a go… I always get my timing wrong! I've had one of these dual boilers for over 5 years and it's still kicking along.. I'd highly recommend it! Mine gets around 2 coffees per day when I'm home.. I guess there's a lot more usage since Covid.. .but it's been a good machine!
Oracle is more expensive, is it worth the extra money?
There are two Breville Oracle models, one is the standard one and the other is the fancy one with the LCD screen.
Both of oracles are semi-automatic machines compared to the bes 920 which is fully manual.
My experience with semi-automatic machines that you ultimately trade convenience with the end quality of what's in the cup. So if you're happy learn how brew coffee , I'd go for the bes920 which also have a full commercial group handle (58mm) v the Oracle (54mm).
I also don't like the idea of having a grinder above a coffee machine. It's a very expensive repair if the grinder brakes compared to the standalone Breville smart grinder which could easily be swapped out for $200 if it fails.
All that said, I don't think you could go wrong with either. Even with the worst operator at the helm the Breville dual boiler machine, it will produce better coffee than McDonald's ever will.
I have the Oracle, and I’m very sure it’s a 58mm portafilter - it’s identical to the one from the BES920.
I always get my milk/coffee temps right, with the PID accurate to 1 degree with the oracle (and the auto milk is great). The main downsides for me are:
* Grinder is only okay
* Auto tamp means machine doesn’t come with a puck
* Mostly automatic - wish I had got the machine with recipes/touch, so I knew approximately how to grind different beans without writing them downThe BES920 is probably the best value - I’d get a Virtuoso+, and save the money.
It is a 58mm i've had both they are interchangeable
@maverickjohn: Which do you have now?
Edit: ok I can see you have the Oracle now.
Was your bes920 still working at 8 years, or did it reach the point that it was no longer economical to repair ?
@ash2000: Still working buddy. Gave it to my in laws. I never repaired it or serviced it professionally. I looked after it myself. Did the descaling and cleaning all on my own.
@maverickjohn: Did you ever replace the O rings ? And do you know what the 'cup count' was after 8 years ?
My 5yo machine has done 4500 cups, but has required many repairs over this time.
New pump, new opv, new solenoid , new triac pcb. (I've replaced these myself).
@ash2000: Ooof not sure how you got your cup count but I was doing a minimum of two a day when friends or family were over we easily hit 10 cups a day.. and in all fairness never replaced anything apart from the filters. That machine was a charm
@maverickjohn: You've been very lucky!
There is a digital counter in most breville machines that is an un-erasable record of how many shots the machine extracted.
On the bes920 it can be viewed by holding the one and two shot buttons for 4 seconds then pressing the power button.
Then press menu once.
Mine reads 453, which represents 4530 cups.
The Oracle is probably the same.
Ok, thanks for that. I'd always thought it was smaller.
- Auto tamp means machine doesn’t come with a puck
A puck of what?
@spaceflight: When properly tamped the used coffee grounds should come out as a solid lump known as a puck when knocked out of the portafilter.
@yodhe: I've nearly always had a problem with the BES920 to get a puck with the single shot filter…. can't seem to get that right…. the double shot is always a nice puck.. any suggestions or tips?
@maddoglee: If you can't get a puck with the single shot, then recheck your dosing and grind amount for the basket you are using. I use 17g in the 58mm single cup basket, it pucks just fine.
@maddoglee: I think the answer is that you pretty much have to use the double shot filter.
If you look at any cafe, they are always configured for double shots. If it's slow, and they can't make two cups, they will dump the 2nd shot.
@AlexD Breville grinders are too coarse from the factory. You need to adjust the grind size at the conical burr itself. You'll see the red dot and numbers imprinted on the top burr. I had to adjust it finer by 2 steps. Now the grinder works great, whereas before it was like drip coffee.
I’ve got the analogue oracle. Paid $1500 with the deal on ozbargain. Best machine I’ve used to date. Auto tamp, dual boiler and milk frother are super easy.
I’ve actually Purchased take away cups as I prefer to make it and take away than buy coffee from a cafe.
Haven't thought of a reusable cup?
For me? Sure. For others. No. I entertain clients a lot on site.
if you don't mind, can you let me know where you buy your take away cups?
@bemybubble: thank you so much, one more question, its out of stock now but do you remember roughly how much did you pay for 50cups?
@akumi: For $1.50 you can get one that you can use again and again
https://www.kmart.com.au/product/430ml-light-blue-reusable-t…
@spaceflight: Thanks, i used the kmart one, it's the missus that wants disposable!!! Please teach me how to change their mind lol.
I’ve actually Purchased take away cups as I prefer to make it and take away than buy coffee from a cafe.
Why don't you use a Keep Cup, Frank Green or other reusable cup?
Refer to my answer above
@bemybubble: Which one of your 4 other posts do you believe answers the question of why don't you use a Keep Cup, Frank Green or other reusable cup?
I’ve got the analogue oracle. Paid $1500 with the deal on ozbargain. Best machine I’ve used to date. Auto tamp, dual boiler and milk frother are super easy.
I’ve actually Purchased take away cups as I prefer to make it and take away than buy coffee from a cafeOr
For me? Sure. For others. No. I entertain clients a lot on site.
Or
Not at all
From amazon
https://www.amazon.com.au/dp/B08CNLTRJNOr
$15.95
@spaceflight: I can see your a bit of a planet crusader which is great. But you should never impute your life choices on other people.
But if it puts your mind at ease like I said, I entertain clients and use disposable for them. If it makes you feel extra warm and fuzzy I also compost as opposed to contributing to landfill
I can see your a bit of a planet crusader which is great.
Wow you dug up a sarcastic comment I made from 2018, well done!!
My pet dolphin loved eating them and I still see the others washing up on the cost after I dumped a boatload in the ocean.But you should never impute your life choices on other people.
I don't care what you do and I'm not pushing anything on you.
But for $1.50 you can buy a reusable cup versus 32 cents for a disposable one.
It doesn't take many uses to save money. This is ozbargain.I don't care what you do and I'm not pushing anything on you.
But for $1.50 you can buy a reusable cup versus 32 cents for a disposable one.
You just contradicted yourself in 2 paragraphs. You’re assuming I was in the market for a reusable cup. Sure that would be a good bargain. But I wanted disposable.
This is ozbargain and not ozopinion
You just contradicted yourself in 2 paragraphs
No I didn't.
I don't care what you do.
That doesn't change the fact that "for $1.50 you can buy a reusable cup versus 32 cents for a disposable one"
Did I tell you to use one? No I didn't.You’re assuming I was in the market for a reusable cup.
No I didn't
I asked "Why don't you use a Keep Cup, Frank Green or other reusable cup?"
I never told you to use one, I asked a question.
Sure that would be a good bargain. But I wanted disposable.
You have a reason why, congratulations.
This is ozbargain and not ozopinion
Nice story. I never gave you my opinion though.
Officeworks
To be honest, you dont need a expensive machine to make coffee on par with a cafe or McCafe. The Barista Express, Bambino or Infuser would do a good job too.
The machine is only one part of the puzzle. Out of importance, I'd rate the freshness / type of coffee beans first, followed by a grinder and then the machine.Thanks for the inputs all, appreciate it. Being as impatient as I am I should probably go for a machine with DB, and get a separate grinder, rather than one built in.
I had my bes920 for 8 years before "upgrading" to Oracle.
Dual boiler is completely manual which is better in my opinion to the oracle's semi automatic design.
Dual boiler requires more bench space as a grinder is needed separately. In a house with multiple appliances any bench space matters. So the Oracle wins there.
In terms of functions between the two. I loved having control of my grind and content setting which the manual grinder had. With the Oracle you can only control the grind setting not the content. The auto tamper is perfect and more consistent than my manual tamper but ultimately you have to work with the content it pours into the group head.
The frother is much harder to get a creamy latte texture in comparison to the bes920 the circumference that steam projects is a lot wider in the Oracle making it more annoying to get a good texture in manual mode. Surprisingly auto mode is the best auto frother I have experienced though. Much better than the likes of those delonghi all in one.In summary if you want your barista hat and don't mind the space it takes. You can't beat the bes920. If you want convenience with an auto brew that's pretty damn good but not quite as barista focussed you won't go wrong with the Oracle.
The BES870 Barista Express will meet your needs at a more friendly budget, but this machine punches well above its price range.
Go this one if you plan to make more than 1-2 drinks per use, or if you never want to upgrade.
I think you pretty much summarised it perfectly!
The Oracle is essentially a Dual Boiler, but with an integrated grinder (which tamps at the same time) and the auto temperature milk steamer. If you want some added convenience, go for the Oracle. Shame it is so expensive now, I bought my Oracle (non-touchscreen) from David Jones about 7 years ago for $1400.
That's a decent price, they're about $2,000 and up now, might hold out for a sale.
For all the comments/questions about Dual boiler vs entry-level coffee machines. One of the main points that highlight in pro-reviews is that DB got an industry standard grouphead. The portafilter is 58mm compared to other models that come with 54mm portafilter. The smaller portafilters are deeper. For better coffee you need wider and shallower portafilter. At least that's what the Pros say.
Simple comparison: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zvKWvkDUmVU
Sounds like it requires both a lot more experience/skill in getting the grind and tamp right and a really good grinder.
Not really. You just adjust the grind so that you get about 7-10 seconds of infusion before the coffee starts to flow, and then adjust the weight of the grind in the basket so that you get your shot volume in about 25 (one-cup basket) or 40 (two-cup basket) seconds. Then it is fire and forget. People think you have to tamp really hard, get it level etc, but today, there are tools which tamp to the right level and right density each time and every time for very cheap. Like this one: https://www.amazon.com.au/Distributor-MATOW-Portafilter-Adju…
I remember my normal manual tamp costing more than $50, but now I don't even use it due to the Oracle doing its own auto tamping.
The good thing about the dual boiler is you quickly gain the experience required and it's not only easy but a lot more satisfying!
And yes, a good grinder makes all the difference, I use the Breville Smart Grinder Pro, get it on sale.
I have both machines. The Barista Express 2 cup single wall basket still struggles to fill with 17g of coffee. The Oracle/Dual Boiler's 58mm basket easily fills 22-24g of coffee and can still be tamped and not press against the shower screen. I'd go for 58mm basket and not anything smaller. If only Sunbeam fixed up their leaking issues. Their machines are 58mm and could be a market changer for people wanting to dip their toes into making their own espresso at home.
Thought it was just me. I'm putting in 18g and the coffee level basket is still quite low considering the leveling tool still shows the coffee grind level to be about about 2mm under the tool. I'm thinking 20g may be better alright.
From my understanding, Larger basket allows you to grind finer because the surface in contact with the water is larger. In result, the coffee is better.
Prefer to get a basic espresso machine for $200 and spend the savings on coffee beans. After all, the beans make a bigger difference than the machine.
You need a decent grinder to make good coffee. It is not recommended to use the Breville Smart Grinder Pro with Dual Boiler.
Why is it not recommended as a combo?
I’m in the market for a new grinder and was waiting for the smart grinder pro to dip below $200.I have read and watched a few pro-reviews on Dual Boiler. Every single review says to go with a higher grade (Prosumer-level) grinder. Apparently grinder makes a huge difference in the coffee.
Check this review for starters: https://youtu.be/zvKWvkDUmVU?t=370
@dealspider: Not required, unless you really want to. Good grinders grind your coffee consistently with a uniform particle size. All that effort will be wasted if you are the type to grind, and then leave your grind in your portafilter for a few minutes while you finish up other things preparing breakfast (the volatiles are all lost from the grind into the air). Even leaving the portafilter connected to the coffee machine for a certain duration can heat up the grind and undo the good work of your $500-800 grinder.
My advice is just use what you can afford. The Smart Grinder Pro is fine, it is simple and entry level, good enough for all the normal beans you all will be using in your machine. When you start buying $50 per kg single origin unwashed beans etc, then consider a really good grinder.
And for those who do buy the SGP, make sure you manually adjust the conical burr. You have settings through the main dial, but there are a whole range of additional settings which bring the grind to whole finer level through burr adjustment. Just adjust it 2 steps finer in the burr, then all your dial settings will end up finer too. Otherwise, the finest setting will still not be fine enough for a proper single-wall basket espresso machine.
SGP is fine for most people. Problem is that it clumps alot and there's alot of retention.
A good flat burr grinder is a better way to go about it. But it will increase the cost alot
@PCHammond: Flat burr grinders retain some grind, probably more than a conical burr grinder though. In the end, we all clean our grinders of unused grinds at the end of each day anyway.
@Sleepycat3: I get 0.2 grams of grind retention on a standard 19g 2 shot grind with the SGP - nothing to lose sleep over. Yes there is clumping and some inconsistency in granularity but again nothing to ruin an espresso pour on a consumer grade machine like the Breville Dual Boiler.
In any case a set of cheap properly calibrated coffee scales to measure the volume of both the grind and the pour overcomes this problem and is what you should be doing anyway if you want to improve your consistency in espresso making.
@FitzChivalry Farseer: @Farseer Agreed, the SGP is good, it served me very well prior to getting my Oracle. Now I use it for my single origin natural beans, whereas the Oracle's hopped holds the daily drinking bean blend for my family.
The fun part is setting up for each batch of coffee that arrives, although I think my wife is over my habit of sticking post-it notes everywhere with timings and shot weight/volume.
@Sleepycat3: Like I said, most people.
It's still a decent grinder, but it has its shortcomings. For me, the main one was clumping, which required me using a WDT and distributor in order to get consistent shots.
I outgrew my SGP. Ended up with a Eureka Specialita, which is flat burr and holds less retention than my SGP. Much fluffier grinds and much better ability to fine tune. No need to use a WDT or distributor anymore. I find im getting much better flavour with flat burr too. Of course this also came with a $750 price tag.
I'd start with SGP and go from there. If you find you have outgrown the SGP, they have decent resale. But the SGP is really the bottom level of the decent grinders. If you find you are happy with the SGP, then stick with it and be happy with what you have. Similarly, I have friends with La Marzoccos and they appreciate the differences. I stick with a BDB.
@PCHammond: Great post thanks. I’ve been using the SGP with my DeLonghi Dedica. Just sold the Dedica and picked up a VGC Dual Boiler for $500. I find I waste a lot of coffee dialling in my grind so have started weighing the beans and running the SGP empty. My wife just shakes her head. 🤷🏼♂️
Can’t get the single Filter right yet but double is good with 22g producing 60g Espresso. So a little less than 1:3 ratio.
Been using the smart grinder for 5+ years with the dual boiler , works great.
What? Since when?
Utter Rubbish.
The Breville Smart Grinder Pro is a perfectly capable grinder able to that is able to grind to the level of fine granularity required for espresso. Furthermore, it is adjustable to even greater levels of fine-ness with a simple movement of a bracket on the the burr.
Sure it lacks the step level consistency of, say, the sette 270 or other quality grinders $500+, but it is perfectly capable and well matched to the Dual Boiler at its price point for the home user who makes a few coffees a day.
Yes, you are correct.
I didn't know about this extra adjustment! Where is this bracket and are there instructions online?
I tend to go close to the finest digital setting at a 4 or 3 and didn't think I'd need to go finer?
At a 2 or 1 the extraction pressure goes too high and there is less output?
@JTTheMan: It's in the instruction book that came with your BCS but this video explains it pretty well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNvOcE4-VEo
Note that versions of the BGS prior to around 2017 didn't have this feature but Breville send out a shim kit free of charge for owners of that earlier version so that they can make their own fine adjustments.
Oh, and a word of warning. Once you unclip that wire bracket make sure you have a good hold of the burr assembly as you make your adjustment as there is now nothing holding the burr and its hard plastic seating mechanism together. I dropped the plastic component on my tiled kitchen floor and a part of it broke off - luckily it has not affected the way the part works.
@FitzChivalry Farseer: This was a bad idea!
I’ve moved the grinder to too fine and can’t extract coffee!
I should’ve known as my setting at a 4 was perfect on the factory setting. Hopefully I can change it back?
@JTTheMan: I don't really worry about extraction pressure, but look at the time it takes before the first drop comes out of the portafilter. I aim for 10 seconds, but will be happy with 8 seconds. Not any longer though. I use grind fineness to adjust this time to initial extraction.
Output, I want my full extraction done within about 25-30 seconds for the 1-cup basket and 40 seconds with the 2-cup basket. I adjust grind weight to control total extraction time.
So in your case, if you are getting the first drop in about 10 seconds, but not getting enough output, then put 0.5g less coffee in your basket to begin with. Keep reducing until you get the extraction volume you desire. If the time to initial extraction becomes too short by this point, then you can adjust the grind to be finer.
@Sleepycat3: I was getting perfect output at 9 bar pressure, I just set the total extraction time to 30sec and it tastes good. I have made the mistake of adjusting the factory burr setting and now I’ve ruined it!
Just a tip for all yo ozbargainers, I managed to get 10% off on top of this by calling their online order line. Nicely asked them to apply their door buster/showroom special. I got one picked up yesterday for $958.00 including 5 year concierge membership ($149).
The 5 year warranty is easily worth the $150. These machines are great but lots of them fail within that time. Corrosion, seals, temp sensor, leaks, etc
I've just bought another to replace my last one but this time opted for the extended warranty.
Edit: also recommend filling them with filtered water. It seems to help with longevity.
Cleaning them helps. But seals etc need replacing, that's normal and not actually a fault or failure.
I heard using filtered water isn't recommended.
Filtered water IS recommended, ideally one that can filter scale if you live in a hard water area..
Note that the Breville Dual Boiler has a replaceable filter system in its water tank as well and it is absolutely essential that you replace that filter at the recommended intervals to maintain the quality of your coffee and, most importantly the health of your machine.
Following the clean and scale process is also essential - DO NOT IGNORE THE 'CLEAN ME' or 'DESCALE' PROMPTS.
The steam boiler is the one that can presents scale issues over time due to the fact that it is never fully emptied during the normal clean and maintenance process. While it is possible to undertake maintenance on this yourself (plenty of youtube vids on how to to this) it is a bit fiddly and time consuming and I think getting a professional descale and refit of the o-rings once you taste a deterioration in the flow or quality of the steam process makes good sense.
@FitzChivalry Farseer: Yep, I ran into the steam boiler problem after 5 years, I looked at the DIY youtube videos and decided to pay a professional to fix it. Well worth it.
@FitzChivalry Farseer: ahhh ok I'm in Melb so we don't have such hard water.
Always do a clean when it says "clean me"
I just replaced the filter as well.
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For practicality and quality of coffee it can made how is this compared with the Breville Express Pro?