Qantas Introducing No Jab - No Fly Policy

SlavOz on 24/11/2020 - 19:17
Last edited 24/11/2020 - 19:51 by 1 other user

Is there a legal precedent to this? How is a major airline allowed to take it upon themselves to mandate medical decisions on behalf of the public?

By comparison, would it be acceptable for insurance companies, telcos, or energy providers to deny their products/services to a large part of the country based on similar criteria?

Eg - anyone who's ever had an abortion is not eligible for this power plan. Too bad for you, guessing you'll have to learn to start a fire or freeze to death.

This is truly absurd.

Qantas will ban travellers who don't have the COVID vaccine — can other businesses follow suit?

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Comments

  • SF3 on 24/11/2020 - 23:02
    +10

    Sounds a lot like anti-vaxxer arguments, by self joining the dots and creating correlation to suit confirmation bias.

  • Meho2026 on 25/11/2020 - 02:34
    +5

    Qantas don’t give a shit about keeping the population safe from COVID19.

    Priority number one is profit. It will cost them money to implement a system that verifies vaccinations. The only way they would invest in that is to increase profits or market share.

    Most likely market share, it could make them a more appealing airline to fly as passengers. Obviously most Australians have concerns about being injected with a potential poison from a vaccine process that has been sanctioned to bypass normal safety protocols. However a lot will take it if they get something out of it. Plus there’s some cultures that will be lining up and begging for it.

    A plane load of vaccinated passengers can allow Qantas to negotiate priority departure and arrival processes for everyone, which will appeal to its target market of patriotic elitists.

    • modiika on 25/11/2020 - 14:26

      I mean organisations are run by people, its likely some do care. I agree ideas are rarely implemented unless they have an upside for the company, even if its just a PR one.

      They may also want to simply avoid being associated with an out break. Associating plane travel and safety can only be a plus from a branding perspective.

      SO while i think they probably do care, there are many reasons they may want a policy like this.

    • pharkurnell on 25/11/2020 - 17:02
      -1

      Well waddaya know.. a business thats priority number one is profit.

      You learn something every day here.

    • Vote for Pedro on 25/11/2020 - 23:19

      Most Australians trust vaccines

    • bmerigan on 26/11/2020 - 22:56

      I love being called elite.

  • Yonaton on 25/11/2020 - 07:35
    +2

    I think most people will be fine with this given the rollout of vaccines next year. Or alternatively Qantas could always require passenger to provide negative COVID test result before flying for those who don’t want to be vaccinated. Given flying for most people is a choice rather than necessity I don’t see why a private can’t enforce rules to ensure customers are not exposed to certain risks.

    • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 07:37

      A huge part of the population has family or works overseas. Flying is not a luxury to them any more than you can say electricity and hot water is a luxury for everyone else.

      • modiika on 25/11/2020 - 14:30
        +2

        if you work overseas then stay there. Travelling around the world all the time, is pretty much a luxury. Plenty of people are separated from family, all the time for all sorts of reasons, family is not some crazy override.

        As with any restriction, the question is not so much is a right being restricted, its is it reasonable in the circumstances. By not vaccinating you are putting others at risk. There maybe valid or invalid reasons why a person chooses not to vaccinate, but that doesnt mean them not vaccinating doesnt carry a risk for others. This would seem a reasonable precaution. One that countries, as much as airlines are likely to adopt, even if not all do universally.

        I mean even just economically, does any country have an appetite for more lockdowns and more outbreaks?

        Also its unlikely this would be a permanent lifetime policy. It'll probably be a 1-2 year policy, while most of the populations are vaccinated, and huge outbreaks are unlikely (at least in first world countries).

  • shaybisc on 25/11/2020 - 07:50
    +2

    "This is truly absurd."

    It's truly absurd to think any other course of action is possible or desirable.

    Maybe they could organise anti-vax flights if there is sufficient demand? No that wouldn't work. They would have to find anti-vax cabin crews and even then probably would not be admitted to the destination country.

  • orangetrain on 25/11/2020 - 07:57
    +2

    This country is turning into a nanny state, I rather go to USA where free market is the best way to deal with pandemics. Too bad, they now got a commie president that will slow down the freedom.

    /S

    • stephenharrington on 25/11/2020 - 08:18
      +6

      Missing you already … make sure to renounce your Aussie citizenship and cut up your Medicare card on the way out. Good luck! :-)

      /S

  • buderim11 on 25/11/2020 - 08:01
    +1

    Will Qantas make it their policy that all pilots and cabin crew are vaccinated as well ?

    • whooah1979 on 25/11/2020 - 08:12

      All that time people spent is churches, temples, mosques and synagogue will come in handy.
      https://theconversation.com/can-the-government-or-my-employe…

      A religious body, however, may be able to argue a federal compulsory vaccination policy interferes with the freedom of religion protections under the Australian constitution, but that is a complex legal question.

      One religious group did successfully claim an exemption to mandatory childhood immunisations — the Christian Scientists. This “conscientious objection” exemption was removed in 2016, but it does provide an example of how such an exemption could be dealt with under the law.

    • modiika on 25/11/2020 - 14:31

      I think this is an international policy, so perhaps they could move them to domestic routes?

    • Spic3y on 25/11/2020 - 15:14

      No doubt, I've had jobs myself that have had mandatory vaccination requirements and I'm far, far from an international airline pilot.

  • [Deactivated] on 25/11/2020 - 08:26
    +2

    If you don't want to abide by a private companies decisions, you are free to take your money elsewhere.
    Do you really want to be stuck in a 300 people metal recirculated air fart tube with potential covidiots around?
    Currently they require you to wear a mask when travelling, but is that against your asthma rights?

  • [Deactivated] on 25/11/2020 - 08:41

    The irony is too strong.

    On one hand, you willingly overlook a person's right to live but you're mad about someone's "rights" to a warm house.

  • whooah1979 on 25/11/2020 - 08:55

    Will Qantas also ban domestic travel?

    • MrHyde on 25/11/2020 - 09:09

      From what I've read this thought bubble specifically mentioned international travel and not for domestic travel. Again, the way I read it, this was Alan Joyce making public his views on what he thought was going to be required for international travel to start again.

      • Foreign countries may mandate vaccination before entry (like Yellow Fever)
      • They may be mandated to have a -ve test in the 24 hrs prior to travel

      IATA has already developed an app to enable passengers to provide their test and vaccination status that can be accessed by airlines and are promoting it as a way to get international flying started again.

      • whooah1979 on 25/11/2020 - 09:23

        I don't understand why Qantas would think that unvaccinated customers would be safer on domestic flights versus departing international flights. It's like they're saying "we don't want your overseas business, but are more than happy take your money from Melbourne to Sydney."

        • shaybisc on 25/11/2020 - 10:26
          +2

          Isn't Joyce thinking primarily of the hordes of the infected overseas and not wanting them here? Domestic travel isn't much of a risk because there isn't any virus.

  • ozbjunkie on 25/11/2020 - 09:06
    +1

    I don't care. I don't even like travel.

    I feel sorry for anyone not able to take the vaccine (immunocompromised or other).

    I'm also curious whether vaccine will prove safe in time. Happy enough at home. Saving money like a boss.

  • Ashbargin on 25/11/2020 - 09:21

    The NRL had a no jab no play requirement. Although there we are fee exemptions for those with medical issues that prevented it.

  • OzHunterNSW on 25/11/2020 - 12:10

    Well…. this is where it is heading. And get ready for an annual jab. This is why minion Morrison is spending a billion dollars creating a vaccine facility. It will pay for it self in no time bc all citizens will be required to take the annual jab

  • HeWhoKnows on 25/11/2020 - 12:19
    +1

    Dear OP

    Welcome to the new COVID19 world

    Expect this to spread across the world
    Hotels, pubs, clubs, trains, buses, plains, sports, gyms, clubs
    Anywhere there is a crowd.

    This is forced but not compulsory innoculation.
    Taking the Jab wont be compulsory but the consequences will make it feel that way.

    You need worry more about whats REALLY in the vaccine and how it will affect you

  • afah0447 on 25/11/2020 - 12:26

    It is a bit of worry for society when the CEO of company thinks he this powerful enough to standup and start making policy decisions that are the reserve of elected officials. Joyce does not control the Australian borders…the Commonwealth Government does. This does not bode well.

  • Duckie2hh on 25/11/2020 - 13:19
    +2

    I hope you (OP) never step on the same plane as me. No one is infringing your freedom and rights. You are within your right to not get vaccinated. I just hope you can swim far, if you want to travel internationally (because Qantas and most airlines will not take you).

    Wow you really want to compare abortion to vaccination?

    I support your decision not to get vaccinated… natural selection will take good care of you.

    • wheretobuychocettes on 25/11/2020 - 13:24
      +3

      Came here to say something just like this. Ran out of daily downvotes for the utter nonsense comments the OP could muster up. Great fun, to be fair.

      Even being in the same vicinity as OP would get under my skin. My advice is go back to your QAnon forums and stop trying to entice outrage from the reasonable people in the world (generally speaking, anything that isn't a QAnon forum). 'cause we've all figured out that a vaccine is the best possible way to put COVID-19 behind us, rather than letting it drag on.

  • zombrex on 25/11/2020 - 13:22

    Going to be introducing how they spin this considering it discriminates against many peoples religion and spirituality especially Aboriginal and Islander people.

  • boomramada on 25/11/2020 - 13:34

    If you have issue flying with Qantas, try Qatar, they have no jab yes punani policy:)

  • dufflover on 25/11/2020 - 13:35
    +3

    LOL this either a troll post or the previous "only in America" style attitude beyond belief.

    btw I'm in no rush to get this rushed vaccine either but I support the rule, whether it was brought in Qantas or as a Government decision. If it means postponing international travel then I fully understand the why. That's if I can even afford to for starters … so much for your "freedom" argument then?

    • Spic3y on 25/11/2020 - 15:17
      +3

      It's just a Facebook user leaking into other forums..

  • wallet72 on 25/11/2020 - 13:43
    +4

    Simple solution: you either show proof of vaccination or have a mandatory two week quarantine in a hotel (at your expense) before flying.

    I won't be taking the vaccine (chemo and all the fun that goes with it) but I fully support actions like this that will help minimize the impact of pandemics. People seem to think their 'poor me' attitude about being 'forced' to take a vaccine somehow outweighs the attempts to reduce the number of deaths and illness the pandemic causes.

  • [Deactivated] on 25/11/2020 - 13:57

    (while out side of the scope of qantus, vaxinating one's self for the flue, or what evers still common sense even before the virus)

    Now in regards to qantus,

    I recall asking a customs officer on arrival why qantus is the only airlines with their own cattle quarantine for its passengers, isn't it your job to body check me, and scan my carry on bag, why does qantus?
    He said: "I don't know you can email them why, different department"

    Because if you were flying on a different airlines then suddenly arrive you'll pass by qantus's (cattle bag checking, scanning, and two security doors that requires the hired staff member to open the doors as you stand there waiting with only two options, walk up the stairs to buy more stuff, then walk down the stairs and wait for the security guard to open the doors.) security, while they make the experience painful on arrival, they make it easy on departure.

  • glassyan on 25/11/2020 - 14:10
    +3

    Seems like you are looking at the wrong angle: Regardless of what Qantas does, it's very unlikely you will be allowed into a foreign country without the covid-19 vaccination, so unless you have multiple passports, you would be forced to get vaccinated anyway if you want to travel anywhere outside Australia.

  • Hunter14 on 25/11/2020 - 14:36
    +5

    What a bizarre comparison.

    I have nothing against anti-vaxxers. Your body your choice. However, when your demand puts others at risk, then you are selfish and entitled. If you don’t want to be vaccinated, don’t travel. Simple.

    The ones shouting human rights is ironically putting other human life at risk for the sake of 'freedom of choice'.

    I 100% support Qantas in this decision.

    • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 16:20

      You're putting human lives at risk every time you drive, smoke, swing a bat, or contribute to the production of fast food.

      You're worried about a virus with a 97.3% survival rate.

      Relax dude, you're not a hero for getting vaccinated.

      • Vote for Pedro on 25/11/2020 - 17:40
        +1

        BuT mA FrE3dOmZ!!!!!!!!?!???

        You have no automatic right to service from anyone so long as they don’t discriminate in a way that is against the law.

        Also, parler is a thing. Might want to try it out. Like minded people you might enjoy talking to

      • Dr Ginger on 25/11/2020 - 18:06
        +9

        In terms of raw numbers COVID has a similar death count (907) to car accidents. But that is with the restrictions and lock downs we have put in place.

        A "97.3% survival rate" is a 2.7% fatality rate.
        Australia's population is 25.6 million so if we allow uncontrolled exponential growth of the virus so 90% of the population is infected then ~620,000 people would die based on your numbers.

        Car accidents kill ~1,200 people per year, with no risk of exponential spread.
        Lung cancer kills ~9,000 people per year, with no risk of exponential spread.
        Cancer kills ~50,000 people per year, with no risk of exponential spread.

        Do you see a difference in the risk here?

        • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 18:48

          But that is with the restrictions and lock downs we have put in place.

          We have very heavy restrictions in place on driving too. Age limits, licensing, speed limits engine capacity etc.

          Cancer kills ~50,000 people per year, with no risk of exponential spread.

          You're not really comparing like for like. Everyone had COVID at once, so of course the death toll is gonna be high. More serious diseases develop over a long time so the amount of patients in a year is always fairly low.

          If 90% of our population got heart disease or lung cancer at once, we'd be at upwards of 15 million deaths. Our very existence as a nation would probably be under a threat.

          And don't forget that COVID would likely go away on its own over time as immunity develops.

          620,000 people is a lot, so why not just tell everyone who is at risk to isolate or live under these new dystopian rules? Why should 95% of of the population be locked down just to minimise risk to the minority?

          The majority of people who need to travel or work are at an age where COVID passes like a bad flu.

          • Dr Ginger on 25/11/2020 - 20:15
            +3

            @SlavOz:

            We have very heavy restrictions in place on driving too. Age limits, licensing, speed limits engine capacity etc.

            Yes, and this helps to limit damage.

            You're not really comparing like for like.

            I was using cancer as an example as I assumed that was what you were referring to with smoking.

            If 90% of our population got heart disease or lung cancer at once, we'd be at upwards of 15 million deaths

            But there is no mechanism or evidence this is possible so it isn’t worth discussing.

            620,000 people is a lot, so why not just tell everyone who is at risk to isolate or live under these new dystopian rules? Why should 95% of of the population be locked down just to minimise risk to the minority?

            No man is an island. Even when isolating it can be hard to eliminate risks if the virus is spreading unchecked through the population especially with non symptomatic carriers.

            Everyone is at risk. 25% of deaths are aged under 60.

            I also asked if you see a difference in risk. Do you think there is a difference between the risk of COVID-19 and that of driving?

            • SlavOz on 26/11/2020 - 00:43
              +2

              @Dr Ginger:

              Even when isolating it can be hard to eliminate risks if the virus is spreading unchecked through the population especially with non symptomatic carriers.

              So get vaccinated. Problem solved, you can't catch it.

              But of course that's not enough…the vax crowd wants everyone else to get jabbed as well to make sure their choices are validated.

              I also asked if you see a difference in risk. Do you think there is a difference between the risk of COVID-19 and that of driving?

              Of course there's a difference. For most of the population, you're at a far greater risk of dying from a car accident than COVID. In fact you'd have to drive for almost 8,000 miles to have the same risk as dying from COVID if you're under 30

              • jv on 26/11/2020 - 00:45
                +2

                @SlavOz:

                So get vaccinated. Problem solved, you can't catch it.

                Yes you can. No vaccine is 100% effective.

                • SlavOz on 26/11/2020 - 00:49
                  +1

                  @jv:

                  No vaccine is 100% effective

                  So why force it onto the whole population?

                  BTW nothing is 100% effective. Any control or measure you put in place will only reduce certain risks, not eliminate them completely.

                  • jv on 26/11/2020 - 00:50
                    +1

                    @SlavOz:

                    So why force it onto the whole population?

                    Nobody is forcing the whole population.

                    It is a choice you have if you want to travel overseas…

                  • Dr Ginger on 26/11/2020 - 11:19
                    +1

                    @SlavOz: Seat belts aren't 100% effective.
                    Yet we force them onto the whole population with fines and penalties for not using them, exactly for the reason you describe of reducing risks.
                    Is this okay? Do you think we should allow people to drive/ride without seat belts?

                    Would you support me in choosing to not wear a seat belt?
                    Would you support the removal of fines for me not wearing a seat belt?

                    Would you be okay if ride sharing services and taxis tell me I can't ride with them without a seat belt?
                    Would you condemn Uber for this stance the same way you are with Qantas and a COVID-19 vaccine?

              • jv on 26/11/2020 - 00:49
                +2

                @SlavOz:

                you're at a far greater risk of dying from a car accident than COVID.

                NOT if you are a close contact of someone that has it… Then there is a real chance you could die. 907/28,000 chance of dying (3.2%)…

                Unlike being a close contact of someone who died in a car accident, then you still have a 1,100/25,000,000 change of dying in a car accident (0.004%)…

        • oO0Dam0Oo on 26/11/2020 - 11:03

          As the saying goes "you cant fix stupid but your can sedate it".

      • gramoras on 26/11/2020 - 00:18
        +4

        A better hero than any anti vaxxer. They hide behind the herd immunity provided by people who do get vaccinated.

        I suppose it's the natural downside of living in a free, clean society where the old diseases such as pertussis, typhoid and small pox were driven out by public vaccination programs. So easy to forget why you are safe and start assuming it's entirely because of your decisions.

        • SlavOz on 26/11/2020 - 00:47
          +1

          A better hero than any anti vaxxer. They hide behind the herd immunity provided by people who do get vaccinated.

          lol nobody is hiding. Do you honestly think we're shallow enough to live in fear of a flu consuming us?

          Get jabbed 17 times or 0 times for all I care. I'll still treat you like a normal human being and even talk to you if I find you interesting.

          I know…such a racist

  • apple2016 on 25/11/2020 - 14:53
    +3

    Why not? Qantas certainly needs to ensure its employees have a safe working environment and one of the options is to enforce a "No Jab - No Fly Policy".

  • Alx75 on 25/11/2020 - 15:17
    +3

    Anyone thinking "it's a private company, they can do whatever they want", think again. Millions given by the government as a "rescue package" in 2020 and billions over the last 30 years. Government money? Last time I checked government doesn't "earn" money, it collects taxes and takes foreign loans that get repaid by taxpayers. If they were 100% private and operating on their own money I would be the first to say that they can do whatever they want.

    • whooah1979 on 25/11/2020 - 15:38
      +3

      I forgot that.

      Qantas got a $715m bailout and in return sacked 20000 workers. Whose interest are Qantas looking after because it sure isn’t their workers?
      https://www.crikey.com.au/2020/03/23/qantas-government-bail-…

      The latest act of irrationality came when Prime Minister Scott Morrison, who has long called for the end of the “handout generation”, handed $715 million to Qantas, the national air carrier. The only problem is that it’s not actually our national airline. Less than 48 hours after receiving news that a bailout was coming, Qantas stood down two thirds of its workforce — just over 20,000 workers.

      • Spic3y on 25/11/2020 - 15:54

        We all know who they are looking out for. Like any publicly listed company, their shareholders!

        • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 16:22

          BUT anY vaCcInE iS gUd f0r mE cuz the TV said so.

          • Spic3y on 25/11/2020 - 16:30
            +1

            @SlavOz: Why would I listen to my TV?

            Currently my computer is telling me vaccines cause autism but I sure-as-shit don't believe that…

          • Ughhh on 25/11/2020 - 20:18
            +3

            @SlavOz: It's amusing how you believe that your "research" is 100% accurate, yet everyone else research is false must cOme FroM tHe Tv CaUse tHats My oNlY aRGumEnt.

  • saltypete on 25/11/2020 - 16:09
    +2

    Well here's another revelation OP, if an airline doesn't have that policy I won't fly with them, and I am in the majority.
    I'm not getting into a metal tube with a bunch of other dirty humans that haven't had their shots. Don't really care if you like it or not. Don't really care if you never fly anywhere….
    Put it in your memoirs in case anyone cares.
    I am a bit over individual rights. This is a pandemic, people are dying, businesses are going under.

    • whooah1979 on 25/11/2020 - 16:20
      +3

      I'm not getting into a metal tube

      Are you talking about public transport?

    • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 16:26
      -2

      I am a bit over individual rights

      It's nice to know that we don't even have to hide our bigotry anymore.

      people are dying

      OMG no way…I thought people lived forever.

      In that case stop everything, can't have anyone die on us now. This would truly be a terrible time in history if that happened.

      businesses are going under.

      Most likely because of people like you who support draconian lockdowns and operating procedures in some faux hope that the government can shield you from confronting your own mortality.

      Perhaps if more of us respected individual rights (admittedly not you), we would've respected the rights of businesses to operate instead of hiding from a virus that is apparently so deadly we need to be tested just to know we caught it.

      • saltypete on 25/11/2020 - 22:14

        If you think taking 3 part statements out of context and mounting a rebuttal is anything close to reasonable or fair, perhaps take Logic 101. You embarrass yourself.
        You have no argument based in anything other than a selfish attitude, and you try to give this the old ‘personal freedom’ spin. I come from a strong background where personal freedoms have been fought for in ways that matter, and I have a strong sense of the need to balance these hard won personal freedoms with responsibility to the broader community.
        You have an absolute right to your view, but it is selfish and illogical in the context that we are living through at the moment, and I think you are wrong.
        And yes, I’ve sort of had a gut full of the personal rights brigade at the moment, although I do understand that you are a vocal minority and nearly all Australians are operating on good sense.

    • ddrex on 25/11/2020 - 18:48
      +4

      This is the selfishness and divide the media brainwashing achieved.
      How would you know if a person "is dirty" if he wasn't sick and nobody told you they didn't have their shot?!?

      You obviously think whatever the tv tells you. You are the perfect citizen. Good on ya.

  • MrMoo on 25/11/2020 - 16:29
    +4

    You sound like an anti vaccer.

    • Hunter14 on 25/11/2020 - 18:54
      +3

      Anti vaxxers are like vegans.

      I have no problem with them if it that's what they believe in. More power to them.

      However, when their actions start negatively effecting other people then hell yes I have a problem with it.

      • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 18:58
        -2

        You're literally suggesting that unvaccinated people should live like second class citizens but you have the ego to accuse others of affecting your life?

        Ouch.

  • morse on 25/11/2020 - 16:43
    -1

    Wow! Last time I checked abortion wasn't contagious.

    Even if your example was something contagious, signing up for a power plan is generally over the phone or online, so no risk of spreading disease and harming others.

    Being higher risk of having COVID (which in case you haven't heard is contagious) by way of not being vaccinated and being in a confined space on a plane, presents a risk of harming others.

    By all means don't get vaccinated, or wait until you're happy that it's safe - but you'll have to weigh that up relative to the restrictions it might present to your freedom, given the risk of harm to others will be considered by companies like Qantas.

    • burns13 on 25/11/2020 - 21:42
      -2

      They want to exert their imaginary right to make me sick with deadly infectious diseases. Not to mention play their part in destroying the global economy …

  • pharkurnell on 25/11/2020 - 16:50
    +1

    Fly with another airline.

    Is this really an issue anyway?

    The fishing is insanely good in this place.

  • CalmLemons on 25/11/2020 - 16:52

    Here for the anti-vaxxer posts.

  • Emerald Owl on 25/11/2020 - 17:01

    They better not say that since there is a vaccine they can open the border!

  • [Deactivated] on 25/11/2020 - 17:06
    +3

    Ah, welcome to the modern world where you're either solving world hunger and issuing in a new era of peace, or literally Hitler personally murdering all of the Jews.

    Remember when we had people in the middle who might question the efficacy of spending millions on a COVIDSafe app that didn't work, nor ever would, but be willing to use the Apple or Google products (that the government won't allow).

    Remember when we had people in the middle who might question the privacy and data security issues around any man and his dog collecting your personal information and selling it to whoever, but be willing to be involved in truly anonymous collection and legally binding regulations around its control (no, I don't use Facebook)?

    Remember when we had people willing to wear a mask in a public place, but then felt it was all sort of disingenuous because the regulations didn't specify that the mask had to have any actual safety standard requirement, and the people price gouging during a pandemic weren't punished?

    Nope, these days everyone is a Trump supporter or an Antifa member, both having punch ups in the street in the middle of a pandemic.

    Almost this entire forum post is reinforcing my belief that COVID isn't dealing with enough people.

    • gramoras on 26/11/2020 - 00:21
      +2

      It's got to the point where you have to be for or against. Try to be in the centre and you are chewed up by both sides.

  • KBZ on 25/11/2020 - 17:07
    -2

    SlaveOz lover of whataboutism and strawman arguments.

  • Deals For Days on 25/11/2020 - 17:28
    +8

    Great job Qantas! Common sense business to protect travellers and customers.

    Vacinnation relies on a high percentage of the population having them. If not enough people have them they don't work (this is why they don't need to be 100% effective to work on a large scale).

    Qantas is protecting customers from infection with policy like this - and good on them.

    I would be surprise if the Aus government themselves don't mandate vaccine for international travellers in and out of the country.

    • ddrex on 25/11/2020 - 18:23
      -2

      Please explain how my vaccine will not work if you dont get yours??

      • SydStrand on 26/11/2020 - 22:34

        Please explain how my vaccine will not work if you dont get yours??

        In population health, vaccines are most effective once a certain percentage of a population is protected, i.e. once the herd immunity threshold (HIT) is reached, you effectively eliminate all routes of transmission within that community. This is how you can achieve eradiation, even without 100% vaccination rate. This is important because it protects vulnerable people who cannot be vaccinated due to other co-morbidites. It also means that anti-vaxxers can live in a polio-free world and shit on vaccines.

        • ddrex on 27/11/2020 - 09:42
          -1

          So if you are vulnerable or have other comorbidities, the effects of vaccination may cause further damage to your health or body, or kill you in extreme cases, but if you are healthy, that same vaccine with the same designed effects, is good for you. Makes sense…

          You guys should learn about a viral load and infectivity. By all means, look it up but in essence it means that if your viral load (number or quantity of virus/viral particles in your body) is not high enough for you to have any symptoms, you cannot infect another person by a short, casual contact, because the amount of viral particles you exhale in your breath or have on your skin or clothes would be a very small % of the amount that already has no effect on you.

          So, claiming that people without any symptoms are dangerous to anyone else is ludicrous fear mongering.

          Even immuno compromised people will need to spend an active night in bed with an "asymptomatic carrier" for them to have any chance to contract enough virus from them, to make themselves sick.
          It doesn't happen when you say hi from less than 2m distance or shake someone's hand briefly.

          Besides, airlines claimed that they filtered the air passengers breathe, up to about now, and I'd say those filters would have been more efficient than your regular cloth masks. Have they decided they won't filter the air any more???
          It would really suck if that is the case…

          • SydStrand on 27/11/2020 - 13:27
            +2

            @ddrex:

            So if you are vulnerable or have other comorbidities, the effects of vaccination may cause further damage to your health or body, or kill you in extreme cases, but if you are healthy, that same vaccine with the same designed effects, is good for you. Makes sense…

            Are you being sarcastic, or are you sincere and would like an actual explanation? Because I don't mind going through this step-by-step.

            You guys should learn about a viral load and infectivity. By all means, look it up but in essence it means that if your viral load (number or quantity of virus/viral particles in your body) is not high enough for you to have any symptoms, you cannot infect another person by a short, casual contact, because the amount of viral particles you exhale in your breath or have on your skin or clothes would be a very small % of the amount that already has no effect on you.

            Incorrect. And I find it ironic that you're saying 'you guys should learn' because I have a postgraduate degree in epi and virology prior to this outbreak, and I'm quite sure you don't, because otherwise you wouldn't be saying that. Viral load does not directly equate to physical symptoms. Asymptomatic shedding is a thing, and certain viruses, e.g. herpes simplex, base their entire life cycle on becoming infectious before symptomatically recrudescent in an otherwise healthy host. In the animal world, swine are among the worst superspreaders of viral vesicular diseases and flu, despite being quite resistant to them.

            So, claiming that people without any symptoms are dangerous to anyone else is ludicrous fear mongering.

            Exactly how do you think healthy people infect each other? You think old people on ventilators walked down the streets of Melbourne? No, it was unknowingly infectious and healthy people who eventually brought it to aged care facilities. You think anyone at that White House Rose Garden superspreader event was physically ill? This was the White House. Everyone was given on-the-spot testing and they were all negative.

            Besides, airlines claimed that they filtered the air passengers breathe, up to about now, and I'd say those filters would have been more efficient than your regular cloth masks. Have they decided they won't filter the air any more???

            I don't know if you've flown recently, but all flights (even Qantas) still require you to wear a mask while seated.

  • Vote for Pedro on 25/11/2020 - 17:32
    +2

    Meh, it’s their business who they want traveling with them. That’s their choice so long as it complies with anti discrimination laws.

    • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 19:02

      Using laws as a basis for morality is probably the worst mistake humans have ever made.

      Signed, some dude from 1940s Germany.

      • Vote for Pedro on 25/11/2020 - 21:23

        so what you’re saying is that you’d like to be able to force Qantas to run their business the way you want them to run their business?

  • jakka on 25/11/2020 - 17:47
    +3

    Great business sense from Qantas. The majority of Australian's will choose to travel with them if they know they are going to be safe. Qantas' safety record is the reason I have flown with them in the past, even though it has cost more.

  • bigbadboogieman on 25/11/2020 - 17:51

    I ain't traveling anytime soon anyway… So will wait and see how the early inoculations go… I am in no hurry to get this "expedited" vaccine.

  • bigbadboogieman on 25/11/2020 - 17:53

    I also read that Qantas is working inline with an App being developed by IATA which will act like a Covid Passport and will give Covid inoculation status of travelers to all registered airlines.

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-11-23/airline-l…

  • ddrex on 25/11/2020 - 19:07
    +2

    The whole premise of mandatory vaccination certificate and mandatory vaccination for everyone after that, is based on people being cconvinced that you can actually be sick without having any symptoms.
    Most of you guys should learn what a viral load is and how infectious you are if you don't have any symptoms.

    While vaccinations are a good idea in theory, in reality you cannot just assume a person is sick and infectious and poses a threat to anyone, if they have no symptoms whatsoever.

    To force a vaccination on somebody as a condition of service, or any other reason, when that somebody is not sick, is not only unethical, it is a totalitarian breach of human rights against forced medication, and must never be accepted, regardless of what your tv says.

    • SlavOz on 25/11/2020 - 19:17
      -3

      But why should I have to think for myself or confront the reality that I will die one day and the government can't keep me safe forever? That's so unfair!

      How dare you suggest people should take their health into their own hands.

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