Toyota, I Don't Get It

Yorkshire-Man on 08/06/2020 - 21:43
Last edited 09/06/2020 - 18:57

Ok, at the start I'm a migrant & I live in the city so this is why I'm asking. In the UK Toyota is a niche brand, outsold by VW, Kia, Ford and many more, they dont stand out.

But here in Australia Toyota seems to rule & I don't get why. What I see is bland cars, low levels of value for the price point with competition that seems to offer far more in tech / design and price.

Is this a city V's country thing? If you live in the bush I totally get it, bullet proof practical cars with great support from a dealer network. Or is it a perception that these cars last longer / are better quality.

Looked several times but never seen great value or great design… but easily the No 1 in sales.

What am I not getting?

Edit - Thanks everyone for their views, I get it way more now. Good insights, guess my comparison was more against Mazda, Kia, Hyundai & to a lesser degree Ford & Honda. Not the Euros, I get why Toyota is favored above them.

Automotive Toyota

Comments

  • terrys on 09/06/2020 - 08:45
    +5

    " bullet proof practical cars "

    British cars face 5-500 Km runs, temps usually between -5C to 35C [rarely] a few country lanes, cobblestones in a few areas still and the occassional track. Toyotas are prefered for 3000 Km trips, temps between -20C to 45C, Gunbarrel Highway, The StrzeleckiI Track and similar.

    We still have quite a few cars from the 1970s and 80's on the road. There are lovingly restored Beamers, Ovlov's Holdens, Fords and the like, very very few out of the morass that Leyland became, and many toyotas than have been used continuously from that time.

    The results have been in for some time, as I'm reminded as I gingerly try the toffee-lock on my Ford festiva that is really a Mazda but was assembled by Kia and fish around for a gear, any gear, to drive off.

  • brad1-8tsi on 09/06/2020 - 09:16
    +8

    I worked for a Toyota dealership (Rockdale Toyota) in the '80s; my uncle was dealer principle for Stewart Toyota (one of the largest dealerships) and Dad owned an RT104 Corona and a Crown Super Saloon.

    I also did a lot of my apprenticeship on 1970s (FJ54??) Landcruisers and Land Rovers and the difference in engineering logic, build quality, technology and reliability was very much in the Toyota's favour. You can pull a Landcruiser apart with about 5kg of metric spanners and sockets. A Land Rover needed a full 50kg tool kit of both Whitworth and standard imperial tools. The electrics were like chalk and cheese.

    Modern Toyotas do nothing for me and agree they are bland and boring and low tech. I also think the build quality isn't as good as it used to be. There was a noticeable difference in a Japanese built V6 narrow body Camry and an Australian built 4 cylinder Camry. God only knows what Toyota was thinking when they agreed to sell a rebadged Commodore as a Lexan or put the Starfire 4 into the Corona but most have forgotten that.

    Toyota have a great reputation because in the 70s & 80s their imported cars were better built, stronger, more reliable and had better support than their competitors. They've traded and built on that ever since. Well done Toyota.

    Despite not having a desire to own a Toyota I still tell my friends that just want A-B transport to buy a Toyota because at least they are consistent in what they do and won't send you broke once the warranty is finished (Hello VW!).

    • Yorkshire-Man on 09/06/2020 - 09:31

      I made the mistake once of buying a Landrover, at it's first service (1,000kms) it had an oil leak & the service dept chuckled about being part of their 'charm'. I was livid, it's clearly a sign of shocking build quality!

      • ProlapsedHeinous on 10/06/2020 - 18:36

        I hope you got rid of it as soon as the warranty finished.

        • Yorkshire-Man on 10/06/2020 - 19:16

          After 18m of ownership I sold it, the worst car I've ever owned. Nothing would ever make me buy another Landrovers car inc Jags. Shocking build quality.

    • payless69 on 09/06/2020 - 14:40

      The Lexcen named after the designer of the Yacht who won Americas cup. I bought one for the price of a Corolla while keeping another Corolla. After 10,000k the Lexcen felt much older, around 5 breakdowns under warranty and a week out the door handle fell off, locks fell apart let alone suspension, what suspension? But it had bottom end grunt!

    • Miami Mall Alien on 10/06/2020 - 02:01
      +4

      There was a noticeable difference in a Japanese built V6 narrow body Camry and an Australian built 4 cylinder Camry.

      That's hardly a reflection of Toyota's failings and that's precisely why our automotive manufacturing industry is a historical footnote now. Toyota themselves stated that Australian-built vehicles were not suitable for export to most overseas markets due to persistent quality-control issues and lower reliability over time compared to JDM/USDM vehicles and as such, their extremely limited target market made them sell at a loss. The well-known cabin noises/rattling and poor interior trim quality on Australian-made Toyotas was a common complaint.

      Quite amazing actually given that most of the mechanical components in the average Australian-produced Camry or Aurion were imported from Japan, including the engines, but somehow we managed to even fck that up which is a testament to our woefully inefficient and inept manufacturing industry (yet still one of the most expensive in the world).

  • ESEMCE on 09/06/2020 - 09:23

    VW weren't even present in the Australian market through the 80's and early 90's. And since their return, have positioned themselves here as a "luxury" brand.
    This has been assisted by adding Skoda as their "budget" VW option.

    That's probably starting to change a little, but they still have a miniscule dealer network that tends to associate to the Luxury segment.

    The Aussie made component is huge especially when you factor that Toyota made both Camry/Aurion and Corolla here, badge loyalty is strong and these are the only "Aussie made" badges remaining today.
    Then factor that their Aussie made competitors are in serious decline and have been for years.
    Holden is already gone (on the back of pretty much universally terrible Daewoo product rebranded as Holden and sold at a premium),
    Ford is headed to being 4x4/SUV exclusive (and earned themselves a poor reliability and customer service reputation with Powershit)
    and if you think Toyota are Utilitarian, you've clearly never been in a Mitsu!

    Also factor that Hilux earned it's reputation (through a superb "unbreakable" marketing campaign) at the perfect time to both catch the rising tide of SUV's and the culling of Falcon and Magna Wagon. As a result, formerly brand loyal buyers looking for a tow vehicle for their boat or caravan were forced to look elsewhere for a product replacement (few considered Mondeo Wagon, or Outlander as suitable replacement vehicles) and many found themselves in Dual Cab Hilux which was virtually in a class of its own at the time.
    Toyota happened to cover Small, Medium and (through Hilux) Large segments with reliable, quality vehicles, and a good dealer network.

    As per someone else's comment here, Mazda is the unusual standout in the Australian Market.

  • Bid Sniper on 09/06/2020 - 09:27
    +3

    Landcruisers, Australia is the biggest market for these cars in the world. Have have a bullet proof reputation here and rightly so. So its their halo car that set the tone for the brand here, tough, durable and last a very long time.

    Most buyers here just want a car thats reliable, works and are more concerned about safety and reliability.

    Personally I think they're boring and expensive and would prefer a Kia or Subaru.

    • chriskq on 09/06/2020 - 21:25

      Not a fan of Corolla or Camry but i'd get a Landcruiser Sahara if i needed a 4Wd and had the $$ although part of me would still want to risk it and get a Jeep Cherokee Trackhawk </brain_fart_thoughts>

  • Rockets84 on 09/06/2020 - 10:24
    +3

    Toyota's are well known for their reliability & holding their value better than other brands in Australia. I agree that the interiors are spartan on the edge of ugly and very plastic. I'm not a fan. That said for my eldest daughters first car we'd probably get her a Corolla because they are pretty bullet proof. I've driven my mother in laws previous version entry level Camry and I really don't like it, it drives well but I wouldn't want to own it. With Kia & Hyundai really upping their game on exterior visual design & interiors Toyota have had to really pull their finger out and the new Camry & Corolla don't look any where near as ugly and the interiors seem a lot better too.

    I was reading about the co-development of the new Z4 & Supra platform and apparently the BMW engineers were amazed at how much more time & effort the Toyota engineers spent on reliability testing each component of the platform. The Toyota engineers suggested numerous changes to the BMW supplied engine and gearbox on the platform for reliability reasons.

    • Euphemistic on 09/06/2020 - 11:38

      Toyota's are well known for their reliability & holding their value better than other brands in Australia.

      The reason Toyota have better resale value is their reliability.

  • Snake 4 on 09/06/2020 - 10:45

    It comes down to marketing and the gullibility of consumers.

    From a US chart on recalls percentage wise from vehicles sold from 1985 to 2016.

    Toyota came in number 8. Porsche had the lowest number of recalls per vehicles sold. Volkswagen the most.

    The list in order.

    Porsche.
    Mercedes.
    Kia.
    Tesla.
    Mazda.
    GM.
    Subaru.
    Jaguar/Landrover.
    Mitsubishi.
    Ford.
    Volvo,
    BMW.
    Hyundai.
    Honda.
    Chrysler.
    Volkswagen Group.

    • Euphemistic on 09/06/2020 - 11:37
      +3

      You might want to have another look at that list.

      I’ve checked it a few ones and ant see Toyota.

    • Snake 4 on 09/06/2020 - 11:57

      Oops.

      Toyota comes between Subaru and Jaguar/Landrover at number 8.

    • lordezekiel on 09/06/2020 - 14:39
      +6

      What does the number of total recalls have to do with the day to day reliability of a car?
      Nothing.

      • Euphemistic on 09/06/2020 - 18:12
        +2

        It does indicate the level of thoroughness of design. Less recalls means less errors in design.

        But it also shows the willingness of a company to admit a common fault and rectify it.

        Toyota regularly tops reliability surveys.

        • KMeister on 10/06/2020 - 22:10

          Toyota issues voluntaty recalls when other manufacturers wait till the government forces a mandatory recalls.
          Toyota recall bactch size is relatively small(except for Takata) due to kaizen.
          Relaibility mostly comes with quality control, higher margin of error and relatively simple design.

    • brad1-8tsi on 15/06/2020 - 15:19

      When I worked at Toyota we didn't do "recalls" we had "service campaigns" (and this is still the case). We fixed dozens of faults and design issues as part of the service and most customers were none the wiser. Brake lights with faulty wiring, crank bolts that backed out and lunched the engine, heat shields that caught debris and started fires spring to mind.

      Things have to be really grim before Toyota will concede a recall. It's similar to Qantas using every weasel word so as not to have the word "crash" in a report.

  • Snake 4 on 09/06/2020 - 11:13
    -2

    Toyota are as morally bankrupt as the Volkswagen Group.

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-20/toyota-pays-1-3-billi…

    Toyota Motor Credit Corporation Settlement
    Toyota Motor Credit Corporation, while neither admitting nor denying the claims, voluntarily agreed to pay up to $21.9 million to repay eligible buyers.

    https://www.tmccsettlement.com/

  • Battlestar666 on 09/06/2020 - 11:20

    Think what your parents drove has a large impact. My parents drove European, I always end up buying a European even after seriously considering something Japanese. My wife's family drove Holden's and Toyotas, she still has a hankering for a Toyota, though I keep buying her European :-)

  • HeWhoKnows on 09/06/2020 - 11:52
    -2

    OP is ABSOLUTELY CORRECT !

    In Australia Toyota has built a reputation of affordability and reliablity.

    But in reality no more than Mazda, Hyundai, Holden, Ford, Mitsubishi etc

    So yes you pay a PREMIUM for a Toyota for no reason really.

    Any car that has been serviced regularly will deliver the same results for much less money.

    And Toyotas if not serviced regularly will be a very bad choice - for a premium price!

    • Euphemistic on 09/06/2020 - 11:56
      +3

      Toyota has always had a better reliability perception than Holden, Ford and Mitsubishi. Hyundai is gaining ground, butToyota have a longer history, hence the perception.

      Ford and Holden have a reputation of building ‘the big Aussie sedan’. Perfectly suited to outback highways. Comfortable, powerful, just not as reliable but certainly easy to fix - mainly because there were so many of them.

    • Indomietable on 10/06/2020 - 22:12

      Any car that has been serviced regularly will deliver the same results for much less money.

      This is just naive generalisation. Reliability, especially for cars, is done at the design time & in the production line.
      There are so many components that can break - and during a service its just not possible to check all of these component.
      For small example, regular Service will not prevent issues like rear boot locking failure ( looking at you golf! )

      Just read the reddit thread) posted above and it might shed some light.

  • OzHunterNSW on 09/06/2020 - 12:23
    -4

    Precisely…. it is cheap, and bland. The qualities of low maintenance.
    This is why some men choose a cheap and ban woman. Reliable, cheap and low maintenance.

  • greencomet on 09/06/2020 - 12:29
    -8

    All I know is I give most Toyota's a very wide berth on the road, you never know when their drivers are going to try and kill you and others around them.

    • Caped Baldy on 09/06/2020 - 12:32
      +14

      I tend to give luxury euro's a wide berth. Tend to either be a knob or inexperienced overseas driver.

    • lordezekiel on 09/06/2020 - 14:44
      +16

      Incorrect.
      Ute & 4WD drivers are the most danagerous by far.
      They are the vehicle of choice for your below average intelligence bogan aussie dumbass with too much testosterone/alchohol in their system, not enough empathy or care for those around them and a bad case of overconfidence.

      Often seen wearing a fluro shirt in dash cam compilations crashing into other cars/people/bikes/poles/etc.

      • Miami Mall Alien on 10/06/2020 - 02:12
        +2

        Don't forget tradie vans/utes. Truly the worst of the worst.

        • netjock on 10/06/2020 - 12:58

          Tradies confuse themselves with taxi's and think they drive for a living. Even thought they offensively drive and get to the next job quickly the results often take longer and not what you asked for.

      • OzzyOzbourne on 10/06/2020 - 09:19

        Adding wrap around steel bars and rear bars and driving with the attitude they can ram anything because they won't be damaged…. Their mentality doesn't stretch as far as the consequences of injuring and killing someone or having to pay for damage to the other vehicle… Expectation is they'll lie to get away with it and hope for no evidence.

      • ptl93 on 10/06/2020 - 19:56

        Commodore, HSV and Ford Falcon drivers are the worst IMO. I've seen a lot of them trying to race, tailgate or skip the queue.
        Trucks and utes come 2nd. They don't usually race but they do tailgating with high beam.

    • DonWilson on 09/06/2020 - 18:07
      +1

      You must be incredibly jumpy, they're one out of every six cars on the road.

  • [Deactivated] on 09/06/2020 - 12:31
    +6

    I owned 4 VWs in the past. First one lasted 1 year before requiring new engine (118tsi). Second and third one had major timebomb (GTI & Tiguan TSI timing chain). 4th one was reliable (Golf6 R) and kept it until 8 year old.

    I also had 3 Toyota's and currently have one. First one (Mk2 Rav4) kept for 9 years without any issues. None had / has had any issues.

    But, welcome to OZ where the market / preference is different.

  • Cluster on 09/06/2020 - 12:32
    +5

    It's not just Australia. In many other countries Toyota has a reputation for great quality but not the most exciting vehicles.

    Ford is a dying brand in Australia. Don't buy it. Sales have collapsed. The Falcon died, Focus/Fiesta reputation was ruined by the PowerShift fiasco, the Mustang is great however. VW is a greatly damaged brand from the diesel disaster, DSG, and a general reputation of being a great car to drive but for the love of deity don't keep it past the warranty period.

    KIA and Hyundai have come along in leaps and bounds over the last 10 years. Mazda is a great brand if you want a good looking car that drives great and is well built. Mazda is now the innovator that Honda was in the 1990s. Speaking of Honda, there's another brand that has one foot in the grave in Australia.

    • bender000 on 09/06/2020 - 18:31
      +3

      The mazda premium thou, if the OP thought Toyota had a premium - is a Mazda 6 really worth 15% more than a Camry? Not really (and I say this as a happy ex-Mazda 6 owner)

      Hyundai is probably the smart pick IMO but no arguments with Toyota reliability/resale/maintenance costs

  • nubzy on 09/06/2020 - 12:46

    Not a fan of the direction Mazda is heading in at all. Absolutely hate the new 3. Overpriced and claustrophobic, their old cars also felt more solid to me. The new Focus ST looks great aside from average interior and it too has jumped up in price to 45k, getting a bit much. Love the current line up of Peugeots, outstanding cars for the money with beautiful interiors, this is a brand which is innovating and going places and has a much better offering than VW. Would not go near Korean cars full stop, they are certainly reliable and 7 year warranty is nice, but ergonomics, styling and material choices are wrong wrong wrong.

  • mike001 on 09/06/2020 - 13:09
    +3

    Toyotas reflect our culture - dynamic, exciting, stylish :)

    • payless69 on 09/06/2020 - 14:48

      Maybe in the past but the gloss has come off. Landcruiser had oil burning issue, alternator deep in the vee, 1k + repair going thru water etc.
      Hybrids are well built but do they save you much?

      Surprise in my town Merc's outselling Bimmers 5 to 1!

      The Ford Ranger offers a lot of Truck for the money!

    • Hackney on 10/06/2020 - 10:17

      @Mike001.????

  • Archer12 on 09/06/2020 - 13:28
    +1

    As with most things, it comes down to the masses.

    This forum and others included (WP etc) are usually enthusiast based and they know what they're talking about, generally speaking. For a regular punter, a car is just an appliance and Toyotas seem to capture that market well. These are the equivalent of the person to walk into a Telstra store and saying I need an iPhone and i have $x to spend per month. Couldn't give a shit about specs, OS, etc.

    Toyota have made their sub brands household names, Corolla, Hilux, Camry RAV4, and more so in Aus the Landcruiser variants. When the masses join, then there's added benefits of having a good dealer and parts network. In Aus, as others have mentioned, add up to recently local manufacturing and sporting alliances (AFL).

    As an enthusiast, I probably wouldn't touch one, short of the 86 or a top spec Landcruiser just because they've got their purpose. In the coming years with some very good Kia/Hyundai models especially coming into the market in this price zone, Toyota are going to have to come with with some segment leading products. RAV4 is the only one that comes to mind that is currently close to that, and maybe only because of hybrid tech.

    • Yorkshire-Man on 09/06/2020 - 16:20

      Hmmmm, this is probably spot on.

      The general perception is "Toyota's are good quality and cheap to run" so people just go there and buy one without looking at the alternatives. I agree, an '86 would be all they offer that might turn my eye.

      • Emerald Owl on 09/06/2020 - 17:29
        +2

        It’s not just a perception, it is fact. They are cheaper to run and more reliable.

        The iPhone at Telstra analogy doesn’t stack up. Telstra is the best network but is more expensive. It is the equivalent of a Mercedes.

        I wouldn’t brush it off as the masses being stupid. Some people are car enthusiasts and want to drive the fastest car with the nicest leather. Most people look for value, and that is with Toyota.

        If you want to understand this more, watch Scotty Kilmer on YouTube.

        • Archer12 on 10/06/2020 - 00:08
          +1

          Agree my analogy might not be 100%. But I was going for the 'masses' want something that 'just works' and is proven to work e.g. Telstra, IPhone example.

      • MarsTitan on 10/06/2020 - 00:35

        but 86 is a Subaru..

  • 2BsQzrbgkL on 09/06/2020 - 14:00
    +6

    Cheap a to b cars.

    Agree if I want a car for driving pleasure and a better interior cabin I’d take a euro car, if I want a car I don’t care about and just a economical commuting tool I’d go Toyota. Hate driving my Corolla, would rather have a Golf GTI/R32 but couldn’t justify it due to my low usage + AU premium. When I compared used prices on the VW they where 5-10k AUD more than the equivalent UK price for same age, spec, mileage.

    Also where Audi, BMW and Mercedes are fairly common in the UK and the lower end models purchased for not to much money so are more in the just a normal car bracket, here the prices with tax etc push the basic models into luxury car prices. This also makes the used market ridiculously priced when you look how much 5-10 year old Audi, BMW and Mercedes are asking for out here. Some used prices you think it’s only a couple thousand more to get a brand new 0km out of the show room vs a 5yr old 100,000km+ model who would buy used at that price.

  • mike001 on 09/06/2020 - 14:04
    -7

    It’s interesting some people here keep referring to Toyotas as bullet-proof. I would not even call them finger proof. You can quite easily push in any panel with your thumb. Even a LandCruiser which looks sturdy is just painted tin foil and plastic on wheels.

    • lordezekiel on 09/06/2020 - 14:46
      +9

      What a load of garbage mate.
      (your opinion that is, not toyota)

  • FareEvader on 09/06/2020 - 14:07

    Why is Toyota popular in Australia? I genuinely believe that they make good quality cars. From people I've spoken to in the car community and general community, that's also the general consensus. They've also got strong marketing campaigns and partnerships (e.g. AFL).

    Having owned both Japanese (Honda + Toyota) and European (BMW) cars, my vote is for Japanese cars.

    They're cheaper to buy, operate/maintain, insurance and parts (OEM/after market).

    No frills but they're more reliable and saves me some bucks.

  • 91rs on 09/06/2020 - 14:09

    Diesel Vs Petrol argument is also part of this in a way.
    So many cars in EU are diesels, not petrol. The Corolla for example is only sold in two markets as a diesel, UK isnt one of them.
    VW and Ford offerings (current and of the past 10 or so years) are rubbish if we're honest, VW especially. I don't see them as anything to be excited about.
    Very different regions and countries to compare in such a simple way.

    • netjock on 10/06/2020 - 13:01

      So many cars in EU are diesels

      Because they thought it was cleaner until they figured out VW was fiddling the results.

  • arescarti42 on 09/06/2020 - 15:39
    +10

    Toyota is the number 1 car brand globally by a pretty considerable margin. The fact that they're less popular in UK makes it the outlier, not Australia.

    Most people value overall cost and reliability in a car over pretty much anything else, which is why unreliable and expensive euro cars are less popular

    • Brick Tamland on 11/06/2020 - 09:27

      This is so true. But then you read the car reviews by my magazines and websites like Caradvice that give glowing reviews for Euro's but average reviews for Toyota. These reviewers gush over soft touch interior plastics and complex tech in the Euro's but completely fail to address critical areas like reliability, durability and service costs and cost of parts. All these nice things are great in the honeymoon period of ownership but when it comes down to everyday life you need a car that is reliable and low maintenance.

  • netjock on 09/06/2020 - 15:48
    +1

    But here in Australia Toyota seems to rule & I don't get why

    Family have a Toyota. Personally drive a cheap European car and regretting the servicing costs.

    Due to how much closer we are to Japan / Asia (Thailand where some Toyotas are made) it is cheaper to ship the car and also the parts.

    European cars if it is a low volume car with low volume parts you might have to wait for the part to be ordered with Germany then go through Asia hub (Singapore) before coming to you with a big mark up.

    If in doubt have a look at how much European car parts are in the UK on UK sites.

  • tik tok on 09/06/2020 - 15:53
    +2

    Wheres spackbase when you need him ? Not a single comment

    • superuser on 11/06/2020 - 09:29
      +2

      he's so busy to sell car, maybe?

  • gromit on 09/06/2020 - 16:25

    I think others have covered it pretty well already. Australian roads and conditions are VERY different to the UK, especially in the past (our roads have improved a lot in "most" areas now), this made reliability and repairability king as cars like VW and other european brands were not only unreliable but expensive to repair which made them very much niche. Ford and Holden were also very popular here until more recently.

    Personally I don't much care for the look of most Toyota's and don't buy them but my family come from a farming background and they wouldn't buy anything else. Growing up we had the old traditional corrugated dirt roads which really would rattle just about any car to pieces that hadn't been designed for it.

  • wannagrababargain on 09/06/2020 - 16:29
    +1

    It comes down to history mostly.

    Toyota has a long history in this country. They used to make Toyota's locally. Back in the 90s those locally made cars gained a reputation for reliable, value for money cars. Remember this was back in a time when Japanese cars were offered with a lot of extras in the standard trim (such as power steering and ABS) when the domestic cars like Holden and Ford made you pay extra for things like ABS!

    There were no small cars made domestically by local brands so this was a market prime for the Japanese small cars, as both countries drive on the left there was very little re-design needed to meet Australian design rules. Coupling with the local manufacturing capability this meant no import tarrifs or logistics of bringing in fully complete cars. Even our local domestic brand Holden sold re-badged complete Toyota models like the Holden Nova (rebadged Corolla). Ford Australia also did similar things with Mazda.

    Back in those days the cost of fully importing complete cars a long distance from Europe was astronomical, plus there were strong import tarrifs. This all added up to any European made car (even your average VW) being a premium priced niche product. In comparison, importing cars to the UK from the Europe mainland has always been pretty easy logistically and politically UK has been (until recently) on a path of integration with Europe meaning free trade/low tarrifs.

    Companies like Merc and BMW don't even bother to compete on the low end of the market here, they only bring in their premium products to Australia at premium prices. Even base model BMWs in Australian spec have quite a few features that are priced as optional for European or UK customers (eg You can't get a BMW with cloth seats here).

    The opening up of free trade and imports of the likes of VW golf/polo at the lower end of the market is only a recent phenomenon of the last 8 years or so as VW has simultaneously become more and more of a global brand like Toyota. There is now huge competition in the segment of small/mid family cars in Australia.

    Toyota has no. 1 in overall sales because they do a huge amount of fleet sales (taxi, government, rentals), commercial sales (hilux) and are in the mix there too with the small/mid family cars on the back of that historical reputation.

  • kaleidoscope on 09/06/2020 - 17:12
    +3

    Why?

    Reliable/ lesser maintenance cost. They just keep working until you give up on the vehicle, not when car decides it’s times up!

  • Emerald Owl on 09/06/2020 - 17:16
    +3

    European cars are more expensive to own and especially run here for whatever reasons. Namely, the UK has been in the EU with Germany, resulting in their cars being cheaper there. People are less pretentious with cars in Australia. The focus has always been on functionality rather than looks. Unfortunately new immigrants are the ones pushing wasteful look at me attitudes in Australia, driving their Mercedes, BMWs in disproportionate numbers. Toyota is well ingrained in Australia, used to make cars here, has captured the respect of tradies, sponsors football teams in hardworking areas. For example, Toyota sponsors North Queensland whereas Huawei sponsors Canberra. One focuses on earning the respect of working people, the other on bribing corrupt politicians. The Americans like Toyota as well.

    • netjock on 10/06/2020 - 13:03
      +1

      Unfortunately new immigrants are the ones pushing wasteful look at me attitudes in Australia

      After servicing and repair they will be with the rest of us peasants in no time.

    • Emerald Owl on 09/06/2020 - 17:50

      Do you mainly live around immigrants? Australians love Toyotas but also love label bashing. Maybe the label bashing is justified?

    • plmko on 09/06/2020 - 19:09
      +6

      All the brands you've listed are top brands in the world, and you are somehow surprised they might be Aussie favourites too?

      Like statistically they are top brands because have top products. Even children can name them based on logos alone.

      It's not Aussie bias, it's simply the world leaving you behind.

      • stumo on 09/06/2020 - 21:04
        -6

        Its called prestige pricing.

        They are "Top brands" and can be named by children because they spend a lot of money on advetising/marketing. Not because they are good value for money or the best.

    • tin tin on 09/06/2020 - 22:52
      +3

      I agree there is no point in loving brands just because everyone else does, but all of those you mentioned (except Bose) I've had excellent experiences with the actual product, so maybe they have earned respect the hard way.

    • OzzyOzbourne on 10/06/2020 - 09:23

      People have a lot of borrowed money and free money from the government they need to spend.

  • LFO on 09/06/2020 - 17:53

    I wonder what "Toyota" are we talking about…

    Or is it all Toyotas at once?

  • welfoj on 09/06/2020 - 18:03

    Resale value is way better than Europeans, and there is a huge stigma of unreliability and exorbitant cost to maintain euro cars

  • This Guy on 09/06/2020 - 19:26

    Of the four former local manufacturers, Toyota is the only one not to screw up.

    Ford (gearboxes), Holden (Cruze) and Mitsubishi (380) all have had major reliability controversy's that damaged their image. Ford and Holden never showed up to our SUV market. So Toyota is the only brand that has kept Australian trust.

    As Toyota was a local manufacturer, they have excellent part availability and dealership coverage. Due to their volume, their parts are generally very reasonably priced.

    Mazda earnt it's position with it's Zoom Zoom campaign during the prohibition on speed in advertisements. Mazda's sale process is industry best. And Mazda's design language clicks with their target market.

    Hyundai and KIA have risen by not fing up. If there is a problem, they fix it before anyone outside of Korea hears about it. It also helps that they are generally $5k to $10k cheaper than the competition.

    VW marketed it's self as European. Just after a few years of major reliability issues with MB and BMW. VW passed that image issue and started to pick up steam, then they had their gearbox issue. Now VW are designing parts with a significantly lower design life compared to the Asians and Americans. They keep shooting themselves in their foot in our market.

    Reliability is such an issue here because Australian's often tease people who do something stupid (take the p*** when people f*** up). Wasting money on a lemon is considered stupid.

    • Speckled Jim on 09/06/2020 - 22:34

      Ford and Holden never showed up to our SUV market.

      Sure about that?
      Jackaroo, Explorer, Captiva, Territory, just to name the few I remember. Not many smaller ones if that's what you meant.

      • This Guy on 10/06/2020 - 07:30

        You are right. If I show up at a gun fight with a knife, yes, I technically showed up. But I failed to understand the situation and came woefully prepared.

        • miicah on 10/06/2020 - 12:29

          The Territory was massively popular and was around when Falcons were still a popular choice. Ford pivoted pretty quickly into the small/medium SUV market.

          • This Guy on 10/06/2020 - 22:59

            @miicah: Yes. 10k+ each year for a decade. Jim brought that up in the comment right above mine. And Ford and Holden are both doing well with their SUV sales. Right?

  • pogichinoy on 09/06/2020 - 19:49

    VW is the Toyota of Europe but with worse reliability.

    An ex gf’s Beetle has its dashboard melting, resulting with sticky residue because it wasn’t built for Australian summers.

    You won’t get that problem with Toyota.

  • CalmLemons on 09/06/2020 - 20:23
    +1

    Reliable. Looks ok. Price ok. Reliable for Australia.

    Uber drivers love them. Families love them.

    Corolla, camry and Hilux have a cult following here.

  • whatgift on 09/06/2020 - 20:46

    I thought I was alone in this thinking, but maybe it's because Australians value function and reliability over style. I don't care what my car looks like, as long as it gets from one place to another without costing me a lot of money to keep. My 2001 Corolla worked well for me for 15 years, and when I sold it it still worked without issue and sold for a decent price considering the kms it had on the clock. The only reason I sold it was to upgrade to something newer.

  • Orico on 09/06/2020 - 21:09
    +2

    Because i am poor and Toyotas are cheap and reliable relative to the bling bling cars you find in Eastern Suburbs. My personality is very boring and loner so Toyota fits my image. lol

    Family member has an Audi and the servicing costs are mental. It also has too many buttons. Like (profanity), I just want to go A to B in shit traffic, not press buttons and look at 10 screens telling me how warm my seats are or which suspension setting is on.

    Other family members have expensive Mercedes Benz cars and 10 recalls later (for the hatch and two sedans) and 2 court cases, I think we're done with that stupid company. C63 is just the stupidest car ever made. Like I cannot even begin to go through the problems with the 2016+ models.

    I also get speeding tickets driving European cars so I told my family that my basic Toyota is enough.

  • ribze1 on 09/06/2020 - 21:21

    Long time sponsor of the AFL, the number one sport in the country.

    • Snake 4 on 09/06/2020 - 21:25

      Paid for by the Toyota Tax.

    • Yorkshire-Man on 09/06/2020 - 21:44

      Would you choose their cars because they sponsor this? Genuine question, I'm not a sports fan and always wondered if people buy based on this?

      • ribze1 on 09/06/2020 - 22:12

        Personally no, but there must be some research that shows it works, why else would companies do it?

        P.s Toyota have been the principal sponsor of the AFL since 2003. Current contract is worth $18.5m a year.

      • gromit on 09/06/2020 - 22:30
        +3

        I doubt they are expecting you too consciously buy because of it. But brand recognition at positive events will help jog your subconscious when considering a car.

  • AustriaBargain on 09/06/2020 - 23:41

    People believe Toyotas are common and easy to repair so they buy them, so repair places stock a lot of Toyota parts and mechanics get familiar with Toyotas, which makes people believe Toyotas are common and easy to repair so they buy them. "Just look at taxis, they are all Toyotas because some whiz kid at the taxi companies did the math and they were the best value per km driven". Could be Toyota just have more effective sales people when dealing with taxi companies.

    • Euphemistic on 10/06/2020 - 07:59
      +1

      Wasn’t that long ago that taxis were pretty much all falcons and occasionally hi ace vans for maxi taxis. Then hybrid came along, negating the cost benefit of LPG and now Camry rules the taxi ranks.

    • Hangryuman on 10/06/2020 - 08:28

      'Could be Toyota just have more effective sales people when dealing with taxi companies'

      interesting - so all those customers have been fooled ?

      nice conspiracy theory - but I haven't heard any rumours of price dumping for Spamrys

      the last taxi driver I discussed this with recommended I get one (or a Lexus) so I presumed he was talking dollars from his private pocket not business deals

    • Indomietable on 10/06/2020 - 22:45

      I chatted with few taxi drivers before I bought my Camry Hybrid.
      One guy used to own 8 fords but replaced 5 of them with Camry. He said Toyota gave him no issues at all - No unexpected downtime means no money lost . He will be changing the rest of his fleet to the hybrids. He bought 2-3 years old used camry and he did not get special deals from Toyota Sales. And that's how I bought my Camry Hybrid.

  • Velt on 09/06/2020 - 23:45

    There's not really anything in the current range that excites me which is a pity. They really need to bring the corolla wagon over.

    • OzzyOzbourne on 10/06/2020 - 09:24
      +9

      Wow, so many k's and still no problems

    • Tsuivan on 10/06/2020 - 17:41

      Every car can do 50,000km no problems. Come back at 300,000km and let us know.

      • LeoDMD on 13/06/2020 - 22:21

        Not many would like to hold a car that's done 300k's … :)

  • Seni0r El Cheapo on 10/06/2020 - 00:09
    +3

    Ever noticed, in all terrorist-related videos on news channels and movies, 99.9% of the times you will see them using old beaten up Hilux.

    Why? They are (profanity) reliable. Just like AK47.

    /Borris out.

  • Hangryuman on 10/06/2020 - 08:24

    I used to teach Quality Management

    and read an example of US vs Japanese quality in the 1960s - a US car guy visiting Japan was dumbfounded that a committee meeting of Japanese - including the cleaner sat around for half an hour discussing the radius of curvature for the edge of a small piece of plastic for the dashboard of a car

    he was jeez - in the US one guy would decide that in a minute - no need to discuss

    but - at that time, US cars had a reputation for failure - while Japanese cars never broke - and they sold a million Toyotas - only outsold in the US I think by the Ford F150 - the big truck for men with small - you know …

    • Yorkshire-Man on 10/06/2020 - 08:32

      Yup. I agree this was the case in the 1960s but is a Toyota massively better built than a Mazda today? And worth a premium for a lower spec interior space? Or are people paying still out of perception? What's your take on quality today…

      • Hangryuman on 11/06/2020 - 08:49

        Mazda is Japanese build quality similar to Toyota

        I've been to both factories in Japan - Toyota outside Nagoya, Mazda in Hiroshima - interestingly Mazda was a lot more secretive and didn't let us see the actual production line, so … ? They seemed proudest of their sport model and cherry red paint.

        Toyota fell from top spot as world's most something (valuable car company?) some years ago with brake recalls - I haven't looked since but that was also around the time of the Takata airbag failures - story of wimpy son corrupted by pushy greedy mother or somesuch - https://www.consumerreports.org/car-recalls-defects/takata-a…

        https://www.caradvice.com.au/848422/takata-airbag-recall-200…

        My feelings about driving recent model (rental cars) Toyota and Mazda - Toyota white-good efficient, does the job, no feeling - Mazda more fun to drive, but more road noise which puts me off. And last time I was back seat passenger in a brand new Mazda 3 last year it was bumpy and jerky (that could have been a bad driver - you know - jerking the steering wheel back and forth thoughtlessly unaware of the effect on passengers) - I felt nauseous and decided I didn't want one of those.

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