Contacted by NSW Police about traffic incident which never happened

harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 07:40
Last edited 10/05/2020 - 08:19

At the end of last year my parents got a call from police stating they needed to speak with me regarding a traffic matter. My parents gave me the officers name and contact number and I called her up. She said that someone had reported being involved in a collision with a car that was registered in my name.

I explained that I had not been in any collisions and that no one else had driven my car on the day in question. She told me that regardless they (nsw police) needed to see me in person to take down my driver details. I told her that I wasn't going to give up my driving details when I wasn't involved in any traffic incident because I don't want to get a phony insurance claim against me for an accident I was never in.

Anyway I never heard anything further about it until 2 weeks ago I got a card left on my door from the police. On it was written to email the police officer otherwise I would receive a fine. I emailed him and he arranged a night to come over and "see me" but he never came. When I called the following day he said he was working at another station but that he needed me to come there that day or I'd get a "big fine". I went there and waited for over an hour for him before having to leave without getting to see him.

Anyway since then the original female police officer who I spoke to at the beginning is now calling me again and saying I need to go to any NSW police station immediately and give them my details.

I still don't see how I'm legally required to give over my details unless I was involved in the alleged incident/collision. Is there a law saying that I must comply with this request? The last time I spoke with her she threatened with charging me with something if I don't do what she says.

<EDIT>

I should have mentioned the original officer did give me some details of the “incident” just the date, time and location. It was in a suburb over an hour from where I live and somewhere I have never driven before, let alone on the day in question.

Automotive

Comments

      • burningrage on 10/05/2020 - 09:16
        +3

        Did OP do hit and runs?

        No. So again, with all the resources cops have, what are they good for?

        • whooah1979 on 10/05/2020 - 09:33
          +2

          Did op do a hit and run? I don’t know.

          OP is saying that it’s impossible that the vehicle that is registered to them has been involved in a collision. That doesn’t explain how the LAC have their rego.

          • smpantsonfire on 10/05/2020 - 11:06
            +4

            @whooah1979: I could pull any rego out of thin air and theres a chance it will match someones car.

        • RockyRaccoon on 10/05/2020 - 11:21

          How do we know, maybe we should get the cops to investigate 😀

  • holdenmg on 10/05/2020 - 08:44
    +1

    Not legal advice…

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtVteemLin4

  • oscargamer on 10/05/2020 - 08:59

    It's not up to the op to assess whether they were involved in a collision.

    If the police ask the registered owner who was driving a car at a particular time and date, the owner is required to tell them. If the owner does not, they will be charged with that, regardless of whether a collision actually happened or not.

    Read the link provided by string bean.

    Up to you, OP, whether you comply or not.

    • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 09:18

      I read the link, it has nothing to do with this situation.

      • oscargamer on 10/05/2020 - 09:49
        -3

        I never read the link. Just assumed it linked to something relevant.

        In Vic there are numerous legislated requirements on the owner.

        I had a very quick look at nsw and found this one.

        http://www5.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/rta201318…

        There will be others.

        All you have to do to be charged, is do nothing or be deliberately obstructive. Over to you

  • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 09:10

    Ummm, they have your registration details anyway. If they are cops, cooperate.

    • Scantu on 11/05/2020 - 18:05
      +2

      close eyes
      follow instruction from the man
      good boy

  • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 09:13
    +27

    If they want something from you, get them to submit that in writing. All communications in writing, even setting up appointments.

    If they want something from you, they need to come to you. If they miss their appointed time, it's not your problem. You need to have all this on record.

    • burningrage on 10/05/2020 - 09:17
      +3

      This is precisely the point!

  • Ocker on 10/05/2020 - 09:49

    They already have your rego number and in turn your license details, address, etc - what additional "driver details" could they need?

    • oscargamer on 10/05/2020 - 09:50

      They do not have the driver details, only the owner details.

      • bmerigan on 10/05/2020 - 21:50

        He said he's the only driver

  • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 09:51

    The closest info I can find which relates to this specific situation is from here:

    https://www.armstronglegal.com.au/traffic-law/nsw/car-accide…

    "What Actions Might Constitute Failing To Notify Police Of Car Accident?

    If are involved in an accident and despite someone being injured, you don’t contact the police.

    If you are involved in a crash and your vehicle must be towed away, and you don’t report the matter to the police.

    If you are contacted by a police officer regarding a crash they suspected you were involved in, and you fail to respond to their requests to provide the required particulars.

    What The Police Must Prove:

    You were the driver of a vehicle in an accident; and

    You failed to provide the required particulars to the police.

    Which Court Will Hear Your Matter?

    In general this offence is finalised by way of a traffic infringement notice, a fine of $330 and a loss of 3 demerit points. You will not be required to attend court if given an infringement notice from the NSW Police or the Roads & Maritime Services (RMS).

    However, you have the option to elect for the matter to be heard in the Local Court before a Magistrate if you wish to request the Court’s leniency or do not believe you are guilty."

  • pjetson on 10/05/2020 - 09:51
    +3

    Does the OP have an Android phone? If so, Google may have collected tracking data for their location for the relevant date and time period that could help establish that the OP wasn't at the location of the crash. Check out Google Timeline.

    Also, where was the OP at the time of the crash? Do they have an alibi?

    • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 10:03
      +3

      Not sure why OP needs to divulge their timeline, or any details for that matter. If OP is claiming innocence or non involvement, it should be up to the other party to prove otherwise.

      Reading out a rego is not sufficient. I can get a rego number anywhere.

      • pjetson on 10/05/2020 - 10:10
        +2

        Telling the police that it could not have been you because of a provable alibi seems like a reasonable idea to me.

        According to my TV, witholding such information could harm your defence in some countries!

        • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 11:51
          +8

          witholding such information could harm your defence in some countries!

          The most harmful thing one can do when dealing with the law is to volunteer information.

    • peterpeterpumpkin on 10/05/2020 - 11:07

      I once thought to use Google to prove I was at work a day the contractor claimed was not a work day (to avoid paying Sunday rates). It showed me arriving at work. The only problem is it said I somehow flew from Sydney to Newcastle in 5 minutes before flying back to Sydney for the last leg of my trip and I was at my place of work 10 minutes later.

      • loropy9 on 10/05/2020 - 11:25
        +6

        Clark Kent?

        • peterpeterpumpkin on 10/05/2020 - 11:38
          +2

          oh oh. I mean haha.

          I'd call this "second-world problems" but it seems the English speakers of your planet have already adopted this phrase with a different meaning.

        • xsacha on 10/05/2020 - 21:30
          +7

          Needed to fly to Newcastle for cheap 7-11 fuel.

      • OZBMate8911 on 18/05/2020 - 15:27

        Must have been your helicopter trip to lock in some cheap fuel

    • callum9999 on 10/05/2020 - 22:22

      If any court would accept Google location data as evidence of anything I would not trust any of their decisions… Not only can you make it show anything you want it to, you can also give your phone to anyone.

      It proves absolutely nothing whatsoever.

      • pjetson on 10/05/2020 - 22:28

        It proves absolutely nothing

        I didn't say that it did, merely that it may help.

        • callum9999 on 11/05/2020 - 10:36
          -1

          If it can't prove anything then it couldn't possibly help.

  • holdenmg on 10/05/2020 - 09:59

    Why don't you get a Traffic Lawyer to draw up a Stat Dec that says your vehicle was elsewhere (and state where it was).

    Might resolve things and exclude you from further inquiries.

    • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 10:09
      +6

      Now OP is open to liability of a potentially inaccurate Stat Dec for which they may be charged with perjury. Even if it was unintentional, now OP has to be on the defensive against an accusation with tangible evidence.

      • holdenmg on 10/05/2020 - 10:12
        +1

        Well, that is what a Traffic Lawyer could warn against…

      • pjetson on 10/05/2020 - 10:16

        Most prisoners insist that they are not guilty. Perhaps if they had revealed their alibis, they wouldn't be in gaol?

        • holdenmg on 10/05/2020 - 10:18
          +3

          My alibi is I were on OzB at the time.

    • Hardlyworkin on 10/05/2020 - 11:44
      +1

      Maybe it was El Cuco

  • Teamfight Tactics on 10/05/2020 - 10:26
    +5

    It might be id theft scam

    a free government-funded service which will work with you to develop a specific response plan to your situation and support you through the process.
    https://www.idcare.org/

    if you can show us the letter and removing sensitive content for us to see it.

    • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 11:19

      https://ibb.co/gSbCpDH

      • holdenmg on 10/05/2020 - 11:30
        +14

        How can you be advised by phone on 9 April 2018 for something that happened in December 2019???

        • brendanm on 10/05/2020 - 11:34
          +6

          This all seems very sloppy.

          • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 14:03
            +4

            @brendanm: So… the usual standard then?

        • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 11:37
          +5

          Yes exactly!

          • Pantagonist on 10/05/2020 - 12:47

            @harthagan: You mentioned that you sent an email to the police. Was the email address an official NSW police address (i.e. [email protected])?

            • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 13:29

              @Pantagonist: It was a 5 digit number @police.nsw.gov.au

              • Pantagonist on 10/05/2020 - 13:39
                +8

                @harthagan: Personally I'd email the address again and provide a summary of what has happened since you first emailed.

                e.g. We arranged to meet at X:XX on X/X/XX but unfortunately you were not available on the day. After calling I was informed that you required me to attend X station, however when I arrived you were not available. etc. etc.

                Also point out the discrepancy in the dates provided in the written letter and send a scan of it.

                Request that you would like future arrangements to be made via email from this point forward.

          • Teamfight Tactics on 10/05/2020 - 13:10

            @harthagan: add their contact number see if anything show up

            https://www.reverseaustralia.com/ or https://www.reverseau.com/

        • ssquid on 10/05/2020 - 15:57
          +6

          You've cracked the case. Time police are after OP for an accident they haven't committed yet.

        • McFly on 10/05/2020 - 16:33
          +10

          How can you be advised by phone on 9 April 2018 for something that happened in December 2019???

          I don't see the problem.

      • Dumax on 10/05/2020 - 17:58
        +13

        This letter is just a mess on so many levels…

        • Legislation quoted is wrong they're mixing up the Road Transport (General) Regulation 2013 with the Road Transport Act 2013.
        • Title of s177 is changed.
        • Convinently omits subsection 2 from s177.
        • Typos and strange sentance structure.
        • Dates (years) clearly incorrect.

        Considering the intent of the letter it is very clear that you're dealing with a pretty low-level operator.

        • Vote for Pedro on 10/05/2020 - 20:11
          +3

          And those types are usually the most arrogant know it alls who use the bullying tactic

        • trustnoone on 11/05/2020 - 00:28
          +7

          To be honest with you, even the writing seems odd, why would you say "this matter is under investigation by the police" if you are the police? Why not say this matter is currently under investigation.

          Dates are a big one, you were told by phone a year before about a crash that happened a year later? Also it goes title and then info, wheres dear x? Is it hidden OP (fine if it is), but if they're asking YOU to produce info, then they should say WHO YOU are?

          Also wheres the contact info, its saying you HAVE to do it, but not how, goal 1 for any letter is to have a clear way to do something.

          Lastly this is the first "warning" that you need to "make yourself available"? Normally point 1 is to say "this is a warning as you have NOT made yourself available". You will NEED to make yourself available in the future otherwise yada yada. Typically a warning is given after you not doing something? Which they haven't said at all here? And then at the end they state this is your first written notice? So is it a warning or your first notice?

          Is there a refernce number of some sort on the page somewhere?

          Honestly if OP wern't being told to go into a police station, I would almost believe this was fake, maybe made by someone trying to get your info. Or they think its you and this is their way to get it?

          • Vote for Pedro on 11/05/2020 - 06:16

            @trustnoone: The thing is, you don’t have to make yourself available to the police. You can offer to assist with their enquires but you are not compelled to actually do anything.

            Remember your right not to say anything.

          • harthagan on 11/05/2020 - 11:32
            +1

            @trustnoone: It has my name at the very top (albeit misspelled lol)

            It also has the constable's name and the number of the local police station at the very bottom of the page.

      • Drakesy on 10/05/2020 - 23:27

        Today Tonight/A current Affair would have a field day.
        Maybe actually turn up to a police station and ask (with the info redacted, is this a letter to expect from the police/report it as a scam and see their reaction.

      • Samsungnote10 on 11/05/2020 - 00:33
        +2

        Do police even send postal letters like this?

        • harthagan on 11/05/2020 - 11:29
          +2

          Was left under my door.

          It seems the only time the constable has come to my residence is unannounced, when I have not been at home. Every time when he has told me that he will be there on a certain night he has been too busy to make it.

      • chk on 11/05/2020 - 01:18
        +1

        OP - how were you served the letter?

        • harthagan on 11/05/2020 - 11:33
          +1

          Left under my door on one of the constables surprise visits when I was not in.

          • chk on 11/05/2020 - 12:19
            +2

            @harthagan: Can anyone comment on this?

            Surely this wouldn't be classified as being served with a notice? The police would have a hard time in court proving this "notice" was given to the op?

            • matt_will_fix_it on 12/05/2020 - 05:12
              +2

              @chk: They could reference this thread - that would be proof enough :)

  • shrek4 on 10/05/2020 - 10:27
    -5

    If police are investigating the matter and the OP isn’t being cooperative could that fall into Perverting the course of justice? If so that is an offence in itself.

    • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 10:46
      +16

      Lol I'm the one being mucked around. Twice the officer in my area was supposed to come over, he wouldn't give me a time window either. Both times he failed to come. Then a third time he insisted I come to the station to see him and when I got there he was too busy to even see me

    • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 10:47
      +2

      If that's the definition of perverting the course of justice, we can fit anything in there.

      Not letting the police but the queue. Police had to queue, didn't spend as much time with their kids. Police distracted. Perverted course of justice.

    • Vote for Pedro on 11/05/2020 - 07:15

      Rubbish. You do not have to talk to police.

      • Euphemistic on 11/05/2020 - 07:24
        +2

        But sometimes talking to them and providing a written statement will prevent more serious and ongoing problems.

    • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 16:08
      +1

      Not yet. It's heading that way.

  • DiscoJango on 10/05/2020 - 10:52
    +6

    Ah, some police are thugs in uniform. Rock up with a classic NWA song playing and the rest is history.

    • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 11:48
      +11

      The guy I've been dealing with in my local area is a real thug. My neighbour told me that when I wasn't here he was banging on my door for like 5 minutes and calling out my name at the top of his voice.

      Every time I've spoken with him on the phone he has been nothing but rude and arrogant. At one time he tried to get me to come down to the station at midnight (that was in mid April during the height of the covid lockdown)

        • Vote for Pedro on 10/05/2020 - 17:08
          +2

          And he can’t be forced to go to the station. If police want a statement they can be nice about it. OP has not broken the law.

          And before you come in with ‘but surely you want to prove you had nothing to do with it’ it’s important that we live in a country where we aren’t presumed guilty and have to go about proving our innocence. The police have to prove guilt.

          • whooah1979 on 10/05/2020 - 17:15

            @Vote for Pedro: They're not forcing OP to come to the LAC and provide particulars. They're advising OP that they have the legal power to issue the registered operator of the vehicle with a fine in accordance with the Road Transport Act.

            • Vote for Pedro on 10/05/2020 - 17:22
              +1

              @whooah1979: Then they should do so. OP has tried to be helpful. They should stop dicking OP about.

              Likely they haven’t issued a fine is because they don’t have the grounds.

      • Love a bargain on 10/05/2020 - 17:21
        +3

        I'd file a complaint against him if I were you

      • Randolph Duke on 11/05/2020 - 00:49
        +5

        Cop called you near midnight?
        Bashing on the door yelling your name out?

        Sounds like they want you for something else, or there’s some mayo on this story.

        • harthagan on 11/05/2020 - 09:26

          No I had been waiting all night because he said he was going to come. Then I called his station at roughly 10.30pm and they put me through to him.

          He said he was working on something else and to come to the station at midnight when he would be available. And this was after 3 fails on his part. After that I have not spoken to him since and that was in late April. He threatened me with the "big fine" one last time before i hung up on him in disgust.

  • Euphemistic on 10/05/2020 - 10:55
    +6

    It’s quite possible that the incident involved a vehicle that has been confused with yours. Maybe the rego/make/model/colour was similar enough and when entered into the system they got your details.

    You need to sort it out with the police. It sounds like it’s not going away so ignoring it will not help.

    • brendanm on 10/05/2020 - 11:09
      +9

      Can no one read? Op has tried to sort it numerous times.

      • Euphemistic on 10/05/2020 - 11:51
        +1

        Be that as it may, it is potentially a serious incident they are investigating. The OP has not yet formally provided a statement relating to the incident. The OP has only verbally told the officer. There may be some requirement of a formal statement to be lodged.

        If in doubt about the necessity to formally respond the OP needs to talk to a lawyer, not OzBargain.

        • [Deactivated] on 10/05/2020 - 12:05
          +1

          If it is that serious, the police will seek and be granted a questioning warrant.

        • brendanm on 10/05/2020 - 12:36
          +7

          Op has tried to talk to the police. Should ha take every day off work and wait at the station in the hope of talking to someone about an alleged offences he had no part in?

          • Euphemistic on 11/05/2020 - 06:46
            +1

            @brendanm: If the allegation is serious, eg hit and run, then yesthe OP does have to formally respond else they’ll be considered guilty and non cooperative which makes things worse.

            It appears that the police system has had some hiccups and possibly escalated because they perceive the OP is being difficult

            • brendanm on 11/05/2020 - 07:41
              +2

              @Euphemistic: Being difficult by trying to contact them numerous times? After receiving a letter with wildly incorrect dates? I wouldn't be very helpful at that point either.

              • Euphemistic on 11/05/2020 - 08:03

                @brendanm: I didn’t say they were being difficult. There may be a negative perception - from both sides. One probably easily cleaned up with a face to face meeting.

                • brendanm on 11/05/2020 - 10:05

                  @Euphemistic: Which op has attempted to facilitate. Only to be mucked around.

                  • Euphemistic on 11/05/2020 - 12:03

                    @brendanm: Yes. They did attempt to facilitate, but it certainly seems like they didn’t really want to help. “I told her that I wasn't going to give up my driving details”

    • peterpeterpumpkin on 10/05/2020 - 11:28
      +1

      Confusing similar licence plates on same model cars is one of the negative side effects of NSW's sequential licencing allocation. I think they register the same new car models in batches, which is why the first 2 letters are often the same (from my casual observation). Then you have old cars like mine that were re-registered a decade ago and make you wonder what the car has been through…

  • Drakesy on 10/05/2020 - 11:14

    Last time I checked anything civil was too hard for the police to handleand was a matter between the drivers parties. I'd guess the driver is pushing for damages and has said it was a hit and run in order to pursue hence the inquiry.

  • Randxyz123 on 10/05/2020 - 11:23
    +1

    Ignoring the police won't do you any favours. I'd call the officer back and say you want to speak with legal aid for some advice and then you will come in. People on here saying to just ignore it is terrible advice to give.

    IANAL but the cops just want a chat at this stage to find out if the other party is a BS artist or they've confused silver for grey or a 1 for an I.

    I would suggest you start gathering any details of where you were that day. If you have google maps timeline on, print out those details if it clearly shows you as nowhere near the scene of the accident and as you say it was an hour from your house, it should be a 5-minute conversation.

    Is there a law saying that I must comply with this request? The last time I spoke with her she threatened with charging me with something if I don't do what she says.

    Again, IANAL but cooperating seems like a good idea? When an officer asks for your details, normally you need to comply. If you weren't involved then you don't need to worry. Let them do their job to find out what happened.

    Has anyone else driven your car? Housemate? Friend? Family? Etc?

    • McFly on 10/05/2020 - 15:28
      +1

      Try reading the OP.

  • harthagan on 10/05/2020 - 11:27
    +14

    The relevant act states that I must give the information when required to do so by an authorized officer.

    I can't see where it says I must take a day off work to go to the police station and wait like an idiot for someone to get around to taking them down. Or that I have to stay at home all night waiting for someone who may or may not show.

    I've made myself more than available to the NSW police, if they can't be bothered to do their job that's not my issue.

    • oscargamer on 10/05/2020 - 11:31
      +6

      That's fine and correct.

      Phone the station. Ask to speak to the member. If they are there, get their email and email them the answer to who was the driver. If they are not there, speak to a Sgt or above, get their email and email them the name of the driver.

      You have then complied with nominating the driver.

      If the car was not being driven at the time in question, tell them that but also nominate who had possession of the car.

      If police need more info, just get them to email you their questions. Given the COVID restrictions, it is MORE than acceptable to communicate via email.

  • loropy9 on 10/05/2020 - 11:32
    +1

    So typical of any govt agency.

  • bvdbvd on 10/05/2020 - 11:47
    +5

    Few years ago, I got a phone call from a police officer saying I was involved in a fight at the stadium which I have never been to and they requested me to see him the next day. I paid a visit to the station and waited for hours before two officers saw me. They took my details and showed me a photo of someone which I don't know. It was just 10 minutes talk and I have not heard from them since then. The most important thing is my name is cleared. So, just visit them and sort thing out. P.s police just do their job to find out who was involved in the accident.

    • ausmechkeyboards on 10/05/2020 - 17:46
      -2

      police just do their job

      No they don’t. If they were then they wouldn’t spend all their time attacking law abiding people and inventing new rules and regulations to sting normal people on.

      There are plenty of drug dealers, rapists and thieves they should go and sort out. But of course, actually doing their job is too hard so instead they just spend their time on traffic offences.

      • Ughhh on 10/05/2020 - 22:12

        Heh. Yes, If you were ever a victim of hit and run or you were punched in the face, the cops should deff not bother investigating your case. They gotta better and more serious/important things to do, glad you agree.

        • ausmechkeyboards on 11/05/2020 - 07:25
          -3

          Happy to double down. Police are lazy, manipulative thugs that are nothing more than extensions of the police state. They provide 0 value to any community and exist only to break communities apart.

          • samfisher5986 on 11/05/2020 - 11:17
            +2

            @ausmechkeyboards: Just because you or your family has done something illegal and had the police catch you, it doesn't mean they are bad.

            • ausmechkeyboards on 11/05/2020 - 18:55
              +2

              @samfisher5986: Haven’t done anything illegal, I’m just not a statist who worships an extension of the military.

              The police have decided it is illegal for you to defend yourself and assume full responsibility for your protection. They’ve gone so far as to put you in jail if you try to defend yourself against an attacker.

              So why is it that I can’t blame the police for things that go wrong? Why am I not allowed to ask why police don’t do their job when crimes still take place?

              Either the police fix all crime, or they allow communities to be able to regulate themselves. All we have now is a complete erosion of rights and freedoms with more victimless crimes and no less violent crime.

              If you think people should have their entire lives ruined because they had a bag of weed or should be fined hundreds of dollars for going 5km/h over arbitrary speed restrictions then you’re part of the problem.

              OP is a great example. Being harassed and threatened by a power tripping state employee when he has done nothing wrong. Maybe he’s a criminal too in your books?

              • ssquid on 11/05/2020 - 21:22

                @ausmechkeyboards:

                why police don’t do their job when crimes still take place?

                There was a crime. OP was apparently identified by a third party as being involved. Police are trying to get a statement from OP, is that not their job? Should they just ignore it, and screw the guy whose car got bingled?

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