Recently some thieves broke into my house and stole around $2000 worth of stuff. The police were able to identify the thieves due to fingerprints they left at the scene and were eventually able to catch one of them . The person pleaded not guilty to break and enter so it went to court. After waiting over 4 hours for the case to be heard, 5 minutes before we went into the courtroom, the thief changed their plea to guilty and made a deal with the public prosecutor to be fined instead. This was extremely frustrating as not only did I lose a day of work but so did a detective, fingerprint forensics analyst and the beat cop who were associated with the case. Anyhow, the thief was fined half the amount of the stolen goods (they were not able to apprehend their accomplice for the other half). A few months passed and I had not received any money so I contacted the local police station for information. I was told that because the thief was on a pension they cannot afford to pay me back so I have to wear the cost of the stolen good myself (they will not garnish pensions). So it seems that in Queensland if you are on a pension, you can freely break into other people's houses and steal their stuff without any repercussions.
Thief Convicted and Fined but Does Not Have to Pay Me Back as They Are on a Pension
Last edited 16/12/2015 - 12:49
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China the same country that executes criminals as sends the cost of the bullets to their families. Great legal system!
This would be a good scandal segment for 7 news Queensland
It's easier to get away with criminal activities than speeding in this country.
I was involved in a near miss incident once. I was on my motorcycle and a car being driven by a teenager with a bunch of his idiot friends ran red light and almost took me out. I lowsided while avoiding being run over at the last minute. He did a runner, good Samaritans even tried to chase them down but I was told that he ran more red lights trying to get away. Witnesses left signed statements confirming rego number. Police went to the address of the vehicle registration and the parents claimed that their son moved out many months ago and they don't talk to him anymore (despite his son driving his car around]. There was nothing the police could do because they claimed they can't locate him.
I was out of pocket for my insurance excess and debt collector working for the insurance company gave up trying to chase the money.
There you go. If you do 10km/h over the speed limit, you will be chased to end of the earth but you injure someone and so easy to walk away scotfree
I think there is a sliding scale of minor offences against the state done by people with something to lose all the way to huge crimes that affect lots of people or a few people drastically (murder).
There is a window in between where its pretty much not worth the resources required to uphold the law especially if the crime was against private citizens.
If I am not wrong, minor assault is also probably a only a civil case if you not a protected class of persons.
Yeah, the justice system in Australia in general is screwed. I heard a story, not sure how authentic it is but, a thief in Sydney climbed a man's walls/fence which were fairly high up at night, the man noticed racketing noise outside so he went to go check it out and when he shone his torch at the thief, it gave the thief a fright, so much so that he fell off, the thief made claims against the house owner because now he won't be able to 'work' and his family relied on him to make money. The claims were put through without a hitch and I heard the house owner had to pay for his medical bills and like 800/week for a couple of months.
sounds like bullshit
I have heard a similar story but pretty sure it was in America
Yeah I've heard it before too, in fact I think even on this forum.
Also sorry to hear op. Society is pretty shit.
Had a guy drink drive through my back fence, through my garden and into the garden shed. He was caught a short time later, police told me he has been in and out of jail has no money for compensation, so I had to pay for everything myself. Got the fence repaired, cleaned up the garden myself and my previously new shed now looks like a big used VB tinnie. Not worth putting an insurance claim in for $1200 excess and lower my rating.
Don't you have an insurance for Home contents?
insurances don't do much when insurance limit is not much, sub limits apply to specific items or contents with attached emotions are stolen.
I know all this strain is hard to bear, but in most cases the choice a state prosecutor makes is not about the victims or the perpetrators, it is about the Court and the resources it can spend on balancing the law (mistakenly referred to as justice) and the money we spend on it.
These are two choices here.
- Give more money to the lawyers, or
- Accept worse outcomes
The lawyers decide the policies (most MPs are trained lawyers) and they manage the bureaucracy too (or worse, bureaucrats who think they are lawyers but are actually just hacks, do). Then other lawyers look after every next step down through the system (and there are many) until you get to the parties who are at odds, (or in reality, their lawyers, registrars and/or judges who all have to balance what they see as outcomes vs effort.
If you feel the perpetrator got off lightly, talk to your MP about the reasons the legal system is broken. Perhaps Democracy is too, but your MP won't do anything about that for the same reasons as a lawyer won't do anything about the miserable state of justice. Remember none of them are supposed to, the system has been built to persist and protect its protectors. So be careful what you say, individuals and journalists are all being monitored, many argue further that the people are actively controlled in many ways as well. Remember, they all take their cut (or at least make a living) out of what others before them built. They will protect what they know and trust.
Feeling dejected? Find a way to improve things that does not make the system more complicated, more cumbersome or more expensive. That is the challenge. Then you know will know about dejection.
If you feel wronged, remember that:
- If your matter was over something of low value (below say, $250,000) then it is getting in the way of matters of significance and will be dismissed at the earliest opportunity by a Court. Most Courts cost far more than that every hour.
- If your matter was about principal, or is in any way motivated by vengeance (and you expect the state to prosecute it), it will be a hot potato that will be promptly buried. Prosecuting it yourself can get you somewhere but at enormous cost (they'll take you for all you have if you want them to!) Whatever you do, don't expect the state to support you as you will feel it should.
- If the perpetrator has no resources/is a Houso as they normally are, no-one can make them pay, not even the law. Police are not paid enough to deal with morons produced by our society. Throwing them in jail costs the system money and that means a far more capable criminal will have to be left roaming around the community, and anything else has to be enforced at a considerable cost.
The Courts are not a place anyone wants to end up. Even those who you might think get get away without punishment- because all Courts really do is make money for the most highly trained enemies of the state at every other parties' expense, and opaquely maintain the appearance that they are upholding our(or rather their) law.
It was not long ago that all these laws did not exist, instead there were constitutions, religions, emperors, tribes, anarchies and monarchies. Some think we have something better, but it needs a lot more care than we afford it.
Go To Current Affair
Yeah same with insurance companies if an uninsured party is at fault, if they are on a pension or benefit, legally you can't enforce recovery. You can try to ask them nicely though :)
I would hope the OP would be compensated by Insurance (less Excess if applicable), then the Insurance companies use their dogs to chase the perps.
Can you not take them to Small Claims Court? The criminal charge has been dealt with, but as I understand it there is no impediment now for you to make a civil claim against the thief for restitution. Given the amount involved, you couuld get an order from Small Claims Court (or whatever its called in your particular state)?
Sorry to hear man, I would've thought they would just deduct a certain amount from their Centrelink payments each fortnight until the debt was paid.
What annoys me the most about this story is that the courts puts the value of the fines as more important than restitution. If the man could afford a $500 fine, then would can't he afford $500 restitution instead? The government are the crooks here, they walk away $500 richer off a crime committed against you.
A friend once had a worker in a family business steal up to 50k over a two year period (altered documents every week when depositing the businesses earnings to take a cut off the top). She supposedly bought a car with some of it, crashed it, spent the rest, cried poor when convicted. They never saw a cent. Ended up sending the family bankrupt.
How to get absolutely anything for half price!
In reality, the cost bared on the government already exceeded (consider all those people you mentioned, their salary * 4 hours + lawyers, and court fees) that of the stolen goods, the perpetrator unable to pay and having paid half that liability to the court.
Keep in mind the thief is down net 50% and the victim is down 100%, the government is probably down 500% but recovers 150% by absorbing costs.
They take the 350% loss in the hopes that the perpetrator doesn't repeat their actions.
It sucks for sure, but that's the inherent flaw with the legal system when used for "petty crime".
The solution is obvious for dealing with these repeat minor offenders and juvenile perps. Forget about jails. They are too expensive. Instead adopt a disciplinary system like they have in Singa'rich'. Public corporeal punishments for like whipping would have a strong deterrent effect upon most petty crims. For hardened criminals, put them to a firing squad, or if that is too gory for people inject the malefactors with a lethal dose of a barbiturate (they use thiopental to put down pets, a very quick and painless death). No expensive retrials either. The judicial system is so expensive and inefficient.
Perhaps young troublemakers could also be drafted into the military for a year to straighten them out… Instead of nannying people and denying them any responsibility for their malicious actions, we need a strict right wing approach which holds people accountable for their crimes, and punishes them appropriately. Simple Pavlovian conditioning - do something bad, and the state will do something bad to you in return. It works on animals, and just as effectively on humans.
Firstly, Singapore is a very different country to Australia with a different culture. So applying the Singaporean system is not going to work. Think about how the first Australians from UK was sent here, many got sent here because they were poor and had to resort to stealing for survival.
Rather than using punishment as a way to deal with the rise in crime, we have to find the root cause of it.
Prevention is better than cure. Killing poor desperate people do not make the society a better place.
In southeast Asian countries, even the criminals would beg being put in jail when caught. Coz the other alternative could have been being beaten to death by the masses before the police arrive.
Totally agree, but unfortunately the pro-life/ anti physical abuse groups will be up in arms.
Maybe this should be posted in the new deals section. "This man found an easy trick to get free stuff; homeowners hate him"
More like a Buzzfeed article.
OP, if it is worth it to you I would suggest going to a lawyer for a consultation (as some in this thread have suggested) rather than trusting the police to advise you on your rights under civil law. It's possible they might tell you the same thing, but imo something about what you have been told doesn't quite stack up.
If anyone sees the OPs stuff on gumtree or ebay make sure to link to ozbargain !
Burglary should be punishable by capital punishment.
Simple course correction of the gene pool.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Australia_(1788%E2%80%931850)#Convicts_and_free_settlers
No Offence to anyone.
This sounds sketchy. How were they not able to apprehend the accomplice or at least find out who he is and apprehend him at a later date? I mean they caught one of them obviously.
Jail is appropriate punishment. There is a reason why there are so many repeat offenders on crimes such as theft and burglary. Coz they know they won't be sent to the gaol.
It is not just Qld, it is everywhere. It is not just burglary either. I lost over 10 grand due to a druny driver and the ststem between the courts and jurisdiction borders of Qld & bloody Victoria. If you ever break the law, or drink and drive, you are in my sights. Look out you evil scum. We have moved on, but 10 years ago now and still suffering fiscal dramas from that day.
You lost be at "China has a better justice system" hahahahahaha