Hi all, I have a very old safe in the basement that I can’t open. It’s likely there’s nothing in it but I want to make sure. I’ve been quoted $2000+gst to reinstate the lock or $1200+gst to force it open. Are there any more affordable options?
Edit: photo here https://ibb.co/LX6F04D0
Top Reddit tip: never show the contents.
If you don't mind destroying the safe, I would guess someone would cut it open with an angle grinder for <$200 if you put it on Airtasker.
This for sure. I cut open a safe using an angle grinder once. Took about 15 minutes and 5 discs (it chewed through the discs). Only risk is the sparks setting the contents of the safe on fire.
/edit.. Nevermind. Just saw the photo of the safe. Doubt a angle grinder would get deep enough through the wall! Looks like a tank of a safe!
Yeah, nah. Look at the photo of that safe. I don't have an angle grinder that could do anything to that safe.
You might have a chance going with absolutely hardcore industrial stuff, but that will cost far more $$ that the quoted $2000.
Or you could buy a $45 angle grinder from bunnings and do it yourself
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*edit - photo finally loaded, looks pretty tough
Dynamite
I believe its any old Powergel you can get your hands on that you use these days.
Packaged emulsion isn't much good without a detonator.
Acme Dynamite
Drop an anvil from 100m and might get lucky?
Are there any more affordable options?
Advertise safe-cracking practice for would be/rusty bank robbers; only $50 an hour - they pay you.
Did you get get three quotes or just one? Try a different safe cracker. Have you tried air tasker to see who can do it the cheapest?
Most safes are incredibly heavy. If you finish up with an open but damaged safe, then what. I suspect you may need a locksmith so you don't end up with a useless safe you cannot shift. If very old, the lock is unlikely to be super complex. Keep chasing quotes.
Offer it to a locksmith class, provided they tell you what was in it. If they can open it.
Tried that. I had to buy 4 safes as a bulk lot just to get the one I wanted. Offered the rest to the Ultimo TAFE where I was doing locksmithing, and they didnt want them, and even if they did, I would have to pay for transport… These things were 600+kg each.
Oxytorch and cut it open if you do not want to use it anymore.
Otherwise have a look on lockpicking forums on places like reddit etc
Put an ad in the Long Bay Old Scholars newsletter.
The locals prefer it be called the Malabar Old Scholars Newsletter.
The only ones who know the truth will be its alumni and those who live east of Anzac parade
We defer to someone who apparently has reasons to have knowledge of the matter.
I thought it was Malabar Long term Hostel by the sea.
What kind of safe is it? If el cheapo, it should be pretty easy to force open yourself… also, is it bolted in, or can you move it. And what kind of lock mechanism is it?
If el cheapo, it should be pretty easy to force open
At least buy me a drink first.
👌
Get a cobolt drill bit and a borescope inspection camera (with light).
Drill a hole to suit the borescope camera and feed the camera in.
If there is nothing in the safe, then why waste time trying to open it?
You just have to determine where is the best location on the safe to drill the hole.
Be aware that if it's an old safe it probably has asbestos between the steel layers
It does say fire resistant 😭
Just keep adding cutting fluid to the drill hole you're making (it's an oil that will prevent any dust flying around and helps with cutting into metal) and wear a P2 mask. You'll be fine.
Drill it put camera in ,Check if is empty then leave like that no point to open.
I could almost guarantee that this has it. And it could be in the most hazardous form (friable). Its not worth putting a powertool on it as it could cost your life in the end.
As above, you drill bit that can get through the thickness. You just need a hole in it to see if there’s anything in it
Contact the lockpicking lawyer
Safecracking Solicitor likely more suitable for this one
Nah, boxopening barrister..
You wouldn't use Combination Querying QC for a safe?
Jar opening judge?
In any case, that's all I have for you today. If you do have any questions or comments about this, please put them below. If you like this video, and you would like to see more like it, please subscribe. And as always, have a nice day. Thank you.
Who else read that with the LPL’s voice in their head?
Everyone.
I would spend days trying to open that by ear despite knowing the probable futility.
How old are we talking, 1800's old or 1997 old? Does it have a dial or a key hole? Is it mounted into the floor/wall or free standing? Is it a thin steel box looking safe or a concrete filled body safe? Are we talking the size of an A4 sheet of paper or are we talking big enough to stash a body in? Does it even have a brand? Chubb? CMI? etc?
As for "is there any cheaper way to get in…" Yeah, all safes have a secret lever you pull and it just opens like a banana… FFS. It wouldn't be called a "safe" if there was an easy/cheaper way to get into them. It all depends on the type of safe it is and how much damage you are prepared to exact on it to get it open.
If it is a proper, well made safe, you could be looking at a safe with all sorts of security features like re-lockers and door bolts. The outer skin could be hardened steel and then have a thick wall of compacted concrete. You are not going to just "angle grind" into one of these, not to mention, depending on the age of the safe, some old safes were full of asbestos to make them fire rated, so drilling or cutting into those could be problematic.
If it is a thin walled/single skin safe, then you can basically just open it with a hole saw, angle grinder or anything like that. (I would not be using an "oxy torch" on a safe just in case there was something valuable inside.)
The reason your quotes are so high is because locksmiths a: hate safe jobs. b: they are hella time consuming, especially if the customer want to reuse/sell the safe afterwards c: some of the equipment for safe entry can be very expensive and d: they know that what is in there could be VERY valuable and worth way more than their $2,000 fee (think of a bank safe with $2 million in it)
Locksmith makes cents. Cheers
I’ve never leant so much in my life
Consult an orthopaedic surgeon.
Thanks for the detail. So it says milners patent 212 fire resisting but there’s a dial on it that looks modern. The only person who knew much about it has just passed and I recall he said there wasn’t anything in it. I’ve put a photo in the original post now
Yep, I would not be grinding a safe of that age that is "fire resisting". There is a greater than 0% chance this thing is full of asbestos.
The 212 patent from Milner is not just a trademark, it represents a fire-resistant mixture of sand, sawdust and alum crystals that were injected into the sides of the box. During a fire, these contents owing to the chemical reaction of the ingredients were guaranteed not to heat up beyond 212 degrees Fahrenheit.
Age of the safe seems to put it about the late 1850s? So maybe a museum piece if you were to donate it, or some "collector" might be interested in it if it is cheap enough and let them get it open.
The S&G dial is a modern dial on the front. That is an addition. There is no telling with that keyway though, if it requires a key or if the key is an override or if the key portion is even locked. Good chance looking at it though that it requires either a "warded" key or a "lever lock" type key.
Know nothing about safes, but looking up pics seems the key was the original lock mechanism. So is it likely that the dial has replaced the key mechanism making the key redundant? Or is there still a possibility that somehow it has been modded that both key and combo is require
Posting a photo would have saved 20 messages of speculation.
I couldn’t see an option to upload a photo. I do have one!
Top hinge looks like it has been played with. I would see if you remove the screws and see what happens w.r.t. movement of the door/hinge.
Safes wouldn't be very safe if the hinges were on the outside and you could just remove them.
If it is a safe, not just a fireproof cabinet, there are sliding bolts that push out into the frame around the door. Even if you remove the hinges the bolts continue to hold the door firmly in place.
@GordonD: As you posted "Safes wouldn't be very safe if the hinges were on the outside" so have you changed your mind now?
I posted ".. see what happens w.r.t. movement of the door/hinge.", so I never said it would open, but may move a bit more and therefore if you are a safe expert then would know what the next step is, but I have NFI as I am NOT a safe cracker.
@AndyC1: I am, and I’m telling you, removing the hinges would do (fropanity) all in helping you get it open. If anything, removing the hinges may in fact, make it harder to open, because the wright of the door would now rest on the locking bolts, not the hinges, possibly making the opening handle almost impossible to turn.
It's like everyone here needs help on how to ask for help.
Reminds me of my GF's scenario 1 year ago …
She was moving house - was an electronic safe (Bunnings type option - which was then bolted/concreted into floor with good size 20cm bolts).
Batteries were flat, but had option to use key … Sadly, she had also lost the key … Which the safe contained her passport + expensive jewellery.
Since house was being demolished … It took 4 of us strong guys - with an axe/mattock/hammer/screwdriver - 2 hours to Jimmy the safe from bedroom wardrobe.
Once we had the safe out - her brother used angle grinder to open it.
[EDIT] : and yes, everything inside was still 100% undamaged.
the safe contained her passport
That makes it worth destroying the safe. When your country has the most expensive passports in the world.
Sorry to say this after you did all that hard work, but pretty much any “safe” from Bunnings can be picked in seconds without specialist tools. I was in a similar situation a few months ago and got mine open with a screwdriver and an allen key. I now keep it unlocked for convenience and just use it as a fire/water resistant strongbox for passports, documents, etc.
yeah … but NAH … 100% NAH to your "pretty much any “safe from Bunnings can be picked in seconds without specialist tools".
and yes … WE DID try screwdriver/allen key +++ watching several YT videos first.
PFTT.
The treasure is all the friends you've made on the way to cracking the safe.
Third degree burns, terrorism convictions, mesothelioma, etc.
Now we have a picture I would remove the handle on the far left. Drill through the screw hole (yes it will take a long time and a lot of drill bits), check inside with a bore scope. When you confirm it's empty put the handle back on.
Two options:
Option 1. Look for a Caravan parked on the side of a Road, put Safe nearby, and wait.
Option 2. Bikies.
Stethoscope and YouTube videos on how to crack a safe with a combination lock :)
As a locksmith who spent more than enough time during my traineeship (fropanity) around with with these S&G dial combination locks for the "practice", the old "stethoscope" attack isnt going to work. There are other, easier work arounds for these types of locks.
There are other, easier work arounds for these types of locks
Yeah, but where is the op going to find 4 mini Cooper's, mark Wahlberg and Charlize Theron?
Just get the Fonz to slap the top of it, it pops open while the Fonz just double thumbs up and says "ayyyyyyyy"
The lock picking lawyer posted a video on a safe cracking machine (ITL-2000), which figures out the combination by trying every combination, said it can take up to 30hours.
Link: https://youtu.be/nDgC8JOQhiM?si=QKQF7UUcnkJvipGi
Had a CMI safe with a sergeant and green leaf combination dial once… was a good safe.
Try turning the handle
Stay safe
That's the key to this situation.
if it would be me, looking at the picture - angle grinder with cutting disk (9 inch grinder) and cut the lock bars.
you have a gap between door and door jamb - so can cut though the lock bars
Not how that works at all, but thanks for playing…
The locking bars are set further in and deeper… All you would be doing it cutting into the side wall of the safe and not even touching the locking bars…
And a 9" angle grinder in a groove like that sounds like a prime recipe to loose a finger or an arm in the process.
even on 19th century safe it will be the same ? Bars further in to protect from cutting them (with what though?)?
The photo I linked to is almost this same safe as OP's. That photo is of a safe from the same era. The safe in OP's photos is well over 100 years old. So, yes, even 19th Century safes would be the same. The locking bars are buried this deep in the safe for the exact reason you are trying to offer as a solution.
Bars further in to protect from cutting them (with what though?)?
I dont know, I wasnt around in the 1800's designing safes. I think it was more the way they had to design them. Thick safes often have a very small volume inside compared to their outside dimensions, so the back of the door needs to fit into the "smaller" safe area so the locking bolts just naturally engineered themselves to be like this through necessity. I dont think back then they were thinking "what can we do to make this safer from 9" angle grinders??".
OP, you have messaging off, I have a friend that can help, message me
Thieves usually do it with an angle grinder through the hinges, then crowbar to rip the door off, a non theft rated safe shouldn't take too long. Like others have mentioned, watch for sparks. If you go the drill route be aware it will take longer and you don't want to use a fast drill speed when going through steel. Put a cordless drill on its slowest speed, slow and steady with a bit of machine oil and resting the bit every few minutes to prevent overheating will get you through eventually. If it's not attached to the ground, and not too heavy, try 'bumping' it ie. lift it up and drop it a few times to see if the lock opens. Some cheap safes can be 'bumped' to get them open.
This reply is literally a list of what not to do.
Well I didn't see the image. I assumed it was a Bunnings special of which all of these methods will work. Others have mentioned to drill to see inside before committing to opening the safe. I'm just giving advice if they want to take that route. If you're going to drill thick steel, unless you've got some crazy industrial drill a slow drill speed is the only way to do it. Running your drill bit as fast as you can will just overheat the bit. Seriously go Google it
Beautiful piece of artwork. Forget trying to crack it open. Just relocate it in to central position in your house & offer visitors a prize if they can open the thing.
Far too good to destroy
I'm not expert here, but some of these old safes can kinda be quite expensive antiques depending on brand and so on. They don't make them like they used to.
I'd get the safe itself valued, and it can guide you in your decision.
There is a fair chance the safe is worth more than the contents.
Thanks - who would value safe?? I looked it up but I’m not sure they’re worth that much.
Wait 200 more years.
I cut the front plate off my old fire safe in 5 minutes (if you want to stuff the safe) Very simple. My spin dial pin fell out so there was no way to do the combination. I even welded the face plate back on and gave the safe to a local business (they key part still worked) Up to you if you want to grind it open. Trust me, its easier than you think. Cutting the hinges wont work.
Giant hammer?
Thats worth about $5k if you get it restored.
https://www.lincolnrestorations.co.uk/antique-original-victo…
That one looks a bit more fancy no? I mean sure I could get a decorative paint job but I have a feeling this one is a later model. Unless the safe was antique when it was put in the house. Definitely not an 1850s house.
Only costs 10k to restore it
Put out shares/lottery for the content. $10 a ticket for 10% of what's in it. Everyone takes a risk. I'm sure there's a bunch of degenerate gamblers on here that would take a risk
If you have a free afternoon and a steady hand, you can crack it yourself. You’ll need some graph paper and a pencil handy. You basically “map” the lock by rotating and feeling out the mechanism. It allows you to narrow down the possible combinations. Boring and time consuming but it works. There’ll be tutorials on the interwebs.
I am a gambler and can open this for you.
If there's nothing inside as you say, I leave without any payment required. But if there's anything inside, I take 20% of the value.
What do you think?
Cheapest way is to run through the 90,345,024 possible combinations, but first learn to lockpick via YT.
Ya all haven't seen movies? Put your ear towards the dial and turn the dial until it clicks….. then open
Reach out to LockPickingLawyer to see if they can help. Might add content to their channel in exchange for help opening it up.
Buy this https://www.amazon.com.au/Bosch-2609255025-Metal-Diameter-15… and this https://www.amazon.com.au/Industrial-Endoscope-Flexible-Wate… you will be able to see inside the safe and find out if it is worth spending the money getting it opened.
Whatever you do, put it on Reddit