Should I File an ACL Claim for My MacBook Pro Which Is Completely Dead?

gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 13:52
Last edited 18/12/2024 - 14:42 by 1 other user

My 2018 15" Macbook Pro completely died last week. It spontaneously shut down and would not power on at all.

I took the laptop into the Apple Store in Chermside, QLD on Saturday the 15th of December, 2024 and they said that it's likely that the logic board would need replacing at a cost of ~$1100 (I can't remember the exact figure but it was pretty exorbitant). I bought the Macbook Pro on the 26th of August, 2019 for a cost of $4114 so it's just a touch over 5 years old with a cost/year of $822. I pushed for them to repair the laptop under their ACL obligations, but they've formally refused.

I'm of the opinion that a laptop of this price should last for longer than 5 years. Sure, if I'd bought a $1500-$2000 laptop, I'd understand that I'd be barking up the wrong tree but considering how much I paid for this laptop, I'd expect a longer duration of use and I'm thinking of filing a claim with QCAT for remediation of this issue via a no cost repair.

What are everyone's thoughts on whether I should proceed? Am I being unreasonable here?

Computing Apple Computer Laptop

Comments

  • Dollar General on 18/12/2024 - 14:03
    +14

    A $100,000 car comes with a 5 year warranty but for that price it should be a 20 year warranty

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:35
      +4

      A warranty provided by a manufacturer is not the equivalent to the rights afforded to a consumer under ACL. There are numerous examples where car manufacturers have had to offer repairs to cars over 5 years old and I remember Jeep having to repair blown engines for cars at or around 10 years old.

    • justworld on 18/12/2024 - 17:45
      +1

      I have no doubt that car warranties that last only 3 or 5 years on expensive cars are insufficient under the ACL. It depends on the nature of the defect. Something big like a blown engine I think should be repaired far beyond the warranty period (assuming normal use by the consumer) particularly for higher-priced models that are advertised as being luxury vehicles. If I bought a 911 and it suffered a major defect beyond the 3 year warranty period I'd be litigating it for sure. In this regard I think Ferrari with its 7 year warranty clearly shows up Porsche and all the other luxury brands who only offer 3-5 year warranties, and I think you'd be a mug to ever buy an extended warranty on a car like that within 7 years of manufacture.

      That said I litigate for a living and others might enjoy having the 'peace of mind' of a warranty extension.

      • mhz on 19/12/2024 - 07:48

        Warranty extensions are usually provided by a third party and aren't worth the paper they are printed on. Have a look how Harvey Norman and JB were both fined for selling them to customers.

      • zyj494949 on 19/12/2024 - 11:45

        Same as lexury cars, sell it before warranty ends and not your porblem

  • 87percent on 18/12/2024 - 14:04
    +14

    Lodge it, can’t hurt

    • JustSomeUser on 18/12/2024 - 14:09
      +9

      I agree, lodge it now.

      Just my 2 bucks worth, but I am also of the opinion that the device/product should last longer than that, at that price.

    • HeWhoKnows on 19/12/2024 - 08:20
      -1

      For a 6 year old laptop?

      LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL

  • geekcohen on 18/12/2024 - 14:11
    +12

    How often are you using the laptop? Daily? If so, 5 years is pretty good. ACL might say it is wear and tear.

    for a cost of $4114

    and this why I don't own a Mac. Cannot justify this cost.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:41

      I used it daily but it was mainly for emails, web browsing etc. with some photography/video work thrown in. It was my daily driver but I just would have expected it to last longer given Apple's supposed reputation and the premium I paid for it.

      And I agree: this will definitely be my last Apple product based on my experience.

      • geekcohen on 18/12/2024 - 14:46

        Daily for 5 years is good even for Apple. When it comes to electronics, it could've lasted 2 years or it could've gone on for another 2 years. Its hard to tell. You really paid a little more of the brand and the OS.

        I wouldn't be against another Apple product, my wife loves her Macbook Pro 13". I cannot justify the cost of a highly spec'd machine for what I would want. But they are good for others that just need it for general usage with low resource requirements. If you need large resource requirement, go a Windows machine and get more bang for buck.

        That's just my view.

        • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:50
          +2

          I hear you. Thanks to a deal on here, I ordered a Lenovo Yoga Slim 7i Aura Edition (15'', Gen 9) with a 1TB HDD and 32GB RAM from their outlet store for ~$1700 since I needed a replacement laptop urgently. I can't justify the absurd cost of Apple's laptops. The equivalent Macbook would have cost 2-3 time as much.

          • geekcohen on 18/12/2024 - 15:41

            @gyrex: Perfect! You could get one of those again in 2-3 years and still be in front compared to an Apple.

          • watwatwat on 19/12/2024 - 10:42
            -2

            @gyrex:

            You really paid a little more of the brand and the OS.

            This is so wrong. Non-Apple laptops are pieces of junk from a hardware perspective. They'll also not have as long as a lifespan as a macbook and won't have anywhere close to the same resell value over time.

            I ordered a Lenovo
            The equivalent Macbook would have cost 2-3 time as much.

            Yeah, it costs more and it's worth it, for many.

            People are shocked when a macbook doesn't last more than 5 years after years of daily usage, which goes to show how high the expectations are for mac reliability.

            If someone complained that a Lenovo didn't last more than 2 years, people would say "yeah, sounds about right".

            • Skinnerr on 19/12/2024 - 11:50

              @watwatwat:

              Yeah, it costs more and it's worth it, for many.

              Its funny how you don't explain at all why its worth it, 'for many', just insist that it is.

    • Geoff-bargain on 18/12/2024 - 16:14
      +2

      My 2016 (but bought 2017) MBP cost 3x what I'd spent on a laptop before. But definitely worth it. Apple fixed it a couple of times for known faults and since has been perfect. Mine so far is costing about $430 a year - but each year I hold it for that drops even more.
      I've taken it on some long trips as well which can be hard on tech. I will definitely replace with another when it eventually dies.

  • LanceVance on 18/12/2024 - 14:13
    +1

    Might as well lodge it. But also the repair prices at an Apple Store for repairs are going to be very high. Take it to a few other 3rd party repairers for alternative quotes. At the very least they may be able to help you recover your data.
    Years ago I had a Macbook Air fail and the independent repairer recovered my data and ended up offering to buy the machine for parts so I walked away with money in my pocket.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:37
      +1

      Thanks for your comment. I don't care about data recovery. I used a NAS with a Time Machine backup so I've got all my data backed up. I'd just like them to repair the laptop.

  • trapper on 18/12/2024 - 14:16
    +8

    A laptop should last until it's obsolete, especially a $4k one.

    • jv on 18/12/2024 - 14:52
      -6

      That's why you pay for AppleCare+

      • LanceVance on 18/12/2024 - 15:42
        +3

        AppleCare wouldn't help here.

  • Duckie2hh on 18/12/2024 - 14:19
    -5

    for a cost of $4114

    Was it worth it to look cool/hip?

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:36
      +1

      This is a pretty asinine comment considering I didn't buy the laptop to look cool or hip. I bought it because it was effectively a desktop replacement and it was super powerful for its time.

      • jv on 18/12/2024 - 14:52
        +2

        it was super powerful for its time.

        It's not super powerful now though…

        • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:07

          Touché

      • TheFreaK on 19/12/2024 - 11:51

        Doubt.

        Macbook on the Intel platform? Not particularly powerful and more than likely spent its life thermal throttled

  • joka on 18/12/2024 - 14:26
    +15

    I feel like an expensive computer/ laptop is expensive because its powerful and fast, not because its designed to last 30 years. Five years I'd say is pretty decent. What if you were mining crypto and pushing it to its max 24/7 for those five years, should it still be covered?

    • Ynk on 18/12/2024 - 14:35
      +2

      Agree, you can spec up a MacBook to over 11k, doesn't mean it's going to last 5 times longer than a base model. 5+ years for portable electronics is pretty good, obviously OP is unlucky but can't say I would be surprised it could happen nor expect a free repair.

      • trapper on 18/12/2024 - 18:33

        The $11k one should also last longer than 5 years though.

  • jv on 18/12/2024 - 14:38
    -1

    Should I File an ACL Claim for My MacBook Pro Which Is Completely Dead?

    How would you do that?

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:38

      QCAT

      • jv on 18/12/2024 - 14:47
        -1

        ?

        • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:52
          +1

          Queensland Civil and Administrative Tribunal (Small Claims)

          I'll self represent myself and it will only cost a small-ish fee to lodge the claim. Hopefully the claim itself will prompt Apple to come to the table and mediate and provide a repair.

          • jv on 18/12/2024 - 14:53
            -5

            @gyrex: Read the reviews… It is pretty bad.

            • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:55

              @jv: The reviews of what? Can you provide more context in your replies?

              Edit: The reviews of QCAT? They're an administrative tribunal. If I don't get the result I want, it goes to court and a magistrate will provide a ruling.

              • happydude on 18/12/2024 - 16:25
                -3

                @gyrex: You are prepared to take this beyond QCAT to court?

                You are in over your head. There are no circumstances where a magistrate will be involved.

                • gyrex on 19/12/2024 - 11:34

                  @happydude: There's a lot of people on here who profess knowledge on this process and ACL but clearly have no idea what they're talking about. I've used the QCAT process previously to have a fridge repaired outside of the manufacturer's warranty period (successfully) and when mediation was unsuccessful, the case was transferred to a local court to be heard by a magistrate.

  • zombrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:46
    +5

    The fact they did not even look at it shows how little they care.
    They aim to quote a high repair cost to hope you will just buy a new one.
    As others had said take it to a proper rerpair shop, they will actually look at it and likely be able repair it.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:54
      +1

      Yeh, it's really turned me off Apple and I won't be buying any more of their products. I'll lodge a claim via QCAT since the consensus on here seems that it's reasonable for Apple to repair the laptop given how much it cost.

      • lunchbox99 on 18/12/2024 - 14:59
        -3

        You think if you buy a dell, hp, Lenovo, MS and it dies after 4 years they will repair it for free? lfmao…

        • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:04
          +1

          I don't think you understand how ACL works.

          • lunchbox99 on 18/12/2024 - 18:04
            -2

            @gyrex: Well one of us doesn't.. thats for sure.

            Be sure to report back if you get your laptop fixed for free.

        • knobbs on 19/12/2024 - 10:56
          +1

          For comparable hardware it would also cost less. Part of the Apple tax is supposed to be quality, IE lasts longer.

          • lunchbox99 on 19/12/2024 - 11:13

            @knobbs: There is zero chance ACL is going to force warranty of a laptop over 5 years old. None. Zero. Nada.

            • knobbs on 19/12/2024 - 12:00

              @lunchbox99: ACL don't do the enforcing but yeah I don't think there is close to a 0 chance. I am thinking it will be a 50/50, it is sort of in that middle ground that could go either way. This is a "premium" brand that is marketed to be better. I think if the OP goes through with it cheapest case scenario for apple would be a free repair before it goes to court. If apple want to stick them the middle finger they will take it to court.
              I have had letters sent to me from apple legal before trying to get them to repair a known defect on my wife's phone. It was 3yrs old and they basically said get *****. Wish I took that to QCAT

    • jv on 18/12/2024 - 14:54

      how little they care.

      To care, you need to pay for applecare…

      • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 14:54

        Absurd, isn't it…

        • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:15
          -1

          Apple includes a 2 year warranty with the purchase. If you want more, you need to pay for it.

          • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:18
            +4

            @jv: You should probably familiarise yourself with your rights under ACL. A warranty provided by a manufacter does not absolve said manufacturer of their obligations under ACL.

            • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:19

              @gyrex: ACL does not specify what number of years the warranty of a laptop should be.

              • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:29

                @jv: You don't say… Yet you confidently made a post below stating how many years laptops should be covered under ACL. Dunning-Kruger in full force here.

                • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:50
                  +2

                  @gyrex:

                  Yet you confidently made a post below stating how many years laptops should be covered under ACL.

                  That is just my opinion on what I'd consider reasonable. It is not enforceable in a court of law…

              • mhz on 19/12/2024 - 08:23
                +1

                @jv: "Statutory rights have no set time limit – depending on the price and quality of goods, consumers may be entitled to a remedy after any manufacturers’ or extended warranty has expired"

  • neo on 18/12/2024 - 14:57
    +3

    To make things worse, could be something so simple and easy to replace on the board. I like watching those videos of the guy in the U.S that changes one capacitor and their 4k brick is now working again.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:00
      +4

      Yeh, I watch a lot of Louis Rossman's videos since I love electronics, soldering, repairs, building stuff etc. He's been a prolific opponent of Apple for years. Apple's products are disgraceful when it comes to repairs.

      • neo on 18/12/2024 - 15:01
        +1

        If you get nowhere you should give it a go!

        Plug her in, get a IR camera and start looking for RED. Could be something simple :)

  • tsunamisurfer on 18/12/2024 - 15:05
    +1

    OP, how many years do you think is reasonable to no longer be covered by ACL?

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:15
      -2

      Really good question… I guess if a $1500-2000 laptop should last maybe 3 years at a cost of ~$650/year, a laptop which cost >$4000 should last maybe 6 years at the same cost/year?

      • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:17
        +11

        at the same cost/year?

        Cost has nothing to do with it…

        Why would 64Gb RAM last 8 times more than 8GB RAM ???

          • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:28
            +3

            @gyrex:

            It has everything to do with it.

            Nope…

            I would not expect an i9 processor to last longer than an i5…

            • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:33
              +2

              @jv: https://imgur.com/dP6fEcv

              I mean, I knew you were obtuse based on comments I've seen in other threads, but I didn't realise you were this obtuse.

              • coffeeinmyveins on 18/12/2024 - 15:37
                +3

                @gyrex: jv is a known troll, but i actually agree with them here. you're on a high horse thinking that because you got higher spec that it should last longer.

                You think a Ferrari has a 5000 year warranty because it costs so much more than a Mazda?

                • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:39

                  @coffeeinmyveins: From memory, I think it was pretty much a base model at the time. Maybe I upgraded the RAM from 8GB to 16GB for a nominal amount but the base price wasn't much cheaper than what I got.

            • lunchbox99 on 18/12/2024 - 18:32

              @jv: Agreed. You pay for higher specs - faster cpu, more ram, bigger ssd, better screen and wifi. That doesn't mean they last longer. They are just better specs - faster, bigger, higher res, better contrast.

          • pharkurnell on 18/12/2024 - 15:34
            +3

            @gyrex: A laptop with 128g of ram is going to cost more than one with 4gig of ram

            You keep referring to cost per year.. in the above example there is a massive cost difference per year..
            I dont think anybody would expect the more expensive of the 2 to last longer

            • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:52
              +2

              @pharkurnell:

              I dont think anybody would expect the more expensive of the 2 to last longer

              OP does…

              They probably also think a computers with a 1TB SSD should last 4 times longer than a 256GB SSD.

          • TheFreaK on 19/12/2024 - 11:55

            @gyrex: Apple's costs especially when it comes to storage and RAM are purely mark-up, they are not indicative of the quality or cost of the included components.

        • mhz on 19/12/2024 - 08:29
          -2

          Cost has everything to do with it. As gyrex said you would expect a $4k laptop to last a lot longer than say a $1500-2000 laptop. It clear you don't care about your consumer rights!

          • gromit on 19/12/2024 - 08:59

            @mhz: I think people do care about consumer rights. But in this case the OP's perspective is horribly skewed. higher specs and cost doesn't mean higher quality and longer lasting. To expect that to change how long the product lives is not a reasonable expectation.

            If anything the expectation should be a shorter life as the higher performance/spec/cost models consume more power and generate more heat which has a detrimental effect on its longevity.

          • jv on 19/12/2024 - 09:30

            @mhz:

            expect a $4k laptop to last a lot longer than say a $1500-2000 laptop.

            So if a laptop had a high spec CPU, it should last longer than a low spec CPU ??? 🤣

      • Ynk on 18/12/2024 - 15:27
        +3

        Just note best case they will do a pro-rata refund under ACL - you yourself who would be the least impartial person thinks 6 years, you have had it for 5 years + 3 months. So even if they completely agreed with you at best it's $500.

    • jv on 18/12/2024 - 15:16
      +1

      OP, how many years do you think is reasonable to no longer be covered by ACL?

      Max 4 years for a high end laptop… 2 years for an el cheapo one.

  • JimmyF on 18/12/2024 - 15:18
    +2

    Its 6 years old, a little early to die but also not. So meh, not really a ACL issue in my books. If it died at 7 years I would say too bad. 6 years is a bit like oh well.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:19

      5 years old

      • JimmyF on 18/12/2024 - 15:20
        -3

        My 2018 15" Macbook Pro completely

        Make your mind up….

        • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:20
          -2

          Maybe read the post properly. It's a 2018 model which I bought in August, 2019.

          • JimmyF on 18/12/2024 - 16:28
            +3

            @gyrex: Either way, its dead and at least 5 years old. ACL isn't on your side just because you spec'd up the machine, pushed the price up. This doesn't mean the warranty becomes longer under ACL because you added $600 in upgrades.

            Starting price was AU$3,499. You got 5 years.

            • lunchbox99 on 18/12/2024 - 18:34

              @JimmyF: OP is living in fantasy land. No way they will get a free anything on a 5yo laptop. Repair or replacement. Nothing.

              Where people get confused is just because it CAN last longer, doesn't mean it could or should be WARRANTED to last longer.

              It's no different to a car. Some last 20 years, but that doesn't mean manufacturers are on the hook for the maximum lifespan observed out there.

  • happydude on 18/12/2024 - 15:19
    +1

    The ATO says the effective life is 2 years. If it is 5 years old that is 2.5x more.

    I would push them further as it really should last longer, but your time is probably not best spent at QCAT.

    But if you are committed, bust out Schedule 2 of the Competition and Consumer Act 2010 and make sure you have a good argument.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 15:24
      +3

      The ATO's guidelines relate to depreciation and has no relationship to whether the product has met its durability according to ACL.

      • happydude on 18/12/2024 - 15:45
        +1

        It was to put into perspective what you are trying to claim. What on earth did you come here for if you have all the answers?

        IMO 5 years is the low end, but long enough to satisfy the acceptable quality provisions.

        • apu on 18/12/2024 - 16:52
          +2

          Completely agree with @happydude here. Whilst the ATO guide relates to depreciation, it certainly shows what the ATO expect to be a reasonable and claimable lifespan of a laptop.

        • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 20:25

          What on earth did you come here for if you have all the answers?

          Fair point, I should have been a little more objective and understanding in my responses. Either way, I'm going to lodge a case with QCAT and I'll let everyone know how it goes. Having an expensive but extremely capable (when working) laptop as a doorstop is somewhat annoying.

          • happydude on 18/12/2024 - 20:29
            +1

            @gyrex: Frankly I think it is a 50:50 and you would be better off sending it to Paul Daniels (as featured on the the Rossman Repair Channel) - https://pldaniels.com/repairs/

            Yeah, it's the principle and all, but if the independent repair is about $300 you'll get it back sooner and save a heap of time.

  • coffeeinmyveins on 18/12/2024 - 15:34
    +3

    I'm of the opinion that a laptop of this price should last for longer than 5 years.
    Sure, if I'd bought a $1500-$2000 laptop, I'd understand that I'd be barking up the wrong tree

    you're confusing the cost you spec'd a laptop to with how long it should last.

    A base model care may cost $30k, and a fully spec'd one may be double that.

    It doesn't mean the fully optioned out one should "last longeR" as a result

    5 years for an apple product is pretty good.

    you're expecting that higher spec such as ram should magically last longer, just because? lol

    • watwatwat on 19/12/2024 - 11:04
      -1

      It doesn't mean the fully optioned out one should "last longeR" as a result

      Actually in Australia, it does kinda mean that.

  • snapper17 on 18/12/2024 - 15:50

    5-6 years is a good time frame

    Even if they fixed it I’m not sure if you could run the latest software version

    There were some sales on the new MacBooks and you can also use discounted gift cards to buy a new one.

    The new one will also give you access to Apple ai ect.

  • trustnoone on 18/12/2024 - 15:57
    +1

    For me its a hard one, I'd say it can go either way to be honest, FWIW I don't like your chances too much, but I certainly can see why you'd want to see others opinion as at least for me its not super clear cut considering cost and type of device. If it was like 4 years I think it would've been an easier argument.

  • rambutann on 18/12/2024 - 16:19
    +4

    Yeah you're gonna have a bad time on that one.

    I have succeeded in this exact scenario twice… same computer, same problem. Gotta love Apple.
    Mine was in the 2-3 year mark, they claimed its out of warranty, pulled the ACL argument on them, after a bit of back and forth I got it done.

    Highly doubt you'd win at the 5-6 year mark.

  • Geoff-bargain on 18/12/2024 - 16:21
    +1

    Please post back what your result is with QCAT - I've been to NCAT (the NSW one) and found them fair.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 20:15

      Will do.

  • brokie on 18/12/2024 - 17:54
    +1

    The cheapest MacBook pro listed on the Apple website right now is $2,499 and the most expensive one I could spec out came to $11,529. If the cheaper MBP lasts 5-6 years, how long do you expect the 11k one to last?
    More ram, more storage and a different processor doesn't really change things much here I think.

    • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 20:17

      The cost of a base 15" Macbook pro has come down quite a lot from when I bought it. As I mentioned earlier, I bought a base model but upgraded the RAM for a couple of hundred bucks at the time.

  • trapper on 18/12/2024 - 19:18
    +1

    Price is a consideration on how long things should last under the ACL.

    So ignore all these people saying it doesn't matter.

    • Ynk on 18/12/2024 - 19:33

      It is a consideration however it's nuanced the legislation section 54(3)(b) references the price if relevant. What they mean by that is comparing two items with the same functionality/capabilities in terms of price. What it doesn't allow for is what some have pointed out above is to spec up a 2k laptop to 11k and then claim the price means it should be lasting 10 years. Or put another way my Rolls Royce shouldn't last much longer than my Camry.

      • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 20:20

        I agree with your explanation but I didn't spec up this macbook pro to the extreme. I just checked and a base model 15" MBP was $3.5k at the time - https://imgur.com/a/7vXi5e9

        • Ynk on 18/12/2024 - 20:35

          Sure, appreciate that, my comments were more general than specifically related to your case and just highlighting how the cost doesn't always directly relate to the time period. I'm not saying it's not worth a shot, I would always say go for it (unless the costs are high to go down that path) just highlighting that it's not a slam dunk win so don't be too disappointed if it doesn't end up going how you hope but I do wish you a win!

          • gyrex on 18/12/2024 - 20:40
            +1

            @Ynk: I understand and thanks for the best wishes! It was only $150 to lodge a case and in my opinion, it's a small price to pay to have a crack at getting it fixed. I'm not paying $1200 or whatever the estimated cost was to fix it when you can buy a brand new laptop for not much more.

  • holdenmg on 18/12/2024 - 20:28
    +2

    Have a look at:
    https://www.zoorepairs.com.au/macbook-pro-logic-boards/ for a cost effective repair

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