AMP Saver Account Introducing a Balance Increase Requirement from 1st February 2025

Ave Maria on 09/12/2024 - 20:54
Last edited 10/12/2024 - 17:06 by 1 other user

From 1st February 2025 the AMP Saver replaces the $1000 deposit requirement that could be easily met by moving funds between the Saver & Access accounts.

"Instead of the current requirement to deposit $1,000 or more each month, you’ll just need to grow your account balance by $250 or more each month."

Full details at https://www.amp.com.au/amp-saver-changes

The only benefit associated with this change, for those not making withdrawals to pay for living expenses and able to increase the balance (on top of interest earned), is that the upper limit for earning the bonus has increased to $500K.

AMP Saver with an interest rate of 5.20%, was favoured over other saving accounts because of not having to increase the balance each month. Not any more.
At a time when everyone is doing it tough, and "feeling the strain" in the AMP owns words in an unrelated Facebook post, AMP is counting on more savers failing to meet the bonus criteria.

It is all about greed and maximising profits. Nothing about customer care.

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Comments

- - - - Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 15:35
        
        @Mad Max: I spend too much time already asking ING why they did not approve my credit card application (when they asked me to apply) or why my Term Deposits dissappeared after maturing with no evidence they ever existed, or why they did not honour their email campaign promotion I clearly qualified for. Once you engage with them it is a never ending message exchange with nothing achieved in the end. I will simply move money out tomorrow. If problem is fixed later on I may consider moving it back if I can be bothered to do that. You can only talk to and reason with a bank with good customer service and attituded. ING ain't that at all.
        
        Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 15:41
        
        @Ave Maria: That's a shocking report card for ING!
        I have not had problems that I can recall.
        As usual if everything goes smooth without havin to interact with a human at the bank, all is good.
        As soon ad you have to interact, you find out how good the bank really is.
        Trouble is that they are all the same!
        Edit: I found it often depends from the human at the bank you interact with…
        
        Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 15:49
        
        @Ave Maria: I would have to agree 100% with this as it sounds like I could have written it about my own experience with ING. They invited me to apply for an Orange One card too and then when I did complying with all thier minimum requirements and being a continuous customer of their's since Sep 2000 (more than 24 years!) and having not one but two mortgages with them with perfect unblemished payment records for more than a decade on both, they rejected me. No explanation, nothing at all. ING are very similar to Macquarie Bank in fact in that they have no branches, you can never talk to someone face to face and they are answerable to no-one. They set the rules and those rules are the only ones they will ever consider. There is no common sense, no human to human interaction, no compassion, no understanding, no relaxation of the rules whatsoever with ING. It's their way or no way at all. Just like with Macquarie, they hide behind messages and will do everything they can to delay, deny & defend to an extreme that you can scarcely believe until you get caught in it. God help anyone who ends up with a locked account be either Macquarie or ING because the fight you will have to have will sap you of the will to go on living.
      - Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 15:49
        
        @Mad Max: Something has happened - but not good - it now shows as MAX3 selected for January - when I just selected it earlier for February - so it is all messed up still and depending on what time you look and how badly their system is messed up in terms of updates you see very confusing info
        
        I will wait until tomorrow for more clarity - not I am not calling ING (there is no point)
        
        Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 16:01
        
        @Ave Maria: Just as a hindsight, considering these changes, I guess it would have been better to select the new account later in the day, like now. That way it would have probably been ok. Not good to be so prompt and do it in the morning!
        
        Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 16:23
        
        @Mad Max: Yes - but I did it well after noon and it was clearly stating that I am nominating the account to receive the interest in February - how it ended up now showing as Max 3 selected for both Jan/Feb, when earlier it was showing Max 1 for January (instead of Max 2 as done last month) is a mystery to have an answer for tomorrow. I will not worry about it for now and sort it out tomorrow (hopefully auto-resolved & no further action required). ING works in mysterious ways.
        
        Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 16:30
        
        @Ave Maria: There goes my theory!
        I did it around 9am, but if you did it after noon…
        
        Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 16:42
        
        @Mad Max: I am hoping it wil auto-resolve overnight - otherwise I did send a secure message today about the January account nomination not refleced correctly & will wait for their response - If necessay I am prepared to move money out tomorrow to BOQ at least until it gets resolved.
        
        Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 17:28
        
        @Ave Maria: I don't think it will auto resolve.
        I actually think it is because we switched bonus account before they fixed the glitch, which was fixed about 2pm.
        So even yours done at noon was still within glitch time.
        
        Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 18:11
        
        @Mad Max: All of which perfectly encapsulates and proves my point that all your messing about with 3 accounts is way too complicated and risky to be bothered with and not worth the cents loss each month by just doing the minimal shuffle out to an external account instead paying just fractionally less interest for a day or two before sending it back in again. You are making yourselves vulnerable to processing timing delays at ING that you can have no knowledge of or control over.
        
        I don't normally get proved right so quickly, so thanks for doing so this time for me.
        
        Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 18:58
        
        @Mad Max: Based on posts on WP as well, this appears to be a widepsread problem. If you used more that one maximiser and switched to a different one for January then that selection is lost. The Nominated account is either the one from December (before the afternoon update) or the one selected for February (after the update). ING will have to fix the nominated account for January on request. If not fixed tomorrow send them a secure message asking them to change the moninated account for January. I do not see how they can refuse based on the number of savers affected today.
        
        Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 19:09
        
        +1
        
        @Ave Maria: You are correct, but the fact is that the affected people are really only the ones that run a 3 accounts rotation. And that is not going to attract much help from ING.
        It is a huge pita!
        Every month there is a problem with one of the accounts/banks or they change the rules after you had it all worked out (latest is AMP)!
        After this ING will realise the 3 accounts job and change the rules. They don't even understand their own rules anyway!
        May be the answer is to buy a few lingots of gold set and forget.
        
        Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 19:22
        
        +1
        
        @Mad Max: The number of ING savers that do the 3 account rotation may not be inisginficant as other than UBANK only ING offers 5.5%
        
        An alternative solution would be to use an account with no requirements, high upper balance limit and be content with a lower rate.
        
        St George came close to that up to a couple of years ago, but then introduced the $249.99K limit and also reduced the interest rate. It is still an option, but the way they handle end of month and non business day processing is paifull.
        
        That really leaves Maquarie at 5% and a 1 Million balance and no requirements to meet. Some love it, some hate it -:)
        
        I will wait until tomorrow & see how it goes with ING
        
        Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 21:21
        
        @Ave Maria: No, the alternative is doing exactly what I've been saying all along. You operate just one SavMax and leave it nominated for the bonus interest and never change that. You make the nominated linked account to be an external account with an interest rate just fractionally lower than ING - BOQ is ideal for this now with them upping the interest rate to 5.15%. On the last trading day of each month you take out as much as you can whilst leaving enough in ING to still make the grow balance hoop and send it to BOQ. After the change of month and interest added to ING you send enough back to top it up to 100K again for the next month. Doing this is vastly simpler and comparatively risk-free than what you're doing with 3 accounts, at the cost of literally cents of interest each month. I've lost $1.76 in interest today by doing this. Literally $1.76. People like to use the cost of coffee as a measure of what they regard as a trivial amount of money. Where can you buy a take out coffee today for $1.76? I gonna bet nowhere.
        
        Compare that to what you're now faced with. I've lost $1.76, while you're going to spend the majority of January arguing with a disinterested ING CSR playing messaging tennis trying to not enlighten them to how you're gaming their system so you don't get completely debanked for engaging in such a convoluted loophole emploitation scheme that you're in very real risk of being told you're using their system contrary to the spirit in which it has been intended.
        
        Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 21:48
        
        @Legoman: I used to do that with ME Bank until they removed the balance increase requirement. There is 2 ways of doing this, no argument there, but for me having to do transfers from/to external accounts at end/beginning of month is not an attractive option (it may be for you). Everything works until it does not, and BOQ is not exatly a very reliable bank tending to break down at each month's end -:). I prefer to do all transfers (i.e. interest out) just once a month for all of my savings accounts to just one account (that is still AMP for now) and minimise transfers between banks. For that reason, the 3 account option worked well for me for ING - it has for 2 years with no glitches. I do not intent to spend too much time or arguing with ING. I already send them a message indicating that the nominated account for January is not what I selected in December and asked them to fix it if not auto-resolved tomorrow. If they refuse to fix it, then I do not want to bank with them anymore (simples). Accounts that require a balance increase are as bad as accounts that require zero withdrawals. We got ME Bank moving to the good banks side (BOQ, UBANK, GSB with no balance increase) only for AMP to move over to the likes of ING and Rabobank that I only bank with for the higher interest rate while it is on offer.
        
        Other option is to keep the ING balance at say $90K and just add $1 on top of interest but that would not allow me to withdraw whenever I want.
        That would work for about 2 years before needing to take the money out and start over again.
        
        Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 23:22
        
        @Ave Maria: BOQ had a massive breakdown right on the end of month once which was caused by the failure of a Microsoft server in Sydney IIRC which just happened to be the one and only one server that was hosting all BOQ banking services. BOQ seemingly had no redundancy backup server, so they were basically crippled for 3 days. That said, it was a one off event and they acknowledged it and made amends by paying compensation. There was no fight about it required, and it hasn't happened again, so there's that. BOQ are useful because you can move stuff around willy nilly whenever you want within the BOQ ecosystem because all Virgin Money, ME Bank and BOQ systems are all on the same servers and all transfers between them are all instant regardless of weekends/public holidays. I for instance have today shuffled money around between all three and met all my monthly hoop requirements for all of them today despite it being a public holiday.
        
        Ave Maria on 02/01/2025 - 00:07
        
        @Legoman: We agree that the problem is ING. I saw on a WP post that someone called ING today. Response was that he/she will not get the max interest rate in January and that it will take 2 weeks to investigate if a case is raised. That is the usual ignorant & pathetic reply expected from ING customer service - I did not waste my time calling ING. I will raise my transfer limit for a day and transfer the entire balane out. First time doing that with ING so I hope it does work. It should go on the BECS system same day. If ING fixes the problem I may transfer back but I will not assume that they will. This way I will minimise losses to just one day.
        
        Legoman on 02/01/2025 - 01:57
        
        @Ave Maria: It's not just ING that handle customer complaints this badly, it's every single organisation/corporation these days! 'Computer says 'no'' is the only reponse a human being is allowed to give these days. No-one is allowed to think for themselves or offer any opinion of any kind or dare to use common sense. Straying outside even a single mm from their standard scripted responses is justification for instant dismissal, so you won't get any help from ING even if you were to actually get to speak to a real human being.
        
        You're also going to run into a world of frustration and pain trying to get $100K out in one transfer in one day if it's to anywhere other than your linked account. If your linked account is another internal ING account like an Orange Everyday, then I'm afraid you're stuffed. This is another good reason to have set your linked account as an external one instead of internal - it's your emergency exit strategy if/when ING suddenly change the rules with no warning or lower the interest rate or you make a mistake with the monthly hoops and need to exit quickly to earn interest elsewhere instead. The linked account is the only way you can send the entire balance in one transfer, so if your linked account is still within ING them I'm afraid you've created a gaol for yourself.
        
        Ave Maria on 02/01/2025 - 02:34
        
        @Legoman: In retrospect, yes I would have changed my Linked account from the Orange to my CBA account & would have done on a well planned exit but this was clearly an emergency (it takes ING a couple of days+ to change to an external linked account). I recently had 2 matured term deposits that landed in the CBA linked account just before 2:30pm same day on maturity date and I requested the linked CBA account well ahead of that. The reason of being up so late is that I did manage to take all my money out (hopefuly same day but if not I will bight the bullet and loose 2 days of interest instead of 2 (small price to pay to escape from ING). It should have been simple but it was anything but. First I utilised the $5K OSKO limit and took out just that imedialtely. Then for the remaining $95K I used the app to raise the limit at about 1am. Tried both app and online but event though I could clearly see the available daily limit now as $95K it would not let me transfer anything over $15K. So I just did that. Then I tried the remaining $80K and it let me do it with an additional SMS code verification (it makes you wonder what secure algorithm they are running right?). Despite ING giving a warning that it may take 1-2 business days (they always tell you that) a BECS transfer (several scheduled today) should be same day - if not tomorrow. ING took an extra 2 hours of my sleep time - so I hope it was worth it. I just could not risk leaving the money sitting in a 0.55% interest account hoping ING will rectify their glitch in an appropriate manner. They may still do, but that will be a story for another day.
        
        Legoman on 02/01/2025 - 11:40
        
        @Ave Maria: Banking at 1am to get out of a mess created by ING is not ideal. I'd wager that after this all washes out and you are able to figure it out, you'll have lost a lot more in interest than the $1.76 I did in shuffling my funds out to BOQ @ 5.15% on 31 Dec and back in again today 2 Jan. I also didn't have to stay up until 1am to do that.
        
        Ave Maria on 02/01/2025 - 12:46
        
        @Legoman: Good news is that the funds are received just after noon (as expected) via BECS (got on the early schedule). I used AMP for the quick exit from ING & may be moving to BOQ before the end of the month. So other than the reduced interest to 5.20% ($24.65 less for 30 days) I only lost $13.56 while the money was sitting in ING on the 1st Jan. Even if ING fixes the issue and nominate the correct account (unlikely) I do not think I am going back to ING. Your method works well for you. I did that for MEB for a while and I could not keep doing that month after month. I even used a spread-sheet to calculate how much to take out at the end of the month before putting it all back in on the 1st. I ended up leaving $90K in it and just adding $1 each month. Now that the balance increase is gone using MEB it is so much better. I wish ING followed the MEB example.
        
        Mad Max on 02/01/2025 - 13:46
        
        @Ave Maria: Well done.
        But to AMP only works if you were under $250k in AMP.
        I wonder how many million $ exited ING today.
        And I bet the idiots working there would be there scratching their heads why all that money rushed out all of the sudden!!!
        They don't even ubderstand how their own system works!!!
        
        Ave Maria on 02/01/2025 - 14:08
        
        @Mad Max: I had almost emptied AMP already due to the change of rules and I have BOQ empty as a backup. I went with AMP for now as the new rules do not kick in until February and beyond. I make sure I meet the criteria the month before for both AMP/BOQ in case I need to use these accounts for a quick exit from somewhere else (like ING -:)..
        
        Legoman on 02/01/2025 - 15:57
        
        @Mad Max: I think you're rather over-guesstimating just how many people are punishing themselves with this ridiculously overcomplicated tri-account shuffling exercise each month in order to bypass the account growth restriction. I think you'll find as a percentage it's an infinitesimally small proportion of their account holders who have the patience and spare time to do this nonsense and have been caught out. Most who want to game the restriction, will be doing so using much simpler methods which are far less subject to the risks of ING processing delays and BECS reconciliation timings.
        
        As a rule of thumb, if your banking methods are reliant upon trying to time what you think are reliable time of day intra-processing intervals of BECS transfers, then it's only a matter of time until you are caught out and your system breaks down. You might be able to time the intra-day BECS processing once, or even twice, but relying on it month in, month out is a mug's game you will inevitably lose sooner or later.
        
        Mad Max on 02/01/2025 - 16:11
        
        @Legoman: It takes me less thsn 5 minutes a month to do. First time you have to work it out and it took a bit longer. After the first time it is just an automatic process. This time it didn't work because of an ING glitch. It has always worked before.
        I reckon less risky (and also instantaneous transfer) to transfer internally in ING than sending out to another bank.
        ING system is not so bad to work out.
        It is just the people that work in ING that are useless.
        
        Legoman on 02/01/2025 - 17:47
        
        +1
        
        @Mad Max: Export out to a decent external account that BECS reconciles multiple times/day like the BOQ/ME/VM set or Macquarie Bank for example is also almost instant - between a few minutes at best to around 2 hours at worst - more than quick enough for the purpose, whilst at the same time acting as a convenient path out of the clutches of ING when the manure hits the fan (as has done this month). AMP is not a good choice for this because AMP only credits once per day and that's right at the end, so by the time you can actually access the funds, it's too late in the day to do anything else with it. You should always have a reliable and tested exit strategy from whatever bank you're with. Australian Banks are just so unreliable and untrustworthy these days, you just can't let yourself be trapped by any single one of them.
        
        This is why even though technically you can keep 100K in GSB and get the highest interest rate on all of it, I will never keep more than 30K in a GSB account, because they offer no way of transferring out more than 30K in a single day no matter what. That and when you do withdraw the first 30K, GSB fraud dept at Cuscal will flag that as "unusual activity" and immediately hold the transfer and lock your account and your online access entirely so you can't even log in to message them. Facing that 4 days in a row just to get your own money out is simply not worth the pain for any amount of interest.
        
        Ave Maria on 03/01/2025 - 16:17
        
        @Legoman: I agree on planning ahead the exit strategies -:)
        
        For example,
        
        Rabobank (that always drop rate same day) have an empty nominated linked account to transfer money out same day (initiate request before 6pm).
        
        Great Souther Bank, the $30K is not that bad as it can be raised with a phone call (and yes 2nd call may be necessary as they may block). They do give early advice so unless the drop is significant will do it over a number of days. Utilising an empty joint account allows $60K out of GSB per day ($30K from each account by doing a transfer to the joint account that does not affect the daily limit as it is treated as internal). Normally GSB will not block a transfer to a known account previously used but most likely they will to a new account.
        
        AMP - you may have confused them with St George. They actually do use the BECS system, so if credited after 6pm that is on the sending bank delaying sending the money over. I used AMP to make large transfers to/from CBA/GSB etc. and it has aways been instant from CBA. St George is the only bank that treats AMP transfers in a special way (overnight) as they cannot switch from OSCO to SCT even though both are NPP methods. St George is one of my accounts that I keep empty and will only use if I have no other choice.
        
        Ave Maria on 29/01/2025 - 16:27
        
        @Mad Max: So ING responded 30 days later !!!!
        
        "While I recognise, we have not met your expectations, ING has not made an error in your eligibility of the bonus interest rate for the month of January 2025. As such I respectfully decline your request for compensation."
        
        I appreciate this is not the outcome you were seeking and if an issue has not been resolved to your satisfaction, you can lodge a complaint with the Australian Financial Complaints Authority (AFCA)"
        
        Obviously, they ignored all the info I gave them, their own confirmation that I did nominate the correct account for January and got the above response from a lazy ING employee that waited until the last possible day to respond and did not check any facts.
        
        So easy to waste more of my time & AFCAs (I will not do that).
        
        I replied back stating pretty much "politely" what I said above, and ask them to escalate this with someone that will actualy check the facts and what has occured on the 1st of January. I asked for another complaint to be raised about how badly they handled my complaint stating that if they never admit to any mistakes and simply direct customers to the AFCA they will never improve their systems or customer service. If I end up being kicked out as a customer even better as I had enough of them. Simply incompetent.
        
        Mad Max on 30/01/2025 - 14:00
        
        @Ave Maria: I received a similar email, but in mine they credited me about $14 compensation for the bonus interest I missed out on, for the day the money was there before I shifted it out.
        No compensation for the loss of interest I incurred in the other lower interest account for the month, but that was never going to happen.
        They admitted that the bonus account selection change was due to a glitch in their system and because I selected a new account for the following month before the glitch was fixed.
        I actually hadn't even asked for compensation. Just lodged the complaint.
    - Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 15:14
      
      I would warn you about starting an argument with ING about this. You are clearly in breach of their nebulous "in the spirit of the offer" clause in their T&C's in going to this extreme with 3 accounts so you can shuffle funds around to avoid losing cents of interest. You are the one making this deliberately complicated for absolutely minimal gain and creating an enormous amount of extra work and statement reconciliation. Yes, ING are the ones who have set the playing field that created this mess, but you have taken loophole exploitation to an unnecessary extreme to get around it. If you start a fight with them, I would not be at all surprised if they decide you are just too difficult a customer to want to bother dealing with and they could just flat out debank you as an unwanted customer. ING have been known to do this citing nothing more than their "use of banking services outside the spirit in which they are offered" clause. Be careful would be my advice. ING are a prickly one a bit like Macquarie. As long as you play straight up and down by their rules only, you can generally be OK, but as soon as you start to take advantage, they lose their sense of humour very quickly indeed and without any warning.
      - Ave Maria on 03/01/2025 - 16:27
        
        +1
        
        @Legoman: The advantage of the 3 account method is to be able to take all (or whatever amount) money out and still qualify next month in one of the other 2 accounts for the remaining balance. ING rules as per Term and Conditions fully followed.
        
        Mad Max on 03/01/2025 - 17:06
        
        @Ave Maria:
        
        ING rules as per Term and Conditions fully followed.
        
        Problem is that the people working at ING do not understand their own rules.
        I ended up ringing them and I was passed from 1st call operator to supervisor to manager. 3 arrogant, ignorant, know it all females.
        None of them knew how it actually works!
        The supervisor read the rules to me to tell me that I was wrong until I asked her to read them again slowly while I explained to her what she was reading. Then she realised how stupid she was and instead of fixing it, she put me on to the manager. She also didn't understand the rules. I lodged a complaint. So possibly that could be the end of ING for me. Good riddance if that's the case. If not, money back on 1.2.25 hoping to never have to speak to anyone at ING again.
        I know, you both told me…
        
        Ave Maria on 03/01/2025 - 18:00
        
        @Mad Max: One of the ING officers that responded to my secure messages confirmed that I did nominate the correct maximiser for January on December 1st (they have a record of that). A case has been raised & I have to wait for ING to resolve it. I did ask for compensation for financial losses due to no fault of mine. I also asked them to do what ME Bank did (and ING used to be) and remove the balance increase requirement. Then Savers would be happy to just use one account and keep things simple. I would also rather not bank with ING if not for the higher interest rate (while it lasts).
        
        Mad Max on 03/01/2025 - 22:03
        
        @Ave Maria: Ok, so you may end up with no ING account too.
        The 3 women I spoke with all had the attitude that "the customer is always wrong" regardless of what has happened.
        They want people to increase their balance to qualify. They have rules, but they are not smart enough to work out that there are ways out of their rules.
        We followed their rules and somehow outsmarted them. They don't like customers that outsmart them, even if the customers were following the rules. You raising a case or me lodging a complaint will mean that they review the accounts and if the person doing the review is half smart they will understand what's going on. It is not difficult. Let's see what their next move is.
        
        Ave Maria on 03/01/2025 - 22:19
        
        @Mad Max: You get less drama just using secure messages. They take the time to read and understand before they reply. I did not get anyone contadicting what I present to them so lets wait and see how the compaint proces works.
        
        Legoman on 03/01/2025 - 23:02
        
        @Mad Max: Just remember they have that clause in their T&C's that says they can simply close your account entirely if they deem that you're not using the accounts in the spirit of the way they're being offered. It's deliberately nebulous for a reason, because it gives them an 'out' if they just can't be arsed dealing with difficult customers. ING can and do debank customers that take up what they regard as an unreasonable amount of their time to manage. If you don't care if that happens, then go right ahead and fight on, but if you think you would like to keep an ING account some time down the line, then it might be prudent to lay low and stop poking the bear. I have multiple ING accounts, but I know exactly how prickly they can be, so I don't ever use my ING accounts for day-to-day transactions, even though it's obvious that's exactly how they would like me to use them. Far too risky. I use ING as a quasi-term deposit account only and never touch it until forced to at the end of each month. You really don't wanna give ING any excuse to lock your account access, because when they do, getting it unlocked again is equally as difficult as Macquarie and GSB and UBank (who are collectively the world champions of unjustified account locks for no reason)
Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 15:42

+1

I am not arguing about not arguing with ING but the interest loss is not cents. Compared to a 5.15%/5% interest paying account (like BOQ/MBL) with no increase requirement it is $350/$500 a year. The shufling each month takes about a minute for me - so no big deal. If ING decides that is against their rules (it is not) the money will move somewhere else (their loss for making it so complicated = balance increase + 5 card transactions + $1K deposit to ING, to earn maximum interest each month).
- Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 15:47
  
  By letting it be, there is a loss of about $15 for the day the money has to stay there with no interest, plus the lower interest elsewhere for the whole month.
  - Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 15:51
    
    That is correct - but better to loose $15 for a day than an entire month
    - Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 15:54
      
      If you open a new saver, does that automatically qualify for the first month, given the $1000 transfer and the 5 transactions have occurred?
      - Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 16:27
        
        +1
        
        @Mad Max: NOPE - prequalification in previous month required. Only when you 1st open an account as a new customer you qualify automaticaly for the 1st 2 months (as far as I know)
        
        Mad Max on 09/01/2025 - 15:41
        
        @Ave Maria: I just noticed I now can no longer transfer funds between my 3 Savings Maximisers like I did up until now
        Just wondering if they have done the same to your Saving Maximisers .
        I did change the linked account in one of my Saving Maximisers to get the money back in quicker in February, and that was easy. But now each Saving Maximiser can only send and receive money from the linked account (other bank).
        
        Legoman on 09/01/2025 - 17:44
        
        @Mad Max: That's normal. You can only transfer money out to the linked account, but in from anywhere. If the linked account is an external account as opposed to an Orange Everyday account, then you can only transfer money from SavMax to SavMax via that linked account be it an internal OE account or the nominated external account. Obviously it will be a lot quicker to transfer via an internal OE, but you lose a lot of control by not nominating an external account instead.
        
        I have two Savings Maximisers too - 1 x used, 1 x unused, but even when specifying an internal transfer, if I select one of the Savings Maximisers to transfer from, there are no options to choose a destination for other than the linked account. If you've previously been able to transfer directly to/from multiple Savings Maximisers, then that's the aberation. Sounds like they've just realised the mistake/loophole they had in place and closed it for you.
        
        Mad Max on 09/01/2025 - 18:11
        
        @Legoman: I was able to transfer between Savings Maximisers, but all 3 Savings Maximisers were linked to the same external bank account.
        Now 1 of them is linked to a different external bank account. That may be why. Or it could be that they are looking into the 3 accounts rotation and they sought to stop it by removing the ability to transfer between Savings Maximisers.
        If you have your Savings Maximiser linked to OE account, doesn't that limit your transfers out of ING, because OE limits are: $5k immediate via OSKO, or max. $20k same day. More than $20k you have to ring them. With the Savings Maximiser linked to an external bank account you can transfer in or out $100k in one go without ringing them.
        
        Legoman on 10/01/2025 - 12:54
        
        -1
        
        @Mad Max: It is really odd that you were ever allowed to transfer directly between Maximisers. That should not have been the case at all and I think perhaps by complaining, you've alerted them to this leak and they've now closed it. Maximisers are normally only ever able to be withdrawn from via the linked account (whatever that is - OE or external account). I have never seen the option of selecting anything other than the linked account to withdraw to when selecting the Maximiser as the source account. It makes a joke of the destination account drop down selection box when you have a choice of exactly one account.
        
        Yes, your other comment about the restrictive reason for NOT choosing the OE as your linked account is perfectly valid. While the OE is instant for the transfer, you're then stuck having to call them and authenticate yourself a thousand times to verify that you're sure you know what you're doing before they'll allow you to withdraw your own money in one transfer, otherwise you're stuck doing it over 5 days and then having to fight with them when they inevitably lock your account for suspicious activity as 20K withdraws on 5 consecutive days will definitely look. This is a very good reason for nominating a reliable external account instead like Macquarie or BOQ.
        
        Ave Maria on 09/01/2025 - 19:44
        
        @Mad Max: I use the Orange Everyday as the linked account and I can freely transfer money between all 4 of my accounts. It must be because you now have an external linked account.
        
        Mad Max on 09/01/2025 - 20:28
        
        @Ave Maria: Are you able to transfer out the whole $100k from the Orange Everyday if required?
        
        Ave Maria on 09/01/2025 - 22:08
        
        @Mad Max: Just use the app to do the temp daily limit increase to match your balance. You may be asked to verify the transfer out via SMS code. The funds are received same day if done early in the morning via BECS. Once the limit is increased you can do the transfer either via the app or via online.
        
        Mad Max on 09/01/2025 - 22:49
        
        @Ave Maria: I thought the maximum transfer out of the Orange Everyday was $20K. So in the app you can increase the daily limit to $100k?
        
        Ave Maria on 10/01/2025 - 23:21
        
        @Mad Max: The info is on the ING website if you search for Daily limits. From Online you can only increase the daily limit to $20K, from the app you can increase to whatever your balance is (there is no max). Once you make the change in the app then it is effective from both app & online. I can only guess that ING considers the change from the app more secure than making it from online (it makes no sense to me) -:)
        
        https://helphub.ing.com.au/how-to/how-to-change-my-pay-anyon…
        
        Legoman on 10/01/2025 - 12:58
        
        -1
        
        @Ave Maria: If I were you I wouldn't draw attention to this nor change any of your banking settings, because this is definitely not how the Maximisers are supposed to work. You've somehow lucked into non-standard setting in ING Banking they haven't picked up on yet, which most customers don't have access to exploiting.
        
        Mad Max on 10/01/2025 - 14:52
        
        @Legoman: If you have the OE as linked account to all 3 SM you are able to transfer easy betwen them. Worse thing is that you have to go through the OE, but it is still immediate.
        I think Ave Maria said that you can transfer up to $100k out from the OE from the app just rising your limit in the app. Not sure if I understood correctly.
        
        Legoman on 10/01/2025 - 15:20
        
        -1
        
        @Mad Max: I get that you can go Max<->OE<->Max if the OE is the nominated linked account to the Max, but you've been talking about going Max<->Max directly and that's NOT supposed to be possible. I haven't tried, but I don't believe you can nominate another Max as the linked account for a first Max. If that's even possible, then that would be the only way you should be able to transfer directly Max<->Max (and it would be utterly pointless)
        
        Ave Maria on 10/01/2025 - 23:28
        
        @Legoman: Well, for something that is not possible I have been doing it for the past 2 years. I only ever used the single OE as the linked account to my 3 Maximisers and I have been freely transferring $$$ using the internal transfer option between them. I do it every month cycling $100K & $1 between the 3 on the first of each month. I only move the interest to the OE so it can be paid out but that is the only restriction and a non issue for me.
        
        Ave Maria on 10/01/2025 - 23:30
        
        @Mad Max: That is correct and that is what I did on the 2nd of January. I transferred all $100K at once same day.
  - Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 16:03
    
    You don't take out the whole amount and you don't take it out for the whole month either. You take out an amount that is just less than the amount required to satisfy the growth requirement. So if the balance after interest on 1 Dec was 6578.99, then on 31 Dec you take out $93421 only, leaving 6579 in ING thus satisfying the growth hoop. 6579 > 6578.99. You then transfer that out to another account to earn 5.15% for two days (in this case right now on NYD) and then put it straight back in again on 2 Jan, thus limiting the loss to only two days at the lower interest rate and only for the portion of the 100K funds actually being moved, which in this example is $93421, not 100K. This loss is further reduced by the fact the remaining $6579 goes on still earning the ING 5.5% rate. Doing this is vastly less work and results in a truly trivial loss measured in the cents for a single month and maybe as much as $15 over an entire year.
- Legoman on 01/01/2025 - 15:54
  
  I've shown my calculations using a BOQ account to shuffle the funds out to and back in again for this month right now (today) and the loss of 5.15% for two days vs 5.5% in ING is $1.76. You now show me how 12 x $1.76 comes out to $350/yr. I'll be interested in your workings.
  - Ave Maria on 01/01/2025 - 16:35
    
    That was on the assumption that you do not come back to ING and use another bank.
    
    The $350/$500 was the lesser interest earned if using BOQ/MBL instead of ING for a year.
    
    You stand to loose a days interest today, if issue is not resolved, as you can only move out the bulk of the money tomorrow & only get .55% at the base rate.
    The lost interest for $100K for one day left in ING is $100K x (4.95%) = $13.56
Mad Max on 01/01/2025 - 22:53

Do you guys know how long it takes to change the ING linked bank account? I found how to do it in the online banking, but no mention if it is immediate or not.
- Legoman on 02/01/2025 - 11:36
  
  It is definitely NOT immediate. The process takes a few days. It involves moving funds around, waiting for them to arrive with a transfer code, then delivering the transfer code back to ING as confirmation, then waiting for ING to manually make the change on your behalf etc. All that crap. It's made deliberately painful and slow I suspect in order to discourage people quickly and frequently changing linked account all the time to take advantage of loopholes. It is definitely something you need to do well in advance. It's best to think long and hard about all the potential pitfalls you may encounter and choose a linked account that can be an emergency exit for you when the excrement hits the fan - as it inevitably will do.
Ave Maria on 17/01/2025 - 22:37

Some carification from the AMP Web site - basically the last day to move money out of AMP without any consequences is Friday 31st January.

"Up to 31 January 2025, the current criteria still applies, and you’ll continue to qualify for bonus interest if you deposit $1000 or more each month. From 1 February 2025, instead of needing to deposit $1,000 or more each month, you’ll just need to grow your account balance by $250 (excluding interest) or more each month to qualify for your monthly bonus. For example, if you deposit $1000 in January, you will be earning the bonus interest in February. This interest will be paid out in March. In February, you will need to grow your balance by $250 (excluding interest) or more by the end of the month to qualify for the bonus interest to be applied in March. This interest will be paid out in April."
- Legoman on 17/01/2025 - 22:51
  
  Thank you for the clarification. I will begin the out/in shuffle to a BOQ Smart Saver (5.15%) on that Friday in this case and wear the 0.05% loss in interest over the 3 days of the weekend (Fri-Sun). I'm sure I can handle the loss of 0.05% interest for 3 days without having a stroke.
- Mad Max on 18/01/2025 - 10:03
  
  The problem is where else to put the money with at least equal interest rate. Or leave the whole balance there and treat it as a 1 month term deposit. Then money out on the 1st of the month if you are going to need any of it.
  AMP now has a 5.15%, 6 months term deposit. I noticed more term deposits offers and slightly higher.
  I think the AMP one is currently the best available for 6 months.
  - Ave Maria on 18/01/2025 - 13:15
    
    1st of month out will have to wait until 1st April or 1st of May as until then 1st is not a business day. I will be using BOQ @5.15% as it has no increase requirement and large transfers out are easy through the app. Other short term options are special offers from Defence Bank, iSaver @5.4% for 6 months or BankWest @5.35% for 4 months both up to $250K with no increase requirements. BankWest is easier to take money out at a $50K dailiy limit over 5 days. Defence is $20K daily limit.
    - Legoman on 18/01/2025 - 14:30
      
      Defence also insist on dodgy crypto-currency broker sign-up holding your passport while taking a selfie photo nonsense, which I won't do. They also have branches primarily located on defence bases which will require an all-day exercise to access if you want to do the alternative and open the account in person face-to-face. Basically, Defence Bank make it intolerably hard to bank with them unless you are actually employed by Defence. Jumping all their hoops for a measely 5bp of extra interest, frankly is a pain I can't be bothered with.
    - Mad Max on 18/01/2025 - 14:53
      
      I looked at the BankWest 5.35%, but the short 4 month honeymoon period makes it not worth to open an extra account (with all the associated hassle) for just $125 extra over the 4 months compared to AMP's 5.2%.
      Defence Bank, I haven't looked into, but from Legoman comment below, I think I will give it a miss.
      I am keeping an eye on 6 months TD. Anything better than 5.2% would be good.
      - Legoman on 18/01/2025 - 15:25
        
        @Mad Max: Bankwest are another in the photo selfie with a phone brigade nonsense for sign-up. And they've closed all their branches too, so in-person is not an option there either.
        
        Mad Max on 18/01/2025 - 15:37
        
        +1
        
        @Legoman: They all want to have as much info about you as they possibly can, even to hold YOUR money. Photo selfie included for good measure!!!
        Then when they get hacked they think that just a "sorry" is enough for everyone to be happy.
    - finbar on 18/01/2025 - 15:51
      
      Why does the money need to come out on the first of the month ?
      - Ave Maria on 18/01/2025 - 16:31
        
        @finbar: Unless you intent to keep increasing the balance each month, that is the only time you can take it all out without interest loss. Any days in a month with no balance increase will only get you 1%.
        
        finbar on 18/01/2025 - 17:05
        
        +1
        
        @Ave Maria: Doesn't work that way. Read the terms and conditions. You'll find that if you meet their conditions in the previous month you then get bonus interest for the entire current month. If you withdraw money during the current month on any day you still get bonus interest on the remaining balance for the rest of the month. You're free to move the money out any pace you want but has to be completed by the end of the current month. You won't get bonus interest for the following month tho. It doesn't have to be on the first of the month.
        
        Mad Max on 18/01/2025 - 18:08
        
        @finbar: You are right. Thank you finbar.
        That makes it much easier then.
        If during a month, at any stage, you need to withdraw money and/or cannot grow the balance by $250, then you should witdraw the whole balance any day before the last business day of that month, because you are not going to get the bonus interest the following month.
        The money you had in the account for the month still earns the bonus (calculated on daily balance and paid monthly).
        
        Ave Maria on 18/01/2025 - 23:53
        
        @finbar: Yes - you are correct (if only all banks had the same simple rules = no rules)
      - Legoman on 18/01/2025 - 17:18
        
        @finbar: It doesn't. It needs to come out on the last day of the month (leaving enough behind to satisfy the growth hoop). Then you put it all back in again on the 1st of the month (or as close to it as you can get excluding weekends/holidays etc). Doing this gives you the headroom you need to keep increasing the balance every month without ever exceeding the max 500K balance holding
        
        finbar on 18/01/2025 - 17:31
        
        +1
        
        @Legoman: On the month you require to withdraw funds you.can withdraw anytime and then move the remaining balance out before the end of the current month and not lose bonus interest.
        
        I was responding to Mad Max comment
        "Then money out on the 1st of the month if you are going to need any of it."
        
        Legoman on 18/01/2025 - 17:38
        
        @finbar: My way is simpler and results in a truly trivial interest loss for a maximum of 3 days worst case depending on weekends/holidays. Doing the end of month out/in shuffle each month means constantly maintaining a trivial balance growth requirement to 'beat' each month typically in the hundreds of $$ or very low thousands $$$ which does not ever mean being without maximum funds in the highest earning account for an entire month - which results in a less than trivial interest loss. It requires a little bit of work moving funds out on the last day of the month and then the same work again in reverse direction back in again on the first day of the following month. Exactly the same process everyone should already be doing for ING Saving Maximiser. No different.
        
        finbar on 18/01/2025 - 17:46
        
        +2
        
        @Legoman: It's for each person to decide which way is best for them.
        
        I'm simply pointing out that if someone needs to withdraw money from AMP and not lose bonus interest then it doesn't need to be done on the first of the month.
        
        Legoman on 18/01/2025 - 17:53
        
        @finbar: That's entirely true. There is nothing special about the first of the month. That only applies to accounts with a 'no withdrawals' hoop, which does not apply to AMP - looking at you Hiver / Australian Unity / Move / Defence Bank / RACQ / easystreet / Bank Australia / IMB - anyone with money in any of these banks needs to have a seriously good long hard look at themselves in a mirror!
        
        finbar on 18/01/2025 - 18:00
        
        @Legoman: Yeah agreed. I avoid those "no withdrawals" accounts coz ya never know when ya might require an emergency withdrawal.
Ave Maria on 23/01/2025 - 23:16

+1

I got this info from existing AMP customers that have a Cash Manager account, posting on WP (they received an email so info is not published anywhere else yet).

The AMP Cash Manager Account ongoing variable interest rate is increasing to 5.00% from 4.80% pa effective from 29 January 2025 for balances between $10,000.01 – $250,000. You must have at least $10K in it to earn interest and it drops significantly if you go over $250K. So only useful for balances between $10K and $250K.

The CM account can be used to easily move money out of the AMP saver on the last day of each month (leaving enough to qualify for the bonus next month) and back in on the 1st. Just an alternate option to moving money to an external account, if it suits.
- finbar on 25/01/2025 - 01:20
  
  +1
  
  Yeah that's a good option. Another option is … If you just add $250 a month to the Saver account and then one day there's an emergency and you need some of the money. Withdraw the required money. Then move the remaining balance over to the Cash Manager on the last day of the month. Then on the last day of the following month deposit $250 into the Saver and then on the next day the balance of the CM can be returned to the Saver account and you'll earn 5.2% again. So effectively you'll earn 5% for one month whenever a withdrawal is required and can't be returned before the end of the month. On a balance of say $120k that would equate to earning $20 less interest for the month. This might be suitable for cases where there's only a small chance that an emergency withdrawal might be required.
- Mad Max on 30/01/2025 - 14:08
  
  AMP Cash Manager now showing 5%.
  Are you going to transfer funds on the 31st?
  I am thinking to just leave the funds in AMP Saver all the time and keep adding $250 to qualify.
  In the unlikely event that 1 month I need to withdraw and cannot increase balance by $250 before end of the month, then I will open a CM and on last day of the month and transfer the money there for the month, or elsewhere if better than 5% is available. Just easier.
  - finbar on 30/01/2025 - 14:48
    
    Yeah I agree that's a much easier option.
Ave Maria on 30/01/2025 - 23:26

Nor right now. I will keep adding my salary to AMP and not worry too much about the increase requirement.
As you said if I need to, I can open the CMA. -:) with plenty of time to move money around as the current month is always prequalified.

February will be interesting, as if the RBA decides on an interest rate drop banks may start dropping rates immediately, so best to leave the money where it can be easily moved out at the moment. AMP is certainly good on letting you take your money out with no much fuss (up to $250 per day).

The response I got from ING was very dissapointing, as it is obvious they are unable to investigate anything or willing to put the required effort to do so.
I will wait for the follow up reply (it can take up to 30 days) and then contact their customer advocate (yes they have one but they do not advertise) before going to the AFCA (something that I am not keen to do - too much effort for the $40 I lost & all they had to compensate me with). They are just lazy & pretty much cases are not investigated consistently (depends who your case lands with). I will put back the $100K just for the 5.5% on the first via OSKO from St George. I have done it before same amount on a Saturday with no issues (yes they allow $100K OSKO - with no holds)

Basically the order of contacting ING for complaints is

[email protected]
[email protected]
- Mad Max on 31/01/2025 - 09:21
  
  $100k Osko from StGeorge to ING on a Saturday seems risky. If anything goes wrong you won't see the funds in ING before Monday evening or Tuesday morning.
  Possibly better to do it on Monday. The loss due to reduced interest for a couple of days is only about $2.
  - Ave Maria on 31/01/2025 - 10:08
    
    St George is only problematic on Sundays. Saturdays is business as usual, especiallly for OSKO. They have been reliable on past $100K transfers and I did one $100K to ING from St George on a Saturday before so I am not worried. If they delay an OSKO payment it is still sitting in ST George earning interest until they release the payment so no problem. If it was BECS yes I would not do it for sure. The only thing to be careful is to do the payment by first transferring into the Freedom account as otherwise the payment will not be OSKO.
    - Mad Max on 31/01/2025 - 11:40
      
      If they delay an OSKO payment it is still sitting in ST George earning interest until they release the payment so no problem
      
      The only thing to be careful is to do the payment by first transferring into the Freedom account as otherwise the payment will not be OSKO.
      
      But it doesn't earn interest in the Freedom.
      
      I linked the ING SM to a dedicated new StG Incentive so I will do as direct debit from ING platform on Saturday. If ING takes the money from the StG Incentive on Saturday it's good (don't think so though). If not it will happen on Monday, but it will stay and earn bonus interest in StG Incentive until then as long as I leave at least $50 in the StG Incentive until the end of February.
    - Mad Max on 01/02/2025 - 13:34
      
      @Ave Maria
      Did you end up doing the Osko transfer from StG Freedom acc to ING SM acc?
      Did it work with immediate transfer?
      - Ave Maria on 01/02/2025 - 13:53
        
        @Mad Max: Yes, I have done the same 5 times in the past for $100K and 3 on Saturday. OSKO is instant any day (except to AMP).
        I send the $100K I took out to AMP on the 2nd January to St George on the 31st as a scheduled payment - went at 7:30am. Showed up at 3am on the 1st February and instantly send back to ING. All back to being normal now. I have not changed my nominated account for March yet to avoid a repeat of the same issue. Will not do so until ING looks normal & no issues reported -:)
        
        The only issues with St George are listed below, from my own experience
        
        all payments to AMP are treated an non OSKO as, unlike other banks, St George does not recognise that AMP can receive fast payments in (ME Bank also has the same issue as St George).
        
        BECS payments to St George, if done on time to be on one of the daily BECS scheduled times, do not show until about 3am next day (but credited same day)
        
        Internal transfers between St George accounts if done on a Sunday at the end of the month are credited next day (that can realy mess up end of month planning, like account flipping and meeting conditions).
        
        Mad Max on 01/02/2025 - 13:54
        
        @Ave Maria: Can you dm me please? I cannot dm you.
        
        Ave Maria on 01/02/2025 - 13:59
        
        +1
        
        @Mad Max: I will try
        
        Mad Max on 01/02/2025 - 14:01
        
        @Ave Maria: I think you may have private messages disallowed in your settings.
        
        Ave Maria on 01/02/2025 - 14:03
        
        @Mad Max: I just turned it on
        
        finbar on 01/02/2025 - 16:44
        
        @Ave Maria: You say St George does not recognise that AMP can receive fast payments in
        
        Is it possible that it's AMP that's the issue and they're possibly not accepting osko payments from St G ? Or could it be an NPP issue ? Or does the fault definitely lie with St G ?
        
        Ave Maria on 01/02/2025 - 19:58
        
        @finbar: No St George is the issue and always has been - AMP uses the NPP services as it and does not put a block on any consumer.
        You can check the St George payment record and clearly see that the payment is not send via OSKO.
        
        AMP can receive OSKO payments from anyone and also make fast payments out using SCT (like Macquarie does) up to $5K per day
        
        CBA, ING, YOU, GSB, MBL all do instant OSKO to AMP via NPP and are all instant (not near real time)
        
        St George - all payments to AMP are send via BECS
        
        ME Bank also treats AMP like St George and sends payments via BECS
        
        If you try to send $100K from St George to AMP on a Saturday, believing that it will go via OSKO then you will loose at least 2 days
        of interest having to wait until the next business day to receive funds (and very late in the day at that).
        
        St George to CBA/ING/MEB/BOQ/MBL/GSB anyone but AMP will be instant OSKO
        
        finbar on 01/02/2025 - 20:45
        
        @Ave Maria: There is an obvious miscommunication between StG and Macquarie systems but how do you know for sure the blame lies with StG and not Macquarie or NPP ?
        
        Ave Maria on 02/02/2025 - 03:49
        
        @finbar: if an Osko payment is send to a non OSKO bank, it should be automatically converted into SCT if supported by the receiving bank.
        Otherwise a normal transfer takes place, e.g. BECS.
        
        St George does not support switching an OSKO payment to SCT (in other words does not support SCT).
        
        What fails for St George, works for CBA to AMP, ING to IMP, Ubank to AMP, HIVER to AMP, GSB to AMP, Macquarie to AMP and vice versa. AMP is happy to receive both OSKO and SCT transfers.
        
        finbar on 02/02/2025 - 11:34
        
        @Ave Maria: Well looking into this a bit more. StG don't claim to offer SCT outward. And AMP don't offer to accept Osko payments. So it's actually a situation where the two banks are incompatible for instant fast payments. I guess the blame can be shared equally between the two banks. You could say that maybe StG should offer SCT outward but you could also say maybe AMP should offer to accept Osko payments.
        
        "At this time, we’ve not enabled customers to send and receive payments using Osko"
        
        https://www.amp.com.au/personal-banking/ways-to-bank/new-pay…
- Mad Max on 31/01/2025 - 13:25
  
  February will be interesting, as if the RBA decides on an interest rate drop banks may start dropping rates immediately, so best to leave the money where it can be easily moved out at the moment. AMP is certainly good on letting you take your money out with no much fuss (up to $250 per day).
  
  I wonder if it would be the best time to get in the AMP 6 months TD at 5.15%. I would have already done it if it was 5.2%!
  - Ave Maria on 31/01/2025 - 15:02
    
    I got another response from ING Customers Complaints rejecting my case & again asking to contact the AFCA - in every reply they inadvertedly provide evidence that my claim is correct - :)
    
    I did give a lengthy reply but in summary what proves my case is stated below -:)
    
    In your latest response you stated that "the (January) nominated account for the Savings Maximiser bonus interest was changed (to Maximiser 3) through online banking on 01/01/2025".
    
    Nothing else is necessary to confirm the basis of my complaint.
    
    I did not nominate Maximiser 3 for January on January 1st (not possible). I correctly nominated Maximiser 2 for January on December 1st. The January nomination can only be done in December.

AMP Saver Account Introducing a Balance Increase Requirement from 1st February 2025

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