Would You Return an Accidental Double Refund?

Lcircular on 05/03/2023 - 22:48

I bought a product at store for $270. Decided I didn’t want the product and took it back to store for a refund.

They initiate a refund to my card, but the Internet cuts out half way through the process. Manager comes over and says we’ll give you the refund in cash since the card refund failed.

Cash is given, and surely enough, two days later $270 comes through to my bank account as a refund.

So now I’ve received two refunds for the same product.

It’s been a month since (I was overseas) and I haven’t heard anything from them, so I assume they have no idea.

I intend to return the extra money since I believe that’s the correct thing to do, but I’m curious to hear what others think. Bonus points for actually quoting any relevant laws and not just talking out of your ass.

Poll Options expired

  • 410
    Yes, I would return the extra refund
  • 70
    Yes, but only if they reach out to me about it
  • 91
    No, I would not return the extra refund
  • 9
    I’m undecided
  • 28
    I didn’t read the post but I feel inclined to vote anyway
General Discussion

Comments

  • Dumax on 05/03/2023 - 22:56
    +15

    Search "unjust enrichment".

    You should atleast make some attempt to return the money (which might be difficult since it seemingly happened a while ago), as many businesses may view your proposal with some suspicion. This would atleast demonstrate that you have acted in good faith once you realised the error (and where in a position to attempt to remedy it).

    • Daabido on 08/03/2023 - 13:15
      +3

      I would return the money, but no one is going to knock down your door in the dead of night, shouting "Freeze. Unjust enrichment!" So many people think that companies will take the time to sue you over such a piddly little amount. Some might if they want to waste thousands of dollars, others just write it off. Let your morality guide you, because that will be the only consequence here.

  • seanfoite on 05/03/2023 - 23:05
    +5

    Of course you should return the extra money.

  • Jimothy Wongingtons on 05/03/2023 - 23:10
    -1

    I cannot believe you need to come to a relatively anonymous forum to ask what to do.

    • Aureus on 06/03/2023 - 10:16
      +69

      It is pretty obvious what he should do.

      Buy more stuff. Return it. Activate WiFi jammer. Infinite money glitch.

    • eklipsils on 07/03/2023 - 16:15
      +14

      "I intend to return the extra money since I believe that’s the correct thing to do, but I’m curious to hear what others think"

      He isn't asking what he should do. He is asking what others think.

      • DingoBlue on 07/03/2023 - 20:40
        +6

        Receive one comprehension point.

      • Downfall on 08/03/2023 - 17:04
        +4

        "It’s been a month since (I was overseas) and I haven’t heard anything from them, so I assume they have no idea."

        He literally fled the country and hasn't paid back yet!

  • JimmyF on 05/03/2023 - 23:10
    +37

    but I’m curious to hear what others think

    Normally yes return it, but if this was Harvey Norman, then hell no! Gerry has enough money already.

    • OMGJL on 06/03/2023 - 00:29
      +2

      I hope a Harvey store employee comment to share to us wither they need to pay for their mistakes.

      • JimmyF on 06/03/2023 - 09:26
        +11

        Its illegal to force employees to 'cover' mistakes.

        • OMGJL on 06/03/2023 - 10:16

          Could you please share the source of this law?

          • Jolakot on 06/03/2023 - 13:33
            +7

            @OMGJL: https://www.fairwork.gov.au/pay-and-wages/deducting-pay-and-…

            Highly illegal, I'm sure it still happens at small businesses given how dodgy some employers are, but would not happen at somewhere like Harvey Norman

            • OMGJL on 06/03/2023 - 13:42

              @Jolakot: thanks for your link and wisdom, haven't been working in retails for ages and current job is not customer facing at all, but always good to know things has improved so much.

            • Sean8802 on 07/03/2023 - 19:03

              @Jolakot: Highly illegal but it doesn't stop BHP from invoicing employees for the bill if they break their laptops by accident.

    • Hasbulla on 09/03/2023 - 11:01
      +1

      Bang on.
      Your response should depend solely on business size and ethics.

  • MS Paint on 05/03/2023 - 23:17
    +17

    Bonus points for actually quoting any relevant laws and not just talking out of your ass.

    Then you have come to the wrong place to ask your question.

  • mmd on 05/03/2023 - 23:28
    +3

    Yes i would return.
    I worked in retail and the till would have been down when they reconcile at the end of the day. i.e money does not balance what the software shows.
    I dont think there's any law as such, but its for Karma.
    If

    It’s been a month since (I was overseas) and I haven’t heard anything from them

    I assume this is ia big chain as they have your contact details?

    -

    • Love a bargain on 06/03/2023 - 14:05

      The till would be balance on the day because they would have noted that a $270 cash refund was given.

      • Sleeqb7 on 07/03/2023 - 15:21

        Retail stores also balance eftpos transactions against the day's orders too.
        It would have been noticed on the day it happened, and they likely either didn't want to chase it up, or didn't have customer details to be able to.

        • Nebargains on 07/03/2023 - 19:14
          +2

          A lot of retailers don't manually balance EFT because it's typically integrated, so if the POS said it happened it happened. Or in this case it never happened because it sounds like the internet cut out and it never received a response from a bank. So for the store to reconcile it they would need access to bank stuff that they won't have access to (depending on size of retailer, the bigger the less likely)

          So sure the companies finance team probably reconcile this across a period of time for a store or company wide but they would be looking at huge sums of money and not concerned about a few hundred bucks.

          IMO if this is a big company it will simply be written off as a small discrepancy which would cost more to investigate than it's worth. A small retailer (maybe like a single store sort of retailer) might pick it up pretty quick but again investigation is probably going to cost more than its worth.

          Seems incredibly unlikely anyone will ever truly pick this up.

          Personally I'd return the money anyway.

  • ihfree on 05/03/2023 - 23:41
    +16

    That's pretty good of the business to give cash in that circumstance. If they've treated you well, I would return it for that reason in addition to it being the right thing to do.

  • SF3 on 05/03/2023 - 23:51

    I intend to return the extra money

    Just do, don’t think.

  • hasher22 on 05/03/2023 - 23:54
    +18

    I would return the money but it depends on the company, if it was woolies, apple, HN…. eff em…..

    • Smol Cat on 07/03/2023 - 16:04
      +14

      Basically if its any small store I would definitely return it, but if its a massive retailer, I'd think twice.

  • KaTst3R on 06/03/2023 - 00:20
    +5

    If you even need to ask, that means you have some ethics issue.

    • Eeples on 09/03/2023 - 15:29
      -1

      Questions of ethics are seldom cut and tried.

      For example is it okay if the OP pays it back at the end of next month as he had to pay extra in house repayments this month ?

      • KaTst3R on 10/03/2023 - 09:24

        This is not a loan facility. The moment OP realises the mistake, it has to rectified as soon as it is practically possible. Whether or not he has to pay extra in house repayment is irrelevant. By without holding it longer even with the intention of paying back in a future date is still a breach of ethics.

        This is clear cut, i dont even know why are you mentioning this.

  • iNeed2Pee on 06/03/2023 - 03:27
    +12

    Everyone on here saying "yes return". I guarantee most of you will not but are just saying that.

    • jjjaar on 06/03/2023 - 07:38
      +5

      Nah, I’ve literally done it, and would again.

      Bought items online from a popular chain and after a few weeks had no delivery. Chased both store and courier and neither could locate. Both said they were looking into it.

      A few days later I received the item so I contacted both to let them know. The next day I got an auto generated email saying that my item could not be located and I would get a refund. Contacted the store once more to remind them I have the item and I already told them. They replied basically saying “just keep the refund”.

      • WhyAmICommenting on 07/03/2023 - 16:50
        +5

        The computer system can’t cope with honesty 🤣

        • jjjaar on 07/03/2023 - 18:58
          +1

          Haha probably true, but at least I know I tried!

    • pegaxs on 06/03/2023 - 08:01
      +2

      Incorrect. I have had this happen a few times and I have always returned the over payment. It’s not mine and I leave it up to the store on what they want to do about it. So long as they don’t want me to jump through ridiculous hoops, I’m happy to refund the error.

      And a lot depends on the store/business. In OP’s case, this is a change of mind return that they are absolutely under no obligation to offer a refund, but they did, now they are paying for their good customer service twice and OP not informing them of the mistake and they will probably know about it and this may deter them in future claims to just outright deny any refunds of this nature.

    • Fredfloresjr on 06/03/2023 - 09:34
      +5

      Meh.

      Do not compare majority of people to your ethical behaviour.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 06/03/2023 - 11:15
      +4

      Not everyone is a secret (profanity) waiting to come out. I've had this happen with a cashback where it was done twice and I contacted them about, they said thanks for letting us know and to treat it as a gift (probably too much hassle to get it back).

    • ssfps on 07/03/2023 - 16:32

      I've offered to return an over-refund and the business (large-ish chain) said "just donate it to a charity". This was over the phone.

    • gromit on 07/03/2023 - 16:54

      "yes return" is the right answer, but freely admit I probably wouldn't bother unless they asked for it back unless a large amount and hence one of the few that picked option 2. though if I spot a mistake while still in the store or close to it I will rectify, just last week I returned a $50 to a store as they mistakenly thought I gave them a 100 instead of a 50. I am not looking to screw others for honest mistakes.

    • Serapis on 07/03/2023 - 17:06

      I'm saying "no, keep it" though. I guarantee I would not return it either. Keep the precious, it's my precious.

    • Darude Sandstorm on 08/03/2023 - 14:53

      I, unfortunately and illogically believe in Karma. Always seem to get bitten on the arse if I try pull shit like this.
      If the refund didn't get noticed for a few weeks though, I wouldn't bother and I'd be okay.

  • Sinnerator on 06/03/2023 - 07:19
    +7

    Treat the business exactly the same way they treat you

  • pegaxs on 06/03/2023 - 07:55
    +1

    Change of mind refund? Give them back their money. They didn’t have to refund you anything for change of mind, do the right thing, they have treated your fairly and you are taking advantage of the situation.

  • Motek Benzona on 06/03/2023 - 08:23

    Nope…. Its not some old granny.. $270 is an about an ounce.. ENJOY!!!!

  • Flying Ace on 06/03/2023 - 08:40
    +4

    Depends on the company I guess. If it was a small business or even a medium-sized one I would return it without hesitation - but a multi-national or big business I would be inclined to keep it.

  • this is us on 06/03/2023 - 08:41
    +12

    I would return but I wouldn't actively chase them to do that. I've spent a lot of time in life contacting companies when they overcharged me and they often don't give a shit.

    Hours and hours on the phone, multiple emails…

    Although some companies give a refund straight away, others essentially make you give up… Namely Qantas… Sometimes I think Alan Joyce and the managers should be in jail for stealing people's money because that's what Qantas does… Twelve calls to get my money back…

    If you bought from a disorganised company, there is a chance that you will give the money back and they will find a way to cancel the refund and they money will be taken from your payment method again ("because it's a different department") and you will have to go back to get your money back again.

    If it's a small business and it's easy for you to return the money, make sure you document everything and get receipts.

  • AustriaBargain on 06/03/2023 - 09:11
    +2

    Was it Harvey Norman? Gerry wouldn't tell you if you double refunded him, fwiw.

    • ihfree on 06/03/2023 - 09:46
      +1

      A big business with a lot of automation is much less likely to notice when something that is hardly normal happens.

  • mreddie on 06/03/2023 - 09:16
    -2

    Karma works in mysterious ways

    • iLikeSales on 07/03/2023 - 17:08
      +9

      This is false. People do bad shit all the time and usually have nothing bad happen to them. Example, the rich, dealerships and wage theft. Cant forget Narvey Morman

  • Motek Benzona on 06/03/2023 - 09:27
    +4

    My S22 ultra had to go in for repairs last year. I sent it into Samsung. On the day it came back I had 2 x packages delivered, there was 2 phones. My one and another one, also an S22 ultra

    I tried to call them, wrote to them, told them i had it and wanted to give it back. In 2 months NOTHING happened at all. Im not going to chase these morons for the rest of my life. Once the 60 days was up i sold mine and kept the "spare". Legally i did what i had to.

    Samsung created this issue and did nothing about it. It is their problem not mine, the spare has now been traded in anyway. Funny, Ausrion would not let me trade it saying the IMEI was blocked but the JB trade in mob did not give a toss and took it for the trade in.

    As far as i could tell there were no blocks on the phone at all. i tested it with multiple new sims.

    Was GREAT as i sold the original for $1700 the day after i pauid for flights that totalled $1700.. WINNING

    • MagicOZ on 07/03/2023 - 20:29

      Was that a phone with someone's data or just brand new one?

      • Motek Benzona on 07/03/2023 - 20:53
        +1

        It was new..factory reset

  • Ricky Jones on 06/03/2023 - 09:34
    +4

    Shouldn't this be in the "Deals" category? The title could be "200% cashback when getting a refund"

    • Motek Benzona on 06/03/2023 - 09:58

      The original only cost me about $800 with vodafone after a massive trade in bonus of $700 or so i think. percent off the chart….

  • lostgoat on 06/03/2023 - 10:22
    +3

    If its Hardly Normal I definitely would not return it .

  • djsweet on 06/03/2023 - 10:57

    The till would have been balanced and the shortfall noted on the day of your refund. You should try and return the money, but chances are its too late for them to do anything about it and will just let you keep the money. It would be too hard for them to reconcile the extra income against the return which would have already been sorted out months ago.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 06/03/2023 - 11:16
      +2

      If it's a small business then just walk in with the $270 in cash and give it to the store owner, make their day.

      • djsweet on 06/03/2023 - 11:53

        Great idea. I bet for a smaller business this would be awesome :) In my mind this was a business like Officeworks for HN, where it would cost them so much effort to account for the extra money that they'd rather not have it.

        • coffeeinmyveins on 06/03/2023 - 13:52

          100% if it was one of those businesses this is just a rounding error for them, they would have moved on by now.

    • Love a bargain on 06/03/2023 - 14:04

      The till would be balanced though because they would have noted that a $270 cash refund was given out on the day.

      • djsweet on 06/03/2023 - 14:27

        Yeah I guess they would, if they did it properly. The refund might have been recorded as some discretionary management code or wastage. Good chance it’s not actually recorded against the original transaction, which would make it super hard for a larger business to accept the money back. But either way, the OP does really have an obligation to attempt to return the money. My thought is it’s pretty unlikely he will have to though.

        • Love a bargain on 06/03/2023 - 14:34
          +1

          Agree. If it's a medium to large business, their staff would have trouble dealing with any extraordinary transactions (such as a repayment of this nature) and won't bother.

          My point was more that no-one would have got into trouble on the day for the till being $270 short.

      • Qazxswec on 08/03/2023 - 21:14

        but when they do an x read or z read it would show a -$270 refund on eftpos because refunds go on a different line on the print out, it would then come apparent that the credit refund did go through when they compare it to the eftpos print out and they would realise they paid the refund twice

  • MrThing on 06/03/2023 - 11:13
    +5

    If it was harvey norman, qantas, auspost, coles, woolworths, et al.

    fukn big no

  • Deals For Days on 07/03/2023 - 15:41
    +1

    Harvey Norman -> took job keeper had bigger profits. In that case, no.

    Similar question for other businesses IMO. If it's an ethical honest business then yeah I would return. If it's a company that regularly stuffs consumers (ACCC violations, jobkeeper/excess govt money) then no.

    Small business almost definitely.

  • Brick Tamland on 07/03/2023 - 16:04

    Most of the time I'd keep it but if it was a small business or a business I really enjoyed shopping at then I'd return it.

  • Cluster on 07/03/2023 - 16:26

    It's an obvious mistake and 'finders keepers' is only something children do. The extra $270 doesn't belong to you. Return it.

    You will feel better having done it, and it's possible the store will give you a small reward like a gift card for your honesty and bringing a problem to their attention so it doesn't happen again. I know I would.

  • avseqcfc on 07/03/2023 - 16:29
    +2

    You can transfer it to me and I'll return it on your behalf.

  • aboogee on 07/03/2023 - 16:31

    Just do what your heart tells you is right… dont need a clause in the law for that….

  • Serapis on 07/03/2023 - 17:00
    +2

    Keep it like the police just found your car which was stolen 18 years ago.

  • T3J on 07/03/2023 - 17:10

    Google 'Theft by finding' which is one that also surprises people.

    Yeah I would return it too anyway. I've found and taken 3 full purses/wallets to the police station before, never taken a thing from them.

    • Korban Dallas on 07/03/2023 - 17:43

      I found $20 on the road. How does this fit your definition?

      • T3J on 07/03/2023 - 17:47
        +1

        Technically you aren't allowed to keep it, you have to make the effort to find the owner (aka take it to the police station). In reality, no ones doing this are they but technically you can be charged with 'Theft by finding' that 20. Edit: Of course you have to be caught, thats the thing.

        Some detail here: https://www.armstronglegal.com.au/criminal-law/vic/offences/…

      • Tonyh87 on 07/03/2023 - 19:40

        i found $50 on the ground in my local shopping centre just before christmas a couple of years ago. I took it to the coles service desk to hand it in in case someone came to them searching for it. The coles employee took it and made no attempt to collect my details in case it was not claimed. I'm sure he would have put it straight into his own pocket as soon as I walked away.

        • ReaperX22 on 08/03/2023 - 12:14
          +2

          I found 50 once at an old work, near a staff-only gate. I gave the note to a team leader and he asked around etc etc. Few days later he came up to me, no one claimed, no one said they were missing anything (no one asking around for any lost money) and gave me the 50 to keep. Pretty sure I bought a decent meal that night XD.

  • MrKnowItAll on 07/03/2023 - 17:49

    I had similar as a young teen, picking up dinner at dominos but they gave too much change (extra $20). My dad thought I was nuts but it ate at my conscience so much that I went back and they corrected the mistake. Felt good to do the right thing and likely saved the poor girl behind the counter the trouble of having to explain the mistake later after shift.

    Of course some 20 years later my moral compass has shifted somewhere whereby I'll leave ikea with $5 worth of clearance stuff and 50+ "free" pencils for the kids and woodworking projects.. so, I ask which store it was or if you'd rather not say, at least fit it into one of two categories: giant corporation or small family business before deciding what the right thing to do is.
    I'm no expert, but I assume giant corporations would have insurance for this kind of thing and likely woudn't notice $270 missing from the millions of dollars they take as profit every year. However a small family business could really suffer if you were dishonest here.

  • Unacceptable on 07/03/2023 - 18:21

    I bought $500 Amazon gift cards from Aus post (a deal posted here), I put my home address to delivery but didn't arrive.
    They actually sent to my work place (the address must be saved in their system). It was during the lockdown and I couldn't go out of the house.
    I wasn't sure if the gift cards would still be there or left in front of the office door, etc. so I contacted the Aus post and they re-sent to my home.
    A few weeks later when I got back to work I found the delivery was on my desk but Aus post didn't contact me to retrieve the fund.
    I rang them and paid by credit card over the phone.

  • badg3rz on 07/03/2023 - 18:48

    If they refunded you in cash, and put it through some other way to go back in, how would they know at the end of the day when they add up the books?

    They would be scratching their heads that there's $270 missing in cash, but not in a refund, who knows how the manager returned it into stock, he probably did something and at stocktake it might popup as missing, unless the manager did something sly and took the product for himself, or perhaps gave it to staff to use.

    I'm sort of on the fence about this, although to be honest I would go in and say they made a mistake, but don't go out of your way about it. Just make sure that refund $270 in your account doesn’t go missing, otherwise you would be out $540. They might actually say keep it

    • Love a bargain on 09/03/2023 - 10:18

      Surely the manager would know and that $270 would be put into the system or recorded in the cash count as an adjustment of some description at the end of the day rather than leaving it shown as an error.

  • auna on 07/03/2023 - 20:26

    I would absolutely not do it. Donate to charity or purchase something from the business to clear your conscience if you want, but it will 100% backfire on you in future circumstances.

  • darkmattersunB6c0MV on 07/03/2023 - 22:39
    -1

    I would absolutely do it. ( And have in the past).
    It is not yours to begin with. Think this way. If some money is accidentally transferred to you in a bank account- or someone does it twice accidentally, your are not entitled to keep it.
    If they refuse to take it as it is not in their system, then you keep it. But make a genuine effort to try to return it when it is convenient.

  • Morphio25 on 08/03/2023 - 07:16

    I wouldn't bother. Is it worth your time and effort to try and return the money to them? At the end of the day you aren't responsible for their technology problems or their decision to give you cash. They could've simply said 'Sorry our Internet is down please come back tomorrow and we'll process your refund then.'

    What if the situation was reversed and they double charged you? Do you think they'd go to the effort of tracking you down to reverse the second amount? Probably not, they'd just wait until YOU notice and YOU do something about it.

    Having said that if it was some small mum and dad operation I probably would give the money back because that kind of money may really make a difference to them but if it's a large chain then forget it, their profits are already so massive that $270 won't make a scrap of difference.

  • TimApple on 08/03/2023 - 08:48
    +1

    Happened to me before, long time ago before online shopping. After trying to refund the double refund for 10 mins, the shop owner absolutely refused to accept my money. I gave up and kept the money.

  • R4 on 08/03/2023 - 11:00
    +3

    Depends who gave you the double refund - Vinnies, return it. Harvey Norman - enjoy the bonus at Gerry's expense.

    • splicer on 08/03/2023 - 23:28
      +1

      Small company - yes.
      Big company - no.
      Harvey Norman - abso-friggin-devo-not

  • RolandWaites on 08/03/2023 - 11:07
    +3

    Small business? Yes. Large multinational previously found to have been systemically under-paying staff, has been reducing the number of human-operated registers in favour of self-serve checkouts and received generous COVID government assistance grants despite making record profits through the pandemic? No.

  • lonewolf on 08/03/2023 - 13:35
    +1

    It depends on the store. If its Harvey Norman, I wouldnt….Not after what that guy has done to the general public

    • Camelface on 08/03/2023 - 19:41
      -1

      So your moral values depend on the person whom you deal with. Interesting.

      • Morphio25 on 08/03/2023 - 21:21
        +3

        Treat others how they treat you. Gerry's got it coming…

      • lonewolf on 08/03/2023 - 22:13
        +1

        Nothing to do with morals when you deal with Harvey norman.i am just getting back some of my tax payer money that he stole.

        • Camelface on 09/03/2023 - 10:44

          If B steals $200 from A, and A goes and steals $200 from B, does this mean A stole from B?

          • lonewolf on 09/03/2023 - 13:32

            @Camelface: I didn't steal. I was given the money back by the other party. After they stole it .

  • herecomestheoost on 08/03/2023 - 14:04

    Take it! :D

  • gimme on 08/03/2023 - 15:24

    Maybe I'm wrong but I'm not buying the OP's post and the 'innocent' question. My senses say OP has no intention of returning the money and just fishing to see if they'll get caught and if so whether they'll get in trouble. my 2c

  • DingoBilly on 08/03/2023 - 15:39
    +3

    Keep it. It's rare to get a win atm in life and it's not like the company is losing out. Reversing the scenario companies rip off and accidentally overcharge people all the time, so I wouldn't feel bad at all.

    Worst case scenario you always plead innocence if they come after you.

  • BlueberryOrangeJuice on 08/03/2023 - 16:21
    +1

    Love how everyone here reckons they’d give it back. Guess we all think we’re very righteous until you have an extra $270 in your bank account.

    How’s this any different from all the keyboard warriors taking advantage of obvious price errors, then crying about it when the company doesn’t give them the profit for 10% of the rrp. 🤦‍♀️

  • lostgoat on 08/03/2023 - 16:26

    If OP a Goody Good Shoes . OP is simply getting back a small % of the shop lifting tax being paid by everyone by keeping the extra refund .

  • Camelface on 08/03/2023 - 19:39

    I definitely would. Why do you want someone else's money? Sad to see that this question has even been asked. Are we really this low? This not bargaining but stealing.

  • cobknob on 08/03/2023 - 20:58

    I don't want any bonus points 😜
    Remem seeing something on the news about money being lost and an officer stated that if you come into possession of money that doesn't belong to you technically keeping it is considered theft. In your case it could come back to bite you.

  • champ23 on 08/03/2023 - 21:01
    +2

    Bro take the win

    • Papa Huggies on 09/03/2023 - 12:28
      +1

      Everyone here saying "return it" like they wouldn't keep it.

      Bro keep it I ain't judging you

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