Car Collision with Bicycle (Bike at Fault) - What Are My Options?

WillKillfor5Cents on 12/12/2022 - 21:42
Last edited 12/12/2022 - 21:43

Hi all, just got in an accident today. A bike from the opposite side of the road was riding at a high speed and lost control when turning left (I was turning right) in a wet weather condition. So he and his bike skid across to the other side of the road and hit my car and cause quite a noticeable dent.

At the time, he looked and sounded like a minor (stupid me, I didn't ask for his ID thinking hes just a minor - big mistake I guess). So after exchanging phone number, his parents called me later in the day. Later on, the parent conveyed that the guy that hit me is in fact already 18yo (I can't confirm this) and he also casually mentioned that if I try to make a claim through the insurance, it's pointless because the kid wouldn't have been able to pay and I would go nowhere. Trying to be reasonable, I'm happy to hear his proposal which is to potentially settle this outside the insurance process. However, he indicated he would prefer go through his mates (which is something I am not too keen on). Is this true that if my insurance is unable to get the "kid" to pay up, then there would be nothing they can do? That I would be at a dead end?

I tried to call my car insurance (with AusPost), but they are closed for the day. Has anyone here been in a similar/same situation before? I am just curious what are my options :(

Automotive

Comments

  • pegaxs on 12/12/2022 - 21:47
    +21

    Wow… another one. Came here thinking it was old mate taking a third run at seeking confirmation bias… nope, it’s a new one.

    Your options are, talk to your insurer about it. Talk to your panel beater about it. Don’t do anything about it if it just cosmetic damage.

    Talk to your insurance company and give them the information you have, ie: phone number. It’s not your problem if he has no money/job/responsibility. The insurance company will chase him for it. He doesn’t want you to use insurance because he knows it will be $5,000 instead of $500.

    Talk to your panel beater (you do NOT have to use their panel beater NOR get 3 quotes). Get them to give you a quote to fix it privately. Send this to the bike rider with a letter of demand. If they fail to pay, escalate it with a letter from a lawyer. If they ignore that, VCAT hearing or a magistrate and a judgement. And then when they don’t pay, back to court again and get a payment order.

    Lastly, let it go. If he has no money and is only 18 and the damage is minor and it’s not a collector vehicle, you will spend more time and effort trying to get blood from a stone than what it’s worth.

    • WillKillfor5Cents on 12/12/2022 - 22:07
      +1

      Thanks for the pointers! No definitely not the same guy and a totally different situation.

      Guess will give the insurance a call first thing tomorrow and see what they say. Will give them chance to settle privately, but if no dice, would just go through the insurance. Since the damage is around the wheel arc and I'm just afraid if water keep going in, it might rust and cause further problems down the track. If this was just a paint job or purely cosmetic, probably wouldn't have bothered. As you said, prolly not worth the effort.

      Much appreciated!

      • Euphemistic on 13/12/2022 - 09:01
        +1

        Got a photo of the damage? I find it hard to believe a bicycle could cause enough damage to let water in enough to rust.

        • bargaino on 13/12/2022 - 14:04

          How more work? Insurance would want at least one quote, forms, and take time.

          hope that the quote you went with stays the same

          You get a quote, not an estimate. If they don't pay, or muck you about, then you can pass it on to the insurer guilt-free.

            • WillKillfor5Cents on 15/12/2022 - 00:47
              +1

              @El cheepo: Sorry guys, been slow with the update. Been jumping the hoops with insurance and looking for repairers as well. Will probably post a proper update tomorrow.

  • thatonethere on 12/12/2022 - 22:07
    +4

    Parents may still bail him out so he doesnt have a debt so still worth it. You can mention it will be hard for rent, credit card etc. Less hassle to just claim or to pay cash.

    I would not go thru "mates" tho

    • WillKillfor5Cents on 13/12/2022 - 00:12
      +1

      Yea deffo. If he still insisted on going thru "mates", I'll just say no deal and claim via insurance instead (assuming all goes well tomorrow and they are happy to process the claim).

  • AdosHouse on 12/12/2022 - 22:14
    +9

    If you have comprehensive insurance it doesn't matter if the other party can pay up or not, it's the insurance company's problem to chase them for money. They can get $5 a week for the rest of their life if they need too.

    I would ask for the guys name and address from the parents, just say it is for putting on a quote you want to get. Then pass it on to your insurance company.

    • WillKillfor5Cents on 12/12/2022 - 22:33

      Yep, mine is definitely a comprehensive policy. That's good to hear.

      Because when the dad said that if the Insurance can't claim the money, I'm stuffed. So naturally I was taken aback by it (don't really know how these things work tbh).

      Thanks guys!

      • Quantumcat on 13/12/2022 - 16:31

        You're not stuffed, just that you might have to pay excess if your insurance company can't find out who is responsible. Which they should be able to, if you are careful, as AdosHouse says above.

      • TheGhost on 14/12/2022 - 17:31

        You should have told him your username ;

  • bobbified on 12/12/2022 - 23:09
    +3

    A name and phone number may not be enough. You will likely need their address as well.

    So when you speak to them next, don't mention anything about making an insurance claim and try 'tease' their address out of them during the conversation. Once you get that, lodge a claim with your insurer with those details and the details of any witnesses. It's up to your insurer to try and recover the cost of the claim from the party at-fault. You just have to supply them with the at-fault's details.

    • WillKillfor5Cents on 12/12/2022 - 23:20

      Yea I got their address, but stupid me didn't ask for any ID from the at-fault party (thinking he was a minor, thought I should just deal with his parents). So the address is a supplied information rather than a verified one (in case they are giving out a fake address).

      I don't have any witness details actually. Would that count against my claim?

      There was a car behind me who would've seen the whole thing, but obviously, I didn't stop them :(. Should I have stopped the car behind me and ask him/her to be my witness in the future?

      • bobbified on 12/12/2022 - 23:22
        +4

        Yea I got their address, but stupid me didn't ask for any ID from the at-fault party

        You can still lodge a claim with that address. Name, address and phone number. No need to say that it's "not verified". Let the insurance company sort that stuff out.

        • WillKillfor5Cents on 12/12/2022 - 23:38
          +1

          Cheers, will do. Thanks for the pointer.

      • Seraphin7 on 14/12/2022 - 15:53
        +1

        Yea I got their address, but stupid me didn't ask for any ID from the at-fault party (thinking he was a minor, thought I should just deal with his parents).

        Lesson for next time, get ID and all particulars immediately. No ID (or something shady) = immediate call to the popo. At that point, do not accept, "ah, sorry mate, here it is, didn't think I had it on me". Let the popo turn up, they take all particulars as well as you.

        From this point on, whatever shenanigans they might wish to play fall away pretty quickly.

        • WillKillfor5Cents on 15/12/2022 - 00:49

          Yep, lesson learnt. To be honest, this is my real first incident. Touch wood, I've never been in an accident before, other than scratching my bumper in the parking lot many moon ago. Stupid me, never thinking to prepare for something like this, I was kind of lost when it all happened! But have now made mental notes on what to do in such situation. Even tempted to get dash cam as well!

  • AustriaBargain on 12/12/2022 - 23:51
    +6

    It sounds like the parents don't really believe you won't be able to compel them to pay, otherwise they wouldn't have felt the need to try and convince you it is pointless. They would have just ignored you. The parents are probably telling the kid he was stupid for giving his real phone number.

  • Some Human on 13/12/2022 - 02:26
    -3

    Sounds like a scam. Getting the kid to hit a car to drum up business for the parents mates.

  • ifyareckon on 13/12/2022 - 06:41
    +2

    Worth trying to keep communication to text/email with them. If insurance in involved and there is any dispute further into the process about fault, you will have something in writing from the other party.

  • o53djz7qTPY4der on 13/12/2022 - 07:10
    +3

    Chances are you will end up paying your excess. Why do you care about the riders personal/financial situation? Go through your insurance, pay your excess and hope you may get it back.

    The rider should be insured. I ride every day and have insurance for my bikes and third party. My TP is $60 per year - literally nothing. I am a strong believer in cycling but also in people taking responsibility. That means people protecting themselves and others. Let the rider deal with the consequences. Do not go through their mate. Whatever you pay in excess will be far less of a headache than dealing with somebody outside of your insurance.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 13/12/2022 - 07:35
      +1

      The rider should be insured

      My sides. You are probably one of the only people in Sydney that have insurance for their riding.

      • DashCam AKA Rolts on 13/12/2022 - 07:45
        +3

        Anyone belonging to a state cycling association, state or national racing associations or a competitive riding club has insurance cover. It comes with the membership, which is mandatory if involved in any of the organised cycling races/rides.

        • coffeeinmyveins on 13/12/2022 - 08:54
          +2

          Cool, my point stands. I know a lot of riders who cycle every day and none of them have insurance or memberships like that.

        • pharkurnell on 13/12/2022 - 10:00

          and how many people would that be out of the 10,000's with bikes? 1%?

          • DashCam AKA Rolts on 13/12/2022 - 10:41
            +1

            @pharkurnell: Just one organisation out of a number, as an example: AusCycling currently represents over 54,000 members
            There are numerous organisations, state level, recreational and competitive offering insurance cover with membership. In the club of 140 approx riders (social) to which I belong, 100% insured.

          • DashCam AKA Rolts on 13/12/2022 - 17:06

            @pharkurnell: Also, the insured members may hold household membership, such as I do, which means other people in the family are covered. So actual insured numbers are significantly higher than the simple membership levels suggest.

      • o53djz7qTPY4der on 13/12/2022 - 10:28

        I'm not in Sydney. :-)

    • WillKillfor5Cents on 13/12/2022 - 09:52
      +1

      The rider is a kid, most likely uninsured. Not those regular/daily experienced riders. So I highly doubt it.

      • o53djz7qTPY4der on 13/12/2022 - 10:29
        +1

        Well… The age of the rider is unclear., The OP said minor but that the parents said they are 18. In which case, just go through your insurance.

  • jason101 on 13/12/2022 - 07:52
    +6

    This happened to me once (cyclist plowed into my car), call your insurance company give all the details you have, proceed to get the car repaired and forget about the kid/parents/circumstances - let the insurance company worry about it and move on trying to cause yourself the least frustration.

  • nswnotill on 13/12/2022 - 08:27
    +1

    Report to police perhaps? Just to cover yourself.

  • [Deactivated] on 13/12/2022 - 09:03
    +3

    Go through insurance and let them chase the parents/kid.
    At least then you're not on the hook for the repairs and don't have to waste your own time chasing them for the money.
    Call me cynical, but the parents could be urging you down this path so they can continue to delay until you give up chasing and therefore, they don't pay a cent.

  • DingoBlue on 13/12/2022 - 10:26

    Sounds like cosmetic damage. Let them fix it and ensure you're satisfied with the cosmetic outcome.

    Leave insurance for big issues, remain a good customer by not claiming.

    • WillKillfor5Cents on 15/12/2022 - 00:53

      That's what I thought too! But other than the dents, scratches on paint/rim, the front panel is bent near the door too :(. It creates this shrieking noise when I'm opening/closing the door as the bent panel gets in the way of my front door's trajectory (if that makes sense). I know someone asked for a pic, will upload it at some point.

      I was happy to ignore scratches on the rim, but got quoted $1.5k-2k from my local panel beater (without fixing the scratched Rim - and more if I want it all fixed!). I was actually willing to overlook few things to make it cheaper. But in the end, at that amount, I get the feeling the other party will drive a hard bargain/play games, so following good advices here, probably just took the insurance route and let them sort it out. I have enough stress in my life I guess.

      • Euphemistic on 15/12/2022 - 05:29
        +1

        While you are waiting to sort it out it might be worth pulling/pushing the panel to make it clear the door. They are often not particularly strong and can be manipulated enough to stop the scraping.

        I did that with an older car a while back. Opened the door, grabbed the guard with my fingers and pulled it out enough to clear the door. Saved a trip to the wreckers for a new guard

  • Ocker on 13/12/2022 - 10:39
    -1

    Is your real name Daniel Andrews (Premier of Vic) by any chance, and the incident really happened in 2013?

  • Seraphin7 on 13/12/2022 - 10:46
    +6

    Is this true that if my insurance is unable to get the "kid" to pay up, then there would be nothing they can do? That I would be at a dead end?

    If the kid doesn't pay up, the insurer will commence legal proceedings to recover the costs.

    You are not at a dead end. Your insurer has fixed you up and will chase the other party for costs.

    This is precisely what comprehensive insurance is for.

    Why on Earth anyone would hold insurance and then opt not to make use of it because of the preferences of the other party is simply beyond me.

    • Mistredo on 13/12/2022 - 12:02

      Why on Earth anyone would hold insurance and then opt not to make use of it because of the preferences of the other party is simply beyond me.

      Excess?

      • Seraphin7 on 13/12/2022 - 12:44
        +2

        Where you are assessed as not at fault, the excess does not apply regardless of what's going on with the other party. (at least not with any insurers I've ever dealt with).

        In any event, that's a decision the insured makes based on their preferences, not that of the other party.

    • Euphemistic on 13/12/2022 - 16:33

      Why on Earth anyone would hold insurance and then opt not to make use of it because of the preferences of the other party is simply beyond me.

      Perhaps to keep premiums down. Less claims equals less premium (for everybody). Cash repair may be cheaper. If it’s minor damage and the at fault party is playing ball them why not give them the option to save some coin.

      The second they start causing dramas, go to insurance.

      • Seraphin7 on 14/12/2022 - 10:14

        If it’s minor damage and the at fault party is playing ball them why not give them the option to save some coin.

        Not my problem to help the other party save coin. The other party had the ability to save coin by not crashing into my vehicle. After that, I'll do everything to suit my interests, not that of the other at fault party.

        • Euphemistic on 14/12/2022 - 10:22

          NOT making a claim does serve your interests, but only if it’s a painless easy process. EVERY claim made adds to the cost of every premium. Then there’s also he possibility that your rating will change because of the claim even if it’s not at fault. It won’t be obvious like an at fault claim increase, but it adds to their data to determine premiums.

          • Seraphin7 on 14/12/2022 - 10:43
            +1

            @Euphemistic:

            NOT making a claim does serve your interests, but only if it’s a painless easy process.

            In my humble experience, attempting to get an at fault party to do anything is nothing more than an exercise in total frustration.

            Frankly, my time and sanity is worth far more than any possible increase in premiums that might arise. I put in a claim, the car goes to the repairer, it gets dealt with, and my car is back on the road with all the guaranteed workmanship that comes from the claims process. This is already a painful process that I have no desire to make more painful for myself.

            So far as the other party is concerned, my view is they have (had) two options … (1) don't hit my car, or if they are unable to do that, (2) deal with my insurance company, their lawyers, and their debt collectors. I'm not opening up the opportunity for a single minute of runaround.

            • Euphemistic on 14/12/2022 - 15:04

              @Seraphin7: I agree that insurance makes the process easier. I also think that giving the person a chance (just one) to pay up is a reasonable action. It also means I may be able to collect cash for the incident, make my own repairs and profit - of course that depends on the damage. In that case, it’s well worth waiting. Eg id like to put a bullbar on my vehicle. If someone wrecks the front bumper but nothing else and are willing to pay repair costs i can put that money straight to the bullbar. If I went insurance I’d just get a new bumper which is kind of pointless.

              If the damage is serious enough, then it’s insurance time. The second they screw around and don’t want to pay, its straight to insurer.

  • AndyC1 on 13/12/2022 - 19:03
    +1

    If other people stop ask them if they say the accident and get their details if they are willing as they witnesses when you put the claim in just inn case the other party denies that they were the cause of the accident.

  • seedy on 13/12/2022 - 20:10

    Confused, if he was turning left how was it his fault?

    • DashCam AKA Rolts on 13/12/2022 - 23:10
      +1

      A bike from the opposite side of the road was riding at a high speed and lost control when turning left (I was turning right) in a wet weather condition. So he and his bike skid across to the other side of the road and hit my car

      • seedy on 15/12/2022 - 21:08

        So aren't you supposed to give way to him and give him at least a metres clearance?
        Still don't understand.

        • DashCam AKA Rolts on 15/12/2022 - 22:02

          Still don't understand.

          A bike FROM THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE ROAD was riding at a high speed and lost control when turning left (I was turning right) in a wet weather condition. So HE AND HIS BIKE SKID ACROSS TO THE OTHER SIDE OF THE ROAD AND HIT MY CAR.

          • In other words, the bike was travelling on the other side of the road.
          • The rider lost control and slid across the road, colliding with the car.

          This has nothing to do with the metre separation rule, which applies when passing a cyclist travelling in the same direction.

          • seedy on 16/12/2022 - 09:27

            @DashCam AKA Rolts: Driver was turning right cyclist left. Driver gives way. After the maneuver they are travelling in the same direction but regardless the driver should have given way. Do t bother copying and pasting the original post again, I can read.
            Also if the bike was turning left and someone turned in front of him he'd hit the brakes and sliding a straight line and only then hit the car. If he lost control while turning in wet he'd slide and fall off to the left and would unlikely hit the car. On the information available this is a reasonable conclusion. The driver should have given way. On the information available I would go with the driver is at fault regardless as to any admission by the cyclist.

            I'd be interested to see what would happen if it went to court.

            Btw unless you are the op you have no more information than I do. He/she can reply for ghenselves

            • DashCam AKA Rolts on 16/12/2022 - 13:29

              @seedy:

              If he lost control while turning in wet he'd slide and fall off to the left and would unlikely hit the car.

              You have either never ridden a bike, nor studied physics.
              A bike turning left at speed will fall on the left hand side, but will slide in a vector moving directly away from the centre of the turning radius. This is due to centrifugal force. In other words, yes, fall on left side, BUT rider and bike slide to the right. If you don't believe me, try an experiment and hop on a bike, take a left corner in wet conditions. Record your findings and report back.

              The car could easily have given the rider adequate space to turn, but if the rider lost control on the corner, as described by OP, it was possible for a collision to occur even if the vehicle was stationary.

              • seedy on 16/12/2022 - 13:44

                @DashCam AKA Rolts: Funny, studied physics in an engineering degree and ride every day.
                The car should have given way.. so tired of repeating myself

                • DashCam AKA Rolts on 16/12/2022 - 13:49

                  @seedy: Like wise I cycle regularly. I would assume someone who rides could see how this unfolds, particularly a person with a Science background.

                  The car should have given way..

                  Nothing here indicated that the car did not give way.

                  so tired of repeating myself

                  Likewise.

              • seedy on 16/12/2022 - 13:48

                @DashCam AKA Rolts: Honestly you know no more than me. Now stop it you will go blind.

                • DashCam AKA Rolts on 16/12/2022 - 14:03

                  @seedy: I know that a cyclist turning left at speed and losing traction will slide outwards, whilst you apparently don't.

          • seedy on 16/12/2022 - 09:47

            @DashCam AKA Rolts: I notice the OPs tag name.. not great

  • nasz on 14/12/2022 - 15:11
    +1

    Just log the accident with the insurance company and see where that goes.

    In addition, get a quote - if its minimal (I can't imagine how a skidding bike would cause a lot of damage) - see if they will pay in cash - else, let the Insurance company pursue it.

  • WillKillfor5Cents on 16/01/2023 - 11:25

    Sorry for the lack of updates all, life got really busy and then pre-Xmas and all. Anyway, thank you again for everyone who have kindly replied here! Your inputs are much appreciated. I thought I just update this for one last time as there are some lessons that can be learnt. Hopefully, the information here can aid some of you, if you are ever in a similar situation. Anyway, bullet points:

    (Lesson 1)
    Lodged with insurance and car is now fixed without having to pay excess, as insurance ruled that liability resides with the cyclist, BUT:
    (i) initially, insurance argued that cyclist is classified as pedestrian. Hence, in this case, they might not be able to recoup cost and I'll still have to pay excess fee.
    (ii) However, through research on google, I came into several law firms website which argued that cyclist on the road are NOT pedestrian. Highlighted my findings to them, including an article from VicRoad which implied that cyclist need to abide by road rules too (duh…), and eventually they mentioned that I am correct and apologies for some of their team members for saying such things. Mind you, most of the staffs are offshored and from my research some countries actually do classify cyclist as pedestrian.

    (Lesson 2)
    Always just take the insurance road if you have them, don't even bother dealing with private settlement (thanks to all of you here!). In fact, the cyclist said who promised to call me the next day never called at all! LOL… So, if you are in the right, just go the insurance route

    (Lesson 3)
    Dash cam would probably provide a peace of mind! Although it wasn't required in the end, but having no witness and misinformation regarding the definition of cyclist as pedestrian vs. vehicle, added to the anxiety of the whole process. Plus, the presence of a dash cam recording would probably made the party at fault more accountable as well.

    Anyway all is well, car has been repaired to its previous state and I'm ready to move on.

    Thanks all for checking in! Much appreciated.

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