Recently my old bones starting to hurt at the neck. Was wondering what our fellow ozber favourite go to when this happens? Share some first hand experience?
Chiropractor or Physiotherapist, Who Do You Believe in?
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The quackery might be true for overseas, especially in America. But here there are actual standards, and chiros here don't claim to cure cancer or perform corrections on babies
I've seen chiropractic manipulation on babies.
Here's an article by RACGP (I'm not a GP): https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/banned-chiropracto…That story points out a moron who went outside of acceptable guidelines and has been banned due to it. Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency (AHPRA) is set up to do so, to prevent the quacks from practicing in Australia.
The point isn't that it can't happen here at all. As with every other profession including physios and medical doctors, they can also be negligent and go against what they're supposed to do and get banned for it.
You don't assume Australian doctors are all quacks because of the many times individuals have been accused of malpractice.
The point is that we have acceptable standards that get people banned when they do the wrong thing for chiros, physios, etc. In a lot of countries o/s this isn't the case, and that's where 99.9% of chiro horror stories come from
I use both but for that sort of thing either a 'good' physio or an osteopath. I would try the osteopath first but ask around locally and see who gets recommended.
This is my honest experience. No bias, no affiliation, no pufferies.
I went to 2 Physios - One near AAMI Stadium and one at Kieser; And 1 Chiro.
The case study is frozen shoulder. Before I know it was frozen shoulder, I went to one at Kieser. Recall the one at Kieser is a legit phsyio. Prescribed training with bands. Internal/External rotation plus their machines. It got worse. More physio, the condition was worsening. This went on for 3 months.
Finally went to specialist and correctly diagnosed as frozen shoulder. Banned from doing strengthening exercises (ie Banned from Kieser). Only stretches. This went on for 1 year.
Then the specialists took me to the physio next door (they are in the same building near AAMI stadium). Did a few strengthening exercise but never for once explained the roadmap to recovery. The physio even said my left arm will get frozen shoulder too soon. At my last visit, he finally loosening up my humeral muscle and said, "Maybe I should have done that a while ago". This went for about 7 visits. I honestly didn't get any better.
Then I went to Chiro. I used to see him but because of frozen shoulder, didn't see him anymore for 1 year. When specialist certified I was ok to strengthening, I went to see my chiro and after a few cracks (Because I didn't see him for a year, I went back to 1 month at weekly interval before once every 3 weeks and now once every month), he also did adjustments on my shoulder and to be honest, my right arm went much better. He also asked me to do basic strengthening and pec stretch/exercise. He diagnosed my issue more likely now rolled shoulder post frozen shoulder. I did that and I felt better. He also did myofascia release along my lower and upper traps plus levscap.
My left arm is worsening yes but that's because I only exercised my right arm but it never progressed to frozen shoulder. Maybe tendinitis he wasn't sure. I am seeing specialist again soon for my left.
Today my right arm is probably 75% recovered pre-frozen shoulder. A bit of tendinitis but overall, I am in much less pain and I felt I got better advice from my Chiro than my last 2 physios. My two physios never did myofascia release onto me. Just typical massage you get from shopping centre masseurs.
I know most Ozbs here are anti Chiro but for once, I hope my experience can provide some balance.
I think a few easy rebuttals are:
- "but that's just your individual experience"
- "just because you got lucky doesn't mean your experience is reliably repeatable"
- Causation / correlationI could argue the other way if that is your form of rebuttals. People can choose to believe or disbelieve but sharing an experience is still legitimate.
not my rebuttals, hence the quotation marks.
it seems both of us were burned by not getting enough investigation/scans done prior to embarking on a recovery plan.
@andresampras: That's true! Next week when I am seeing my specialists I want to ask him about scans.
It is strange why he never really suggested it although I had a few hydros.
@burningrage: I can't speak to your issue, but for me the initial ultrasound & x-ray didn't show the whole story - it wasn't until I had an MRI done that the source of the problem became clear.
it wasn't until I had an MRI done that the source of the problem became clear.
Exactly my experience.
Years of pain killers, Cortisone injections, physio, and chiro, made not even an iota of differance, all an expensive waste of time for me.
1 MRI later I was booked in for priority surgery. Problem solvered.
@Hithere: Yeah it's not uncommon it seems.
The analogy that's just popped into my head is the GP + Specialists are the engineers who really understand the product and are able to think about why the problem has occurred; the physios and chiros (to varying extents) are more dealing with the symptoms - like the sales people or the customer support team, in that they get to work with whatever information they are given.
Happy for someone to point out if this is a bad analogy.
frozen shoulder naturally resolves within a 12-18mths time frame..
I second that! The chiro didn't get it fixed, the physio after several visits didn't fix. I was sent by my GP to osteopathic surgeon who sent me home without doing anything, saying the frozen shoulder would resolve in 2-4 months. He was spot on!
I suspect you mean an orthopaedic surgeon rather than an osteopathic surgeon?
Treating frozen shoulders often leads to exacerbating the shoulder. It can take up to two or more years for the shoulder to "thaw", so it's very likely that the chiro get lucky becauae your shoulder was on the mend.
Source: Mrs vietbargain is hand physio that specifically deals with upper limb injuries and conditions.
psa goto a hand physiotherapist for any physio needs with your hamd/wrist/elbow/shoulder. Even a good general physio will refer patients to a hand therapist.
For anyone reading. Frozen shoulders have a natural 3 stage process
Here's a quick summary https://www.vejthani.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/3-stages…
At the last stage the frozen shoulder will start settling on its own. Whichever practitioner you see at this time will 'appear' to be fixing the problem.
I can't speak specifically about your case, but this is the known science around frozen shoulders
I tried a chiro for the first time two months ago. The impression I got from the one I went to was that it's more in the mind than anything else. The chiro would do a manipulation then strongly suggest that he can feel parts are more balanced or range of motion has increased. It felt like a stage show.
One thing he did was to ask me to close my eyes, then he lightly tapped my eyelids with his finger and told me one eye had higher pressure than the other. After doing some manipulations he repeated the process and said the pressure is now balanced.
The treatment table had a peculiar feature where a small part under the chest can be tilted upwards and released with a lever. He pressed down on one part of my back (like a thump) and released the tilt at the same time. The tilt then collapsed with a loud sound which feels like it's designed to make the patient think something in the bones just got realigned.
I went back for a second session to give him the benefit of the doubt but it was more of the same so I never went back after.
I had that similar experience too but you can tell a good one when it can name say for example your C7, C8 were slightly off and that was contributing to your shoulder pain (words to that effect). I don't know if it was true but at the very least he went through with me the specifics.
Put it this way, if it's only 20 minutes, I wouldn't go back again to that joint. I had a few of that. This one I am going atm is at least 45mins sometimes 1 hour.
but you can tell a good one when it can name say for example your C7, C8 were slightly off
I'm not trying to dismiss your experiences, but anyone can learn a few medical terms in a few hours, and appear to be knowledgeable. That doesn't necessarily make them better at getting you what you want to achieve - in fact this can actually make them even more dangerous.
I appreciate your point of view.
But that is just prejudicial. If this is your view of any allied professional then why can't this be applied to medical professionals?
What I am trying to suggest is be open minded and consider that maybe not all allied professionals are bastards who are trying to impart you from your money.
I did my research too and didnt just blindly take whatever he said.
@burningrage: Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I was responding specifically to what you'd typed, I wasn't trying to make a general comment on chiros.
The fact is there are a lot of people, especially in the medical field, who consider chiros (in general) to be unqualified and dangerous. My response to you was an attempt at playing devil's advocate.
I've never been to a chiropractor. I have been to one physio who was great, and another physio for another issue who could've done some permanent damage had I not been suspicious and got extra scans done that showed his attempted remedial plan was making the problem worse.
I guess my overall message is - have a healthy amount of curiosity and scepticism and ask questions before accepting any professional's advice - and listen to your body.
but you can tell a good one when it can name say for example your C7, C8 were slightly off and that was contributing to your shoulder pain
well, C8 vertebra doesn't exist, there's only the C8 nerve. so if they say that, run for the hills
Osteos are also good. Great for my back.
Osteo. Reformative Pilates. BUT a GP first. Get a scan done etc.
Chiro is a good choice if you like wasting your money and you want the injury to get worse. Speaking from experience here
Earlier in life I fell awkwardly during a soccer game and injured my back. Went to physio for months without progress, 2 chiro sessions and it was fixed.
I'm mid 40s now but still active, heavy weights (squat / deadlift) , running, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu 5 times a week so getting smashed all week long. I have monthly chiro sessions as a way to maintain spine and neck health. Actually going tomorrow morning so at this point of the month everything is feeling pretty tight but will be great after tomorrow's session.
In the past I've seen physio for other things such as knee feeling funny but they never fixed anything in my experience. Even when I had a knee reconstruction all they did was massage the scar tissue (which I had to get fixed years later as they messed it up) and put me on their bike and squat machine. Useless.
You don't think the weight training and jiu Jitsu may have contributed to a positive impact on you recovery? Not really an affective control for the purpose of evidence based practice.
First things first- a lot of people say chiros are quacks. A lot of chiros are quacks, and try to offer service or advice outside their training. A good one can make a difference though.
My experience has been that chiro is good for symptomatic relief- it will reduce pain and stiffness temporarily. Physio will help fix the issue through exercises and other treatments like massage, dry needling, etc.
All of this though is predicated on finding a good therapist. Read reviews, look at what sort of clients they treat. If you're not athletic and it's not an exercise or sport related injury a sports physio probably isn't the right choice, go for someone who focuses on rehabilitation or functional treatments.
Also, don't be afraid to try a couple out. Everyone reckons their physio is the best because most people just stick with the first one they find.
This is as dumb as asking if people believe in vaccines.
What a coincidence, earlier tonight I read a post on reddit about someone who went to a chiro and then ended up having a stroke.
Here’s a journal article you should read. Inb4 any “scientific/medical journals are fake propaganda” comments.
I really hate pseudo-research being used to make a point. I just assume that to search for that article the mindset was "chiro bad, tell me what bad things they do".
Scientific/medical journals are definitely not fake propaganda. But if you're going to use a scientific article to back up a viewpoint you should include you asking several questions, like "Are there any biases present in this article", e.g. An article titled "Deaths after Chiropractic: a review" where the tiny scope itself tells you that it's not actually "a review".
Ask "If someone was arguing against this article, what would their proof be?" Then you can look that up, and go ahead and refute their shitty proof. And hopefully part of the article you're using to make your point does just that.
Also, a good bit of research will have some context, such as "Deaths after chiropractic manipulation vs. manipulations performed by alternate practitioners (physiotherapists, osteopaths, medical doctors) who also perform cervical spinal manipulations" or "Risk of serious injury due to chiropractic manipulation vs. alternative treatments for the same condition".
Luckily, this article also comes with some context in the form of several critiques, listed right next to the article in the pubmed link. That forms part of the peer-review process. Here's one finding that helps put the original article in context.
"However, because 90–95% of spinal manipulation is performed by chiropractors and 43% of the deaths reported in this study were caused by procedures performed by non-chiropractors, it appears as though chiropractors actually perform this procedure more safely than other professionals."
There's several more critiques of the article. But I'd say that the credibility of an article titled "Deaths after Chiropractic" is pretty suspect when it's found that almost half the case-studies they used were erroneously attributed to chiros.
""However, because 90–95% of spinal manipulation is performed by chiropractors and 43% of the deaths reported in this study were caused by procedures performed by non-chiropractors, it appears as though chiropractors actually perform this procedure more safely than other professionals."
'43% of deaths in this study were caused by non-chiropractors' would suggest '57% of deaths in the study were caused by chiropractors', wouldn't it? How is that a get out of jail card for the chiros?
Edit: I guess the 'logic' is the chiro-untrained racking up 43% of the kills while doing only 10% of the field work is the argument to saying chiros are 'safer'. But this is the same as saying it's safer to play russian roulette with a revolver that has 30 barrels instead of just the regular 6 (and ignoring the question "should you be playing russian roulette at all?")
@CrowReally: I agree with you. None of these patients should have had their spines manipulated by a chiro or otherwise. It was playing Russian roulette. Although if every other treatment for the same condition also carried a risk, and there was a risk associated with not treating the condition, then you can make a better arguement for chiros in this case.
If the article wasn't so disengenious it would have made a great contribution to the argument that the sudden onset of neck pain should require a referral to get an MRI or ultrasound to assess the patient for weakened corotid arteries and the possibility of thrombosis prior to any treatment.
But my main issue is that the article is obviously bias, contains no context, is half wrong, and therefore it can be pasted into forums like this as "proof" by people pretending to do research
@Mukduk: It's nice to be agreed with, but it's never quite as simple as that.
If the article is discussing the unwarranted risk of injury or even fatality of having non-doctors (chiropractor or not) manipulate the spine, then 'bias' has to come off the table. Scientific studies saying using homeopathy to cure cancer is an unnecessary risk are probably biased as well. Because there's public safety at sake.
Stating less than half of the fatality practitioners weren't traditionally trained in chiropractic technique so they shouldn't be classified as chiropractors seems churlish if you're also pushing the argument that chiropractors who didn't go to medical school should also get to call themselves doctors.
It's frankly chiropractors discovering first hand what happens when someone wants to pass themselves off as having abilities of a higher pay grade at the risk of a patient's health. Which is exactly why those doctors wrote that article in the first place.
@CrowReally: Your arguments are getting very fuzzy here.
It sounds like what you're saying is that the critique of this article that the 43% of people who were erroneously stated as being chiros were just untrained chiros in disguise? Sounds like a guess, there is zero evidence of that. And chiros are in fact not the only people who perform spinal adjustments.
Also nobody anywhere here is "pushing the argument that chiropractors who didn't go to medical school should also get to call themselves doctors." Ah yes, the strawman you created has been shot down?
It's frankly, not that at all. There's one author for this article, who's entire work can be summarised as "self-publishing my bias on the field of chiropractic".
I'm arguing against the use of a shitty article, and the use of poor research being used to make a point. Pseudo-research by people who never learnt how to conduct a literature review, who only read the headlines of an article before patting themselves on the back for having posted it on a forum somewhere.
@Mukduk: Fair points. I think you're letting the perfect be the enemy of the good ("Your arguments that chiropractors are dangerous was not entirely well supported, there would have been better ways to articulate this accepted fact" etc etc) but if those are the windmills at which one tilts, you do you.
@CrowReally: I don't mind dying on this hill, after all I've seen of anti-vaxxers and conspiracy nuts using this exact brand of pseudo-research I'll call it out regardless of whether I believe the research supports what others believe is in the publics best interest.
You're more than welcome to link any published work that reports "Chiros are amazing, safe and everyone should use them". Good luck finding one.
@Typical16-bitEnjoyer: Why? So that you can pretend you know how to read another article?
Make sure the next time you see your cardiologist that you first find a paper entitled "cardiologists are amazing, safe and everyone should use them". You know, like even if they don't have heart problems. Genius
Osteo FTW!
Physio, because it doesn't require belief.
Q: What do you call alternative medicine that works?
A: Medicine.
Plenty of millionaires had dropped out of uni.
If Jack Ma had succeded in any of his 14 job applications at KFC then ebay would not have a competitor.your comment vs. price of fish?
If Jack Ma had succeded in any of his 14 job applications at KFC then ebay would not have a competitor.
Ooh, what auction site does he run?
as far as I know it is not Wish.com but you get negged here to tell the truth!
When was the last time you bought something from eBay using anything other than the "Buy it now" button? The auction aspect of eBay is tiny fraction of its trade these days.
When was the last time you bought something from eBay using anything other than the "Buy it now" button?
26th of November. Before that, the 24th. Before that was the 31st of October, then 23rd Oct, 18th Oct, 28th Sept. All auctions. eBay is a great place to find used non-everyday items from around the world. There is no real alternative.
I keep throwing things into my cart and then get usually cheaper offers.
Why pay more?
Look outside the box - have you tried a Myotherapist? Does good deep tissue massage and will send you home with exersise recommendations to help keep you flexible. I've had physio, chiro, naturopath, musculo-skaletal therapy… Myotherapy is miles ahead in terms of relief and long term benefit.
In Brazil, Chiropraxis is a college bachelor's degree, and I had one fix me up quite well several times.
I had slightly dislodged my collar bone doing bench press, and I left his office with half the pain I went in with. His advice on care for full recovery were also on point.
So yeah, if chiros in Australia don't really need anything else other than an Udemy course, I wouldn't believe them. But the problem doesn't seem to be Chiropraxis itself, but the quality of available professionals.
Chiropractors are as good as naturopaths. If you think it works then it works.
Welcome to old age when your body begins to tell you that your better days have long gone.
See your doctor first… it is most probably signs of arthritis: Pain, Stiffness, Inflammation of the joints.
Get smarter - you are old enough now to draw upon your "wits".
Go on Utube for advice. I find myself sitting watching Utube on the TV… there, many will show you various stretching techniques with common household items, e.g. using a towel, etc.
Further, you can look at natural remedies, also on Utube, where Turmeric would be mostly recommended.
I'm about to pop a Turmeric right now.
If tension, stress related, look at magnesium…. and contrary to what they say… go and have a glass of salty water: just mix some table salt in water and drink.
Your body is a battery and requires salt for the nerves to function properly. A glass of saline will do wonders for cramps.
Cheers
Bones hurting at the neck is a bit vague.
Chiro: Useful if you say slept funny and and now have a sore neck and it hurts to turn your head one way to check your blind spot but the other way is fine. Usually includes a massage of sorts to loosen up the offending muscle group and an adjustment can be made for instant relief. Really only works from skull to hip.
Physio: Torn muscle or ligament, go to them. I havent been to one since being a teenager and played too much sport
Massage: Went a few times only, never thought much of it. Just relaxing. However recently I pinched a nerve in my back which happens now and then. Usually I would need my chiro. This one was quite bad and it hurt to walk so I was basically bed ridden. After 2 days I could walk far enough as mum made me an appointment at her "very good masseuse". I was skeptical! After an hour, some heat lamp etc etc I could walk without pain and within a couple of days I was 90%. Sure it hurt like hell and its probably the tightest back she ever massaged. Pretty expensive massage though, $50 just for one section of my back.
Acupuncture: went once, didnt notice anything. Mum keeps trying to get me to go but its just voodoo BS to me.
The problem with all of the above is your experience will depend on the person treating you. My Chiro is a physio too so I would suggest that combo, he left to work at AIS so I had to find another but ended up learning to adjust myself for all the minor stuff
acupuncture worked miracles for me, this was after trying traditional medecine and being in such pain after being hit in the back to the point to having trouble breathing. yes, being a guy i waited about 2 weeks to seek medical advice.
They stuck needles in my hand and put coloured lights on my back and i couldnt believe the pain relief. miraculous in 20 mnThe traditional doctor only gave me good for nothing tramadol, which i popped like no tomorrow (again being a guy who reads the prescription)
however a friend went to the same doctor after falling off her motorcycle and it was a very mild success
Chiros usually get me in my underwear to do crazy exercises, which i find hilarious and never follow through - i go to unis teaching this so its pretty cheap
I've never tried physios but those i know doing that job are pretty lazy, not sure they all try their besti'm surprised nobody has mentioned crystals :D
Osteo > Physio > Chiro
my colleagues seem to think like this
Yeap. Osteo by a country mile.
Osteo will crack your joints, releive pain with deep tissue massage, set you on a solid exercise and strengthening pathway, and all round will sort you out.They are best all rounder IMO.
Physiotherapist by a mile out of Chrio osteo and Physio
Physiotherapist are the only ones part of the Allied health group of practitioners
The rest are alternative medicine
I'm simply terms physios are backed by evidence based practice and it is recognised at a national level
I don't think this is right. Chrio & Osteo are both part of allied health.
Well there you go, i stand corrected i always assumed on physios worked in the public system ie hosptials etc
Thanks OP
Yep it seems that a lot of alernative medicines are still a part of allied health.
The real crazy ones are excluded.. homeopathy ..
In a lot of universities and especially in the medical industries, Chiros are thought of as a snake oil salesman. Placebo effect or at best very short term effects. Physios at least work with muscles and strengthening the surrounding areas to provide extra support and fixes for the issue in the mid to long term.
Chiro is great if your back or neck is out of alignment. They can sort it out almost immediately with a few cracks and give you instant relief.
And how did your neck or back get out of alignment? Poor positioning, muscle imbalance etc. This is what a physio will help fix.
It's not always some kind of imbalance than needs fixing.
If you do any kind of physical sport you can get into all kinds of awkward positions that will throw your back out.
Usually that just means you’ve stressed or strained a muscle, so that load is now being transferred to other muscles and the damaged muscle isn’t healing.
Physics excel in that.
@JSONBourne: When your spine is out of alignment, the muscles in the area are all tight and sore trying to pull it back into place.
One little crack from the chiro and that joint is back in place, so the muscles can relax, that's the instant relief.
Physios, because it's based on evidence based practice + research.
Saying that there are good physios and bad Physios, just as there are good chrios and bad chiros.
If you don't get results in 2-3 sessions then try another therapist
Who Do You Believe in
Santa.
The real answer is Osteo
I "believed in" my Physio that much that I married her … true story! 16 years later she's still got me fully conned … :-D
I "believed in" my Physio that much that I married her
But she doesn't believe in cracking your bone.
"There is no conclusive evidence that chiropractic manipulative treatment is effective for the treatment of any medical condition, except perhaps for certain kinds of back pain".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiropractic#Effectiveness
"Physical therapy has been found to be effective for improving outcomes, both in terms of pain and function, in multiple musculoskeletal conditions. A 2012 systematic review found evidence to support the use of spinal manipulation by physical therapists as a safe option to improve outcomes for lower back pain.[65] According to randomized control trials, a combination of manual therapy and supervised exercise therapy by physiotherapists give functional benefits for patients with osteoarthritis of the knee, and may delay or even prevent the need for surgery."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physical_therapy#Effectiveness
Whilst I have heard some complaints from physicians noting that physiotherapy can't fix everything -i.e. that the benefits epoused are exaggerated by some physios - with regards to peer reviewed studies, physiotherapy has scientific basis whilst chiropractic manipulation does not.
Physio is a real science backed by scientific evidence.
Chiro is a quackery which requires hardly any study. May as well buy some crystals.
I think Chiro is quackery as well, but hardly any study? That's absolutely not true. Their initial qualifying course is 5 years at all the Australian universities that offer it. Physiotherapy is 4 years.
Which universities are offering 5 year qualifying course for Chiro?
I believe there are 4 - RMIT, Macquarie, Murdoch and CQU. And they're all 5 years (more or less) for initial registration.
@downbythecreek: It makes me wonder why Melbourne University, University of Sydney, University of Queensland, Perth and so on do not offer a Chiropractic course. Aren't the ones you mentioned all private universities? Perhaps they only offer it because it's a revenue earner.
@WrittenByKevinWatson: No, they're all public universities. I don't know why they offer it, but it must be worthwhile as they haven't stopped.
I hurt my back last year and neither were any help to me. I tried 3 different physios too. They all thought they could fix me but it just got worse.
Turns out I had a ruptured disc. What helped was about 3 months of not bending my back at all, not even sitting. Then after the disc had healed just started slowly bending my back again.
I know they can help for certain injuries, it just hasn’t filled me with lots of confidence. I wasted around $2000 in sessions and turns out they had no idea what was wrong. Just going through the usual steps.
Chiros are quacks. They are after your money. You cannot move bones from small 5m manipulation. It's total bullshit. I got caught into this when trying to fix my back. The physiotherapist helped me. The (profanity) chiro slurped my money
My previous physiotherapist was hitting on me for sex
then I noticed Rapist in their title.physiotherapists are trained allied health professionals. they are bound by lots of regulations like a doctor.
chiros are not.there are also different types of physiotherapists. Orthopedic, Neurological, Geriatric, Cardiovascular, Pediatric. Best to get the one who specializes in your condiiton
Gotta love how Chiros:
-Need you to come back every 2-4 weeks for months or years on end… are they actually fixing the problem?
-Everyone has some sort of “misalignment” according to any chiro who lays their hands on you, no matter how healthy you are.
-Are one sided in terms of the treatment, so you have to come back every time
-Disguise themselves under the title “a medical Dr” yet they couldn’t even take your blood pressure or tell you how a vaccine works
-Prey on the fact you cant read X-rays so they’ll tell you this or that is out of whack and you’ll believe it
-Tell you that every problem you have in life is due to some sort of musculoskeletal problem that they can apparently ‘adjust’
-Work on the power of placebo.. which they profit greatly fromMD here. Take a look at their wikipedia page. It says enough. You’d likely get a better result just having a remedial massage without the bullshit upsell.
Melbourne Uni has a course "Doctor of physiotherapy" yet physiotherapists are not considered doctors either.
The "Doctor of…" is a misnomer. I don't agree or like it either and I think it's a marketing ploy by universities. Nonetheless, the degrees are legitimate.
Chiropractors are unfortunately allowed to use the Dr title though. As long as they don't attempt to make it seem like they have a medical degree.
It's absolute bullshit but whatever.Just the other day I had a family member of a patient who was persistently trying to get in contact with me and when she was like "I'm a doctor… of chinese medicine" it took everything I had to not sigh out aloud. (she wasn't chinese either).
@diazepam: No I meant that the degree being named “doctor of” is a misnomer. Doesn’t technically make one a doctor in any traditional sense (not a PHD and not necessarily a medical practitioner degree).
Calling oneself a Dr is also not prohibited under ahpra laws as it’s not a protected title. Heck anyone can call themselves one if they wanted to.
@Jaystea: Yeah not really sure how the unis can get away with that… it’s not a doctorate
Even the MD is a masters by coursework…
@diazepam: No decent universities offer chiropractic courses though. You might as well get your doctorate from bovine university.
Physiotherapy degrees are tough. They do have real knowledge of the body in multiple areas (muscular, respiratory, neuro etc)
I won't give my opinion, but real results. I had sharp pain in my elbow for 4 months after an injury. Had 4 chiro sessions in a month and at the end my elbow was back to normal. Could a physio have worked too? Of course.
Osteopath is almost between the 2, does the cracking/manipulation like a chiro and the massage, stretching and teaching of strengthening exercises like a physio. Having been to all 3 over the years an osteo worked best for me.
But like every profession there's some who are really good and others who are useless so check reviews before you book
As someone studying Osteo, it's great to see people with positive experiences in the field:)
I'm 38 with a back and neck that's stuffed. Been going to osteos for the last 15 years, not a good quality of life without them
Chiros are quacks.
There's a reason you'll never find them in a hospital, and a reason practically every uni has ditched their chiropractic courses. There's only 3-4 actual unis left that entertain quackery.