If you own a Tesla Model 3, tell us about your experience.
Any regrets? How's depreciation? Bought new/secondhand? Any issues?
Also.. just wondering for the general ozBargainer.. is a Tesla Model 3 something you'd ever consider, not over a Camry of course, but do you think it's worth it?
I'm going through my half yearly phase where I really want a new car and going down the rabbit hole, this time its for the Model 3. Just want to know what everyone's thought on it is.
No
double negation?
Yes! Wait… no, sorry.
Also No
Nein!
Yay!
@Kangal: .
What about my food delivery car (AE86) which I have slapped a Tesla sticker on to cover a dent? Does that also count as a Tesla?
Nope
아니요
why Tesla? Aren't there other EV options?
Some of it is hype, but if a hyundai electric is 60k, might as well pay a bit more and get the tesla.
Most other EV with similar range starts off around the same price. Haven't really done much research into other models though tbh.
for the same price tesla is miles ahead in range and performance.
Why the ‘might as well’ with a Tesla?
Might as well buy a Hyundai as they’ve been making cars for longer, have better quality control and have a bigger dealer network.
I'll tell you why I think Tesla is probably the only choice… apart from a Taycan if you're extremely rich.
If you buy an EV from a traditional company you'll need specialist care at the dealer.
If your dealer specialises in petrol cars how many EV techs do you think really know their shit there? The dealers known for using apprentices.
Yeah exactly. Buying an EV is like buying a niche model like an R35 GTR from Nissan. Its their baby but how many techs at Nissan see Xtrails Pathfinders vs. an R35.
Tesla ONLY deal with EVs. That's their bread and butter.
I would imagine 66% of their turnaround is Model 3s.
And still no other car company supplies the complete package like a Model 3. Now you may say the quality isnt there. I get that but at this point the Shanghai cars shat all over the Fremont cars and the base $60k Tesla is fair buying. As far as electronics integration no one comes close to Tesla.
Or maybe we shuld be getting use to $2-$2.50 petrol… I hate to say this… I'm despise Elon Musk but its hard to deny there's a reason why his company is worth $1.2 trillion and Toyota is worth $0.3 trillion.
@tonyjzx: You know Nissan has been selling EV for 9 years yeah?
I also hope you never experience Tesla for repairs etc for something as simple like a replacement headlamp since they have zero logistics in Australia.
@plmko: I hope you mean a mobile service that you book through the Tesla app that comes to you anywhere when you say ‘zero logistics’. And with a decent warranty that headlight is going to be a free replacement.
@plmko: That's completely false, care to back that up with evidence?
There's quite a number of tesla service centers and authorised repairers. They also have mobile repair guys that come to you.
@tonyjzx: Nissan dealers have to send a technician to Nissan school for months at the dealers expense to learn about the R35 GTR and have to pay higher dealership fees to have the 'prestige' to sell the GTR brand (not every dealer can work on them, they won't be able to order parts and wont have technical documents).
Do you really think the 1st year/2nd year that starts working on 15K services will next minute be doing highly technical battery mods on your ioniq5? you have no idea of how dealerships work when it comes to specialised vehicle lines.
And how do you think these mechanics you entrust get to work on the highly technical vehicles? They start life as apprentices so stop shaming the industry, you wouldn't say the same to a medical student (oh, you only have a pHd?)
And lastly, what is the component of the not so profitable car business of Tesla vs the internet network and other operations tesla as a company is involved in?
@Boogerman: My point is it's still technical training, junior web developer a bit more to your liking then? But when that 'dumbass idiot' apprentice mechanic is dealing with your brakes/tyres/suspension you may want him to have a high IQ and competency, just like a doctor. Master tech status is a lot more than just oil changes.
@[Deactivated]: Medical doctors don’t graduate with a PhD. Never have. Today’s Aussie doctors graduate with an MD, which is recognised as an AQF level 9, ie a Masters level degree.
@Ozpit: And apprentices don't become master technicians for their brand/s once they finish their apprenticeships, but they spend time and money (company and private) and go to manufacturer courses for sometimes weeks at a time.
@Ozpit: 'Today’s Aussie doctors graduate with an MD'
interesting - I didn't know that - my father had MBBS - Bachelor of Medicine and Bachelor of Surgery
last I looked MD was a standard in the US, not in Australia, unless that's started to change and upstairs universities are now offering online courses in medicine.
I would question if they'd be admitted to practice as a medical doctor by the AMA if they didn't have MBBS - other 'medical' degrees I've seen are more about working in a clinic as a medical technician, not as a GP
@mdavant: Multiple universities failed to meet the research component for the MD recognition. So not just lettering, has clearly defined program differences.
@Gradesbrah: Research does not matter one iota to one's competence.
Sure you might have to do a few token projects to blow your way onto a program but doing a useless review etc is not going to make you a better doctor.
MD Vs bmed Vs MBBS all can do everything that the others do.
@mdavant: It matters for most training program applications, several large training hospitals place significant emphasis on previous research experience, some training programs you are not considered without a PhD, which I know of three fantastic clinicians well respected who were turned down for Dept head roles without a PhD.
PhD programs at three universities indicated my wife’s MBBS is insufficient to meet the previous research requirements this was despite demonstrated addition research that is published, my MD automatically did.
Personally I am a strong advocate for science/research based learning In medical school and as a DiT, if you do not appreciate research systems you cannot appreciate nuance treatment planning in the edge cases that fall outside of guidelines. In general, I agree the lettered have zero correlation to the quality of doctor. The best clinician I know who has graduated in the last 10 years is an MBBS - I married her, the second best had a bmed (but did a medsci year for honours). My cohort was hundreds of MDs less than ten I would let them treat a family member as primary physician/surgeon.
@Gradesbrah: Exactly.
Do what must be done to blow your way onto a program and apart from that the letters make no difference.
research makes stuff all difference which is why a vast majority of the physicians I work with have zero zip zilch research projects post acceptance into a program.
As well as that, often research is a waste of time away from helping patients.
Sure, contributing to the pools of data is admirable but you can garner as much knowledge in 1 hour reading a good paper as you do wasting valuable days /weeks etc designing and executing a well thought out, valuable project.
A vast majority of "research" I have seen physicians do to blow their way onto a program would never be cited by any reputable paper as they are superficial checkbox projects.
We all know that getting onto a program is all most want.
@mdavant: Yes, I agree that training progress is the primary focus of most.
You said there was no difference between the degree titles, the fact is there is a difference even if you believe it is a nonsensical one or one of know real world value. Personally I enjoyed my research component and I made some relatively usefulness contributions to the systems I was working on, something that lead to change in how the world did something. There are plenty is small contributions every year of the same nature, overtime systems improve and we appreciate the innovation that occurs over decades. A lot of that is small contributions in piecemeal form. The other major benefit is the exposure to research as an area, for a majority it is bothersome but for some it captures their interest and they aim to have it as a part of their career moving forward.
My wife did the MBBS, never did research until gaining fellowship and then decided to pursue a PhD to advance her understanding and work towards filling a knowledge gap in the specialty.
Medicine was built on evidence based advancements. The modern day medicine understanding was by physicians who were scientists many came through the master & apprentice model.
@Gradesbrah: So on the flip side. Bmed MBBS must be better doctors as they have spent more time doing real medicine instead of research rubbish?
They are all the same.
@mdavant: Most MBBS programs had substantial theory courseload, much of this is addressed in MD programs having condensed theory curriculums which leverage the students pre-existing self guided study experience.
I stated the best doctor I know did MBBS, but clinical performance is based on clinical performance and I have not read any studies comparing the outcomes of the different course structures. I am only stating that objective differences exist, some very relevant to people but not to others.
All the best with things.
@Gradesbrah: I'm glad your experience with self directed learning is better than what I have witnessed.
Sure, self directed learning is the best way to learn, but a lot of the people I studied with needed lectures / direction.
I just can't see how research study can replace this.
But if you believe it can, then the flip side is that the research component of a MD is replaceable by some self directed learning too.
Hence no real difference. It is almost like saying usyd is better than uq. Effectively nobody can tell where an intern is from, well I can't anyway, nor whichever qualification they are most proud of.
@tonyjzx: "I'm despise Elon Musk but its hard to deny there's a reason why his company is worth $1.2 trillion and Toyota is worth $0.3 trillion."
hype. america is full of impressionable idiots
Or maybe we shuld be getting use to $2-$2.50 petrol… I hate to say this… I'm despise Elon Musk but its hard to deny there's a reason why his company is worth $1.2 trillion and Toyota is worth $0.3 trillion.
The reason Tesla is worth $1.2t and Toyota only $0.3t has nothing to do with the cars they produce. In fact, I would say that the cars Tesla are producing today are basically still proof of concept of EVs.
Tesla is the largest manufacturer of batteries and basically have huge purchasing power in much of that supply chain. On top of that, Tesla own a swathe of EV-related patents that they are going to earn plenty off of.
Basically, Tesla is the modern-day Microsoft, whereas Toyota is the modern-day IBM. I wouldn't be surprised if over time, most of Tesla's revenue won't even come from the cars they produce, but the royalties and fees charged to other EV manufacturers and what they make from batteries. I can already imagine other EV manufacturers basically building cars using technology developed by Tesla, possibly even using Tesla batteries.
@tonyjzx: 100% with your assessment on choosing Tesla, if you are in the market for an EV.
Valuation wise, i think it would be better if we could away all the government subsidy towards EV and renewalbe at large, around the world, then we can have a fairer valuation on a more level ground.
@tonyjzx: I agree with the above 100%. I would recommend Tesla for my folks, but I will never touch one just just on principal and will wait for EV from other main stream manufacturers down the line.
I'm despise Elon Musk but its hard to deny there's a reason why his company is worth $1.2 trillion and Toyota is worth $0.3 trillion.
His companies COMBINED.
Tesla is worth $283bn, compared to Toyota's $240bn. So nearly the same. Also Tesla's build quality is still rather shoddy. Toyota, known for their quality control, have been in the EV game far longer than Tesla has and has the highest selling EV, the Prius, which has been around for what, nearly 20 years now? Their fully EV powered car, the Camry hybrid was well established long before Tesla came into the scene.
So your whole argument is flawed
@tonyjzx: Tesla is so much more than a car company so comparing it's valuation against a car company is silly.
Dealer network = financial baggage. Hyundai will be broke probably before 2030.
Test drive a Hyundai EV. Then test drive a Tesla. They are not the same. Tesla makes a compelling product, Hyundai makes a product.
Tesla’s quality control from either Fremont or Shanghai is currently on par with any of the best automakers out there. Look up the recent reviews.
Hyundai will be broke probably before 2030
I almost fell off my chair, Hyundai, Ford, Toyota will all be around longer than Tesla.
@[Deactivated]: Yes, they have been around longer than Tesla. That is no metric to support them outlasting Tesla. Many people will continue to fall of their chairs.
Majority if not all legacy automakers will be a shadow of their former selves. They will either be broke or have merged with another company.
Meanwhile Tesla will be producing about 20 Million cars in 2030.
See you in 2030…
mic drop
@steven00007: of those 20 million, how many will be the 'dead in the water' cyber-semi tesla zealots keep stroking?
still waiting 3 years after 'scheduled production' to begin.
@[Deactivated]: Rephrase the your first sentence, I’m a Tesla fan and even I can’t understand it.
Re: 3 year wait comment.
Which Tesla product are you referring to? 3 years won’t seem long whilst people wait for the GM hummer or a decent EV.
The 3 year wait is because they have SO much demand, thus they are to DOUBLE the amount of factories they have. The Tesla Model 3 is the most popular luxury car in the world. Period.
Also making EVs is hard, thus no legacy auto maker has made one at scale yet or even made a compelling one yet. They are trying to work it out but their engineers don’t have the knowledge and will be bankrupt/merged by 2030.
@MrThing: I’ve done a fair whack of research and yet to see any evidence that points to otherwise.
Tesla have been making and researching EVs for 10+ years. That gives them a minimum of a 5 year lead on anyone else.
Tesla ‘per vehicle’ are twice as profitable as Volkswagen. Imagine when they ramp production further.
Also the Model Y will overtake the Toyota Corolla as the worlds most popular car in a couple years. Model Y production capacity is about to crazy in the next 6-12 months. They will be selling them here in Australia sometime next year. Likely first half.
@[Deactivated]: It’s hard to grasp the future. That’s why people look backwards to label the TSLA market capitalisation farcical
@Boogerman: I await with massive pleasure to see conventional car makers falter.
Once 2025/30/35 hits and ICE becomes either banned or non viable, watch how many can transistion.
This is from someone who likes motorsport, likes race cars, sports cars, V8s, turbo imports.
Conventional car companies need a reckoning. Like oil companies they need to fall.
TBF Tesla isnt a dream company either, they have massive issues in product and labour but in the same way Uber destroys taxis you need a wolf to fight wolves.
I took great delight in seeing Honda Holden Ford fail in this country.
What the hell do I care for rich US multinationals…. and Honda.
@tonyjzx: It's easy not to care about the encumbent car companies in Australia because they treat us like a toilet. They give us crap models, with worse specs, worse safety, charge us up the arse while taking subsidies from the government and then when the subsidies stop they shut up shop an f off with our money. They can and should all get f'd
Tesla at least supports their software. If a patch comes out elsewhere, it's a matter of time for it to be available here. Actually providing features to customers they didn't have, when other companies are stopping support only a few years after someone drops 60k on their cars. The next automotive powerhouse is China, but 95% of people in Australia have no idea yet. In 10 years half of us will be in Chinese made cars. Jeez even Australia posts fleet are now from SAIC Motors.
@[Deactivated]: Ford is in some serious financial trouble. They seem to be taking EV more seriously than they did, but every time they sell one they eat an ICE sale with a bigger profit margin. Unless Toyota gets off this Hydrogen thing they could be in the toilet too.
@steven00007: So basically when you say "test drive a Hyundai", you wouldn't actually know what you're talking about.
@AlanHB: What % of people who test drive one, buy one.
What % of people who test drive a Tesla drive one, buy one. The instant torque of electric motors gets people by surprise. There is no lag when you put the foot down.
It's basically like saying why buy apple? Tesla has a higher resale value, more in demand and a better network.
Test drive their EV's but do not expect too much.
This
I have driven:
Tesla 3 - boring look and feel, good range and good acceleration
Merc - luxury feel, crappy range and acceleration.
Volvo - fun to drive but range is not so good.
It just other cars need to catch up and they slowly getting there.
Yeah I find the Tesla 3 to be super boring. It's the Apple of the car world, people either love it or hate it.
Personally think Model 3 looks boring as all hell too, but at that price level, its probably the best looking ones.
How do you define "boring"? Is there any set of objective criteria?
Model 3 isn't special to look at, but it's not a boring car. Especially when the majority of Ozb recommends buying boxes like Camrys and Corollas.
Which Merc?
I tested the EQA seemed reasonable, smacked 82k on salesmen's desk but he said no way, we are now sham contractors and unless you get a lucrative finance packet we can not even pay for the power of the showroom!
@boomramada "It just other cars need to catch up and they slowly getting there."
They are way behind and will possibly go bust before they can catch up with Tesla
Because people only like Apple phones.
Yes I like Apple and love Android!!!
I'm approaching my every 2 decade phase of considering a car and I already know I will tell myself that I should wait 10 years for the technology to get cheaper and improve in quality. Basically what I told myself about electric bicycles 5 years ago (5 years left until I revisit potentially buying one of those).
Maybe try think of it this way. How many decades you got left?
how many decades do you think our society has left given the global warming thing?
to me an EV is worth it just so i never had to visit a servo ever again nor pay 42c excise.
I could give a shit about the NSW VIC sub $500 ev tax a year.
Does anyone enjoy the current $1.95 petrol nonsense? There's your answer there.
You really think the time our society "has left" can be measured in "decades"…?
You really have bought in haven't you…
@Binchicken22: Why worry over projections? ICCC is an intergovernmental panel, not a scientific panel. Temperatures are regularly below the 95% confidence interval of doomsday projections.
You'll be paying an excise in one way or the other once EVs become a significant market share. The government aren't just going to let that stream dry up.
Please don’t… looks like I’m about to be sent to the penalty box again after I upset all the fanbois one more time.
Bring it on… Let's go!
Ok… let’s have some fun…
InB4:
No regrets, best decision I ever made.
What’s “depreciation”?? Tesla’s only increase in value.
There are no second hand Tesla cars. Owners never sell. They have the longest ownership span of any car. 147 years on average.
No issues. Panel gaps, build quality issues, fires and autopilot crashes are all fake news
“Ever consider?” Tesla should be your only consideration.
Worth it? It’ll pay for itself in 3 years and only goes up in value.
ICE is dead, EV is the future. Buy now is the general consensus…
And don’t forget, you’ll need as much $TSLA stock your broker will let you buy and you may as well start up and Instagram account for your car while you wait for delivery.
oh man the panel gaps. I walked by a random tesla the other day and it was visible from 10 meters away. Horrendous.
@coffeeinmyveins: I still maintain a Tesla only makes sense if you own a freestanding house with a pretty sophisticated solar cell setup that can 100% push all the power to the car.
Now if you can afford what is a million plus house in Sydney then a $60k Model 3 isnt even a blip to you.
And as a daily commuter but since I dont think I've driven over 300km in on stretch over 2yrs (thanks covid) then a Model 3 range is fine for me.
Then again if you own a house you can afford a petrol car as well.
@tonyjzx: So, getting 300km out of $12 worth of electricity is not worth it unless you have solar and it's $0-$3? Bizarre take.
@apiecost: 60k car with say free fuel Vs a 20k car with 2.5k fuel for a year.
Yeah, nah, the sums still don't add up.
@coffeeinmyveins: Walked up many dealers and usually sales ladiies pointing at their gap in hope I fall for it. Sorry, seen 100's of Teslas never been bothered by slight metal mismatch.
ICE is dead, EV is the future
Ignoring everything else said, this is absolutely true. For commuter cars, public transport, etc - ICE is dead.
Dead = almost no market relevance.
There will always be a place for ICE cars, just as we still have horse and carts today.
@iDroid: ICE isn’t dead, it’s retired and getting dementia. one offspring is trying like hell to get it into the nursing home while the rest of them are doing everything possible to keep it in the family home that’s falling down around it.
@Euphemistic: Yep ICE is dead, go burn down all your cars with ICE. EVs global 2.5% market share will take over and replace all ICE vehicles. While burning down your ICE vehicles make sure to purchase some Floki inu coins and you should leapfrog to the future and be a divine being in year 2100
@asafasr: They will be taxed so high that only people with high income can afford the running costs.
@pegaxs
Spot on! couldn't have said it better myself.
Anyone thinking about buying a new car please test drive a model 3, there's no simple way to describe it, it's the only way forward.
yeah but nah I'm buying my Tesla from my Roulette winnings
I'm keen if you're able to run a training course?
Any reasons?
Overpriced still
I think maybe worth considering when it is 30-40k.
No