$248 Fine for Forgetting My Headlights

TightBum on 21/07/2021 - 10:52
Last edited 22/07/2021 - 00:17

Hey Guys,

I got pulled over by the cops and received a fine for forgetting to turn my headlights & backlights on at night which I understand is dangerous and was genuinely a mistake on my part and I thought I had them on, I even saw the cops pull up behind me when I was at the red lights so if I knew they were off I would have turned them on.

I confused my start light with my headlights, the car I was driving has a headlights which come on when you start the car, which I thought were the actual headlights at the time, they don't look all that different until you're in a not so well lit area and I had just started to drive on the main road where it was really well lit.

Given I have never been fined for this before, I thought I'd at least get off with an official warning so I tried challenging this for an internal review when I received the fine but I had no luck with that. So now I can either pay the fine or challenge it in court.

I understand how dangerous it was but getting a fine for genuinely confusing my 2 headlights when I have a good driving record seems a bit extreme. The cop who fined me seemed like he was having a bad night, I was been pretty responsive and compliant through the whole exchange and he got super defensive pretty aggressive when I was surprised that my backlights weren't on.

Has anyone had any experience challenging fines in court? Or should I just fine pay the fine and get over it.
Maybe next time I'll get a car that has auto lights to avoid this experience all together..

Update:

Thanks everyone for your input. After reading the comments, I clearly didn’t know the difference between a DRL and headlights before this incident. I feel like people assume I forgot to turn on my headlights when I got confused by the two. I do always check for my headlights even during the day when I drive as I’ve had a near collision with someone in the past because they didn’t have their lights on. The car I was driving that night wasn’t my car, it was my first time driving it and I thought they were my headlights as they’re pretty bright for DRLs. The police didn’t even pick up on my headlights when they pulled me over they thought my taillights were broken until I played around with the lights to see what was going on. In hindsight, I should have asked the owner of the vehicle before I took off.

I’m obviously in the wrong for not having the correct lights on and I was just asking if anyone had any luck challenging it as the fine isn’t huge but still a fair amount for someone who lost their job to Covid. From reading the comments there seem to be payment options so this seems like a fair option.

I do hope for those of you that thinks that the punishment should have been harsher receive some compassion when you do something wrong because of an honest mistake in the future. Y’all making it out like I’m driving recklessly going 40kms over the speed limit while running reds.

Automotive

Comments

  • MS Paint on 21/07/2021 - 10:56
    +37

    You are confusing headlights with daytime running lights (DRLs)

    DRLs do not turn your tail lights on.

    Does you dashboard light up as soon as you start the car day or night? This feature confuses many.

    • plmko on 21/07/2021 - 11:13
      +6

      It's going to get worse when digital dash gauges are a standard feature.

      • ATangk on 23/07/2021 - 11:51

        Digital gauges are like dark and light modes usually.

    • Lichen6420 on 21/07/2021 - 13:33
      +13

      Most dashboard are lit up day and night these days.

      • spackbace on 21/07/2021 - 14:19
        +1

        Depends whether the driver sets it to full brightness when the headlights are on, which is normally way too bright for night driving

        • capslock janitor on 22/07/2021 - 11:04

          i miss that feature in my 90s corolla - dial to turn up/down brightness and only lights up at night with headlights on

          • spackbace on 22/07/2021 - 11:13
            +2

            @capslock janitor:

            dial to turn up/down brightness

            Whether it's a dial or a button, every car has this feature still…

            • capslock janitor on 22/07/2021 - 11:16
              +1

              @spackbace: my bad i should put more emphasis on the dash "only lights up at night with headlights on" which is the bigger feature i appreciate

      • Nebargains on 22/07/2021 - 10:06
        +1

        Same, my dash is always lit up. I have forgotten to turn my headlights on before, so easy to do, especially if you say enter a car park while its light, then leave when its dark but the car park is well lit so you don't notice it, then if the roads are busy enough and there is street lights you can easily not notice.

        Personally I think a near $300 fine is a bit over the top. It's not like we have an epidemic of motorists driving around without their lights on, I rarely see it, in comparison we see people speeding all the time.

        I would have thought a warning would have sufficed.

    • SF3 on 21/07/2021 - 19:51
      +16

      If OP, relies on whether the dashboard lights up to know if head lights are on, rather than checking if the "head light" indicator/lamp is active, that's the lesson.

      "The world's greatest teacher is pain." at $248.

  • Gervais fanboy on 21/07/2021 - 11:04
    +25

    Courts won’t help you if you are clearly guilty, you yourself have admitted to it anyways…

    You’ll just be wasting your time and resources over a lost cause. $248 isn’t that much, when you think about going to a court over it.

    • mrvaluepack on 21/07/2021 - 21:24

      Watch Caught in Providence and you'll be surprised how lenient some judges can be.

      • Gervais fanboy on 21/07/2021 - 22:48

        Okay thanks

        I’ll check it out 👍🏻

      • HelpMeiCantSee on 22/07/2021 - 08:34
        +16

        In Australia, they’re only lenient to crooks and junkies.

        • [Deactivated] on 22/07/2021 - 10:02
          +3

          Did you expect any different living in a country founded on convicts?

        • Antikythera on 22/07/2021 - 11:27
          +11

          come on now…also politicians and celebrities.

          edit: oops you already said those.

    • humdogg on 22/07/2021 - 13:06
      +5

      Again, avoid legal advice from Ozbargain.

      "Court's won't help you if you are clearly guilty" is not very accurate again. I (might) be mistaken but it is unlikely this offence has a mandatory fine. So, you could plead guilty and ask the Court to give you a different sentence./penalty that does not involve a fine, such as a good behaviour bond or a reduced fine, or a dismissal (but you are still guilty). You do this by pleading guilty, and doing a brief plea of your mitigating circumstances. Judge's discretion, but decent chance if you explain/show you have lost your job because of covid and the circumstances of driving a new car, the fine could be reduced. There is also a risk that the fine remains plus you pay court costs of between $100-200 on top. So mileage varies.

  • GG57 on 21/07/2021 - 11:06
    +75

    Pay the fine.
    Check your lights are on.

    • stueyh on 21/07/2021 - 13:00
      +11

      This is the only correct answer, I have seen accidents caused by people failing to have their headlights on in low light situations and it's really not fair on the others involved in the accident when it could have been so easily avoidable

    • CalmLemons on 21/07/2021 - 19:29

      i believe the law says that even before you drive your vehicle, you need to do a walk around to ensure all the lights are actually working - isn't it?

      Furthermore, you need to make sure your headlights are on?

      • AlanHB on 21/07/2021 - 21:28
        +16

        I haven't heard of that law before.

        That said, it was an instant death in Police Quest 1 if you didn't.

        • WhyAmICommenting on 22/07/2021 - 18:57
          +1

          Halt!

        • sickburn on 22/07/2021 - 22:36
          +2

          "Kick tyres"
          "Don't be so violent, Sonny"

  • pharkurnell on 21/07/2021 - 11:09
    +49

    Its amazing how many dark cars you see driving with no lights on at all in bad weather or after dark on the freeways in Melb…. every day

    • 87percent on 21/07/2021 - 11:21
      +11

      FTFY "Its amazing how many cars you see driving with no lights on at all"

      • Hybroid on 21/07/2021 - 12:58
        +4

        I actually notice far more cars with only one working light and other burnt out. Particularly taxis for some reason. Also very dangerous.

          • CalmLemons on 21/07/2021 - 19:24
            +6

            @Kangal: This week i've witnessed 6 black coloured cars without their headlights on this week alone.

            The issue with black cars in the dark or even dark colours, is that at night, they become completely invisible, especially if it's raining, and especially if they're beside you or behind you are you are merging.

            This is why darker coloured cars attract a higher insurance premium also.

            • Kangal on 21/07/2021 - 21:07
              -6

              @CalmLemons: I didn't know that they increase your insurance fee. Personally, in poor visibility or the dark if I can't see a White car in the dark, I won't see a Black car either and vice versa. Though you may be right in specific lower light scenarios.

              • DoctorCalculon on 21/07/2021 - 22:42
                +12

                @Kangal: Lighter colours reflect photons, and dark colours absorb them, which make the former more visible than the latter.
                These are scientific facts, and has nothing to do with being "car-racist".

            • Batapotamus on 24/07/2021 - 08:36

              @CalmLemons: Is this true? I've just bought my first black car. The last car was written off in a not at fault accident and we bought the same year and car but the luxury model and put down the extra $100 insurance down to being a step up in comfort…but colour.

              • CalmLemons on 01/08/2021 - 23:26
                +1

                @Batapotamus: Yes. Next time you get an insurance quote, check out the difference in price if you put black or white (it may depend on the model of car as some other features of the car may outrank in the algo).

                Risk is based on data. Colour of car, suburb of owner, experience, mileage all goes into it.

                For the record, another moron on the Monash today in a new black BMW X5, flashed him like 10 times, then he moved lanes thinking I wanted to overtake him. Then he drove infront of another car who flashed him repeatedly and he/she still didn't get the message.

                NFI wtf is with guys driving black cars these last 2 weeks and not having their lights on. Must just be more noticeable as they become very hard to spot in the dark because they're black so make drivers around them a lot more nervous. Only takes one bad move next to a big truck to take out every car across the lanes behind the guy.

    • Nebargains on 22/07/2021 - 10:08

      Really? In normal circumstances I would drive to work while its dark in the morning and usually be driving home when it is either dark or getting dark (most of the year anyway) and I rarely see it.

      • Antikythera on 22/07/2021 - 11:31
        +1

        I occasionally do a 6am starting shift while most are noon or 4pm starts and I've noticed the early morning traffic has a much higher quality of driver than my other commutes.

        • MS Paint on 22/07/2021 - 12:57

          I agree with this. Early morning shift work drivers are among the best in my experience too.

          • CalmLemons on 01/08/2021 - 23:28

            @MS Paint: Because everyone is awake. Arvo/twilight are fun, especially in glare.

  • oscargamer on 21/07/2021 - 11:09
    +53

    " The cop who fined me seemed like he was having a bad night, I was been pretty responsive and compliant through the whole exchange and he got super defensive pretty aggressive when I was surprised that my backlights weren't on."

    I'll re-word that for you…

    "The cop who was doing his job, enforcing the road rules for the betterment of ALL road users (not just you) was having a fine night, but was frustrated by drivers who don't know how to operate switches in their car. I was been pretty responsive and compliant through the whole exchange and he got tired and bored of listening to your whining about how great a driver you are and you've never had a ticket and you're safe and everything and could he PLEASE, PRETTY PLEASE let you off with a warning, when advising you for the third time that he was going to give me a ticket and not let me off for driving around with no rear lights at night because I don't know how my car works"

    :)

    You're welcome

    • pe arl on 21/07/2021 - 13:28
      +36

      Come on, yes the OP clearly made a mistake here and the fine was issued in accordance with the road rules, but you don't know that's anything like how the conversation went unless you were there to hear it. No need to mock anyone.

      • gimli on 21/07/2021 - 18:10
        +3

        I think everyone is taking the piss because OP Is still trying to make excuses.

        If OP was like "I was an idiot for driving without lights got fined. Genuine mistake but was wondering if there was any scope for leniency…" people might be nicer

    • Ahbal on 21/07/2021 - 18:47
      +9

      "driving around with no rear lights at night because I don't know how my car works"

      / endthread

      • nobro25 on 23/07/2021 - 20:02

        That could also be interpreted as not knowing how to drive a car. I.e. Using the light switches & attention to detail is also part of driving.

    • Misplaced on 22/07/2021 - 08:23

      Why re-word it? It was much more factual and truthful as it was stated by the OP.

      • oscargamer on 22/07/2021 - 08:25
        -1

        The only facts are that the OP didn't have his lights on and got a ticket. Everything else is his opinion on the mood of the cop, the OP's great attitude etc …

    • Velocita on 22/07/2021 - 22:05

      That was a woeful piece of writing, and to top it off, you think you made a good point.

  • djkelly69 on 21/07/2021 - 11:19
    +37

    Do you honestly think 'I forgot' is a legitimate basis to challenge the fine in court?

    Stop wasting everyone's time, pay the fine, learn your lesson and move on.

    • [Deactivated] on 21/07/2021 - 14:24
      +4

      Where would it stop?
      I forgot my headlights, I forgot to put my seatbelt on, I forgot to stop for the red light, I forgot which side of the road to drive on.

      • Mechz on 21/07/2021 - 15:07
        +1

        I forgot to learn how to operate a vehicle before I operated it.

        • [Deactivated] on 21/07/2021 - 15:09

          Well if you can't open the door you can't fined ;)

          • dtorr on 21/07/2021 - 19:01
            +2

            @[Deactivated]: Dukes of Hazzard has entered the chat

            • [Deactivated] on 22/07/2021 - 07:56

              @dtorr: Those damn Duke boys are at it again!

    • happydude on 21/07/2021 - 21:17
      +6

      Mistake of fact is a legitimate defence.

      Hit the wrong button and on a well lit road no reason to believe they weren’t on.

      There is a reasonable argument for a not guilty verdict.

    • Saars on 24/07/2021 - 01:57

      I agree with this, forgetting is not a legitimate defense, it's called neglegence

      Depending on the colour of the car, and the time of day, it can sometimes be basically impossible to see a car coming.

      After dusk your brain starts looking for headlights more than for cars

      This "simple mistake" could have cost people their lives

      $248 fine is totally reasonable

  • Seraphin7 on 21/07/2021 - 11:21
    +10

    Could a warning have sufficed in this situation? Somewhere between possibly and probably depending on a range of factors.

    Is it worth fighting the fine? Up to you, but if all you're up for is $248, I reckon you'll spend more in time and effort to get off it, but with the probability that you won't get off it. In other words, if you fight it the probability is that you'll be worse off than you would be just by paying it.

  • apple2016 on 21/07/2021 - 11:21
    +11

    if you have time, go to court, plead guilty, ask for leniency and given this is your first offense, you might have the fine waived. the demerit point if any will still apply.

  • whitelie on 21/07/2021 - 11:31
    +34

    This is one of my pet peeves. Learn how your car works and use it properly. Chances are if the car has DRL's, it also has auto headlights, you just have them set to off.
    Pay the fine and don't waste the court's time.

  • Mechz on 21/07/2021 - 11:32
    +8

    Pay the fine and learn your lesson. I wish there were more cops about to hand these fines out. It is incredibly dangerous especially to pedestrians.

    Imagine if you actually hit someone. You'd be up fo4 a lot more than 250 bucks.

  • brad1-8tsi on 21/07/2021 - 11:36
    +18

    You shouldn't be driving if you don't understand how the controls of the car work.

  • Marcsie on 21/07/2021 - 11:37
    +3

    Just pay the fine, learn the lesson and move on !

  • Ryanek on 21/07/2021 - 11:37
    +13

    I bet after paying that fine, you won't be as likely forget to turn on your lights from now on.

    • Blue Cat on 21/07/2021 - 12:03
      +4

      As much as I agree that fining someone for "speeding" at 51 km/h in a 50 km/h zone is just revenue raising and scummy from the police's part AND it does not pose a very high (or maybe none at all) risk to other drivers, people who drive without lights on are a real danger to others.
      I had a few close calls myself so whenever I see people driving on Princes Highway without their lights on at night or heavy rain, it just makes my blood boil… and I am happy coppers fine such people.

      • EightImmortals on 21/07/2021 - 12:07
        +4

        Yes I agree, that's not the point I am arguing though. It was obviously an honest mistake and if it's the cops job to keep people safe then, as I said, he should have pulled the OP over and alerted him to the fact that his headlights were off thereby mitigating the danger. The ridiculous fine was unnecessary and just revenue raising.

        " had a few close calls myself so whenever I see people driving on Princes Highway without their lights on at night or heavy rain, it just makes my blood boil… and I am happy coppers fine such people."

        But that's just petty spite. Why would you be happy to see someone punished for what is most likely an honest mistake?

        • oscargamer on 21/07/2021 - 12:09
          +5

          As has already been said, a warning goes a little way, a ticket…..well the OP will probably check his lights EVERY day / night now…..much more effective.

        • Blue Cat on 21/07/2021 - 12:15
          +4

          That honest mistake could have resulted in a another forum thread titled "Got into an accident, I am at fault and don't have insurance. What to do?!?"

          I always make a conscious effort to turn my headlights on when it is raining, the sun is setting or it is really cloudy so I could be seen by others more easily, and I expect other people to do the same.

        • MS Paint on 21/07/2021 - 12:36
          +1

          It was obviously an honest mistake

          The only mistake op made was not to spend an hour with the cars user manual and becoming familiar with its functions.

          Case in point…

          the car I was driving has a headlights which come on when you start the car, which I thought were the actual headlights

        • Mechz on 21/07/2021 - 12:52
          +2

          An honest mistake that means OP would have never driven with proper headlights on until something bad happened.

        • spackbace on 21/07/2021 - 14:23
          +1

          for what is most likely an honest mistake?

          OP claims honest mistake, as clearly that helps influence peoples' thoughts on them, yet it shows a lack of understanding when driving.

          Dunno about you, but I'd prefer that people who are in control of 2T objects know how to operate them…

          Case in point

      • TEER3X on 21/07/2021 - 20:34

        Can you get a speeding fine for 1km/h over?

        In Victoria, at least, my understanding is 3km/h is wiped off the recorded speed.

        • PerthectDeal on 23/07/2021 - 02:21

          And walking speed is 5 to 6kph!!!! Just makes you realise they have revenue ahead of safety and common sense.

          I always put a small bit of money aside now and then and consider it as a little bit of tax I should have paid. if I was ever stopped by a policeman having a bad day and fined for an injustice, I would not feel hard done by and politely accept it.

    • Crow K on 21/07/2021 - 12:25
      +9

      (movie trailer voice)

      In a world based on the cold totalitarian works of George Orwell's 1984 … and the ridiculousness of circus clowns.. one man dares to fight the power by forgetting to turn his headlights on and then hope that the money-hungry police state will decide not to enforce that law.

      But the overlords are playing by the rules, and they know all about the infractions, even the minor ones that have little quote marks around them which sort-of imply they aren't infractions at all because they're 'infractions', not infractions. Even those ones.

      Starring TightBum as Driver and EightImmortals as Confused Poster Dragging Insular Conspiracy Theories Into Otherwise Ordinary Discussions in…

      OrWeLl CloWn WoRlD - rated R, for 'Really Something That Is Actually Happening'

      • EightImmortals on 21/07/2021 - 13:45

        haha, OK that deserves a thumbs up. :)

        Just one corrections, the overlords aren't 'playing by the rules', they make the rules and then only play by them when it suits them. :)

        • Crow K on 21/07/2021 - 14:11
          +1

          I think the 51km an hour in a 50km zone is a good example of the concepts you're discussing but I think you're a bit off on the headlight one (FWIW) - basically everyone who leaves their headlights off is doing it by mistake (the only instances where someone would be knowingly driving without headlights are people with a car that doesn't have working headlights or actual sociopaths looking to cause accidents - both of who would always deserve to be fined) - so as others have said above, it's a road safety issue that's so egregious it has to warrant the penalty. The "oops I accidentally forgot" crowd aren't going to get any better at remembering based off a 30 second stern lecture from a cop, etc.

    • Gervais fanboy on 21/07/2021 - 13:24

      Good point

  • Oz8argain on 21/07/2021 - 11:42

    I copped once too at 6am at sunrise.
    nothing you can do, just pay.
    i'm surprised at the number of cars with no lights on the road.

  • Hithere on 21/07/2021 - 11:52
    +5

    The cop who fined me seemed like he was having a bad night

    He was probably sick and tired of pulling up drivers without their headlights on and hearing the same old excuses about it being their first time and how they have driven for umpteen years without getting pulled over etc.

    Pay the fine, it'll be a good life lesson.

  • SF3 on 21/07/2021 - 11:53
    +3

    I understand is dangerous and was genuinely a mistake on my part
    I confused my start light with my headlights
    I understand how dangerous it was

    All other reasons you've stated is not relevant.

    It's your car, you should know better. This is likely to mean, this happened before, you were not aware and you didn't get pulled by the cops.

    Let this be a lesson, so that you do the right thing next time.

  • bobbified on 21/07/2021 - 11:57
    +1

    Pay the fine. Be grateful that you didn't find out by having someone slam into you!

  • boomramada on 21/07/2021 - 11:58
    +1

    Cop ones pulled me over for driving without lights on, then when he try to write a fine but he couldn't find the offence code, apparently at that time, its was only applicable for highways (15+ years ago) not in suburbs and let me go with a warn. Just in case, just doble check the offence code before visiting the court.

    • TightBum on 22/07/2021 - 00:22

      Thanks for this, I checked the code just before, seems like they used the right one. Probably why they had to mail me the fine instead of giving it to me in the spot. I’ll just have to cop it on the chin

  • harveyworld on 21/07/2021 - 12:01

    I would like to know if there is a secret 'one brake light' club that I don't know about?

    The number of vehicles with only one brake light working constantly amazes me that I am now convinced it must be some kind of secretive cult akin to the masons.

    Have a look next time you go out… I guarantee you will see one. Its one of those things that once you know about you will see them everywhere.

    Oh - and if it is a secretive members only club can anyone shed (one brake) light on what its all about.

    • StingyBritches on 22/07/2021 - 11:43
      +2

      You idiot!
      Don't you know the first rule of One Brake Light Club is…

  • pegaxs on 21/07/2021 - 12:08
    -1

    Move to NSW, it's only $119 and 1 demerit here.

    Strange you didn't get a warning after sending in a request for leniency (or did you ask for a "review").

    Ring them up, ask to be put on the absolute minimum payment plan (something like $10~$20/fortnight.)

    Or go and have your day in court, get the experience. Plead guilty, show your exemplary driving record and ask for "leniency" tell them you have learned your lesson and request whatever your state's version of a section 10 (google it). You will probably be let off with no fine, but with court costs that will be about 1/2 the fine's initial cost.

    • activ8newbs on 21/07/2021 - 12:26
      -2

      I didn't know it costs to go to court and fight a fine!

      Imagine fighting, and losing! That would suck. Fine+court fees

      $119 could we'll turn into $219 :(

      • pegaxs on 21/07/2021 - 13:51
        +2

        You're not "fighting" it. Fighting it would be if you believe you are innocent and being charged with an offence you believe you didn't do.

        If you have a good driving record, you can go and plead guilty with an explanation. Quite often the magistrate will just dismiss it if you are genuinely repentant and have a clean driving history.

        I've been to court a few times both for myself and as an emotional support animal for some friends and all have been dismissed and some without even having to pay court costs (YMMV).

        The court system is interesting to be a part of and something people should experience at least once in their life, and it's a small price to have that experience. Sure, it "could" end up more expensive, but generally, if you are honest, genuine and have a good record, they are not going to throw the book at you over a single infringement, especially if the people before and after you are have over 10 or 15 infringements each they are fighting.

        I'm not sure with my negs if I offended the "iT's jUsT ReVeNuE rAiSiNg, Ya'LL jUsT gOvErNmEnT bOoT LiCkErZ!" crowd or the "did the crime, pay the fine" crowd.

  • Ocker on 21/07/2021 - 12:11
    -3

    Aside from everything else you need to recognise the Victorian Government is broke and will be raising all the revenue they can. Even more-so given road traffic fines are well down due to the lock down

    • havebeerbelywillsumo on 21/07/2021 - 12:53
      -6

      Huh? Negged.

    • doheedo on 24/07/2021 - 09:10
      -1

      Do you have any evidence that money from fines is being spent as general revenue? Or are you making stuff up for no reason?

      • Ocker on 26/07/2021 - 14:34

        Suggest you read the Victorian Government budget papers

  • SlowCarSlow on 21/07/2021 - 12:37

    My dad did the same thing on a trip to the USA, the daytime running lights were bright so he didn't realize he needed to turn on the actual lights. Let me tell you we were terrified after hearing all the stories and didn't know why we were getting pulled over.

    Cop comes up, "may I ask why you don't have your lights on today?"

    My dad, "I'm sorry I didn't know! It's a rental!"

    Cop asks where we are going, just down the road, so he tells us to get going and be very careful.

    When we got to the hotel we figured out what happened and dad was very confused.

    • TEER3X on 21/07/2021 - 21:17

      Generally speaking, the only ones that give fines out in the US are the cops on motorcycles. If they'd have pulled you over, it's 100% a fine. No escaping.

  • p1 ama on 21/07/2021 - 12:39
    +6

    I understand how dangerous it was but getting a fine for genuinely confusing my 2 headlights when I have a good driving record seems a bit extreme.

    No, by your admission, you got a fine for doing something dangerous, not for confusing your 2 headlights.

    Has anyone had any experience challenging fines in court? Or should I just fine pay the fine and get over it.

    I don't get why people always have this mentality of trying to challenge things in court. What exactly are you challenging?

    You challenge something in court when you didn't actually do what you were accused of doing such that the prosecution will have to go up and present evidence to the magistrate/judge that you did what you were accused of doing. Then it becomes a battle of the evidence.

    In this case, both you (the defendant) and the cops (the prosecution) actually agree. Both sides agree that you didn't have your headlights on, so what would you want the magistrate to adjudicate? There is no disagreement, so I genuinely don't understand what you are trying to achieve.

  • [Deactivated] on 21/07/2021 - 12:59
    +16

    Hate drivers like you. I flashed a guy over 8 times and he was still clueless about his lights.

    • Yawhae on 22/07/2021 - 12:58
      +2

      Pretty sure you'd get a fine for flashing your head lights if a cop saw it.

      • Mikeer on 22/07/2021 - 13:29

        What road rules apply to flashing headlights and/or highbeams?

        Edit: found it, in NSW it's 218-1(d):

        The driver of a vehicle must not—
        (d) flash any headlight…

        In VIC our rule 218 is different. Closest I am finding is 219:

        A driver must not use, or allow to be used, any light fitted to or in the driver's vehicle to dazzle, or in a way that is likely to dazzle, another road user.

        Open to interpretation whether flashing your lights would be "likely to dazzle"

        • microsnot on 22/07/2021 - 21:54

          It's 218 in Victoria since flashing lights at someone is usually achieved with high beams:

          Using headlights on high-beam
          (1) The driver of a vehicle must not use the vehicle's headlights on high-beam, or allow the vehicle's headlights to be used on high-beam, if the driver is driving—

             (a)     less than 200 metres behind a vehicle travelling in the same direction as the driver; or

   (b)     less than 200 metres from an oncoming vehicle.

          Penalty: 5 penalty units.

          Note

          High-beam and oncoming vehicle are defined in the dictionary.

          (2) However, if the driver is overtaking a vehicle, the driver may briefly switch the headlights from low-beam to high-beam immediately before the driver begins to overtake the vehicle.

          Note

          Low-beam and overtake are defined in the dictionary.

      • [Deactivated] on 22/07/2021 - 17:34

        Rather risk that than someone getting hit by an idiot who people can't see.

  • DashCam AKA Rolts on 21/07/2021 - 13:04
    +7

    To effect behavioural change, the consequences must be sufficiently toxic that the subject wishes to avoid a repetition.
    $248 fine sounds like it may have hit the sweet spot to effect the required change.

    • yk300 on 21/07/2021 - 13:12
      -1

      To effect behavioural change, the consequences must be sufficiently toxic that the subject wishes to avoid a repetition.
      Do you honestly believe that's how fines work?

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