Tenants Lost Key - Who Pays to Cover to Cost of Changing Locks?

yjun355 on 15/07/2021 - 13:02
Last edited 16/07/2021 - 17:48

Its my first time situation where tenant lost the key. It is those restricted keys where people have access to build and limited number made. In summary, there is no option but to change the locks (~$300).

Tenant argument that if they known it was that expensive they be careful or if there was any formal wording in the standard lease contract.

  • Anyone know if there is formal legal documentation around who is liable to pay for change of locks?
  • Is this the things which you take to Bond tribunal for dispute?

Update: Thanks for everyone's interest. Got the answer. It is high security system. So, if you loose key there is obligation to replace locks. Otherwise, future tenants can claim for loss of robbery. That in general is true for all cases. So, if tenant loose case, as landlord you are best to get locks replaced . Obviously, it is is common key, you wouldn't know and tenant would just replace it. However, as landlord if you know that keys are lost, you need to proceed with locks replaced. This is to cover yourself for future tenants.
Then in terms of cost, tenants are obligated to cover the cost. It is in Section 33.3 of contract. Going foward, i just created new welcome doc, so that they are aware on how it works.

Home & Garden

closed Comments

    • Extreme on 16/07/2021 - 08:18

      It might not necessarily be a common property lock.

      It could be a registered key system to access the lot. Systems like this are occasionally used for ease of access in case of a fire.

  • sam-1966 on 15/07/2021 - 17:50
    +3

    Friend of my daughter managed to lose both keys (yeah, don't go there…we already did). He approached the managing agent and was told to call in, collect their spare key and go to Bunnings and get another one cut.

    He walked into the agent and was handed the spare key without asking his name or details. Just bring it back some time.

    Yep - restricted key. He couldn't do anything. Still can't get over the agent handing over the ONLY spare key and telling him that.

    Thankfully he moved…

    • pegaxs on 17/07/2021 - 16:38

      You cant get "restricted keys" cut at Bunnings… If they did get it cut at "Bunnings", it wasn't a restricted key.

      • sam-1966 on 17/07/2021 - 18:17

        Yep - we knew that. Pity the REA didn't seem to. Husband worked for a CIT company in the ATM area so had a very good understanding of that side of things.

        Also bizarre that they just handed the 'allegedly' ONLY spare key without actually getting his name or ID.

  • Austaurean on 15/07/2021 - 21:37
    +4

    Tenant responsible….

    • Boogerman on 16/07/2021 - 09:29
      -2

      Umm, no they’re not

      • Austaurean on 16/07/2021 - 17:34

        Umm 14 years of experience.. tenant fault, tenant expense.. if they just want new keys cur then fine, but if the expectation is all new locks then its still there issue.

        • Boogerman on 16/07/2021 - 19:04
          -4

          The need to replace the locks is the landlord’s fault for not retaining access to having keys cut
          Your ‘experience’ means diddly squat

    • parsimonious one on 16/07/2021 - 17:26
      +1

      Tenant responsible to replace the key. Not the locks

  • mickyb80 on 15/07/2021 - 22:51
    +8

    if lost - Tenant. (in this case)
    If damaged, worn out etc. Owner.

  • jojo13 on 16/07/2021 - 07:42
    +1

    Careless with this key….careless with the new one???

  • Waltervp on 16/07/2021 - 08:23
    +2

    If they're decent tennants I would offer to go halves this time as a gesture of good will, … It's stupid, and it is their responsibility, and even dumber to say they would've taken more care had they known!!

    Or another option is to say you will reimburse half if they find the original key later. That way you'll have a spare lock and key at least.

    If I was them I'd just get a Bunnings lock for now and hope to find the old key later!

  • koplik8 on 16/07/2021 - 08:38
    +2

    I've had investment properties. Your the owner. It's not your problem. It's the tenants problem. They can choose to change the locks. Plus it should be in their tenancy agreement. It's not covered under Land Lord Insurance.

    Everytime I've moved into my investment property the first thing I did was change the locks. God knows who has copies of the keys.

    • Boogerman on 16/07/2021 - 09:30
      -3

      No, it’s the landlord’s problem

  • popsiee on 16/07/2021 - 08:40
    +5

    Forget who pays for the keys .
    What stand out for me is OP integrity ( I'd love to use another term ) with wanting to forge the contract .

    • parsimonious one on 16/07/2021 - 17:28

      Yeah. 😂 his thing about just adding it in now and initialing it…. All totes legal

  • snooksy on 16/07/2021 - 08:48

    It’s not clear why there is only one key to the lock? Does OP or tenant have another key, get that take it to the patent holder and tell them you need another one copied. If OP has lost the other key or doesn’t have another key then unfortunately the cost is on him because he is unable to provide the tenant with a copied key at a reasonable cost - as is the intention of the clause 32.9 in NSW agreement.

    OP has learnt the cost of replacing the lock, not replacing the key. The key needs replacing, not the lock. If the owner needs to replace the lock because there is no key to copy then it’s the owners responsibility as they bought into this lock system.

    If the key patent holder won’t supply another key at a reasonable price then change the lock to a generic lock with non patented keys. Cost less then $100 at Bunnings. Copy generic key and have tenant pay $10 fee for copied key. OP pays a bit but now has a spare key for an in patented silly system. Problem solved.

    If the building is secured by some other key then the tenant needs one of those keys as well to get into the building.

  • Boogerman on 16/07/2021 - 09:22
    +1

    It’s a restricted key system so the landlord has to order keys with their signature on the order form from the designated locksmith (landlord’s signature gets matched against the signature on file held at the designated locksmith).
    If the signature isn’t on file, the original holder of the system has to authorise the transfer to the current landlord.
    If the landlord doesn’t know who the designated locksmith is then there could be something stamped on the lock/cylinder to indicate which locksmith holds the system. If there isn’t that, then the landlord will need to change the locks/cylinders at their expense.

  • OzHunterNSW on 16/07/2021 - 11:58

    The LL "SHOULD" have spare keys. If not, they obtain the lock number and simply put keys.

  • FreeUyghur on 16/07/2021 - 12:52
    +2

    the tenant must pay the fee/s

  • MagicOZ on 16/07/2021 - 17:22

    What if the tenant did lose the key but instead it was stolen from them without they even notice and they assume it was lost?

  • MagicOZ on 16/07/2021 - 17:24

    Adding security via obscurity won't guarantee good security lock. Custom made lock is not foolproof.

  • RecklessMonkeys on 16/07/2021 - 17:27
    +1

    The question becomes - is it reasonable to pay so much because of a lost key, which is not exactly a rare occurrence.
    I would say no.

    You as the LL chose to implement an expensive system.

    I note the comments from Fair Trading, but I wonder if they know the whole story?
    I would challenge in the tenancy tribunal if you tried to sting me for 300 bucks.

    • parsimonious one on 16/07/2021 - 17:30
      +1

      Yeah I agree. Plus the alleged verbal advice contradicts the standard terms of the nsw lease agreement

      I’m not sure what the OP was “told” on the phone overrides the lease terms.

    • immortalbjr on 17/07/2021 - 14:03

      And if it had been you and he had chosen a cheap or no protection and you got robbed you'd then be complaining it wasn't expensive enough for your protection.

      People like you with zero self responsibility are what makes dealing with people so frustrating at times. Even if your at fault your pointing fingers trying to come up with an elaborate excuse as to why you shouldnt have consequences for your mistakes.

      Dont worry your not the only one though, pretty much the way people are heading in recent years from experience.

      • RecklessMonkeys on 17/07/2021 - 20:05

        Ahuh. It's not Fort Knox, buddy.
        Is he doing a retinal scan too? Oops we need a new retinal scanner, that'll be 10 grand.

        You have a lock. You have a key.
        You lose the key, you inform the land lord, they give you a key, you pay for the key.
        That's the tenant's responsibility.

        It's common for people to lose keys, and unreasonable to change the lock as a result.
        Why does the landlord even have spare keys, if he doesn't want to hand out replacements?

        The OP says he's written this into the 'welcome doc' , which is a concession that it's not the norm.

  • Austaurean on 16/07/2021 - 17:32
    +2

    $300 is quite reasonable to change locks, remember, its a locksmith callout, plus locks, plus keys…. even a simple lockout is generally over $150 to be let back in depending on day of week and time..

    • RecklessMonkeys on 16/07/2021 - 17:37
      +3

      OK, but the tenant lost a key, not a lock.
      The LL has spare keys - you have to ask why?

  • ATangk on 16/07/2021 - 18:16
    +1

    Haha. Some keys (rather, remotes) are like $600 from apartment buildings.

    • ProlapsedHeinous on 16/07/2021 - 19:03

      Sounds like a great way to make the tenants more accountable so the management aren't wasting their time on replacement keys all the time. Personally i'd take the lock apart and make my own key for it out of feeler gauge, and keep the originals somewhere more secure…

      • hikaru78 on 17/07/2021 - 07:32
        +1

        How do you plan on doing that when the profile is restricted and you can't get blanks?

        • ProlapsedHeinous on 18/07/2021 - 00:40

          I play with locks as a hobby. You tend to accumulate a lot of equipment and experience to navigate restricted systems after a while. restricted profiles are meaningless when you can fashion your own keys using a dremel.

  • mutanti on 16/07/2021 - 19:10
    +1

    Take it out of his Bond

    • parsimonious one on 16/07/2021 - 20:18

      Another baseless thought bubble

      The relevant clause from a standard tenancy agreement had already been posted.

      The clause says in the event of a lost key the landlord needs to replace the key but can charge for the copy. Thus it’s unlikely any tenancy tribunal will award the OP the cost of lock replacement when the tenancy agreement clearly states what the landlord can charge

  • leiiv on 16/07/2021 - 21:06
    +2

    OP, is the property just of a normal residential and not of commercial nature? So why does it need the "high security system"? What else is in the property?
    Whether you are owners or tenants, losing key is VERY common. It does not make sense to replace the lock everytime you lose a key.

  • No ONE on 16/07/2021 - 21:23

    Tenant pays.

  • Davo1111 on 16/07/2021 - 23:46
    +2

    Can i handwrite additional notes and initial it on it?

    disgraceful

    If they attend court with their contract, that doesnt have that initial on it, you could be charged with fraud/perverting the course of justice

  • Hugh G Rection on 17/07/2021 - 10:00

    just go to bunnings, its cheaper

  • BHR on 17/07/2021 - 10:32

    If changing the locks is required it’s on the owner. Tenant required to pay a reasonable cost… if you’ve opted as the owner to go high security and not keep spares, that’s actually on you. You can claim back from their bond reasonable costs, but that’s actually about $4 for a standard key to be duplicated at Bunnings. Sorry to hear you’re learning this one the hard way. Crappy position to be in.

    • p3nf0ld on 17/07/2021 - 12:13
      +1

      Bunnings won't cut a restricted key

  • john_conner on 17/07/2021 - 10:35

    Agreed that the tenant should pay for a replacement key, NOT lock.

    Where is it written that the locks need to be replaced or rekeyed if lost? OP hasn’t provided this info. It would be impossible to enforce (prove) that lost keys were the cause in order to decline a claim and then come after the LL for compensation. It is reasonable to expect lost keys to be handed in, not used by crooks who automagically know your address! As has been said before keys don’t have the address on them for obvious reasons.

    What about non security keys? They could be copied all the time and cause this issue. If this were a reasonable concern then it would be required to change the locks after EVERY tenant for non security systems…

    Even if it were a LL responsibility, then it’s a LL responsibility, not the tenant responsibility to change the lock. It’s only the tenant responsibility to pay for a copy of the key. The tenant is governed by rental laws, not obscure high security lock rules (are these “obligations” law, recommendations or even strata rules?).

    My guess is if the tenant took this to tribunal, OP would lose the lock changing argument.

    Also, even if you put such rules in the agreement in the future, may be hard to enforce as the tribunal enforces on the rental laws, not necessarily the contract you sign…

    • parsimonious one on 17/07/2021 - 14:44

      As someone already posted from the standard lease agreement

      32.The landlord agrees:
      …..
      32.2 to give each tenant under this agreement a copy of the key or opening device or information to open any lock or security device for the residential premises or common property to which the tenant is entitled to have access, and
      32.3 not to charge the tenant for the cost of providing the copies except to recover the cost of replacement or additional copies, and …

      This suggests the landlord is a) required to keep a copy of the key and b) only charge for the cost of providing a new copy of the key in the event the tenant requires a new/ additional copy

      OP and other posters seem to think the can just charge tenants whatever they like in spite of tenancy regulations

  • JungliChilli on 17/07/2021 - 10:35
    -1

    Change the locks now and then deduct the amount from the bond when they move out?

  • DemocracyManifest on 17/07/2021 - 12:17

    The RE and you would have a spare key so go cut one

  • Stevenw on 17/07/2021 - 13:02
    +1

    Have you tried getting the locks re-keyed ?
    It costs a lot less because You can reuse the locks
    Even cheaper if you remove and take them to the locksmith your self

  • darkmoss on 17/07/2021 - 15:58
    +1

    the idiot owner that didn't have a spare

  • kzrocky on 17/07/2021 - 19:42
    +1

    Replace locks with smart locks, no need for keys or rekeying anymore.

    • ProlapsedHeinous on 18/07/2021 - 00:43

      common areas should really have keycard access. much easier to deregister a UID than have to change a lock and hand out replacement keys all the time.

  • jv on 18/07/2021 - 00:47

    Who Pays to Cover to Cost of Changing Locks?

    Michael.

  • Eeples on 18/07/2021 - 13:01

    I think the LL and tenant should pay $150 each to maintain goodwill.

    But, then the contract needs to be specifically amended to make the tenant explicitly liable for the change of key/locks.

    Otherwise the tenant could lose the key everyday and the LL would explode.

  • Moderatorscrimshaw on 18/07/2021 - 13:08

    Thread closed as OP has solved their issue

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