[NSW] Do I Need to Indicate with My Blinker at This Small Street Junction When Turning?

Lvtech2 on 11/01/2020 - 13:26
Last edited 11/01/2020 - 13:26

To clarify, I am a new P plater and this scenario happened recently. This happened on a suburban street so it isn't a major intersection or anything.

I was following the pink path looking to turn right when I was told that I had to indicate when turning right here. It is my understanding that I don't need to indicate here as I am simply going straight in a way (despite the road ending) and still had the right of way considering both sides have a stop sign and a give-way sign.

Please inform me. Cheers

Diagram here: https://i.imgur.com/Fg2xKVm.png

Poll Options expired

  • 631
    Yes
  • 125
    No
Automotive

Comments

    • whooah1979 on 11/01/2020 - 23:31

      https://imgur.com/a/itM9tji

      Indicating isn’t required here.

      • kawinuyo on 11/01/2020 - 23:34

        …that's what I said, OP did a drawing, might not be a complete picture hence I said IF this situation no, if not yes.

  • hdew47221 on 12/01/2020 - 07:45

    This is always confusing - Averill St and Cavell St down at Rhodes have the same setup where the stop and give way is in the wrong places due to traffic flow off the main road (I think).

    I reckon you need to indicate because you can turn either way and for cars behind you/pedestrians it’s handy to know your intentions.

    Such a confusing road

  • voiletmay on 12/01/2020 - 08:16
    +3

    Wow, just indicate, it isn't difficult. Maybe pedestrians are crossing the road and it helps them to see you indicating.

  • tabitha731 on 12/01/2020 - 08:37
    -4

    YOU TURN in the car… YOU USE your INDICATORS! Its quite simple!

    • Lv80 on 12/01/2020 - 19:31
      +2

      You 'turn' on roads that don't have intersections…do you use your indicators then? no.
      No change of lanes, or 'turning' is going on here. Driver is only following the lane which is bending.

  • elgrande on 12/01/2020 - 10:52

    Is that corner in Melrose Park?

  • HardlyCharly on 12/01/2020 - 10:58
    -4

    You are turning and it is not a one-way street, so yes. Remember to indicate on round-a-bouts too. Almost every day I have to flash someone after the turn through one and don't do it.

    • Muzeeb on 12/01/2020 - 12:17

      Indicating at roundabouts could be a whole new thread.

      • berger on 13/01/2020 - 09:15

        Varies state by state there, a real popcorn type thread

  • Lockieasy on 12/01/2020 - 11:03

    I would say you do have to indicate because you’re doing a hard turn from one street into another and it lets other vehicles and pedestrians know your intentions.

  • OzHunterNSW on 12/01/2020 - 11:17
    +2

    You have slipped through the net… tell the motor registers that you have little to no knowledge of road roles and would like to attempt the test again.
    Of course you indicate.

  • MrBear on 12/01/2020 - 12:15
    +1

    Ahh, the intersection for Alpha and Edinburgh roads in Willougby. Some people indicate, others do not.

    https://www.google.com/maps/@-33.8024865,151.2060116,58m/dat…

  • nomoneynoproblems on 12/01/2020 - 13:30

    Do you have to? No. But should you? Yes.

  • r3volt on 12/01/2020 - 13:48
    -4

    Do i need to stop at a stop sign? Its not a major road or anything

    Do i need to give way to car coming? Its not a major road or anything

    Do i have to pull over to use my phone or can i do i while driving because its not a major road?

    Are people really this stupid?

    • Ughhh on 12/01/2020 - 14:09

      Think you've missed the point of the question…

      • pegaxs on 12/01/2020 - 15:26

        The point of the question was to troll the forum.

        New account, stupid question, no replies, not logged back in since. What else was the point of it?

  • Peck on 12/01/2020 - 14:20

    For Road Courtesy, if for no other reason. It also serves as a double confirmation that you are not turning left. And other cars will be confident about proceeding they way that they wish. So many people turn left without indicators, especially at roundabouts. Very frustrating.

  • [Deactivated] on 12/01/2020 - 14:41
    -1

    If you live in Brisbane, it's optional to indicate anywhere.

    • WhyAmICommenting on 14/01/2020 - 14:52

      Especially if you drive a BMW or high yield investment vehicle

  • Lexan on 12/01/2020 - 16:21

    Put yourself in other car travelling at give way lane, you see a car coming but not sure the car will turn left or right. Should you keep going straight because it will turn left.

  • crashloaded on 12/01/2020 - 16:57
    +1

    You need to provide the real address as I think your ms paint is misleading.

  • Ahbal on 12/01/2020 - 17:01

    Real question is why not? You lose nothing by indicating you are turning right, because thats exactly what you are going to do. You wont confuse anyone.

    • lostn on 12/01/2020 - 20:49
      +2

      it takes calories to move the stalk. Every little bit adds up.

  • [Deactivated] on 12/01/2020 - 18:22

    Your diagram seems to show a situation similar to the one under the Plan Ahead heading. Better to indicate and not need to than not and cause someone to pullout on you cause “9/10 people turn left” .

  • monkeyfood on 12/01/2020 - 18:40
    -1

    I didn't know indicators were mandatory in Australia at all

    • Munki on 12/01/2020 - 19:06
      +1

      Only European car drivers are exempt.

      • Bargain80 on 13/01/2020 - 09:38

        and Holden cars too?

  • Lv80 on 12/01/2020 - 19:30
    +1

    No you don't. it is a 'straight' road and you aren't 'turning' off it. It's not a 'corner' but a 'bend' of the road.
    Not sure what is so difficult for anyone to understand here.

    Indicators for turning or changing lanes. You are doing neither but following the lay of the road and lane.

    • lostn on 12/01/2020 - 20:35

      what if he was to turn left? would he still be following the lay of the road and lane?

      No you don't. it is a 'straight' road and you aren't 'turning' off it. It's not a 'corner' but a 'bend' of the road.

      Is the street name the same before and after the bend, or does the name change?

      I don't understand what kind of bend or 'straight' road would look like a T junction. If there was no left part I could understand, but it looks like two roads. If it's one road, then it has three exits which I've never seen in my state.

      According to this info, they are two separate roads, not a bend in the same road.

      • Lv80 on 12/01/2020 - 21:04
        +1

        the road names do not matter. if the 'lane' is not broken by a white line it is a continuous lane…and therefore does not need indication….because you are neither turning off or out of the 'lane'.

        You are following a lane. No different to a geographically straight lane…cept there is a very tight bend in this lane.

        • lostn on 12/01/2020 - 22:43
          +1

          i live in small streets.. there are no white lines anywhere. Only major roads even use them.

          That would mean I never have to indicate in my neighborhood. Or any really.

          • field1985 on 13/01/2020 - 14:05
            -1

            @lostn: There would still be Give Way signs, even if there aren't lines marked. You need to indicate before you turn left or right, or change lanes."

            You are not turning or changing lanes, you are continuing, and thus DO NOT NEED TO INDICATE.

            This diagram (https://imgur.com/ALXzesm) clearly shows a T intersection where the continuing road goes around a corner.

            There is no requirement for Car A on the "continuing road" to indicate. Even RMS shows Car A as NOT INDICATING.

            https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roads/safety-rules/road-rules/int…

            About time we introduced retesting (at say 45 years of age) as there are clearly a majority who don't understand the rule(s).

            • pegaxs on 13/01/2020 - 16:29
              +2

              @field1985: You can cut and paste it as many times as you like, but you're the one that is wrong.

              PS: Talking in CAPS doesn't make you right, it just makes you loud.

  • Riczter on 12/01/2020 - 19:54
    +2

    It looks like legally you don’t have to, but you would be mad not to, and should indicate so other road users know where you’re going

    • Lv80 on 12/01/2020 - 21:07

      Why would it be at all difficult for people to know where the OP is going? Each other section has to wait and give way to oncoming cars….It's like a normal intersection, cept instead of going straight you veer right…to suggest other drivers can work this out and give way is to assume they dont know what to do at a regular intersection that works almost exactly the same way.

      It's not rocket science.

      • lostn on 12/01/2020 - 22:44
        +1

        it allows a pedestrian to know you're not turning left, so it's safe for them to cross. Or you are turning left and they should wait.

        • Lv80 on 13/01/2020 - 11:20

          The road suggests any car not turning left or indicating left is going straight. It's no different to a technical straight road…the LANE is 'straight' and unbroken. It's not a 'corner' but a bend in a road. This really isn't rocket science.

          A non straight road doesn't equal a corner.

      • Riczter on 13/01/2020 - 01:55
        +1

        Lv80 have you driven on our roads? People are absolute retards. I absolutely assume certain people dont know what to do at a regular intersection. Only have to watch a few of the Dash Cam compilations on DCOA to see that for yourself. Confusion causes accidents. Indicating minimizes confusion.

        • Lv80 on 13/01/2020 - 11:19

          Indicating aint going to help if people cant follow the instructions of a STOP or GIVE WAY sign.

          Simple logic. Any driver that doesn't stop for a stop sign isn't going to stop for a little blinking light.

          Not to mention, a blinking light doesnt mean any driver on either of those roads is going to stop.

          I agree you must indicate when signalling a change…always. But in this instance there is no 'change'. Again…if a drier won't stop for the STOP or GIVE WAY signs…they obviously don't realise they have to also give way to any other car coming from the left (right).

          Instead of indicating in this instance…spend more time focussed on what other drivers are doing and if they are in fact stopping. Putting an indicator on and assuming people will stop is much much worse than not putting an indicator on and being cautious. Beside the point that you don't legally have to and don't need to anyway…as indicating doesn't change what cars have to do regardless

  • rave75 on 12/01/2020 - 19:58
    +4

    Don't indicate, you will have to change your blinker fluid too often.

    • CocaKoala on 13/01/2020 - 06:20

      I always service at the dealer, and they offer me large discounts on the monthly blinker fluid topups in return.

  • grog on 12/01/2020 - 19:58
    -2

    In W.A this would be dead easy to work out…

    If we are are turning left or right we must indicate.

    Dead easy

    It look like you are turning right?

    Here you must indicate to do what you did.

  • lostn on 12/01/2020 - 20:33

    yes. Why do you think you shouldn't?

    From your position you could either turn left or turn right. The person behind you should know which direction you intend to turn.

    I am assuming there are no traffic lights. Even if there are, it's common courtesy.

    Your diagram no offense is a bit shitty. Could you post the address or show the google maps image? I want to know if both perpendicular roads are two different streets or if they share the same street name.

  • Ragnarok1983 on 12/01/2020 - 21:45

    Only (maybe) exception is if the lane is turning right and marked with dashed lines. Even then I'd indicate.

  • Herbse on 12/01/2020 - 22:58
    -4

    I'm going to go against the grain here.

    People say to "get into the habit" and so on. But IMO if you're driving, you should be very aware of the road you're on, who's around you and who needs to know which way you're going to turn. So I believe you should use your indicator when you legally need to and when people need to know what you're doing.

    In the drawing, I can't see who would benefit from knowing which way you're turning and how it would make anyone situation any safer. You know this because you're aware of the road and how it works. So I personally wouldn't bother.

  • Kranbone on 12/01/2020 - 23:35
    +4

    No, you are continuing along the road (no crossed lines), it just so happens the road is curved.

    • MonkEE on 13/01/2020 - 07:39
      -1

      It is not a curved road. It is a t junction. If you don't signal right, people might think you are turning left.

      • Herbse on 13/01/2020 - 08:44
        +1

        Those people need to get off the road then.
        No indicator means he's continuing on the road

  • monkeyfood on 13/01/2020 - 00:19

    if you don't indicate you will have to drive "straight" through the curb and off the cliff top onto the gigant spike pit

  • coolroy on 13/01/2020 - 01:31

    Yes, always indicate when turning left or right.

    • field1985 on 13/01/2020 - 14:02
      -1

      They are not turning or changing lanes, they are continuing along the right of way, and thus DO NOT NEED TO INDICATE.

      This diagram (https://imgur.com/ALXzesm) clearly shows a T intersection where the continuing road goes around a corner.

      There is no requirement for Car A on the "continuing road" to indicate. Even RMS shows the car as NOT INDICATING.

      https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roads/safety-rules/road-rules/int…

      About time we introduced retesting (at say 45 years of age) as there are clearly a majority who don't understand the rule(s).

      • pegaxs on 13/01/2020 - 16:27

        You can cut and paste it as many times as you like, but you're the one that is wrong.

        PS: Talking in CAPS doesn't make you right, it just makes you loud.

  • Not Me on 13/01/2020 - 05:54

    The whole purpose of indicating is to "indicate" your intentions to other road users. I was always taught that my driving/riding should never take anyone by surprise.

  • CocaKoala on 13/01/2020 - 06:18
    -1

    Right of way has nothing to do with indicating. If your'e changing direction, then just indicate.

  • MonkEE on 13/01/2020 - 07:36
    +1

    Yes, cause people might think you are turning left..or right..or you are very annoying.

  • zetapulse on 13/01/2020 - 08:14
    +1

    Is it so hard to indicate whenever you're moving to the right or left? It's better to make a habit of it, better safe than sorry.
    I used to get complaints from family about using my indicators "too much", and maybe I am fervent about it, but it's only a minor inconvenience compared to the risk you take when you don't advertise your intention on the road.

  • Seraphin7 on 13/01/2020 - 09:58
    -1

    FMD, of course you need to indicate there. Please go back to your L-plates for another year.

    • field1985 on 13/01/2020 - 15:06
      -1

      Wrong

    • monkeyfood on 14/01/2020 - 06:46

      you might as well start indicating next time your driving on a freeway and come along to q 30 degree bend too

  • PirateKingJack on 13/01/2020 - 10:00

    Indicating, even if necessary or not, makes you a better driver. You want to show your intention to other drivers. It's like not having your headlights on at night. Even if you can see others, others can't see you.

    Good drivers are predictable.

    Edit: you should indicate in that situation since you are turning right (indicate right)

    • whooah1979 on 13/01/2020 - 10:23

      It's like not having your headlights on at night.

      Using headlights is a legal requirement when driving or riding between sunset and sunrise.
      https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roads/safety-rules/road-rules/lig…

      Headlights
      In many daytime situations driving with your vehicle’s headlights on can improve the likelihood of being seen by other road users. This applies to both country and city driving situations.
      Your headlights must be on when:
      Driving between sunset and sunrise
      At any other time when there is not enough daylight to be able to see a person wearing dark clothing at a distance of 100 metres

      Indicating left or right is not required while driving on a continuous stretch of road.

  • wannagrababargain on 13/01/2020 - 11:27
    +1

    I don't understand the thought process here. Indicating should be something that is so ingrained in your muscle memory that you don't even have time to think "Do I or don't I?"

    I am imagining the debate in your mind: "Ok So I am about to turn right? Do I need to indicate or not? Oh Sh**t I'm nearly at the intersection what do I do? Better ask Ozbargain. Too late…Oh why is that guy beeping at me? That warrants another Ozbargain post!"

  • ssjwill on 13/01/2020 - 12:05

    yes only if vtech just kicked in

    • cycleri3 on 13/01/2020 - 14:04
      +1

      I thought you don't if vtec kicks in, cause you'll be gone before the others even see you indicating.

  • aciid on 13/01/2020 - 12:53
    +2

    Best advice I can give anyone… when in doubt (and even sometimes just to be safe) indicate.
    People fail to use their indicators for the basic things, even when turning on a roundabout, then wonder why accidents happen.
    Expect people to be stupid on the road, and drive to a safe defensive level. Plus know your own local road rules.

  • zqipz on 13/01/2020 - 13:36

    Technically no, that lane continues and has right of way, but I would approach this situation with care, it’s atypical.

  • Ti-au on 13/01/2020 - 13:46
    +1

    Op. Can we rename the site to ozroadrulesadvice?

    Cheers.

  • field1985 on 13/01/2020 - 13:58
    +1

    The amount of people on this forum who are wrong is staggering. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO INDICATE.

    "You must indicate to let others know what you plan to do … before you turn left or right, or change lanes."

    You are not turning or changing lanes, you are continuing, and thus DO NOT NEED TO INDICATE.

    This diagram (https://imgur.com/ALXzesm) clearly shows a T intersection where the continuing road goes around a corner.

    There is no requirement for Car A on the "continuing road" to indicate. Even RMS shows the car as NOT INDICATING.

    https://www.rms.nsw.gov.au/roads/safety-rules/road-rules/int…

    About time we introduced retesting (at say 45 years of age) as there are clearly a majority who don't understand the rule(s).

    • dcash on 13/01/2020 - 14:48

      Agreed. Hopefully OzBargainers don't represent mainstream population, else we're really stuffed!

    • djprima on 13/01/2020 - 15:30
      +1

      OP's diagram is not that one though? There's a possibility for the car to turn left as well, so indicating right clears that confusion

      • Herbse on 13/01/2020 - 18:51
        +1

        What if someone sees his indicator as the OP wanting to turn into a property before the intersection? Since there's no other reason he should legally be indicating, this "indicate to be safe" tactic is actually going to cause an accident.

        • djprima on 13/01/2020 - 19:27

          What scenario are you suggesting? Indicating means everyone is taking caution not to pass on the direction indicated. I can't think of a scenario where indicating cause accidents (as opposed to not indicating)

          • Herbse on 13/01/2020 - 19:44
            +1

            @djprima: Say you're driving down a road, and indicating to turn further up. But there's a road you could turn into earlier that someone is trying to get out off. He can take your indicator as Turing in before him, so he goes and you T-bone him.

            Similar thing can happen here. If the driver coming out of the road thinks you're indicating to turn into a property. Because normal people wouldn't indicate to continue down a street.

            • djprima on 13/01/2020 - 20:03
              +1

              @Herbse: Ah I see what you're getting. If I'm the other driver I would wait until the driver completes the turn, assume all drivers are moron. Otherwise you could also reasonably judge whether the driver is actually turning before you (by slowing down), or after you (by not slowing down)

              • Herbse on 13/01/2020 - 20:07

                @djprima: Yes that's what people are supposed to do. But like you said, not everyone is on the ball all the time. Creating an ambiguous situation can cause a not at fault accident.

            • pegaxs on 13/01/2020 - 20:11
              -2

              @Herbse: It is that other waiting person's "obligation to give way" to your car, indicator or not. To suggest that putting an indicator on is the cause of crashes, is ludicrous at best. What caused the crash was the person who had the obligation to give way, not giving way.

              Here is how silly your analogy is; What if there is a driveway 5~10m from an intersection that I want to turn into. Do I only indicate in that section between that driveway and the intersection? Or as the driver waiting in the intersection, do you want to know what I am doing much sooner?

              • Herbse on 13/01/2020 - 20:36

                @pegaxs: People seem to think that using your indicator is 100% safe and to "always use it when in doubt".
                I'm pointing out that there are situations where using it without using your head and looking at it from the other driver's point of view can lead to situations where an accident can occur.
                The legalities of who's fault it is has nothing to do with what I'm pointing out.

                People need to know what they are doing and use their indicators when other drivers need to know which way you're going. Not just everytime you turn your steering wheel.

    • pegaxs on 13/01/2020 - 19:30

      You can cut and paste it as many times as you like, but you're the one that is wrong.

      PS: Talking in CAPS doesn't make you right, it just makes you loud.

  • JungliChilli on 13/01/2020 - 17:41
    +1

    If unsure always indicate.

  • [Deactivated] on 13/01/2020 - 18:33
    +1

    If in doubt, always indicate. It might just end up saving your life.

  • Captain Howdy on 13/01/2020 - 18:55

    If there's no markings on the road for you it's considered a continuation of the road, not a turn. I would indicate just in case though (technically I don't think you'd have to).

    • pegaxs on 13/01/2020 - 19:49
      +2

      If there's no markings on the road for you it's considered a continuation of the road

      Incorrect, as it is actually the opposite. For it to be a continuation of the road, there needs to be markings to show that that part of the road is indeed a continuation, and not just an end.

      This is an example of a road ending with no continuation around the bend. Notice the lack of lane marking going around a bend. Another great example of something similar to OP's drawing where a road just ends was posted by @dcash

      This is an example of a road where it is clearly "marked out" that there is a continuation around a bend. (Markings for a "continuous lane" are also clearly shown on the RMS website example.)

      No markings = end of road.

      Curved lane edge markings and/or directional arrow = continuation of road around a bend

  • No ONE on 13/01/2020 - 22:01

    Yes. But if the left turn had broken line, then you may consider that a continuous lane a bit like this & signal not required.

    • lint on 13/01/2020 - 22:52

      Why would signalling not be required there? I always signal there because you're technically moving into a newly created lane.

      EDIT: I mean I always signal left there if I wanted to go onto Briens Rd rather than continue on A28.

      • No ONE on 13/01/2020 - 22:57

        Of course you signal left when exiting. I was implying going through continuous lane does not require indicator.

        • lint on 14/01/2020 - 00:21

          Yeah, I know, hence my edit.

    • Herbse on 13/01/2020 - 23:40
      -2

      According to some people on this thread. We should all be indicating to veer right.. 🙄

      • pegaxs on 14/01/2020 - 08:39

        You and @field1985 need to hand your licenses back into your respective traffic authority and resit your driver knowledge exams. It's like you have never read any of the road rules.

        We should all be indicating to veer right.

        That's because, under Aust. Road Rule 45 and 48, if you "veer right", you have to give a signal that you are doing so…

        ARR 45: What is changing Direction
        (3) A driver changes direction to the right by doing any of the following—
        (c) diverging to the right

        and

        ARR 48: Giving a right change of direction signal
        (1) Before a driver changes direction (outlined above) to the right, the driver must give a right change of direction signal

        And if that isn't enough, if you look at "Example 3" on this page you will clearly see Car B, "veering" within its own lane, to the "right", with its indicator on.

        • Herbse on 14/01/2020 - 13:01
          -2

          Why don't manufacturers just make the indicators turn on automatically when the steering wheel is turned more than 10 degrees. By your logic and misunderstanding of the rules you've just quoted, that's what everyone should be doing.

          Looking at the rules you're quoting. Directly below it on page 46, there are drawings of the OP's exact situation. It clearly shows he should indicate if turning off but says nothing about continuing straight.

          If you think using your indicator when you're going straight on a road and not changing lanes even though doing so benefits no one, but is the correct thing to do, you're either 80 years old and/or have no clue

          • pegaxs on 14/01/2020 - 15:28
            +1

            @Herbse:

            By YoUr LoGiC

            It's not "my" logic, it's the legislation.

            YoUr MiSuNdErStAnDiNg

            It's pretty black and white. If you diverge, you need to indicate.

            RuLe 46 sAyZ… oP'z eXaCt SiTuAtiOn…

            Incorrect. This is not related to OP's drawing at all. Not only do you need to resit your driver knowledge test, seems you need a trip to Specsavers.

            iF yOu tHiNk… "when you're going straight"

            That is not what you said. You said "veer right". I don't have to think, it's right there in the legislation. If you diverge, you need to indicate.

            And the rest of your post is just you building strawmen…

  • berry580 on 13/01/2020 - 22:35
    -2

    By the same logic, you can turn left and argue no indication is required.

    What made you think a driver's licence is required for driving again?

    • Ajax45 on 14/01/2020 - 09:03

      Did you have the same attitude and tone of voice when your missus was booked for parking near the double solid lines like you asked this forum about?

      People make mistakes and it's more embarrassing that your missus who has had her license for bloody 10 years didn't know this was the law than a new P-plater not knowing to indicate at a certain turn. The holier-than-thou attitude you and a few others have going on on this website is mind-blowing.

      What made your wife think a driver's license was required for driving again?

      • berry580 on 14/01/2020 - 17:11

        Lol. Pulling my wife into the discussion is uncalled for.
        And when did I ever say she thinks it's required?

        Is your real name Ajax, or is it called Speed Bump back in high school?

        • Ajax45 on 14/01/2020 - 19:56

          Speed bump, proper boomer humour that.

          You can obviously dish it to new P-platers but can't cop it, that's just sad really.

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