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Optus Huawei E5577 4G Modem $29, Telstra 4GX Wi-Fi Modem $29.50 @ Australia Post

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Optus Huawei E5577 4G Modem $29, Telstra 4GX Wi-Fi Modem $29.50 @ Australia Post
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MELso on 30/11/2018 - 14:21 catalogue.auspost.com.au (4706 clicks)
Last edited 30/11/2018 - 15:56 by 2 other users

For those looking for a cheap 4G modem, Australia Post has a couple on special until 23 December.

They have the Optus Huawei E5577 for $29 with 14GB of data, and the Telstra 4GX ZTE MF910V Wi-Fi Modem with 12GB of data for $29.50 (both normally $59).

They're CAT4, meaning they don't have carrier aggregation. They can still manage up to 150/50 speeds though.

I would presume both are locked to their respective carriers.

Specs:
https://offer.optus.com.au/shop/prepaid-device/wifi-e5577?SI…
http://www.ztemobiles.com.au/MF910V.htm

Electrical & Electronics Huawei Mobile Broadband Modem Optus Telstra ZTE

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closed Comments

  • Kaboda on 30/11/2018 - 14:24
    +1

    Pretty cheap to unlock the telstra one through ebay code. I think I paid under $5 bucks for a code.

    • alwayslooking on 30/11/2018 - 14:28

      Do you have a link for the unlock code?

    • hashtagbargain on 30/11/2018 - 14:28

      Do you know if the Optus device can be eBay unlocked?

      • shadowangel on 30/11/2018 - 14:36
        +3

        Are they locked ? Last one I bought was not but that was over a year ago

        • ozhunter68 on 30/11/2018 - 14:40
          +2

          That probably was the Optus/Huawei E5573 which was in most cases unlocked.

      • wortho on 30/11/2018 - 15:05
        +3

        I had an Optus/Huawei E5573 and it was unlocked as I used on Telstra. However one day it stopped working on Band 28 (700Mhz) and found a thread on WP that suggested Telstra made changes due to IOT and certain non Telstra devices stopped working on B28 as a result of this.

        • ifuggedxyz on 01/12/2018 - 01:12

          So the Optus/Huawei E5573 cannot be used with prepaid data plan on Telstra network, is that what you meant? Sorry for the stupid question as I know nothing about all these :)

          • StrayfireX on 01/12/2018 - 08:50
            +2

            @ifuggedxyz: Telstra disabled band 28 for some non Telstra devices. This means that the range of Telstra 4G is reduced unless you get one of their devices. Just a WP theory tho.

          • ozhunter68 on 01/12/2018 - 09:18
            +1

            @ifuggedxyz: Will work but in some cases not as fast and not as long range from specific Telstra towers.

            Mostly trial and error with testing, or can get apps to see what towers use particular frequencies in your area.

        • ozhunter68 on 01/12/2018 - 09:15

          "wortho" Good point, I read something along those lines in an article and mentioned this in a comment a while ago but not many people seem to know about it. I remember reading that they did software updates to their Telstra branded/approved modems as well as phones that they wanted to continue using 4GX ( B28 ).

          Sounded like some non Telstra unlocked ( previously other carrier prepaid ) and normal non carrier unlocked would no longer work on band 28 or not use carrier aggregation as well/at all, but not clear which models.

    • sd4399340 on 30/11/2018 - 14:28

      wow, that's pretty cheap, is that still a valid deal?

    • get-innocuous on 30/11/2018 - 15:51

      Are the Telstra ones good? I have a cheap Optus stick and it gets 1.5MBit when in the same location with the same SIM at the same time (+/- time taken to move the SIM between the two) my Galaxy S7 on tether gets 20+

    • zealmax on 01/12/2018 - 10:40

      I think I paid $1.30 on ebay for the telstra one.

  • PorkHunt on 30/11/2018 - 14:38

    Does anyone know if the 4gx modem offers faster speed than a regular Telstra 4g modem?

    • ozhunter68 on 30/11/2018 - 14:43

      Best way to compare is if it includes 4G/B28 ( must have for 4GX ) and next what number CAT it supports ( the higher number the better ).

  • bargainparker on 30/11/2018 - 14:42

    Officeworks match?

    • SnoozeAndLose on 30/11/2018 - 14:47

      i believe so, give them a call?

    • turkz1 on 30/11/2018 - 17:36

      Doesn’t seem like they stock the same item?

      • bargainparker on 30/11/2018 - 19:04

        They don't, but it doesn't hurt to try https://www.officeworks.com.au/shop/officeworks/p/telstra-4g…

        • turkz1 on 30/11/2018 - 19:13
          +1

          Not sure how this will be possible at all if they don’t have the same item. Care to try and let us know?

          • bargainparker on 30/11/2018 - 19:27

            @turkz1: I will later on, but unfortunately this still means you will have to try it too, since they can see it is not the same modem. So it is more of a luck if you get them to sell it. If you are close by or passing by Officeworks, it might pay off.

  • incipient on 30/11/2018 - 14:48
    +2

    So our adsl at work is terrible… I could use this and connect to a WiFi laptop and bridge it with our work network and…wait that sounds like a bad idea =p

    Where is my nbn damnit ¬¬

    • googoogaga on 30/11/2018 - 15:04
      +3

      Not sure you would be getting the right NBN. The current government has tarnished the name of NBN, all this fttn,hfc, fttb and other crap. FTTP should have been the only one.

      • incipient on 30/11/2018 - 15:19
        +1

        I'd love Fttp, however from a pragmatic standpoint, they should have just rolled out FTTC from the start. The ~30m section of copper should easily handle even up to gigabit.

        People can upgrade to premises when they renovate etc.

        They burnt too much cash on trying to get premises up and going and now business are stuck with rubbish adsl and ISDN lines (which they're threatening to decommission!)

    • coxymla on 30/11/2018 - 15:53

      Just use the 4G modem as a USB network and route your internet through that.
      Don't bridge it with your corporate LAN or anything.

    • khomeini on 30/11/2018 - 16:09

      I don't see why that's a bad idea - probably better off getting a 4G modem (Huawei B525) which acts as just that, then you have a DMZ or firewall to bridge it to your network.

      Obviously depends on the data plan you have on the service.

      Whoops - assuming that you're the IT/Network guy there - if not definitely a bad idea!

      • incipient on 30/11/2018 - 16:19

        Haha I'm not CCNA or anything! "random small business IT chap".

        WAN->4G Modem->"Gateway" (a laptop?)->Router (w Firewall)->LAN

        Seems…convoluted! And would likely end up with a non-edge designed device in an edge location; whatever I use for the gateway. Port forwarding across the chain would be interesting too; does a consumer 4g device allow DMZs to be set? I would ideally use a proper device…but i can't think of anything that allows uplink/WAN over wifi!

        • khomeini on 30/11/2018 - 16:57

          Mate it's simple. Just use it like this… 4g modem (eg Huawei b525 - I wouldn't suggest a WiFi modem like this deal) -> router/firewall device —> Lan. Or if you want it basic then b525 modem direct to Lan.

          I know as I've used this in a small business environment. It works… But make sure you to protect the connection with security protocols either in modern settings or via router/firewall.

          I got two 4g modems which I forget the makes/models of but both I got from officeworks - worked fine via the above setup.

          Good luck

          • garage sale on 30/11/2018 - 21:42

            @khomeini: they are wifi hot spots that support upto 10 connections …..just turn it on and go.

            the usb versions also work in the tp link vr600 as backup ….was my go to when tpg adsl died

    • DangerNoodle on 30/11/2018 - 16:54
      +1

      I run the Optus Netgear ac800s modem at home on the aircard smart cradle to expand to four Ethernet ports. Off-Peak speed is 224 mbit, peak speed is 120-ish mbit downstream, speed would be faster if I lived in an area with better reception. Upstream stays around 40mbit. Ping isnt as good as fttp but still good enough for gaming without holding me back (15ms-20ms). I'm on a $60/200gb plan with Optus and it data pools to our phones as well.

      Alternatively the $60/200gb plan could also get you a free Samsung galaxy tab s4 which has a cat16 1000mbps modem and comes with free wireless headphones, but harder to use for your network. The galaxy tab s4 also has 5ghz wifi band for its wireless hotspot capabilities.

      • carling on 30/11/2018 - 21:14

        I'm currently running the hauwei b525 set up and my speeds have been disappointing to say the least. I'm the cbd and average 2 or 3 bars of 4g reception at home. Is it worth upgrading my router set up, will it improve my speeds.
        I get constant drop outs and flucuations in speed.
        Off peak 12mb-20mb
        Peak anywhere from 1mb-10mb.
        I'm with optus btw

        • DangerNoodle on 30/11/2018 - 21:45

          the modem will improve speed as it maintains multiple connections instead of a single connection to optus. However, it does depend on the saturation in the area. CBD areas tend to have much more bandwidth but they do have a lot more traffic, its a bit of a trade off.

          I find quiet areas tend to be better, and areas with less signal interference.

  • Schumi5 on 30/11/2018 - 14:50
    +3

    Was looking at getting a wifi pocket device for use while travelling overseas, because there is 2 of us and really only interested in using it for DATA, can anyone recommend which of the 2 would be capable of
    a) being unlocked to use with any network overseas
    b) use it with a local sim card when going overseas for Europe and the US.
    or even if none of these, another model that can do the above?

    Much appreciated

    • Mokr on 30/11/2018 - 15:23
      +1

      Make sure it can handle (850/900/1800/1900MHz) GSM and 2100MHz 3G

      • DangerNoodle on 30/11/2018 - 17:48

        Look into skyroam. You can buy a single and global Sim and pay for the days you use it.

    • cimrak on 01/12/2018 - 20:49

      I used a slightly different model (ZTE MF920V. Pretty sure it just allows more devices to connect to it compared to the MF910V listed here) earlier in the year for a trip to Singapore, UK and canada.

      Popped in a local sim card in each country and had instant internet for 2x mobile plus a laptop. Builtin battery on the hotspot lasted around 5hrs from memory but it charges via micro-usb so I plugged into a battery pack for longer trips away from the hotel. Can use it fine while charging.

  • noyesmaybeok on 30/11/2018 - 14:54
    +4

    Would either of these be faster than E5573 on Optus?

  • lawyerz on 30/11/2018 - 14:54

    if you're getting the 4gx modem, does any other carrier offer 4gx speeds other than telstra?

  • Rukiata on 30/11/2018 - 15:20

    which Modem is the better one? and has more bands? what model number is the telstra one?

    Why am I being downvoted? I am trying to find out which one is better. Yet cant find any specs on them

    • wortho on 30/11/2018 - 15:43
      +2

      I'd probably go with the Telstra 4GX ZTE MF910V as it supports LTE 700 (Band 28) on Telstra. As I mentioned above non-Telstra devices have ceased working on Telstra's LTE 700 since they implemented IOT changes. I recently purchased the Telstra Pre Paid 4GX Wi-Fi Pro (Huawei e5787) for $99 and very happy with performance and battery life as well as larger screen. Also have a patch lead to allow external antenna which works really well when out bush, i'm the only one with coverage on the campsite ;)
      http://www.telcoantennas.com.au/site/patch-lead-telstra-pre-…

      • noyesmaybeok on 01/12/2018 - 07:36

        Do you know if it'd be good for Optus?

        What external antenna are you using?

        • wortho on 01/12/2018 - 11:30

          The Antenna I bought on eBAY was an AXIS CLR8 4G 3G GSM 7-9DB 720MM ANTENNA MOBILE BLACK HEAVY DUTY however it came with around 4-5 meters of coax cable and I worked out the losses on the coax were almost as high as the gain on the antenna so I chopped the cable down and fitted a new connector which can be tricky. If you buy an Antenna from telcoantennas you can specify the cable length and keep it to a minimum and preferable no more than 1-2 meters. The problem is the coax is quite skinny and subsequently it has high loss especially at the the higher frequencies.

  • bargainparker on 30/11/2018 - 15:21

    We need a technician here, people are asking questions

  • twang on 30/11/2018 - 15:33

    Any of these work with 4g on DoCoMo in Japan?

  • nzthunderboy on 30/11/2018 - 15:38

    As per the latest reports.. I see a national security threat from buying anything from this brand.

    • bargainparker on 30/11/2018 - 17:01
      -2

      Just about anything you buy from China can be a national security threat if we are going to be paranoid.

  • Bellyup on 30/11/2018 - 15:45
    +3

    i have this: Optus Huawei E5577 4G Modem. I've used it on cruise ships all through the med and morocco, scotland, finland, iceland, france and it's been fantastic. obviously it won't work out at sea, but has been great for the cruises i've been on when at port and on land (using a prepaid libara sim or similar). the ships charge by the minute and are really slow when hundreds of people are on at the same time so you can leave this on continuously without having to jump on and off the internet to get emails and it's fast enough for most surfing and youtube.

    • ttkc on 30/11/2018 - 16:38
      +1

      Isn't the E5577 locked to Optus? Did you pay to unlock it to use overseas sim?

  • aboutconfig on 30/11/2018 - 16:12
    +3

    Optus Huawei E5577 4G Modem
    Bands:
    3G Network Bands (in MHz) DC-HSPA+/HSPA+/HSPA/UMTS： Band1(2100MHz)/Band5(850MHz)/Band8(900MHz)
    4G Network Bands (Band & MHz) LTE FDD：B1(2100MHz)/B3(1800MHz)/ B7(2600MHz)/B8(900MHz)/B20(800MHz)/B28(700MHz)
    LTE TDD: B38(TDD 2600MHz)/B40(TDD 2400MHz)/B41(TDD 2500MHz)
    WiFi Bands: 802.11 b/g/n

    Telstra 4GX
    Wi-Fi 802.11 Dual Band (2.4GHz & 5GHz) b/g/n, MIMO 2x2, up to 10 users
    LTE 700, 1800, 2600
    3G UMTS 850, 2100
    LTE speeds up to 150Mbps download

    • aboutconfig on 30/11/2018 - 16:12

      Seems the optus one supports a shit load more of frequency

      • bdl on 30/11/2018 - 18:48

        The manual of the 910Z actually says it supports 4G 700, 900, 1800, 2100, 2600 (yes I know this contradicts what is on the Telstra website)

        FWIW the 910Z also has 2x TS9 antenna ports

  • aboutconfig on 30/11/2018 - 16:21

    Telstra 4GX Advanced III

    3G:
    850MHz
    900
    1900
    2100
    HSDPA CAT24 (42.2Mbps)
    HSUPA CAT6 (5.76Mbps)

    LTE:
    700
    1800
    2600
    900
    2100

    Supports Carrier Aggegration on, up to 600Mbs
    1800+700,
    1800+2600,
    2600+700,
    2600+2600,
    700+1800+2600,
    1800+2600+2600,
    700+2600+2600 MHz

    antenna connector(s) 2 x TS9

    • hungerlord on 30/11/2018 - 16:27

      Sorry for this dumb question but I know nothing about all of these. Does this mean the Telstra one supports more frequencies?

      • MELso on 30/11/2018 - 17:06
        +2

        That Telstra model is a more expensive, fancier CAT11 model that can go up to 600mbps if your reception is good enough.

    • [Deactivated] on 04/12/2018 - 15:24

      Yeah but is that one $29….?

  • [Deactivated] on 30/11/2018 - 16:30

    Sorry for the ignorance, but is there generally a time limit to use the include 14gb after activation? I couldn't see anything in the T&Cs. Considering getting this for backup internet and occasional travel so it will probably sit unused for a while until i need it

    • garage sale on 30/11/2018 - 21:47

      yes they have time limits once activated ….need to check on specific offer as some have bonus data but typically 14 or 30 days …..none are long life.

  • Davros on 30/11/2018 - 16:35
    -3

    Still don't know why you'd bother when you can simply use your phone as a hotspot AND make calls.
    That's how we've been doing it full time for the last two years

    • athk on 30/11/2018 - 16:45
      +2

      I thought it was simple..

      Longer battery life on your mobile ;)

      • Davros on 01/12/2018 - 05:58
        -1

        We simply leave ours plugged in running 24/7

        • athk on 01/12/2018 - 07:57
          -1

          Plugged in… The keyword here…

          Now on the move when your battery bank has run out and you have no power.. what do you rely on? That's it! Your phone's battery…

          Which is now dead because you're hotspotting 24/7 and using it at the same time.

          Boom.

          See ya.

          • Davros on 01/12/2018 - 09:30
            -1

            @athk: We live on a boat so are continually on the move.
            If we go ashore, because the phone is plugged in, it has 100% charge.

            • athk on 01/12/2018 - 09:55

              @Davros: You're either really daft or just shite at trolling.

              • Davros on 02/12/2018 - 05:55
                -1

                @athk: Is that all you have, insults?

    • bargainparker on 30/11/2018 - 17:05

      Not all phones are good for hotspot. With some you get a delay in opening pages, while using modem loads in an instant.
      You also have to account that it takes toll on your phone.

    • garage sale on 30/11/2018 - 21:49
      +1

      most phones don’t have replaceable batteries …it’s an expensive way to shorten the life span of your phone.

      • Davros on 01/12/2018 - 05:57

        Never had a phone that didn't have replaceable battery
        Never spent more than $50 on a phone
        Never had to replace a battery yet.

        • smartazz104 on 01/12/2018 - 13:18
          +1

          Great, so this particular product isn't for people who use $50 phones with replaceable batteries who live on a boat for most of their lives.

  • Entropy Sky on 30/11/2018 - 16:53

    So, this or a phone with dual sim?

    • mangoed on 03/12/2018 - 00:14
      +1

      Depends on how do you plan to use it. If you use your phone to share the internet connection with some other devices (laptop/tablet etc), then better get a modem because hotspot mode eats phone's battery pretty quickly, especially when a lot of data is transferred. if you just want to use one sim for calls and another for data on your phone, dual sim could be more convenient because there is no need to carry another device in your pocket.

  • ifuggedxyz on 30/11/2018 - 17:24

    As others have been asking above, which one should I get - considering both can be unlocked?. I know nothing about all these other than they are portable modems and work like… portable modems :)

    • bdl on 30/11/2018 - 18:42
      +1

      I got the Telstra one cause I had a few hundred of credit to burn through on my Telstra prepaid account. Used $80 of that to unlock the device so my total outlay was only $29.50.

      I had a non band 28 hotspot I was using previously, this way I figured I could obtain Band 28 coverage on Optus and Telstra after unlocking. The Telstra device doesn't cover Optus' 2300Mhz TDD, but I thought gaining the 700mhz was more valuable.

      FWIW the Telstra device is MicroSIM tray which is a little bit of a tight fit with the Amaysim nano sim and tray adaptor. I really had to bash the nanosim into the adaptor to make it thin enough. Kogan sim had no problems.

      Another difference - the Android ZTE app compared to the Huawei app is a lot less polished. Gets the job done but the Huawei one is definitely superior. Looks less like it's been programmed by a preschooler :D

    • tramperleo on 30/11/2018 - 19:40
      +4

      If your want to use it with sims from different carriers. Both of the 2 are not good. The best choice is still Optus E5573.
      Except has a screen, Optus E5577 is a lower version than e5573. It lacks 3G 850MHz and so works with Telstra 4G ONLY in most areas. It also 2.4GHz wifi only.
      For Telstra ZTE one. All this modem on market now are 910z, but not 910v. Similar, 910z is a lower version than MF910v. It's also 2.4GHz only compare to 910v 2.4+5GHz.

      F
      Also for unlocking, ZTE can be unlocked cheap, but no 3G 900Mhz compatible even after unlock. Optus e5577 still has no unlocking solution.

      So for 4G wifi modems on market, Optus huawei E5573 still the best choice: All frequencies compatible (except Telstra 700MHz after Telstra narrowed its 700Mhz network), unlocked originally and dual band wifi.

      • ttkc on 30/11/2018 - 22:55

        Are you sure the E5573 supports 5GHz wifi? Also I think the little LCD screen in the E5577 is a big improvement over the E5573 as it is much more convenient to check battery status, signal strength and data usage with a built in display. I just hope there is a cheap way to unlock the e5577.

      • ifuggedxyz on 01/12/2018 - 01:15

        Sorry for the stupid question as this is all new to me.

        When you said "except Telstra 700MHz after Telstra narrowed its 700Mhz network" does this mean that prepaid data plan on Telstra network will not work on this modem? And any data plan on Voda and Optus networks will be fine?

      • JTTheMan on 06/12/2018 - 11:50

        @tramperleo - Thanks for that info as I was wondering about all of the above.

        I currently have the E5573 and wanted to know what the difference is to the E5577?
        All I could find with a Google search is that the screen is the only difference but after reading the above I think I'll just stick with the E5573

    • ShoeyAU on 02/12/2018 - 15:22

      I got the Optus one. I saw this deal via Sizzle on Friday and went straight to the PO at Martin Place but the Telstra was sold out already! Still got Optus as a "2nd prize". It looks like the Telstra can be unlocked via ebay code but after a bit of Google it seems the Optus E5577 needs a bit of faffing around using dc-unlocker on Windows via USB (dc-unlocker still charges for the hardware specific unlock codes on a credits basis).

      I'm going to use up the data allocation on the optus sim before attempting to unlock. I would have preferred the Telstra one given the better coverage in my area and ease of unlocking.

  • Mnke on 30/11/2018 - 17:32

    Neither of these support 5GHz wifi so I’m sticking with my E5573.

    • aldroid on 30/11/2018 - 18:27
      +1

      The Telstra MF910V does support 5GHz wifi, but you must choose either 5 or 2.4 in the advanced settings. It won't do both at the same time.

      • tramperleo on 30/11/2018 - 19:16

        MF910v no longer on market for a period time. All these devices selling now are MF910z including this Auspost one. MF910z is 2.4GHz only.

        • aldroid on 30/11/2018 - 19:35

          Sorry, my bad. Didn't notice it was a Z.

  • he88388 on 30/11/2018 - 17:53

    I am new to this as I have move house to an area without nbn. Only ADSL with 8mpbs which I am not interested in paying $69 per month with 100b data.
    I am thinking of buying a modem like these and use it as my home internet instead of ADSL.
    My question is will I be able to buy a prepaid mobile sim card and activate it and use the data component in this modem? Or does the telco knows it and the sim will no work inside these modems. Please advise.

    • cwongtech on 30/11/2018 - 18:30

      Should be able to do this as long as the apn settings are right. Look into Kogan 1 mth promos… Usually $5 or under for their XL plans (currently 40GB), pair it with a Xiaomi repeater and you have a solid cheap internet source.

      Not suitable for low latency applications like gaming though. Everything else is fine

    • bdl on 30/11/2018 - 18:54

      For home use I'd even look at something like this:

      https://www.kogan.com/au/buy/kogan-4g-wifi-home-router/
      https://www.kogan.com/au/buy/netgear-4g-lte-modem-lb2120-100…

      .. gives you a wired Ethernet port for home devices that may be Ethernet only. You could using all your existing wired hubs, switches, xboxes, stoves, toasters, kettles, etc :)

      Then just shop around with SIMs and get the Kogan super cheap SIMs when on sale

      And if you ever go to NBN or ADSL in future you could always use something like the LB2120 to provide a backup 4G link since it has a WAN port.

  • pdperth on 30/11/2018 - 18:45

    http://www.ztemobiles.com.au/mbb_products.htm compares the MF910V and MF910Y - the V is locked to telstra? Telstra have the MF910Y at $79 with the same activation bonus - telstra have longlife $150 on the same website for 50G for 365 days no rollover which is a ripoff but good for telstra?

    • bdl on 30/11/2018 - 18:46

      All the prepaid devices are locked to Telstra. FWIW the one that I got from Auspost day before yesterday at this price is a MF910Z :P Even though it says 910Y on the website.

      • zfind on 07/12/2018 - 18:53

        Do you know what prepaid it comes with? Trying to find out the data allowance and expiry but here’s no info.

  • draistlin on 30/11/2018 - 18:48

    Anyone know if these will work in China?

    • bdl on 30/11/2018 - 18:50

      Depends what mobile network you are using in China, are you roaming on a Telstra SIM?

      • draistlin on 30/11/2018 - 19:24

        No probably looking to get a sim when I get there

    • tramperleo on 30/11/2018 - 19:51

      If you can unlock them successfully, then
      Both of these modems work with China Unicom, China Telecom, but not China Mobile

      • draistlin on 01/12/2018 - 00:41

        Cool, thanks for that. Though If I had to pick, would you have any suggestions?

      • draistlin on 01/12/2018 - 00:41

        Cool, thanks for that. Though If I had to pick, would you have any suggestions?

  • GreenGuava on 30/11/2018 - 20:46

    I recently signed up for the Optus 200GB data SIM plus tablet deal to use as the main internet at home (NBN not due for 6 months). Was planning on using it as the main mode of internet and was thinking of either using the tablet or an old phone (HTC M8, Cat4 LTE, Wireless AC) as hotspot for my other devices to piggyback off.

    After seeing this deal, I was wondering whether eithet of these would these give better WiFi range than using the wireless hotspot function on a tablet/phone as above?

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