Hi all
In NSW, during double demerit points, driver can lose 10 demerit points.
With only 13 points at max, losing 10 point isn’t bit too much where driver has to wait for 3 years to earn points back?
With all latest safety features and safer cars (+ traffic forcing cars to go slow), what do you think?
I reckon a lot of those safety features make drivers lazy and reduce the attention paid to the road.
This.
For decades, road engineers have worked to make accident prone road bends less severe, because the thought at the time was that car accidents were happening due to the angle of the bend.
It took some time for them to realise that the reason why car accidents were still happening at these bends, was not due to the severity of the angle, but due to the fact people were still driving too fast for the road conditions, because they were not paying attention to the road or subsequent warning signs.
I reckon a lot of those safety features make drivers lazy and reduce the attention paid to the road.
Agreed. If there are a huge spike on your steering wheel instead of an airbag, people would drive a lot safer.
Or move the driver’s seat to the front bumper.
My car didn't come with Bluetooth unfortunately, Hyundai i35
I purchase a Bluetooth option at an additional cost as well as a Magnetic phone mount for my Phone as listed on Ozbargain a while ago now,
after I got the phone holder I bought more for my family and my brothers family cause I thought they were brilliant.
No excuse to not have your phone on mount and not to have some sort of Bluetooth addition to your car.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Baseus-Universal-Magnetic-Ball-M…
What bluetooth option did you go for.
The car had an option from Hyundai. I just booked it in for it to be fitted, it wasn't a third party.cheers
Isn't it a bit of a joke that you're ONLY allowed to touch the phone when in a mount? What's the difference?
I agree, I think the idea is that you're allowed to use your head unit or climate control while driving so if the phone is mounted somewhere then using it becomes the same as those. It's a weird area as there are worse things you can be doing while driving that won't get you in trouble as fast as if you were holding your phone.
(Edit) Just noticed "happirt" explained the same thing earlier.
I like the idea that phones have built-in tech to help avoid some of the unnecessary tragedies, although what form it should take will surely be a subject of debate. The suggestion given here:
Apple and Google have the power and the technology to change this.
They could auto-enable their existing “Do Not Disturb” function on their smartphones, which can activate as soon as a vehicle starts moving. You could still use maps and Bluetooth. You just wouldn’t be distracted by notifications or text messages.
Don't see why not.
Technology isn't going in that direction. The future is autonomous vehicles where the driver is having video conferences, a nap or other types of fun.
I suppose until autonomous vehicles become mature and reliable enough, affordable and adopted by every driver, then any aid which can help avoid death and injuries from manually-driven cars, has to be beneficial.
The problem with that approach, is that everyone in the car would be unable to use their phone, even if they were in a taxi.
They could auto-enable their existing “Do Not Disturb” function on their smartphones, which can activate as soon as a vehicle starts moving.
I read this as a aid, which can be turned on. And can be turned off if you are not driving or a passenger in a vehicle.
I do, ever tried public transport or passenger in a car.
As an iOS user it bugs the heck out of me always, turns on when I am on the Bus or Train.
I keep it set to AUTO as I drive a few days a week and weekends.
Tried the various modes and contacted Apple.
Choices are either turn off and disable the feature, or put up with the prompts.
Or buy a new car with "Apple Play" then it can tell if I am in the car and assumes I am driving (if paired).
Even though it bugs the hell out of me, it's still a great safety feature and I leave it on. (Calls still come through)
As a truck driver, this makes me sooo angry. It’s up to 60+tonnes of rolling death, why the need? I get it, it’s their business or the long haul work is boring, but it’s just dumbfounding when I come across other truckies on their phone. Or listening to the same guys at truck stops complaining about the amount of car drivers that do it and then drive off and do the same thing.
I have less sympathy for truck drivers than I do for car drivers when it comes to mobile phone use whilst driving…
Or the police, who for some unfathomable reason are allowed to use a mobile while driving.
I'd like someone to show me, where in their training, they're taught to be super multitaskers.
That overweight, 50 year old I saw the other day was certainly not magically better at driving while texting, than the bimbo in the car next to him.
They're much safer when speeding too aparently
Oh look, a down vote without a comment. Don't like it, but can't put together an argument? Or a cop?
You also LOSE several points for misspelling "lose" (Two offences in the one post)
Should be instant loss of licence. Do you know how many times I’ve seen someone partly out of their lane and gone by them to go oh of course they are on their phone. I even nearly got collected by a guy the other day he swerved towards me and realised so swerved back towards the other car. Nearly took both our cars out. Considering 2 seconds looking at your phone at 60km/hr is 17m a second you will travel 34m without watching now that’s dangerous. Imagine at 80 or 100. If you really need to use your phone in a vehicle get a bus or taxi!
I think most people have been guilty of using their mobile phone at one point, but that doesn't make it right. Speeding doesn't kill, distraction does, and it's good to see everyone can get on board with being as harsh as possible to mobile phone users.
Worst I do is (profanity) with my maps while stopped. Pretty rare I do it though.
Would never dream of touching it while moving though.
I think Police (and other drivers) use discretion in judgement here, if someone looks at their phone, at a traffic light, just after it went red, then throws it away, no one cares. If they're intently looking/reading something and the light changes, that's when I and others get annoyed, and I don't think a honk is out of the question at that point.
saw the car of a girl (smart, pretty scientist) after she took a call and then tried texting on a motorway. she took out all 4 lanes, multiple cars and incredibly no fatalities but lots of injury's and after that I never touch my phone driving, points or no point/fines!
my niece has paid >5k in fines, she still has her licence but its only a matter of time. you live and learn, or you dont ~ evolution at work!
IOS HAS A DRIVER DETECTION MODE AND IT WILL ONLY BLUETOOTH A CALL. ALL OTHER FUNCTIONS WHILE THE CARS IN MOTION ARE DISABLED ~ BEST MODE EVER, SHOULD BE MANDATORY!
Does it shout at you if a call comes in?
I get it - your need to take a call or text is far more important than the lives and property of those around you.
Quite frankly it should be mote. It should be an instant suspension.
People are being injured and killed because people think its ok to text while they drive.
It should be 10 points all the time, AND instant confiscation of the phone for 1 month.
Destruction of the phone (and the sim) for repeat offender.
People pay tens of thousands of dollars for a vehicle and can't (won't) stump up $200 for a handsfree device…..go figure
People pay tens of thousands of dollars for a vehicle and can't (won't) stump up $200
But it's worse than that. Doesn't nearly every new-ish car have bluetooth integration for calls? Pretty sure even 2006 Hyundai Getz has, and the following i30 of 2008.
Point is, basic stuff that isn't expensive!
put one into my ek civic 97 for 60 bucks …….. dont think ive ever used it but its not expensive (saved 20 by installing myself)
You can buy a handsfree kit off enay for $20 that works throuvg the car radio. There is no excuse.
If you want to see how bad mobile phone use is, hop on a bike. It is far worse and more widespread than people think.
If you want to see how bad mobile phone use is, hop on a bike.
Er… because riding a bicycle bestows mystical powers of superior observation ability?
Ah… maybe receiving those skills is a trade-off for those cyclists who weave through traffic, ride onto footpaths, go through red lights?
Nah… No-one has ever seen a cyclist do those things.
Cyclists really are perfect humans; their own smug self-satisfaction and moral superiority proves it.
With all latest safety features and safer cars (+ traffic forcing cars to go slow), what do you think?
Which modern safety feature do you think adequately compensates for being distracted? The irony might be that because of risk compensation the more safety featured advertised the more complacent people become about their role in driving.
People vastly over estimate their driving skills, couple that with safety features & you get people who think it is cool to drive as they please and people whinging about the consequences of doing so. The state probably would cut up their license but being a vehicle owner and operator is too profitable for them so they rarely go that far.
More often then not when I look in the rear view mirror these days at a red light, I see the driver behind's eyes doing the dart down & up dance. It's so obvious they're on their phone - infuriating. What is so important?
You don't loose demerit points, nor do you lose them, or even win them.
You also don't start with 12 demerit points to lose.
Generally speaking, when you are issued with a fine, you are also allocated or receive demerit points, which are then recorded against your driving licence.
Once you receive / are allocated a total of 12 or more (WA law, but likely similar across the country), it usually results in your licence being disqualified.
(De)merit, is a negative concept.
Now who wants to buy some demerit points from me? These are the only ones I've ever won, and have a "use by" date of the 27/12/2018, so be quick as stocks won't last!
The demerit points are the legal term. However, It’s just easy for drivers to use the term gain or loss or get back demerit point because it helps them better understand the offence and they don’t care about the technicality of demerit point system. At the end of the day, it reaches the same outcome.
Well excuse me for trying to promote a country where we put the concept of understanding a basic concept before resigning ourselves to ignorant stupidity, because who wants to be correct when we can be lazy.
Look at how the Yanks have absolutely slaughtered the English language by following the same methodology, and there you have a perfect example of why ignorance is not bliss.
Btw, to whomever down voted my original comment, all I have to say to you is wow.. Just f**king wow.
u can still use it if the phone is either:
seriously though, phone addiction is real. get help.
10pts is only for a few days a year.
Why is it ok in a cradle? I can't get my head around that
a fixed mount is considered safer, much like your stereo and climate control is fixed in the dash. but most people have temporary fixed cradle that doesn't hold the phone tightly so any high speed impact could cause the phone to become a projectile, right near your head. magnetic holders anyone?
even in a cradle they are specific on usage. you can only use for phone, navigation and music, ie. you're not supposed to text or facebook.
It should be disqualification on the spot.
Saw some numbnut on a motorbike texting whilst riding the other day. Deathwish.
It should be instant license suspension for a period of time + heavy fine + towed car.
If you really must attend calls during driving it should be done the proper way with a bt headset or other means such as carplay / a-auto. Mobile phones have become way too distracting.
Why not confiscate/impound phones?
Hoons have their cars confiscated and crushed on the third occasion in NSW under Hoon Laws. $1,500 phone vs $50,000 car.
Seen this made mention of a few times now, and I love the idea. Only problem is, confiscating someone’s $29 burner… maybe confiscate or lock out their mobile account for a few days, then a few weeks and then banning them from having mobile accounts. If they are caught using someone else’s account/phone, that is shut down and or restricted, the same as hoon drivers in other cars. If I knew someone was banned from having a mobile phone, no way would I lend them mine under these conditions…
this is why you ban the individual from activating a new service. Obviously you can't stop them getting a phone in someone else name but its another obstacle to overcome.
if it was up to me with all the warnings about use of mobile phones whilst driving I would give complete loss of license for 3 yrs and loss of registration and have their vehicle impounded for 3 years,if you use your mobile you are a bloody idiot and Australia does not need bloody idiots driving around on our streets especially during double demerit times when there are more children and their families using the roads and people like this have their vehicle deemed as an offensive weapon
Would plugging the phone to charger constitute mobile use?
Read the rules for your state.
In Victoria, it would be if the phone is not in a mounted phone holder.
You can use your phone, in a phone mount for GPS and music use here in Victoria
loosing 10 point isn’t bit too much
It's not enough.
1st offence should be forfeiting the phone, loss of licence for a year and a huge fine.
Doubled for second offence, then lose licence permanently for 3rd.
No excuse for using your phone, it's an arrogant and blatant disregard for the law and other people.
No 'safer car' is going to save someone's life when you've veered off into the emergency lane and slammed into someone changing a spare tyre.
Wish the penalties are harsher. I have seen so many on the mobile phone while driving, it worries me.
I had a young girl drove onto my car head on while texting. Funny thing is I spotted it, stopped and blared my horn to no avail. I couldn't swerve as it was a narrow road and there were pedestrians. She then had the gall to say it wasn't her fault when both our cars were in my lane lmao, only she was in the opposite direction.
(profanity) idiots.
I think they should lose the license automatically. Sometimes when I'm on the road seeing some idiots playing mobile phones I wish I were the cop. I'll take out his license and cut it into many pieces in front of him.
Get a foreign drivers licence and you have unlimited demerit points ;)
Wrong. You can still accumulate demerit points. You need to change your license over if you plan on staying or residing in NSW any longer than 3 months (from memory). You’ll need to transfer your license over.
If you stay on your international license, the NSW government has the right to revoke your right to drive, regardless of what license you hold. They can also ban you from applying for a NSW drivers license for a period of time if you have accumulated a significant amount of demerit points.
So no, getting an international license is not a “get out of jail free” card for someone to break the law with impunity.
Technically I am correct - holding a foreign licence and if driving less than three months, you have unlimited points.
However,
You said the "NSW government has the right to revoke your right to drive, regardless of what license you hold?"
and
You said "they can also ban you from applying for a NSW drivers licence for a period of time if you have accumulated a significant amount of demerit points"
Where does it say that?? Come on, prove me wrong. To help you, here is the link to the RMS site:-
Drivers visiting NSW
If you are a visiting driver and do not hold a NSW driver licence, your permission to drive in NSW can be withdrawn under the same provisions.
Found here
Come on, prove me wrong
I see you have a little bit of foot in your mouth…
The reason I am aware of this law was because my wife had a license from another country and I asked the question at the time she was changing it over, “what if she just stays on her international license? She can’t lose it from points…” and the reply I got was the one above.
The NSW government still has the right to revoke your permission to drive if you make an arsehat of yourself whilst driving on their roads, regardless of your license being “international”.
And technically, no, you are wrong. If you are on an international license and receive enough traffic infringements, your right to drive in NSW can be revoked. So no, you don’t have “unlimited” demerit points. Sure, you can leave the country and go home, but those fines and point and suspension will still be there if you ever decide to return.
While you could say 'oh but the safety features in cars now, using a mobile should be fine!'. Well with all the HANDS FREE features in cars now, Apple Car Play, Android Auto, Echo Auto - there is really no great justification to need to use it. You can send a read a text, write a reply, check that its correct and then send it entirely without looking at a screen. You can change songs, change apps, do your navigation. These features can be added to pretty much any car, especially with Echo Auto launching for a very affordable price.
I'm sure we all do have a cheeky peak at our phones from time to time. But we really shouldn't.
Its really dangerous man. You aren't watching the road. You're probably safer driving at 0.06 BAC than driving while texting.
But hey, I agree, as soon as 'mind free' auto pilot exists, then I think you should be able to drive that sort of car and text away, or have a nap. But we aren't there yet. Current auto pilot systems are far off being mind free. They aren't even at Eyes Free yet.
Biggest contributor of mobile use is heavy traffic all the times in Sydney at least.
Drivers caught on phone should lose licence on the spot.
It's not enough. There's been some horrific accidents due to mobile phone use and it's nothing but pure arrogance to think that it's not going to be you.
The only people on the road who don’t see the issue with drivers using phones are the phone users themselves…because they’ve got no f—-ing idea what’s going on around them.
And wtf has car safety features got to do with reading and writing while you “drive”. YOU are the one meant to be operating and controlling the car and it’s “safety features”. Dimwits.
Don't know why there are always SO many driving posts or enquiries along the lines of "I knowlingly endangered people's lives, BUT…" How about we stop trying to put a "but" at the end all the time. The road rules aren't rocket science; they're pretty simple to follow. Take your demerit points and go.
I bought a cradle for my phone which I use for GPS.
You shouldn't be texting at driving at the same time (my phone sometimes doesn't pick up keyboard presses near the edge anyway so texting while driving is pointless).
…come to think of it, so was changing the radio on my old head unit, the buttons were microscopic. go figure.
You get 10 points for being loose?! 😂
Tightarse has negative demerit points.
I'm not sure how safety features are going to stop you causing an accident while using your phone.
Just dont use your phone for the small amount of time you're driving
Im in Mississippi ATM and I see many use there mobile phones while driving daily.Havn't seen an accident yet.Include Louisiana in that also….
I believe texting is frowned upon…
I have been flicking lit matches into a dry pile of leaves, haven’t seen a fire … yet.
I’ve been driving locally and haven’t SEEN an accident in months. Hear about the on the news nightly.
As I recall, this was pushed because someone who had previously received a fine and a slap on the wrist decided to stay glued to their phone for 30 seconds and ended up pinning two officers against their vehicle at an RBT.
It's already hard enough avoiding all the idiots out there without being distracted by a non-essential device - honestly, people can live without Facebook and Instagr while they drive. If you want to use your phone while travelling, do the smart thing and ride public transport.
I no doubt support penalties for using a phone while driving.
But if running a red light, which is much more dangerous, is costs 3 or 4 points, I don't think 10 points fits a mobile phone usage fine.
I saw a hoon do 60kmh in a packed carpark at 2pm yesterday. Kids and family around, pushing strollers, old people, and myself. Don't think they would have gotten 10 demerits. The only thing which saved most of us was the loud roar of his engine warning us, amplified by the underground parking walls.
Like you said, 10 Demerit points is a disproportial punishment to other offenses out there.
Same goes for drug users. It's simple. Just don't use drugs (just don't use a phone right?). Punishment should be execution. They're a burden on the healthcare system when when the Doctors have to deal with you OD'ing and then have to deal with your dumbass corpse when your useless existence comes to an end. /s
The issue is in educating the public, and higher demerits aren't going to be an effective deterrant. The punishment for murder still doesn't stop people from murdering does it?
I'm sure lots of ozbargainers here can't take a dose of reality when their hypocrisy gets called out.
If you are a half competent driver in an automatic car, I don't have a problem with someone talking on their phone. Don't see much difference in using the handset or bluetooth. Texting is a completely different story and the book should be thrown at morons who text and drive.
there are some things that need to be same country wide,
we are one country after all and having different laws in different states for some very important issues is crazy.
Appreciate some things don't matter, so go for gold, but some things should be the same no matter where you live in the country.
You can buy a quality Bluetooth for not very much or you can get a fine and lose demerit points. Simple.
What about using mobile as GPS.
Can I opearte google maps while driving while mobile is mounted?
*6. Can I use the GPS function on my mobile phone?
Yes, if you have a full unrestricted licence. You can use a mobile phone as a driver’s aid, such as GPS, as long as it is secured in a mounting fixed to the vehicle and doesn’t obscure your view of the road. You cannot hold your phone to use the GPS function.
No, if you have a learner or provisional licence, you are not permitted to use a mobile phone at all while driving.
http://roadsafety.transport.nsw.gov.au/stayingsafe/mobilepho…
As long as the phone is mounted and you don't touch it. You can.
The link above doesnt say you cant touch it for GPS use.
Seeking a confirmation.
Busted without a P-plate is now 2 demerit points, which i think is a little extreme. One of mine fell off my motorcycle, without me knowing. Highway patrol treated me like I was a drunk driver…
Sounds like failed the mandatory attitude test? :p
Because every P plater without one on display says it fell off.
TBH I think 3 points is plenty for the people that end up using them stopped at traffic lights etc. It's not great, but even 3 points is alot when running a red light or major speeding is only 3.
On the other hand, using it while the vehicle is in motion should be an instant loss of licence.
Considering @ peak times the traffic moves slower then a snail who can blame people for being on their phones. Here is an idea, upgrade our roads.
One thing I don’t get is, you can’t use your mobile (can’t even touch it) yet cars are adding more and more gadgets that you can have your merry way with with no restrictions.
So on one hand we can’t be distracted by our phones (which I completely agree with) but our actual cars are being more and more of a distraction.
i had an argument with a guy at a stop light that cut me off. he was in the left lane approaching a round about and went over to the right where i was on my motorcycle. later down the road he was all over the place so i kept my distance. i stopped next to him at the light and asked him what he's doing on the phone "im lost" he says. i told him to just pull over some where safe and plot out the course, or buy a $5 phone holder. he kept carrying on about being lost and not being able to find the place. then he carried on down the road
pretty sure that day he lost a mirror
pretty sure that day he lost a mirror
Just be careful with this - sooner or later, you're going to come across someone that can't control their anger and you'll probably end up under their car.
After it all, you'll regret it (with broken bones, IF you're still alive), the driver will regret it (probably in jail) and both your families will feel the pain.
Best thing to do is to not go around damaging other's property - even if they piss you off.
Every weekend I see wayyy to many people going past me at 60km/hr + without looking up once from their phones, also had enough people slowly cross onto the wrong side of the road that i've had to move for. I'd be happy if they got disqualified/lost their license on the spot. Wouldn't be as bad if they were only endangering their own lives, but they endanger entire families lives doing that.
Fed up with this nanny state. Bring on the post apocalyptic mad max hellscape. I want to add a barb wire bull bar to my wagon
$5000 fine would wipe it out overnight.
Not if it's not enforced. Seen plenty police cars drive past people on their mobiles and they don't bother hence there's a culture of not being too worried about it. Need to make some examples of people to send the message across.
I've seen people drive wrong way into freeways, into back of police cars, into houses, smash into daycare centers, smash into several cars trying to park, they barely get 3 point.
People should not be using their phones while driving period, but there are far more dangerous drivers on the road and the punishment should fit the crime.
Should also really do this with people who smoke while driving? don't know how controversial it is, but can distract and car pollution is worse enough
I think it’s great. As a cyclist, my biggest fear is being hit by a distracted driver. Phones cause the biggest distraction and danger on out roads, especially now that most of us have got the message about drink driving. If you see someone swerving, or not paying attention you can pretty much guarantee it’s phone related.
I reckon a lot of those safety features make drivers lazy and reduce the attention paid to the road. Some of it is great, but only when the driver is paying proper attention. With lane departure warnings, vibra-lines, adaptive cruise control, autonomous braking, you could nearly drive at your eyes shut on the freeway.