Shattered Glass Oven Door, out of warranty

shinkionline on 25/08/2014 - 10:29

Long story short,

After a loud thud I woke to find my over door
shattered.(westinghouse, if thats of any use)

Lucky I had been sleeping and no-one else was home or someone could have been seriously injured.

Had not been turned on, no cracks (that we could recall) previously

*Purchased it last year and falls outside the warranty period

Just been on the phone Westinghouse refuse to budge and the option is sending a tech out at our costs to see who's fault it is.

Is it worth my while getting a tech out
or simply just getting a new oven

Thanks all in advance

Also included pics of the door
https://www.dropbox.com/s/gkhkstx5lcw9ppe/IMG_9520.jpeg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z1lp4ep77umju4x/IMG_5597.jpeg?dl=0

Home & Garden

Comments

  • StewBalls on 25/08/2014 - 10:41
    +13

    Contact your local office of fair trading. This is a very common manufacturing fault (with the glass itself IIRC) & most definitely falls within the purview of statutory warranty.

    • shinkionline on 25/08/2014 - 10:51
      +1

      Thankyou! on to it

      • kabammi on 27/08/2014 - 11:15

        Absolutely. Your Australian Consumer Law rights state that any item should be of acceptable quality. That is, "what a reasonable consumer, aware of the goods' condition, would find acceptable". Consumer Law Section 54(2)

        It's very well illustrated in this video:
        see 2min 4 secs in:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uE8BB-ioNRw

  • grog on 25/08/2014 - 10:46
    +2

    Check with your household contents insurer, ours covers glass breakages.

    • shinkionline on 25/08/2014 - 10:51

      thanks!

    • matt_will_fix_it on 25/08/2014 - 21:52
      +9

      I don't think that is good advice. If you claim you will need to pay your excess plus future insurance premiums will cost more.

  • [Deactivated] on 25/08/2014 - 11:15

    Crazy! Did they say how much the tech call-out fee would be?

  • blitz on 25/08/2014 - 12:19

    So you were asleep, and out in the kitchen this thing just shattered??

      • [Deactivated] on 26/08/2014 - 00:40

        Even when there is something specific that has predisposed a piece of toughened-glass to shatter, it usually happens while the glass is cooling down, or - as is often the case - it just happens at regular room temperature.

      • ESEMCE on 26/08/2014 - 07:37
        +1

        OP specifically stated that the oven had not been on. Not even cooling down is the way I interpret it!

        Had not been turned on, no cracks (that we could recall) previously

  • Cheeper on 25/08/2014 - 12:25
    +5

    Had a shower screen do this… was nowhere near it and it just exploded. According to the guy that we paid to replace it this happens a lot.

    Get a new glass from a appliance spares store… should not be that expensive… Only need to undo a few screws to replace it. Easy fix… move on.

    If you are forced to pursue rights under consumer law you will soon find out the truth… there is none in Australia.
    You will have to go to a tribunal (at cost to you) and the outcome is not guaranteed.

    • noyesmaybeok on 25/08/2014 - 12:33
      +3

      Standard really. Make it take so much time only crazies could be bothered going down that road. Easier to hand over a few hundred $ and get it fixed vs months of waiting, stress and hassle.

      • StewBalls on 25/08/2014 - 13:24
        +2

        Never hurts to make the call though…you'd be surprised what you can accomplish with a little bluff & bravado.

        Plus, if you're going down the self funded road, why not save a few bucks & just go to a glazier?

      • Daniel Plainview on 26/08/2014 - 12:50
        +9

        Strongly disagree - if an individual consumer is ruling out the tribunal path due to cost+hassle+time etc IMAGINE how unappetising this is for a company! As it's expotentially moreso for them.

        As the other poster said a LOT of companies will at the mere mention of statutory warranty rights realise that you (unlike the vast majority of consumers) have a decent grasp on your rights under Australian Consumer Law and meet their obligations.

        The reality is that companies can flaunt the rules as most people don't know what they're entitled to - but if you do a little spadework and approach it in a professional manner the smart co's will take the path of least resistance e.g repair/replace your item.

        Had exactly that happen with Sony Australia a few yrs ago. Top of the range TV broke down 3mths outside of warranty - flashing error code and it was a well known fault with the sets due to a faulty chipset. At first contact they gave standard answer, "Outside of warranty so not our problem" - so I stated under statutory warranty it was very reasonable to expect the Tv to last beyond 15mths and if they didn't repair I'd take to Fair Trading.

        Had a Sony Tech out at my place to repair it within 2 days. Very few companies will do this as they know they have to - but once you show that YOU KNOW they have to as well they'll generally comply. Thats been my general experience anyway.

    • ChickenTalon on 25/08/2014 - 13:43
      +3

      Yes, this is very common with some of the earlier framless shower screens. I was sleeping quite close to a shower screen that did this (ensuite). 3am. BOOOOOOM! then a noise like rain as the glass kept cracking. I thought the place had been struck by lightining. I'd hate to have been in the shower when it went.

      • [Deactivated] on 25/08/2014 - 14:18
        +8

        What the hell. All these spontaneous glass shattering stories are freaking me out a bit lol. I had no idea it could happen (and seemingly quite commonly too).

        Any ideas what causes the glass to go? For those of you who it's happened to - was it relatively new glass like the OP's or can it also happen to items that have been fine for years and years?

        • ChickenTalon on 25/08/2014 - 14:43
          +1

          This was about 12 years ago (frame was installed 15 years ago, late 1998). It was an early example of a frameless shower screen, I'd never seen one before. Since then I think they've worked out that they need to support the glass better. We had two of them shatter in our house (back when I lived with my parents). One, we figured could be just an accident/damage, then the second…. all the bathroom showers were braced after that and no more problems.

          When it was replaced they changed it slightly to better support the glass.

          I think it's caused by bad design. The glass isn't as strong as they thought it was over time.

        • rodericb on 25/08/2014 - 15:37
          +8

          Pockets of stress in the glass from not-perfect treatment. Toughened glass is under stress normally but if treatment isnt uniform you get those stress points. Engraved normal glass can explode too, such as an engraved bottle of wine. Day to day stress cycles move it closer and closer to failure. As it is under internal tension it pulls itself apart, hence the explosion.

          My oven has about three panes of thinner glass, which would not get so stressed with heating/cooling like a thicker bit of glass.

        • ESEMCE on 26/08/2014 - 07:40
          +5

          @rodericb:
          Look up "Smarter Every Day Prince Ruperts Drop" on Youtube for an awesome explanation of a version of glass under tension.

      • hts on 26/08/2014 - 09:51
        +1

        I recently finished my bathroom reno, 3rd shower using the brand new frameless shower screen, corner 2 door style. Finished having my shower, separated the doors and the left hand door exploded all over me. Had pretty severe cuts across my body, blood everywhere, glass everywhere. Not fun when you are also suffering from Salmonella poisoning I can tell you! I ended up getting the manufacture to send a complete new unit after a whole lot of back and forth. Their view was I couldn't prove I didn't smash it and they don't warrant glass breakage at all. Ended up talking to their lawyer with them threatening to take me to court, which I found odd when their product was the one that exploded and injured me….. but anyway go after the manufacturer. Mention ACCC etc etc and get it replaced under warranty.

        I have spoken to many glaziers and they mentioned a carbon imperfection that is generally noticed before shipping but some times you can't see it and the sudden temp change can make it burst. But unsure as to how this would relate to an unused oven….

        Good luck OP!

  • [Deactivated] on 25/08/2014 - 12:35

    Surely it wouldn't break without some form of energy. in this instance maybe pressure from the door?

    My glass stove cover broke without warning, although one of the stove plates was still lit.

    Any estimates on cost to replace 500x400mm

    • Cheeper on 25/08/2014 - 12:44
      +1

      You would think so but not so. Toughened glass like this can just explode all of its own accord.
      Ask any glass replacement co about toughened glass shower screens… they go off like a bomb!! LOL

      The guy who replaced it refused to use the original toughened glass and used laminated glass.

      For the op… some reading here… quite common with ovens also.
      https://www.google.com.au/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=&oq=g…

    • [Deactivated] on 25/08/2014 - 14:20
      +1

      Could it be stored energy or tension from how the glass has been installed (ie. the frame etc)? Eventually all the added little daily vibrations of the house cause it to shatter?

      I'm quite interested to understand it. Curious phenomenon (at least to my simple mind lol)

      • [Deactivated] on 25/08/2014 - 17:51
        +8

        Can help. I love glass - even the utilitarian stuff.

        The making of toughened-glass, and the properties conferred by the process, are nicely described here .

        The stresses inherent in all glass (very pretty when viewed using polarised light) are key to the way glass of the toughened variety works, and particularly in the way that it works when it fails.

        The basic toughened-glass used in many oven doors, glass shower-screens, glass tabletops and in some table and ovenware, can all shatter spontaneously.

        Beyond any initial problems that can happen in the manufacturing process (or any actual impurities that can end up in the glass), poor installation or frame design/or anything that otherwise leads to edge-chipping or scratches, can precipitate the glass to go 'boom'.
        As per the OP's situation, quite a fright to experience, I'm sure.

        Over the years there have been some notable batches of oven doors and tabletops that have had a high failure-rate and I can also remember a particularly extensive recall of one brand of glass tableware - one that did indeed make for some not so 'fine' dining…

  • [Deactivated] on 25/08/2014 - 12:54
    +5

    Warranty or not. If it is reasonable to expect that type of appliance to last longer then the manufacturer has to fix it.

    Have a look here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrxxzsaBkC4

    i.e if my fridge comes with 12 months warranty and it breaks down at 18 months, the manufacturer should still fix it because most people expect a fridge to last a lot longer than this.

  • Puska on 25/08/2014 - 13:15
    +9

    Girlfriends family had a glass study table bought from office works which exploded whilst being out of warranty. Office works gave them an instore voucher and replaced the apple mac computer which got damaged from the explosion (was placed onto of table and fell).
    goes to show the difference between retailers.

    • Daabido on 25/08/2014 - 14:19
      +5

      A good OW story? That's mind shattering.

      • darren870 on 25/08/2014 - 16:56
        +9

        One could say it was Glass Shattering!!…..

    • ronnknee on 26/08/2014 - 13:17
      +2

      Wow, I'm very surprised that they replaced the Apple Mac computer… But how, they don't even sell Apple computers.

      • Puska on 26/08/2014 - 16:01
        +1

        They gave them an apple voucher for the cost of a new one

  • tonsta on 25/08/2014 - 16:29
    -1

    Glass explodes like this all the time in the Ukraine and Gaza.

  • cannedhams on 25/08/2014 - 20:11

    Had the rear windscreen in a Holden Astra shatter during the night. Quite disconcerting really.

  • bigticket on 25/08/2014 - 22:12

    Being just out of warranty as you purchased it a little bit over 1 year ago, its unconscionable conduct that Westinghouse does not offer to repair it straight off the bat under consumer law. Sending a 'tech' guy to 'see who's fault it is' a lot of BS. It then boils down to the 'techies' opinion. To determine the absolute cause of the failure would literally require a CSI type lab to investigate.

    It appears that the failure originated from around the area where the left part or possibly the right hand side of the door handle fixed to the glass, as far as I can tell from the photo. It could be a manufacturing/design fault or simply slamming the door or possibly to much pressure on the handle during use. Drilling a hole in the glass to attach the handle is inherently poor design.

    Its best to initially call again (it could be expensive as the door itself could be damaged and will require replacement as well) and only speak to the service manager and email them the photos. Pointless to send a tech out. In reality only photos should suffice with info that the door exploded in the middle of the night(oven cold). Explain the potential danger to your family and to your kids if you have any. If all fails threaten ombudsman, ACA etc.

  • shinkionline on 25/08/2014 - 22:28
    +14

    thanks all for the input, been on the phone to consumer affairs
    they were super helpful
    opened up a case.
    They've asked me to email situation pics to them
    and if nothing is done
    They'll call on my behalf

    We'll see how it goes

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 26/08/2014 - 10:15

    Was the oven installed by a pro or is it just sitting in a cavity?

    • JimB on 26/08/2014 - 10:26

      There's not much to installing an oven.

      Plug in power socket (or hard wire if a big one), slide in oven, screw oven to cavity.

      • cookie2 on 26/08/2014 - 22:53
        +1

        dont forget ventilation requirements

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 26/08/2014 - 11:32

    There's not much to installing an oven, but it can cause issues if not installed correctly. Have a look again at the pics again and you'll see why I kindly asked.

    • matt_will_fix_it on 26/08/2014 - 12:40

      What can you identify in the pics that indicate it may not be installed correctly?

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 26/08/2014 - 21:11
        +1

        could just be the picture but looks like its maybe just sitting in the cavity, as seems to be sticking out of the cavity too far to be screwed in. which also asks the question whether it was installed by a licensed installer, which also asks the question whether the OP obtained a cert of compliance, which also asks the question whether the oven was even covered by warranty in the first place :) if a tech is sent out the very first thing they will ask is to see the COC :)

  • wayacos on 26/08/2014 - 12:23
    -1

    Threaten them with ACCC as it clearly has not lasted anywhere near what it should have.
    Did you only get 12 months warranty with it?

    • matt_will_fix_it on 26/08/2014 - 12:40

      The ACCC won't take any action.

      The ACCC publish the guidelines but its each states Consumer Affairs that enforce it.

      • lplau on 26/08/2014 - 15:49

        Actually you are wrong.
        Consumer Affairs do not enforce anything, they do not have any power under law.
        I remember reading it on their website somewhere about them not being able to force a company to abide by laws.

        They can try to convince a company to do the right thing.

        Only courts & small claims courts can force a company to abide by Consumer Laws.

        • lplau on 26/08/2014 - 19:01

          Err looks like people negged me because they mistakenly think Consumer Affairs have power, but according to atleast Victorian Consumer Affairs website they do not have power:

          http://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/contact-us/resolve-a-dispute?…

          I copied this from their website, which clearly states they have no power to get a company to comply only VCAT or Courts do (i suspect this is the same case with other states, and their equivalents such as ACAT and NCAT):

          General conciliation
          Conciliation is an informal process to help you and the business resolve a dispute through communication, identifying the issues in dispute and exploring options for resolution.

          We usually conduct conciliation by telephone, email and letters, but we sometimes hold face-to-face meetings.

          As Victoria’s consumer affairs regulator, we can try to help you reach an agreement, but only VCAT or the courts can force a business or landlord to resolve an issue. We can advise you about your options with VCAT or the courts.

          Note: Consumer Affairs Victoria’s conciliation is voluntary and we cannot force a trader or consumer to be involved.

  • adam149 on 26/08/2014 - 14:09
    +1

    This happens when the glass on the oven is not tempered properly in the first place, they owe you a new door. This is extremely dangerous and sign of a poor product.

  • bigticket on 26/08/2014 - 16:14
    +2

    OP, check out this link showing numerous oven door incidences like yours made by westinghouse.

    http://www.productreview.com.au/r/westinghouse-pop667w-pop66…

  • timmyb on 26/08/2014 - 17:53

    Who was your retailer? Westinghouse products have a two year manufacturers warranty. If you purchased it last year, it should still be under warranty, and the retailer you purchasd it from are obliged to arrange your warranty service for you. Also, how much did you pay for it? If it was one of their higher end models you also have a case for implied warranty.

    • matt_will_fix_it on 26/08/2014 - 21:09

      Unless it was a factory second with reduced warranty?

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