Awesome deal for a card that is better than the GTX Titan, which is double this price and is surely bound to be better than the new R9 290X.
This is the fastest card on the market at the moment, even better than cards that are much more expensive.
Gigabyte HD 7990 Graphics Card - $599 at MSY
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Micro stutter was long since fixed by AMD. Newer Radeon drivers include frame pacing which fixes the micro stutter.
partially fixes the micro stutter
Those drivers (including the fix) are still in beta right?
Yeah the latest Radeon 13.11 beta driver supports frame pacing.
No, the 13.8 official whql drivers support frame pacing. There is also 13.9 whql drivers since then. You don't need betas for frame pacing.
As a person who got a 7990, it's definitely not fixed. But it's a lot better than before.
My one has coil whine though
LOL for once an honest owner, not just an ATI fanboi…
Are you sure the coil whine is not from the psu in your pc? To test just lay the pc on its side, then take the side off the pc and swith it on. When the coil whine sound starts put your ear to the PSU then to the videocard and should be able to easily discern from which one the whine is originating from. In my experience, from having multi PC's with coil whine, it is nearly always the psu not the videocard.
Whilst that is a possibility, wouldn't any GPU fan drown out the fan from PSUs?
That's why you lay the pc on its side and put your ear directly over the psu then directly over the videocard. Doing it this way you can easily discern where the whine is coming from regardless if the videocards fan make more noise than the psu or vice versa.
To clarify, Coil Whine is not the same as fan noise. It's this high pitched hum from the actual circuitry
I had a 6950 that would screech horribly under load, had to RMA
OR… and this is just a suggestion, remove your GPU and then start the computer and see if the whine is gone?
Coil whine is not from the fan, two different noises
for all crossfires or just this model?
All 7990s are crossfired lol
wait i dont understand…. you mean to say 7990s are made up of crossfired cards? So it's not actually a single powerful card?
my most powerful card i ever own is a 6850.. so i've no idea whats happening at the upper range of these cards. lol
A 7990 is basically a single card with two 7970 GPUs on it in crossfire. It has the most of the same drawbacks as a typical crossfire setup (such as microstutter).
yeah its 2x 7970 ghz chips in one card.
ah… that explains it.. thanks ! :)
so technically a 7950 will fare much better because it doesnt have internal cross fire, is my understanding correct?
Well, no.
7970 is a more powerful card than the 7950 - and the 7990 has 2 7970 cpu's. Crossfire will always be 30%-90% better than a single card depending on how compatible the game is.
Crossfire issues are less apparent on dual cpu cards vs their 2 card counterparts.
Single cards have no issues in terms of stuttering and new game driver issues, but they also don't have the extra horsepower crossfire provides.
ok.. thanks for clarifying.
I am after a single card as I don't think my current setup (its a silent build on a Fractal Design R2 case) has enough space for a card as big as 7990?
So was thinking 7950 or 7970(actually never heard of this model until today) could suffice as a upgrade replacement for my 6850. :)i want to be able to do 3-4 monitors for work but play games on 1. (I can't handle the physical monitor borders on mutliple screen play modes)
but i'm in danger of going offtopic.. so thanks for now :)
you want a 290X :) its the best single card out at the moment
No the GPUs need to be of the same family. The ROUGH rule of thumb is that the first two numbers should be the same.
http://sites.amd.com/PublishingImages/Public/Graphic_Illustr…
Fractal R2 should be able to remove a HDD cage to fit long cards.
3-4 monitors is difficult to achieve off a single card, you are best getting two cards. Say a low end 6450 as a second non-gaming card.
Noooooo, just bought 2 GTX670 sli for $600
Since this is a dual slightly-slowed-down 7970 card, you're not missing out on much. The performance you'd see on this versus your 670s is probably comparable, with some games worse and some better.
Nooo I just bought this from pccg for 699. At least i can justify that it's out of stock in WA now =S
Nooooo i just bought a gtx 780 for $620
Jeeez, that's a cracking price. Just this morning I was contemplating an upgrade from my 6950… it's a sign, perhaps.
Sorry, this product is currently out of stock in all QLD branches….
We have 1 left at Slacks Creek today.
sold out i was advised to get someone interstate to buy and post
I've always been interested in learning about graphics cards. I don't understand what makes one product better than the other. Has anyone got links for reference to understand how they work?
Try looking up benchmarks and reviews.
This is a good reference:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-graphics-card-rev…Similar to CPUs really. At the heart of a graphics card is the graphics processing unit (abbreviated to GPU). More powerful GPUs are draw more frames per unit of time. Drawing a frame is pretty much like performing a mathematical calculation.
More powerful GPUs can perform more complex calculations more quickly, meaning that they are able to draw more frames every second and provide you with smoother gameplay. Weaker GPUs might not be able to draw enough frames per second to keep up with the game meaning that you jet visuals that are jerky and not smooth.
Can't justify buying this card if it doesn't have TrueAudio
i'd say the same is true of anyone who experienced A3D before creative killed them off in the courts.
Just read about TrueAudio
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7370/amd-announces-trueaudio-t…
Not sure if it's that much of a game changer?
TrueAudio won't do anything. It is purely a way to run audio processing on your GPU rather than CPU. Great for small APU devices, useless for this.
Also nothing supports it yet anyway.
that is absolutely NOT all true audio is about.
look into A3d if you want to know all about what true audio does, but i'll list a basic summary:
it will render a simple 3d representation of the game environment for doing positional sound, i'm not talking about virtual speakers but actual sound that you can perceive as coming from it's actual direction.
sound reflections, occlusions, reverb etc is all simulated in a representation of the actual 3d environment you're playing in.
as you've not experienced a3d back in the day i can understand your misunderstanding and skeptisism but for me, now that this technology is back, it's a must have.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenAL
Been around a long time. This adds nothing to existing solutions other than hardware acceleration. And this isn't needed on any reasonable desktop CPU anyway.
I concur, A3D was the bomb! It was miles ahead of anything else. Creative was a distant 2nd in their virtual sound technology. Which is basically why they went after A3D and shut them down. Shame as those cards were just amazing for games that supported the technology.
you are speaking out of naivete.
openAL is incomparable to what A3d used to offer and what trueAudio will offer.
sigh, this is like describing colour to a blind person, you will just have to experience it.
edit: maybe a good analogy is 3d on a regular computer monitor compared to 3d on an occulus rift? that's kind of what the difference feels like.
double post
sigh, this is like describing colour to a blind person, you will just have to experience it.
Nothing you have mentioned is not supported by OpenAL. If your best argument is a subjective one, particularly for a technology which isn't even available for you to use yet, I can't take you very seriously.
Fine, Here's some objective things that openAL doesn't support:
Direction (heading) effects
Doppler effects
Time difference of arrival effects (propagation delays)
Interaural time difference and level difference effects
HRTF effects (modeling human perception by head-related transfer functions)
Obstruction, occlusion, diffraction, reflection, scattering
Reverberation effects from physical objects and surfaces
Physical collision effects (coupling with collision detection in a physics engine: hear a ball bouncing/towards towards you)
Source radiation patterns
Spreading loss / distance attenuation
Atmospheric effects (humidity, temperature)
Multiple listenersc'mon Brucey, counter the argument below, my popcorn just came out hot and crunchy!
Still unconvinced by the "experience" of a technology that isn't available yet ie. hasn't been experienced.
It's not new technology, it has exsisted before, look into the saga of aureal vs creative.
TLDR: aureal hit the market with this/similar sound technology and some financial backers, creative tied them up in court, backers pulled out, aureal won the case but were bunkrupted, creative bought them up and threw away the key.
OzB just turned into Head-Fi -_-
Lets reserve all judgement for when units are actually out and have been tested. Plus, people buying this card couldn't care less about audio. They just want top scores in fps, which the new R9's wont do, let alone in this price range.
they didnt throw away the key, they merely kept the tech around so that when they manage to run their soundcards to the ground then they will bring it out as some 'new' "R&D" tech.
at the moment creative are doing what gillette does with it's shavers… just adding blades until it gets to critical mass. ;)
(at least this is my speculation)…
creative's retail business seems to have slowed down… they actually shut a couple of their shops in their home country (Singapore) I heard.
who knows, someone else would've buy them out and you'll get trueaudio again.
Okay, since Bruce isn't here, I'm just gonna chime in and say that support for TrueAudio is irrelevant at this particular point in time.
I agree that the things you guys brought up are benefits of TrueAudio, however, right now, nothing supports it.
Do you know anything about OpenAL? Read the Wikipedia page?
From your list here are the things OpenAL actually can't do:
Time difference of arrival effects (propagation delays)
Multiple listeners… doesn't sound so game changing. Though I guess in some big outdoor settings the sound propagation is a nice plus without having to hack the effect in.
well yes you can implement some of those features in a sub par manner via some third party stuff (bit hacky) in software, while it's better than stock openAL no games come like that and believe it or not it's quite taxing on your cpu to enable all those advanced features.
not only that but it's quite inferior qualitatively.
secondly to those points openAL has now gone closed source as creative have snatched it away from the public so expect fragmentation and issues with openAL :(
Looks like a great price, but i am holding my breath on stock in MSY, never had any luck with them.
Does anyone know if it comes with the "Never Settle Bundle" games?
HD7990 qualifies for the 8 free games reward. If MSY is giving out Never Settle Forever bundle codes. The codes come from the retailer. MSY was participating in the Never Settle Reloaded bundle so there's a good chance that they're also participating in the Never Settle Forever bundle.
Yes we do participate in Never Settle Forever. Thank you
I bought it 2 weeks ago from them and got the Gold (3 games)
OK you got ripped off because according to this article the 7990 qualifies for 8 free games from the Never Settle Forever. The HD7970 and HD7950 qualifies for that 3 free games on the gold reward however the HD7990 gets the top prize of 8 games. It's the king of the crop.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7218/amd-announces-never-settl…
Also to back up that statement here's another site about the Never Settle Forever bundle
"One notable exclusion from the rewards system is AMD's dual-GPU HD 7990, but don't worry too much, as the $700 card still comes with a voucher to redeem eight free games."
http://www.techspot.com/news/53634-amds-never-settle-forever…
So yes you were eligible to get 8 free games. All buyers here for this HD7990 card are. Best to email AMD to ask where the 8 free games are they might give you a coupon for those 8 free games.
I've bought it couple weeks ago as well and asked AMD. Aussies only get 3 games. The 8 game bundle is only for NA I think, maybe EU.
I think it was 8 games when it just got released and cost $1k+
got dual 6990 in WC loop, wonder how this would compare.
Should I wait for the R9 290x or grab one of these?
Depends what you're after. Advantages:
* Almost certainly $100+ cheaper.
* Most likely faster in most games
* Should come with more games (depends on whether these ones actually do have the 8 games bundled in)Disadvantages:
* Requires more power
* Generates more heat
* Larger (might not fit in your case)
* Less memory (this is effectively a 3GB card, compared with 4GB for the 290x)
* Does not have TrueAudio
* Does not have DirectX 11.2 (not exactly sure if this will change much)Personally, I'm waiting for the 290x to be released (should be either today or in the next week), and possibly even waiting for the 780 Ti to be released (mid November). I'd rather avoid micro stutter as I've put up with it for a while with Crossfire 5850 cards, and I think I'm more interested in PhysX than TrueAudio.
Don't forget R9 290x will come with BF4 Premium (north of $100 for the Australian release I believe)… it was confirmed earlier today.
Well, I considered that under the 'more games' category. The 8 games that come with the 7990 are worth a lot more than BF4. Whether they're games you're interested compared with BF4, well that's subjective.
It does not come with BF4 Premium. It comes with BF4 Limited Edition, which only includes the china rising expansion.
Don 't think I'll ever go AMD again, always have issues with them. Nvidia may be more expensive, but its hassle free.
I agree. I've had nothing but issues with the cheap and nasty ATI/AMD cards…
I find overheating is a massive issue with anything AMD/ATI that has stock or non-ultra cooling…
Have gone Nvidia in my latest build and have no regrets…
Exactly, overheating was definitely an issue. Started to artifact shortly too.
The drivers always had problems when gaming, plenty of desktop crashes and sometimes blue screens.
:|
I thought BF4 was optimised for AMD cards..
Was purely going to choose an AMD gpu over an Nvidia one because of this..Devil's advocate here: I've had none of that. Zero problems with overheating, and no problems game-wise due to the drivers.
7 series cards have been really good. Gigabyte branded ones seem run very cool. Haven't had any issues with my 7870, the Asus 4870 I had previously on the other hand always seemed to be on the edge of overheat problems.
I wouldn't choose a GPU based on one game… Also, when they say that its optimised, it just means that it has an advantage over the Nvidia card (which seems to be AMD's Mantle at this point). I believe the best example is Nvidia's PhysX does great on Nvidia cards, but AMD cards suffer when you have it on… its just some added features here and there i believe.
I generally recommend people choosing the GPU based on their usage…
AMD
Pros
Cheaper
Generally better at stock (7970 vs GTX 580, 7970 Ghz vs GTX 680), may yield higher performance when (if) OC'd
Good performance to price ratioCons
Generally runs hotter compared to Nvidia cards (so less likely to be high OC unless cooled properly)
Usually uses more powerNvidia
Pros
Runs cooler usually
Driver updates more frequently (it seems… never used an AMD)
More efficient in terms of power usage (?)Cons
Usually more expensive
Generally less in terms of performance for competing cards (7970 vs GTX 580 etc.)There's probably some of these that can be taken out and some that needs to be added in… but from what i've seen so far.
I'd honestly recommend AMD GPUs provided you either watercool or don't OC since they are generally cheaper. I personally own a GTX 780 SLI (damn nvidia and their GTX 780Ti) because i had the cash and it was better in terms of performance when i bought it.
the cheap and nasty ATI/AMD cards…
I've been happy with my 6850, done everything with it including mining Bitcoins and it still kills many overly priced Nvidia cards on the market… lol
When I had an Nvidia I paid a lot more money, for a lot less power…
I hope you didn't quote me coz i didn't say that at all… i was merely stating the pros and cons that i know of…
This is how people become grossly misinformed. AMD have gotten their act together re: drivers and frame latency, with more fixes to come. With Nvidia you pay a hefty premium for the 'notion' that it's hassle-free when in actuality there isn't that much difference between the two in this regard.
I'm not an AMD fanboy by an stretch of the imagination, but it annoys me when people immediately dismiss AMD cards and throw out the old 'drivers' excuse. It's particularly galling when you see it on a website that is catered towards VALUE for the customer, and a 780 is retailing for $800.Regarding the drivers thing is based on what i have read and heard. I've personally never used one myself so i can't judge it.
Overheating can occur in either AMD or nVidia cards.
Sometimes the manufacturers just do a bad job on applying thermal paste to the GPU/heatsink. As soon as you buy your new card, remove the manufacturer's thick thermal paste and apply a thin layer of good thermal paste.
so struggling between this one or next gen game console….
Without going into all the console vs PC business, from a bang-for-buck perspective I'd rather get a graphics card now (though this is assuming you have a capable PC already) and a gaming console later in its lifecycle. Multiplatform games will look better on the PC, and you get to play all the exclusives later when the console, and the games, are a bit cheaper. You could have different priorities, but that's what I plan on doing.
^ this… im a Console person turned PC gamer… the quality (IMO) is better… but different people have different needs and wants.
my view,
games will still have priority coding for consoles and poor ports to PC will exist as long as we are trapped in this monopolistic system by windows.
it is said and known that for windows PC's to render as efficient as consoles you'd need 2-3 times more hardware power
consoles will still be sold at a lost, but the games will recoup the losses, the best usage would be to leverage games trading.
if you check watch dogs pc requirement, its a tell tale sign that PC gaming is still and will be very taxing on hardware. Watch Dogs is only a launch title for next gen consoles and I do not think it has exploited every part of the system yet. I hope AMD will work out something good with Mantle + Kaveri for the budget conscious.
PC hardware has now matured to a level where a budget consumer could spend $500 and play everything previous and current gen with high res and fantastic frame rates (except certain games which is due to poor porting). Moreover, steam sales make gaming on the current library of games that much more affordable.
I can imagine the same cycle would happen in 5 years time where the PS 4 specs would look outdated compared to a mid range PC.
This is very unlikely to be true anymore.
Playstation 4 and Xbox One are running X86, makes porting very very easy.
The above consoles are also running AMD APU, optimisation is almost not needed except for higher speced computers.
The two problems that will exist in the console/PC world are this.
Games being designed around a controller which can often lead to clunky PC controls and bad menu's.
Many popular game engines are made specially for the xbox 360 and playstation 3, both PC's and the new consoles will suffer as a result of this, I doubt they are going to be able to make very good launch day release games because of this.
A good example of this is the Assassins Creed engine, its made around the playstation 3 and xbox 360 consoles and does not scale to more complex graphics very well, so bad for new consoles + PC.
while all the gaming systems are sycned with x86 architecture, AMD explains very well on why PC needs low level API very badly, which consoles have been enjoying.
There's a level of skepticism surrounding Mantle as most critics claim it's GLide 2.0, but I think this time around AMD has more control of the situation since they handle both consoles and PC hardware specs. The GCN graphics cards is the key to bonding all 3 platforms, provided that PC consumers would continue to support them.
The Mantle patch for BF4 will be the turning point for AMD in the PC market if the results show significant improvements.
My point I guess is that Low Level API would be great, but we could live without it now that we have x86 and AMD.
If Mantle does take off then its just going to humiliate the consoles more then they will be soon.
Mantle is gaining momentum. Latest news on Mantle:
"DICE's Johan "repi" Andersson revealed via a Twitter response that there are over 15 titles in development that will utilize not only Frostbite but also the upcoming Mantle technology revealed by AMD.
The current list of known titles includes Battlefield 4, Mirror's Edge 2, Star Wars: Battlefront, Need for Speed: Rivals, Dragon Age: Inquisition, Plants vs. Zombies: Garden Warfare, and the next Mass Effect title."
From http://www.ggmania.com/?smsid=dice-claims-that-15-titles-wil…
.. utilize not only Frostbite but also the upcoming Mantle technology …
Wording isn't great. Basically Frostbite supports Mantle ergo all Frostbite games do. No one else seems to be caring at this point.
I think MS shutting it down for XB1 is the most important part here. If you could use it on XB1 no one would need DirectX any more, Mantle/OpenGL would run on every platform.
But you can't so DirectX and OpenGL is still required. Mantle is only going to be an optional extra.
.
In addition to Prospective Darkness' post..
Games depreciate in value more via Steamsales in comparison to console games, you can turn your PC into a steambox and you will have faster and more adaptable hardware for the future.
The next PS will require you to pay for their online service in addition to your internet access to play multiplayer online?
Neither consoles will scale to 1080p properly and will not look as 'good' as pc games.
A good number of PC games have a vibrant mod community that add value to a game over its life (e.g. any Bethesda RPG game).
A better explanation:
The games for the PS4/Xbone will be 720p with some basic side scrollers etc being 1080p.
This makes the new consoles outdated before they are even released, sure if you sit 3m away from the TV you won't notice it, but then if you can't notice it then why have decent graphics?
Either way PC's are already miles ahead, if you don't believe me boot up Battlefield 3 in 720p with 0x anti aliasing and tell me if you like it.
The games for the PS4/Xbone will be 720p with some basic side scrollers etc being 1080p.
This is just a rumour. Nobody really knows what res the games are going to run at. It's up to the developers. My guess: yeah, a lot of games will probably start out running at 720p, but as the devs get used to the new hardware, they will be able to optimise for 1080p.
This is pretty sad if true, I would of thought the "next gen" would have 1080p as standard.
As far as I am aware Killzone SF is native 1080p at 30fps in SP and maybe unlocked in MP (they said it hit 60 most of the time or something).
Even Ryse is 900p upscaled on XB1.
The reason you get a console is for living room exclusives, convenience, ease of use, and relatively low startup costs (lower initial price, no need to upgrade over lifetime).
You will never be able to purchase a PC that plays games at the graphical fidelity of a PS4/XB1 at the same price, although the savings from free online and steam sale price differentials may pay off.
"You will never be able to purchase a PC that plays games at the graphical fidelity of a PS4/XB1 at the same price, although the savings from free online and steam sale price differentials may pay off."
That's not exactly true, for $600 (the price of the xbox) you can build yourself a computer that is just as fast as the xbox. As for whether this PC will play games at the same quality and resolution as the xbox equivalent, that won't be clear until the xbox is released.
easy. 4+ Teraflop of graphic vs 2 Teraflop console. Overprice console games price in a lock ecosystem vs competitive cheaper retail game code reseller.
If you're all about graphics - theres no denying that pc will best it now let alone 7 years from now.
The more important question is, what exclusives do you want to play and which platform will your friends be playing on.
The more important question is, what exclusives do you want to play and which platform will your friends be playing on.
This. I've been saying it for years.
sold out in NSW?
Great card except for the annoying coil whine.
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nice price but you have to look out for micro stutter in these factory crossfire cards.