Leaking Roof, Unresponsive Roofer, and Consumer Law: What Are Our Options?

dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 14:08

Hi all,

Firstly, wishing a happy festive season to you and your families.

TLDR - I am wondering if I could get some advice on a new roof my parents, who are pensioners in their late 60s/early 70s, got installed at their place in Sydney in June of this year (i.e. 2023), including whether anyone has any advice / experiences going down the path of lodging a complaint with Fair Trading (or whether it’s a pointless endeavour) for breach of ACL consumer guarantees. They paid around $6500 for the roof and it continually leaks, and the roofer has refused to come out and repair it, despite being chased up constantly and saying he would come out, and also providing verbal and written assurances in messages that the new roof would not leak.

More detail:

• My parents live in a house with an outdoor entertaining area, which had a polycarbonate roof that leaked when they moved in. The leaks were especially problematic where the roof met the house, causing water damage to timber doors.

• In early 2023, after getting multiple quotes, they hired a roofer who suggested replacing the entire roof to resolve the issue, stating the old roof was poorly installed.

• The roofer assured my dad, both verbally and in writing, that the new roof would fix the leaks and that it would not leak. After verifying his credentials, my parents proceeded with the installation at a cost of $6500.

• The roofer installed the new roof in June 2023, including sheeting, flashing, and an incline to prevent leaks. He assured my dad that he would return to fix any issues.

• However, after the first heavy rain in July 2023, leaks appeared at the same junction. The roofer initially applied sealant to try and fix the leaks, but the problem persisted.

• Despite months of repeated follow-ups, where my dad contacted the roofer nearly every week—sending texts, calls, and videos to explain the ongoing issues—the roofer continued to avoid repairs, citing being overseas or unavailable. By November, no repairs had been made, and the leaks were still occurring.

• My dad even resorted to putting plastic sheets over the doors to protect them during heavy rain. It took constant persistence just to get basic acknowledgment, let alone repairs.

• I eventually got involved and continued the follow-up process, texting and calling weekly to try and get a specific commitment for the roofer to come out.

• The roofer finally agreed to inspect the roof on Boxing Day but said this would be the last time he would come out. He also stated there was nothing more he could do except apply sealant every 2 months—an option my dad can’t manage due to his age and the height of the roof. Furthermore, he claimed the roof was only cosmetic and not intended to fix the leaks, which directly contradicted his earlier promises.

• When I referenced Australian Consumer Law (ACL) provisions, including that the roof should be fit for purpose (Section 54) and of acceptable quality (Section 55), the roofer abruptly left and threatened to block our contact if we pursued him further.

• We’ve tried every reasonable avenue to resolve this amicably but are now exploring other options, including lodging a complaint with Fair Trading.

I’d really appreciate any advice or insights from others who have gone down this route or dealt with similar situations.

Thanks for reading and happy 2025.

Home & Garden

Comments

  • try2bhelpful on 29/12/2024 - 14:25
    +2

    https://www.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/about-fair-trading/our-se…

    I would have a chat to these people. See if they can help you resolve this. Best of luck.

    • RogerLoger on 29/12/2024 - 14:46
      -4

      In my experience, they're a waste of time and government office space. That is possibly due to the Labor-introduced efficiency dividend, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Efficiency_dividend. If you do your maths, that's a lot of cuts. The Senior Executive Service component of the Commonwealth increased 40% in 20 years. So, at the same time staff were being cut due to 'efficiency', the SES fat cats took a larger slice to increase their number. More fat cats, less workers. See page 9 of https://www.apsc.gov.au/sites/default/files/2022-08/APS%20Hi…
      Support for Aussies who need it is reducing in the APS.

      • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 14:54
        +1

        yeah that's' what I've heard….I am hoping to make this roofer's life as miserable as possible if nothing else.

        • RogerLoger on 29/12/2024 - 16:00
          +3

          Don't back down. If you can find one willing to do it, get a building contractor to assess the damage and offer an opinion about the cause (hard - they dislike court intensely). Use that as ammunition. Broadly, you need to be able to put up a package with photos, dates, records of phone conversations, etc, etc.

          My experience was with a bad building inspection. I refused to discuss anything major on the phone to there was no argument about who said what. Nobody wanted to take my side. For ages, I badgered the building inspection company until they handed it to their lawyers (from a very large city firm). I kept at it, eventually settling. It took about three years, but I suspect the building inspector might actually open his eyes when he goes out to jobs now, instead of just taking photos of logs in the yard and reporting they may lead to termites.

          If you go the DIY path, you need to do a LOT of homework to understand your rights and how to read and interpret law. It is frustrating work.

          • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 21:56
            +1

            @RogerLoger: Yeah thanks for this. Frankly for 6k I'm not sure it's worth the effort to engage lawyers etc… but I would like to make sure others out there are aware of this guy's dodgy operating tactics.

            • RogerLoger on 31/12/2024 - 05:29

              @dinglejerry: Like all else, you need to make a decision about the reward gained for effort spent. The reward is not just the cash. Teaching the b…d a lesson feels good😏

              • dinglejerry on 31/12/2024 - 07:12

                @RogerLoger: Absolutely. Just mean there's a financial consideration as well, but I definitely will go down the fair trading path and get him sweating a bit.

        • HeWhoKnows on 30/12/2024 - 12:51
          +1

          Good luck

          This guy is obviously an expert in responsibility avoidance

      • try2bhelpful on 29/12/2024 - 14:59
        +3

        This would be a NSW issue not a Federal issue wouldn’t it?

        • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 15:06

          It would be NSW yes.

          • try2bhelpful on 29/12/2024 - 15:11
            +1

            @dinglejerry: Not sure the efficiency dividend would apply then. A phone call can’t hurt. It sounds like you have tried to resolve this and can’t. I think the roofer will do squat until you kick it up a notch.

            • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 21:54

              @try2bhelpful: Yeah I will contact them post holiday season. And people like this shouldn't be operating in the community and ripping others off, if nothing else I would like to make his life more of a pain than he'd like for what he's done.

              • DoctorCalculon on 30/12/2024 - 01:13

                @dinglejerry: Just out of curiosity, did you check the reviews on Google and/or other service seeking platforms (hipages, etc.) that the company is listed on?
                It is most likely this dodgy tradie has stooged other customers in a similar manner once he got paid.

                • dinglejerry on 30/12/2024 - 07:04

                  @DoctorCalculon: Hi mate,

                  Yes I did, both hipages and google. There were positive reviews, but also 1 or 2 other customers who had reported that he didn't come to fix things once he'd gotten the money and issues arose (not sure if I can share the link here).

                  • DoctorCalculon on 30/12/2024 - 08:07

                    @dinglejerry:

                    (not sure if I can share the link here)

                    I am all for naming and shaming so that others learn from your bitter experience with this tradie / company.

                    However, in this case they might turn around and say you are trying to defame them. Oldest trick by these dodgy dealers.

                    Why is it that roofing and solar attract some of the most dodgiest tradies?!?

                • JIMB0 on 30/12/2024 - 08:34
                  +1

                  @DoctorCalculon: Google reviews can be manipulated. Some companies are good at getting 1 star reviews removed through various means, including suing for defamation.

                  • DoctorCalculon on 30/12/2024 - 22:50
                    +1

                    @JIMB0:

                    Google reviews can be manipulated.

                    Just take a look at Alfa Roofing Services.
                    This company managed to have three customers with the name "Ahmad" but different surnames all provide very positive reviews. What are the chances?

                    1 star reviews removed through various means, including suing for defamation.

                    This has happened with many companies. They have also tried to sue OzBargain and other platforms for any negative comments posted by their users.

                    /cc @dinglejerry

                    • dinglejerry on 31/12/2024 - 07:11

                      @DoctorCalculon: Yeah in hindsight it makes sense now, the guy is a dodgy operator. I'm trying to find a roofer that is actually reliable and trustworthy to provide a second opinion on the roof now.

    • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 14:53

      Already found that and will lodge a complaint for sure, just looking for experiences of people who have actually gone through this process.

  • ihbh on 29/12/2024 - 14:29

    You mean the roof of the outdoor area? How big is it the area?

    Unless there were holes in the polycarbonate roof (e.g. hail storm), what was the point of replacing it vs doing something to make sure the space between the roof of the outdoor area and the wall of the house was sealed (and might involve a lot less work, but more expertise)?

    • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 14:53

      It's about 10x25m. We initially obtained quotes for the option you mentioned but the roofer indicated this would not be a guaranteed solution as the roof hadn't been installed properly in the first place, which was the whole point of installing a new roof that had an incline and proper flashing/sealing.

      • ihbh on 29/12/2024 - 15:02

        new roof had an incline

        I'm assuming the previous roof was either flat or (half) inclined towards the wall of the house and this new one is inclined away from the wall?

        proper flashing/sealing

        I suspect fixing the flashing/sealing wouldn't take them nearly as long and they wouldn't be able to charge as much for a new roof.

        • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 15:04
          +1

          Yes the previous roof was flat, and the new one is inclined. The roofer indicated we could go for the cheaper option but there was no guarantee it would fix the leak, we have written emails from him that indicating that putting in the new roof would fix the leak, hence why my dad ended up going for it. Whether he made the right decision in hindsight is another matter, but the point is more what's done is done, the roofer hasn't produced a leak free roof and hasn't been willing to help, so now looking at what the options are.

          • ihbh on 29/12/2024 - 15:30

            @dinglejerry:

            and the new one is inclined

            Away from the wall right? Do you have photos?

            • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 21:53

              @ihbh: Yes away from the wall. Yes have pictures and videos when the leaks happen during the rai

            • dinglejerry on 30/12/2024 - 07:31
              +1

              @ihbh: Here are some quick photos I took, also have some videos of the leaks when it rains but those are often at night and better for those to be viewed on a big screen as a result to see what's going on so haven't posted those

              https://ibb.co/album/dGTbw2

  • RotundPolarBear on 29/12/2024 - 15:09
    +3

    It doesn't sound like this roofer knows how to fix the leak. i.e. he is incompetent.

  • solidussnake on 29/12/2024 - 15:23
    +1

    Time to go to NCAT, get a proper professional tradie to do a report and use as evidence. Although doubtful he would pay it back after being ordered..

    • RogerLoger on 29/12/2024 - 19:22

      I know someone who did that over a concreting job that half covered house weep holes, draining water to the subfloor area instead of away from the house. She went through two court cases and was awarded full reparation and damages. AFAIK, after more than a year, the concreter is yet to pay.

      • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 21:53

        Yeah this is my worry, whether it's worth the heartache, but I also want to make his life as miserable as possible if we aren't going to recover anything else out of it.

        Also he has google reviews, I haven't posted anything yet though.

  • Kongzi on 29/12/2024 - 16:33

    Got pics? Make sure the tip of the sheet is bent down to avoid water from dribbling backwards. And the other end needs to be turned up.

    • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 21:52

      Yeah I can share, anything in particular you are after? I don't think he did that to the sheets, but there is an incline from the back of the roof (which adjoins the house) to the front (which leads to a gutter that was already there). He made assurances in the emails to us pre-install/engagement that there wouldn't be any leaks.

      • JIMB0 on 29/12/2024 - 22:20

        Post a few photos up and someone may be able to make some good suggestions.

        • dinglejerry on 29/12/2024 - 22:21

          For a fix? I'll engage another roofer to help with that, but right now I'm looking for ways to take action against this roofer.

          That said, I have some pics and happy to post some shots up tomorrow.

    • dinglejerry on 30/12/2024 - 07:31

      Here are some photos , let me know if others would help

      https://ibb.co/album/dGTbw2

      • Kongzi on 30/12/2024 - 09:43
        +1

        Can't comment on what to do with the roofer. If it was me, I would get it fixed first, then give the roofer a hard time.

        This roof is fairly small and don't look too high. Get a ladder and hose, then make it rain. You need to first find out the root cause and where the leak is coming from. Once you find that leak, the rest should be simple.

  • 82norm on 30/12/2024 - 09:01
    +1

    He shouldn’t be using silicone to that extent. He hasn’t put Rib Top Foam Infill Strips between the polycarbonate in to stop any water coming back from any downpours.

    Google it and you'll know what I mean.

    Also with NCAT, fair trade….its the way to go. However, even if you win, there is no assurance he’ll pay up. Then you need to go down another route with the Sheriff office, which in my experience, doesn’t guarantee you of success either.

    • dinglejerry on 30/12/2024 - 09:05

      Hi mate, thanks for this - the thing is, we aren't roofers, we researched the guy when he provided a quote, he was licensed, he had some good reviews, so my dad put his trust in him.

      I'll research what you have said and try and get my head around it… is there anyway we could get another roofer in to remediate the issue?

      Tbh I am not sure whether I would keep pursuing him beyond lodging a complaint with fair trading, that remains to be seen, but I do want to make his life a bit more difficult as it's not right that people like this are operating.

  • ihbh on 30/12/2024 - 09:10

    Some things to consider:

    • You don't have any eaves on the house above the polycarbonate roof. It's very hard to get a permanent seal between roof and wall; perhaps try to Google ways this can be achieved.
    • There could be a problem with your door/window seal; the water should flow down the gap between polycarbonate roof and ground; how does this get into the doors/window?
    • Is water getting in from the side of the roof - the door with the tarp is close to the side?
    • dinglejerry on 30/12/2024 - 09:26

      Thanks for this info, appreciated. All things I will discuss with a roofer, once I find one I can trust. I don't think from what I can tell that the water is getting in from the side, but will definitely discuss the other 2 with an expert.

  • Loopholio on 30/12/2024 - 09:24
    -3

    TL;DR: My retired parents in Sydney paid $6500 for a new roof in June 2023, but it leaks, and the roofer refuses to fix it despite verbal and written assurances that it wouldn't leak. Considering lodging a complaint with Fair Trading for breach of ACL consumer guarantees and seeking advice on whether it's worth pursuing.

    That's a TLDR :) This is the first time I've found a use for ChatGBT!

    A mate got ripped off by a dodgy plumber. The plumber did some damage, gave a massive quote to fix everything and left.

    Where have all the cowboys gone? Nowhere. They never left.

  • gelatiman77 on 30/12/2024 - 22:48

    From looking at the pics you have supplied I would say that the flashings that meet the house wall are installed incorrectly. The roofer seems to not be an experienced one or possibly a cowboy. That flashing should return up the wall and the top of it chased into the wall to terminate.

    • dinglejerry on 31/12/2024 - 08:27

      Thanks for your feedback. I’m trying to find a trustworthy roofer who can suggest whether this can be remediated.

  • dinglejerry on 31/12/2024 - 08:29

    I’m also going to obviously post a negative Google review but I’m wondering whether I should do that now prior to the fair trading complaint or not

  • Euphemistic on 31/12/2024 - 22:36

    Aside from trying to leave neg reviews etc i suggest the money is gone and youll be best to try to engage a new roofer to fix the works.

    • dinglejerry on 31/12/2024 - 23:26

      Maybe, maybe not. But for the sake of the community at large, these weasels need to be weeded out, too many of them around.

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