Looking to buy first ETFs.
Just curious what does the portfolio of ETFs look like as there are quite a few options.
From my understanding, VDGR (balanced growth) replicates super funds balanced growth products.
Also curious on what app do people use nowadays to track different different stocks and ETFs?
Nice
The pins and paperclips being the same colours yet in a different order is doing me an uncomfortable.
Would be interested in the asset allocation and average annual return over 10 years of your portfolio. Thanks!
This is mine.
Username:
MS Paint
I was expecting better Muzeeb….
You sound like my wife.
Maybe I am…
Thanks
This is useful
VGS 60%
VAS 30%
NDQ 10%
Thanks. Just curious on why not VDGR.
I was recommended to just get that
The returns haven't been great but that doesn't mean it won't do better in the future.
I see.
Maybe you want to check the holding of VDGR? VGS + VAS + NDQ is basically 30% Australian share + 70% international share. However VDGR has 20% bond, almost 9% of fixed interest. It's certainly less volatile but also does not perform that well against 100% share funds during bull markets.
Check with your financial adviser to figure out your risk profile, and then buy products that match it.
Best answer, saved me time.
In my opinion VDGR makes more sense closer to retirement and draw down phase but still have some runway left (10yrs+). Just to protect downside risk and for more stable dividends.
Longer your time horizon i.e. younger you are. The better off you are building your own without the bond/fixed interest (provided you are committed long term and not tempted to change up, sell up etc).
As long as you stay invested and keep adding over time I can't see either option doing poorly or being a mistake.
@souljah: Meh - balanced funds drop when the market drops but marginally less than a growth fund. And when the market does well the growth fund massively outperforms the balanced fund.
I think the major mistake people make in super is not being aggressive enough early enough. Make your nest egg big enough you can stay in high growth funds lifelong.
If you are below 50 years old, you don't need any allocation to cash/bond.
You already have your own cash or money in your offset.
you want all your money that you are investing to be actually invested.
Also which app do you use to track these ETFs? Just standard CommSec app?
Thanks. Got the stake app
@bin555: Make sure you do a lot of research and don't just go with what someone recommends to you.
Also remember that ETFs are investments for the long term, usually minimum 7-10 years.
Mine is almost the same but I've added IVV in the mix last couple of years.
@onetwothreefour identical portfolio to mine. Initial I had NDQ and a bunch of other ETF's that didn't make sense. So I sold them off the other bunch and went down the VGS/VAS path. I know NDQ is covered by VGS but pure exposure to the top 100 nasdaq companies can't hurt.
Mine has always just been DCA into VGS and VAS but I decided to put a small lump sum into NDQ. So far so good and currently getting a 13.5% return per year since I started 3 years ago.
How often do you DCA and how is that panning out for you?
VGS 80%
VAS 20%
looks bull and green
Wow that’s a fine looking portfolio… why doesn’t mine look like that 🥹
u100 50%
iwld 50%
Mine looks like an empty box.
Me too
I have VOO and I use eTorro
Seeing all these abbreviations of which i know nothing makes me feel like an alien in this thread.
You don't DCA your AUD into ETF's 24/7?
To be fair, they are acronyms, so that may be where the confusion lies.
Ah, you mean like B.O.B.O.D.D.Y and B.I.Z.N.U.S?
Go with CHESS sponsored brokers trading ETFs on the ASX but beware of CGT on exit.
which ones offer auto investing?
Not CHESS sponsored but Superhero does
@TheFreaK: Is betashare directs free brokerage on asx traded etfs not cheaper than superhero? Free seems less than $2 :)
@SBOB: I stand corrected, didn’t realise it was free. Likely to change though as it was launched less than a year ago and they would just be trying to build up a user base. Superhero did the exact same thing
@TheFreaK: They'll probably keep it free for at least their own funds, same as how Vanguard have had their own platform free for their funds since basically forever. They probably get more from the ETF management fees than brokerage for most large accounts anyway.
Pearler does auto investing. The downside is that as you accumulate funds in Pearler to reach the trigger value, these funds arent earning any interest. I prefered to setup an auto lump sum deposit which would then trigger said purchase.
@Filbert: I don't follow - how do you accumulate funds in Pearler that are lower than the trigger value?
Once you setup the auto deposit, doesn't it trigger straight away?
@fredblogs: Extremely late reply sorry. Say you deposit $250/week regularly and you trigger at $1500. Then those accumulations until it reaches the trigger don't get any interest.
If you pick a trigger value that does not sync with a regular auto withdrawal on either your account or Pearler.
I set it to a calendar reminder.
Pearler does autoinvest and is CHESS sponsored
From your question and your choices I'd suggest reading a bit more or just check the ETF construction.
VGS 100%
Just curious what does the portfolio of ETFs look like as there are quite a few options.
Though your question doesn't seem to indicate you understand the question,
Joint investment
80/20 VGS/VAS , via fortnightly Vanguard direct debit
(Use to be vghd, but moved to this split recently)
Lowest earners name
100% DHHF, via regular weekly market buys
(Use to be vghd, moved to a more aggressive single buy)
(non-super) portfolio (approx), balanced by holdings in cash & term deposits:
60% QUAL
20% VHY
20% non-ETF (small number of Aussie, USA & UK shares)
Notes:
- Still hold some VGS, which is included in the QUAL % (to keep it simple).
- VHY instead of VAS to access more imputation credits - held in my wife's name (who pays a lower tax rate)
I use CommSec, Stake and Vanguard apps/platforms
VHY instead of VAS to access more imputation credits
The franking credits are about the only benefit of investing in Australian shares, so may as well go for the high dividend stocks. The US markets far outperform if you're looking for capital growth.
Indeed. VHY holds ~70 of the ASX200, so not quite as diversified as VAS, but the higher dividend paying /fully franked stocks tend to also be the larger companies in the ASX 200, which move the index the most, so VHY essentially still behaves as an index tracker. QUAL gives me my growth exposure with ~75% in the USA.
Thanks.
Rip vdhg
What do you mean?
Also curious what you mean, I got VDHG
OP - All ETF's have a different risk/return profile. What might be acceptable to others, might not be acceptable to you. You need to think about the timeframes you are investing over, and how comfortable you are with periods of low/negative returns. We are in a "bull market" right now, which typically sees very attractive returns, but they don't last for ever, and things usually have a way of leveling out to the average over the long term.
Agree. The hard part is you can think about it all you want. Never really know how your going to react until you see some massive drops.
Seen so many people say they will never sell, back up the truck, even take out a loan during a big drop… Only to sell near the bottom or best case do nothing but very rarely actually keep buying or let alone buying more aggressively.
You only need to go through one 20%+ "correction" to work this out!. Many people aren't prepared for such events and as you say, sell at the worst possible time. You have to believe prices will recover and don't need to cash in your investments in the short-term.
IVV 3%
A200 4.5%
VDHG 18%
VESG 1.7%
The rest is LICs & individual shares and shows a lack of planning and focus
Mine was abit like this when I got started. The trick for me was to write down a plan (it's less than 1/2 page of A4), which captures the logic I would use to select, buy and sell investments, plus how I would manage risk. Every time I came up (or heard of) a "good idea", I reviewed it against my plan. Things that didn't fit the plan have progressively been sold off.
Mines looks like it does because of 30+ years of investing and learning from mistakes. It's healthy portfolio but a bit like a house that has had multiple rooms added to it. Looks weird but achieves a goal.
There was no such thing as an ETF when I started. I didn't understand the advantages of buy & hold and still don't understand how to analyse when is the right time to bail out. I thought I'd done well when I bought CSL for $18 and sold it for $30 but that's better than buying for $30 and selling for $18. :-)
Whilst ETF's are only a decade or so old, the concept has been around for decades (as managed funds). The criteria for selecting them and balancing a portfolio is the same, so it's just the technical implementation of ETF's that is different.
On your other point, you need to decide if you are a "hold forever" investor, in which case you don't care about selling! … or if we want to sell to capture profits over time (hopefully), consider using a trailing stop loss system (and stick to it).
My personal view is that index-based ETF's can be "hold forever", but very few individual stocks can be (due to changes in the environment) and thus need more frequent attention over time.
I have equal holdings in VAS & VGS (VGS is more expensive so I'm heavy international).
Only because Vanguard was the only free-purchase provider I sucessfully setup for SMSF. (I'm very disappointed in CMC.)
Betashares now accept SMSF so I expect to be reviewing soon. (I'll still hold Vanguard - I don't pay any CGT I can avoid.)
F100
VAS
I have way too many various ETF's. Went in as a bit of a N00b, started 5 years ago with Clover and they got me some nice ones, then went with BF reccomendations on Breakfree and Idiot Grandson folios when they were still doing Barefoot Blueprint.
IOO, STW, VAP, VAS, VEU, VSO, VTS, ETHI, RARI.
ETHI, IOO & VTS have been the stand outs. Others around 10% returns. Im happy.
I recommend:
Suggested ETF portfolio:
IOO: https://au.finance.yahoo.com/quote/IOO.AX/
GOLD: https://au.finance.yahoo.com/quote/GOLD.AX/
Dogecoin all in.
100% dogecoin
I've been investing for almost 20 years and I got almost no idea what people here are saying lol.
Yes, I know what you mean.
How do you get these (are they all on the ASX)?
Do any have some sort of reasonable security? I don't mind making 0% return sometimes but I really hate losing the capital (looking at you Superannuation!).
I just dont get why people want to invest in a product where they can't value the underlying.
Many years of investing education tells me the idea of ETF was to eliminate non-systematic risk by being the in the index, yet the irony now days is that you can choose to add ETF with added non-systematic risk by choosing ETFs which does not represent the index (by defination there is only one index and the fact people are investing in multiple ETFs says they are not index investing).
I guess the financiallsation of products can do that to people, take a good thing and ruin it to the point where people actually forget the reason why it was developed inthe first place.
by defination there is only one index
There are definitely many different indices, and those fund managers definitely tell you the composition of their fund + their "investment strategies" (which are usually just buying the top shares). For example, some of the top ETF people suggested here:
@BuyNow Think Later: I'd say the key difference is actively vs passively managed, but recommend you ask ChatGPT or Perplexity for a detailed breakdown
@BuyNow Think Later: ETF = Exchange Traded Funds, which means these are primarily managed funds but can be traded on the stock exchange (ASX in our case).
It just happens that most ETF mentioned here are index funds, i.e. they are tracking whatever indices which require minimum management. They are probably only rebalanced once a quarter. Almost no research has been performed to determine the holding assets. Thus lower management fee comparing to actively managed funds.
What have you been investing in then?
BGBL - 74
A200 - 6.5
VGS - 6.5
VAS - 6.5
IVV - 6.5
MVW - 40%
QUS - 30%
HQUS - 30%
30% IOZ (Ishares Core S&P/ASX 200)
70% BGBL (Betashares Global Shares ETF)
Webull has free brokerage for ETFs, no catch, and is CHESS-sponsored. PM for referral code or use the ozbargain randomiser.
Also how do fees work?
Vanguard site says they charge 0.29% per year. But you are just buying a share via say Stake platform. So how do they take the .29% fees out? Is that factored in the price?
Fees are basically automatically deducted from the underlying asset (the actual stocks the ETF holds) and would be reflected in the price. Well, technically, in the net asset value or basically "value of the actual stocks held", but there are people with deep pockets that create additional ETF units if the price goes above the net asset value and turn the ETF units back into the constituent stocks if the price goes below the NAV because it's worth it for them to spend their money making trades that net them fractions of a cent per ETF unit like that because they can do it a whole lot.
VAS 20%
VGS 40%
ETHI 40%
VAS is my worst performing by far. +11% vs +35% for others.
That's because the risk / return profile of each of those ETF's is different. It's all relative, but you'd expect VAS to deliver ~9% YoY (which is the historical average return of the ASX200, noting there are ~300 shares covered by VAS)
Yeah, plus dividends from VAS seem better than VGS in general too.
But I'm a very passive investor. Bought them once a couple of years ago without much research, and just leave it be and check on it every now and then for interest.
Aussie shares tend to pay higher dividends than global peers, and you also get franking credits from Australian companies (not internationals), which is why VAS pays more dividends. To counter that the VAS share price growth tends to be lower, but the total return reasonably stable.
VAS & VGS are well suited to a passive investment style. Good luck.
Raiz Emerald (ethical) 78% (mostly RARI, ETHI and IAF)
DHHF 22%
Next thinking GHHF
Feel free to rip me to shreds.
GHHF isn't a bad product if it fits your needs, and Raiz is OK I guess… fees got a bit high though, I feel like DZZF would be better for most people looking for a similar product, though I suppose paying a couple a bucks for convenience isn't the worst thing.
I would suggest you maximise your concessional contribution to your super to take advantage of the 15% tax on the way in and 0% tax when you switch to the pension phase from age 60.
Then just switch the super fund to between 50-100% Australian/US low cost index fund equivalent - no need for 'high growth, balance, defensive'. Just go with the lowest fee.
If you've already done this then start doing it outside of super.
The most important thing to know is money is fungible and you need to see all your money in the super + outside of super as your total portfolio and manage it as such. i.e. super is for when you're 60+ and investments outside of super is for when you're below 60.
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/tag/exchange-traded-fund
Or
https://www.ozbargain.com.au/tag/brokerage