Can a Man Complain about Gender Imbalance and Inequality at Work?

dimes on 26/01/2024 - 23:04
Last edited 27/01/2024 - 13:41 by 1 other user

For context, I work in a state government agency and I've been told my female boss "likes women", which I take to mean she prefers working with women rather than men. So this made me curious and I wanted to see if there was any statistical proof to this. I looked at the internal and external recruitments for June to December 2023 and found that 16/20 successful candidates were women, and 9/10 managers in my office are women.

We also occasionally outsource work where we have a panel of qualified people to choose from, and I heard this boss tell someone that we have to choose a woman next time.

I know for sure if the genders were reversed, women would be complaining and everyone would be up in arms about gender inequality. But as men, can we complain about the same thing when it happens to us, or will we be cast away as whingers and also commit career suicide at the same time?

Education & Work

Comments

      • anonymous01 on 28/01/2024 - 20:30
        -1

        Then how can we help you? What if you work in prostitution industry and complaining about the gender ratio?

    • dimes on 27/01/2024 - 01:13
      +51

      I believe if this was the response given to women, what you would hear is "women shouldn't have to leave, the work culture should change".

      • LFO on 27/01/2024 - 11:39

        What happen when they are utterly useless?

        • th123 on 27/01/2024 - 12:48
          +8

          Sounds like a good portion of the public sector

    • ozbjunkie on 29/01/2024 - 01:48
      +1

      Said to every woman in roles where they were discriminated against and harassed, until discrimination and harassment law rightfully caught up

      But. What. About. Men?

      There, I said it.

      If your argument ends with… " And that's why men should accept less or worse conditions than women " I want us to revisit our premise of "axiomatically, gendered discrimination is bad and should be reformed ".

      If you cannot hold true to your premise it is mere sophistry presented to fatigue your audience before you deliver your preformulated conclusion

  • mitt on 26/01/2024 - 23:39
    +17

    Report it anonymously. Report it to a HR division/management above & separated from your own department or it will be quashed. Make sure its actually untraceable. Don't voice your concerns with co-workers or they will immediately know it was you. Make it clear in your complaint that you are reporting it anonymously because you are worried about retaliatory action.

    From watching an acquaintance complaining about a similar thing, the clique that had formed absolutely crushed him with back-biting & petty sabotage but never did anything overt enough to have actual evidence or warrant HR intervention. All the women in management that were ass-kissing the problem manager marched in lockstep to do it. Working with them was generally poison (constant petty nonsense & drama) but they really came down on him when it was suggested they were doing something wrong.

    He eventually quit, so did a bunch of people who were sick of the nonsense. Afaik its still a problem department & the problem manager has only failed upwards. I am luckily insulated from it all by an old guard boss that dgaf & has friends in high places, making him untouchable. I actually watched the problem manager have a full blown tantrum at him back when this all went down because he keeps ignoring her petty nit-picking. Was wild to see.

  • bobbified on 26/01/2024 - 23:42
    +16

    You can complain, but what proof do you have? She can just say that the female was the most suitable at the time.

    Also, don't trust HR or anyone else if they tell you these complaints are anonymous. I suspect you'll have great difficulty retaining your job after you make that complaint. So think very carefully before you make a move.

    • dimes on 27/01/2024 - 01:16
      +5

      That's the issue, there's usually no hard proof with these types of things, you rarely get someone on the record saying "let's hire this person because they're a man/woman".

      When women were fighting these fights, they pointed to statistics (whether skewed or not is another issue). But seems like men can't do the same.

      • El cheepo on 27/01/2024 - 01:44
        +4

        When women were fighting these fights, they pointed to statistics (whether skewed or not is another issue).

        Do you know of many examples of a woman pointing out these sorts of obvious acts of discrimination and in doing so, solving gender discrimination in the workplace?

        I don’t. (Maybe there are some, who knows)

        Generally anyone who tries to fight it within their workplace will end up ostracising themselves.

        But seems like men can't do the same.

        Of course they can. Just expect the same result as if the roles were reversed.

        The problem is bigger then your workplace.

    • kraigg on 27/01/2024 - 07:58
      +13

      Be very wary of any HR person that tells you that you have complete anonymity, they're lulling you into a trap. In a previous job I was asked to create an "anonymous" staff survey, in MS SharePoint. But each response was, unknowingly by most staff, linked to their email address. So what was said and voted in the survey was completely traced to the person that said it.

    • Cluster on 29/01/2024 - 10:36

      Indeed. The 'most suitable for the role' argument is tough to fight against, as it was the very same argument used by certain groups to keep non white and non male people out of management roles in previous decades.

      As for anonymous complaints, it's easy to do. Send a printed letter with no return address to HR. Use gloves if you're really worried. Do not use a printer at work. Also make sure there are enough male employees around you so that the complaint cannot be zeroed in on you and your position.

      • bobbified on 29/01/2024 - 13:54

        OP says that 16/20 are female.. so even with an anonymous complaint, I think it'll be pretty easy to narrow down who it was! Especially if 2 or 3 of them tend to just sit there all day minding their own business….haha

  • Trying2SaveABuck on 26/01/2024 - 23:59
    +7

    you can complain, unfortunately in this woke world we live in unless have proof or you are a 'minority' with have some proper sob story no one will care

    i got a 'few' examples of women or minorities been given promotions they did not deserve at my workplace - doesnt bother me as i never apply for them but for the people who do and 'probably' deserve the promotions i feel for'em

    often the good people leave and that is my advice to you - if you're unhappy either find a new job or do what i do, do the bare minimum and start a side hustle and focus on that ive almost doubled my income and no one at my workplace knows it at the same time i do half as much work as i did when i started. I used to be one of the 'best' workers now i honestly reckon i should be performanced managed but the people in charge are 'so incompetent' i doubt they would have balls to even sit down and have a conversation about my performance with me, also think they are pretty dumb so i'd talk my way out of it

    in situations like this you use it to your advantage or find something better - it is also the argument for 'working for yourself' you dont need to put up with stupid politics if you run the show

    Survival of the fittest

    • SpainKing on 28/01/2024 - 20:00
      +1

      If I may ask, what's the side hustle you've been focussing yourself on?

      • SBOB on 28/01/2024 - 20:06
        -1

        I've heard they get paid by the LNP to downvote labor voter posts ;)

      • Trying2SaveABuck on 28/01/2024 - 20:09
        +4

        same as a main job but via my own business - i rented a place out for a few hours a week - it took awhile to get going but now it is pretty busy i have gradually increased my hours to the point where im hoping within the next year my main job will need to become my 'side job' and my business will become my main source of income

        my main job is government so tax wise i wouldnt 'leave' because of salary packaging [essentially tax free money] but it is full of woke-trads so unless i start identifying as a cucumber i won't get promoted

        • SpainKing on 28/01/2024 - 20:15
          +4

          Good on you having the courage to fend for yourself in the world of business, I imagine that's gotta be pretty spooky. Congratulations and thanks for sharing

          Salary packaging sounds damn good, hopefully when I'm out of Coles I get the opportunity

          Are the rumours true, you hate the Labor party? 👀

          • Trying2SaveABuck on 28/01/2024 - 20:23

            @SpainKing: thanks for the kind words

            i worked at coles for 4 years and woolworths/BWS for 3 whilst studying - believe it or not when you look back 'you will' the relaxed work culture and being around young people when life gets serious but i in my business now i earn in 45-60mins what i used to earn in 8 hours at woolworths so i could never go back but i still have friends from the uni/high school job days. - Believe it or not i used to work with Adrian Portelli [Lambo guy] in my Coles days

            lol i don't hate the ALP they used to be a good party, up until they started taking Greens preference formally [and yes i do hate the Greens and anyone who votes for them i automatically have no respect for]. Out of the majors i prefer the LNP however if ALP ever f—ked off the Greens and went back to looking after working people id probably switch my support back to them but i doubt that will happen as the Greens and ALP are almost the same party these days.

            • SpainKing on 28/01/2024 - 20:32
              +1

              @Trying2SaveABuck:

              thanks for the kind words

              Of course mate, you deserve 'em after biting the bullet

              My time with Coles has been nice but I'm not really developing my skills so I reckon it's time to find another industry with some better upwards mobility

              The greens are a blight on the voting ballots but their supporters' hearts are in the right place, possibly just misguided with optimism. Appreciate you not saying "LNP and ALP are the same" as is a common sentiment 'round these parts and loses some respect on my part. Hope you have a nice, lazy Sunday to finish the week off :)

              • idonotknowwhy on 30/01/2024 - 09:19

                @SpainKing:

                their supporters' hearts are in the right place, possibly just misguided with optimism

                Road to hell is paved with good intentions

    • idonotknowwhy on 30/01/2024 - 09:18

      I used to be one of the 'best' workers now i honestly reckon i should be performanced managed but the people in charge are 'so incompetent' i doubt they would have balls to even sit down and have a conversation about my performance with me, also think they are pretty dumb so i'd talk my way out of it

      Is that because you're falling behind with the skills and self-aware, or because you don't give a (profanity) and want to see how far you can go? lol
      I'm guessing latter since you said you're doing a side-hustle in the same field.

  • hasher22 on 27/01/2024 - 00:03
    +10

    Can you complain? Yes
    Will anything come out of it? Most likely not
    Will your name be tarnished if you make a non-anonymous complaint? yes

    It's very hard to prove or even get stats of demographics based on personal preferences. You will basically find a bunch of opinions and hearsay without any hard proof. The only proof you will get is through observation and even that isn't justifiable.

    For example if she likes working with women and she's open about it, and you noticed slowly her team and the people she surrounds herself are women and she's slowly pushing out the men… is that evidence? yes but that's not tangible evidence if you're going to pin her on discrimination.

    • follow on 27/01/2024 - 03:41
      +3

      Matriarchy?

      • AustriaBargain on 27/01/2024 - 04:09
        -5

        That sounds right. In any case, I wouldn't complain about a matriarchy if I worked in one. That's no way to get ahead in a female environment. I'm gay though so I probably wouldn't be seen as a threat to women anyway.

  • OMGJL on 27/01/2024 - 05:06
    +13

    Where I work, there is a proclaimed "high standard of gender equality," and to achieve this, they actively strive to hire more women whenever possible. In a general sense, our workforce has an equal percentage of men and women. But in order to maintain this balance, the company has been intentionally hiring more women.

    Since genders are equal, according to probability theory, with a diverse pool of candidates, the likelihood of finding a qualified male or female candidate should be approximately 50-50. Nevertheless, the company has hired significantly more women in recent years. To compensate for having equal percentage of genders at work, it seems they have deliberately chosen female candidates while potentially letting go of equally qualified male candidates.

    While it is acknowledged that gender inequality existed in the past, favoring men in the workforce, the current approach appears to be impacting the rights of younger male candidates today. Younger males are paying the old debts.

    (my own comment touched up by ChatGPT)

    • trapper on 30/01/2024 - 13:03

      the likelihood of finding a qualified male or female candidate should be approximately 50-50.

      This is contingent upon an equal number of male and female job seekers possessing similar qualifications, which is almost never the reality due to differing preferences and interests between genders.

      • OMGJL on 30/01/2024 - 14:39

        I forgot to mention, I work in a big firm and this industry itself is definitely not gender specific. Though I am working in the IT department in this non-IT company, IT department naturally have more males, but our company still maintains almost 1:1 gender ratio overall, it is very much likely that we having a gender hiring preference going on here.

  • avoidfullprice on 27/01/2024 - 07:04
    +1

    dazzle your complaint with a bit of Kenergy and a dance routine! Shouldn’t need to feel you’re a number two. Anywhere else you’re a ten!!!!

  • GordonD on 27/01/2024 - 07:45
    +9

    If the OP has a specific complaint about his treatment, a complaint he can substantiate with facts, then he should make it.

    But in the world we live in if he just has a general complaint of bias towards women on the part of his boss, he should think carefully before making it. Because he might just find that he gets a label that is career-limiting and perhaps as a result be career-ending in the long run.

    There's an old quote that may be apposite. If you wish to know who you are ruled by, ask who you can not criticise.

  • backupper1 on 27/01/2024 - 08:40
    +1

    There should be a whistleblower option in HR section or ask HR for whistleblower process. Then report that manager because it’s clearly a discrimination and against Australian workforce laws which don’t allow bias based on gender, age, race etc.
    Who knows she might even be biased in favour of older females, maybe like building a ’cushion’ around her by filling up office with people like her only?
    In that sense she is going against the law on multiple discriminations.

  • Dollar General on 27/01/2024 - 09:04
    +6

    To be fair we are only hearing your side of the story. Maybe less males are applying or they are not as qualified as the females applying. Who knows. The world has become more woke but people have also become more sensitive and bigger sooks

    • moar bargains on 27/01/2024 - 13:17
      +7

      Plot twist, it's a maternity ward

    • ozbjunkie on 29/01/2024 - 01:53
      +3

      No no, less males applying just reflects another, deeper, systemic bias in the profession, and either malicious or subconscious biased thinking and discriminatory behaviour (including micro aggressions) perpetrated by the individuals within and around that profession.

      I have been paying attention, can't fool me

      What's good for the geese

  • Ughhh on 27/01/2024 - 09:32
    -1

    People like people who are like themselves.

    There's been many cases at my work where men were given promotions or senior roles they did not deserve. Using one as an example, his phd resume would tell you he is 100% qualified. If he wasn't hired, perhaps some guys here would be defending him. He was a good talker, but a horrible project manager, horrible mentor, spent his time on youtubing conspiracy theory's instead. Even clients said he was useless off-line.

    Useless people exist for all genders. But you can't ignore the fact that boys club has been a thing for a long time.

    • Davo1111 on 31/01/2024 - 13:16

      There's been many cases at my work where men were given promotions or senior roles they did not deserve

      I'm sure thats the case everywhere, and not gender specific.

      Useless people exist for all genders. But you can't ignore the fact that boys club has been a thing for a long time.'

      I can see people promoting those they get on with, or at least not promoting people they dont get on with. However i think "the boys club" is gone.

      I work in mining (services) and visit dozen + sites per year. People are (by the most part) very professional. Even the managers that are involved with "boys club" style events. Sports, tipping, drinking etc, want people who can do the work in work hours.

      I very rarely very hear sexist comments. people just want reliable workers they can trust.

      Granted - im not referring to the entire industry (and the people i work mostly have a degree), but i think it's a good start

    • us3rnam3tak3n on 28/01/2024 - 15:31
      +1

      To save others from wasting time, it's just some sort of Israel/Palestine propaganda. I didn't watch enough to know which side it favoured.

  • mskeggs on 27/01/2024 - 10:34
    +5

    The government keeps very detailed statistics on gender in larger businesses, and the experience OP talks about is vanishingly uncommon.
    The stats show the reverse is true in nearly every industry:
    https://www.wgea.gov.au/publications/gender-equality-workpla…

    • dimes on 27/01/2024 - 15:05
      -1

      Well…

      1. That's from 2022, probably based on data in 2021, whereas my numbers are referencing 2023
      2. I'm just talking about my office, not whole of Australia. It would be like saying 60% of people in Bankstown are Vietnamese, therefore 60% of people in Australia are Vietnamese
      • Gunnar on 27/01/2024 - 16:04

        How did you get those recruitment stats from your agency? Those stats aren’t stuff that HR of an govt agency give out easily.

        Also what grade are your ‘managers’ in the office? The NSW public service (assuming that’s your employer) is a BIG place!

        The PSC publishes overall workforce data and you can see the gender differences there. The NSW public service is a female dominated workforce:
        https://www.psc.nsw.gov.au/reports-and-data/workforce-profil…

        That being like any employer , the nature of your industry can impact the gender roles and who applies for jobs.

        As for challenging it is this the hill you want to die on?

        • dimes on 28/01/2024 - 07:51
          +1

          An office wide email is sent around announcing the successful candidate for each position advertised internally or externally.

          All managers are at the level just below executive.

  • AlienC on 27/01/2024 - 11:11
    +4

    Now imagine how hard it is for aliens.

    • ozbjunkie on 29/01/2024 - 01:57

      Unless it's a position where hiring is personally conducted by one of the lizard billionaires that run our world, and you're one of the lizards

      Then you just blink your side-lids 3 times quickly

      Hired

  • cuckchump on 27/01/2024 - 12:55

    its simple, if they are ugly or hot, you still have to listen to the delegated tasks assign to you…or else see you at centrelink

  • monky on 27/01/2024 - 14:38

    no

  • bargain huntress on 27/01/2024 - 14:57
    +2

    If you are really passionate about it and pretty confident that you are correct then attempt to find a lawyer who is interested in rights and willing to working no win low/no fee. Probably not easy

  • Drakesy on 28/01/2024 - 14:00

    Now i'm intrigued as to what the role is.

    if it's admin in health or education i believe it's very female based because that's reflective of the type of work done and who falls into the area.

    If it's engineering based then you end up with a male dominated working environment.
    It's pretty much reflective of what comes out of university.

    But yes complain away, don't be surprised when they turn you down and give you some BS excuse (it really is double standards).
    Worked at an engineering company where HR was actively suggesting to managers to hire more females, when there was push back that there just weren't that many female engineers out there HR would rather they didn't hire at all, and so began the toxic cycle, and one of the reasons i ultimately left. (Disregard the fact that HR was 90% female) "But we're an exception"

    • dimes on 28/01/2024 - 22:49

      It's not health or education.

  • valuer on 28/01/2024 - 14:48

    Of course you can complain. But make sure that you have lined up a job somewhere else first as the sort of people who say they believe in diversity and equality - usually don't.

    Is she a lesbian? I had a manager once who was and she definitely had a preference when it came to new hires. But she was effective at her job so any complaint wasn't going to be welcomed. I didn't complain because I was also effective in my role and she wasn't targeting men.

  • MrKnowItAll on 28/01/2024 - 15:33

    It's a tough one that's for sure. Anyone who's done hiring would know that it's difficult to remove all biases when making a decision, sometimes you can even do it without even knowing! The fact that it's 80% hires being female shows that if it's bias, she is able to put them aside to make the best choice for the company which looks much better for her than hiring 100% females.

    That being said women have had it though for a long time in the workplace and I continue to see it even now with all this 'woke' stuff going on, for instance where I work, a friend of mine is a team lead who manages just under 20 staff and I manage two.. but, I get paid 20% more than she does despite a much easier job and much less management of people. So to see it swing the other way is actually kind of nice, even though technically unfair.. there's that bias again.

    I'd be keen to know the industry, I work at a large healthcare organisation and the male / female split is 80% female, 20% male which from the outside looks biased until you realise that most of the employees are nurses which makes more sense.

    End of the day if it's bothering you that much and you're ok changing to another company, you can challenge it. But beware that it very likely won't work well for you.

    • nobro25 on 28/01/2024 - 16:28

      Male nurses have left the chat.

      • MrKnowItAll on 29/01/2024 - 00:38

        They're a very, very, very small minority :)

        • payless69 on 29/01/2024 - 16:06

          how do you define very vey?

          Female pilots are still putting up with directories saying: Notice to airMEN !!

          • MrKnowItAll on 29/01/2024 - 17:56

            @payless69: 'very very' to me is 10% which I confirmed this morning - pretty telling given the typical population split is often 50/50 or close to it. Healthcare is very much a female oriented industry which is what I was trying to ascertain with OP here, there may genuinely be a reason that females are being hired over males (not that it matters all that much as long as suitable applicants are being chosen). He only says govt agency which is super broad as govt. run a number of things.

            I can't find anywhere that OP has clarified which part of the govt. they work in either so who knows.

            • payless69 on 29/01/2024 - 20:16

              @MrKnowItAll: Healthcare? Didn't know that female doctors outnumbered males. I know veterinary doctors is much of a girl thing.
              In today's news: NSW Premier calling for the South African model of returning all stolen countries to the first inhabitants.

  • brenwildman on 28/01/2024 - 16:01
    -1

    You work for the government. You are part of the problem. Fix that first

  • BartholemewH on 28/01/2024 - 16:16

    No. But I think you knew that.

  • nobro25 on 28/01/2024 - 16:27
    +4

    According to feminism this isn't considered as sexism. Equality only is looked at if it benefits women that's what feminism is all about.
    Common guys we live in a woke society. I've seen a lot of ads lately to hire people of indigenous descent. If we're truly inclusive you don't need to do that. Literally just put up the Job ad and state objective credentials to apply.

    • Cluster on 29/01/2024 - 12:07
      +1

      Much of the effort to hire ATSI people is a token gesture and just copying and pasting text. For example, I was looking at government ads for a friend who wanted to work as a translator. Native speaker level Mandarin required. The ad stated that Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders were especially encouraged to apply. The same text is mindlessly copied and pasted onto every ad without thinking. How many ATSI people have native speaker levels of Mandarin? You could probably count them on one hand.

      • infinite on 29/01/2024 - 23:01

        They'll 100% hire an ATSI "identifying" person with no language skills at all for that role, then commit to training them with taxpayer funds for an unlimited time until they can speak Chinese. They'll fumble uselessly through the position for 6 months before getting past the probation period & being confirmed as full time, then immediately apply and be given a substantially better job elsewhere. Rinse and repeat - that's how public service hiring works & useless minority hires get stacked into every department that operates based on woke ideology instead of performance.

  • Mrgreenz on 28/01/2024 - 16:46
    +1

    If you like your job, no,no you can't.

  • randomvis on 28/01/2024 - 18:08
    +2

    Good luck getting people on this forum to acknowledge this as a problem.

    The Pink Ceiling et al.

  • Cusack on 28/01/2024 - 20:57
    +1

    What if some of the women identified as a man? Then it’ll be more even right? Oh wait, what if some of the women she hired were actually men that identified as a woman? I need a drink.

  • sirstiv on 28/01/2024 - 21:01

    Sounds like you work for a hen house lol
    Bawk!

  • ChatCPT on 28/01/2024 - 21:27
    +1

    you gave them equality

    now suffer the consequences

  • BluebirdV on 28/01/2024 - 21:36

    Start working for yourself so you don't have to deal with all the nonsense.

  • Breno785au on 28/01/2024 - 22:34

    What are complaining about? You can just tell everyone you identify as a woman.

  • DemocracyManifest on 28/01/2024 - 22:39
    -1

    I can already guess this is FACS

  • BeamMeUp on 28/01/2024 - 23:23

    Maybe ask HR what is the gender balance ratio objective? Whats the policy on hiring on merit? There are proportionally that few blokes who would be qualified to work in your office? I assume this is not a hospital ward.

  • Eeples on 29/01/2024 - 00:12

    I don’t think you should complain as a man.

    I think you should voice your concern that not having a balance of male and female employees necessarily reduces your sections productivity.

    Ie. never say you want more men employed just argue for balance. It is someone else’s job on how to best achieve it.

  • spriggan43 on 29/01/2024 - 01:09
    -2

    Op, probably works in a state funded womens program and now wasting tax payers money to administer his own ozbargin post.

  • acersaurus on 29/01/2024 - 09:13

    Gender equality works both ways - but I'd be really sure before complaining about gender equality.

    Also if you are told that your boss likes women, who is saying that? Is it third party info? Do you have solid info to know she prefers to hire females?

    It might be that more women are applying for jobs in your area than men. I work in local government and in my organisation over 70% of staff are female and in Local Gov generally it is around 2/3. I don't see this as discrimination, I've been on interview panels and think that in many cases a lot more women are applying for local government jobs hence the resulting staff ratio.

    And in an office of mostly women, it's not implausible that 9/10 managers would be women and be hired on merit alone. At my last employer, the office was mostly women too but all of the directors and the CEO were men. It was a bad look, but not necessarily due to discrimination if the best applicants for those jobs were men at that particular organisation.

  • KaTst3R on 29/01/2024 - 10:31
    +5

    Plot Twist: OP works for the NSW government, under the NSW Women's Strategy initiative group.

  • freefall101 on 29/01/2024 - 12:03
    +1

    I've been told my female boss "likes women"

    Well if someone told you, it must be true

    So this made me curious and I wanted to see if there was any statistical proof to this. I looked at the internal and external recruitments for June to December 2023 and found that 16/20 successful candidates were women, and 9/10 managers in my office are women.

    That is not statistical proof of the claim, it is simply a correlation.

    Honestly, the biggest issue here is that you're using your access to recruitment information to look up the gender of everyone being hired in the office. I'd probably think twice before telling that to your boss, because that seems a hugely inappropriate use of your data access.

    • dimes on 29/01/2024 - 23:23

      Using my access to recruitment information to look up the gender?

      HR sends out office wide emails announcing Amanda/Bella/Cassandra have been hired. I think I can safely assume they're all female.

      • Taro Milk Tea on 30/01/2024 - 09:36
        -2

        I think I can safely assume they're all female

        I don't think you can safely assume in this era. They could be men if they want to be.

        • chriskq on 30/01/2024 - 12:47

          they could be penguins too

      • freefall101 on 31/01/2024 - 10:59
        -1

        You probably want to re-read your policy. Simply having access to data doesn’t mean you should use it inappropriately.

        https://www.abc.net.au/news/2006-08-23/centrelink-staff-sack…

        Justifications you thought of afterwards (the emails) don’t tend to fly.

    • dimes on 30/01/2024 - 22:49
      -1

      Also, you might have a technical point on this being correlation rather than strict proof, but it's the same 'proof' women have been using the last 20 years to fight for their own definition of equality. We still see these types of headlines today like "Men still hold 9 in 10 CEO roles at Australia’s largest companies".

      Oh I actually didn't make that up:

      https://womensagenda.com.au/latest/men-still-hold-9-in-10-ce…

      • freefall101 on 31/01/2024 - 11:39
        -1

        You’re right, go raise a complaint about your boss based on a generalisation of women, your data activities and what someone told you.

        Let me know how that works out for you.

      • Eeples on 02/02/2024 - 20:03
        +1

        Equality of outcomes I don't think ought to be the goal. It should be equality of opportunity.

        Otherwise, one could argue there ought to be quotas in male dominated jobs like garbo's and bricklayers.

        (In fact where are the women groups arguing for the equality of outcomes in 'lowly' men dominated (frequently middle/low paying) jobs?…. absent… because this has never really been about equality… it has always been about power.)

  • quanticism on 29/01/2024 - 13:50

    Complain if you're easily hirable by other companies. Otherwise things like DEI will die with time as society reverts back to meritocracy.

  • dmac on 29/01/2024 - 15:39

    Very interested in hearing OP thoughts now. As an outsider, it seems worth complaining anonymously as long as that's true - as it can potentially change the workplace for the better by standing up for equality. If proven, this could set a precedent and prevent this from becoming the norm in other workplaces.

    On another note, it's interesting to think about this conversation taking place for women's workplace rights 50 or so years ago and how people would have dissuaded their complaints - many likely lost work but some created positive change.

  • Powershopz on 29/01/2024 - 16:11
    +1

    No. Keep quiet and move one. One way ticket to the doghouse if you were to complain about this.

    I'm in the same situation which I find funny because I've seen it both ways. At the end of the day it generally comes down to senior leadership/company.

    One of my previous roles - GM was a flamboyant, inappropriate ~60yo gay man - 9/10 senior leaders below him were all men. Definitely men's club vibes - +points if you were a smoker as well.

    My current company - the role/industry demographic would be ~50/50 split. HOD is a woman and only 20% of team under her are male despite overall industry being 50/50.

  • syousef on 29/01/2024 - 17:11
    +2

    Affirmative action is enshrined in law.

    https://classic.austlii.edu.au/au/journals/UNSWLawJl/2004/45…
    https://humanrights.gov.au/sites/default/files/document/publ…

    Some of these provisions and special measures could potentially be applied to either gender but it's pretty clear "The Equal Opportunity for Women in the Workplace Act 1999" is not for addressing the imbalance in genders in roles that are already female-dominated.

  • The Value on 29/01/2024 - 18:10
    -1

    It can never be exactly 50/50.

    Rest assured there are many more workplaces that are skewed the other way.

    • RefusdClassification on 29/01/2024 - 18:29

      The difference is that there are lots of males who would like a public-service career. Not many females want to be tradies, abbatoir workers, sanitation workers, arborists, engineers, mathematicians and so on.

    • Davo1111 on 31/01/2024 - 13:49

      The issue is that equality works both ways. People should be judged on their merits, not because of your gender.

      If the talent pool of grads is 80% women, then i'd expect the company to have around the same percentage. If it's the opposite, then theres a bias that should be explained.

      Same goes in reverse

  • RefusdClassification on 29/01/2024 - 18:27
    +1

    White collar public service jobs are essential middle class welfare programs for people who belong to so-called "disadvantaged minority groups". The more minority groups you belong to, the more likely you are going to land a public-service job and to advance quickly to a managerial role.

    In America it is the same. Women and Afro-Americans are over-representing in government white-collar jobs compared to the percentage of the population they compromise.

    The modern left doesn't believe in equality. They believe in special privileges for groups like like, so-called identity politics. The Nazis practiced identity politics too: Jews were forbidden from having government jobs, teaching positions and law careers in Germany (the Nuremburg laws). Apparently the Nazis were evil for doing so, but when liberals do so they are hailed as enlightened paragons of virtue.

  • Korban Dallas on 29/01/2024 - 19:46

    Times are changing.

  • Asti on 29/01/2024 - 21:56
    +3

    Yes you can complain. But nobody takes workplace discrimination against men seriously. That is the reality of the world.

  • frostman on 29/01/2024 - 22:36
    +1

    In the 1960s-1970s, the US government devised a plan to collect more tax as revenue from the citizens, at the time, 90% of workers in the corporate, labour and most other industries were male.
    With the exception of low paying female-dominant roles such as sewing, wet nurse, teaching, and switchboard operators. This was not good enough. How can a government sustain tax revenue with only a mere 50% of the population whilst the other 50% stayed home? Mind you, the average family in that day had lower debt, a house, car and kids at school with fewer mortgage stress and loan-free holidays ….you following?
    So they decided to finance/support/etc feminist groups which led a new paradigm shift for women to leave this old, decrepit life for a new life in the workforce!

    The motive was that it wanted women to be financially independent, whilst the real motive was just to collect revenue and support capitalism and let the private sector control the country's trade - you guys all know which group of people today control the billion dollar industries like Google, Blackrock etc.

    [Taxation, in one form or another, is an essential function of the State of which it is a part. Historically, the State is the general political institution by which the ruling classes dominate the classes under their control.]

    So back to the point, women entered the workforce in the hopes of being financially independent, and free! the marketing was great..
    the word 'Childfree' started trending in the 1970s because the fad is now to choose financial liberty over sitting around the dinner table right?

    So cool, between 1970 and 2023 there is appx 53 years of the paradigm shift in full force, things must be getting better for the household with dual income in half a century, right? wrong:

    //Trends in household debt During the 1980s, the ratio of debt to disposable income for Australian households was fairly stable at around 45% (Graph 1). But since 1990, this ratio has risen rapidly, reaching 157% in December 2007. Housing debt accounts for the bulk of the increase, with the ratio of housing debt to disposable income rising from 31% to 134% over the period. By comparison, the ratio of personal debt to disposable income increased from 13% to 22% over the same period. The ratio of debt to assets has also risen sharply over the past two decades, from 8% in December 1989 to 17% in December 2007// -https://www.bis.org/publ/bppdf/

    This publication is 17 years old , what do you think the ratio is now?
    What has it solved? Nothing, just over-supply of jobs, high taxes, increase in money supply, and redaction of labour work has led to a financial phenomena called, Inflation.

    However one thing did work:

    Personal income tax revenues grew slightly in nominal terms in 2019–20, from $228.4 billion in 2018-19 to $229.7 billion in 2019-20

    You may be asking, what is your point here?
    The point is to outline how a government organisation (in Ops case), which is a public servant body has the gall to publicly hire only women and not be called sexist, because it has the backing of the federal government.
    The downside of this is some women who naturally would be more inclined to be stay-at-home mums are socially looked down on because they're not 'women in leadership/corporate world'.

  • infinite on 29/01/2024 - 22:53
    +1

    You have every right to complain and you absolutely should, however it's probably wise to acknowledge that the discrimination hearing you'll be having about the matter will be stacked even harder in the favor of females and then the appeals process will be handled by a group custom selected to be 90% female and minorities who openly hate men after that.

  • R4 on 29/01/2024 - 23:20
    +7

    I work in the mining industry in WA. What I'm going to write here is basically what is happening right now - take it or leave it. At managerial level, all mining companies are actively promoting women and minorities just because they're women and minorities. If you're a young White professional entering the mining industry today, you will be actively discriminated against when it comes to promotion and opportunities. Now, whether this is a good thing or not, I'll let others decide but that's what's happening. I'm older and a technical specialist contractor and earn more than many of my bosses and I'm not trying to get promoted, so this isn't sour grapes on my part. I read recently that the head of BHP said that 80% of their new apprentices are female and minorities - and you can't get to that kind of percentage with actively discriminating against men. The few women I work with and are at the same level as me are not happy with this discrimination as they want to be judged on their work performance, not the fact that they have a vagina. I feel sorry for young people entering the industry today.

    • Davo1111 on 30/01/2024 - 02:43
      +1

      One of several reasons I'd never work for bhp

    • UltimateAI on 30/01/2024 - 06:39

      This has been corporate culture in most large organisations for years. The good women actually hate it.

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