Lost My Job

Kidaway on 03/11/2023 - 23:30

I am in the legal industry and just lost my job. Joined the firm for a year now and got offered a redundancy pay for 3 months, which I think is generous and can probably last me till March next year. Got cut off mainly because of team’s budget and personal performance.

I’m now at a stage where I’m thinking of a career change. Pretty much sick of have a fixed salary with hardly any motivation to work hard on a matter knowing that whatever you billed wouldn’t go straight to you.

Would a real estate agent be a better option?

Education & Work

Comments

  • coffeeinmyveins on 04/11/2023 - 00:00
    +13

    Feels like if you only have money until March then a drastic career change is a risky move.

    And real estate? Really? Lol

    • Some Human on 04/11/2023 - 01:16
      +29

      Maybe they want to be as equally hated as a real estate agent as they were as a lawyer.

      • cashless on 04/11/2023 - 08:03
        +2

        Can also add 2nd hand car dealer to that list then.

        • Brianqpr on 05/11/2023 - 19:12

          And traffic warden

          • iDroid on 05/11/2023 - 22:38

            @Brianqpr: Hey.. come on.. Traffic wardens are .. Oh yeah.. moving on..

      • scotty on 04/11/2023 - 08:08
        +23

        According to Governance Institute of Australia Ethics Index 2023, Real estate agent is actually the least ethical occupations, more so than the lawyers. So the transition would actually be from "hated" to "most hated".

        • holdenmg on 04/11/2023 - 08:12
          +11

          Qantas is making Real Estate Agents, Lawyers and Used Car Salespeople look good.

          • Kangal on 06/11/2023 - 08:12
            +1

            @holdenmg: There's other occupations that are worse/more hated, but we don't talk about them. Just like they say in Soviet Russia "can't complain" ; )

        • Gunnar on 04/11/2023 - 08:36

          That’s a really Good study, thanks!

  • p1 ama on 04/11/2023 - 00:00
    +23

    Good on you for having a positive attitude, and also good on your company for being thoughtful. Sometimes staffing needs change, but the least you can do for your employees is to give them a good redundancy package that can help them have the time and space to apply for new jobs. Sounds like you're happy, which is a good start.

    Not sure why you are considering becoming a real estate agent - it's not a particularly attractive career to be honest. Whilst I think sales commission jobs sound nice in theory, they're not as great as you think. Having a pay structure that's heavily slanted towards commissions are designed to pay employees less, and to make employees bear a lot of the market risks that employers traditionally bear. It's also not as meritocratic as you think. It's not the best and hardest working REAs who make the highest commissions.

    Reading your previous post (https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/516972), I think this is a good opportunity for you to step up into a role more suitable for you. Obviously not everyone is cut out for a top law firm, but there are plenty of positions (e.g. within government, or corporate counsel type roles) which you might find attractive and have the experience for now. There are also a lot of tangentially related positions which are not "legal" positions, but where your skills would be really useful - e.g. policy roles, roles in legal and regulatory teams for corporates…etc.

  • Hybroid on 04/11/2023 - 00:01
    +1

    There's got to be a stereotype joke in here going from Lawyer to Real Estate Agent…

  • Hardlyworkin on 04/11/2023 - 00:04
    +1

    No.

  • Kongzi on 04/11/2023 - 00:19
    -2

    Redundancy is normally offered for those who don't perform well 🤔

    • MS Paint on 04/11/2023 - 00:21
      +6

      OP admitted they were deadwood employee of the month for 12 months straight.

      personal performance

    • Hybroid on 04/11/2023 - 00:21
      +3

      Genuinely not necessarily. Lots of companies (or even just teams therein) undergo transformational change or downsizing based on workload/contracts and metrics.

      • Kongzi on 04/11/2023 - 00:40
        +1

        And the first to go are contractors, followed by casuals, then poor performers.

        • Hybroid on 04/11/2023 - 00:41
          +1

          Yep, you follow the big money first. Cutting 1 contractor could save 2 full time employees.

        • R4 on 06/11/2023 - 00:16

          Not always. I've only ever been a contractor in Australia and there's been occasions where I've been kept on and permanent staff have been sacked.

          • Kongzi on 06/11/2023 - 00:32

            @R4: You are the outlier. A good outlier

    • OzBarAnon on 05/11/2023 - 22:35

      Not going to disclose exactly where I work, but a couple of years ago, my company was restructuring (downsizing) and was offering opt-in redundancies.

    • spacemannn on 06/11/2023 - 00:04

      My entire team was made redundant due to a shift in strategy, bad decisions were made by management and they tried to fix it.

  • Almost Banned on 04/11/2023 - 00:29
    +3

    As a five year qualified lawyer you should be in pretty high demand.
    You are experienced enough to be useful, and not so experienced as to be demanding huge money.
    However, I can understand wanting to leave the profession.

    • coffeeinmyveins on 04/11/2023 - 13:27
      +1

      Quality over quantity.

      I've known people with over a decade of tenure in a profession and some that have two which where much more experienced.

      • Kangal on 06/11/2023 - 08:19
        +1

        It's saul good man…

  • hasher22 on 04/11/2023 - 00:30

    Jumping careers is fine if you feel you need to but you need to fully research the pay, time, education, experience and so on to make sure it's worth it for you in the long run, you don't want to regret switching then go back to being in law firm on where you left off.

    IMO, prob best to find a company that is more suited to you, finding a job is like dating, plenty out there but a few are a good match. Maybe you haven't found the right match?

    If you want all the revenue, start your own practice as a lawyer.

    My mate is a lawyer and she bills hundreds of thousands of dollars of billable hours per week but she's on a salary, I don't know why you think you should get a cut of those billable hours unless there's an agreement to get a percentage?

    • holdenmg on 04/11/2023 - 02:50

      I agree.

      If the agreement is to work on a matter for "X" Salary, then it also means you don't have to go look for clients, set up a firm, employ people.

      Real Estate would offer a minimal retainer, assume you get your own listings (and sales) and is performance (results) driven.

  • jv on 04/11/2023 - 00:55
    +5

    Pretty much sick of have a fixed salary with hardly any motivation to work hard

    So no motivation to keep your job?

  • avoidfullprice on 04/11/2023 - 05:32
    +2

    Have you discovered your own reward path? It is not clear what brings you motivation.

    I personally can’t connect your dots and arrive at “let’s do REA” instead. Is a bit random, but there could be more solid reasoning other than what you have shared.

    If it is not random, then you will able to rationally decide if you want to stay as lawyer but on different payment terms, or pick jobs which have deliverables based income, or focus on clientele engagement if thats your thing.

    If it is indeed a random thought on picking a commission based job and asking random what do they think, perhaps check in with your own personality and find out what is important to you first professionally.

  • Porker on 04/11/2023 - 06:09
    +1

    You've got a 3 year old child and mortgage to consider too. Many are not necessarily comfortable or happy with their jobs, but the motivation and/or reason to continue is more than self-satisfaction.

    Understand (yourself) why you didn't like the job and/or what prevented you from performing, as those road blocks may follow you to the next job.

    Presumably you're considering real estate as you feel they're paid for the work/sales they achieve, as opposed to your current fixed salary system? Or is it that your passion is with real estate?

    I have some appreciation of the 'billable' hours work model I assume the law form works under. I used to work for a private consulting firm and felt like I worked 3 times as hard as the next for the same pay.

    In hindsight, my motivation for working like that didn't suit me such that I resigned. I put all that extra work into starting my own consultancy firm which I operate along side my normal salary job.

    My point being is that see if you can use your current skills and strengths to your advantage rather than a (potential) reset. You'll also need to consider any time required for an industry change and what that'll mean to your family.

  • Kidaway on 04/11/2023 - 07:28

    Thank you guys for your input. It’s not a random thought of just wanting to venture straight to REA. But having been practicing in the property area of the law, I thought it would work well given that I know the property aspect of the transaction and the terms people negotiate.

    That said, given this “opportunity” that I have been let go with advance notice, I’m just thinking of either a career switch altogether (and not sure what kind of job would suit best though personally I’m more of a routine kind of person and I enjoy talking to people) or sticking to law in a local or mid tier firm and working my way up the corporate ladder (with ceiling of course).

    I reckon overtime I find myself being a person who is reward driven (compared to just sitting there and getting a decent salary with a promise of a promotion and probably more salary) with a drive of wanting to do more while I’m still young than regretting later in life as to why I spent X years doing something which would not make me more money.

    In short, I am at this crosspath of not knowing what I can do or want to do or just sticking to my old trade again for god knows how many years.

    Any practical example of friends moving from being a lawyer to something else? Would love to hear about it :)

    • barge-in hunter on 04/11/2023 - 07:54
      +1

      While this isn’t incentive based, I’ve worked with a few corporate in house legal teams - and they’ve enjoyed the work for the most part.

      Not setting billable hours is a bonus, but getting the chance to engage in the broader culture of a good company can make work far more tolerable. You do need to find a company with that good culture first though

    • SBOB on 04/11/2023 - 08:13

      reckon overtime I find myself being a person who is reward driven (compared to just sitting there and getting a decent salary with a promise of a promotion and probably more salary) with a drive of wanting to do more while I’m still young than regretting later in life as to why I spent X years doing something which would not make me more money.

      If you're actually good at your chosen profession, have a high drive for work delivery and resulting rewards,I fail to see how staying in law isn't the automatic choice.
      Get a fewmore years of quality experience under your belt, be the highest billing lawyer in your group and promotions and increases in salary (either within or by moving companies) will come.

      Align with like minded and similar high work output individuals and open your own practice once you have a decade or so of experience and start printing money (again, if you're actually very good at your job).

      Though none of this is valid if you arent actually very good at the career choice.

    • Protractor on 04/11/2023 - 10:50
      +1

      If you are really rewards based ,like talking to & helping ppl, take on a legal aid role.

    • p1 ama on 04/11/2023 - 12:50

      But having been practicing in the property area of the law, I thought it would work well given that I know the property aspect of the transaction and the terms people negotiate.

      I would have thought that something along the lines of conveyancing, or some local boutique firm that does property law specifically?

      I find myself being a person who is reward driven (compared to just sitting there and getting a decent salary with a promise of a promotion and probably more salary)

      The "promise of promotion" is the reward though. I feel like you're expecting that sales commission roles are this sort of utopia where everyone is paid based on their performance alone, and that could not be further away from the truth.

    • popcornready on 04/11/2023 - 18:47
      +3

      I don’t see how you are reward driven when (1) reward of keeping a job should be incentive and (2) you said you are more of “a routine” person. To unlock rewards in incentive based roles you won’t have a standard routine

  • WreckTangle on 04/11/2023 - 07:38
    +7

    Maybe train to be a nurse, cop, teacher or ambo. Something good for society and not a leach like a lawyer or real estate agent.

    • BeamMeUp on 04/11/2023 - 08:18
      +1

      Good suggestions, we need lots more good nurses, cops etc.

    • p1 ama on 04/11/2023 - 12:52
      +1

      Something good for society and not a leach like a lawyer or real estate agent.

      Why are lawyers a leach? The vast majority of legal work are just relatively boring things that make the world go round (much like any other job, really).

      Only a very, very small minority of lawyers are doing the very stereotypical "frivolous" work that most find a drain on society (which of course, is the only part that's sensationalised and put on TV).

      • WreckTangle on 04/11/2023 - 15:23
        +4

        I once watched a documentary about leeches being used in hospitals. I guess even leeches have a purpose sometimes.

  • BeamMeUp on 04/11/2023 - 08:15

    Second the in house legal counsel suggestion or maybe contracts management. I worked with a bunch over time in ICT and Science Industries and met a lot of really helpful colleagues. Target an industry you are interested in. A lot have employment contracts have an incentive component that works around company and individual performance.

  • Ozbar Gain on 04/11/2023 - 09:26

    Don't you like being called a legal eagle 🦅 😎

  • Protractor on 04/11/2023 - 09:59
    +3

    It seems your key motivation is $$$, given you want to jump from one Pariah status to the next.

    EDIT:How about legal adviser on Ozb. Just brush up on nuisance neighbours,uninsured cars, and multiple vehicle car crash conundrums.
    That's 90% of the business here.

  • Neoika on 04/11/2023 - 11:26

    Find another job that only need to work for one year and gives 3 mths redundancy payment. That's 25% increase to the work contract/agreement.

  • Protractor on 04/11/2023 - 12:10
    +1

    You could also become an immigrant and refugee lawyer.Going fwd you'll be run off your feet, and be able to set up a large business.

  • Ghost47 on 04/11/2023 - 14:46
    +4

    Did you defend criminals? If so REA would be a good fit.

    • Protractor on 04/11/2023 - 15:57
      +2

      Or NSW Liberal P{arty

      • gromit on 05/11/2023 - 23:49

        Or labor. Both are as corrupt as each other.

        • Protractor on 06/11/2023 - 09:42

          Corporate gangsters thrive on one side of politics in Straya. It aint Labor. They are amateur petty thieves compared to the LNP.

          • gromit on 06/11/2023 - 09:47

            @Protractor: both sides are corrupt, NSW Labor has a massive long track record of corruption and people prosecuted for it.

            • Protractor on 06/11/2023 - 10:00

              @gromit: Only one side has perfected in.It's a business model involving corporations and media and foreign superpowers.There's corruption on both sides sure, but that in no way equates to they are equal. One side(LNP) are 'gold standard.
              Ask Scomo and Glad

          • coffeeinmyveins on 06/11/2023 - 10:00

            @Protractor: Let's be honest dude, there are no innocents in politics. They're all as corrupt as each other, only interested in themselves and no-one else.

            • Protractor on 06/11/2023 - 10:01
              -1

              @coffeeinmyveins: No they are not as corrupt as each other. This is what the right always say. It's a lie.That's also skill they excel in.

              • gromit on 06/11/2023 - 10:07

                @Protractor: seriously dude you have rose coloured glasses on. both Labor and Liberal are corrupt to the core. To think otherwise is to be incredibly naive, especially given the decades of evidence for both, especially so in NSW.

                • Protractor on 06/11/2023 - 10:09
                  -1

                  @gromit: One side has corrupt individual (ALP) The LNP are Olympic athletes
                  Hiding money in a blind fund? Legal? Moral? Ethical? or Cute

  • sam-1966 on 04/11/2023 - 17:35

    You could take advantage of some of the state Education Departments to undertake training to become a teacher - Legal Studies is quite popular.

    Other alternatives could be getting a job at a bank or similar for now - think about becoming a REA and do the training on your own time while having an income.

  • ChillCrowie on 04/11/2023 - 21:28

    You can consider consultant, program / project manager. If you're a contractor, the pay does vary on the project that you work on.

  • Dollar General on 04/11/2023 - 21:39

    There’s a lady in Melbourne who’s a bad cook and needs a good lawyer now. Give it a crack

    • Protractor on 05/11/2023 - 11:26

      The way the media and social media is gossiping about the case she won't need a lawyer. They'll ditch the case based on 'can't find an un-compromised jury',or opt for judge only trial, which is a deal breaker, anyway.

  • Eeples on 05/11/2023 - 19:15

    OP, do you really think it’s time to get naked?

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0NJ5P8cRvNQ&pp=ygUYTGV0cyBnZXQ…

  • DrScavenger on 05/11/2023 - 20:57

    Depends on your former salary and future salary expectations

  • roundnumbersonly on 05/11/2023 - 21:54

    My dad was a real estate agent, he made decent coin - mainly in commercial real estate, but he was just never home, so worth keeping that in mind as you start out, especially if you have a young family.

    My sister did a stint with a fairly large re company and got burnt out within a month - had to make a certain number of cold calls each day, go out and visit potential clients, run the opens and pretty much be a slave to the lead agent. All while being told that if they didn't achieve something like 20 listings in the first month the y would be fired. Sounds pretty soul destroying to begin with, but im assuming it gets better after a few years.

  • LoserScott on 05/11/2023 - 23:54

    My Amazon package is lost also 😥 well best of luck on your future job search

  • ChunkyToast on 06/11/2023 - 21:49

    Real estate against are snakes but they make bank, so could work out.

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