My Son Was Not Successful in the Selective Entry Exam - What Can We Learn from This?

blitzzbargain on 08/09/2023 - 23:24
Last edited 12/09/2023 - 21:18

Hi All,

Initially, I was uncertain about whether I should write this post (as it might be controversial), but this is the only place where I can seek input from this wonderful community.
This discussion is merely to gauge what lessons were learned as retrospectives and share with others.

Background:
My son participated in this year's Victoria Selective School exam (Exam for Year 9). He had been diligently preparing for the past 9-10 months leading up to the exam, attending multiple tuition sessions, both at large, well-established tuition centers and private ones. Additionally, he devoted himself to studying beyond his school curriculum for about 2 months before the exam, completing numerous practice test papers. While the cost of these tuition sessions was substantial, I didn't mind spending the money on his education as long as it benefited him.

I want to clarify that I encouraged him to take the exam, but he was willing to do so of his own accord.
He had the potential to succeed, as he is considered an A+ student in his current school.

The results:
He performed exceptionally well on his mock-up exams, so we were quite confident that he would succeed. He performed very well in Reading, Mathematical Reasoning, and Quantitative Reasoning, categorising them as Top and Above Average, However, the actual results were very disappointing especially on the writing and verbal reasoning, well below expectations. He told me that he had the best sleep and was able to concentrate during the exam.

I am proud of what he has done, but I want to learn from this setback.
It is a very challenging experience.
How do I take this as a lesson learned? What went wrong? I doubt the department will revisit this case as it has been decided.

All suggestions are welcome.
Thank you for all the comments! Most of the comments are very supportive, encouraging, and enlightening. Please continue to do so.
I hope some of you will find this thread useful.
However, there are a small number of comments that have resorted to personal attacks on my son (e.g., not good enough, etc.). These comments do not reflect the Ozbargain community and the broader principles of humanity.

Education & Work Selective High School

Comments

        • Ghost47 on 09/09/2023 - 20:15

          I don’t think a lot of people understand my comments on these forums tbh, but yes if I was wrong somewhere would like to be corrected.

          • katykat on 10/09/2023 - 00:19
            +1

            @Ghost47: You weren't wrong and at all and I am very confused why the OP said you were spreading misinformation.

  • [Deactivated] on 09/09/2023 - 14:36
    +3

    I've usually found parents that put this much pressure on their kid over being perfect usually have unresolved feelings of inadequacy about their own lack of accomplishments, mediocrity or feelings of inadequacy. Every. Single. Time. May be best to work on your own issues first instead of living vicariously through your child's accomplishments.

    I've come across a lot of people that have straight up flunked uni and are successful earning 6-7 figure salaries. Conversely I know people that were school toppers and are carrying mental baggage due to pressure from helicopter parents preventing them from functioning as adults or reach their full potential. There's plenty of self help books booming on the market to help adults to undo the damage parents like you do, albeit your's isn't on the extreme end and leans towards being unintentional, but still damaging. I'd tread carefully. Luck and connections play a bigger part in how successful someone will be, more so than perfect grades or which school you went to. Especially in this country.

    • apu on 09/09/2023 - 16:05
      +3

      Totally agree with the first part of this comment.

      Wonder if the OP was as academically successful as he wants his son to be…. Would he appreciate the pressure put on him if the shoe was on the other foot?

    • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 16:32
      -1

      @le457 I am not sure where you made the assumption that I put pressure on my son. I think, before you provide comments, please read the explanation above. I have repeated myself over and over again.

      He was interested in taking the exam, and I supported him with all the resources that I have.
      I am proud of him and gave him a reward for his hardwork even before the results,

      Please do not make a big false assumption that can lead to damaging information. Thank you for your understanding. 🙏

      • [Deactivated] on 09/09/2023 - 17:18
        +6

        the actual results were very disappointing
        I am proud of what he has done, but I want to learn from this setback.
        It is a very painful experience.
        How do I take this as a lesson learned? What went wrong

        You keep saying you're proud yet this paragraph and your conversations across this tread seems to indicate the opposite along with your obsession over his performance. You also seem trying to convince yourself and others you're being somehow supportive and trying to 'learn' from this 'setback'. Defensive statements like 'Please do not make a big false assumption that can lead to damaging information' indicates your 'reputation' is more important. Another common trait from helicopter parents. If you really do care about your kid's wellbeing and not just his grades, Id encourage you to read some parenting books from experts over this type of helicopter parent behaviour over grades rather than looking for parenting advice from a bargain website of all places. This type of obsessiveness can hamper a kid's future more than grades, that much is well known.

        • Protractor on 09/09/2023 - 17:25
          +4

          Agree with this. It smacks of, not even recognising the risks being imposed on someone at the most vulnerable stage of life.

          OP needs to read the room,LISTEN and communicate with the son about big picture stuff. Not rely on the public galery.
          Talk to him, not about him

        • bobbified on 09/09/2023 - 19:02
          +4

          It is a very painful experience.

          The wife is now telling OP to get a better paying job so that he can for the kid's private school fees.

      • katykat on 09/09/2023 - 17:32
        +3

        Because you've alternately said that he performed really well in an exam but also described him as failing. You admit that he has undertaken extensive prep work and the whole reason for the post is to recover from this "setback" ie. failure by your son.

        Just because he's interested and keen does not mean you aren't also pressuring him. You can have both.

  • bobbified on 09/09/2023 - 15:14
    +2

    ….as he is considered an A+ student in his current school.

    I don't think anyone's said it yet, so I'll say it: A+ at school means nothing if the current school is populated by kids who are not too bright. It's all relative.
    (An average student in a class of lots of bright kids is likely doing better than a kid who's topping a class of not-so-bright kids).

    • Eeples on 09/09/2023 - 16:39
      +2

      Yeah, and to make matters worse OP has said son is not in an academically competitive or academically cooperative peer group.

    • Oz em on 09/09/2023 - 19:08

      The test is for a higher level than school.
      It averages around year 9 level for children who have just began year 6.
      It’s for very academically gifted children and requires much more than A grades in your year level at school.

      • katykat on 09/09/2023 - 19:48
        +1

        Just FYI he's talking about Victoria, which is Year 9 entry so tets taken in Year 8.

        I have no idea what Year level the test sets itself at though.

        • Oz em on 09/09/2023 - 20:08

          SA is for entry in year 7. (Ignite). I assumed Victoria was the same.

          • katykat on 09/09/2023 - 20:56
            +1

            @Oz em: Yeah I feel like Vic is a bit of an outlier in how things are handled!

    • yessum on 09/09/2023 - 23:20

      Highschool grades aren't bell curved or ranked until VCE. If he's getting A+ then it means his exam scores are high, not that he's better than his cohort. And OP hasn't said anything about him topping his class

  • BobCobb on 09/09/2023 - 15:16

    High risk post in the land of mediocrity.

    All the best to him.

  • Willy Beamish on 09/09/2023 - 16:52
    +1

    Everyone thinks their children are special.

    News flash, they ain't.

  • shaybisc on 09/09/2023 - 17:14
    +3

    I thought they didn't have selective high schools in Victoria.

    https://www.vic.gov.au/selective-entry-high-schools

    Oh, I see. Only 2 of them in Melbourne.One school for boys in a city of 5 million. No wonder he didn't get in. Only room for so many cram-schooled Asian kids. Move to NSW.

    • bmxr on 09/09/2023 - 19:37

      This comment is the truth.

      There are around 340 boys per year taken in at Melbourne High. Approximately 3,000 sit the selective test each year for the 4 selective schools in Victoria, only 1 boys school in Melbourne. 85% of enrolments at Melbourne High are via the selective schools test. That is a low chance of enrolment given almost every applicant would have been undertaking the same training and coaching as OPs son.

      OP, your son may be better off being in the top tier at their current school than being at the bottom in a selective school. Look at it as a positive.

  • Protractor on 09/09/2023 - 17:18
    +2

    Sorry but on reading most of the responses by OP, I can only conclude they actually have no idea.
    I feel sorry for the kid, and I don't even know him.
    Geez

    OP
    What does the son actually WANT to do?
    Not what do YOU want him to do.
    What feeds his 'soul'.

    • [Deactivated] on 09/09/2023 - 17:58

      The miracle will happen

  • capslock janitor on 09/09/2023 - 17:30

    What's the career/field youse going for?

  • exit on 09/09/2023 - 17:45
    +4

    I didn’t get into a selective school (rank ~90 public school, and yes I did do prep for them) but got a 99+ ATAR, and my uni grades and career blow the vast majority of Melb High graduates in my course (the school I’m assuming you are talking about) out of the water. Who cares?

  • [Deactivated] on 09/09/2023 - 17:55
    +1

    Remember that there is always an opportunity
    in every failure.

  • MS Paint on 09/09/2023 - 18:03

    I just looked up the Victorian schools out of curiosity.

    Was macrobertson's always a selective school? I used to hang around with girls from there in the early 90's and I don't recall them being particularly academic.

    • bobbified on 09/09/2023 - 18:35
      +3

      All the smart ones must've known to stay away…. 😋

      • MS Paint on 09/09/2023 - 18:54
        +1

        That makes sense. Cheers

    • lainey13 on 12/09/2023 - 21:40
      +1

      Since the 80s at the very least. Back in the day MHS and Mac.Rob ran their own tests.

  • congo on 09/09/2023 - 18:28

    How many spots for Selective? How many participants?
    I recall NSW has more Selective schools/positions than Vic.
    I assume only the top 1% get a place?

    It's very competitive. Nothing wrong with not being in the top 1%.
    This is Australia, plenty of opportunities.
    Send him to a good private school that is within your budget and distance.

    Lesson learn: Maybe start tutoring him earlier? 10+ months isn't a lot for Selective training.

  • deme on 09/09/2023 - 18:52
    +2

    Title: How Can We Learn from This?
    Post: How do I take this as a lesson learned?

    OP get over yourself, I got into a selective school without studying. I didn't go because it was further away and meant I'd miss friends.

    The way that an ATAR is calculated you are best being a big fish in a small pond anyway.
    But who cares:
    Just do this https://www.vu.edu.au/study-at-vu/how-to-apply/special-admis… (I did the equivalent for my NSW uni) and then your kid can relax.

    I had zero stress during the HSC because the only requirement was that I sat the exam.

    Just go take him to do something he enjoys, you are only a kid once.

  • congo on 09/09/2023 - 18:56

    @blitzzbargain you should post these kind of questions on Facebook Selective forums, you will get better feedback.
    It's a tough crowd here.

    • Look Up on 09/09/2023 - 21:35
      +1

      It's a tough crowd here.

      No

      OP is not an idiot - he is deliberately seeking input "from this wonderful community" (his words)

      It is good to see that most of the OzBargain crowd who responded are still based on reality and not giving out soft advice for fear of hurting feelings

      As much as OP tries to cloak this thread as some type of collaborative group therapy, it is not

      He is being called out, personally challenged and rightly so

      Whether OP chooses to swallow his pride and accept the golden advice is up to him

      Whether he helps or hinders the future development of his son is also up to him

      The most positive part of this thread is that OP does mean well - a father posting about their son to a public forum on a Friday night at 11:30pm is a noble thing

      • congo on 09/09/2023 - 21:57

        I never said that the Op was an idiot, don't put words in my mouth :-)

        Different cultures have different values and different ways to skin a cat.
        The best way is to listen and be open minded, take it all in and make the decisions for yourself and your family.

        Many folks here are fixed in their mindset that believe that their way of thinking is the "reality", but they don't understand that their reality is different for other's people reality.
        You can give your advise, but that doesn't mean that it is the best advise for everyone.
        "It may work for you, but that doesn't mean it would work for everyone".

        There has been many advise here that is just plain incorrect.
        They state their beliefs as "facts", or show one example and state that is fact for everyone, but clearly they are not facts, but simply their opinion.

        • MS Paint on 09/09/2023 - 22:11

          Advice - just sayin'

          • congo on 09/09/2023 - 22:12
            +1

            @MS Paint: Thanks, you can tell that I didn't use ChatGPT to write my reponses :-)

  • Oz em on 09/09/2023 - 19:06

    My daughter took the same test. She’s gifted and she threw the test because she didn’t enjoy studying for the test. It was hard and we should have done it over a few years not a few months.
    She was offered a spot in the school anyway. She declined and is now going to go to a non-academic alternate school.

    • Eeples on 09/09/2023 - 22:21
      +2

      She threw the test… so didn’t answer correctly… yet still got in ?

      Really?

      So she failed at throwing the test. Doesn’t sound too gifted.

      Judge Judy: if it doesn’t make sense then it isn’t true.

      • Oz em on 09/09/2023 - 22:48

        She got in as an out of zone applicant. But she declined.

        • Eeples on 09/09/2023 - 23:44
          +1

          “Specialist schools do not have a school zone for enrolment purposes.”

          One of us clearly doesn’t know what the hell they are talking about.

          EDIT: OP is in Victoria. (If you are in SA, yes, that really is out of zone).

          • Oz em on 10/09/2023 - 00:18

            @Eeples: Some demographics do have the option of out of zone placements in any school.
            But yes Victoria must be different to SA. I assumed it was also the ignite test as our study guide was the Victorian selective school study guide.

            My point was that the pressure is huge and she has opted out. It’s not the end of the world and she will still do well wherever she goes to school.

            Maybe ops child threw the test too. If he did so well in practice exams he may have also hated the amount of study required and decided it’s not for him.

  • cookie2 on 09/09/2023 - 19:13

    Is it possible that the mock testing wasn't inline with the actual exam difficulty and subject areas? Did your son feel like he performed well in the exam and was surprised afterwards, as if that's the case then I'd tell you that he should have some self reflection to be aware of himself more. Normally when you do bad at something, you tend to know. Good on him for giving it a go tho.

    • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 21:42

      Thanks for the comment.

      He mentioned that he performed very well in the real test. He consistently ranked in the top range in all areas during mock exams and completed 100 practice papers. This performance was also evident in his actual results for Math Reasoning, Quantitative Reasoning, and Reading.

      What surprised us, however, was his performance in the essay section. He received an average score, which unfortunately wasn't enough to secure a place. He mentioned that he did well in his essay and provided all his best ideas. This has left me puzzled, and I'm not sure what could have gone wrong.

      • congo on 09/09/2023 - 22:14

        Did you get an actual score for each subject?
        In NSW, they only give you a band, not an actual score, so it is not transparent, and hard to figure out exactly where he went wrong.

        • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 22:51

          Unfortunately, they do not provide scores for each subject, only bands.
          I am very keen to know what was happening with the essays… as it might be very subjective :(

          • congo on 09/09/2023 - 23:10

            @blitzzbargain: Same as NSW then.
            What is the appeal process? Ask them to get a second opinion on the essay. No harm in asking.

          • locosam on 10/09/2023 - 03:02

            @blitzzbargain: Its like what others have said.
            The external classes and tuitions given for writing have a certain 'flavour'.
            Whilst technically competent, theyre usually copy cutter formats and layouts.

            Now imagine you're a marker and you've read a 100 similar responses, why would they mark your son's any higher than the hundreds of others that have gone to the same tuition and have the same arguments.

            Maybe rather than assume its 'very subjective', the lesson to learn is that it just wasnt good enough currently and that maybe tuition for that subject is not effective.

  • idonotknowwhy on 09/09/2023 - 19:29
    +1

    Read up on "Growth Mindset" before you do any more damage to your boy.

  • kaleidoscope on 09/09/2023 - 20:37
    +1

    attending multiple tuition sessions, both at large, well-established tuition centers and private ones. Additionally, he devoted himself to studying beyond his school curriculum for about 2 months before the exam, completing numerous practice test papers.

    OP, you keep telling you didn’t put pressure on your kid but your own post says otherwise. You may have not asked or put pressure on him directly, but sending him to these so called best places and private tuitions and probably by talking about it (i.e hey son, you’re with the best etc etc) you have set your expectations so damn high.

    This is not some south east asian country where the grade 9 or 11 selective exam is a make or break point of a student’s entire life’s success. There are so much opportunities here and take that to your advantage. Be glad your son passed the exam with really good score and I’m sure great things await him in future and all you got to do is be supportive of whatever result or outcome there is.

    Good luck.

    • [Deactivated] on 10/09/2023 - 16:18
      +1

      This is not some south east asian country where the grade 9 or 11 selective exam is a make or break point of a student’s entire life’s success.

      Hit the nail on the head.
      I've sat in on countless interviews in current and previous jobs. More than often I've seen people get rejected for personality quirks that get embedded from this style of parenting making them fail culture fit or communication ability checks. People that on paper were toppers and had an array of academic awards. The only exception is in fields that have extreme shortages (shortages because no one wants to deal with the stress of these jobs to begin with).

      What op has described is the type of life a kid is expected to go through in countries like Japan.

  • ChatCPT on 09/09/2023 - 20:54
    +10

    Feel so sorry for this kid. I bet they actually think they’re great parents.

    What a horrible father. Someone definitely failed and it was not the kid!

  • ef7411 on 09/09/2023 - 21:09
    +1

    I didn't make OC placement, nor selective school placement in NSW and my parents spent a lot of money on private tutoring for 2 years to prepare me. I was a bright student, but ultimately when it came to these sort of tests and exams, I did poorly. My Atar wasn't anything amazing either, but I've come out the other end and about to graduate uni with a distinction average in a few months. This isn't the end, and your exam marks do not define who you are. Some people put too much emphasis on the importance of passing these exams, but in reality, it's not that important, nor is it the end of the world if you do not pass.

  • MS Paint on 09/09/2023 - 21:16
    +2

    Hey Op

    Everything will be ok in the end.

    If it's not ok, it's not the end.

  • centrelink on 09/09/2023 - 21:18

    Don't they exam/test always throw those out of place questions to differentiate those who are flow charty to those who are able to come up with an answer by themselves?

  • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 21:34
    -2

    I was surprised to see some people think that when a child works very hard for their own motivation, it implies they are being pushed by their parents. I'm not sure if this is a stereotype or simply a narrow-minded perspective!

    • MS Paint on 09/09/2023 - 21:41
      +5

      I think the biggest issue here is that you feel your son failed. I'm guessing he passed very well but just not as good as others.

      Be proud that he put in the hard work and had a crack.

    • Look Up on 09/09/2023 - 21:42
      +2

      At the end of the day, he is your kid and you will guide him based on what you feel is best

      If you solicit feedback from any type of "wonderful community", you should expect to receive responses that differ to what you believe

      If you judge those perspectives as "narrow-minded", how broad is your own perspective to make that judgement?

      Request the mods to close this thread on your behalf because you have already received everything productive to advance yourself and your son

      • [Deactivated] on 09/09/2023 - 21:45

        You're scary

        • Look Up on 09/09/2023 - 21:53
          +1

          Not as scary as a well meaning but stubborn parent who on the surface is asking for advice on a public forum, but in reality is seeking confirmation for their parenting style from strangers on Australia's #1 bargain website

          • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 22:00
            +2

            @Look Up: I suggest that if this discussion doesn't serve you well, you can simply ignore it. For some reason, it seems like you felt this discussion wasn't a good fit for you from the start, yet you continued to get involved (I'm not sure why).

            I'm confident that some people will benefit from this discussion.

            • icanconfirm on 09/09/2023 - 22:36

              @blitzzbargain: I am not providing any opinion upon parenting styles. I am typing that to ensure that I am not seen as siding with anyone on that matter

              But what I wanted to highlight, and what I thought worth juxtaposing was these responses. One which is judgemental and hostile. Another that is controlled. That's a good trait- teach it to your child

          • icanconfirm on 09/09/2023 - 22:03

            @Look Up: Tell me what's scary about that

          • [Deactivated] on 09/09/2023 - 22:25

            @Look Up: Yikes - now you remind me of me ~12 months ago.

            You machines should have your own forum

      • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 21:50
        +2

        I don't think you quite got the point. There are a small number of comments that reflect this idea, but I'm not generalizing it to the entire community.

        What puzzles me is that I have repeatedly mentioned that he wanted to attend the selective school, and I wholeheartedly support whatever he wants to do. So there's no pressure from me whatsoever.

        This discussion is simply to find out if anyone else has had similar experiences and whether they can share the lessons learned. I hope this clarifies the matter and helps you better understand the situation.

        I am 100% sure that this discussion will benefit some people who may consider taking a similar path so it's valuable to keep this discussion open. If you don't find it beneficial, that's perfectly fine too. Thanks.

        • icanconfirm on 09/09/2023 - 22:11

          I can only provide my experience reading this thread- I think that there has been a lot of useful information, reassurance and advice/viewpoints offered in this thread that is worth reflecting upon. Some of the advice may not work for you or your family. That's your discretion, not any one elses. I think you are coming from a good place

          • congo on 09/09/2023 - 22:18

            @icanconfirm: Exactly,

            Some of the advice may not work for you or your family

            The above are "viewpoints" not facts.
            If the Op doesn't agree with some of the comments here, it doesn't mean he is a bad parent.

            Different cultures have different beliefs, don't enforce your beliefs onto others, and don't say that the Op is an awful parent because he doesn't believe in your beliefs.

        • Juice-Wa on 11/09/2023 - 09:10
          +2

          So there's no pressure from me whatsoever.

          Now compare that with his own previous post:

          …I encourage him to study to get a place in a high achiever/accelerated class as I am not able to send him to a private school.
          In my opinion, he can get a place, but he needs to work very hard for it.

          This dude has convinced himself it's all on his son's desire and has no pressure applied from himself. You need to seriously self evaluate…

    • CalmLemons on 10/09/2023 - 22:55

      I believe people are more so picking on your phrasing and the overal picture it gave.

      I believe whatever you say now you'll find you won't get the best response, as it's now crowd behaviour.

      It does appear you may not be too switched on with the nuances, but you do mean well.

      Alas, welcome to the internet, friend.

      Meet Troll 1, and Troll 2 and …

  • Kelsy on 09/09/2023 - 21:45
    +2

    Based on my current work with the sections that you and your son is disappointed with, here are some of the tips that we find that many can benefit when taking such tests…
    1) Writing Tests - especially with kids taking external essay coaching and tuition. Many came with the mindset to practically write an entire memorised essay which is completely irrelevant to the essay question. Or even to rewrite a recognisable storybook. Many students have high writing calibre but unable to portray their true writing potentials on the test day too. The essay pieces (narrative and persuasive) needs authentic and a good reflection of their writing ability.
    2) Verbal reasoning questions require the student to draw inferences from the passage, this is often a weakness when the student is not well read or unable to “see beyond the picture” and draw conclusions.
    The rest of the sections, well done! Glad to see the level of achievements and the hard work that you and your son have put in.
    There are many other avenues in and alternative pathways in education whether in Private or selective schools. It’s also good to understand your kid’s strength (eg. Maths), and how to path towards his career dreams. All the best!

    • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 21:55

      Thank you for your constructive comments.
      Just for your information, he typically doesn't have any issues with his essays, so it's a bit of a mystery what happened on that particular day!

      • Eeples on 09/09/2023 - 22:25

        No. He does have an issue with essays as evidenced by his relative failure.

        • bennos on 10/09/2023 - 14:05
          +2

          Yep, can't see the forest for the trees.

          Son forced to study (trying to please family, so he wants to), son is genius. No, son is rote learning but has no real social skills or social interactions to form arguments based on his own opinion.

          Just another robot

      • leiiv on 10/09/2023 - 00:31

        Essays are very subjective as opposed to math where 1+1=2 is always true. I assume that the test is not only about spelling or grammatical correctness. Coming up with something within a very short time limit is very hard.
        Have you tried to compare his essays to other people's?

        • TheJoker on 10/09/2023 - 23:09

          0.1+0.2 is not 0.3 though!

  • Drakesy on 09/09/2023 - 22:37
    +9

    Ngl this has asian parent written all over it

    • kaleidoscope on 09/09/2023 - 23:45
      +1

      most likely. I’m from that part of the world as well and this is the same exact picture I see about 99% of the people I know follow… One of my mate’s kids is only 7-8 years of age and the kid is put through 5 days of tutoring/ kumone, weekend sports activities and shit. I was like wth …

      • TheJoker on 10/09/2023 - 23:12

        Lol, I've said no homework at our house (unless they want to do it). Kid's at school 6 hours per day, don't try and force that crap into home time!

        • Drakesy on 11/09/2023 - 11:17

          Homework i feel is a different kettle of fish.

          Homework is set by the school and i'd consider mandatory.
          Extracurricular study such as Kumon/northshore/tutoring should be thrown aside.

    • ChatCPT on 10/09/2023 - 13:23

      1000% ASIAN

    • LKJ899 on 12/09/2023 - 10:39
      +1

      either asian or indian

    • mandelbrot on 12/09/2023 - 11:45

      Def Asian. OP had a separate post a few years ago about taking shoes off when entering a house.

  • jaimex2 on 09/09/2023 - 22:44
    +3

    A good learning opportunity for dealing with failure and getting back up and moving on.

    You succeed in life by how you pivot and adapt after failure, not by what school you go to.

    Will your son learn the lesson of true grit?

  • RedDevil860 on 09/09/2023 - 22:48
    +5

    How about lower your expectations… hate to be that kid growing up.

  • labyrinthinecities on 09/09/2023 - 22:59
    +13

    Hi OP - my parents put me through intensive tutoring and told me that if I didn't get into the select entry school, they'd send me to the local government school and the only thing I'd end up being in life was a garbage collector. I got in, and my cousin who attended the same first highschool as me, who went to the same tutoring classes, didn't. Fastforward more than 10 years and my cousin is a dentist and I'm a university dropout with multiple suicide attempts under my belt because highschool gave me treatment resistant depression and a generalised anxiety disorder. (I'm mostly alright nowadays.)

    How do you take this as a lesson learned? Well first, if you haven't already, go tell your son you're proud of him and the effort that he put in, and that the exam and school isn't everything. Then move on. There are plenty of paths to success, and just because one potential route (which isn't even guarenteed) is closed, doesn't mean there's no other paths. If your son is as smart as you say, then he'll do fine. A sense of enjoyment in learning, emotional resiliency, and an internal sense of self-esteem are far more important than any exam score or highschool environment. Others will have better advice about highschools and the like.

    Also? A good chunk of my friendship group (the nerd group) at my first highschool got into the same uni or other G8 unis. I also have plenty of examples of year mates from the select entry school who aren't where they saw themselves being at time of graduation.

    • blitzzbargain on 09/09/2023 - 23:20
      -1

      Thank you for sharing your experience. I am also sorry to hear what you have gone through.

      Indeed, I have told him that I am so proud of him, and his effort is very commendable. He is very motivated on his own accord, so I support him all the way.

    • Oz em on 10/09/2023 - 00:23
      +2

      I hear this so much, the pressure is huge. This is entirely why I let my child opt out and didn’t push her into attending. Mental health is more important and there are other ways to get into the uni course you want. I’m sure your parents did what they thought was the best and wanted you to have a great life.

  • Y2K1 on 09/09/2023 - 23:03
    -4

    This is what ChatGPT says(edited):
    I'm sorry to hear that your son's results in the Victoria Selective School exam were disappointing, and I understand your concerns. It's important to remember that standardized tests can be unpredictable, and sometimes, despite diligent preparation, results may not reflect a student's true abilities. Here are some suggestions on how to approach this as a learning experience and how to support your son moving forward:

    Positive Reinforcement: First and foremost, reassure your son that his efforts and hard work were not in vain. Acknowledge his dedication and encourage him to keep striving for academic excellence. Ensure he knows that standardized test results don't define his worth or potential.

    Open Communication: Have an open and empathetic conversation with your son about his feelings regarding the results. Understand his perspective on what may have gone wrong or how he felt during the test. Encourage him to express his emotions and concerns.

    Analyze the Results: Review the test results and analyze which specific areas (writing and verbal reasoning) need improvement. Understanding the weaknesses can help you tailor your approach moving forward.

    Feedback and Evaluation: If possible, try to obtain feedback on your son's test performance. Some educational institutions provide feedback on areas of improvement. This feedback can be valuable in identifying specific areas to work on.

    Adjust Study Strategies: If your son plans to retake the exam or continue his education, consider adjusting the study strategies. Focus on the areas that need improvement while maintaining strengths.

    Emphasize Well-Rounded Development: While academic excellence is important, remember that a well-rounded development includes other skills like critical thinking, communication, and emotional intelligence. Encourage your son to participate in extracurricular activities or hobbies that foster these skills.

    Manage Expectations: Help your son understand that standardized tests are only one aspect of his educational journey. Keep realistic expectations and emphasize the importance of personal growth and learning over test scores.

    Encourage Resilience: Teach your son about the importance of resilience in the face of setbacks. Life is full of challenges, and how we respond to them can be a valuable life lesson.

    Stay Involved and Supportive: Continue to be involved in your son's education and provide emotional support. Your belief in his abilities and your encouragement can make a significant difference in his academic journey.

    Remember that one setback does not define your son's future success. Many successful individuals have faced similar challenges and setbacks on their paths to achievement. By approaching this experience as a learning opportunity and offering your unwavering support, you can help your son grow and develop resilience for future challenges.

    It's important for your family to collectively move past this rather than your son alone. Consider taking a well-deserved family vacation to help put this experience behind you. In the grand scheme of things, what happened will likely become insignificant in a few years.

    • UNO on 10/09/2023 - 21:03

      Should have asked Bard.

  • leiiv on 10/09/2023 - 00:22

    How do I take this as a lesson learned?

    Do not spend too much time or money on something that has very small chances to success.

    What went wrong?

    Expectation and luck. Mock/practice test is obviously different than the real one. Maybe the mocks that he had done were not difficult enough or not properly simulating the right ones. And there are tricks to learn for every test to make it easier to tackle. Maybe he did not learn the right tricks. It is also likely that writing is his weak point. Not everyone is good at writing.

  • maverickjohn on 10/09/2023 - 05:48

    I'm not sure what your goal for your son is or what his goal is. But let me just say.. if it's something like medicine. He would have had to sit Umat and pas that still which is a logic based exam.
    Studying hard in school can't prep you for the UMAT.
    If he wants to do medicine and do a post grad pathway he will have to sit GAMSAT which also requires a different level of tuition and training.
    The selective school will contribute slightly due to scaling but his grades and preparing portfolios have higher importance. Networking with unis and finding out how to support students in admission into courses would probably reap more benefits than relying on a school to scale your son's mark. Keep his tuition and grades up as there are far more pivotal points in his journey than going to a selective school.

  • Daddy Chill on 10/09/2023 - 06:26
    -1

    This reminds me of my son. I spent over 100K on him so I can make him the best soccer player. Went to coerver coaching, clinics, trips to Japan, Croatia then he turns 18 and wanted to quit soccer. Now he works night fill at Woolies

    • Juice-Wa on 11/09/2023 - 09:15

      Surely this is a troll comment because that's a hilarious story hahaha

  • kyle on 10/09/2023 - 07:29

    When you write that most people here have been supportive, it seems to me that you're refusing to admit that those dishing out criticism could be correct.

    You mentioned you haven't expressed your disappointment. Not even through body language subconsciously? Have you expressed disappointment previously when he didn't get A+?

    The lesson to be learned is, failing to get in is not the end of the world. Things don't always go to plan, just like in life outside of study.

  • bigbadboogieman on 10/09/2023 - 08:20
    +2

    Mate, you need to help your kid learn to accept failure in life. You probably need to learn this lesson too. That is the biggest learning from all of this. The second learning is Pivoting in life. Real life is full of failures big and small. Two lifeskills that help anyone succeed is learning to accept a failure gracefully and pivoting to achieve your objectives through other means. As I understand, your objective is a successful career for your kid. How can you achieve that now that selective schools are not an option?

    • blitzzbargain on 10/09/2023 - 09:08
      +1

      Thank you for your comment.
      Yes, we accept the failure and move on.
      Part of the retrospective process, this discussion is to share the journey and learn from this experience. Also, it would be good if people could share a similar journey.

      He will continue with the current school if he decides to do next year's selective entry, I will support him as well with all the resources that I have.
      It is up to him what he wants to do next.

      On a side note (if I may say), I don't spend my money on myself, very rarely. Even though I have enough money to spend on it. I put all aside for my family. Maybe I put aside just $150 for myself a month, the rest of my money will go to the family. So when my family needs something I have enough resources to support that.

      Thanks again.

      • bigbadboogieman on 10/09/2023 - 10:37
        +1

        Don't beat yourself up too much. Keeping a little money aside for yourself is good but be sure to spend it on yourself too. I don't have a kid but I can share my life journey. I am a gold medalist in my "eventual" field of study but these medals don't mean anything to me except a good story to tell.

        I used to be a good student in early years until later in school when I tanked my grades. I lost all interest in studies. By the time I was in high school I was failing classes. I never went to any special schools or special courses. I just didn't see the value of classes I was being taught. I dropped out for a little while and started working odd jobs. Did those jobs for 2+ years before realising the error of my ways. It was a hard life and despite of doing so much hardwork, I had no degree or paper to get me into the door for a better paying job, no way to progress in life. I had 0-zero self-worth at this point in my life. I remember standing in front of a mirror and asking if I would pay anything to buy myself (or hire myself in a less crude context) and the answer was a No. Very dark place to be in life if you ask me.

        I went back to school just for the sake of completing it so I could move on to greater things (2 added years to complete high school). I knew trade skills were not for me because it didn't interest me and therefore was really hard work for me.

        Struggled afterwards to find my interest. Eventually after trying a whole bunch of stuff (art schools, internships, working at stores/servos, etc.), landed accountantancy studies at the insistence of one of my siblings. To my surprise I found this very interesting because it involved keeping track of money and transparency. I loved money 😂 (no surprise here as this is OzB). I found that I was studying accountancy not to pass exams but I was genuinely interested. This added to my happiness. Exams never stressed me out in most topics around accountancy however there were parts of it where I lacked interest and therefore struggled because everything in life comes as a bag of positives + negatives. I earned a few medals in the process although funny enough I was never competing for them. These medals came out of no where and just prove a point that where there is interest, passing exams and achievements don't matter. The greater achievement is to find something that adds meaning and self-worth to life.

        May be selective school is not the way to go and your kid is telling you this indirectly. Observe which area of study lights up their face. The topic which lights him up is the one he wants to focus on, not the whole damn universe.

        • blitzzbargain on 10/09/2023 - 20:20

          Thank you for sharing your story; it's very inspiring.

          I'm a family man, and everything I do, I do for them. I never force them into anything, but I encourage them when they want to pursue worthwhile endeavors. I always tell them, that as long as it's legal and they have a genuine interest in it, they should go for it.

  • syousef on 10/09/2023 - 08:23
    +3

    Your son is better off as a big fish in a little pond, than a little fish in a big pond anyway. i.e. He's going to have a better chance thrive as one of the best students in his school instead of being one of the least gifted in a school where it's all about who is topping the class.

    As for what happened, there's nothing to understand. Entrance exams have always been about how someone does on the day, and that doesn't always meet potential. If he's as academically gifted as you say he simply had a bad day and didn't do well. If he's not as academically gifted as you think, it's possible that exam prep companies etc. if you used them took advantage of you and propped up your child in order to charge you more money to train him.

    In terms of opportunities, you missed the opportunity to pay very high school fees and his marks may be a few percent shy of what he would have gotten at the other school, potentially with a lot of effort and even maybe burning out. School then university aren't the golden path they once were unfortunately and the thinking of this generation doesn't translate well when a good education now involves a lot of debt and competition that means a child might not recoup those expenses in adulthood.

    I attended a public talk by Nobel prize winner Professor Brian Schmidt shortly before Covid hit and he had some things to say about what predicts and secures success. You can read about him here
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Schmidt
    I'll paraphrase what he said In his talk to the best of my recollection: He said almost didn't get to do the research that brought him the Nobel prize and if a particular set of funding wasn't secured he was going to leave academia, in part to support his wife who was also an academic. He said he was fine with that because he had enjoyed doing his PhD and the work he had done so far, and knew that whatever he did next he'd put in the same effort to succeed. He further said that the students that do best aren't the ones that are hyperfocused on one goal and then end up in crisis when they don't achieve it, and that he was proud that many of his students were all in very high demand regardless of what they chose to do. The students that do best are the ones that put all their effort into the opportunities they get instead of being lost when things don't go their way.

    You can't change the results he achieved. You need to accept it and move on. What I suggest is that you find and present opportunities for your son - not just academic entranace exams! Teach him to be tenacious and resilient, and to find his own way in the world so that he's happy with what he becomes. I'd suggest also that you set a good example for your son, which I'm sorry to say I don't think you've done in this thread. Look for activities like STEM, art and sports camps and after school activities he might actually enjoy alongside his studies. Employers actually look at what else you're doing with your life these days. If there's an advanced study program or accelerated classes within the school you can look at them, but they shouldn't be the only thing you're looking at.

    You asked what you should learn from it - THIS is what I think you need to learn from it. As a parent of teens that's still learning myself I sincerely hope you take this on board and that it's helpful.

    • blitzzbargain on 10/09/2023 - 08:47
      +1

      Thank you so much for your great and supportive advice.

      I have commended his tremendous motivation and effort, and I support him all the way. When he asked me, "Can I have this tuition to help with the test?" I said, "Yes, whatever you need." So, it is abundantly clear that there is no pushing, forcing, or any of the misconceptions that some people may have.

      He also actively engages in other extracurricular activities and holds leadership roles at school, making him a well-rounded individual. Additionally, he spends time playing games for a few hours a day and socializing with his friends online, striking a balance in his life.

      Unfortunately, a small number of individuals in this community persistently post judgmental or negative comments, wrongly assuming that I forced him to study and take the test, labeling me as a terrible father, and suggesting I should leave the child alone, despite my repeated explanations, it is not the case.

      We have now concluded this chapter of his journey. As I mentioned earlier, I initiated this discussion to share our experiences and learn from them, as well as to hear about the experiences of others like yourself.

      Most importantly, if this discussion proves useful to people on a similar journey, that would be great!

      • syousef on 10/09/2023 - 09:51
        +1

        Some stuff you can look into now:

        • Advanced or accelerated classes at their non-selective school.
        • Our highschool runs a program where kids in feeder schools and the highschool could submit proposals for personal projects they could take on, document and present on. My kids did Roblox games and a HTML/CSS choose your own adventure style book. If your school doesn't run something like this you can spend some time together on the weekend and do it yourself.
        • STEM holiday programs. Lots of them are free or cheap compared to a selective school. Coding, space science. Depends on what's available where you live.
        • Academic competitions - ICAS, inter-school science, math, geography and history competitions in highschool.
        • School programs activities - debating and various competitions. Get him involved in being a library monitor, standing for SRC etc. More opportunities will come up in highschool but it is best to get involved early.
        • Public talks. In Sydney we have Sydney Ideas. Look into what's available where you live.
        • Create a family web site or chat server and post educational videos. Lots of stuff on Youtube. If he's curious or interested he doesn't have to wait until something is covered in school to learn about it.
        • Get him into a sport - Soccer, football, tennis, athletics, gymnastics.
        • Creative classes - Music, theatre.

        Make sure he's interested and motivated. If he's not switch to something else. His academic life and opportunity to excel certainly isn't over. Lots you can do to help him flourish.

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