Best Used/Refurbished Coffee Machine?

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  Kangarookiddd on 07/07/2023 - 11:30

  +2

  Gaggia classic

• 

  Banj0 on 07/07/2023 - 12:03

  +4

  The Gaggia and Rancilio are your entry to 'commercial' type build. They are pretty much mechanical, and you won't find an electronic circuit board in either. You will need to learn these machines and hone your barista skills to get the most out of them, but they both have the potential to produce a better shot than a truly automatic machine can (well, excepting the commercial machines, which still have to be dialled in for the roast being used).

  If price were equal, I would go with the Rancilio unless size or looks are a deciding factor. The Rancilio has a slightly bigger footprint, and personally I find the Gaggia to be the better looking of the two!

  In reality, there have been some brilliant brand new prices on the Gaggia lately, so it's difficult to recommend the Rancilio in the face of that competition unless you find a nice used one.

  I think the Rancilio will give better thermal stability, as it packs a bit more metal into the group head and boiler (vs the tiny aluminium boiler on the Gaggia). Also has much more capacity in the boiler (in the scheme of things though, neither is massive). All this does mean the Rancilio needs more heating time, but it remains hot for longer than the Gaggia.

  Machines like the Breville will make pouring an espresso much easier because of the higher level of automation. Also they have one of the cheapest dual boilers on the market. Inside though, you will find electronics (vs simple electrical design) and a lot more plastic than the Rancilio or Gaggia. At some point (hopefully far in the future) it will become 'uneconomic' to repair and will end up in landfill.

  I'm thinking 'throw away society' stuff might be one of your big concerns here, as it is mine too. My finance minister approved the purchase of a Rancilio Silvia a few years back for that very reason, and I've really enjoyed using it. I'm sure it will need repairs in future, but I expect to be able to source parts for it for decades to come. There were no Gaggias available under $400 then like there have been lately though - my decision making was based on around $700 for the Gaggia vs ~$1k for a new Rancilio. A used Rancilio can be had cheaper of course, but watch out for the frames - they only started using stainless for these in the latest model, and previous versions had iron (rust!!).

  • 

    realaaa on 07/07/2023 - 12:30

    aye aye, still have my 10+ years old Gaggia Classic - did not even maintain it all that much, still works ! a bit of rust on the corners of the metal enclosing yes

  • 

    Glenningvalley on 07/07/2023 - 12:32

    i'm seeing a fee Silvia's pop up on FB - what do you think the going price for v1/2 (15 year old + models) V the newer gen models - assuming no rust and well looked after etc?

    • 

      Banj0 on 07/07/2023 - 15:31

      +1

      I’ve not really been watching the market much. Aside from the frame, try to get an idea of what their maintenance has been like. All parts can be replaced, but the boiler will probably be the most expensive component at around $300 (and you would need to be comfortable fitting, or fork out more for a professional to do so). I think frames are available, and much cheaper than a boiler.

      I would have been happy to pay under $700 for a really nice one when I bought ours. If it was a bit older maybe $500. At $300 you’re talking a deal, as it gives you buffer to replace even the boiler if you need to, and remain well under the price of a new machine.

      Broken machines can be had for ~$100 if you're feeling handy.

      What price does the used market support now though? I’m not sure. There may be some nicer used machines for sale now…a lot of people were buying them for home during COVID, and perhaps some of those have just been sitting idle when people found that they didn’t enjoy the ritual of preparing and pulling their own shots. I have seen a few bargain higher spec machines like that recently (still over $1k though).

      Check out the places that sell used machines, and look for prices 30% or better than those maybe (though with JetBlack, DiPacci and the like, at least the used machines have been serviced).

      Eg…
      https://www.jetblackespresso.com.au/shop/p/lelit-anita-42emi…
      https://www.jetblackespresso.com.au/shop/p/lelit-pl41temd-re…
      https://dipacci.com.au/collections/second-hand-commercial-co…

      • 

        Glenningvalley on 10/07/2023 - 20:31

        Thanks for the indepth comment Banj0 - ill check out those links.

        Thank you

• 

  JIMB0 on 07/07/2023 - 12:39

  I have a Gaggia here that is around 20 years old and still going. Had to replace the plastic handle, a few switches and neon globes. Otherwise it's been good. Heats up in few minutes which is good when you're in a hurry to get to work.

• 

  mskeggs on 07/07/2023 - 12:43

  +1

  I think the type and volume of coffee you are making is relevant.
  I have a Gaggia Classic, and it is ideal for my single long-ish espresso, but it runs out of puff if I am steaming milk or making several coffees for visitors.
  If I drank milky coffee I would buy a machine with a separate boiler, and if I was typically making several coffees at once, I’d get a machine with a bigger boiler.

  • 

    JIMB0 on 07/07/2023 - 15:58

    +1

    I use the brew switch to feed water into boiler as I'm steaming. This keeps the boiler full and the heating element on (particularly if you have a leaky group head). I steam several lots of milk in a row then brew the coffee shots.

    • 

      mskeggs on 07/07/2023 - 16:03

      Good tip, I‘ll try this next time.

  • 

    Banj0 on 07/07/2023 - 16:26

    Even with the larger (relative) capacity of the Rancilio I find steaming can require some timing to get perfect. It's best to start steaming on that machine just before the thermostat cuts the power off, riding the wave at the peak and keeping the pressure right up. I guess a PID fixes this, since it will bring the heat back online quicker than the mechanical thermostat does.

    It will steam a pretty decent size pitcher of milk though. I just find it does the best job at the highest possible pressure, and it only hits that for a short window.

    Must be a risk of running the Gaggia dry with the smaller boiler?

    I'm sure we all desire a nice big dual boiler, or at least a machine with a decent HX boiler. I know I do anyway. One day…

  • 

    resisting the urge on 07/07/2023 - 19:12

    The old girl just needs the PID conversion kit put in, cheap and simple fix to make it as capable as any commercial single group unit, in a much smaller footprint.

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  AustriaBargain on 07/07/2023 - 12:51

  Wouldn't quite recommend Dedica, it's a cool machine though. Worth $100 I reckon.

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  Banj0 on 07/07/2023 - 15:42

  I should add, and it's been mentioned in various forums, but grinder is probably one of the most important components in your setup.

  I've never heard of an onboard grinder that is outstanding as a grinder. There is a used machine linked above with an onboard grinder, but it's just a conical burr grinder and probably not the best grinder out there. At this point in my personal coffee journey, I would probably never buy a machine with an onboard grinder.

  You are probably better off with a very good hand grinder than a mediocre electric grinder.