Hi all clearing this popular M710Q machines.
Specs
Processor
1x 6th Generation Intel® Core™ i5-6400T
Memory
8GB DDR4
Operating System
WIN 10 PRO
Storage
128GB SSD
Ports
1 x Microphone (3.5mm); 1 x Headphone/microphone combo jack (3.5mm); 6 USB Ports (Front 2 x USB 3.0 (1 for fast charge) Rear 4 x USB 3.0); 1 x Ethernet; 2 x integrated Display Port (back); 1 x DC power In
Graphics
1x Intel® UHD Graphics 530
Have a good weekend!
I've got two - one running Hyper-V and the other bare metal Debian with Home Assistant docker image. Only issue I've had is getting Intel NIC drivers to install on Windows server.
What's the go with the 'original coupon deal' ? Why's that relevant?
When a post uses a coupon that has already been posted (but the product isn't listed in that original post), you need to link back to the original coupon post
When posting a deal which contains a coupon that's already been posted, it automatically inserts a link to the original post
Does that mean you need to use the linked coupon to achieve the stated price? I do note that the price shown to me is $119
The coupon is in this deal, what’s so hard to understand?
Is it only the M720Q where its possible to add expansion card with Quad NIC for example (with adding a riser)? I haven't been able to find anyone done for the M710Q. Keen to get one for pFSense/OPNSense. I've have some of the Dell equivalents but not possible with them.
Out of curiosity, what use case does the quad nice unlock for you? Surely you can run a small home network off one port?
Pretty much for pFsense/OPNSense
Like, to use both as a fw, and a router replacement?
I was planning to pick something like this up to use for opnsense, but simply plug it into an existing router where everything else connects to - hence my interest in this thread.
@Grazz989: Yes only the m720. Got one from previous deal, bought a baffle card and 4 port pci card. Installed ESXi8 and running pfsense vm along with adguard.
"Keen to get one for pFSense/OPNSense."
I have dual WAN plus the LAN gives 3. 4th for management VLAN
I assume you've considered something like the Qotoms? They're pretty much purpose-built for this and have no reliance on fans. Not sure how the pricing works out but a quad Intel NIC probably isn't all that cheap, and considerably more faff to source then make sure that it plays nice with the box.
The Qotoms are almost the same price really, I'm kind of torn as which to get. The power requirements of the Qotoms should be less I suppose
Both types of machine are great, I have mulple of each.
For a 24*7 box, I'd go low power, fanless and new.
I've had one die, but that was an SSD failure (my own SSD) so that was totally unrelated and easy to fix.
Caveat, none of my industrial PCs were qotom branded, there are dozens of practically identical brands available.
Dell 7080 Micro has a dedicated graphics version which has proper PCIe expansion, too. But that model is impossible to find.
In Lenovo M7xxq and M9xxq series, only M720q/M920q has expansion slot, which you still need a riser card to make it functional. Intel i350-T4 was the only official option when it comes to NICs with those machines, as the slot was really designed for dedicated graphics. M730q/M930q is no longer adding the slot even though the motherboard still has soldering pads for the slot.
M9xx(x) (like M920x and M930x) still has the expansion slot, along with P320q/P330q, are actually designed to have add-in cards and even have fan intake on chassis. Some models got 2x m.2 slots.
For Lenovo Tiny riser card, there are two versions - PCIe 4x and 8x. Only 4x supports Thunderbolt expansion card. Most risers out there are 8x. Though it won't be an issue as why would you need Thunderbolt if you've got PCIe already?
I think M920x is probably the best for 8-9gen platform as you can add 10g ethernet and get RAID 1 on m.2 SSDs, make it quite reliable. However the price for M920x is still very unresonable here in Australia.
Thanks for the detailed reply!
You seem very knowledgeable so I'm hoping I can steal some of your time for a question:
I'm hoping to set up a NAS (using 2x external usb HDD of slightly mismatched sizes in raid 1) and also a firewall for a tiny home network of mine, and if I can somehow do that with one box without spending excessively that'd be grand.
Any suggestions?
I wouldn’t use any kind of raid on USB for obvious stability reasons. I’d rather shuck them and put them into a PC directly.
Also raid is not a backup. It’s just a method to ensure (relatively) high availability.
Your use case is best suited for at least a SFF PC. They can hold 1-2 3.5” HDDs depends on models, and have extra PCIe slots for proper additional NICs. They also are cheaper than those USFF models, and the power consumption are almost comparable. Most CPU/Mobo combos can run PCIe passthrough no problem so NIC performance in virtualised instances of firewalls (like OpenWRT x86 or opn/pfSense). Intel Core 4th gen and up should be able to do switching at line speed, too, if you’re running dual or quad port gigabit NICs, and should be able to route 10Gb if you need it.
@xmagic: Sorry for slow reply, for some reason I didn't see the notification.
The RAID on USB is just for NAS storage …. Of an extra copy of system backups. The system OS for the box would live on a separate SSD. In short, this would double up as a backup box (as well as FW), and the RAID is just to make the backup solution more reliable, not to serve as the only copy unto itself. This way three drives would have to fail: One in my actual PC, and both attached to this new box. I've already purchased the 3.5" HDDs, already in enclosures. I can't find any info as to whether these miniPCs have built in Intel mobo RAID …
I don't think I'd need extra NICs? … Surely the existing ethernet in an m700 is better than 100mbit? Given my internet connection is 70mbit at best, then I'd only need say 150mbit (70 each way + overhead) of BW to avoid that bottlenecking internet connectivity, no? I don't really care if my network transfer speed to/from the NAS part of the box isn't that quick, again it's mostly just for backups.
Does OPNsense allow for basic network accessible storage space (being a RAID 1 drive)? … If so, I don't see why installing it direct onto the moetal wouldn't serve just fine as a dumping ground for backup files? Or is there a smarter way to go about it?
If you have some recommendations for alternative SFF boxes that are better value, I'm all ears - though $120 shipped seems super cheap.
@Grazz989: It's just when USB bridges fail it would cause sync issue between two drives. Too many of these fails may cause further damage to the drive both from the filesystem level and hardware level. That's why it's not recommended to do RAID over USB at all. Maybe you'll be lucky not to see any error while using them over USB but I would not take the chance, especially it's a backup of the data. Of course good practice such as scrub the raid and data regularly would further increase the reliability but I personally just want to get it right throughout the system.
For firewalls, you'll need a WAN and LAN port. That's two ports. Of course there are ways to duplex the only NIC on a mini PC, such as assign VLANs to isolate ports on a managed switch so you can use one of the port on the switch as WAN, but it won't enable you to have the full gigabit bandwidth. I understand that your internet is not that fast, but as you're using this PC to do network-attached storage as well so don't forget your local speed requirements, you'd want the gigabit speed as most HDD can easily saturate the link on sequential access. Of course feel free to run everything bare metal as simple SAMBA share is supported almost on anything.
SFF boxes are generally the same if not cheaper than USFF. But as I explained they're much bigger and may consume a bit more power. That's the decision you'll have to make.
Like this: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/255981483043 and this: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/204041776708
Besides DIY, have you consider having a commercial NAS device? Like a 2-bay Synology or QNAP? They're much sleeker, it won't fail when you're tinkering other parts of your gears, the software and backup solutions are much more polished, and a used old model (not too old, like 2014-2016 models) can be around for only $100-200. Even an end-of-support Synology that runs DSM 6.2 with security updates only is still very useful, and I've been using such model (a DS1812+) for over a decade, and is still running strong as my secondary backup server.
@xmagic: Thanks for your reply!
How likely is it for that kind of USB failure? I've not noticed too many issues just using external USB HDDs in standard usage.
I really don't care about the local speed, as a backup happening over the course of an hour or two instead of 30 minutes means nothing to me, it'll be a background process while I'm doing something else (or sleeping). However, I'm surprised that an external switch would be required, I would've thought that I could simply plug it direct into my internet router (which everything else is connected to) and have it use one NIC to talk to that? … Also, a 1000mbit USB adapter is dirt cheap: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/314011395827 … Is that a viable alternative, or will it add significant jitter/latency?
Those SFF boxes are a bit more expensive, but I'm also a fan of the compactness of USFF … Which is another reason (other than cost) I'd rather not get a dedicated NAS box. My plan was simply to use backup software on my desktop/laptop to periodically run a backup and just have the storage destination be the networked storage location. What benefits would a NAS give, other than not using USB and not going down if my FW box goes down?
could you use the Win 10 Pro code on a seperate pc and sell this off?
probably cheaper to grab it from a grey market site like CDkeys/Eneba.
That's true, plus it's likely locked to this one as an OEM key and you'll need to do the "changed hardware" dance to make it work on the new pc.
Theoretically yes. You might be able to read the key from ACPI table:
https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/linux-find-windows-10-oem-prod…
Or using things like AIDA64 on Windows.
Grey keys are illegal anyway. Why not just host your own KMS on your home server? Or even on the router or a raspberry pi?
the key shows in the bios page on the M900 so probably the same on the M710.
There may be a Windows Pro sticker on the case.
Do you have a screenshot or picture? Of course with the actual key partially blocked.
As far as I know it's the OA3 ID usually shown in the BIOS summary page is just the license ID, not actual key. You'll still need to read the key from ACPI table, which is not visible directly in BIOS.
Like this one: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/my-lap…
@xmagic: You are right, my mistake.
I looked at the Bios briefly when the lenovo arrived and since then I have been away.
When i returned yesterday and had a closer look yesterday i could see where I was mistaken.
My Lenovo came without a hdd so I installed one and loaded windows 10 but it did not pick up the embedded key.
I used Powershell to retrieve the embedded key and then entered that key into the activation page but it was rejected.
An internet search revealed this is a known problem and microsoft is aware that an update a few years ago is causing the problem with the embedded key.
I tried all the fixes on the net but to no avail.
I then set up a Lenovo account and downloaded the original Windows 10 version for the computer from Lenovo site but no luck with the Lenovo win10 either..
Its possible that the embedded key doesnt work because of the update KB4598291 or because the original Microsoft account has changed. But i am not sure.
At this stage I would appreciate any suggestions.
When you go to the deal link you can choose more ram/ssd size.
Does the ebay deal discount apply to all selectable configs or only to the base 8/128 spec listed here ?
Do these upgrade to Win11? Thinking of getting a box for installing short-term Ubuntu and then Win11 after the Ubuntu data recovery job is done.
A quick google says cannot be upgraded to Win11.
For anyone looking for good info and suitable parts for the M710 have a look at this 3 page review of the very similar M900
https://www.servethehome.com/lenovo-thinkcentre-m900-tiny-pr…
It has good tips on suitable wifi card and ram etc.
Your link is broken :(
![[eBay Plus, Used] Lenovo ThinkCentre M710Q Tiny i5 6400T 8GB RAM 128GB SSD Win 10 Pro $109 Delivered @ Metrocom eBay](https://files.ozbargain.com.au/n/19/777219.jpg?h=49ffcd06)
Has anyone used these as proxmox servers as a homelab? Interested in grabbing a few to play around with if it works