Initial Victorian State Budget Thoughts

Aice on 23/05/2023 - 17:10
Last edited 23/05/2023 - 17:33

Interested to hear people thoughts on the few things been released from the state budget in Victoria so far

https://www.news.com.au/finance/economy/australian-economy/n…

Obviously not the most reliable news source but:
- new tax of minimum of $500 per investment property and up to $975 + 0.1% value of the land over $300k
- payroll tax increases by 0.5% for over $10M in payroll and 1% for over $100M

Now not saying landlords don't have a spare $500 per property per year but this will all but certainly be passed on.

Same goes with payroll tax, the 0.5% or 1% will just come off employee salaries in some way or another.

The government blamed this somewhat on their surprise on interest rate rises (which the everyday person is coping too) and their solution is to add to the fire of rising cost of living by just taking more.

Do you think this is going to become the new normal where government screw up and the people pay for it?

Poll Options

252
Yes, it's happening more and more the people in the government have no idea how to manage money
30
It's been happening for ages how have you missed this
99
No, you're making this bigger than what it needs to be
14
Send in the bikies

Financial

Comments

Trying2SaveABuck on 23/05/2023 - 17:16

+68

anyone who didnt see this coming is blind you have voted for argueably the worst premier the nation has ever seen - you get what you deserve

billions of blow outs in projects for his CMFEU mates and he has the stones to 'blame the RBA' who are trying to control inflation

clueless Victorian Government for the clueless voters that support them - id dare say the 'red' seats of Melbourne are where the bulk of investment property owners are so im kind of laughing becuz this tax is not only lazy but unfair considering the steep cost of stampy duty investors paid at price of purchase - but these voters have NO ONE to blame but themselves
- Aice on 23/05/2023 - 17:32
  
  +10
  
  Brutal but fair
  
  Also just clarifying I didn't vote for him :)
  
  I was also more 'hopeful' this wasn't coming rather than blind but here we are anyway…
- orangetrain on 23/05/2023 - 17:50
  
  +52
  
  Who should they have voted for? LNP are far crazier, even Fed LNP preferred to bail out NSW LNP.
  - lachhelix on 23/05/2023 - 20:46
    
    +21
    
    They all suck imo
    - reactor-au on 24/05/2023 - 08:57
      
      +1
      
      We're screwed
  - cloudy on 24/05/2023 - 00:30
    
    +11
    
    That's the problem, this is worse Victorian government i can remember in a long time, and it's all because it has the worst opposition ever.
    
    But we do get what we vote for, I mean M Guy had a decent idea of scrapping the suburban railloop and putting that funding to health, and Andrews trumps it by saying we can have both the loop and massive amounts into health. Of course that means a heap of debt, on top of the heap his piled on already.
    - akashra on 24/05/2023 - 12:46
      
      +22
      
      Consider this: You're a 15-year-old about to head in to VCE in the next few years. Your prospects for the kind of career that interest you gives you options to go to TAFE or Uni at Box Hill, Swinburn or Monash, and the other institutions either don't offer similar programs, or they're just dogshit. And by circumstance of the family you're born in to, you end up living on another train line. Maybe somewhere like Epping or Fawkner, where your choices are basically "catch a train in to the city, then back out" or "catch 3 busses" just to get to uni, which ends up being 2 hours of travel, for the 2 to 5 years you go to uni. While rents are reaching absurd levels.
      
      Getting from one non-opposite side of Melbourne to another has become insane over the past 30 years. If you have to get from West to North, or North to East (or worse, South-East), your choices are either a ridiculously long car-park commute in a car, or an almost triple amount of time via public transport. That's not acceptable for a city like Melbourne.
      - cloudy on 25/05/2023 - 22:55
        
        @akashra:
        
        Consider this:….which ends up being 2 hours of travel
        
        So this niche and most extreme example justifies over 100bill in investment?
        
        I mean if that's the worst case scenario I can't see how its worth its investment. Lets say realistically your example is covers about 1 in 5000 students, not extremely rare nor common. There are 50,000 yr 12 graduates each year, that would mean about 50 15 yr olds out there slugging 2hrs on PT each day. Yeah it sucks, and I feel for them but to get whole state in crippling debt doesn't make sense.
        
        You can further push the case that maybe 300 of them travel 1.5 hrs instead and a further 2000 travel 1 hr etc…and each and every one of them has their travel halved by this loop etc etc.
        
        But all up, you'll never get to a business case that justifies the cost.
        
        I've looked at the business case, its only projected to deliver $1.2 for every dollar invested, assuming it doesn't have a cost blow out, which it already has given the inflation of construction from the business case to today.
        Add in the fact that most of these trophy projects are overly optimistic in benefits as they project 10 years out.
        
        Like I said, we get what we vote for, rosy brouchers of benefits, and grandiose visions sell elections. Now the reality is hitting us.
        
        By the way, this "tough" budget won't even scratch the debt we're in. We would need every single man, woman, child (including my crawling toddler and unborn fetus) to chip in over $20,000 by 2026 to almost reduce our balance our balance sheet. And even if we do, we'd probably have to do it again as we're not even running surpluses.
        
        So how does that sitting on a train with your phone a couple of hours sound now?
        
        oh for the record: that crazy commute you speak of, I've made that commute many times before, you'd be amazed how adaptable one is in making productive use of that time, forging friendships, etc.
        
        p1 ama on 25/05/2023 - 23:04
        
        +13
        
        @cloudy:
        
        By the way, this "tough" budget won't even scratch the debt we're in. We would need every single man, woman, child (including my crawling toddler and unborn fetus) to chip in over $20,000 by 2026 to almost reduce our balance our balance sheet. And even if we do, we'd probably have to do it again as we're not even running surpluses.
        
        This is an extremely flawed way of thinking about the situation.
        
        Victoria is the most successful state economically in Australia right now, people are moving to Victoria, highest growth in state gross product across every state. We need to do more to take advantage of these headwinds whilst we still have them.
        
        You know you're being completely disingenuous because that's not how the tax burden falls, especially for state budgets. Hardly any of state government revenue comes from direct taxation of individuals, so your analogy of whatever your toddler and unborn fetus pays is just hogwash. The more that we make Victoria a great place to live, a place where people can come to live a comfortable life, get high paying jobs, innovate, start small businesses…etc. the more that we will be able to raise tax revenues to support future investment.
        
        Now the reality is hitting us.
        
        What reality? The reality that small-minded people like you who can't see beyond the tip of their nose are starting to back out and push our state into a hell hole?
        
        Infrastructure is always expensive. The earlier we build, the less expensive it is. All of the roads you drive on, the trains you catch were all once big government projects, and of course, were all once criticised by short-sighted clowns like yourself right now. Unless you walk through a jungle on your way to work every day and enjoy it, sounds like a classic case of shutting the door behind you once you've gotten the infrastructure you need.
        
        cloudy on 25/05/2023 - 23:14
        
        @p1 ama:
        
        Hardly any of state government revenue comes from direct taxation of individuals
        
        People pay taxes, you can argue till the cows come home that people dont pay but in the end people pay. Who owns companies? People, who owns property, people, in the end, someone has to pay. What's hogwash is believing that by taxing corporations or trusts etc etc that there is no face at the end of it, its people who create them, who own them and people pay.
        
        The reality that small-minded people like you who can't see beyond the tip of their nose are starting to back out and push our state into a hell hole?
        
        So personal, play the ball.
        
        Infrastructure is always expensive. The earlier we build, the less expensive it is. All of the roads you drive on, the trains you catch were all once big government projects, and of course, were all once criticised by short-sighted clowns like yourself right now
        
        clowns like myself can see that a decade in, when this loop finishes, we'd likely have self driving cars on the road and this loop won't nearly produce a fraction of the business case states. Your naivety in believing every large infrastructure project is worth doing is cookoo land stuff. There are projects like high speed rail mel-syd that is more plausible that the suburban rail loop.
        
        Edit, so i saw your other post citing the fact Vic is the fastest growing state.
        I mean, for an economist by trade (iirc) you'd think you'd recognize the errors of statistics. Here is a line straight from your link.
        
        Victoria recorded an increase in GSP of 5.6% in 2021-22, the strongest of any state and territory. The increase follows a fall of 0.3% in 2020-21 and small rise of 0.1% in 2019-20 when economic activity was constrained by pandemic containment measures.
        
        Vic is clearly the fastest growing state only because of the horrid state we were put in the year before. That is no achievement, shall I call you the clown now?
        
        p1 ama on 25/05/2023 - 23:27
        
        -1
        
        @cloudy:
        
        People pay taxes, you can argue till the cows come home that people dont pay but in the end people pay. Who owns companies? People, who owns property, people, in the end, someone has to pay. What's hogwash is believing that by taxing corporations or trusts etc etc that there is no face at the end of it, its people who create them, who own them and people pay.
        
        Sure, but the point is that by investing in state infrastructure, attracting people to come to Victoria, to bring capital to the state, to get higher paying jobs, to start small businesses…etc. will be generating additional revenue off which the state will be able to levy taxes.
        
        Think of total taxes as the tax rate * income per individual * number of individuals. If we boost productivity, incomes will rise, and if we make the state a better place to live, more people will come here. It is perfectly possible (if not inevitable) that you will pay lower taxes on the dollar in the future because of big investments now, not less.
        
        Or is that too hard for you to understand?
        
        So personal, play the ball.
        
        I mean, if you parrot conservative talking points, I'm not going to give you the respect you can't afford yourself.
        
        clowns like myself can see that a decade in, when this loop finishes, we'd likely have self driving cars on the road and this loop won't nearly produce a fraction of the business case states.
        
        Wow, you're trying to use logic!!! So amazing!
        
        Except it's flawed, whoops…
        
        Self-driving cars are not the solution to anything. They will still be bottlenecked by the road capacity we have right now. Think it takes too long to get into the city for work? It'll be even worse with driverless cars. Maybe your plan is to start the commute at 3am and finish off your sleep in the driverless car on your way to work?
        
        Your naivety in believing every large infrastructure project is worth doing is cookoo land stuff. There are projects like high speed rail mel-syd that is more plausible that the suburban rail loop.
        
        Sure then, point to one major infrastructure project built in the last 100 years that, in your estimation, we shouldn't have built in hindsight in Victoria. If you're this confident, then maybe name a train line, or a road, or something. I'll wait…
        
        Vic is clearly the fastest growing state only because of the horrid state we were put in the year before. That is no achievement, shall I call you the clown now?
        
        Whoopsies, didn't check your data and thought I'd be an easy target eh?
        
        Let's take the past 5 years then, NSW 1.72% growth in GSP, VIC 2.36% growth, and Australia 2.16% growth in GDP (all per annum, of course). So hardly a COVID effect.
        
        Danstar on 26/05/2023 - 09:21
        
        -1
        
        @p1 ama:
        
        Victoria is the most successful state economically in Australia right now
        
        Ahh no it isn’t…
        
        Victoria is basically at the bottom
        
        https://amp.abc.net.au/article/102279292
    - entropysbane on 24/05/2023 - 19:36
      
      -1
      
      The Cain-Kirner Government was much worse tbh. Peak Kirner many of the suburban strip malls, particularly in the west were all empty with smashed in windows.
      
      The problem right now is that despite Dictator Dan running roughshod over the Stockholm syndromed population, it isn’t as though the dinner party crew in the libs would be worth voting for either.
      
      Hobson’s choice.
    - smartazz104 on 25/05/2023 - 13:24
      
      +5
      
      I mean M Guy had a decent idea of scrapping the suburban railloop and putting that funding to health
      
      We all know he would never have actually put that funding into health.
  - Aice on 24/05/2023 - 06:29
    
    +2
    
    Yep you are basically picking the lesser of two evils
  - sareth on 24/05/2023 - 11:18
    
    +3
    
    There is no such thing as the LNP in Victoria, nor NSW, nor the federal government.
    - Rockets84 on 24/05/2023 - 14:06
      
      -1
      
      Same in WA. WA LNP has so few sitting members in the lower house, 2, that the Nationals are the opposition with 4 members. ALP members in the lower house - 53.
- Mokr on 23/05/2023 - 18:13
  
  +7
  
  The gov blocked Dan's china money.
  
  Id balme the gov
  - Bing0 on 23/05/2023 - 20:08
    
    Scomo blowing up the belt and road deal certainly played it's part in this insanity
  - Danstar on 24/05/2023 - 10:31
    
    +6
    
    So better to be indebted to China?
    - Frozensage on 25/05/2023 - 00:00
      
      +9
      
      Who do u think is buying up all that stuff we dig up from the ground to find the whole Australia economy? America?
  - dts88 on 25/05/2023 - 19:53
    
    China?
    
    check on this website then comment.
    
    https://www.dfat.gov.au/trade/trade-and-investment-data-info…
- jv on 24/05/2023 - 00:31
  
  +9
  
  This will move even more businesses interstate resulting in job losses and increase rental prices further.
  
  All this to appease Dan's ego and his obsession to build a rail loop that nobody really wants or needs.
  - akashra on 24/05/2023 - 12:39
    
    +34
    
    BS it isn't needed. It was needed 20 years ago. The longer it's left, the more expensive it gets to eventually build it. State Governments for 30 years have had a disgusting track record with being short-sighted on infrastructure planning.
    - jv on 24/05/2023 - 13:01 Comment score below threshold.
      - RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 13:38
        
        +31
        
        @jv:
        
        They either drive or catch a bus.
        
        That's because there is no other option.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 14:04
        
        -8
        
        @RSmith:
        
        That's because there is no other option.
        
        That's because it is more convenient and way cheaper
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 14:12
        
        +18
        
        @jv: Buses are not convenient.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 14:59
        
        -3
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Buses are not convenient.
        
        yeah they are…
        
        A bus stop does not cost $35 billion to build, and doesn't require 100's of peoples homes to be ~~stolen~~ 'acquired' by Dan
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:02
        
        +13
        
        @jv: If they were so convenient, we wouldn't have trains anywhere in the world.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:03
        
        +3
        
        @RSmith: trains are useful for getting into the city to move large numbers of people at peak times.
        
        this is not the case for connecting outer suburbs.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:09
        
        +11
        
        @jv: That's why we need the loop. All major have it. If you haven't lived overseas in a big city, you wouldn't be able to grasp the usefulness
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:10
        
        @RSmith:
        
        That's why we need the loop.
        
        Nobody will use it. It is a $35 billion white elephant…
        
        The only people that want it are Dan's ego and his disciples…
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:13
        
        +3
        
        @jv:
        
        Nobody will use it
        
        Wish all the infrastructure projects were decided using the same logic.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:14
        
        -3
        
        @RSmith: That's what happens when you have a dictator as a premier…
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:18
        
        +15
        
        @jv: Calling him a dictator doesn't make him one. Try Kim Jong un if you want to know what a dictator is.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:19
        
        +4
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Calling him a dictator doesn't make him one.
        
        Oh he is…
        
        I'd call him out for what he really is, but then I'll get sin binned…
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:20
        
        +10
        
        @jv:
        
        Oh he is…
        
        Obviously, he's not. The people calling him so are the ones can't digest his popularity.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:24
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Obviously, he's not.
        
        He dictates.
        
        That is literally the definition of a dictator.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:27
        
        +14
        
        @jv: Here is the definition…
        
        a ruler with total power over a country, typically one who has obtained control by force.
        
        That is literally the definition of a dictator.
        
        You can't just go on making stuff even though you dislike him.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:29
        
        +2
        
        @RSmith:
        
        You can't just go on making stuff
        
        That's exactly what Dan wants.
        
        Victorian companies to stop making stuff.
        
        That is why he wants to steal more money from them and call it 'land tax'
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:30
        
        +6
        
        @jv:
        
        Victorian companies to stop making stuff.
        
        Lol. That's a six… Out of the stadium.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:31
        
        +2
        
        @RSmith: He is also going to steal more money from people who own a holiday house.
        
        He doesn't even care, he said so today.
        
        He basically said bad luck, they chose to buy a holiday house.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:32
        
        +8
        
        @jv: Phew…. Thank god I don't have a holiday house.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:33
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Phew…. Thank god I don't have a holiday house.
        
        Same selfish attitude by our dictator…
        
        If it doesn't affect you, who cares, right….
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:34
        
        +10
        
        @jv:
        
        If it doesn't affect you, who cares, right….
        
        So if it affects you it is dictatorship and stealing.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:35
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        So if it affects you it is dictatorship and stealing.
        
        It doesn't affect me. My investment properties are overseas.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:57
        
        +6
        
        @jv:
        
        It doesn't affect me.
        
        Yeah, right.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:32
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith: He is also going to steal money from schools, charging them payroll tax….
        
        He is a thief and a dictator.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:33
        
        +6
        
        @jv: Doesn't the government give money to schools?
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:34
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Doesn't the government give money to schools?
        
        No, the tax payers do.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:36
        
        +10
        
        @jv: I see. So the money he is stealing is directly going to his bank account. That's a conspiracy theory on the same level as moon landing.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:37
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        So the money he is stealing is directly going to his bank account.
        
        It wouldn't surprise me if he's getting kick backs, like his union mates…
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:38
        
        +6
        
        @jv: You have too much insider knowledge… Are you one of his mates?
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:29
        
        +1
        
        @jv:
        
        No, the tax payers do.
        
        should be user pays.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:33
        
        +9
        
        @jv:
        
        He is a thief and a dictator
        
        Democratically elected.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:34
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Democratically elected.
        
        By 30% of people…. Hardly democratic…
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:35
        
        +4
        
        @jv: Hope you voted.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:36
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Hope you voted.
        
        Yes, I was one of the majority who didn't vote for him.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:37
        
        +10
        
        @jv: You lost. Have to suck it up. How sad.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:38
        
        +2
        
        @RSmith:
        
        You lost. Have to suck it up.
        
        Yes, the majority of decent Victorians have lost to the corrupt few.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:39
        
        +6
        
        @jv:
        
        majority
        
        Minority of conspiracy theorists have lost and are now making a huge and cry.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:42
        
        +2
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Minority of conspiracy theorists have lost
        
        Good for them…
        
        The majority of hard working, honest Victorian have lost too…
        
        The lazy, corrupt have won thanks to a flawed voting system where most people did not vote for him, but he still wins.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:43
        
        +6
        
        @jv:
        
        The lazy, corrupt have won thanks to a flawed voting system where most people did not vote for him, but he still wins.
        
        Whatever you think of yourself, but the bottom line is that you lost.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:47
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Whatever you think of yourself
        
        That's not what I said…
        
        Deflecting, just like Dan……
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:48
        
        +7
        
        @jv:
        
        Deflecting, just like Dan……
        
        Learn to accept defeat with grace.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:49
        
        +2
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Learn to accept defeat
        
        We don't succumb to dictators and thieves.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:52
        
        +6
        
        @jv:
        
        We don't succumb to dictators and thieves.
        
        Fortunately you have succumbed to a democratically elected leader.
        
        ForkSnorter on 24/05/2023 - 15:41
        
        +14
        
        @jv: I feel the need to weigh in on this new road vs new railway argument.
        
        If you know a bit about mathematics and long-term urban planning, you'd know that building new roads and bypasses doesn't solve congestion problems long-term when the population is growing. All it does is encourage more people to drive.
        
        Congestion gets exponentially worse with population growth. I mean it may not always be exponential, but the relationship between population growth and congestion it is definitely not linear. A new road/bypass can never provide a long-term solution to this problem.
        
        A railway circumvents the entire road system, and potentially diverts thousands (tens-hundreds of thousands of people?) from one transport system to another.
        
        If Tokyo had continued to build more and more roads/bypasses instead of subways/rail loops, its economy would have shutdown 50 years ago, and it would be a hellhole of unimaginable proportion.
        
        Australia needs to stop trying to make it convenient to drive, and instead make it inconvenient to drive. Cars are ruining Australia, in my opinion. We spend a ridiculous amount of time driving. Cities with fewer people on the road are so much nicer.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 15:46
        
        +10
        
        @ForkSnorter:
        
        I feel the need to weigh in on this new road vs new railway argument.
        
        It's not about roads vs rails. It's basically about being anti Dan. Whatever he does is labelled as bad… That's the mentality in people like JV.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 15:48
        
        +1
        
        @ForkSnorter:
        
        All it does is encourage more people to drive.
        
        Some people don't have a choice.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:02
        
        +9
        
        @jv:
        
        Some people don't have a choice.
        
        Some don't have a choice to catch the train. Hopefully, this loop will provide them with that choice.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:04
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Hopefully, this loop will provide them with that choice.
        
        Both of them…
        
        Maybe it should be user pays.
        Do they have a spare $35 billion ?
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:05
        
        +8
        
        @jv:
        
        Maybe it should be user pays.
        
        Tax payer is paying.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:24
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Tax payer is paying.
        
        Should be user pays.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:28
        
        +4
        
        @jv:
        
        Should be user pays.
        
        Same for roads and buses too. Everyone pays for their own bus.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:30
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Same for roads
        
        Yep, I pay for tolls.
        
        and buses too.
        
        They already do…
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:31
        
        +3
        
        @jv: Do you have your own bus?
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:32
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        Do you have your own bus?
        
        They are mainly privately owned.
        
        They don't cost the tax payer $35 billion to setup a new bus line.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:33
        
        +1
        
        @jv:
        
        They are mainly privately owned.
        
        So they don't help with transporting public… Trains on the other hand…
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:36
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        So they don't help with transporting public
        
        You win the 'stupidest statement of the day' prize.
        
        They are private companies who's business is public transport.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:38
        
        +1
        
        @jv:
        
        They are private companies who's business is public transport.
        
        That's not what you said.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:38
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        That's not what you said.
        
        yes i did…
        
        https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/13790812/redir
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:48
        
        +1
        
        @jv: no you didn't…
        
        https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/13790789/redir
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:51
        
        +1
        
        @RSmith:
        
        no you didn't…
        
        There's nothing contradictory about the two statements.
        
        The bus companies are mainly privately owned and their business is to provide public transport. Same as taxis.
        
        We can't afford $35 billion. Especially not one managed by Dan's incompetent government.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:52
        
        @jv:
        
        There's nothing contradictory about the two statements.
        
        There is ambiguity in your first statement which you clarified in your subsequent statement.
        
        jv on 24/05/2023 - 16:53
        
        +2
        
        @RSmith:
        
        There is ambiguity in your first statement
        
        no their isn't.
        
        it is fact.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:54
        
        +1
        
        @jv:
        
        it is fact.
        
        making it bold doesn't make it a fact.
        
        RSmith on 24/05/2023 - 16:50
        
        +7
        
        @jv:
        
        You win the 'stupidest statement of the day' prize.
        
        This takes the cake…
        
        He is also going to steal money from schools, charging them payroll tax….
        He is a thief and a dictator.
        
        akashra on 24/05/2023 - 16:15
        
        +10
        
        @RSmith: It's amazing how some people think anything they say should be taken seriously when they start trying to fling around catchy insult-names. Do they not realise that the instant you try to bring out one of these idiotic names that they think are clever, everyone just immediately stops listening to them because they show their clear bias and inability to think for themselves?
        
        greatlamp on 25/05/2023 - 08:58
        
        +9
        
        @akashra: It amazes me how much hate a leader gets for spending money on infrastructure. Gladys did not get a fraction of this hate and she was literally corrupt.
        
        It's clearly political bias, no logic to it at all.
        
        Danstar on 25/05/2023 - 10:30
        
        @greatlamp: So cancelling a project and losing $1billion is a good investment is it?
        
        greatlamp on 25/05/2023 - 10:55
        
        @Danstar: Of course not, but you don't get to be angry that all this money is wasted on new train lines and also angry when plans are cancelled.
        
        Take a position
        
        Danstar on 25/05/2023 - 12:50
        
        -1
        
        @greatlamp: Considering schooling is on the decline; health system is the same if not worse since Dan took over; maybe, just maybe what he is spending on isn’t of high importance ?
        
        Dan looks after China and his union mates first with his spending
  - entropysbane on 24/05/2023 - 19:38
    
    You are welcome to immigrate to our warmer climate Victorians.
    
    Just leave your politics behind. Please.
- Poor Ass on 24/05/2023 - 08:54
  
  +3
  
  the choices are turd sandwich or giant douche
  - drprox on 24/05/2023 - 15:52
    
    The people choose…douche!
    - smartazz104 on 25/05/2023 - 13:29
      
      Suck that turd down mate.
- Bearhay on 24/05/2023 - 09:32
  
  Is the acquisition of money the only important aim in life?
  It is so easy to criticize and complain as if we are victims and have no control over our lives, yet by the Law of Attraction, if we focus on appreciating what is good in our personal lives, then we'll be attracting more and more things that are pleasing instead of more and more to complain about.
  What goes around comes around!
  - bakemon0 on 25/05/2023 - 08:30
    
    yes the very scientific Law of Attraction, I'm sure everyone in third world countries just need their government to implement this law and everyone would be very happy indeed!

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