https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqJyvkY_MNg
and the nanny state just gets more worrying
how are these mobile phone cameras even calibrated? if I use the in-built radio in my car will it pick up on that?
if my car is in park and I use my mobile phone, will I get pinged by the camera?
New Cameras in Melbourne
speedingftw on 01/04/2023 - 10:51
Comments
If you're on the road, you're driving or travelling.
Just because you put your car on park, in the middle of the road, it doesn't mean you're parking 🤦
@speedingftw: Do you think there is a drone following you or something?
You need to drive past these cameras
@speedingftw: Speed cameras don't need to look down at your car from a certain angle to see where your hands are and if you're using a mobile phone.
better question is going to be, you car got stuck (let's say battery died or engine failed etc.) in traffic, and you in car with hazard warning lights on, trying to call your RACV insurance.
And you got stung with fine.
@speedingftw: Low IQ…
The fines are not automatic, and even if they were, you'd just write back saying hey it's pretty obvious I have a defence and the fine would be withdrawngot any proof this actually work?
It's in the same place you're getting all your info from…
@speedingftw: I've never paid any fine I've got. One of them was pretty legit and I just wrote a story about how the speed signage was poor in the area and got off. I mean I was kinda correct and you can't make stuff up, but with a little analysis of the situation and not being excessive (my fine was 50 in a 40 zone) you can get argue your way out of a few fines.
I can imagine if you have a legit reason with these phone cameras they'll let you off very easy.
You seem to be the <30 year old who constantly complains about things designed to stop people like you from being on the road.
Two things:
- Don't speed
- Don't use your mobile phone while driving.
You don't have any problems.
Too many people use their phones while driving, literally holding and using them even up to their head.
Get a phone mount in your car, they're $15 ffs.
Learn how to connect bluetooth or buy a dongle.You are a danger to EVERYONE if you use your phone while driving.
There are heaps of idi0ts out there.
@speedingftw: Yeah, that's totally going to happen.
By the way, these things exist because of people like you who think that they have the right to endanger everyone else.
@jorf: you're a fool if you don't think it's about revenue
the government even has fine targets in their budget@speedingftw: You're a fool for thinking it's not about addressing your shitty behaviour. The fines for this in Qld are much higher (and I think they should be even higher again). I've noticed a significant drop in arseholes playing on their phones while driving since they introduced the cameras and fines here. Suck it up.
@speedingftw: Following rules is actually so much easier and simpler than not following rules, seeking loopholes and so on.
Just keep in mind my boy.
@baldur: no one here can explain why most countries with lax road rules have lower or similar road toll to australia
@speedingftw: Can you show me where it is in the budgets? I can see they have estimated revenue based on historical rate of fines. But not where they have a target they must hit.
@serpserpserp: it's common knowledge, and what other reason is there for cops to book people for things as petty as 5 over the speed limit on an empty highway?
other than having quotas
@speedingftw: Why not march on the steps of Parliament in real life, instead of whinging on OzBargain? Oh that's right, too hard.
@speedingftw: Well then stop using your mobile while driving, speeding, etc
Do you really thing that a large enough proportion of fines issued by the mobile cameras are illegitimate? If so many of these fines were incorrect, they'd be getting challenged through the courts, and the government would not be expanding the system.
@Chandler: no one still gets the point that australia has the strictest road rules in the world but a road toll that doesn't reflect this
@speedingftw: Maybe there's a correlation there. Strict road rules, low road tolls… 🤔
Ultimately but, the complaint at hand is about getting caught breaking the law. If you didn't break the law, contest the fine. If you did, suck it up.
Your complaint about all these edge cases has not been seen in reality, and if it was there would be adjustments made to placements, algorithms, etc to rectify as the government couldn't just keep issuing bogus fines: there be too many fines being contested in court and it could potentially end up being a class action lawsuit.
@speedingftw: The phrase "revenue raising" always amuses me because:
1) there's a simple way to not have to pay the money
2) if they didn't raise the money by issuing fines to people doing the wrong thing then they'd raise the revenue some other way, such as taxes. The government doesn't make a profit, it spends the income it makes.@SirCH: Well considering Australia is the only country in the world where government gets the money from speeding fines yes it's absurd
In every other country they have other sensible means for the government to get money
@speedingftw: Mate very clear you just don't want to obey the road rules so let's stop with the libertarian discussion.
We will wait for someone who keeps the road rules and has a gripe with these phone cameras to speak up. No matter whether you raise a good point or not it's clear you're biased as hell.
@speedingftw: Only country in the world? I'd love your source because I can prove that wrong with 30 seconds in Google
https://www.thinkinsurance.co.uk/personal/convicted-driver-i…@speedingftw: And yes, the other "sensible means" is what I pointed out in 2) - taxes. I've never seen the government have a bake sale.
@speedingftw: What's not sensible about fining road users for breaking the road rules and spending that money on the roads?
@speedingftw: if they put a cam right outside your house, it'd point to the road NOT your drive way. imagine how much revenue they'd raise if the only pointed at your house. contradicting urself mate
@StephBlanks: What if the cameras pointing at Ops dining area, and it thinks op is driving every time he holds a plate!!!!11!!!
@StephBlanks: Well they'd make no money cause OP is smart and would tin foil his car windows to avoid a fine.
@speedingftw: You're worrying about hypotheticals that won't happen.
Put it this way, it's only cost effective to put cameras where they know many idiots will break the law.
They could put one right outside your house, but at some point you would run out of money, they would force you into bankruptcy etc etc
It's much more cost effective to put it on a major freeway and take in a few million a year of fine revenue.
It's how they build community services and hospitals (albeit with federal funding also)
@CalmLemons: all valid points, but no one is able to answer this simple question
that is, why is australia one of the only countries in the world to have exessive enforcement of road rules without any discretion and a road toll which doesn't reflect this
why is australia one of the only countries in the world to have exessive enforcement of road rules without any discretion and a road toll which doesn't reflect this
Having an opinion on what you deem to be "exCessive enforcement" doesn't make it a fact. If, though, you've got some stats to back up all these opinions of yours, I'm sure I can say for many here that we'd love to see your sources.
We'll wait…
@speedingftw: What is excessive enforcement? Sorry, but you're complaining the government is trying too hard to uphold the law? "I know the rules say I can't do this but why are they allowed to enforce them! I'm a SoVeReIgN cItIzEn! I hAvE rIgHtS!"
We still have a road toll, maybe the enforcement isn't excessive enough?
what if they decided to put a phone camera right outside my house?
I hope they do… cause we know you'd sit in your driveway on the phone….
Worse troll thread of the week.
I would be surprise if someone decide to park under the camera and start using their mobile phone. These are usually on big road with no parking.
one of the issues is, if I put my car in park and use my phone,will the camera know that the car is in park?
It doesn't even matter, the law views 'touching' a phone in parked car just the same as writing a message traveling full speed on the motorway.
that's the issue in australia
laws treated everything the same, no matter how dangerous is actually is
They’ve been around in NSW for years. If you know what you’re looking for they’re really easy to spot. They’re also put around in places where you will be in motion, and not parked.
When you put your car in park, just pull out your sunshade from the back seat and put it over the windscreen.
Problem solved.
how are these cameras even legal?
because the legislation and regulations governing their use say they're legal.
All captures will be reviewed by a human pretty sure.
and capture will show that your car has been in service lane parked too.
can we still have the phone as a gps as long as we don't touch it when driving?
@speedingftw: i think your linked video answers that clearly.
I however have some serious doubts on the "cannot read", and "watch videos" bit that is so vague and honestly impractical, I think as long as we aint like scrolling device or like touching device constantly. its gonna be really hard to argue IMO that we are in wrong.
Why cannot we have a video playing in background and we simply not be watching it, we just listening to its audio.
They recently got similar cameras installed here on south road too. news says many been issued warning from that camera already (which will only last 1 month, after which straight up fine), just like news you linked too
Even without a camera, putting your car in park is not sufficient to stop getting a fine from a passing motorcycle copper. you'll also need the engine off, the keys out of the ignition, the hand brake on, …
you may need to consider getting out of the car, just to be sure.So this proves that cops just want to revenue raise
Not true. Having the car in park means you can use your phone so long as you are parked. Having the engine running is ok. If you have stopped, that is different, that is where you can get fined. You can park in the middle of the road eg with a breakdown, and not be liable for a fine
I can’t wait for you to get a fine and see another whingeing post here. Then we can discuss your consequences and how you got there.
Jesus, man. It's not that difficult to grasp …
let's say I'm driving on a main road, and then pull over to a service lane, put my car in park then pick up my phone, if there's a phone detection camera nearby, will it pick it up? that i'm using a phone whilst parked?
Here's an idea - buy a damn cradle. $10, $15 max.
Build a bridge and move on.
australia's government is corrupt
unlike most other countries
@speedingftw: Time to gtfo of straya with your inflatable boat.
Don't let the tree hit you on your way out.@speedingftw: Every government is corrupt. But also, no one is stopping you from wearing your tin foil hat out in the bush and living off grid - so hop to it.
No because they’re aligned to the lanes you drive in and not a break down lane
Pretty hard to spot when you're looking down at your phone.
This is not creeping nanny-state, this is our society catching up years late with a real danger which results from drivers looking at screens when they should be looking at the road.
When my primary school kid rides her bike, she wears a flouro vest, a light on front and back. Excruciating embarrassment for her but unfortunately even that's not enough for a driver to see her if they're not looking at the road. She doesn't deserve to be mangled on her way to the library/pool/school just because someone couldn't wait to catch up on their vapid instagram feed.
Your vague claim doesn't mean a thing I'm afraid - find a journal study that has looked at the effect these cameras have, and I'll read it. If there aren't any yet, that means it's worth trying out for a while to see. Meanwhile in the places they're already operating there has not been a deluge of innocent people being incorrectly pinged as you fear, so why not calm down? Biggest concern I can see is impinging on the right to privacy for people who like to drive pantless. There's something I might be up in arms about..
I mean, Australia in general is a nanny state compared to other countries
it's not necessary at all for the government to spy on people's everyday actions
no other country has this many traffic cameras to generate revenue for the government@speedingftw: Indonesia, where I spend a lot of time, sees absolute carnage on the roads because people run red lights in town, speed on the freeways out of town, etc (no breath testing either!). This is quite simply because there are no cameras to stop them doing it. Your arguments make sense only if that's what you actually want to do on the road, in which case, just be honest and say so. It's just not the way most people here would like things to be.
@Horacio: australia has a higher road toll then most countries in europe
most countries in europe are very lax with speed limits and driving in general
your point?
@speedingftw: Australian drivers typically drive much longer distances over higher speed roads. The roads in Europe that people are generally thinking about are high quality limited access highways such as Germany's Autobahn system but most European roads are smaller and narrower with slower effective speed limits to start with.
Your assertion is just generally wrong anyhow. True, some parts of Europe have lower fatalities per 100k population, but if you compare the rates of smaller, more urban states in Australia fatality rates are comparable to the safest roads in Europe. The highest fatality rates in Australia are in rural and remote areas, and states with high rural populations such as WA, TAs and the NT. https://www.bitre.gov.au/sites/default/files/documents/inter…
Even taking the above into account, there are plenty of European countries with high fatality rates than Australia, including most of Eastern Europe.
@speedingftw: When you're losing an argument, the most appropriate response is to move the goal posts. We were discussing your flawed inference about European road fatalities.
Regardless, if you want to talk about the NT we could discuss that as well (high relative fatality rates to start with, long roads, tiny sample size), however it's pretty clear that you're only here to assert a preconceived view of the world so I'll leave you to it.
@AngoraFish: no i'm just trying to say that Australia is a nanny state, with citizens who just accept everything (speed cameras, high tax etc)
in other countries the citizens stand up to their rights and it works
@speedingftw: You're just flat out wrong: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic…
@jsheroes: australia should be number 1 on the list considering our speed enforcement
it's around 20th
and the countries with a higher road toll than australia are only marginally higher
and they drive much faster too
@Horacio: Bullshit. Cameras are not the difference between Indonesia and Australia. The difference is we actually make and enforce laws in Australia.
You can look at the statistics for road fatalities in Australia over the years.
Seatbelts, speeding, alcohol. These laws improved road safety dramatically.
Cameras? Nope. Zero improvement.
I mean, Australia in general is a nanny state compared to other countries
You have obviously never been to Singapore.
Sorry mate, what's the issue? We come here to read not watching the news clip.