Amazon Denying a Replacement of Faulty Nvidia Shield (Update: Resolved)

I recently bought an NVIDIA Shield Pro to replace my ageing NVIDIA Shield (tubey one).
From day one it regularly crashes, maybe once every 20 minutes on average.
No errors, no clues as to why just black screen and NVIDIA logo.

I first tried NVIDIA support who made me fully factory reset, which had no effect.

I tried a few different things and I'm quite techy so I managed to get adb logging going, but no clue on the cause.

As a last resort a tried to request a replacement from Amazon and was directed to livechat.

When I bought it from this deal it was $218 and has subsequently gone up to $309.

https://www.ozbargain.com.au/node/762740

I requested a replacement and was told the best they could do was a refund. I told them a refund is no good as the price has gone up and was told I would need to take the refund and wait until the price goes down…..

I ended the chat and emailed Amazon with the chat logs and so far they've ignored me.

I'm not being unreasonable here am I? Amazon have to replace my faulty purchase like for like at no cost to me?

Mod: situation resolved. Title updated. See update https://www.ozbargain.com.au/comment/13572098/redir

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Comments

  • +12

    Just as a follow up, I got on to a different rep and they've agreed to replace it without question.

    I obviously just got a bad rep first time round.

    • +1

      Yay, glad it worked out for you. I haven't had a single negative experience with live chat so far

      • I've generally had good experiences but have heard on here that they've gone downhill. This experience validated this a little but sample size of one to be fair.

    • +1

      That happens with amazon, it's best to just say will think about it and try someone else later. Some seem to have more authority than others. You could of asked for a supervisor too.

      • Lesson learned!

  • +31

    yes, they offered you a solution where you have lost nothing, you get money back and not out anything unreasonable

      • +1

        No, Not when they offering a refund.

        • The way I read the guidance from the ACCC suggests to me that it's my choice.

          "Fixing the problem might involve a repair, replacement, or refund. If it is a major problem you can choose. This is when the product:

          has a problem that would have stopped someone from buying it if they’d known about it
          is significantly different from the sample or description
          is substantially unfit for its common purpose and can’t easily be fixed within a reasonable time
          doesn’t do what you asked for and can’t easily be fixed within a reasonable time; or
          it is unsafe."
          
          • +1

            @pauly85: You reading it wrong, you have a choice if there are two options available, but amazon only gives you one.
            Which makes sense, imagine you buy an end-of-line item, how is Amazon going to replace that?

            Just to let you know, Costco also the same.

            • +1

              @boomramada: huh? It depends on whether the problem is major or minor in nature. Major problem is defined as posted above. Customer can choose the remedy in this case. If the problem was only minor, than the retailer can choose the remedy.

            • +1

              @boomramada:

              you have a choice if there are two options available

              wtf, isnt that a given…choice implies options available.

              Given the word choice is explicitly used, it must be choice by OP, if available by Amazon.

              Now given amazon is still selling it, it must be available, and hence the choice of OP.

          • +1

            @pauly85: really ??

            How about the item you bought was destroyed instead in shipping process and was only one item of a kind ??

            How the heck you would argue for replacement in that case.

            Ask amazon for covering the buying cost of the same item again, They may do it via giving you some Compensation credit on top of refund. Otherwise Amazon giving refund is not a bad solution either.

            Keep in mind Amazon has paid shipping to you, and will also pay shipping from you to their warehouse. Not that this cost amount would ever matter to a trillion $ company

      • +7

        The people negging you are delusional, and this isn't really what I would expect from a website whose users (for the most part) have a hissy fit when stores have price-errors and demand that some small shop sell them an iPhone for $10.00 or whatever.

        If the store didn't have any stock whatsoever of the NVIDIA Shield, then you would have to accept a return and refund as that's literally the only possible option.

        However, in this case, they very clearly have stock because they're still selling them on their website, hence a replacement is possible, and you have every right to choose a replacement.

        I saw further down that you spoke to a second rep and they agreed to a replacement, however if this option wasn't made available to you, I would just say "screw them", buy the $300 Shield, and return the broken one under that new order.

        • +2

          Yes, this probably would've been my next course of action.

        • +2

          A lot of comments say 'what if .. <insert some other scenario>'

          But under the OP's scenario, the consumer law is clear.. they must replace the item if the OP chooses.

          Amazon tried to do the same to me (via livechat).
          They kept insisting my A129 dashcam that malfunctioned just after their 30 day return period was my problem.
          Then they tried to refund me instead of replacing the item (which I got at a bargain price).

          When I spoke to a human and the replacement was issued/delivered immediately.

          I gave the chat logs to consumer affairs.

  • +4

    I think refund or replacement is reasonable. Although you could try getting the manufacturer to replace it, might have better luck.

    • -5

      When it's "Refund or replacement" is that their choice or mine?

      I feel like it should be mine.

      • +1

        Down vote me all you want, the ACCC clearly state it's my choice.

        • -2

          It's reasonable to request it, but Amazon are not obliged to offer it.

          They have offered a full refund which is an adequate course of action.

          No different to say, if they had no further stock available of a product.

          • @Hybroid: But in this case they're making their fluctuating prices my problem no?

            • @pauly85: Sure, but you're not entitled to the lower discount price after it is no longer offered. In the same way they're not obliged to refund you the difference if it went down to $100 a week after you purchased it for $300. Sometimes that's the way it goes.

              You are entitled for them to pay for return postage of the faulty product should they request you to return it though which is a given of course.

              • @Hybroid: Consumer's choice, don't be a bootlicker.

                They have stock, customer can choose a replacement.

          • +4

            @Hybroid: But it is different, the product IS still available. I think the seller should be offering the replacement as they have the product.

  • -2

    Their only requirement is repair, replace or refund (of which they can choose). If they're unable to repair, they then have to replace or refund. They've offered you a refund. It is unfortunate they're not offering a replacement, but ultimately they only have to offer one or the other.

    • +4

      This is somewhat incorrect. If the problem is a major failure, the customer can choose the remedy (refund, repair or replace). If the problem is only minor in nature, than the retailer can choose.

      • Correct, I used to work in warranty claims.
        The customer only gets a choice if it’s deemed a major fault. If it’s a minor fault, the manufacturer has the right to attempt a repair. I am confused why they haven’t offered a replacement if they’re offering a refund given the item clearly isn’t EOL.

  • +7

    Offered refund, says no, wants more. Your being unreasonable

    • +5

      Switch it around. If I bought this from a bricks and mortar store and it was faulty, if I returned it and the price had gone up $100, they wouldn't be charging me $100 to replace it, I'd get a replacement.

      Why are Amazon any different?

      • +3

        If you returned it to any store, they would give you money back and tell you to move on…

        • +6

          No they wouldn't, they'd replace it.

          • -3

            @pauly85: Your entitled to nothing.. just your money back.. unfortunately that’s how it is, return it and move on with your life

            • @Iwantthebestprice: So return it and have nothing to stream with unless I want to pay an extra $100 on top?

              I don't "want more" as you put it, I want the product I paid for for the price we agreed.

              • +2

                @pauly85: As others have put it. It's not about what you want, it's what your rights are under ACL.

                Under ACL they've offered you a suitable outcome under ACL.

                • +4

                  @Frayin: From the ACCC:

                  "Fixing the problem might involve a repair, replacement, or refund. If it is a major problem you can choose. This is when the product:

                  has a problem that would have stopped someone from buying it if they’d known about it
                  is significantly different from the sample or description
                  is substantially unfit for its common purpose and can’t easily be fixed within a reasonable time
                  doesn’t do what you asked for and can’t easily be fixed within a reasonable time; or
                  it is unsafe.
                  

                  "

                • +4

                  @Frayin: "When a business sells a product with a major problem, or a product that later develops a major problem, it must give the consumer the choice of a refund or a replacement of the same type of product."

                  https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/problem-with-a-product-or-…

                  • +4

                    @pauly85: Looks like some ozbers make up their own consumer rights, and they in turn minimise their rights.

                    • +3

                      @cookie2: I used to think many on here had a reasonable grasp of what was the actual truth when it came to purchasing goods/services (it's why I started frequenting these forums originally).

                      This place seems to have turned into the dumping ground for Whirlpool rejects who believe their opinion is all that matters to make something true.

                      If individuals here would consider if they are expressing an opinion or if it is based on the actual rules/legislation truth before they post it would make it less 'lets all pile on to the OP' and a much more helpful site, as it used to be.

          • @pauly85: Ehh I've had an item I returned to a major retail store to be repaired, few days later they said they couldn't repair it and just refunded me.

        • +3

          You've had that situation have you?

          I think we all know that the norm would be that they'd just swap it over and if the price had gone up they'd ignore it and waive the increase because it's not a change of mind or anything, but a faulty product.

          I've definitely never had the situation you just expressed as the norm, when I've swapped something faulty at a bricks and mortar store, when it was still available on the shelf for purchase. What store has done what you described?

        • Actually that's not even true. If you took a faulty product to JB Hi-Fi and it had increased in price since, they just give you a replacement.

          Incredibly, if you take a faulty product to JB Hi-Fi and it had decreased in price since, they give you a replacement and a refund of the difference.

      • +1

        If you e.g. take it to a general supermarket store WITH YOUR RECIPT, generally What they will do is

        GIVE you refund for the first transaction, then tell you, you have been refunded, chapter closed for that earlier transaction.
        You are free to buy the same item again.

        If however you DONT TAKE YOUR RECIPT, and then ask them to replace it, they will record your ID details and generally they will give you a replacement in this case.

        That's been my experience.

        • +2

          I agree with this in that in my experience they will generally do anything they can to avoid giving you a refund and the only reason they're trying to do it here is because the price has gone up, which is not my problem frankly.

  • +2

    We need a ozbargain code of ethics.

    This is the reason people cringe at me when I talk about ozbargain

    • +1

      Ahh so you think this is tightarse or something? What exactly irks you here? Is the consumer asking for something that they're not entitled too?

  • +5

    I believe OP is being reasonable to request a replacement. If I purchased one item over another and the item I bought was faulty, I wouldn't like to be forced to accept a refund, especially if the item in question and its alternative have risen in price.

    • -1

      Thank you Mr Threepwood.

      I'm quite surprised how many people want to side with Amazon on this given the nature of the site.

      I do accept that I came here for validation rather than genuine debate.

      • I'm quite surprised how many people want to side with Amazon on this given the nature of the site.

        you must be new here, let me inform you.

        There are a couple of companies where you shall speak no ill of, regardless if you are right (like in this situation)

        Let me list them
        - Amazon
        - Aussie broadband

        On the other hand, no matter how good the bargain is, you are welcome to bag and pretend to hate…

        -Harvey Norman
        -Kogan (then proceed to secretly purchase from them)

  • +1

    I'm not being unreasonable here am I?

    From the comments and OP's replies. It seems like OP is not interested "Yes" responses the question.

    It ought to be "I'm being unreasonable, please confirm or don't reply"

    • +3

      I don't deny this is the case.
      I really just wanted to express my gripe with Amazon customer services, which has gone very much downhill in my opinion.

    • +5

      Why would anyone suggest that insisting that Amazon comply with the legislation is somehow 'being unreasonable'?
      Just because there is the pile on mentality here does not somehow validate an incorrect response.
      This thread clearly demonstrates that the more people commenting on things they do not know as fact does not make the OP wrong or unreasonable.

  • +3

    i understand why you would like a replacement…but in the same link you provided, it states "You have the right to a repair, compensation or refund, if the services you received are not right. Which remedy, and who gets to pick, depends on the problem."

    not sure if you didn't read it or just wanted to leave it out. my guess is accc would think a refund is reasonable, maybe not preferable, but reasonable.

    • +2

      Well no, in my eyes the problem is they've sold me a product with a major fault so I get to pick.

      For me, that clause there would be relevant if say I bought a car and a tyre had a puncture. It would be unreasonable to expect them to replace the car, so a repair would be reasonable.

      If they could easily repair this I'd be more than happy.

      Refunding me when I can't buy a replacement for the same price is not reasonable.

      • i think you could try more amazon live chat, you might end up getting one rep who might be willing to do the replacement, or offer you a $10 gift card compensation for your trouble. not worth it going to accc though imo.

        • +3

          I've emailed them but so far they've ignored me.
          I've filmed the TV showing it crashing, I feel like the first Rep didn't believe there was an issue and thought I'd just changed my mind.

          She asked me to send a photograph of the issue and I facetiously said what of, the blank screen?

          Thanks for your input.

          • -2

            @pauly85: Amazon does not have to offer your ACL rights unless you specifically say you are claiming under ACL. It says that on the ACL website. So make sure you say that.
            One issue might be that the item has not been tested other than by you. Is it possible for you to test it in a friend’s PC to make sure it is faulty?

            • +2

              @bbinc:

              Amazon does not have to offer your ACL rights unless you specifically say you are claiming under ACL. It says that on the ACL website. So make sure you say that.
              One issue might be that the item has not been tested other than by you. Is it possible for you to test it in a friend’s PC to make sure it is faulty?

              One problem with your post - it's totally wrong.

              ACL applies - not just if you say the magic words.

              By the way - the device being discussed does not go into a PC.

            • @bbinc: "Amazon does not have to offer your ACL rights unless you specifically say you are claiming under ACL. It says that on the ACL website." That is a very interesting comment, and, if correct, is a good example of what a shambles the simple act of buying a product from a "reputable" retailer has become. Not that I am surprised at the tactic; a major electrical retailer, which has since gone belly-up, tried to get out of giving me a refund on a faulty product once by saying, "We are not the seller, we are just the re-seller, so the rules don't apply to us" (that one didn't work, either). I can't find where Amazon says what you have told us it says, but I would be very interested in seeing exactly how they word their "exemption" from the law. Can you give us the link? Thanks!

  • +6

    I'll just add i do believe you're being reasonable to want a replacement over the refund. I do also however believe Amazon is being reasonable in offering a refund of the purchasing amount.

    Your preferred option of replacement might also be seen as reasonable with the ACCC and could seek further advice from them. The only valid reason for them not accepting a replacement (your preferred option) is they can't provide it to you. The change in price doesn't actually change anything under ACL. It would again come down to the merchant being reasonable with offering a refund vs what your preference is (and them having no valid reason under ACL to deny your preference).

    • +2

      Yes I agree with all of this.
      I realise I've come across as combative here but I've been shocked by Amazon's response.

      • +2

        In my opinion, when online opinionated randoms attack you when you are right, actually calls for a combative/assertive response.

  • +11

    Yes you are entitled to a replacement. It is your choice as per the ACL. Not sure why there are so many comments above suggesting otherwise. It’s pretty cut and dry.

  • +5

    Provided they have stock, I think OP is entitled to a replacement.
    If the product was no longer available, then I could understand a refund being offered.

    If the situation was reversed and he had paid $309 for the item and now it had dropped to $218, does anyone really think Amazon would be offering the full refund instead of replacing it?

    I used to work in electrical / electronics retail (admittedly many years ago) but when I did, a refund was always a last resort.

    • This is a valid point I hadn't thought about (the price drop point).

      I bought a Kinchrome car jack from Repco a while ago which broke the first time I used it. I tried to return it but they didn't have any stock and offered me their own brand one, which I rejected. They did everything they could to resist giving me a refund and seemed completely disgruntled by it.

  • +2

    I fully understand where you are coming from and would want the same thing myself. But if they said no I would take the refund and wait for the next sale.

    Anyhow, did you try another rep? Usually when I have a problem with Amazon orders they do ask if I want a replacement UNLESS it was from International Amazon. If yours was Amazon Au, maybe try a different rep, then ask for an escalation, then accept the refund if they really won't. Good luck

    • Thanks mate.
      It was from Amazon AU, I haven't tried live chat yet as I'm waiting for a response to my email, but that will be my next step.

      • +1

        Definitely try live chat! I didn't even know there was an email contact lol. Just hop on and give it a go now they are 247. Maybe don't mention that you've already emailed them about it though..

  • +1

    Are you sure it's the same seller? And that the seller of your Shield is not the same as the seller of any Shield at the moment? Amazon is a bit weird in that things sold on there are not always sold by or shipped by Amazon.

    • Yes it's all the same seller from the Official NVIDIA store and fulfilled by Amazon.

      • +2

        That should simplify things, if the store you got it from still has it in stock. No reason not to give you a new one through you rights under law.

        • +2

          They've agreed to replace it now.

          • +1

            @pauly85: Sweet. I hope it isn't a software issue that'll happen to the new one. These kind of issues would drive me crazy, half the reason I bought into the Apple ecosystem.

            • @AustriaBargain: I think it might be something thermal related.

              The first time I switch it on I might get 45 mins to an hour out of it, and then after the first crash, if I keep switching it back on it will crash maybe every 15-20 minutes, sometimes less.

              I tried NVIDIA support first and they got me to do a full factory reset (not just a data wipe) but it did nothing.

              I'd be very surprised if it was software.

              I had the tube version for 3 years before this and can't recall a single crash.

      • +1

        Yes it's all the same seller from the Official NVIDIA store and fulfilled by Amazon.

        From my own experience, that's probably the problem. The seller is not Amazon AU. Although fulfilled by Amazon, if the store is not Amazon AU, they normally only offer refund.

      • You need to give your facts right when you post. The seller is not Amazon.

        • It says "Ships from Amazon AU, Sold by Amazon AU".
          Sorry I misread it because there's a link to the "NVIDIA Store".

  • -3

    Clickbait title.
    Amazon accepted return and offered full refund.
    It’s OP who’s doing the denying.

    • -2

      It's not really clickbait is it, just semantics.

  • -3

    Buyer is Denying refund offer of Faulty Nvidia Shield

    (The correct subject)

    • +1

      Buyer is Denying refund offer of Faulty Nvidia Shield

      (The correct subject)

      ACCC disagrees with you there (as has been pointed out numerous times in this thread if you bothered to read the rest of it and not just the first post and title).

      When a business sells a product with a major problem, or a product that later develops a major problem, it must give the consumer the choice of a refund or a replacement of the same type of product.

  • +8

    Glad you got it sorted OP. Sorry you had some of the idiotic comments you had from people who are obviously bias and their love of Amazon or their personal views on pushing for your consumer rights being seen as tightarse or entitled behaviour, created some very unsupportive comments and lots of negs to you. The people that push back, well this behaviour is the main reason we even have these consumer rights in the first place.

  • The same happened with a faulty product I bought. The only option Amazon provided me was a refund because the price had increased since I bought it.

    Looks like their online system automatically removes the replacement option from the consumer when the current price is higher than the purchase price.

    I also spoke to their support and they also refused me a replacement, and the only option I had was to get a refund and buy the replacement at the new higher price. I'm glad it worked out for you after you persisted. Will have to remember to do that next time too.

    • +1

      Yeah I agree it seems to be an automates thing if the price has increased, which is pretty shocking in my eyes.

      The second rep I spoke to didn't even question it, just asked me what my preferred method was to return it.

    • Sometimes they'll also tell you to refund and buy at the higher price and they'll refund the difference.

  • I think people are too quick to defend Amazon.

    OP bought something, it was faulty and Amazon has refunded it.
    All good?

    Well Amazon does still have stock of them, they could replace it but now they are selling it at a higher price.
    I understand if there just simply did not exist any of that product anymore.

    Report it here OP:
    https://www.accc.gov.au/about-us/contact-us/report-a-consume…
    https://www.choice.com.au/shopping/consumer-rights-and-advic…

    • Thanks mate.
      They've agreed to replace it now, just had a rep having a bad day I reckon.

      • Good to hear. Amazon are usually very reasonable and always give the option of a refund or replacement in my experience. Like you said seems you just got a shit rep.

        • I was surprised by the response.

          • @pauly85: Yeap too many people are self-entitled these days !
            Covid effect ?

  • I will add Amazon block abuses. And yes it a grey area where they decide. I'm not sure if you took that in to account for your actions .

    • I've got no concerns about this as it's genuinely faulty.

      If I'd just changed my mind and was pretending it was broken then yes.

  • I'm glad it is resolved… but I'm confused.
    You bought it less than a month ago. Why even talk to anyone at all? Just request a replacement through your account.

    What prevented you from doing that? Maybe I'm missing something?

    Edit: Read some of the comments. So they remove the replacement option if it has gone up in price? Hmm. I've never found that to be the case. Hope they haven't made it that way henceforth.

    • I tried doing a normal return and it goes through the process, but then says "Something went wrong, please contact customer services".

      It acts as though it's an error but I think it's a deliberate way for them to vet returns where the price has gone up.

      • Come to mention it, I have seen that before. Only when I was trying to replace an item for the second time, though.

  • I bought my one from amazon Us on the 25th of Jan 2020 because they were not available on amazon Au

    Last year it started doing random resets so i tried the usual hard reset and that didn't resolve the problem so I took it apart and cleaned off the thermal past and added some new thermal paste and still the same problem so I finally got onto chat with Nvidea and even thought it was over 2 and a half years old they sent out a new power supply and I haven't had a problem since

    • Interesting that it would be the power supply!
      I actually received the replacement today and was just going to swap the unit and send the dodgy one back in the box, but now I'm glad I swapped the power supply over for the new one too.

  • +2

    Wtf you got a faulty product, and to replace it, they wanted to charge you almost $100??
    Sad to see so many people bending over for Jeff but I’m glad you got what you’re entitled to in the end.

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