AdBlue - General Questions and Theories

weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 11:14
Last edited 14/12/2021 - 13:08 by 1 other user

Just a random conversation.

AdBlue shortage is going to lead to increased prices and maybe a logistics / supply chain issue. AdBlue active ingredient is urea - urine - pee. China is the biggest producer of AdBlue (pee).Active ingredient is nitrogen which attaches itself to the carbon particles to reduce emissions from diesel engines. Due to environmental laws, AdBlue is mandatory in most big diesel engines and they will shut off without it. So by taking the piss, China can shut down our transport industry, we've asked for more and they've told us to piss off, I'm pissed off.

So will truckies be able to pee in their AdBlue tank to get their trucks going? Can they bypass the environmental stuff, is it an option to not take the piss? Why is it called AdBlue? It's just making me think of those blue urinal cakes, will they work as an alternative? How does China separate the pee from the rest of the stuff? Do they have different toilets over there to make sure the liquid isn't mixed with the solids or do they pick the solids out?

Lots of questions, I'm confused, if anyone knows more, please enlighten me!

Automotive AdBlue

Comments

  • pharkurnell on 14/12/2021 - 11:18
    +17

    WTF?

  • bloom on 14/12/2021 - 11:21
    +1

    Think scomos been stock piling RemoveBlue
    It’s an honest mistake

  • brendanm on 14/12/2021 - 11:21
    +9

    It's urea. China wants it as they need it for fertiliser. You can delete the need for AdBlue in the ecu of the vehicle. I would image that this is what they will do, rather than just have trucks not run.

    • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 11:24

      thanks!

    • Ade99 on 15/12/2021 - 08:05

      It is very pure urea, hence the DIY option will not really work! Not helped in Oz that IPL will be shutting down their plant in Qld which could be used to produce the stuff, another Princess Anna Chook success ….. I think the price of diesel vehicles which don't use AdBlue will increase even more!

      • brendanm on 15/12/2021 - 08:28
        -1

        I never said that any diy option would work?

  • MS Paint on 14/12/2021 - 11:21
    +2

    Hasn't Australia just secured a new supply from Indonesia and also expecting an agreement with the Middle East to provide further supplies?

    I'm confused

    Just focus on your cows. life will be better that way.

    • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 11:25
      -1

      cows pee, maybe i could use cow pee?

      side note, the cows didn't go ahead, it was too late, the cows are too big, too expensive and the rye grass wasn't green enough for them, so it got slashed and cows will wait until next year :'(

      • HelpMeiCantSee on 15/12/2021 - 10:43

        It’s a terrible thing. The best option I have come across is to drink your pee for 5 days (so it becomes super pure) and on the sixth day you can use it as adblu. There’s a big conspiracy around it, because it’s so easy to make and get, but the mega national corporations want to fleece hard working truckies.

        So get stuck into some chicken milk, and in a week you’ll be good to go.

        *on the 7th day, you may rest. Then repeat, it’ll keep you going through the hard times.

  • USER DC on 14/12/2021 - 11:22
    +3

    Yeah the solution is Hydrogen powered Trucks again. It's hydrogen again that gov need to invest more into

    • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 11:26

      hydrogen would be interesting …

      but lots of big engines are diesel-electric (for example, most modern trains at the train company i work for :)

    • brendanm on 14/12/2021 - 12:41

      How much power does it take to produce hydrogen?

      • Euphemistic on 14/12/2021 - 16:03

        Lots of power for creation of hydrogen. It’s really only economical using excess renewables to create hydrogen for use when renewables aren’t suited.

        Hydrogen combustion engines aren’t economically viable. They work, but it’s better to make a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle than runs from an electric motor - hydrogen electric.

        • brendanm on 14/12/2021 - 17:41

          Correct, thankyou for typing what I couldn't be bothered with. People like to say "hydrogen!" without working out how you actually get the hydrogen.

        • HelpMeiCantSee on 15/12/2021 - 10:45

          That’s what modern “hydrogen powered” is- AFAIK no new tech has been developed for H2 combustion, it’s all fuel cell derivatives.. A chemical reaction utilising a special semi permeable membrane that results in electricity, not combustion.

          • Euphemistic on 15/12/2021 - 16:31

            @HelpMeiCantSee: Yep. Hydrogen fuel cells are great, except the amount of energy needed to get enough hydrogen to make it worthwhile. It is far, far more energy efficient to generate electricity and put it in a battery.

            • HelpMeiCantSee on 15/12/2021 - 22:23

              @Euphemistic: It is, and pretty significantly so, but the theory is to use excess renewables to generate the stored hydrogen.

  • c64 on 14/12/2021 - 11:33
    +2

    can't the truckers just pee in the diesel as they fill up

    • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 11:36

      separate tank, they'll have to pee into a bottle while driving and pour the bottle into an additive tank (i'm guessing it's like power steering fluid / wiper fluid tank)

  • pegaxs on 14/12/2021 - 11:46
    +6

    AdBlue itself isn't going to cause prices to rise, but it is going to cause a knock on effect. As it gets more scarce, its price will go up. The good part is that you don't use as much AdBlue as you do diesel, so a lot of vehicles that need it, if they filled up recently, they may be good for a while.

    AdBlue is a proprietary name that has just become a catch-all for or is made under licence by different manufacturers.

    No you can't just piss in your AdBlue tank. No it isn't made from recycled piss. For much the same reason we don't use "sweat" as a source of table salt.

    Some diesel engines require it to run and the ECU will just throw errors or not run if there is no AdBlue. Some manufacturers may allow it to be turned off, but it is possibly going to affect warranty and emissions so many won't do it because there are huge fines for messing with emissions controls on vehicles.

    And most of the rest of your post is just stupid attempts at humour, thus, not worth answering.

  • AndyC1 on 14/12/2021 - 11:59
    +6

    Post from someone who has NFI.

    • Euphemistic on 14/12/2021 - 16:04

      But does seem to acknowledge that fact and may be willing to learn.

      • AndyC1 on 14/12/2021 - 16:05

        Should have used google before posting.

        • PeterSnoot on 15/12/2021 - 07:59

          I reckon the OP knew more than they were letting on and was just "taking the piss".

  • Loot N Plunder on 14/12/2021 - 12:02
    +2

    Last month, South Korea took the emergency step of importing 27,000 litres of urea solution from Australia
    https://www.news.com.au/travel/a-global-shortage-of-diesel-e…

    Look what happens when you put all your eggs in the same basket
    What do you think might happen if you bag out the person carrying that basket without having sourced another basket?
    The liberal nationals should halt all iron ore, coal, food just to show them who the real boss is ;)

    • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 14:10
      -1

      this is on the corporations doing this

      its like people blaming biden for the price of oil

      • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 15:32
        -4

        Ummm, biden closed down the keystone pipeline and shut down onshore oil mining when the USA had become "energy independent" (i.e. not having to import from o/s) …

        Unless you meant the ship's that are backlogged off shore?

        Or signing multi-trillion dollar spending packages and handing out free money to create an inflation crisis?

        Or changes to taxation and laws that have lead multinational companies and foreign countries to lose faith in the USD leading to it being devalued on stock exchange (leading to more USD needed to buy oil from other countries) …

        But nothing to do with Biden at all …

        • DogGunn on 14/12/2021 - 15:51
          +5

          Biden hasn't shut down "onshore oil mining". He expanded a federal oil moratorium, so further oil development cannot occur on federal land. US oil production is also at it highest level ever, but so is consumption, and oil prices are set by the market - I doubt you want the government to set the prices, right?

          Seriously, it would help if your post isn't just American conservative media talking points verbatim.

          • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 15:54
            +1

            @DogGunn: yep this

            its not as if biden is all powerful… i would say the same for trump

            this is OPEC's doing

            should we blame Biden for $2 petrol here too?

            this is affecting the whole world not just the US

          • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 15:57
            -6

            @DogGunn: ohhh, you're trying to strawman …

            he shut down the pipeline and prevented any increase in oil mining activities (how many existing oil derricks had to be shut down due to the expanded moratorium?)

            so yes, he didn't shut it down entirely, he just crippled an industry that was on track to provide sufficient oil supplies to NOT lead to an increase in prices …

            you lefties all buy into the CNN narrative, sorry mate, but your idol Cuomo and the other Cuomo have already been exposed as criminals

            • DogGunn on 14/12/2021 - 16:00
              +3

              @weezlebub:

              ohhh, you're trying to strawman …
              you lefties all buy into the CNN narrative, sorry mate, but your idol Cuomo and the other Cuomo have already been exposed as criminals

              LOL - I'm not you're even aware of the irony here. The best part is I don't even have access to CNN nor do I watch it, but I shouldn't even portend to address what you've said.

              he shut down the pipeline and prevented any increase in oil mining activities (how many existing oil derricks had to be shut down due to the expanded moratorium?)

              He didn't shut down a the pipeline… phase 1 to 3b are constructed and commissioned and functioning. Phase 4 was cancelled due to Biden, but that doesn't help America's oil independence given it was a link to Canada…

              he just crippled an industry that was on track to provide sufficient oil supplies to NOT lead to an increase in prices …

              The price would've increased even if there was sufficient domestic production (which there is). The American oil industry operates in a free market. They would've sold wherever (and do) they can get the best prices.

              • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 16:08
                +5

                @DogGunn: its amazing to me that on an aus forum some wannabee yankee septic froths at the mouth and pants at the name "Biden"

                i personally dont give a shit about what goes on in us politics especially here but surely $2 petrol here is biden's fault because…. "reasons"… and theres a rant about cnn and the cuomos???

                like anyone here except this clown cares????

    • YRT on 14/12/2021 - 15:39
      +1

      By halting all iron ore, coal, AUD exchange rate would collapse; 0.2 - 0.3 AUD/USD is my guess.

      Customer is always the real boss. :)

      • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 15:44

        but, by re-introducing tariffs, our government generates income that doesn't come from our citizens and china pay a little more

        • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 15:56

          china is a country that will let its citizens and companies go with rolling blackouts so they dont have to buy coal

          and they commit to going to nuclear

          they aint gonna bend because that aiint their MO

          that's a dangerous country

          also the world is a big market, they already went to the US to cover what they're not buying from here

          • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 15:58

            @tonyjzx: great, we'll stop sending them yellow cake too win-win :)

            • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 16:10
              +3

              @weezlebub: Increasingly, uranium is imported from Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Canada, Namibia, Niger and Australia….

              IMO we shouldnt be selling it china full stop but hey… LNP

      • Loot N Plunder on 14/12/2021 - 16:15
        +1

        What is Australia's twenty five million going to do to China's one billion four hundred million
        The reality is We need china more than china needs us and the liberal nationals have done nothing in the past eight years to change any of this
        Their idea is, To stupid to be stupid. The liberal nationals thinking about going to war with our biggest exporter and our biggest supplier

        https://tradingeconomics.com/australia/imports-by-country

        https://tradingeconomics.com/australia/exports-by-country

        • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 17:00
          +2

          yep this is it

          on sheer numbers alone its terribly one sided

          with a consumer market of over a billion you have a situation where individuals of a high net worth in china probably outnumbers the entire population of the UK

          what the US have done is quite clever… on the one hand they stoke up anti china sentiment, they will withdraw diplomatic support on the next olympics and they will rightly call out uighur genocides and other human rights issues while at the same time they scoop up the import trade into china from 'partners' like australia

          oh and that French submarines things too

          all the while Australia loses everywhere…. because the country is run by a guy who failed at being the CEO of Tourism Australia and failed at controlling his bowels at Engadine Maccas.

          australia looks like a bunch of f'ing clowns to anyone who matters

          btw. same party who chased out Ford and Holden

  • TEER3X on 14/12/2021 - 12:05
    +1

    If it's really pee, high nitrogen, then pee from a dog will be far more concentrated.

    I've read some cars need the official container and the workaround is to buy one bottle and when used/emptied, cut the nozzle area to work as a funnel, then just used the repco/SCA home brand stuff.

  • pao2x on 14/12/2021 - 12:06
    +2

    Urea is usually 9.3g/dl in urine or approx 9.3%.

    Adblue is 32.5% urea

    Time to bring out the pissing pot again, or Australia won't have a pot to piss on.

  • netjock on 14/12/2021 - 12:11
    +1

    AdBlue is made from natural gas and natural gas has gone through the roof. They also make fertiliser from natural gas.

    Theory it is similar to the natural gas that is coming out of sewerage farms and dumps but obviously we've gotten used to cheap natural gas. There is the problem. If people just peed onto their veggie gardens. Every little bit helps.

    • fimmwolf on 14/12/2021 - 12:26

      and Australia has shit tonnes of natural gas. But we lack the manufacturing facilities, and previously it's always been cheaper and easier to import it.

    • c64 on 14/12/2021 - 13:19
      +1

      i'm partial to peeing on everything in my garden, unless it is late at night. it doesn't stink as long as it is fresh and you spread it around

      • netjock on 16/12/2021 - 11:44

        Doesn't stink long as you dilute it with water afterwards. For farmers since they don't live near densely populated areas it doesn't matter

  • LordSydney on 14/12/2021 - 13:44
    -1

    It's just more engineered FUD like omicron. Dig into the intent behind it.

  • Drakesy on 14/12/2021 - 13:56
    +1

    What i don't get is that you can still run a truck without it, yes it'll belch out more NO's but you can still physically drive.

    Yet another thing where our government has claimed to reduce our reliance on China when the complete opposite has been happening.

    • weezlebub on 14/12/2021 - 15:34

      actually, the ECU (electronic control unit) will kill the engine if there's no AdBlue detected

      • jizmo on 14/12/2021 - 16:16

        Remember a bob cat operated telling me he ran out in his truck cost him 100s to get it reset

      • Drakesy on 14/12/2021 - 16:22

        Well thats a bit of a crap design.
        Surely we have enough piss in Australia to make our own.

        Just ask some pub goers to piss in a tank and she'll be right.
        https://unsealed4x4.com.au/can-piss-adblue-tank/
        Actually nvm

        • recycledrevenge on 14/12/2021 - 16:25

          If the vehicle would still work without AdBlue, people just wouldn't use it. Defeats the purpose.

          • Drakesy on 14/12/2021 - 16:29
            +3

            @recycledrevenge: The irony is you could be in the outback, with a car that won't start because it's low on adblue.
            As in the car will work perfectly fine, just wont get you back to civilisation because of some NO's.

            There should be an emergency defeat device.

        • LordSydney on 14/12/2021 - 17:17
          +1

          Might have to dehydrate the piss before it reaches high enough levels of urea. lol

    • kizzy on 14/12/2021 - 16:15

      It might work if you just put demineralised water in the AdBlue tank.
      (But you try first)

      • Drakesy on 14/12/2021 - 17:40

        I believe there's sensors in the exhaust that measure the NO's in the system which will shut off the car unfortunately. it's not necessary like a fuel tank if it's empty

        • kizzy on 14/12/2021 - 17:46
          +1

          Yeah I guess, you might get away with it on some older models. I've run out on a couple of different makes of heavy vehicles and it keeps going despite the warnings. They could go a fair way before limp mode.
          On one stupid occasion I used a supplied jug of "AdBlue" to fill up, and after spilling some realised is was some sort of cleaning liquid that had been put in the wrong jug. Dunno what happened to that vehicle in the end but can't be good.

          • tonyjzx on 14/12/2021 - 19:48

            @kizzy: early adblue systems can be circumvented but after the VW affair they really cracked down hard

            also i'm not sure how the govt. treats EPA circumvention

            if you remove a cat you're up for fines around $10,000? more?

            for a company to something similar… well… GOOD LUCK

            • kizzy on 14/12/2021 - 19:53

              @tonyjzx: Yeah it's true but the reality is you'll never be caught. I'd say the biggest issue for vehicle owners in voiding warranty.

        • Ade99 on 15/12/2021 - 08:11

          unless you bipass the NOC sensor it wil shut down the engine due to excessive NO levels. I would myself be more worried about the carcinogenic VOC emissions like benzene!

      • ol mate on 15/12/2021 - 10:41

        From memory, Audi had to recall the Q7 because people did this (and the ECU didn't pick it up)!

        Edit: not a recall, just a Stop Sell
        https://www.carsguide.com.au/car-news/audi-working-on-soluti…

  • TheOtherLeft on 15/12/2021 - 08:27
    +3

    This country has no blo*dy clue about strategic planning. AdBlue is made from Urea and distilled water. Urea can be produced from Natural Gas, atmospheric Nitrogen plus heat/pressure. Australia has plenty of all of them so can make enough Urea to never have this problem again. We don't need to import it.

    https://www.incitecpivotfertilisers.com.au/~/media/Files/IPF…

    • Ade99 on 15/12/2021 - 09:11
      -2

      …and Anna Chook and her green mates want to convert the plant to make 'green hydrogen'.

      • tonyjzx on 15/12/2021 - 10:48
        +4

        scomo: mate i dont hold the hose

        you cant expect the LNP to get into these issues…

        unless its to gift $440 mil. to a mate who owns a shell company in the Bahamas to study the viabiltiy of an adblue plant in a Liberal electorate… that is to come online in 2040

  • OzHunterNSW on 15/12/2021 - 21:01
    +1

    Australia's TV General failed in Afghanistan, failed NSW in Covid, and failed the Nation with adblue.

    Spending billions on weapons of gas destruction… when the Nation can be crippled by having no "amble" what a pathetic vassal govt

  • targaboy on 15/12/2021 - 21:19

    Can’t use human or animal pee due to the amount of ammonia which needs to be separated out. I’ve heard that trucks will run without it but once sensors detect lack of Adblue the ECU knocks off 30% power to the engine, rendering the truck to be pretty useless towing a loaded trailer.

  • LFO on 15/12/2021 - 21:31

    Lots of questions, I'm confused, if anyone knows more, please enlighten me!

    From your intro you have decided a lot of things:

    There is a shortage.
    Will affect transport.
    China will make it even worse for us.

    So, what is the question?

    Nothing better that a self-fulfilling prophecy.

  • tonyjzx on 17/12/2021 - 08:21
    +1

    https://www.drive.com.au/news/emissions-software-could-be-di…

    truly mental giants in charge

    • weezlebub on 17/12/2021 - 09:57

      wow …

      1. to keep trucks running, government is thinking of turning off the emissions software
      2. greenies say "you can't do that, some truckers don't want it either"
      3. government doesn't do it
      4. trucks don't run, people lose jobs, shops have no food, they use smaller trucks (10x the number of trucks due to less capacity)
      5. greenies complain about price rises
      • tonyjzx on 17/12/2021 - 10:00
        +1

        tbf its not as if people complaining about current prices rises on EVERYTHING makes a difference…

  • coffeeinmyveins on 17/12/2021 - 14:59

    So will truckies be able to pee in their AdBlue tank to get their trucks going?

    Literally two seconds of googling will give you this answer.

    No.

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