https://www.9news.com.au/national/nsw-speed-camera-warning-s…
Guess i will be running WAZE from the google play store full time and updating on the regular for other drivers on the road now.
Personally i feel this is just another cash grab and ultimately they want to roll out more privately owned mobile speed camera's so they can nab you anywhere at anytime without signage.
What do you all think about this? and is there anything that we can do to keep the current system how it is?
@highdealer: Do you legitimately think people who were speeding previously will just…stop? That's extremely naive.
People who receive speeding fines will not reflect on their behaviour and will instead blame the government for their woes.
At least with warning signs, people speeding will generally slow down at that particular moment, potentially avoiding crashes in high risk areas
@Zarcady: If they get enough speeding fines they do.
Once you lose your license for speeding, the vast majority of people would change their behaviour.
If you’re blaming the government (however you do that) and just continue speeding, the system is setup to stop you from being on the road.
To this sounds like a piss weak argument from someone who doesn’t like the idea they’re more likely to get caught speeding.
I reckon there'll still be a sign up there - the one that tells you that you have just gone through a mobile speed camera zone.
Pretty good deterrent
hahahaha - trolling the speeders…
The effect of the sign is only temporary, can't speak for others but as soon as I'm couple of hundred metres down the road, it's a slightly more pressed right pedal.
Really? Getting a $300 or whatever fine in the mail doesn't deter people from speeding in the future, or make them think "Hey maybe I should be more cognizant of my speed when I drive"? Really?
Not as much as you would think, given these fines have been going out for decades.
But if you see a speed camera sign, you slow down.
There is one near me where people routinely travel 10kmh under the speed limit as they pass.
As Fletcher Reede once said "Stop breaking the law (profanity)"
Reduce the number of speeding cameras and introduce Finland's speeding fine system, where the fine is based on the offender's disposable income.
Or….retain the number of speed cameras and introduce Finland's speeding fine system
sweet so everyone on the dole, just flogs it 200 km/hr through the city, hits your mum on the way, and then gets no fine.
Not that the Daily Telegraph is any more reliable, however the OP is misleading us with the original title; only the mobile speed camera warnings will be removed: https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/no-more-warning-s…
Plus you can tell which vehicles are mobile speed camera ones
Ewwww, subscription only article… Cant read it because I'm not a paying customer…
Plus you can tell which vehicles are mobile speed camera ones
I will guess that eventually the camera car's distinctive colour scheme will also be removed and all camera cars will become "under cover" camera vehicles.
https://7news.com.au/travel/driving/mobile-speed-camera-warn…
Just for you pegaxs :)
I will guess that eventually the camera car's distinctive colour scheme will also be removed and all camera cars will become "under cover" camera vehicles.
Good point, but I'm pretty sure they're all Ford Territories; just be wary of random white ones parked on the grass along a major road
Around the corner from my work is a place that fits out these vehicles. They are neither white nor Ford Territories.
@uncompressed: Concede on the white, but not the Ford Territory bit.
Dunno what vehicle the ute-looking ones are
Just for you pegaxs :)
Awww… thanks, buddy.
And all the mobile speed cameras in my area are all dual cab utes, mostly Isuzu or Ford Rangers.
@kerfuffle: The one in the photo of this article is the exact one I'm referring to. Can't recall what make it is now.
https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/new-speed-camera…
@uncompressed: That's from Victoria. This thread is about NSW mobile speed cameras, not Victorian ones.
Only the initial NSW roll out vehicles were Territories. After that Commodore, Falcon, D-Max and Colorado utes were most popular. No idea what they use now as I live in QLD (they love Merc Vitos and Isuzu D-Max/MU-Xs up here).
You can install this in your browser to bypass paywalls - https://github.com/iamadamdev/bypass-paywalls-chrome
Awesome! thanks for this!
Plus you can tell which vehicles are mobile speed camera ones
Not if you're going really fast!!
Sounds like the government is coming up with new ideas to claw back money from all this covid spending. I can sorta see why, Victorians contribute more than double the amount of money in fines, despite having a smaller population than NSW.
They're also tripling the number of hours mobile speed camera's spend on the road as part of this new change
https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/where-speeding-fine-revenue…
The number of self righteous law abiding citizens on this site always astounds me.
Pretty easy and understandable to speed depending on the situation. I'd rather people concentrate on the road than their speedo.
Really? You are greatly surprised every time you visit here?
Maybe it's just that the majority of people in general don't share your opinion.
Maybe it's just that the majority of people in general don't share your opinion.
They hold the opinion, but they don't "share" it because it's futile to argue with virtue signallers.
me being one of them hehe
Bookmark this link.
https://roadsafety.transport.nsw.gov.au/speeding/speedcamera…
New red-light speed cameras being rolled out
Two new red-light speed cameras will replace the two existing fixed speed cameras on Memorial Drive at Corrimal to target speeding as well as red-light running at the Memorial Drive intersections with Railway Street and Towradgi Road from June 2020. The existing fixed speed cameras on Memorial Drive will be switched off before the new red-light speed cameras commence operation. There will be no overlapping period of operation for the new and existing cameras.
Real easy fix for this…. Don't speed. Speeding fines are an opt-in scheme, more akin to a speeding "toll" than to rEvEnUe rAiSiNg.
The government lays out some rules for you to read, and if you like the rules and think they are acceptable, you can apply for a membership card after agreeing to their terms and condition (one of those conditions is "don't break the rules"). If you don't agree to the terms and conditions, you are free to not pay the membership and to ask your local member of parliament to have the rules changed to suit your needs. They may change them, the may not.
Rules don't always have to be followed. I'm not going to go into what some rules have done to humanity, but the sole driver behind these rules is revenue raising.
The government could do far better things like ban pokies if they cared about our wellbeing.
Has SlavOz become your life coach? Seems like you'll be wanting the 4k rev limiter installed soon.
Rules don't always have to be followed.
I agree, at times, there is a always an exception or a reason to bend or break rules.
I'm not going to go into…
Thank Christ for that.
the sole driver behind these rules is rEvEnUe rAiSiNg.
You see, that’s where you are wrong. Traffic infringement fines, by their nature, are totally optional. They are an opt-in system. You are free to hand in your license or not drive, or, heaven forbid, drive to the road rules that you that you agreed too when you obtained your license.
Revenue raising is done via things that are non optional. Raising taxes, adding new taxes, etc. things that you cannot get away from paying. And I know you won’t agree here, because you’ve been watching to much Today/Tonight and A Current Affair, but traffic fines are more like tolls, totally avoidable if you just drive to the terms and conditions outlined in your member’s handbook.
And as I said above, you don’t have to like the rules, but you signed a contract saying that you will abide by them. And the best thing is, if you don’t like the road rules, you can take up petitioning your local member for parliament and anyone else you can get to follow your cause and have a stab at getting a law you don’t like, changed.
And the sole driver for road rules is not rEvEnUe RAiSiNg. I don’t think that “don’t drive at 110km/h, in a truck, through a school zone” was set up specifically for rEvEnUe rAiSiNg. “Give way to oncoming traffic if you are turning across their path” wasn’t set up just to extract money from stupid people.
blah blah “pokies” blah…
Either a straw man or irrelevant. (Or maybe similar, as pokies are also optional)
SlavOz become your life coach?
The guy is always complaining about road rules and how unfair they are and how they need to be changed. I’m sorry, but that guy is on your side of the fence, not mine. Plenty of comments he has made on here where I am definitely not on his side of the discussion. At least Tracy Grimshaw isn’t my life coach.
Anyway, it seems you’re upset about something and rather passionate about ReVeNuE rAiSiNg, and I’m not going to change your mind any time soon, so I’ve said all I’m going to say to you on the matter.
If this is all about safety (and not revenue raising), why do traffic infringements have to carry fines have to carry fines at all?
Why not simply run "double demerits" permanently that basically means for just about any offence you get one warning in a rolling three year period and then a second one sees your licence suspended? More serious offences would then basically be instant suspension.
Any government that is actually serious about road safety (and wants to prove that it's not about revenue raising) will go with the above. But none will. I wonder why that is?
Personal disclosure … haven't been booked for speeding or any other traffic offence in about 15 years.
Of course revenue raising is part of it, we all know that.
But your system would not make the roads safer. It will cause great inconvenience to many and the really dangerous drivers will just ignore their suspensions anyway, and other taxes would probably rise to pay for the shortfall in fines.
P.s. well done on your 15 year streak. Mine is about 8 and counting.
Points has no immediate consequence on ones wallet/life.
If you want to donate money, then slam on the accelerator.
Because they want to discourage people from committing traffic infringements (by making them pay fines), but not necessarily taking their licence off them (due to the flow-on effects in lots of areas).
Will double demerits actually result in a licence suspension if you get two offences in a 3 year period?
Anyway, I don't think that will be the case because ultimately people are still let off with a warning initially.
It would be great if less people had licences in Sydney though, that'd take crap drivers off the road and also possibly result in less traffic as lots of people in Sydney don't deserve to have a licence with the way they drive.
It’s a voluntary tax…
Fines or monetary penalties are not taxes.
"whooah" is not spelt correctly.
Exactly this. Speeding fines are totally optional. They are a toll. If you want to get somewhere faster, you have to pay a premium. Want to get there in normal time, don't use the "toll" speeds.
It's also regressive in some respects. A lot more speed cameras in "less affluent" areas.
But how will I be able to waggle my finger and berate some idiot on here pleading for a way out of a speeding ticket (already on 11 demerit points and will lose their licence for speeding), by saying that he must have passed at least 2 massive signs saying there's a speed camera ahead, if there aren't any signs anymore?
*some idiot's friend, you mean?
yes finally they do the right thing.
warning about camera is just stupid.
we need to catch fine jail those bastardoes not warning them
we need to catch fine jail those bastardoes, not warn
ingthem
FTFY, because it sounded like you wanted to gaol the people who were not doing the warning… (big difference between "let's eat grandma" and "let's eat, grandma")
Or helping cousin jack, off the horse and…
I agree, it's so idiotically stupid that this is even a thing. I mean it's just so idiotic I cannot believe it's a thing, I really can't.
What if I told you that you don’t HAVE to speed? I have been driving for more than 20 years and never had a speeding fine in all that time. Wonder why that is.
My last speeding fine was in 1992 according to the police officer last time I had a breath test and checked on my license. He was impressed.
Your a tram driver ?
Domino's e-cyclist
The thing is, if you've ever lived in Sydney or seen the roads here, you will see how much it sucks to drive a car in general here.
People here have no idea how to drive, honestly I feel like every single day during peak hour I am stuck behind someone doing 10km below the limit. The way people drive here, factored with the fact this city has the most toll roads of like, anywhere on the planet, and the fact that the roads are so narrow and crap forces people who have a propensity towards speeding to speed.
That being said, I don't speed because I didn't grow up here, but most people I've met who live here seem to think speeding is okay. I guess it doesn't help that there are literally some idiotic speed limits on some Sydney roads. The road system here is just the worst.
I grew up in Sydney, only moved when I got married so I am very familiar with the roads. I visit a few times a year when COVID isn’t ruining it. I drive there and back each time. Still never had a speeding ticket.
Maybe the driver education system was better when you were learning to drive. I'm also sure there were less cars on the road back then too. Sydney these days is so crowded, people only care about themselves, the road system hasn't been built to accommodate the population growth (it's worse than Melbourne, and I thought Melbourne was seriously bad) and all these factors have lead to people driving like selfish idiots.
I refuse to opt in to this tax!
I will opt out in the most cunning fashion, by doing, say, 109 in a 110 MAXIMUM speed zone? That way the swine will never 'tax' me! (the clue is in the word limit, I can legally do 108 in a 110 if that's the safe speed to make progress at, who knew?!)
if you can't regulate your speed and 'accidentally' speed, should you be in charge of a car? Given the absolute weapons that live around me in NSW, I'd say no!
If i ever do get knocked off the 'high horse' and get a ticket, I know it'd deter me from doing it again and make me ensure I didn't pay the tax a second time around!
People who do 109 are the absolute worst scum I've ever had the displeasure of spending 4 hours overtaking at 110
Or..Don't, and arrive at your destination 50km away exactly 15 seconds later than if you'd wasted all that stress sitting in the loneliness of the far right lane!
Wait… 1km/h for 4 hours… They had a 4km long vehicle? Surely that's not legal!
OR… that would mean an ordinary car travelling at 109.996km/h (?) rough guess, with "that guy" determined not to be 'held up', trying to overtake.
But I love the idea of a 4km vehicle!
Well said. It's kind of scary that people think it is hard to glance at the speedo or to be aware of their speed as if being aware of their speed is a "distraction". If that's the case, having any sort of wandering thought such as "what should I eat for dinner tonight?" is also a major distraction. If that kind of thing is actually a distraction, the person should not have a licence whatsoever.
I thought the NSW Government came out a few years ago and expressly stated that these were for safety and not revenue and that why there would be warnings.
Having the warnings also slows people down, which is the safety element. I wonder how many well intentioned law abiding citizens have found them selves drifting over the limit - hardly speed crazed demons.
Also great to see that the already peak hour tortuous commutes will be lengthened as the just-in-casers hit the brakes at every green light intersection.
Definitely a greed move, and we can kiss goodbye one of the few remaining common senses initiatives hitherto untouched by the Nanny State.
PS No, I don't feel better after my rant
PSS 20 Year streak and counting.
The funny thing is that 10 years ago, Labor did the same thing and the Libs had a right old bitch about it and reinstated warning signs when they came in power.
Labor's shadow transport minister is currently having a right old bitch on the radio about how it's 'unproven' that this is for safety reasons.
Just goes to show the difference between a new government (bringing new ideas to the table) and an incumbent government which has let the public servants rule over them a-la 'Yes, Minister'.
There are so many red light / speed cameras, mobile cameras, highway patrol in this state anyway kinda moot point really. Signage in this state is shit anyway.
https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/embed?hl=en_US&mid=1oHDp4e…
Not sure if a cash grab or bad interpretation of statistics.
"Speeding was responsible for 136 deaths and 2941 injuries on NSW roads last year."
In terms of an accident you can technically be speeding but under the limit because you're not driving to conditions when it comes to an accident. Conditions can mean bad weather, poor viability or poor condition of vehicle. I've seen cars with blown shocks past rego year after year that I thought were downright dangerous to drive.
Then there is the issue of the NSW drivers license issued by corn flake packets I see daily …..
As long as the tolerance is changed to 0.1kph (joke) like in Victoria, should be ok avoid this tax.
I'm glad that someone else understands the NSW definition of speeding causing a crash is very different to what the public think, especially when the Govt spruikes it to justify their speed camera programs!
By signage you mean speed signs right? I have to agree. The lack of signage is just shocking compared to Melbourne. There is also a lot more stupid signage on the road surface compared to signs being on the side of the road. That was one thing I noticed right away about Sydney, you have to look down at the road to see the speed limit instead of at car-level height.
Can't agree more about how NSW drivers cannot (profanity) drive. It's just mind boggling how shit everything related to driving is in Sydney. The roads suck, drivers are clueless, the only good roads are tolled (I am assuming they must be good as I don't drive on toll roads), the roads are constantly busy etc. At least the PT system works properly.
Kinda similar to HWP hiding on the side of the road.
HWP can catch you speeding from far away, where as mobile camera only catches right before the car.
But mobile speed camera will ding you for going 2ks over, while HWP will generally let you slide past even if you're doing a little bit over
You've generally got to be doing 10+ for the NSW HWP to get interested in chasing you down. School, 40 or 50 zones though might see them still go for under 10kph speedsters though.
You also have the chance with the NSW HWP writing down your speeding ticket if you have a good driving record and are decent to them. Have known a few people to say do 20+ but only get written up as 10-19 over. That is exactly what proper policing of speed limits should be about.
Have driven past HWP 125 in a 110 zone, they flashed their headlights then that's about it. They do give a shit once you've past the 130 mark judging by my tickets BUT they do generally write it down. Less so in recent years…
As an aside, even though they wrote the ticket down they still record the actual detected speed somewhere. Tried to argue one of my recent tickets with SDRO, I was being cheeky even though the HWP wrote the ticket a category down and SDRO kindly reminded me the actual detected speed.
Hmm so the liberal government wants more revenue. They don't stand for anything do they.
"liberal party", their own name is a lie.
mate those coffers need refilling to pay more bungs…
This is how we're going to pay for overvalued purchase land by the Liberals.
Does QLD currently have this. Relatively new driver here and have never seen one
QLD only have signs for 24 hours speed cameras. QLD also have those portable speed cameras that look like road construction equipment. If you are travelling to the gold coast there will always be at least 3 cameras in both directions. That does not include the fixed ones. I think there are 2 of those.
Coming from Victoria to NSW years ago, I was so happy to see signs about mobile speed cameras. It makes people aware of black spots and places where they need to be mindful of their speed. Driving around Melb made me paranoid and overtly focused on the speedo rather than the road and things around me.
I think this is a backward move for NSW.
Coming from Victoria, I found it mind boggling the police warn speeders to slow down for 400m so that they can get off scot-free.
I don't understand the argument that if people have to watch their speed, it means they end up paying less attention to what is going on around them. You should be aware at all times of everything that is happening when driving a car — your speed, who is (potentially) in your blindspot, any cars around your car, the speed limit, whether or not you are coming up to a red light etc. Cars are not toys, they can cause death and people need to drive as if they could cause serious injury if they aren't paying attention.
And right on cue, the Nationals with ‘but think of the poor farmers’
Would rather drivers focus on their driving rather than on their speedo.
Even though I’m personally against this i know it’s for the greater good. Most motorists struggle to drive properly at best of times, speeding just magnifies their incompetence
I've always thought that having warning signs for speed camera is so stupid. It defeats the purpose of the speed cameras.
Location of speed cameras should not be publcised and there should be many mobile speed cameras so that people don't think about speeding and if they do, they have a reasonable chance of getting caught. I always laugh when I see those mobile speed camera warnings, seriously, they are useless, don't advertise where the speed cameras are.
Such a waste of money putting up those signs.
so that people don't think about speeding and if they do, they have a reasonable chance of getting caught.
Ok, let's break this down.
Basically - what you're saying, and what the government have convinced you of, is that everyone should be able to almost perfectly sit on a set speed throughout their entire driving life. Let's say you're a worker who commutes 45 minutes per way each day + weekends, that's 0.75hr x 2 times x 5 days + 2 hours on weekend = 9.5 hours per week * 52 weeks * 40 year working life = 19,760 hours where you think that people can perfectly sit on ever changing speed limits without ever going over them.
It's such an absurd and brainwashed idea.
People should be paying attention to the road and driving to the conditions, the speed limit is not some magical thing that if you follow it you're guaranteed to be safe. The way the australian government has brainwashed the public is completely irresponsible and takes away focus from much more important driving issues like:
If you can't even stay within the speed limit, how can you focus on fatigue, driver training and driving to conditions? That's like trying to run before you can crawl.
You don't have to drive at the speed limit. The point is to stay below it, so in a 60 zone, target 55km/h and constantly monitor it. I notice that your car speedometer usually over reports your speed, this has been the case with a few cars of different brands I've driven. Its always 3-5km below the speed reported on the GPS.
You are just making excuses for people who speed, there's no excuse.
how can you focus on fatigue, driver training and driving to conditions?
Because those things are multitudes more important than sticking to a relatively arbitrarily defined number?
Reality is - the speed limit is chosen by road designers as a "catch all". In terms of keeping people safe, it's role is miniscule.
It's magnitudes safer to be in a 2020 model car with high performance tyres and large brakes doing 65km/h in a 60 zone (technically speeding), than it is driving a 1990s car, with poorly balanced suspension and nearing the end of their life tyres, tiny drum brakes, but doing 55km/h in that 60 zone.
Yet the safer car would be breaking the law, and according to half the people posting here, should be fined for doing so, whilst the other much less safe car is perfectly fine.
It's this utter ignorance of reality and blind obedience to a law that is so stupid.
We know that speed limits are a generality to cater for the vast differences in cars on the road - therefore we should APPLY the law in a similar general and generous way (similar to most other sensible countries in the world that don't rely so heavily on speeding fine revenue)
@Odin: With the greatest of respect, making statements on OzB on how we should apply the law is irrelevant, because (I assume) we are not the law makers or the police or the magistrates, etc.
We, along with the majority of the population, are required to comply with the laws of the day or pay the penalties. In parallel, we can petition and otherwise try to influence the law makers to make a change, or become one of the law makers.
@GG57: We are the ones who vote for the politicians who will enact legislation. It's our opinion that ultimately should decide how the laws should be applied.
I'd really like to shift a few opinions on here away from the 'authoritarian state' side of things, even on small issues like this.
@Odin: Your intention is understood.
And I generally agree that some political parties (in control in some parliaments) appear to be more and more authoritarian.
I just wonder if a populist driven change effort would be better spent on those bigger issues, rather than if a speed camera has a preceding warning sign (only in NSW).
its very easy with modern cars to go from 100-105 without knowing it. Hell my cruise control on a 3 YO car cant even keep the speed static and increases within 5km when going up inclines or down hills.
I think the point is that most people are not intentionally speeding, and might exceed the limit at times while they are driving but tend to stay within the speed limit range. We are not talking about people doing 20-30 km over the limit.
I'd rather someone driving within the limit range and paying attention to the road then continually checking their speedo every 5 secs.
It's such an absurd and brainwashed idea.
It really is not that hard to drive at the limit. People who think it is should not have a licence.
I can't believe people actually think that it's hard to drive at the limit, or that driving at the limit is some sort of "distraction" that can lead to dangerous driving. It's just so mind boggling, maybe because I don't find it hard at all to drive at the limit. It's like breathing, I do it without even having to think about it when I drive. I'd love to go back in time and see the driving lessons of these people who find it so hard to drive at the limit.
Then again, I drive a manual car so I have to focus on a lot more things than just the speed limit, e.g. what gear I'm in, whether I need to change gears, how to steer with one hand as I turn a corner whilst simultaneously changing gears etc. I think that people who are learning to drive should actually take at least one or two manual lessons just to see how easy it is to drive an automatic, and that since they hardly have anything to juggle when driving an automatic that driving at the speed limit is extremely simple, but it's scary that the people who say "looking at the speedo will make you distracted" probably drive automatics already.
For advanced drivers like you maybe not.
Then again one should not be turning corners changing gears with one hand on the wheel. Changing gears should be natural process one does not even need to think about.
Older cars you could tell the speed by the sound, but newer cars are so quite its harder to determine sped by sound.
Do they still keep signs for fixed cameras? i
yes
They will go next and then it will be switching P2P cameras from heavy vehicles only to all vehicles. Watch this space…
That would be a good change. Point 2 point cameras are very good, I would say much fairer than a speed camera which catches you speed at a certain point in time.
P2P camera should apply to all vehicles.
Can no longer say: "If you couldnt see the giant warning sign, you deserve the fine"
"giant"
Last one I passed (mobile speed camera in a SUV), was about A4 size hanging on a flimsy a-frame.
The counter-argument is that now there is no sign so drivers have to slow down everywhere thus prevent even more crash than before.