Should I Call an Electrician for This?

Laafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:01
Last edited 02/07/2020 - 17:43

Hoping to get some advice before I call a professional.

The circuit breaker for upstairs (yellow one in https://imgur.com/QtvVarn) keeps tripping a little while after I switch on my 2 year old NOIROT 2000w heater.

From google, I figured the heater is drawing roughly 8 amps (2000W/240volts) which should be well within the 20amps circuit breaker.

Also the 20amps circuit breaker plugs into a slot which states 8amps. Should this be the case?

Is this an issue I need to call an electrician for or is should I just not use the heater upstairs?

Thanks

EDIT:

Test 1: I've removed every other appliance from the circuit, and the heater still trips it.

Test 2: I've tested the circuit with a 2400W hairdryer and that was fine.

Test 3: I've swapped out the 20A breaker with a 16A breaker, and the heater tripped that breaker as well.

Test 4: I've plugged the heater into another circuit (albeit one that isn't protected by RCD) and that was fine.

Test 5: I've plugged the heater into neighbours house in a RCD protected circuit and it worked fine for 40+ minutes

Home & Garden

Comments

  • GG57 on 02/07/2020 - 11:02
    +5

    Call an electrician or not use the heater

  • Gunther on 02/07/2020 - 11:10
    +3

    Bin the heater - problem solved.

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:17

      It's $500 heater that's only 2 years old. Since it didn't trip on my other circuit, I suspect the heater is fine.

      • SnoozeAndLose on 02/07/2020 - 14:22
        +2

        Gumtree it and get another one. Calling sparky cost you at least $150 + part or further cost to rewire.

        The choice is yours.

      • kranix on 02/07/2020 - 20:14

        What did Noirot say when you contacted them? If they won't look at it under warranty, claim Consumer Guarantees. A heater that expensive should reasonably last for longer than 2 years.

        EDIT: I just re-read and saw that you think the heater is fine. So my comment may not apply. Apologies.

        • giftcardinspector on 03/07/2020 - 07:38
          -6

          This comment reaction is unnecessary. Why not just say "contact the manufacturer". Such a smug smartarse response.

  • No Username on 02/07/2020 - 11:12

    +1 for observation and analysis. If it was me that would be the most logical reason. But I've never messed with those plugin RCD's or MCB's. So it could be wired correctly in the back and not labeled correctly. Non the less call an electrician if you don't want to take the panel off and take a look. Cut all power if you want to do this. Even safer to pull out the main fuse. But call an electrician for your safety and neighbor.

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:23

      Yeah nah, I'm not confident in my ability around electricity.

      If it was wired and labelled correctly, is there anything an electrician can do other than suggesting I don't use the heater?

  • whooah1979 on 02/07/2020 - 11:15

    https://imgur.com/QtvVarn

    Those look like plug-in breakers.
    https://www.bunnings.co.nz/hpm-20a-plug-in-circuit-breaker_p…

    Youtube is resourceful.

    Wait. Someone used a 20A on an 8A wiring.
    https://files.ozbargain.com.au/upload/81235/81020/screenshot…

    • c64 on 02/07/2020 - 11:27

      the base might be rated at a higher amperage. my guess is the sticker was indicating the nominal rating for the old light circuit.

  • c64 on 02/07/2020 - 11:21
    +2

    to me it looks like it was originally an 8A light circuit and then got rewired as power

    my first test would be to turn off the power and temporarily swap over the 20a with one of the 16a circuit breakers and see if it still trips. it the heater works ok then i think it would be fair to assume the 20a cb is wonky.

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:24

      Didn't think of this. I shall try this and see. Thank you!

      • c64 on 02/07/2020 - 11:30

        just don't leave any of the sockets empty and turn the power on (exposed live power = electrocution risk)

        • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:34

          I just switched off both 20A and 16A circuit breakers, took them out, swapped it and turned both on. I didn't turn off the main switch though. Not sure if that was wise.

          • c64 on 02/07/2020 - 11:36

            @aafny: yeah, well you should so there is zero chance of electrocution.

            • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:48

              @c64: So with the 16A and 20A swapped, the circuit breaker didn't trip for 20 minutes. I switched on the hair dryer to really test it and it instantly tripped the breaker

              • c64 on 02/07/2020 - 12:18

                @aafny: a replacement circuit breaker is $12.90 at bunnings https://www.bunnings.com.au/hpm-20-amp-plug-in-circuit-break…

                turn off the main power switch (the one on the left) before swapping!

                if it still sets of the circuit breaker and you haven't overloaded the circuit (eg hair dryer at same time) then call an electrician

                • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 13:00

                  @c64: I spoke too soon, the heater just tripped out the 16A breaker. Before I turned the heater on, I turned the hairdryer (2400w) on first for 5 minutes without a problem.

                  From that test, it's probably not the 20A breaker that is the problem.

                  So it's either the heater or the wiring.

                  The hairdryer worked fine so probably isn't the wiring.

                  The heater works on other circuits (that aren't RCD protected) so that could be the issue.

                  • Tonyh87 on 03/07/2020 - 09:57

                    @aafny: It shouldnt have anything to do withthe RCD if it is the breaker that is tripping. If it were an earth leakage issue, it would be the RCD tripping instead of the breaker. It sounds to me that the circuit is overloaded. Try the heater on a low setting and see if it still trips the circuit.

                  • Tonyh87 on 03/07/2020 - 10:05

                    @aafny: Is your hot water system 50L instantaneous system? It may be plugged into the same circuit and it combined with your heater could be overloading the circuit (this is a very random guess). If it were a short circuit, it would trip almost instantly, and if it were an earth leakage issue, it would be tripping the RCD, not the breaker.

  • Euphemistic on 02/07/2020 - 11:45
    -1

    Do not play with the circuit breakers if you have no idea

    It appears to be tripping the protected circuit. Ie RCD or earth leakage protected. Plugging in to other circuits that do not say they are protected indicated the device is faulty in someway.

    Maybe take the heater to another place that has protected circuits and test it there. If it trips other protected circuits, it is the problem. If not, call an electrician to inspect for you.

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:50

      If the device was faulty, wouldn't the RCD trip every time the circuit breaker trips?

      Foolishly or otherwise, I swapped the 16A and 20A and the heater (+ hairdryer) tripped out the 16A circuit breaker.

      So yeah, I'm starting to think I will need to call in a professional.

  • [Deactivated] on 02/07/2020 - 11:49

    If it drives you nuts enough yeah find an electrician.

    Would not suggest toying too much with electricity, its not like plumbing or diy stuff.

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 12:04

      I see your point - I definitely not going to be doing anymore than I'm doing now.

      I'm just trying to run some "relatively" safe diagnostic tests to isolate the issue, so I can better explain the problem to an electrician.

  • rxjb on 02/07/2020 - 11:50
    +2

    Do you have a portable RCD switch? Plug the heater into the portable RCD switch and see what happens.

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 11:57

      Unfortunately I don't

  • AndyC1 on 02/07/2020 - 12:49

    The image does not show any RCD breaker. The image shows standard old school circuit breakers with NO RCD rpotection. RCD circuit breakers show the RCD current required to trip the RCD and from memory the RCD trip current is usually 15 to 40 milliamps.

  • trex on 02/07/2020 - 13:46

    Any chance that something else is connected to the circuit breaker eg like your fridge?

    • aafny on 02/07/2020 - 13:51

      Not likely. When the breaker has tripped, only upstairs was affected. I've switched off everything except the ducted AC unit (which is turned off), when I tested the heater.

      • kiitos on 03/07/2020 - 08:16

        Check anyway. We had a sudden power outage in our rumpus room, couldn't work out which device caused it, scratching our heads, turned out to be an old fridge in the workshop underneath an adjacent room, so that was a surprise for us.

      • Tonyh87 on 04/07/2020 - 22:30

        Is your hot water an under bench unit plugged into the power circuit? It definately seems like an overloading issue

  • thatonethere on 02/07/2020 - 14:15
    +1

    I'd get an electrician out based in above. Give them pictures and what you have tried in advance of them coming to save time.

    • whooah1979 on 03/07/2020 - 13:42
      +1

      Australia is a overprotective when it comes to protecting tradie jobs. They always scream don't diy this or that or you'll die.

  • 82norm on 03/07/2020 - 10:07

    Get a gas heater.

  • OzHunterNSW on 03/07/2020 - 17:02

    upgrade heater

  • pinchies on 04/07/2020 - 20:51

    This sounds like an earth leakage issue, not an excess current situation.
    Hair dryer wont trip an earth leakage issue if it is a two-prong device, make sure you're testing with a device with a ground pin.

    • pinchies on 04/07/2020 - 20:51

      Is it the breaker that is tripping or the RCD?

    • Tonyh87 on 04/07/2020 - 22:22

      Not earth leakage, its the breaker tripping not the RCD

      • pinchies on 04/07/2020 - 22:33
        +1

        Get a power meter and put the heater on it? Maybe that will help see what the actual power draw is?

  • TEER3X on 04/07/2020 - 20:53

    I mean, the following advice applies to almost everything else:

    If you have to ask, then yes, call a professional

  • Sega on 05/07/2020 - 21:42

    That’s an old federal enclosure, with ceramic fuse carriers, in which you have plug in breakers. Th only thing a plug in breaker does is give one the convenience of not having to change fuse wire. IE they replace fuse wire And therefore are easier to reset if the fuse is overloaded. When the switch trips to off, that is because you are overloading the circuit. Any appliance that generates heat from a heater, kettle, toaster, hair dyer etc will contribute greatly to overloading the circuit, More so if the appliance is faulty. DO NOT put a 20A breaker into a 16A circuit. The wiring should also be rated to only 16Amps, and therefore if the breaker holds by being of a larger amp rating, the wiring then becomes a weaker link in the chain, could overheat and cause a fire.

    Federal enclosures are limited when it comes to upgrading to RCD protection. (Hence the added module in the second photo). There are spare modules in the enclosure where the RCD is, and these days, RCD, are fitted on each circuit, not 1 RCD for multiple circuits, so technically, you could have 4 installed into the module that is presently containing the one 2 module ABB RCD.
    Looks like the actual wiring coming into the bottom of the enclosure is fine, splitting the circuits is probably a wise course of action. IE increase the number of power circuits from 2 to 3. YOU NEED AN ELECTRICIAN’s ADVICE. Get them to check the GPO, could be faulty. Sounds like all the isolation tests you have done point to an issue with the circuit, which includes the GPO as part of the circuit. Could also be a loose wire in the back of the fuse carrier.

    If you really need to use the noiroit heater, get an electrician to come and advise what specifically is causing it to trip the circuit.

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