Pay Negotiations during COVID-19

Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:16
Last edited 27/06/2020 - 20:17

Hi Oz bargainers,

Hopefully you can give me some feedback here.

My workplace will be going through another round of redundancies (Thanks Corona) and I was approached by one of my superiors and they would like me to take on a more senior role. What the plan is that I will be managing 2 more worksites ontop of the one I'm managing now, so they want me to manage 3 worksites in total.

The current manager that manages those 2 worksites will be made redundant. With the current COVID-19 situation where alot of people are losing jobs, on reduced hours, would it fair for me to negotiate my pay since my workload will increase tenfold?

The soon to be made redundant employee is currently on $90k, so my workplace is saving $90k straight off the books if there is no pay increase for myself which I find it very unfair.

What should I do in this situation? Negotiate my pay or suck it up and be grateful that I didn't got made redundant and still have a job?

Education & Work

Comments

  • elgrande on 27/06/2020 - 20:18
    +19

    no pay increase for myself which I find it very unfair.

    Or… they could keep the other guy and make you redundant.. Maybe he will offer to do it for less?

    If it were me I would keep my mouth shut and get through this period.

    • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:22
      +5

      brutal but fair point. But that's just companies taking advantage of vulnerable employees and using COVID as an excuse

      • Hybroid on 27/06/2020 - 20:32
        +14

        Absolutely, but that's the current situation. Employer's have the upper hand right now while the market is saturated with unemployed job seekers.

        The (I'm generalising) view currently is that if you don't want to do it, they'll find someone else to do it at half the cost. Absolutely wrong approach but that's reality.

        I would strongly suggest bear it out for a few months while things improve and bring it up for a promotion + rumuneration increase demonstrating how you've stepped up and handled the added workload successfully thus now a situation where they need you more than you need them etc.

        • the4thzodiac on 27/06/2020 - 21:51

          Hybroid, hear hear!

        • Diji1 on 28/06/2020 - 09:35
          +1

          Employer's have the upper hand right now

          Right now? LMAO, median wage levels have been falling in this country for over four decades.

          This happened because people voted to lose their own money with the "Fair Work Commission" and other institutions named like they were in a George Orwell novel.

          • ThithLord on 29/06/2020 - 09:48

            @Diji1: Never change, Diji1. Spittin' hard truths

    • kahn on 27/06/2020 - 20:26
      +1

      Yeah, that's it. Play the employees off against each other to see who is the most desperate for a job. Capitalism 101, baby.

      • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:30

        Yeh, that's what I don't agree with.

        • kahn on 27/06/2020 - 20:34

          Well, you could be thankful that you weren't one of the garbage workers in New Orleans who were replaced with prison labour.

        • Seraphin7 on 28/06/2020 - 10:04
          +1

          Play the employees off against each other to see who is the most desperate for a job. Capitalism 101, baby.

          Play the retailers off against each other to see who is the most desperate for a sale. Capitalism 101, baby.

          It's hard to agree with one without agreeing with the other.

    • netjock on 27/06/2020 - 20:38
      +1

      Would agree with this. If OP is going to try to negotiate they need to know the following:

      1. Is the company making money?
      2. Money OP is on vs the person leaving?
      3. Cost saved on redundancy is actually that person's pay less redundancy payment (if they are entitled). Sometimes decisions are also made on who is cheaper to pay out.

      Delicate, it isn't possible to go in there with a number not knowing if it tip the company over the edge or tip you over the edge to be less affordable than the other guy.

      • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:43
        1. No, will be on a loss for the next fiscal year 20/21
        2. Same pay range
        3. ? Don't know what his redundancy payout is.
        • netjock on 27/06/2020 - 20:48

          ? Don't know what his redundancy payout is.

          If you know how many years of service. Think it is 4 weeks a year up to like 52 weeks. You'll have to Google it.

          No, will be on a loss for the next fiscal year 20/21

          That is a problem. It depends on whether the company has reserves to draw on. Remember if you run out of cash you're stuffed. Even if there is an accounting profit if you haven't collected the cash from clients then you can't pay your suppliers including staff.

          • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:52

            @netjock: my cashflow for my site is safe (cos I manage it :)), not sure about the other 2 sites Cashflows.

          • apsilon on 27/06/2020 - 21:28

            @netjock:

            If you know how many years of service. Think it is 4 weeks a year up to like 52 weeks. You'll have to Google it.

            Legally it's significantly less than that. In NSW at least it tops out at 16 weeks IIRC and that for service of more than 9 years but less than 10 and actually drops to 12 weeks once you hit 10 years. You may be on an agreement that gives more however but what's actually legally required is fairly low.

            • OzFrugie on 28/06/2020 - 22:21

              @apsilon: Is this new law? I thought 1 yr of service = 1 month of redundancy pay

    • whooah1979 on 27/06/2020 - 23:02

      Brilliant idea. It's easy to who is or isn't a team player.

  • CecilTheChair on 27/06/2020 - 20:28

    I’d ask for a pay rise, somewhere between what you are currently on and the $90k. Don’t expect to get the full $90k though.

    These opportunities to climb the pay ladder at work only come along every now and again and you have to take advantage, particularly if this is classed as a promotion.

    Edit - this is assuming you’re on less than the $90k currently

    • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:45

      My ideal payraise will be 20k and that's being really moddest. So even if I get 20k, the company will be saving $70k

      The sad reality is, I won't even get 20k and I'm most likely to take on more work for no pay

  • Ash-Say on 27/06/2020 - 20:54

    When your manager asked about senior role, why didn't you that you are hoping you will get some extra benefits for additional responsibilities?

    • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 20:56
      +1

      sorry what?

      • Ash-Say on 27/06/2020 - 20:59

        Sorry watching movie so must have missed few words :)

        I meant why you didn't say "I would love to take this opportunity, however I hope I will get some extra financial benefits for these additional responsibilities". This should have been said when you were asked about the senior role.

        • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 21:06

          Yeh I was called in the meeting unexpectedly so wasn't really prepared. If COVID wasn't happening right now, I would've said exactly what you have just said, but with job losses happening everywhere, I thought it was best to just say Yes to whatever it was asked of me.

          Now that I have time to digest what is going to happen to me and new contract hasn't been offered to me yet, thats why i want to get others opinion if its fair to negotiate my pay during these times?

  • BLB1984 on 27/06/2020 - 21:07
    +3

    Wait, haven't you just said on another post that a monitor costs more than your jobseeker allowance?

    Yet here you are saying you need to negotiate a pay increase for a job promotion from single site to multi-site manager.

    You're bs'ing somewhere.

    • Homr on 27/06/2020 - 21:11

      lol caught red handed, no I'm not on jobseeker and I was making light of that post on how a 27" monitor cost $680!!!!!!

      • BLB1984 on 27/06/2020 - 21:15
        +2

        In that case I'll answer this properly. lol.

        I think you have a case for a small raise and I don't think it would be rejected.

        Ignore what the other person is getting because that's going to skew your thought process and means nothing in an environment where they are letting people go.

        Personally I'd say ask for $10k extra, it's unlikely they would say no for $100 cost per site to look after it and then when stuff turns around and if you've improved the sites then go for the big pay increase.

        (Speaking from experience of someone who has done multi-site management before.)

  • [Deactivated] on 28/06/2020 - 09:05

    Dodge the issue entirely and force them to make a move

    • CheapandUsed on 28/06/2020 - 09:32

      Something like 'look forward to seeing the offer letter for this new position and discussing further?' Puts it in their minds that they have given the impression you are getting a promotion to look after 3 sites (more than anyone previously?)

      It's a hard one in the current times, but the posts above saying to chase it later, well I'd love to hear if that has ever been successful.
      I've personally never been able to achieve it, why would they consider paying me more when I agreed to do more for the same amount in the first place (unless you have another offer to compete with).

      {edit] OP, are you in a union? They will go through all the in place agreements to make sure you aren't being told to do something that isn't in the contract and if it can be argued it is an increase in responsibilities that the pay should rise in accordance.

      • [Deactivated] on 28/06/2020 - 09:45

        Well if its one of those jobs where you dont really do anything…

  • popsiee on 28/06/2020 - 10:10
    -1

    I see some stupid retail union running adds for front line essential retail workers who deserve a pay rise .
    Seriously don't they know these unskilled jobs could be filled 10 fold !
    Best degree the younger the cheaper the award for employers to choose wisely .

  • OzFrugie on 28/06/2020 - 22:28

    bit off topic.. for ppl who were promised bonus if you achieved x y and z during the year, would you ask / expect your employer to fulfil this agreement, assuming you achieve the set goals?
    Is it dependent on how much the bonus is eg bonus less than 10k you'd expect them to fulfil but bonus higher maybe not or partial?

  • Wallyt99 on 29/06/2020 - 07:25
    +1

    I also was in this situation and I was offered LESS money in a new contract. I told them it was ridiculous and they saw my point.

    Eventually same money but slightly better perks. Glad to have a job.

  • Filbert on 29/06/2020 - 09:45

    You don’t have to negotiate now.
    They may be playing both sides atm.
    Go with the flow for now and when the only option is you or look for a new employee, then talk about renegotiate.
    Also you state your work will increase 10 fold, just make sure that your not creating your own argument to make you feel exploited. But you will know if your own site has slowed or the workload is less.
    Personally I would sit tight as imo we are only part way through this ride.
    Good luck.

  • Homr on 29/06/2020 - 11:36

    Just an update. They have proposed a $10k pay increase for me. I'm grossly still underpaid. Ideally I would be more comfortable if it was $15k

    • [Deactivated] on 29/06/2020 - 13:28

      Why don't you negotiate a pay review in 6 - 8 months time noting you understand COVID and are happy to compromise etc.

    • whooah1979 on 29/06/2020 - 13:40

      Why don’t you apply for a job somewhere else if you think your current employer doesn’t appreciate your value?

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