How to Go about Asking if a Murder Has Taken Place at a Property?

Debuting on 22/02/2020 - 21:21
Last edited 23/02/2020 - 10:46 by 1 other user

Are real estate agents supposed to tell people if someone has been murdered at a property?

I've come across an apartment going to auction. I noticed something strange. The place is marketed as needing renovation, but it has no carpets strangely enough….. I would have thought they would keep the old carpets. I've looked at other properties for sale in need of renovation and they all have the old carpets in place.

I looked around and apparently a few people were murdered in the suburb a few years ago. At least one involved someone who was recently jailed, and possibly this property has come to sale as it is no longer a piece of evidence. I am finding it really hard to search for information. I don't want go to the auction and end up overbidding for something which has a dark past.

What would be the most appropriate way to ask the agent without potentially being scolded? Should I be trying to ask the current neighbours instead?

It did have carpets before as you can see the glue stains on the ground. There are no hardwood floors either, just to be consistent with providing all information.

Home & Garden

Comments

  • elgrande on 22/02/2020 - 21:24
    +5

    In NSW the agent needs to tell u if somone was murdered in the last 5 years.

    • Debuting on 22/02/2020 - 21:30
      +1

      I have to ask right? I didn't raise the issue at first, but subsequently I came back home and have thought about it.

      Or is it a compulsory thing?

      • jjjaar on 22/02/2020 - 22:30
        +13

        Of course you can ask. And if they’re not legally obliged to tell you they also don’t have to answer. But their reaction may answer it for you.

        • [Deactivated] on 23/02/2020 - 22:03
          +2

          We were told agents were legally obliged to disclose "material facts" including murders and suicides if they were asked. This is in Victoria and this was after we had bought a house where someone had taken their own life.

          The house was everything we wanted at the time, so not sure if it would have influenced our decision to buy it or not. We later sold the house and told the buyer ( without being asked) and they were also fine with it.

      • ranmalynx on 22/02/2020 - 23:59
        +4

        It should be compulsory, unless the agent wants to be fined. This happened 15 years ago to L.J. Hooker for failing to disclose a murder to their buyers. It wouldn't hurt to ask though.

      • elgrande on 23/02/2020 - 04:36
        +53

        Its best to save your question until just as the auction has started. Just put your hand up and ask.

  • garetz on 22/02/2020 - 21:35
    +41

    Why would they scold you, and even if they did why would that affect you even 1 iota?

    Just use your words, come out and ask the question, you will never know if you never ask.

    • serpserpserp on 22/02/2020 - 21:37
      +22

      Just use your words, come out and ask the question

      It is amazing when you act like an adult and speak to other adults.

      • Debuting on 22/02/2020 - 21:52
        +1

        So there isn't any taboo about it? I was speaking with my family and they were like, "let's ask the neighbours instead".

        If it's fine, I'll call them on Monday. ^_^

        • capslock janitor on 23/02/2020 - 15:04

          Get it in writing, or record the call… Easy enough to lie about it still.

          • Shopaholicdesi on 24/02/2020 - 02:48

            @capslock janitor: You can not record someone's call without their consent!!!!

            • Daabido on 24/02/2020 - 10:35
              +3

              @Shopaholicdesi: It depends on which state you are in!!!!!

              • capslock janitor on 24/02/2020 - 17:02

                @Daabido: Yeah I heard as long as you are a party in the conversation then it's legal. So 1on1, of course which state !!!!!!

            • LikeMike on 25/02/2020 - 12:37
              +1

              @Shopaholicdesi: In QLD you can as long as you are involved in the conversation and you just use it for legal purposes only, eg to only share with your lawyer or for making a formal complaint, so not for YouTube etc.

        • HighAndDry on 24/02/2020 - 11:51

          Don't call. Email and request reply in writing.

          If they refuse, that's saying enough already.

  • serpserpserp on 22/02/2020 - 21:36
    +4

    I've looked at other properties for sale in need of renovation and they all have the old carpets in place.

    Not all houses have carpets? I have seen plenty of fixer-uppers that have no carpets anywhere.

    • argamond on 23/02/2020 - 17:41
      +1

      cat urine is hard to fix in carpets. If the carpets are old, might be just better to remove them

      • juki on 23/02/2020 - 21:14
        +3

        murdered cats maybe, for urinating on the carpet -damn cats

  • stirlo on 22/02/2020 - 21:38

    I don't want go to the auction and end up overbidding

    You only have to bid the minimum bid more than the second highest bidder. It's not possible to "overbid" if you believe the fundamentals of the house are worth that price to you.

  • [Deactivated] on 22/02/2020 - 21:54
    +7

    Why would you want to move into a suburb that has had a few murders in the last few years?

    • OneJay on 23/02/2020 - 13:56
      +32

      Aspiring murderer.

  • MS Paint on 22/02/2020 - 21:57
    +21

    You: hi (insert agent name), nice new BMW. I've heard they're a good investment.

    RE Agent: that's right (shake hands). Welcome to this open for inspection. Let me know if you have any questions.

    You: well……

    • monkeyfood on 23/02/2020 - 14:54
      +6

      RE agent reply: ahh can't say mate I actually can't remember last week because I got pretty drunk on the weekend, actually now that you mention it im pretty smashed at the moment but yeah take care ill look after you don't you worry

  • Peter Enis on 22/02/2020 - 21:58
    +17

    Agents lie through their teeth, so even if you asked them, would you believe their answer?

    • SimbaGirl on 23/02/2020 - 13:06
      +10

      I sure as hell wouldn't. When we were looking for a house in rural Tasmania a couple of years ago, we looked at a small acreage with a river running along one boundary (the land sloped down towards it slightly). So naturally, we asked the agent if the house was on a floodplain, and he couldn't get the words out quick enough - "No, no, definitely not." Hmm, really? . We went and did our research afterwards of course and checked the flood maps of the local area and oh yes indeed, the house was on a floodplain.

  • chumlee on 22/02/2020 - 21:59
    +30

    Don't need to disclose if it's murder on the dance floor

    • MS Paint on 22/02/2020 - 22:00
      +11

      You'd better not kill the groove

    • ego22 on 22/02/2020 - 23:51
      +7

      they better, cos hes gonna burn this god damn house right down

      • munecito on 23/02/2020 - 07:55
        -1

        Only the roof is on fire.

    • goms on 23/02/2020 - 21:34
      +2

      They think they're getting away. He'll prove them wrong.

    • pandamninator on 24/02/2020 - 11:56

      Considering my dance moves can negatively affect property values of surrounding buildings, they probably do if it involves me.

  • kahn on 22/02/2020 - 22:13
    +9

    What would be the most appropriate way to ask the agent without potentially being scolded?

    That's quite a conundrum there, buddy. Your best option is to create an elaborate scheme similar to Ocean's 11 whereby you hire a bunch of experts and craft a scenario where every word spoken at exactly the right time to exactly the right person will result in you discovering the exact piece of information you seek. A poor man's alternative would be surprise property inspections, each more surprising than the last. I tell ya, the real estate agent won't know what hit him.

  • jjjaar on 22/02/2020 - 22:31
    +1

    Is there a chance someone else bought it recently and tried to renovate but ran out of money? Check recent sales of the property.

  • holdenmg on 22/02/2020 - 22:38
    +29

    Look for the Chalk Outline…

  • p1 ama on 22/02/2020 - 22:48
    +9

    How did you draw the conclusion that there must have been a murder from the fact that it has no carpets? Like why "someone was murdered here", not that the old carpets were dirty/ugly and could have negatively affected sale price, old owners in the process of replacing carpets when they found another place to live, renovation firm went bankrupt…etc. There are literally so many more probable explanations as to why there is no carpet.

    Anyway, you can ask the REA, they might not even know, who knows?

    I don't want go to the auction and end up overbidding for something which has a dark past.

    Literally irrelevant.

    • try2bhelpful on 23/02/2020 - 07:02
      +6

      They may have had an incontinent dog. They may have taken up the carpets to polish the boards and found they weren’t worth polishing. You do wonder how you get from no carpets to murder victim? I would be more worried about the place I was buying had been used as a meth lab. That can leave some really nasty residues.

    • veej on 23/02/2020 - 12:16
      +5

      My first thought on carpet being stripped out is that the previous owners/renters were feral and ruined them. I know someone who let their dogs do their business all over their house. The poor owners had to strip the lot because it was disgusting. Others I know who don't let animals go all over their house let their kids ruin the flooring instead by dropping food all over the place, and also smoke in the house. I don't put murder house at the top of my reasons behind lack of carpet.

    • lachhelix on 23/02/2020 - 15:23
      +2

      My thoughts exactly!
      Bit of a leap?
      No carpet = murder
      What if the fly screen is torn? Burgled

      • Yawhae on 24/02/2020 - 15:06
        +3

        Toilet backed up, goldfish genocide.

    • pjetson on 23/02/2020 - 15:53
      +5

      How did you draw the conclusion that there must have been a murder from the fact that it has no carpets

      It wasn't that, it was the writing in blood on the walls.

  • [Deactivated] on 22/02/2020 - 23:00
    +11

    "Did anyone get murdered in here?"

    • [Deactivated] on 23/02/2020 - 09:41
      +9

      lol - to be asked loudly at all open for inspections and at the outset of the auction as a tactic to dissuade other prospective buyers & get the property for a bargain!

  • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 22/02/2020 - 23:12
    +15

    Probably serious water damage.

    And that's something I'd be far more concerned about than if a murder took place.

    • Yawhae on 24/02/2020 - 15:07
      +4

      Unless they were murded by drowning.

      • Typical16-bitEnjoyer on 25/02/2020 - 10:39
        +2

        Sealing an apartment then flooding it to kill a victim.

        Now that's an episode of CSI I wanna see!

  • pegaxs on 22/02/2020 - 23:15
    +1

    Please, ELI5; what difference does it make. I am genuinely curious… I have never even thought to ask this about a house.

    • [Deactivated] on 22/02/2020 - 23:22
      +31

      If someone got murdered in the house, a murder cannot happen there again. The house has built up an immunity.

      • pegaxs on 22/02/2020 - 23:23
        +1

        Oh sweet! What about if it’s multiple murders?

        • [Deactivated] on 22/02/2020 - 23:25
          +6

          Even stronger immunity.

          What doesn't kill you makes you stronger. (I am not sure how that applies here but it is a saying.)

        • dufflover on 23/02/2020 - 15:57
          +2

          Red room … red room … over there.

          You can even make some money back by running tours and saying this exact spot was where they found the torso heap.

    • [Deactivated] on 23/02/2020 - 22:14

      I vaguely remember that the house where the Gonzales were murdered sold for $80k less once this was disclosed to potential buyers.

      Spoiler alert : the 20-year old son did it.

      Edit: $80k less and the agent was fined $20k for not disclosing the house gruesome past to the buyer. This was in NSW.

      • pegaxs on 23/02/2020 - 23:11

        Yeah, but why does it affect the resale value of the house? It just sounds like a tyre kicking thing to do. I mean, if they left the blood and dead bodies there and you had to remove/clean up as part of the sale, I could kind of understand…

        Does this happen with people who have just died of natural causes? Should I be asking if anyone has died full stop?

        I don’t get why it makes that much of a difference or why the REA got slugged a $20k fine.

        • [Deactivated] on 23/02/2020 - 23:15
          +1

          Stigmatisation and superstitions are why the house is worth less in the eyes of a buyer :

          The Lins later said they could not move into the house on the grounds it was haunted and would bring them misfortune.

          The Fair Trading Minister, Reba Meagher, said the agents had breached the Acts for "misleading behaviour in promoting the property for sale".

          Source

        • [Deactivated] on 23/02/2020 - 23:20

          Sorry edited my reply a few times.

        • lainey13 on 24/02/2020 - 00:38

          People don't like living opposite a cemetery so same same?

    • Roman Sandstorm on 24/02/2020 - 11:57

      @pegaxs

      How did it take this long into the thread before this obvious question?

      Does anyone seriously, seriously believe that a property retains an 'essence' of events which occurred there? That a piece of land and some timber and bricks somehow 'remember' a past event, and then…. what? That this 'memory' can influence the future?

      Really, this concern is barely even medieval.

      If someone is making a decision, maybe one of the biggest decisions in their lives, to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on purchasing a property, and they are actually influenced by whether at some time an unpleasant event once occurred at that property, then I think they need to re-evaluate their priorities, and their decision-making capability. Perhaps they should not be permitted out in public without a responsible adult chaperoning them?

      And if anyone seriously believes in 'haunting' then they should be looking for a property with padded walls.

      • Blitzfx on 24/02/2020 - 13:32
        +4

        And if anyone seriously believes in 'haunting'

        People believe in God, so this sort of makes sense.

  • bobbified on 22/02/2020 - 23:28
    +3

    Bring some of this to the next inspection and spray the floor :p

  • Davo1111 on 22/02/2020 - 23:32
    +37

    these are the posts that make me wonder how many users have the capacity to dress themselves in the morning.

  • holdenmg on 23/02/2020 - 00:09
    +9

    Murder or no Murder, you know the Real Estate Agent/Auctioneer are going to make a killing over the property.

  • belbird on 23/02/2020 - 09:21
    +4

    Maybe just ask 'why were the carpets removed?'.

  • Gronk on 23/02/2020 - 09:22

    They're meant to let buyers know if that sort of thing has happened, but its usually a bit of a 'dont ask, dont tell' type of situation…

  • TheBilly on 23/02/2020 - 09:52
    +2

    Does a murder affect property value even in a really good area? what about if your old grandpa had a stroke and died? does that affect value? death is death right?

    • SydStrand on 23/02/2020 - 18:16

      The Sef Gonzales house value tanked, but that was a particularly gruesome multiple murders. I think most people are worried more about the stigma and resale value rather than hauntings.

      • TheBilly on 24/02/2020 - 13:38

        Geeeez… I just wikied that story. I'm on the fence now.

  • ddhar on 23/02/2020 - 10:00

    Could also be the carpet is so old the unit looks better without it? Also possible the owner can't be arsed (or has the money) to install new carpets prior to open house.

  • [Deactivated] on 23/02/2020 - 10:23
    +6

    Oija board or seance.

  • OzHunterNSW on 23/02/2020 - 10:41

    Sounds like you have been watching too much TV!

    It is quite normal to rip up worn unsightly carpets. Some people may want to simply stain the floor boards, or lay new carpet - it does tell you that.

    People die in all suburbs. It is a fact of life, and chances are they may have died in your house as well.

    In regard to the real estate - yes they are… they are to tell you b4 you purchase/rent a premises.

    Ask them straight up…. they should have told you… but simply ask them.

    Or wait until things go bump in the night!

  • tabitha731 on 23/02/2020 - 11:53

    I'd be more concerned with the apparently high crime rate in that area, that could be a food indication of why the price Six soo good for that place.

  • EightImmortals on 23/02/2020 - 11:57
    +1

    "Are real estate agents supposed to tell people if someone has been murdered at a property?"

    For use as a bargaining point?

  • gyrex on 23/02/2020 - 12:29

    Someone else's loss might be your gain in this case ;)

  • pebee47 on 23/02/2020 - 13:05

    Why do you need to know? Is it that you’re looking for a place to commit the first murder in? 🕵🏻‍♂️

  • pebee47 on 23/02/2020 - 13:10

    I once was selling a house that had tenants for many years that cooked (and ate) a LOT of curry. Had to talk the owner into a full carpet clean and to throwing out all the curtains because they smelt so terrible.

  • HeWhoKnows on 23/02/2020 - 13:55
    -1

    I think you can ask about "deaths" only but not specifics

  • Windows98 on 23/02/2020 - 14:05
    +1

    If their answer is "not yet", then you have a problem

  • john_conner on 23/02/2020 - 14:30

    Most contracts basically say that everything is contained in the written contract. So it doesn’t really matter what the agent says to get you to buy, if it ain’t in the special conditions, it is very hard to enforce. If I were the agent I would want to know as little about a property as possible, so I wouldn’t know anything to not disclose… good luck proving they knew it as well.

  • freddofrog42 on 23/02/2020 - 15:48

    A VERY simple explanation is that maybe the previous owners were smokers….

    If I them I would have pulled up the carpets, opened the windows for many days and got some cheap carpet installed but who knows their circumstances?

    If there really was a murder then bid low and get a bargain. Are there any stains on the floors as presented?

    Frankly who cares, it's not like bricks and mortar remember.

    • Wallyt99 on 24/02/2020 - 07:10

      Ghosts though…

  • ssjwill on 23/02/2020 - 15:54

    "did stabby mcstab face live here?

  • SwaggyE on 23/02/2020 - 16:51

    Simple. Request an inspection at night and turn off all the lights and bring a blacklight :D

  • Ok computer on 23/02/2020 - 16:58

    Yeh sad but true, worth checking though.

    It can be difficult to find out after you have bought a house that someone has been beaten to death in your lounge. Especially if you live in a stable neighbourhood where history goes back decades.

    Say 4500 murders over ten years, if there are 9 million dwellings then there is a very tiny chance <0.05%.

    If anything at all, it is far more likely someone committed suicide or has died from a pre-existing health condition then met a grisly end.
    It's probably something alot less menial anyhow

  • stumo on 23/02/2020 - 20:43
    +1

    What about if it was bargained down to manslaughter? Would that make it better?

    • holdenmg on 24/02/2020 - 11:19

      Damn plea bargains…

  • H E B on 23/02/2020 - 22:16

    Are you planning to live there? Or rent out?

    Reminds me of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T94nBQnwRr4

  • superdarkhumour on 24/02/2020 - 02:49
    +2

    No, don't ask the agent, instead at the auction, casually mention to other buyers that people died in that house, like say "I can't believe the husband killed his wife and children in this place" acting like you know the whole story. Then voila, no more buyers, just you left at the auction, the house is yours.

  • cashless on 24/02/2020 - 08:38

    If you see something like this on the floor then you should be suspicious.

  • lint on 24/02/2020 - 10:57

    What would be the most appropriate way to ask the agent without potentially being scolded?

    I find it strange that you're scared of being scolded by an agent. You're well within your rights ask whether there's been a recent murder, or why the carpets have been removed.

    The agent is trying to sell the property, they're out of line if they're scolding you for asking a question that has a material impact on whether someone would choose to buy it.

  • DangerNoodle on 24/02/2020 - 11:34

    My tip is if you're not sure that the agent is giving you the full info, ask the neighbours.

    Had someone ask me about the property they were looking at across the street and they wanted to know why it was cheap. I told them that it's near a main road so the noise can be an issue, someone was stabbed in the front yard of the property next door, and the previous owner of the property wasn't close to anyone so it took weeks before anyone found out he died in his sleep. Hence the room at the back was stripped of its carpet and had the underlying floorboards redone.

  • Trioboy on 24/02/2020 - 11:48

    Whats this suburb with a high murder rate. So I can stay clear from that area.

  • macrocephalic on 24/02/2020 - 12:03
    +5

    So next time I want to get a better house I just need to murder someone in a nice house and wait for it to go on the market? These are the lessons they don't teach you in the barefoot investor.

    • Trioboy on 24/02/2020 - 12:08
      +1

      haha, only way to afford a decent house in Sydney.

    • superdarkhumour on 24/02/2020 - 15:34

      I don't think people call prison a better house, but hey you do you!

  • peterpeterpumpkin on 24/02/2020 - 12:14

    I wouldn't buy a house that looked like the Amityville Horror house, especially if it still had those quarter moon windows.

    But it would be ironic if you skipped a house where someone was murdered and instead purchased the house where the murderer was driven to commit the act.

  • striker5950 on 24/02/2020 - 12:23

    yo my man, has anyone died here before? wink at him so he knows you are serious

  • dny on 24/02/2020 - 13:26
    +1

    Drop subtle hints throughout the inspection

    I bet people would kill to live in a place like this.

    I've been dying to ask, what happened to the carpets?

    And if he hasn't caught on just ask him before straight up as you're leaving.

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