Australia to Ban Cash Purchases above $10,000 (Submissions Close 15 Nov 2019)

The Turnbull government has turned its attention to the “black economy” in an attempt to raise billions of extra dollars and intends to limit cash payments for purchase goods and services to $10,000.

As part of the cash-in-hand crackdown the government will introduce an economy-wide cash payment limit of $10,000 to reduce money laundering and tax evasion, to apply from 1 July 2019.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/may/08/austr…

All while the top 500 businesses by market cap pay an effective rate of 2% with most of that paid by the lower half - while they use the infrastructure that your taxes pay for.

Isn't it about time you voted for someone other than LibLabs to stop this continued crackdown on individuals while big business pays almost nothing?


Update:

In the 2018-19 Budget, the Government announced it would introduce an economy-wide cash payment limit of $10,000 for payments made or accepted by businesses for goods and services. Transactions equal to, or in excess of this amount would need to be made using the electronic payment system or by cheque. The Black Economy Taskforce recommended this action to tackle tax evasion and other criminal activities.

SMH

Treasury: Currency (Restrictions on the Use of Cash) Bill 2019

Update 2:

3 days left to make a submission against the cash ban!

NOTE: If you made a submission to Treasury in August against the cash ban, you need to do another one to the Senate. They are different inquiries. However, you can adapt your submission to Treasury to re-submit to the Senate. Submissions are due in 4 days—15 November. Every submission is crucial! The easiest way to make a submission is to send an email to:
[email protected]

Comments

  • +1

    turnbull wants people to use crypto currency

  • +1

    Whenever some shit happens, let's blame the bloody Chinese!
    Good job, ozbargainers!

    • +2

      Maybe it's because it's true.
      In the 80's the Japanese tried to do it too , but ran out of money.
      Maybe you just need to wait until you see it yourself , when you're pushed to the western suburbs onto a 300m block.

    • Who else do we blame? Something be doing!

    • Never thought I'd see the day that Ozbargainers were on Hillary Clinton's side!

  • +1

    How now will I be able to pay cash for my high yield amg.

  • +2

    Not sure I get the whinge by OP here. Cash economy arguably hurts those of us not in it just as much as multinational tax dodges. Not only does it mean those people don't pay cash, but they also claim underserved benefits. And you've got rocks in your head if you think the government isn't going after multinationals, I've seen it first hand, clawing back billions from a client.

    Not sure where OP gets the 2% figure from, average effective tax rate is much higher than that.

  • +1

    The biggest anti-Wog tax I’ve ever seen!

  • Considering the number of properties and farmland in Australia owned by china/Chinese investors, in the near future Australia will become a China administrated territory and they will remove the 10,000 limit to continue splurging and driving the housing market to shit. True story.

  • Funny that these sorts of measures are put in place as things like bitcoin are rising.

  • Tax only goes to feed scum, parasites, non-producers, and professional protestors. There's no reason to go out of your way to pay any extra. This is simply more government mind control - "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear." Soon they'll ban opaque clothing because it's possible to conceal weapons inside.

    • is that what they taught you in the Chinese communist party?

  • +1

    Good, the quicker we move to bitcoin, the better!

  • Reminds me of when I moved from the US to Tasmanaia and went to buy my car from the Hertz used car dept.
    Just walked in with $12,000 (in 50's) in cash and purchased it. I do understand the implications of this and perhaps what I did was not ideal but it helped me.

    Not sure what the deal is here. A couple of years back, India did their demonetization nonsense and put a whole lot of people in trouble. Fast forward 2 years later and the black market is still flourishing just as well as it was before that move. If people were doing illegal things, they will continue to do so.

    • Didn't work, also their use of digital money is less than Australia so it was doomed to fail.

  • +1

    Well, probably they should have banned Cryptocurrency in the first place then.

  • +1

    "What is it with wogs and cash?”

  • +2

    As a cryptocurrency enthusiast - thank you turnbull.

  • In 5 years, it'll be dropped to $1,000.

    Then another 5m $100

    Then …

  • +1

    It still seems pretty easy to stash say 200k over 10 years in cash in order to be under the assets test for a part or full old age pension.

    Only a cashless economy can stop that.

  • I don't like this measure. It is complicating our lives unnecessarily. IF ti continues along and we are forced on to digital currency totally, how do you pay for something or prove you have money if the power goes out ?

  • But how is this policed, or implemented? I mean it's cash, it's literally not traceable. Who's to say it wasn't three $7000 purchases for that kitchen reno.

  • Merged from Currency (Restrictions on the Use of Cash) Bill 2019: Cash Payments over $10,000 to be banned

    Mod (Clarified post and description):

    In the 2018-19 Budget, the Government announced it would introduce an economy-wide cash payment limit of $10,000 for payments made or accepted by businesses for goods and services. Transactions equal to, or in excess of this amount would need to be made using the electronic payment system or by cheque. The Black Economy Taskforce recommended this action to tackle tax evasion and other criminal activities.

    SMH

    Treasury: Currency (Restrictions on the Use of Cash) Bill 2019


    OP's original post:

    I've not seen much in the news about this, and it's ALARMING. I tried contacting the various news/newspaper websites/FB and got no where. It's almost as if they don't want anyone to find out until it's too late.

    TODAY, is the last day to oppose this in writing.

    THIS IS AN ASSAULT ON THE AUSTRALIAN PEOPLE. Scott Morrison & the LNP are planning to make you a criminal to spend your OWN money! You will no longer be able to spend YOUR money, as YOU see fit. You will NOT be allowed to buy ANYTHING over $10,000 in cash. You will be treated as if YOU are a criminal for having your OWN earned income AS CASH, and using it as YOU see fit.

    This has NOTHING to do with "black-market". It is the LNP making a move to follow CHINA. To control ALL Australians so that they CANNOT have unfettered access to their OWN, earned money!!!!!

    Buy a car for $15,000 cash? You will face TWO YEARS IN PRISON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Scott Morrison has implemented a very EVIL plan to keep YOUR money available to THEM— in order that they control ALL funds you earn, cradle to grave. This, is just the beginning.

    They plan to use YOUR money to bail out banks (including your savings and your super) with this "PLAN".

    This is NOT a joke! It IS happening RIGHT NOW! The LNP have sneakily put this into place without public knowledge— AND with only a DAY to complain to your MP/PM/Sen!

    This change is NOT necessary. It is NOT going to help anyone but the BANKS (AGAIN!), it is NOT "no big deal"—- it is EVIL and FRIGHTENING. ONE day is all we have to OPPOSE THIS!!! Why the rush???

    Start here:

    26 July 2019 - 12 August 2019
    Consultation Type
    Draft Legislation
    Email: [email protected]

    and here:

    https://cecaust.com.au/stop-bail-in-petition

    This, is what the LNP's emotional smokescreens of immigration, equality, pay cuts, etc was hiding….while they kept poking sticks at that, people were caught off-guard. It's time to WAKE UP and stop these traitors!

    The Morrison gov't is trying to stop our access to OUR money by siding with the corrupt “big four” global accounting firm KPMG, which is an accomplice of the world’s biggest money launderers and tax evaders!

    "The exposure draft of the bill has two notable features:

    It bans ALL cash transactions over $10,000, enforced with a penalty of two years jail;

    Division 2 is blank, containing only the words “To be inserted”.

    What is the government hiding by releasing an incomplete draft, on a Friday afternoon, and allowing only two weeks for public consultation?

    "The deception doesn’t end there. In its explanation of the law, the government has sought to make it palatable by emphasising that there will be exemptions to the cash ban, including depositing and withdrawing cash in banks, and, curiously, most consumer-to-consumer transactions, such as for a second-hand car. However, the exemptions are not in the legislation. They are in a separate regulatory instrument to be issued by the Minister after the legislation is passed. This means that they are not permanent, but that in the future, the Minister will be able to scrap the exemptions without requiring new legislation."

    https://cecaust.com.au/media-releases/red-alert-scomo-declar…

    https://cec.cecaust.com.au/pubs/pdfs/flyer/201800222_Governm…

    Pay particular attention to the paragraph titled "dirty trick". THAT will tell you just how traitorous the LNP/Morrison government truly is.

    https://says.heise.com.au/australias-planned-10000-cash-spen…

    Morrison is banning cash so Australians can’t escape bail-in, negative interest rates!!!

    List of MP's/Senators emails:|

    https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1eepbQy48QwEuzu2KPVsW…

    Please fire off a letter opposing, to ALL of them, today!

    • +5

      HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

      backs away slowly

    • +1

      It's almost as if they don't want anyone to find out

      Riiiight, almost.

      • -1

        Right. Buried in a tiny article in the financial sections of the papers.

        It's real, and nefarious. Why wasn't this discussed in front of a full seating of members? It was passed at the last hour, on a Friday, with only the ones pushing it in attendance. If people cannot see how bad this is, we're screwed.

        • -1

          If your post was about something meaningless like prawn size, you'd get a lot more interest from ozbargainers.

    • Classic Boomer stuff with the RANDOM words IN all caps to express outrage.

      • YOU MEAN LIKE THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!??????????????????

      • Oh, and OP forgot "make sure you copy and paste (NOT SHARE) this word for word and you will be exempt from this legislation", etc. etc.

    • +2

      Is this a chain email? Am i supposed to share it with 10 people on facebook?

    • Agree, it's bad. They ultimately want cashless.

    • +3

      Since OP didn't give any, there's a link to an actual news story about this:

      https://www.smh.com.au/business/small-business/anonymous-unt…

      Businesses will face criminal and civil penalties from next year if they make or accept cash payments greater than $10,000 amid a federal government crackdown on lost tax revenue.

      An exposure draft for the government's "restrictions on the use of cash" laws outlines fines of more than $25,000 and possible prison sentences of two years for business owners who knowingly accept or pay large transactions in cash after January 1, 2021.

      Most relevantly to OP's spiel:

      The rules won't apply to individuals accessing their own money from a bank or to private transactions like an individual selling a secondhand car.

      Personally I don't agree with this, but it's also far from a "OMG the sky is falling" moment.

      • Why would a business seek cash payment in excess of $10,000? The only reason I can think of is tax evasion. I support this 100%.

        • They don't necessarily seek it, but this is saying they now can't accept it.

          • @Soluble: Yeah of course. My apologies, poor choice of words on my end.

            What I meant is, businesses sure don't want cash because it's more convenient than doing a bank transfer.

        • Its NOT just cash, the legislation also says DIGITAL currency

          Now we need to understand this a bit more. Like many pieces of legislation the Government publicises the more emotive aspects but skips some of the other detail that might have impacts people aren't aware of. (AKA spin)

    • +1

      Eat a Snickers.
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      ..
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      Feeling better now?

    • Don't know what's more crazy, this policy or the fact that the conspiracy people predicted it…?

      • Honestly, if you have 100,000 conspiracy theorists predicting 100 different things a day, I'm surprised they don't get more things right.

        This policy is pretty stupid though, because it'll be trivial to break up large payments into smaller ones less than $10k and spread between different people.

        • Look at the legislation, this is banned (also gifts) and is part cash/part electronic (totalling more than 10K)

          An entity commits an offence if:
          (a)
          (b)
          (c) (d)
          the entity:
          (i) makes a payment to another entity; or
          (ii) accepts a payment from another entity; and
          the payment is part of a series of payments that are made for a supply or as a gift; and
          the payment is or includes an amount of cash; and
          as a result of the payment, the total value of all amounts of cash included in the payments in the series equals or exceeds the cash payment limit.

    • Uh oh you forgot to hide the author's name (Tracy LF) in your Google Drive.

      ASIO inbound.

      • +1

        lol @techie.geek.girl too

    • Wow OP is going full tin hat with this one

  • Conspiracy theory! Conspiracy theory!

    Don't you love all the agent Smiths appearing from the matrix to defend it :)

    The OP may have used some alarmist language but the fact is it is another attack on our freedoms, however small or large. There is always reasoning provided to justify these things to make many say oh well, you know they have a point there it may stop some tax fraud. Similar to restrictions on freedom of speech. That's how they slip them through…

  • -1
    Merged from Coalition endorses cash-ban bill despite record objections.

    What a crock, this is almost as stink as when they snuck through the bail-in legislation last year with only 7 senators sitting and no formal vote recorded.

     18 September 2019 - CEC Media Release
    

    The Liberal-National Coalition MPs and Senators in the government endorsed the $10,000 cash ban bill in their 17 September party-room meeting; it is now likely to be introduced into Parliament this week. One Coalition MP, Queensland National George Christensen, broke from the herd to publicly announce his opposition to the cash ban.

    This is a corrupt process. Treasury has not yet responded to the overwhelming flood of submissions against the incomplete exposure draft of the bill, hoping to suppress reporting of the scale of the opposition. MPs would become very nervous if Treasurer Josh Frydenberg admitted to them that Treasury received “4,000-plus” submissions opposing the bill.

    As with the APRA crisis management “bail-in” law that the government snuck through Parliament in February 2018—with a loophole that could be used to seize deposits to prop up failing banks—the government hopes to pass the cash ban bill with very little scrutiny. This process happens all too often in Australia’s Parliament, with the complicity of compliant politicians in the major parties, which have been thoroughly captured by corrupt vested interests, especially the banks.

    Frydenberg is especially desperate to avoid scrutiny of the cash ban bill, as the pretext for the ban is false and easily discredited. The CEC and other opponents of the cash ban have proved:

    The excuse of eliminating the so-called “black economy” is a lie. The most authoritative studies, published by the International Monetary Fund (IMF), show that Australia does not have a serious black economy problem, as: 1) Australia has the 10th smallest black economy in the world; 2) Australia’s black economy almost halved between 1991 and 2015; and 3) the near cashless Scandinavian economies all experienced expansions of their black economies after reducing cash use. The Black Economy Taskforce report* that recommended the $10,000 ban makes unverified claims that Australia’s black economy has grown, without proof.
    The biggest perpetrators of real black economy crimes are the ones pushing the cash ban! The author of the Black Economy report, Michael Andrew (now deceased), was a former boss of global accounting giant KPMG, which along with the other Big Four accounting firms are the corrupt bookkeepers for the real global black economy involving trillions of dollars of offshore tax evasion and money laundering by multinational banks and corporations.
    The cash ban will turn Australia into a fascist surveillance state. The former boss of KPMG recommended the $10,000 cash ban to “move people and businesses out of cash and into the banking system”; other KPMG executives have already lobbied for a ban as low as $2,000; and KPMG is also coordinating a project led by the Reserve Bank, and involving Australia’s biggest private banks and the cashless welfare card company Indue, to establish the privately controlled New Payments Platform as the infrastructure for a cashless economy. In a 2017 interview Michael Andrew advocated an Orwellian “shift from a cash to a non-cash society where we can therefore monitor and measure people’s activities”, and reversing the onus of proof to enable summary punishment for offenders.
    The real reason for the cash ban is trap Australians in banks, so they can’t escape extreme policies such as bail-in and negative interest rates. The IMF is openly pushing cash restrictions to stop people from withdrawing their money from banks, otherwise negative interest rates won’t work. The European Union has just enacted restrictions on bank withdrawals so people can’t avoid bail-ins.
    

    It’s time to step up the fight! We are fighting for civil liberties, but also to reform the failed financial system. Negative interest rates and bail-in are a desperate attempt to prop up the banks’ debt and derivatives bubble that is smothering the global financial system. We must instead force through reforms such as the Glass-Steagall separation of banking from speculation, and national banking to direct public credit into the real economy.

    What you can do

    Call MPs at their Parliament House offices while they are in session today and tomorrow. Use and share these links for finding MPs and Senators. Click the link, and find the heading State/Territory in the box titled “Refine search” on the right hand side of the page. Click on your state and call as many MPs and Senators as you can, on their Parliament House numbers, starting with “(02) 6277”. House of Representatives (MPs); Senators
    Make sure you have signed, and continue sharing, the Change.org petition: Stop Scott Morrison from banning cash to trap Australians in banks!
    If you haven’t already, sign and share the CEC’s formal parliamentary petition against bail-in: Hands off our bank deposits—stop ‘bail-in’!
    
    • Click here to read the excellent new website by independent researcher Melissa Harrison, Exposing the Black Economy Report

    https://cecaust.com.au/media-releases/coalition-endorses-fas…

    TL:DR? In that case you probably deserve what's coming. :)

    • -1

      Apols for the format fail….

    • -3

      What is so bad about restricting cash transactions?

        • +3

          A $10,000 restriction on cash transactions. We paid more than that for our driveway.

          It looks like they are targeting tradies and their cash jobs. I don’t have an issue with that.

          • +1

            @whooah1979: Except that's not it…I really wish people would read before commenting. The claimed crackdown on the 'black economy' is merely the lie they are using to sell this scam to the punters. (Personally I don't care if tradies or others can keep some of THEIR hard earned money out of the hands of government). The real reason for the war on cash is simple: (from the links I provided)

            "Back in February this year we wrote this article on the IMF’s agenda to ban cash so that you can’t withdraw your bank deposits when rates go negative. From the IMF itself:“In a cashless world, there would be no lower bound on interest rates. A central bank could reduce the policy rate from, say, 2 percent to minus 4 percent to counter a severe recession. The interest rate cut would transmit to bank deposits, loans, and bonds. Without cash, depositors would have to pay the negative interest rate to keep their money with the bank, making consumption and investment more attractive. This would jolt lending, boost demand, and stimulate the economy. When cash is available, however, cutting rates significantly into negative territory becomes impossible.”

            "Because the architect of the global cash ban, former IMF Chief Economist Ken Rogoff, outlines the REAL goal in of a cash ban in his 2014 paper, Costs and benefits to phasing out paper currency:… it is precisely the existence of paper currency that makes it difficult for central banks to take policy interest rates much below zero, a limitation that seems to have become increasingly relevant during this century.The point of a cash ban isn’t to improve anything… it’s an attempt to increase Central Banks’ control of the economy. And if you think the US isn’t working to implement precisely such a scheme, you’re mistaken.Indeed, we've uncovered a secret document outlining how the Fed plans to incinerate savings in the coming months.We detail this paper and outline three investment strategies you can implement right now to protect your capital from the Fed's sinister plan in our Special ReportSurvive the Fed's War on Cash."

            "The real purpose for the cash ban is to trap Australians in the banking system, so they cannot escape negative interest rates or having their bank deposits “bailed in”."

            • +2

              @EightImmortals: The bill doesn't say you can't withdraw money does it? Only that you can't spend it. Nothing should stop you withdrawing your savings and then only spending it a bit at a time

              • +1

                @Quantumcat: That would be one strategy. And for now the bill only includes transaction with businesses not individuals, so you could buy a car from someone "for now". There re exclusions included in the bill as 'extras' that can be sliced off in the future so I'm not taking much confidence in them. The main point however is that the money you don;t take out of the bank will be charged interest when rates go negative in the near-ish future. It is also designed to get you to spend all your savings as they have no other way to get the economy moving again. They have also been snitching on people who transact over 10K for years now so I would take out multiple withdrawals under 10K each. The real game in all this is the bail-in and negative interest rates AFAICT.

                • +1

                  @EightImmortals:

                  The main point however is that the money you don;t take out of the bank will be charged interest when rates go negative in the near-ish future. It is also designed to get you to spend all your savings as they have no other way to get the economy moving again

                  Why would you not just withdraw all your savings and pay for everything with cash, and on the rare occasion you need to buy something for more than $10K just use your credit card, and go into the bank and pay off the balance with cash? Or open a new account temporarily?

                  Not saying that it doesn't sound very annoying for people that have saved up for a car or something but I don't think it leads to the conclusion that the banks are trying to steal your money

                  • +1

                    @Quantumcat: Maybe but the banks will wise up to this, everytime you put money in, they will charge you a transaction fee - like the old deposits tax. Now its a transactions service fee. Just like the old ATM fees.

                    Easy becuase they know you will have to use it, or go to Jail

                    • @RockyRaccoon: Even more incentive to only use it when you need to then. Why would you keep money in the bank when it costs you money to deposit your pay cheque and negative interest?

            • +1

              @EightImmortals: This sounds like a conspiracy theory. May someone please lend us a tinfoil hat.

              • @whooah1979: I wish it was, but then if that's the best effort you can make it's no wonder these crooks keep getting away with it.

                Here you go, right from the almighty government itself.

                https://www.treasury.gov.au/consultation/c2019-t395788

                • +1

                  @EightImmortals:

                  The Black Economy Taskforce recommended this action to tackle tax evasion and other criminal activities.

                • +1

                  @EightImmortals: So how does this "trap Australians in the banking system, so they cannot escape negative interest rates or having their bank deposits “bailed in”?

                  There is no Withdrawal Limitation here.

                  • @ESEMCE: Not when dealing with small amounts for day to say spending, but if you wanted to withdraw your life savings to avoid the bail-in and negative rates then that is not really practical.

                    • +1

                      @EightImmortals: You could still do that. There is no restriction on Withdrawals.
                      Go read the actual legislation, it's only a few pages worth of double spaced text.
                      The legislation relates to payments in cash only.
                      When the definition of "Withdrawal" is changed to "payment" then you will have right to be concerned.

                      • +2

                        @ESEMCE: Yep, fair point. For now. :)

                      • +1

                        @ESEMCE: Not really, if the only legitimate way to pay is to use a bank, then like all gatekeepers they can charge you a transaction/service fee on your account. You will have no way to avoid it.

                        Banks already limit things like interest on low balance accounts, nothing stopping them from charging you interest on balances being held. Of course now thats not happening, but some already pay no interest. And charge for too many transactions per month.

                        Like when governments build a new tollway, then shut off the alternative routes with speed humps, one way streets, reduced lanes etc

                        Withdrawing cash comes into scrutiny with the $10K+ transaction reporting already in place. So while you can withdraw it, putting it back in or using it will be an issue. Its not legal to pay over $10K. You get a "please explain" where the 10K+ came from. The onus will be on you to prove it was yours already etc

                        And as time goes on that limit will stay and it will be harder to spend it.

            • +1

              @EightImmortals: Negative interest rates are a good thing - it's a great first step to incentivize people to stop hoarding money and get it working, distributing its utility and hopefully distributing wealth.

              But the interest must be distributed properly (or destroyed) and of course in this instance it's not - effectively concentrating wealth.

              • @fantombloo: So saving for my retirement so am I not a burden on taxpayers is not a good thing? (Or were you being sarcastic?)

                • @EightImmortals: No sarcasm.

                  Natural forces generally promote decay in order to keep things in equilibrium, particularly when there is lack of negative feedback. (Depreciation doesn't cut it - it's part of the game.)

                  If money, and wealth more generally, had expiry dates, it would have a much more equitable distribution. No gorilla has more bananas than he can eat, no lion protects more territory than he can roam. It's not an appeal to nature, just a consideration.

                  As for our retirements - yes, that idea would require overhaul as well. At the moment it is predicated on making investments and extracting value from other (younger, poorer) peoples' labour - that's a fitting end for the current system. If we had negative interest then that alone would be a start towards paying for retirements, if we still needed them.

                  • @fantombloo: Yeah I'm still not seeing any solution there though. As for 'if we needed them' are you suggestion Logan's Run or work till we drop? :) The game (as wrong as it might be) seems to be to gather cash and material goods (a home for e.g.) while one is still working for the day when one stops or can no longer work. If they plan to steal even more of those earnings/savings then what is being proposed to support those who otherwise could have supported themselves? Nothing as far as I can see and this will burden the following generation even more.

                    • +1

                      @EightImmortals: Not seeing?

                      Its simple, if you have no money, taking from someone who does makes total sense.

                      If you can get someone else to pay and do the work why would you work.

                      As for future, thats going to be the next generations issue, the ones now too young to vote for thevofa's plan.

                      Why build roads when all they do is encourge people to use them, why build dams, why save anything, we are to go back to the wild ape world where banana's cant be saved, so when there are no banana's, eg when it rains, then the biggest Ape gets the banana's and the young Apes, get nothing except a bite on the backside by the biggest Ape. 😎

                      • @RockyRaccoon:

                        If you can get someone else to pay and do the work why would you work.

                        The capitalist ideal - profit from others' labour. The essential reason for investing in capital markets.

                        And you are using this as an argument against what?

                    • @EightImmortals: I just wrote a response which I lost when this thread got merged. Not gonna repeat everything, (CBF), except to say that my suggestion is a major overhaul of our entire view on property, and money, and retirement - this begins with scrutinising our entire system. If 1% of people owning 45% of global wealth, or 10% of people owning 84% of global wealth, is okay with you then there's no need to question anything. If not ok then its time to hit google.

                      • +1

                        @fantombloo: I think we'd agree on this point, how much does one actually 'need' and who gets to decide that?
                        I'm all for some kind of limited socialism (I think?) but we'd need to avoid the mistakes of full socialism, it just doesn't work, you always run out of other people's money at some point. I like the idea of sharing in the nations resources, so that instead of giving foreign companies/government the rights to mine everything we nationalise those things and any profit goes back to the community in the form of direct payments or less taxation. I AM against the theft of personal property (including cash) or the use of any state coercion and violence against individuals. So I'm not sure what you proposed in your lost post OR how we would go about changing this very dodgy system but things have to change. As it stands they seem to be changing for benefit of those 1%'s you mentioned whether it's cash banning, negative interest rates or a global energy-based carbon-dioxide economy. I'm not seeing anything from the political class or their plutocratic masters that would benefit the majority of humanity in any way.

                        • @EightImmortals:

                          I AM against the theft of personal property

                          Perhaps you should consider that property is theft. It is exactly what allows 1% to hold 45%, protected by force (usually of the state). Possession is a natural phenomenon; property is a social invention. The former requires use or occupation and is self limiting, the latter is only maintained by (threat of) violence.

                          As I said, a major overhaul of our entire view on property, and money, and retirement.

                          You mention socialism - it is just a single, perhaps not even the best, way to address this. There are others.

    • +2

      Got some more reliable sources?

      Personally I don't trust the media release of a minor Political Party.

      • You mean like the other links I provided?

        • +1

          The CEC Australia Media Release is more reliable than the people selling "solutions" to this "problem".

    • -1

      If you are paying $10,000 in cash you are either doing something dodgy or supporting someone doing something dodgy

      • Thanks Mr Morrison, now get back to work.

      • Now I I know cash deals can be dodgy, but not all deals done this way are, with fake Bank Cheque’s and other scams, some do prefer cash so don’t make absolute statements.

    • hey Bro, what’s the issue, you are going to gaol for da white stuff, who gives a shite about the concurrent sentence for overpaying the cash.

      Like everything there are ways around it, but we don’t tell anyone yet, so the loopholes won’t be covered in the legislation, which the fat cats and their 17% super rorts are too busy with their lattes to understand

    • "Preventing the black market" doesn't make any sense, as people are already transacting away from the law. A cash ban is hardly going to stop someone buying a a big bunch of cocaine or whatever. They may as well come out and say it is to avoid tradies operating for cash and not paying tax. If they wanted more tax though there's plenty of big corporations who aren't paying their share they could go after

      • -1

        There isn't really a black economy here anyway, well not much of one, the black economy report was just another part of the scam it seems.

        https://www.exposingtheblackeconomyreport.com/

        • Not directly related to $10k but I will rather prefer that the government makes it mandatory that few professions can't get paid in cash for e.g. taxi drivers, tow trucks, security officers, tradies etc. Only these professions cost ATO millions of dollars by not declaring their cash income.

          • @Ash-Say: If some bright spark can work this out, then sure they will do it, problem is that will mean someone has to police it, the "cash payment police".

            Guess parking inspectors will have the front running here, they have the thick skins needed for this type of enforcement.

            • @RockyRaccoon: It should be straight forward for tradies and security company where the government could enforce that if they accept cash payment then their license will be cancelled for 5 years.

              • @Ash-Say: I was not discussing the penalty, thats clear in this legislation.

                Its like speeding, if you put up speed limit signs without having some way to enforce this. Like Highway patrol officers, you wont catch them or stop it.

                Thats what I was saying.

    • +7

      I called Gladys Liu and she said taking cash donations over $10K is fine for her. Just put it in a red envelope though

      • +4

        I carry all my cash in ALDI bags

        • +1

          I real OzBargainer wouldn't pay the 15cents for the Aldi bag though

          • @chumlee: Thats BS, Gladys uses DJ's bags, where as Edy uses Aldi Bags.

            They use the same cash though, $50 and $100 notes.

            By banning cash purchases, thats more money that has to be disposed of. Great for the influencers business….

    • +1

      There goes Crown casino, no more shady Chinese men in trackies exchanging garbage bags full of money. I'm sure there is a loophole for James

      • +1

        Just like the Pollies already did this by going to the Races.

        Surprising how the Pollies walk away after winning, while business people seem to lose…

        Oldest trick in bookies

  • +1

    Transactions with financial institutions or consumer to consumer non-business transactions will not be affected.

    So what’s the big deal?

    …..paying a tradie cash in hand won’t be effected….

  • +4

    https://cecaust.com.au/media-releases/cash-ban-breakthrough-…

    The fight against the Morrison government’s totalitarian cash ban has achieved an important breakthrough. Thanks to the thousands of submissions and phone calls that Treasury and MPs have received from fired-up Australians, the Labor Party has not done its usual roll-over to the government and banks, but has done the right thing and demanded proper process. Yesterday, 19 September, Labor joined with One Nation, the Greens and Centre Alliance to overrule the government and refer the bill to a Senate committee for an extended inquiry that is due to report by 7 February 2020. This means that Morrison cannot stick to his schedule of banning cash transactions over $10,000 starting 1 January.

    The breakthrough came after Assistant Treasurer Michael Sukkar introduced the Currency (Restrictions on the Use of Cash) Bill 2019 in the House of Representatives first thing Thursday morning. This was first time anyone was able to see the bill since the Treasury issued its exposure draft on a Friday evening at the end of July, to minimise scrutiny. That didn’t work, because thanks to the CEC and others who sounded the alarm, Treasury was inundated with over 4,000 submissions, compared with the average of 30 it receives for a typical consultation. Evidencing Treasury and the government’s continuing intention to ram the bill through, Sukkar introduced it without any response from Treasury to the submissions, which Treasury is refusing to disclose or make public on its website.

    From an initial analysis of the finalised bill, one thing is clear: it is even worse than the exposure draft. The bill legislates an absolute ban on all cash transactions over $10,000, full stop. This includes bank deposits and withdrawals, individual-to-individual transactions—the bill bans everything. Moreover, any breach of the ban carries strict liability—no excuses, even if accidental, you go to jail for two years.

    It is very important to understand that the bill bans everything, because the government will claim it doesn’t. It will claim you can still do many things, that you can still deposit or withdraw more than $10,000 from the bank, and you can still buy a second-hand car from another individual. However, that is only because those things are exempted by a ministerial regulation attached to the bill. The regulation exempts deposits and withdrawals, individuals transacting with each other, armoured guards transporting cash, workers at Note Printing Australia loading crates of cash on trucks, etc.

    The problem is that the minister can change these regulations on a whim. He has the power to suddenly remove the exemption on deposits and withdrawals, for instance, without requiring a vote in Parliament. So your ongoing rights are at the mercy of the minister. The only change that would require a parliamentary vote on an amendment to the bill is a reduction in the limit to less than $10,000. And we know that KPMG, the crooked accounting firm that is behind this ban, and is also coordinating the totally cashless New Payments Platform to force all transactions through the banks, is already lobbying for the limit to be reduced to as low as $2,000.

    • +1

      Thanks for the update.

      Did my part, but apathy on the street is real. The olde 'If you don't have anything to hide then you have nothing to worry about' from most I've discussed this with. Same attitude towards internet monitoring & censorship, etc.

      Australia is becoming less and less attractive.

  • +1

    It's no consolation to me that no one knew this was going on/buried or that trolls made fun, once it's implemented. In fact, this dirty AF gov't will wrap it in fuzzy-sweetness in order to strip cash from our society.

    If you think the haves are NOT in a war with the have-nots, you're asleep at the wheel.

    And no, I'm the last person to subscribe to "conspiracy theories". The last.

    Google it. It's not my original thought— I'm only warning, and for that I get BS. Get a life, trolls.

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