What Are The Signs of Good/Bad Insulation to Look for When Renting a House?

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  dcep on 15/02/2018 - 16:12

  north east south west

  sunrise

  sunset

  directions

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  KaTst3R on 15/02/2018 - 16:13

  +1

  From experience, 2 factors. Materials and direction the house is facing.

  Brick houses (assuming the roof has good insulation) are said to provide better insulation from external temperatures. But if the house is facing West (afternoon sun), you will get the majority of the afternoon heat into the house through the windows. And because the house is made of brick, the heat is also trapped in the house for a longer period. So the preference is north facing brick house.

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    ioga on 15/02/2018 - 16:21

    Thanks, that makes sense. The current unit I'm living now is full brick, facing east but since the kitchen window on the back(west) side is small it's reasonably bearable last summer. Do you know there a way to check for good roof insulation before committing to rent, i.e if we ask the property agents about it would they be obligated to tell you?

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      KaTst3R on 15/02/2018 - 16:28

      +1

      Probably a little difficult to check on this. The owner might not even know what sort of materials are used for the roof. I would just check which side of the house is facing West and decide if too much of the afternoon heat might enter the place. It is a double edge sword, during winter internal temperatures might be comfortable.

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  bohn on 15/02/2018 - 16:31

  +4

  ioga,
  Make sure the house has eaves. So many new houses are not being built with eaves to save a few dollars.
  Eaves are essential in shading the windows, and on a nice north facing house the eaves will block the summer sun from entering the windows, thereby keeping your house cooler. In winter, if properly designed, the eaves will not stop the winter sun, which will save your heating bills.

  Other things you could look for:
  - no aluminium window frames (unless they are thermally broken aluminium, but upvc/wood preferred) due to thermal bridging
  - double glazing and/or honeycomb curtains/drapes
  - little to no westerly glazing

  In answer to your question, one of the signs of poor insulation in the roof - on a hot day get a chair and put the back of your hand on the ceiling. If it's warm, you know the insulation isn't doing a good job ;)

  For more info you might also enjoy http://ata.org.au/forums/

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    ioga on 15/02/2018 - 17:43

    Wow thanks for the insights, and the forum was seriously interesting as well. I'll keep the tip about the roof in mind. I've been playing around with an IR thermometer thanks to a Reddit thread, I suppose I can risk being the weirdo who shoots red lasers on the ceiling during inspection/viewing times.

    Can I ask what are your thoughts about bubblewrapping windows as a ghetto doubleglaze? I've seen some of my housemates did that in the past but not really sure whether it'll be effective. Also, I'm not sure myself about the underfloor ducted heating being a cause for the oven effect, is this accurate?

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      D C on 15/02/2018 - 22:12

      +3

      bubblewrapping windows as a ghetto doubleglaze?

      That works. Plain film works fine too, and doesn't look quite as ghetto. Really more for winter to keep the heat in. Common in some European countries, you can even buy kits. You can also (even in Oz) get frames make that clip into the windows.

      And an aside, bubble wrap was original invented to be used for insulation, you were supposed to wallpaper your house with it.

      In summer the best idea is to stop direct sunlight hitting the windows (like @bohn said about eaves).

      You really just have to resign yourself to the fact that Australians build crap houses. Just utter rubbish the lot of the them. We don't even insulate the walls which is common in other countries (expanding foam is popular in the USA).

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        endotherm on 16/02/2018 - 02:30

        We don't even insulate the walls which is common in other countries (expanding foam is popular in the USA).

        We do, but it is generally only around R1 which is mandated, which equates to a layer of foil. If you live in climate like some USA localities which is subject to deep snow and bitterly cold temperature for long periods, you will need substantial insulation to retain all that heat generated by your basement furnace. Clearly that isn't common nor required here. We would be primarily interested in protecting the living area from the sun's penetration. Heavier ceiling insulation takes care of the majority of heat loss in winter. The local regulations are influenced by the local conditions. It's difficult to get a good balance. It is like wearing a firefighter's coat or motorcycle leathers — both do a good job of warding off the direct radiated heat, but the downside is that they insulate so well internally they trap body heat and cook you like an oven.

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        bohn on 16/02/2018 - 07:45

        You really just have to resign yourself to the fact that Australians build crap houses. Just utter rubbish the lot of the them

        One of the big problems in Australia is we build houses to a standard, eg 6 stars, 7 stars, etc, but, unless you go with a builder who has an energy efficient focus AND THEN SOME, they will not test the home once completed. So many 6,7,8 star homes that people buy do not perform as they should. This is in part due to leaks that haven't be fixed (eg, they put a rangehood in and make a big hole in the wall, bigger than they need, and instead of filling the gaps they just put the rangehood cover over the whole thing). Same goes for power points. Same goes for window frames, etc.

        If I was building today I would firstly choose a builder familiar with all this, but, even if you couldn't, there are some things that you could do, eg, you could put in the contract that required the builder to complete a blower door test afterwards. Insulation also needs to be inspected after it is put in to ensure there aren't gaps or that the insulation is squashed/forced in etc.

        Also, in regard to eaves, many houses have eaves that are too short - and will not block enough of the sun during the middle of summer. There are calculators available to work out how big eaves need to be in relation to your window size/wall height. These are the sorts of thing a designer that is conscious of all these issues would use, but it doesn't hurt to be aware of it yourself. Or if you cannot afford a designer.

        I spoke to a builder recently who had a house and land package with no eaves. He told me, blinds do the same job as eaves so most people just go with that!!! OMG.

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        D C on 16/02/2018 - 11:20

        @bohn: > He told me, blinds do the same job as eaves so most people just go with that!!! OMG.

        Lol. Like I said, we build utter crap for houses. The 'no eaves' movement started quite a while back, at least 30 years. You get a bigger house so all good, yeah?

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        ioga on 16/02/2018 - 14:52

        @bohn:

        One of the big problems in Australia is we build houses to a standard, eg 6 stars, 7 stars, etc, but, unless you go with a builder who has an energy efficient focus AND THEN SOME,they will not test the home once completed. So many 6,7,8 star homes that people buy do not perform as they should.

        I was talking about this with a colleague who was complaining that the heating/cooling design of her house didn't make sense, like it had XYZ heating upstairs but only XYZ cooling downstairs (or something, can't remember now),so it's hell in both winter and summer. Apparently it was a conscious decision by the builder to do it that way because they were aiming for high stars and putting a more powerful cooler wouldn't be seen as environmentally friendly and result in a negative rating. It reminded me of the saying that once a measure becomes a target, it stops being a good measure.

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  Pumpkin_rrr on 16/02/2018 - 07:50

  Following… very good question; and very sensible to ask this important first question before you commit to rent.

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  Euphemistic on 16/02/2018 - 08:52

  Sometimes, less insulation is better. In summer our house gets a bit warm, and I'd like to be able to get rid of the ceiling insulation in the evenings once the sun has gone so the heat from the living space can escape quicker. In winter, it needs to be there to keep the warmth in though.

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    bohn on 16/02/2018 - 09:24

    That's where a well designed house can help - positioned to catch the prevailing winds, or use casement windows to direct inside. An energy efficient house needs to be 'worked'. If someone is rich they can have windows/blinds/awnings on timers etc. If not, you need to shut everything up when hot and reopen to assist in house cooling etc.

    Also the type of cladding can make a house hot long after it has cooled outside. A single stud brick veneer home has all the thermal mass (bricks) on the outside of the house. They have the sun on them all day, then it starts to cool down, but the bricks will let off the heat and keep the inside warmer than the outside for some time.

    A good idea when building (whilst using conventional materials that builders are familiar with) is to build a double stud brick veneer, with insulation in each leaf. This makes it easier to eliminate thermal bridging and helps to reduce the oven effect.

    In regard to roof insulation, you also need sisalation reflective foil insulation as well as the other.

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      Euphemistic on 16/02/2018 - 10:15

      Our house has some good features. Northerly aspect, veranda on the front to shade the north in summer. But it is styled on an old English style so the upper level isn't properly designed and insulation can only do so much. We do catch the breeze though from pretty much any direction.